all eager. how do you view the world that indians are invested and more in america and the india exchange is not back for money it's the pure prepared billions of dollars and also we can export our [inaudible] >> well, i was in india last year and spent a lot of time with the leadership and the heads of the major companies. we have here the chamber a major organization the u.s. and indian business council we brought a lot of american investors to india and hosting a lot of

indian investors to believe the relationship is very positive. i believe that many of the company's particularly on the technology side and the business side spokesman and telecommunications and others there's a lot of things going on. i think he will see a big uptick in exports investment and business with india and the united states in the next year or two. we will do that when you have right there. >> jeneane gold from kaiser health news. what is your game plan for fighting the new health all? how much do you expect to spend and how will you approach some of the provisions the seem to benefit the business community including the small business tax credit which many small businesses appear to be taking advantage of. >> we will the way we can. first if we have filed a comment after comment after comment for

the rulemaking we have seen some constructive positive changes as a result of that. there will be more of that. we will continue in that process. we do expect as i mentioned earlier that there will be some kind of a targeted rifle shot legislative approaches like the 1099 mandate and some of the other things i mentioned. we will work through them when we feel the regulatory process was not fair and we've seen some of that by the way into the we have seen ten or 12 interim final rules that have a long history in this town of becoming final rules and in that process by the way some of them have become interim final rules before even having had a final rule for comment so those are some of the challenges with respect to the small business credit bigot yes some small businesses are taking advantage of it. i think a vast majority in our membership and other business groups that have a high number and high density of small

businesses view that as not a particularly workable issue. but the bigger issue of subsidies i don't want to lose sight of. the ball disappear. so you get everybody in the game and then in 2014 they are gone. so you have a group of people that for well more than a decade or small business members called for a mentally for the small market reforms of the can get in the game and at affordable way. kiwi tease them into it with a very complicated subsidy mechanism that then disappears once the car in to it. >> s emma with insight u.s. trade. i have a question about the free trade agreement. there seems to be an indication in the house some might withhold support for korea as a way to ensure that colombia and panama were in the at and attrition to reduce the power that administration strategy and can you say more about the agreement?

is the chamber on the proposal or are there other organizations reporting that etc? >> well, thank you. first of all, the trade agreement this first upright nellis korea. we need to move on the very quickly and with dispatch because there are so many jobs at stake and right now we are losing jobs, and if the e.u. and canada and others get their -- when i left korea some months ago the australians were arriving to talk about peace and all sorts of things, so it's important to get this done, there are jobs online. at the same time, it is our view that the panel ma agreement should be done because the two problems that were in the way panel took care of, and my own personal and i think chambers view on columbia is a moral imperative. with that country has done for

us and for themselves and how we have continually call on them for their support, for us to walk away from that or even slow it down is unconscionable seóul we are going to leave it up to the congress to cue it up, but a situation that would be well we are going to do one and not together or we are going to do to and not get one you are looking for a fight you don't want to have said is on that issue in case you are interested the question of the project we have under way the question of the project we have under way talking about taking away all of the tariffs on products exchanged and sold and bought between the united states and the e.u., i talked to a lot of companies, i talked to a lot of representatives and

business groups throughout europe and i've had some very serious conversations with leaders of european countries. i've talked to a few people on the hill. i think this would be a great deal. would be a big stimulus to both economies. but i think that if we get it going and talking about it there will be about stepping heads around the world and people say we met, what are they doing? how do i get in on that, and we believe this would be a great stimulus to get people back in talking about a global trade agreement. i am going at the end of the month to further discuss this thing with a lot of people come and my colleagues are beginning to discuss it here in the united states, so i suspect you will hear for and against about that coming from a lot of places and

hope you will follow it and cover it. we've got a few more. why don't we go right there. we will go with you right here. on the issue of global competitiveness in the united states, president obama often mentions three areas he could help global competitiveness, education, r&d,.

this is an hour. >> [inaudible conversations] [laughter] >> it's my pleasure this morning as faculty director for this wonderful seminar eve and on politics in the media to introduce our next guest who is juan williams. juan is a special correspondent and contributor for fox news, a regular panelist on fox news sunday. he's the anchor of fox news for weekend coverage. he has a distinguished record as a journalist and a columnist here in washington and nationwide. in 1999 to 2010, one was a

senior news analyst for national pro look radio. a rather interesting and public departure not too long ago and he may not wish to refer to that today. you are certainly open to ask your questions. juan has received high acclaim for a series of documentaries. he is the author of a best-selling book, to best selling books, "the prize america's civil rights years 1954-1965," and also, i can't read my own riding, quote coauthor good martial american revolutionary." he also has authored the television series this year and stories from the african-american religious experience, and that was in

2003, and juan is still one very much involved in the journalistic enterprises involving racial relations in the united states and it is a privilege to introduce him now as our speaker here at the washington center. juan? [applause] >> good morning to all of you and welcome to washington. to have a discussion about politics in the media seems to be the right moment for that given all the consternation that is spinning around about the kind of vitriol you can get from the media especially conservative media in the aftermath of the shooting of congress woman giffords. i hesitate to do in the introduction to go straight to questions. it seems preferable i would ask the you just give me a second to

tell who i am so you have a sense of who you are talking to. steve did a nice introduction. thank you, steve. i think that many of you no doubt want to be journalists. you come to this program expression of your interest and national politics and the way in national politics is done. i think of that mine-year-old oral who went to congressmen giffords session in arizona and in some ways i think just a reminder of how fortunate we are to have this experience and as you are in your lives. i remember when i came to washington and about your age i came as an intern for the "washington post." not that is with such a plum assignment it may seem to you you were really blessed and had good fortune and in fact there is no question i was blessed but

what is also true is i was a kid whose mom used to bring newspapers off the subway in brooklyn york. she was a worker in the garment district in lower manhattan and the businessmen would read their newspapers and at that time new york have i guess almost 70 lee newspapers and they will leave them on the subway seats and then as they got to lower manhattan you could also find newspapers from new jersey. so she had a bunch of newspapers, and in those days, i would go through them and i was a q huge new york mets fan growing up with an underdog team that never won, and i would read the different sports writers and i would think i don't he got in the locker room i don't think he did a very good job. the keys are doing with his wife or drunk. he didn't get the key moment in

the game. he didn't understand what really happened. i would compare the columnists and i thought wouldn't this be great to be a sports writer, not only to go to the game inside the game and help people understand the game and then you start coming forward especially in the tabloids and looking at cultural issues in american life. books and movies and plays and then you go toward the front of the newspaper and discover there's politics going on, politics and money and power and influence and certain people get their trash picked up and certain people get to send their children to good schools and certain people have police protection and certain people are viewed as being the subject of police protection. so i thought to myself you know, the real exports here is not on the back pages of these tabloids. it's going on in the front, and the game of american life is about politics.

the real game is won people oftentimes don't see, don't understand, don't appreciate and i'm very interested in net. who gets the winning ticket in american life is always determined by american politics even if we are distracted by all the movies and books and athletic events. i became the editor of my junior high school paper and the editor of my high school paper and when i went to college, i was so afraid of the academic competition that i really didn't do much with the newspaper by freshman year. but i applied for an internship that summer at the philadelphia bulletin, one of the biggest papers in philadelphia. i thought to mention one thing which is why malae was in high school i also did some writing for a local newspaper that never covered black people and so why would out to the naacp meetings

or the neighborhood organization meetings and i would send little stories, and much to my delight, and i mean you had no idea, they would run the stories and give me a dollar. so when i was playing for the center japan philadelphia i had clips from my time as a newspaper writer professional if you will and the editor of my high school paper and i had recommendations and sent them into this newspaper the evening bulletin and was thrilled when i got the internship. when i showed up for that in turn should having completed my freshman year at the secure housing on campus so i could continue to live there cheaply, fly remember sitting with a bunch of the interns and the man who was an editor named sam baliles came down and talk to us for a little bit and then he sort of fixed his stair on me and asked me to come outside with him and he said how old are

you? and i suppose just about 19-years-old. he said you know this program is for seniors and graduate students? and then he disappeared and came back with e-file and am i application. he said you didn't put your picture or age on the supplication. why is that? >> i said i guess i didn't know, i didn't have a picture. and i will always remember this he said this isn't a babysitting operation this is an internship and he asked me to leave. so i went back to campus and remember telling people it's over and guinn to have to go back to new york to brooklyn and several calls were made and the idea was struck where i would get to be in the internet the evening bulletin for two weeks, and the would be my experience and i was grateful for that but at the end of the period nobody said a word sabean the jerk on pmi came back the next monday and nobody ever said a word and i was there a whole summer and they paid me and then they invited me to work two days a week during the school year and

then the next summer i was there again and the following summer "the wall street journal" was then owned by fiat dow jones newspaper company and dow jones had something called the dow jones newspaper fund and sponsored internships around the country and i got an internship at the providence journal in rhode island and went there for the summer. went back to the bulletin and hoped to stay at the bulletin. i was having a great time with doing good stories but they said that they wouldn't hire me permanently which was a great disappointment to me. they wanted people who were more mid career in journalism and i've got to tell you all the viewers of interest in media and journalism and it thrills me you are here to you should know that back then it was like it's unbelievable how many young people wanted to go into journalism, and they didn't want to be tv stars so it wasn't about that. i guess they wanted to be more

like redford because they played woodward and bernstein in the movie ought president's men. everybody wanted to be an investigative journalist. everybody wanted to bring the president down and revealed corruption and scandal and all that. so it was a courier of twins. so i wasn't being given the opportunity to stay at the bulletin, and i got my application out and i got to internships one of the philadelphia inquirer and one of the "washington post" and since i thought well the internship is granted in about two and a half months i thought it's better to take the internet but the "washington post" because they are the hot new paper and will look better on my resume and off i came to this town washington, d.c.. i worked as the night police at 7 p.m. at night and three in the morning covered reap, romo does and murders, the kind of thing

that goes on in the city usually at night. it resulted in small items held in the metro section of the newspaper. but being persistent, one of the things i did is i came in early and i must tell you most of my competitors were people from ivy league schools, harvard, yale, it in terms of the ivy league newspapers and the one difference i sensed was the were extremely bright and capable but the big difference was on had worked at newspapers before a and i knew the kind of staffing cycles that took place and the people who would make decisions whether to keep me, i hear me etc or people who worked in the daytime and being a sign that night and i wouldn't get much face time with them so i would come in at 9:00 in the morning and work the day shift and bright light the weather story or a feature story.

i would find something to write about and pretty soon they came to know who i was, to rely on me and expect i was coming in in the daytime and be surprised i was there at night. and i will tell you my favorite story from that period was on saturday night about 2:00 in the morning light was down a police station, and i heard on the radio box that they had a barricade situation and the barricade situation was actually not far from here but in northwest, around ferdinand -- third and cade. i didn't know how to drive. i always took the bus or the subway i had an expense account to pick up the tabs. but remember, i looked a lot like well, nothing like this. i looked like a skinny black kid with a big afro and i am dealing with white cops for the most

part almost exclusively. as recently i look like a dandelion, right, and i don't look like one of these guys and they're always giving me a hard time about anything i have to do, but in the middle of this might the detective says if you want to ride with me come on and we are writing down the street and come to this intersection and there is the most incredible sight. there are people who are the tallest people you've never seen and people who are the fattest you ever seen and who are this canniest you've ever seen, there are people who are just gorgeous and people who are hideous and i am thinking this is an odd sight, and on top of it they are all naked and people are coming from nearby buildings and stores and bringing them blankets and sheets and paper bags to cover up with. the detective and i are looking at each other, the cops on the

scene come over and where i can pick up on the conversation this place is a courthouse -- whore house. two or three gunmen are inside the building one is now outside of the building to read what was happening is there were rousting outside the bedrooms stealing and one of them got in a fight, the one now side being held but the other three gunmen are still inside and some people fled through the fire stairs on the back of the building and those were the people down on the street so then i eventually get over to the police then in blue and say what kind of odd group don't you think? he said ringling brothers are in town so these are people from the circus, and not only that, they are from the naval base and the marine barracks over here so this is a collection of those are the bus guys and some of

them are the women who work here and the duties from the circus, an amazing sight. [laughter] anyway, i called in and now it is almost 3:00 in the morning and i'm told we are not going to get this even in the final edition but we are going to send -- we want you to do it for the monday paper and they didn't even have a photographer to send at that time. so what happened was there was no photographer from the paper, there was no tv, so i end up writing a very descriptive story about what happened in the barricade situation early sunday morning or late saturday night, however you want to describe for the monday paper and of course everybody in town is going to be attracted to a story about sex, crime, guns, and was a big hit monday morning. well, stories like that can then get you in a position where they will offer you a job at the end of an internship. and they offered me a two-year

internship and at the end of one year then offered me a job that the paper and i see the paper for about 20 years. so, covering everything from local government, the mayor's office, the city hall, to the district building here to the white house. and in the midst of that wrote several books. steve mentioned some of them, lies on the prize, america's civil rights years, thurgood marshall, a biography of the first supreme court justice, books about african american religion and stories about people who've been involved in social change, hispanics, women, the disabled, my soul looks back and wonder, and my last book which was sort of a polemic about what's going on in terms of black america called enough. as we think i'm going to stop there. i will mention i've been involved in some controversy.

steve touched on it, about being fired from the national public radio for comments i made on the fox news show, the only factor, about muslims and about the anxiety that i feel in airports if i see people dressed in muslim garb getting on a plane, and aarsele had violated journalistic standards by revealing that feeling, and i think it was unjustified but nonetheless it led to my firing and it has had a tremendous repercussions not only in terms of my life and my career but in terms of national public radio. so i think having said that to you, i think it's a good time to open the door to interaction and to say that i'm hoping the all of you will have great success, and i hope we use this period to answer questions on your mind about what it is to practice journalism and in washington here at the start 21st century.

[applause] ÷ if you have a question go to the microphone. >> go ahead. >> i'm from the university of st. thomas. i interviewed a bunch of different presidents were some similarities and differences if noticed between them? like kind of, you know, personality media or just mannerisms, things like that but maybe you noticed in your interviews. >> you know, it's hard to discern any patterns when you need a president other than you are stunned at being there with the president. i just went over to the christmas party and this would be last month, and i had my son with me, and my son had not met

president obama, and his first reaction was as i described to you to say that he was my god he's a real person from he's not just a picture or the image on tv, he is a guy standing there. i guess i've met them all from ronald reagan and on and it's that you don't know them as human beings. you know them in just the way that my son experienced that my gosh, that's the president and there is a certain sense in which she takes their error all of the room that it's overwhelming to think that is the president of the united states. in the case of prison as ronald reagan for example, what i was struck by is how warm and attentive he was that he really focused on me and in terms of discussion they have all of these aides buzzing around, but that with president reagan he

felt like this is someone you would want to know and be with and trust. and the stories are not washington obviously become a factor in the waiting you relate to someone that is the president because there are so many people that tell stories about the president, and in his case, you know, even people who are political antagonists would say he was a great drinking buddy and he could tell terrific stories. so there was that since about he was great company and then the whole notion of reading the cue cards at not being that smart it became a joke because he would play on it. he wasn't afraid. ..

and if you come forward from that from bill clinton, is much more of a different generation, much more of a young man who i think i'm always captured a dat is that he is a young man at georgetown university was already thinking about how he could become by the president, how he could help students unpack and get to know them and their parent and insinuate themselves into the lives very quickly. and he has the sense that he is extremely smart and not as --

not as much as a reserved figure, if you will, as the first president bush, but much more out there, friendly, sort of a hail fellow well met type attitude. and of course, if you come forward from that to george w. bush, a gang, what struck me they are was but a nice person. in other words, this is the guy is working really hard, someone who's really disciplined about his life, the money was put is whole life on his check to make the best of what he has to understand the opportunities he has an absolutely feels less to be in this position and is working really hard at it and is obviously in very different circumstances. if a president obama, what always strikes me as no matter what the topic, no matter the discussion, whether were having

lunch for a press conference or in a receiving line, here's someone who can have a discussion about any issue. and no more than anyone in the room and be totally conversing with people who are experts on the topic. it's just kind of an amazing range of intellectual bandwidth, just terrific. and so, what strikes me as not white. two things strike me, but i don't know if there's any commonality. they're our leaders, but they all have different characteristics that i would identify as leadership characteristics. >> good morning. >> my name is hillary brown. bankruptcy cisco state university. my question is that now, the republicans took over the house. would there be any media coverage when it comes to

restorations? >> i didn't understand the last part. >> any media coverage? >> like the race to help the wealthy class and all that stuff. will that be media coverage, specifically on race relations click >> definitely. i think for republicans, one of the challenges they have been exclusively white and the congress until just now, and so this 112 session. you can have two black members elect to. tim scott, south carolina and allen west from florida. and that's a breakthrough for them. you have to go back to jc watt. i'm forgetting frank's first name. the congressman from connecticut. so it's been a while since we've seen anybody black in the republican ranks on capitol hill and the challenge for republican

is also the need to understand the party going forward because the country demographics are shifting so quickly, not just in terms of african-americans. i don't think they're going to make a lot of embryos there at the moment, but i do think they have some chance at 16 x, although the chances diminishing given the parties on immigration and immigration reform issues. so, this is a critical issue, race and the republicans. and sometimes when a journalist either assume well, there's not going to be much motion on that front, not much change or there's an occasional piece that points out what a dire situation it is. but i think they're reluctant to talk about it because it could be simply translated as the white party and democrats are the party of the people of color in the united states. i would also make the case that

if you look at major issues like health care reform, tax cut extensions, you could say republicans have become the party of the older generation in america and democrats are the party of younger people in america appeared he can do this in terms of president obama's approval rating. he is a think most white americans disapprove of his performance in office. most americans of color are wildly approving of his performance in office. you look at health care reform bill. tremendous support among democrats. tremendous opposition among republicans when you boil it away in singapore the republicans and democrats and then you come back. and from 1% to two of racial prism in which he say look, people of color and also lower in income, older people come away people are not supportive of this health care bill.

so there's race that plans though many of these issues. it's a very touchy issue. people are discomforted by the discussion, but it is reality and i hope he'll be allowed to find that coverage. >> hi, my name is cat named from the university of san diego and i was wondering, have a say in journalism change the years and in the terms of quality journalism, where do you think that's going? >> well, you know, for me, i came in 76 as an intern, as they told you. so i been here no more than 30 years. and there's a little bit of a forthcoming. you're still young. i don't know if you saw that movie. but there's a fourth come quality to this because when i was coming along, as they told you, i was working initially for an afternoon newspaper. what they don't exist in the united states anywhere.

so now you think about it coming forward. you think about the declining number of morning newspapers in the declining size and quality of disney's papers in the united states, the whole crisis in terms of the newspaper industry. and then you come forward in time and there was the advent of cable news in the early 80s. cnn and the like. and of course the 1990 and the gulf war, everything was focused on cable news and the idea of a 24 hours news cycle that was constant it would take each of the same animals fed them the morning paper was an afterthought because you know everything because he sought the night before. you throw in talk radio, especially conservative talk radio became so big. you come for commandments are talking about the internet and then you're just not talking about the internet itself is the source of news, which are talking about in the popularity of blogs. and now you're talking about

beats and all the rest. and you know, if you throw into this also the fact that cnn, which was initially the premium cable news it's now number three far behind fox news and msnbc. it gives you a sense of how things have changed, the landscape. another way in which i think of this though, as i guess it was last year that walter cronkite type. i think to myself when i was a kid growing up, how much i admired walter cronkite. as i told you i was a black kid in brooklyn. i love this guy is good, i like listening to him telling the news of the day. and i don't think the mets a liberal. i don't think of immense weight. i don't think of him as democrat or republican. i think that's a trust for the good. that's walter cronkite. i'm not sure that would work in this political environment.

in this political environment, people seem to want to know if a host, a liberal or conservative and i want to know about their purse maladies in their views and that's what drives the top-rated primetime cable program in the country. so, you know, even if you swing back over to something like the nightly news and again declining ratings for all the three big networks in terms of their nightly news broadcasts, there's tremendous -- those audiences tend to skew much older. people there are trying to become their personalities. i think he tried to do feature presentations. the whole notion of focus on hard news and what is a very small window, about 22 minutes from a half-hour is gone because they are trying to hold the viewers attention in a way that's quite different than anything i would have seen when i was your age. when i was in your position,

also i think the quality of writing about politics was much different. i mean, i was inspired by books like teddy white rating about the making of the president in 1969. yet a series of books about taking you behind the scenes so you want to do and who was really pulling the strings behind the choice of a political candidate and then to advance that political candidate. usually it david halberstam's books, best and the brightest without policymakers involved in american diplomacy and the war effort and be at tom and the mistakes they have made and what led president johnson that he could not stand for reelection. and then you get into books about like he talked about why mention woodward and bernstein of watergate. and again, getting behind the scenes, these are books that

would time idea of how you can get people to understand the game of national politics of a game in which they are real flesh and that people with real flaws in real strength can take away these are larger-than-life people you could never touch. now those ways, journalism has changed. in the 24 hour news site, constant attention that gets blown up. there is less in the way as it stands a debate that around here and the way of political polarization, although lots of people disagree with me about that. at a conversation with don rumsfeld, secretary of defense. you know, we've you're in the 60s? i said i wasn't. and when they arrived in the streets and there is racial anger, anger over the war in vietnam, all the rest, that

political polarization of a different kind. the political polarization you see today, where there is a clear policy of instruction is on that is employed very little talk across party line, very little debate on big issues because everybody is afraid they will lose their base would not be able to win a primary election, makes for a certain kind of political paller says her polarization that is in the later eristic in my mind of my time in washington. back at morning and ann taylor wiki from a1 university. but the shift in congress there's been talk of having to scale back the education program. and are just curious of your opinion having written on policies, particularly nbc what you thought the first step should be taken to remedy these problems and budget cutbacks. just thoughts in general. >> well, i don't know exactly the details of the cutbacks are thinking about with regards to

education. i think the big challenge right now is whether they're going to reauthorize what remains of no child left behind now called race to the top under the obama administration. congressman boehner, you may not know this, but he was one of the leading forces behind the creation of no child left behind and now a speaker he has an opportunity to put republicans in the part of making sure that that kind of attention to improving quality of public education k-12 continues in the united states. but the very issue that you've highlighted here this morning of budget cuts, include discussion of education because people are saying that's discretionary spending and their arguments from a conservative point of view about legitimacy of the federal government being involved with local schools at all. why is the federal government have anything to say? well, from my perspective if you

ask in my opinion, i think the federal government needs to help the standards. at things one of the great opportunities of america and promise of america is every child will have the chance to succeed. that should have a chance to move up that ladder of upward mobility. it's key to social, political stability that everybody believe that i don't know if it's still true people believe they can become president, but that you can succeed, but you can have a dream in this country and you can have your dream realized he would welcome you can't do that without education. if they're certain places whereby just accident of birth you find yourself wanting a community with low standards, low quantity schools, i think that's a prescription for disaster. i think it's the case because you're a minority are you come from a single-parent family, the presumption is you're not going to succeed and there's not the investment in need to give you the chance to demonstrate that you want to be a good student and that you want to have those

opportunities. again, i think that sends a signal we have become a very different society than the one we've been historically. so to me, this is critical and i would hope people who are taking up the budget ax would realize that you can't cut the roots. because if you do, the people who would become the leaders, the people who would keep the american dream of flame will not be there. so this is a critical issue i think going forward as we look at this new congress in the change that's taken place in terms of political control of the congress and the ability of that republican majority in the house to do business with president obama the democrat. >> hi, sir rehires. but if that sticks out it was your favorite to report on? >> well, that's tough. i've been around a while. i would say, you know, the book

i wrote on justice marshall released dance out for me in the sense that i remember wanting to talk to him so much and he was reluctant to talk to me. he had been described in several books about the supreme court in a negative way, as a buffoon, as someone who came in late, left early, someone who is really not intellectually of the caliber to deserve to be on the supreme court. and he couldn't just in the press. and he was just by serendipity that he finally agreed to do a book with someone else. and then that fell through. and finally, i think at the urging of his law clerks and his family agreed that he should talk to somebody toward the end of his career. and i had been sending messages

out there, asking for that for a long time. and so i got a call. it's a little bit of a funny story and how i got that call because the call came to the "washington post" and i wasn't at my desk. so this is in the 1980s -- late 80s. the phone then ran over to the receptionist was a friend of mine and knew i'd been trying to reach just as marshall. so when justice marshall's voice came on the phone and said hi, this is justice marshall at the supreme court, and like to talk to juan williams, her response was something to the effect of yet right i don't have time to play around. what are you doing? who is this? they said no, this is justice marshall. is that i'm sick of you and then hung up on him. but you know come to think about it and you guys may end up being the supreme court were present

in the united states. you don't have to put up with that level of foolishness. so he called back to the woman in the publisher of the papers with katharine graham. and she took his call and then they found the editor and a reporter and i said chief justice marshall, so sorry. we do know is really you you and all that. and then to go over and to meet him was like meeting someone who would living history. clearly, this is someone as president johnson said the supreme court was going to be in history books on the board of education. through us and a supreme court justice that involves so major rulings. everything from pentagon papers to roe v. wade to pocky. and he's just a great storyteller. so for me, this was an amazing experience and i would go out and visit once a week for about six months and it became a long magazine article and then a

boat. and i think i always remember that experience. but i remember there's so many being the president vacant on the golf course in it that justice orca when they were attacks on the kind of scattering of craziness that attended that moment in life. i remember, you know, i could go on. the point is these things come and go at the moment their front page top of screaming headlines and 24 hour coverage. and of course it fades into the woodwork. and in washington, the response to this weekend would be quite and quite absorbing for an experience, but then you move on to the next story as we think maybe the books got in my mind.

because the newspaper the next day tv and radio seemed to be rather favorable, you know, they don't stick with you. but books stick around. >> whitney donahue from suffolk d. within talk about media buyers this past week and i was just wondering if he tended to lean one way or another depending on the network you are working with at that time. when the difficulties i had it been in the middle. but it's not a difficulty. it's always been a blessing. the fact is that what they fired me at work for npr for 10 years. and so they saw value in what i was able to bring to their listeners. and then i've been working for fox for 14 years and they see value in what i'm able to bring to their viewers.

and i work for the "washington post," cnn. i could go on. but the ideas in terms of my training, when i was your age i was able to tell a story in a compelling, accurate fashion and i didn't care who you were. it's like, you know, steve said we've got a plumbing problem in the building, i don't think he would say and i want a democrat or a want a liberal or a conservative or i want a black person or a hispanic or white boy wants a man or women. each just said get somebody to fix the plumbing and get them here now. while i think it's like that. i was training just to do the work. i can tell you the story. i can collect information that the facts hopefully get the right people, hopefully to a quicker than competition. when you read the story even at

a later come and say that's a better telling of detail. and more from it than i did from the competition. that's what i was trained to do. obviously the earlier question that i've seen, platforms i present that information have changed. i never thought, you know, where do you go from the afternoon paper to a morning paper and then you go from newspapers to tv and radio. i never thought i'd be doing tv and radio. and you know, it will print different formats like talkshow tv and then do something like sitting in for a primetime cable host by bill o'reilly. i think the same skills are can you identify the heart of the story? can you bring information that helps people to better understanding of the dynamics that created the story and what the story is going. so you're helping them to see the broader goods. to me, it's not about whether i

am -- and i am a democrat. it's not whether an liberal or conservative and depends on the issue you're talking to me about. do you know, there's certain people a notice in the black community. often they say you're pretty conservative. i said why is that? they say you're tough on things like out of wedlock birth or high dropout rate or, you know, you don't like a lot of the content of rock music, especially when they use in the. and i say that's true. if that's what you want to do it, that's fine. then he say when you know what, i'm big on gun-control. i live in the district of columbia. i like all these aren't people, especially gang bangers running around with stolen guns. that's a threat to me and my family, so i had a very acute sensitivity to the idea of everybody having a gun. i think everybody might have the sensitivity after what happened

in arizona this weekend. or you go to issues like subsidized marriage or gay in the military. it's like that amount to. it depends on the issue. i don't fit into any talks. a message in the current media environment, there's a great advantage. there are people who advertise themselves specifically as being a voice for liberals or a voice for conservatives. in one of the changes that take is that the audience seems to have an appetite and they say i just want to hear somebody who will reaffirm my preexisting political positions. and tell the other guy what a he is and how silly and make fun to mock the other stuff. the people like their news delivered. that outfit and not box and i haven't changed to make myself identify one way or another.

and i know sometimes i might aggravate the audience and there's evidence they certainly aggravated some people at npr. but that's what you get with me. >> tanks. >> you're welcome. >> and/or charlie from university of san diego. my question is one of your recent departure at npr, the shooting at tucson and the great divide in american politics that's evident, how do you see america's ability to respectfully disagree with one another and just be okay with that, still be friends? and what if any role do you see the media has been trying to bridge that divide? >> displays little on the last question we had. you know, i mentioned earlier that one of the characteristics in terms of the american president is for the most part, that when you meet them, they are our people you feel you could talk to. i don't care what your political

affiliation, you don't come in and say, you know, that guy doesn't deserve to be here. you might question their intellect in some cases but in terms of their commitment to american progress and their love of country and their belief that america really is a blessed place, there's no question. and so, in moments like that you say, a lot of this political fragmentation, a lot of the polarization and hyperbolic but jim that it tends the political process and start to boil away and you have a very clear view of what's really important as embodied, listening to president or any political leaders once you get them away from the rhetoric. to me it's regrettable without a doubt that you have people who

simply take one line or another, without a willingness to acknowledge when the other side makes a good point. now i think debate is absolutely essential. and i think strong debate and strong voices and sharp points are wonderful. i think that's good stuff. that's in keeping with the american tradition. if you go back in terms of american history and go back to the founding of our country that things like the federalist papers, you understand that the founding fathers with all their rebellion against the british were pretty rebellious on an intramural basis with each other about what our country would be in the direction were going. obviously we've had a civil war in this country, was a way no internal division. this isn't our first dance. but i think for the average american trying to make sense of the political system and trying to understand what's in the best interest of the country right

now, the tendency is to say that red state or blue state. arb. and that is so simpleminded. and that does not serve them all in terms of news consumers for it doesn't serve the political process while. the consequence i think as we go from the 06 cycle where we saw at swing towards democratic and then await when it really was another huge swing towards democratic and now he going to 10, where we see a swing towards republicans. so you see this wild oscillation in terms of political process. but the undercurrent tends to be wild discontent with those sites. people don't do politics. they think politicians are corrupt are all about money or simpleminded gap, just craving soda people. so there's a disrespect for

politicians and therefore in for the political process. and you know i must tell you, i think the world of the process and it ain't the world of our congress and institutions and they've been too important in terms of the world and world progress. so the idea that most people think well, i know exactly what to write and i'm on the website or the right side. or in the case of your generation, all these politicians are a bunch of clowns and jon stewart and stephen colbert would they make fun realize how silly and these people are. i think to myself sometimes, this is not helpful in terms of developing people who understand how difficult it is to become a successful politician, to make an important debating point, to make that point in a way that is persuasive so your fellow americans can hear you and appreciate the importance of what you're trying to say.

that is the core of democracy and they just wouldn't sell it cheap. you know, you can obviously get lots of laughs and i don't mean to bring you guys down, but i think it's a serious process and at some point worthy of your consideration. that's why it's so please only made the trip to washington today and treat the subject with some care. >> good morning, roxanne taylor from suffolk university in boston, massachusetts. my question is do see a lot of advanced than we would've reported from newspapers to tv stupider net. so what changes do you see for the way we report news in say 10 years? >> well, i think there's a huge change coming and it's taken me a lot of time to appreciate it, but clearly news is migrating to the internet and that's where people are going to get their news from. so for all the worry about what's going on with newspapers were the major nightly news broadcasts, the reality is now

that news has -- if you're looking for breaking news, people don't go to the major networks anywhere. they go to cable. they go to cable news. and even more so now, from what we're starting to see, puget said a study on this, people are going to the internet. if you think about how people get their news off the internet, they get them from major news brands, but then they quickly go on to blog and they're going to do some research, exploration, a little reporting on the road so they can try and find out what is behind the news. i think in that sense it becomes more days. news becomes more available, but it also becomes much more planted if you will because there are fewer gatekeepers in terms of standards and editors who say yes, this is information that confirmed, that were

shorter. in this environment, if you have a presidential assassination like making 63, you couldn't have the country glued to let say walter cronkite and say well, he's getting the news, yes it's confirmed, et cetera appeared and. and so do people plugging into various websites or blogs in picking up bits and pieces. some people believe in what they're reading. other people say i saw something, not knowing if it was edited and the way if you're familiar with the shirley sharad case where something comes across the internet and find out it's been placed in a way to make it appear to be something that is not. but that spirit going. there's no? going to the internet for news and i will be the source of the question is not only the quality of this product, but how it will be delivered and the economics behind it, you know, who pays for that. and so the news, for example, about something like a piece of legislation on capitol hill if

it's related to the say the drug industry come from the pharmaceutical industry that has an economic interest in how the legislation is reporting in great detail and depth for themselves and their client as opposed to coming from a general interest news organization that's covering for the entire public. that's the difference in tone i think. it's going to be harder to identify exactly the bias behind the person who has put this information into the computer. so in that sense, brands will play a bigger role because it will convey trust. but the question is what's behind the brand? because even now we're not sure how news on the internet is going to be paid for. >> hi, my name is peter. i'm a student at the university of san diego. do you think the issue should be addressed her as a matter of

certain groups pointing fingers? >> know, as i say, i think michelle is an important issue because it didn't pack the political process. and certainly if you can't go to your congressman or congresswoman without a gun on the table between the two of you, i don't think that's a good situation. i think you have to have a free-flowing debate, disagreement, agreement. you have to do you know, thank you standing up on an important piece of legislation. and i think people who are striving to be our political leaders -- i don't think they're going to be so anxious to cannot position. they feel like it's the okay corral for anybody who states an opinion or tries to make a point, that people who disagree feel it is okay to physically attack you, that violence is called for. i mean, who wants that for themselves or their families? so it is a big issue.

now, can you attach b-tree out to the actions of jared lochner in arizona? that's a big issue. what we've seen in some cases as a knee-jerk instinct is to my left to say well jared loughner was inspired by some of the victory all. what is clear this moment is that it is a mentally disturbed person. >> it's time for one more person. >> and nick witkowski for bradley university. my question is over the past year a lot of things have happened politically. has it been any single piece of legislation that you thought was kind of a surprise or did that a pastor didn't pass in what were your viewpoints on that? >> i share president obama's feeling that i was surprised at you and i pass. i thought that was a real opportunity to say we understand how difficult this issue of immigration is.

when it comes to young people who came to this country because their parents brought them, so it wasn't a matter of their own actions. a lot of them came at the mom and dad. and they say to people who are completing school, serving the u.s. military. these are people who i think are really, you know, the bread-and-butter of her future. but everybody's going to agree. we have defined awake to get them a path to citizenship. but the opposition is so strong on this issue. i think again feature all plays into it. i think the demonization of legal immigrants in specific, but anxiety over the amount of immigration is so high right now, but it has prevented the congress from dealing with this major issue for us as an american people. you know, you can talk about

added security at the border, but we have to put more security in place than ever before. you can talk about added strain on the social safety net in terms of hospitals, schools and all the rest, but for the most part -- or you could talk about drug dealing and only collect dvds. for the most part if you look at people who were immigrants of the country i think historically clearly immigrants have been a blessing. but even the current moment, you would have to say immigrants had so much in terms of the workforce and revitalization of neighborhood that were indicating the rest. and if you even go to the high-end of our employment market, you will find that companies going in terms of the high-tech industry come the pharmaceutical industry are trying to get talented, educated people from overseas here to add to our economic duty, to add two jobs. and so you get people from the highest and other business

leadership community saying we need immigration reform. but somehow, the congress is unable to act and even unable to act when it came to the transaction that was a huge disappointment. well steve, it's been a pleasure. i want to thank you all for coming and thank you for listening. [applause] >> we have our traditional speaker gift as well. thank you very much. >> i just wanted to say, juan, that is 30, 40 years ago now when i was here in washington anchoring the morning news for abc, i kept reading this young guy at the "washington post" and identified him as a calmer and it's nice to see how far you've come up with marvelous career.

thank you very much. [applause] >> it also goes to show that it helps to be in the right place at the right time and at the circus is in town. good, good, good. so we're going to take a quick little standup stretch break and we're going to get going here just a minute again. [inaudible] if you leave the rimini to come back in, please try and do so through the stores over here so once we get started were not walking across the camera angle. [inaudible

>> what are your thoughts after so much has happened, i've seen you on national television so many times. people are trying to wrap their arms around this. they're having a difficult time doing that. >> each day i wake up and think, was this just a nightmare that i had or is this real think? didn't think nilling like this would happen in our town. ivepk been here for 31 years and this is not the face of the

town that we know and love. and i'm just -- i'm deeply, deeply shocked that it occurred and of course our condolences go out to all of these victims and particularly congresswoman giffords' family. i know they're suffering terribly right now. >> obviously a new law designs to keep protesters away from the funerals of the victims from saturday's shooting will be on the books more than likely the time the sun goes down here in arizona. key legislators from both parties have told the capitol media services that there's more than enough votes, in fact that vote's taking place at this moment as we speak to make it illegal to picket within 300 feet of any home, cemetery, funeral home or house of worship before, immediately before, during or after a ceremonial or burial. you were outspoken about this pastor and his outrageous comments and i know the whole town agreed with you. republican, democrat, independent, left, right, everybody came together to block this guy from his

horrible speech and the protest that he plans against those who will be burying their loved ones. >> i called brian miller, the chairman of the fema county republican party on sunday, and asked him if he would be interested in helping us out and he graciously said yes right away. and embraced it completely. this is bipartisan. this may alleviate it and we may not have to have any kind of counterprotest or anything to keep this from occurring. but i will warn you that most of these types of laws have been held unconstitutional and this issue is pending before the supreme court with this exact same pastor. as a matter of fact, while this was working its way through the court system, his daughter went to law school and she argued the case before the u.s. supreme court just about a month and a half ago, i think it was. so most of them have been found unconstitutional. they've patterned this one on the ohio law which i think tfls the sixth circuit upheld. so this one might pass muster at least at this stage of the

game. and it might be in effect long enough to help us through this crisis. >> what is your take on the blowback from the sheriff of the county who was very critical of the political climate that existed here? and might even have suggested that that was partially to blame for this mad man and the shooting spree and slaughter that occurred on saturday? there's many who have criticized him, says he has no right to suggest that in fact a political climate that has been certainly ripe with high profile and really vicious comments from one party to the other, but reaction to him mixed all across the country. what's your reaction? >> what i've been telling press from all over the world in the interviews i'm doing, there's a facebook page up now called clarence is my hero and people are joining that by the thousands and thousands. the fact is that he's absolutely correct in pointing

out this kind of language that's gone on for the last couple of years has got to be at the source of this problem and the root of this killer's intent. we must remember that this killer already admitted in his own writings that this was an assassination, it's an assassination of a congresswoman, it is therefore political in nature and are we going to know soon? i hope very soon what kind of sources this person was looking at on his computer. they have seized two computers from the home, i understand it. and once they start sorting through those computers we can kind of see where this killer was coming from. so i support clarence, i think he's one of the finest public officials, he had over 20 years at the tucson police department. he's been elected seven times for four-year terms as the county sheriff in this county. he's a brilliant man, a great law enforcement officer and i stand by everything he said and i think he had the courage to say what we were all thinking and maybe all didn't want to

say at that moment in time. >> some of the block beaback,, too what the sheriff had to say, jack harmer said, he should have had a deputy at the event. he says that dupnick is partially to blame for the shooting because there was no law enforcement officers at the scene of her gathering, where she's gathered many times without law enforcement officers. it would have been unusual to have one there. even al melvin says, obviously the left and he's a republican from tucson, the left is trying to make the shooting into a political issue. it's a mental disorder problem, says the senator. i think the sheriff of pima county ought to stop and think about that a little bit. >> we received a threat at our political headquarters, pima -- pima county headquarters today, about speaking out about this and we'll pay the price for it. so we have received many threats, bomb threats, over the last two years. this all started in 2009, right

after barack obama's inauguration. there were people putting signs up at various events of giffords' that were hateful. we had people coming to rallies saying, we came unarmed this time. i mean, this kind of hatred and vitriol has been out there ever since early in 2009. we've seen it here in pima county, week of seen it across this state and nation. so this is a good time for us to sit back, take a breath and evaluate the civility of political speech in the united states today. and i think that it calls for a serious examination of this, john. >> this is the john c. scott talk show in tucson, arizona, live on c-span 1. thank you so much for watching and thanks so much obviously for people listening. i think we'll take advantage of you being one of the best defense lawyers in the country. explain if you will the justice process under way, both at the federal level and the state level, against the accused

assailant here. >> well, what's first going to happen to him is they'll have to bring formal charges now by way of a grand jury. in state cases they can take it to preliminary hearing but most of the times they take it to grand jury. grand jury in secret listens to the evidence as presented by prosecutor and probably some detectives. then the grand jury then formally indicts, you're now formally charged. the next change is an arraignment where you enter a plea of not guilty for the suspect and then you set trial dates. this trial is going to be a year or more away from now and because he's going to be eligibler to the death penalty and because a prosecutor will most likely seek the death penalty, this will be a very long and very involved trial. it will last a long time. this case will -- isn't going to -- going away any time soon. as far as defenses, i think probably the only thing there is going to be an insanity defense. week of seen the things that the antigovernment kind of

rants that this person has engaged in so there's probably, given the circular reasoning of some of the things i read that he's said, there's maybe a basis there to argue insanity. but insanity is a very difficult defense to mount. as know, my former partner is one of the foremost authorities on the insanity defense for decades and you must show under most laws that -- and most states and federal law, that you either didn't know the nature and quality of the act you were doing, you thought it was a rabbit you were killing, or something like that, or that you didn't know the difference between right and wrong, that your mental instability was so far along that that was the case. and that is a very difficult hurdle. juries are very scrept cal of the insanity defense. >> -- skeptical of the insanity defense. >> this is the john c. talk show. there is absolutely no question that once again tucson is in this spotlight. you've been a long-time resident of tucson. i too have been here for many, many years. but the story i tried to relate

to our listeners yesterday was, yes, this is a story of a mad man's act, we don't know the reasons for which he took the lives of these innocent and then attempted to assassinate the congresswoman, but there were heroes among us. people that were our neighbors, people that we didn't really know that could step up and attempt to save the lives and placed themselves in jeopardy as they were doing so. i think that says as much about tucson as does this mad man that took so many lives. >> really does. some of these people acted without thinking. it was automatic. one of the people i saw, the younger man, said that when he saw the fire, the shooting, he gam began to move towards the gunfire. and the shooter. and i saw something today where one person hit him with a chair. and, you know, this was some remarkable heroism that took place there on that day. but i'm not surprised. i think in crises like that people's best nature usually

prevails. >> the elderly lady that grabbed the magazine so he couldn't reload his automatic weapon. >> that was a very courageous move. >> so much of this discussion surrounds not only the political climate which has been raw in arizona, and we've covered it day after day for the last three or four years, it's become more raw as we headed into this political election of 2010. can the state be capable of luring the discussion and listen -- lessening the kind of impact that these words have had from the right, the left, democrats and republican, all across this political spectrum? are we capable of that? or is this going to be a lull and we're right back? you heard jack harper trying to blame the sheriff, you heard al melvin saying the sheriff doesn't know what he's talking about. where are we going to go with this? what's the end result? >> i'm not terribly optimistic. because the vitriol we've seen coming from the right wing extremists in the republican party has continued on unabated for several years now. i'm not optimistic that that

will stop. i just can't see people like rush limbaugh and people like sarah palin and glen beck ever toning down their rhetoric. the only way it will happen is if the viewers and listeners quit viewing and listening to these programs. that's the only way that this will end, is if the viewers and listeners say, i've had enough of this, this is poisonous, and i won't listen to it again. >> media has reacted, clear channel who of course airs the are rush limbaugh show, has taken down their bill boards calling rush limbaugh a straight shooter. they're becoming sensitive to this as well. those bill boards are coming down all over town. >> i hope so. i'm not taking my shirts and dry cleaning to sparkle cleaners anymore if they don't get off that john justice show. we need to talk to advertisers and say, if you're going to put this bile on and pay for it we're not going to go to your businesses. >> the president coming

tomorrow again puts the national and world spotlight on tucson, arizona. the memorial service at the center on the campus of the university of arizona. i think that's significant in itself because this is not just a local story, it's a story reaching worldwide. you've done international interviews with television from spain to london all over. and i have as well. there's no question the world's watching what we do here. and i think the world's watching how arizona will react. after the tax on ethnic studies and after the senate president, now senate president russell pierce has said he will attack the 14th amendment. we're going to find out whether arizona can change or whether it cannot. >> well, you know, i've been here 31 dwreers and i love this state. it's a beautiful place. i had to drive to globe yesterday and on the way there and back i kept thinking, look at this unspectacular scenery. and all of the people that i've met andino here in southern

arizona have been wonderful to me and my family. and i just hope that we can -- the better nature of us prevails and that these people who want to engage in all of this hatred and talk about weapons and guns, that they don't win this battle. >> the political climate obviously is being discussed. gun laws are being discussed, it's congress may take up these additional clips that allow so many rounds to be fired from a gun. there's another interesting story, literally posted from washington suggesting that in the past year pima county, where of course representative gabrielle giffords and 19 others were shot, saturday, has seen more than 45% of its mental health services recipients forced off the public rolls. was there any possibility of help for this young man? who was identified at pima community be a college and in other particular experiences that he had as being a problem and a potential danger yet no

one could do anything about it. is there anything in place that could have come into play? mental health services, law enforcement or anyone else that could have stopped this? >> you would think that in this state this governor would be particularly sensitive to this issue. because this governor has a son who is currently housed in the state mental hospital for a very, very serious crime and was found to be insane when he committed that very serious crime. and so my hope all along has been that that would be the one area where we could count on this governor for support but apparently we have not been able to get any support from her at all and mental health services have been cut the same way education and other health care services have. >> we were talking in recent conversation immediately following the shooting about the ability of people to come together. they have come together on the pastor from topeka that was to disrupt the burial services for the dead. you talked as you mentioned with the pima county republican chair as well as the tea party

representative, trent humphreys, and they all agree that they would share with you a common goal to try to stop this idiot from literally disrupting the privacy of burying the dead from the families and friends of those that we mourn. so there is at least a step forward here. we'll be talking with brian miller, the chair of the republican party, so they'der more than willing to join you in this effort. >> absolutely. both of them seemed like genuine, concerned individuals that aren't so far out there, but i think what we all have to do and i think it will be easier here in stewson for us to get -- tucson for us to get together and do our best to pull back from the heightened rhetoric that we've seen over the last several years. but i'm not optimistic statewide or nationally. you have to realize that putting this fear and anger into play is what the republicans believe may have turned the election for them in the other parts of this state and in the rest of the nation.

may have helped them capture the house of representatives. so i can't see them say, backing up saying, well, we're going to give up a winning strategy. i'm just waiting for the other shoe to drop. i'm not terribly optimistic on a statewide or national level. >> callers may join us and talk to jeff rogers. this is of john c. scott talk show from tucson,arizona. and jeff rogers is chair of the democratic party. we'll be talking with state representative steve farley who has been close to congresswoman giveredsa familiar -- giffords' family. we'll talk with others, an aide to congresswoman giffords, and obviously the former editor of the newspaper. pitcha county sheriff will be in studio with us live at 4:05 mountain time and u.s. senator john kyle also will speak with us. brian miller, the chair of the

pima kt republican party will be with us. hopefully we'll have the governor. she's trying to adjust her schedule to do a live interview with this audience state representative, stay with us if you don't mind. and be with us for a moment. jeff rogers. we want to talk for state representative steve farley on this show. steve, thanks for being with us. >> thanks for having me. these are tough times, but i really appreciate you getting the word out and spreading the story about who we are and what we do when we face tough circumstances here. >> legislature met this afternoon and a piece of legislation by kirk adams to protect the integrity and the privacy of the burial of the dead, very quickly, how did that legislation come about? how was it so quickly dealt with by both parties of the state legislature and now onto the governer? >> yesterday in our opening day we had an atmosphere of really unprecedented bipartisanship in which there was so much expressions of grief and so much expressions that we will

not be treating each other the way week of been treating each other in the past. we must come together even when we will file the as hard as we can about boil, we will never attack each other using hateful or violent temples. it will not happen and we won't allow it to happen. this is the first example of how we did that. we have to make sure that the families of those people who are attending the memorials, those families of those who died are protected so that they can grieve in peace and every member of this body agreed and it sailed right out of here and it's on the governor's desk. she might have even signed it already. >> by the way, what people might not know is you've been close to the giffords family, her astronaut husband and of course the whole family itself have counted on you to be with them through this terrible tragedy as congresswoman giffords fights for her life. i don't know how recently you've been in contact with the family, her happens you could

update -- perhaps you could update us on how she is doing and how those who are being mourned and those that have been wounded from the governor 's -- i mean, from the congresswoman's staff, a little bit about the personal side of this story and your relationship with the family, please. >> it's been a very tough time for a whole lot of people. and i think that that counts everybody in the tucson area, the entire southern arizona, we really consider ourselves to be part of gabby's family. and the other folks who have died and who are suffering right now, the members of her staff, the member ps of the public who were killed and wounded, we are all doing everything we can to make sure that they are getting the care they need and the hopes and the prayers they need. more specifically, i've been in the hospital visiting ron barber who is her chief of staff and he is in great shape and he's -- even though he's talking in a very soft voice as he recovers, he still has his blackberry on all the time,

he's always asking about everybody else. he's trying to tell people what he'd like to get done. pam simon, another incredible person, gabby surrounds herself by these amazing charismatic type a, kind, wonderful people. and they are all her family, too. pam simon is going to be released very soon because she has done so well and i have to say that there has been some sort of miracle here in how well people are doing. obviously it's a terrible loss that we've lost gabe zimmerman who was also a close friend and such a kind individual and so dedicated and so hardworking and connected to people as well as gabby connects to people. he was also rushing to help when he was felled by hailed bullets and unfortunately he passed from us while dan hernandez, who was her intern that everybody has heard about and was my campaign manager,

his family is my family, basically, he rushed in and did help and he's the one who is hailed around the world as a hero right now but gabe zimmerman was going to go there, too, and unfortunately he did not make it. it's incredible how the people who did make it, though, have come through so well, including gabby who is now wiggling toes, she can breathe on her own, they have a little assistance right now because it helps recovery. both sides of the body are engaged. it's really, really a hopeful thing and i think when gabby comes out of this she's going to lead us to a whole new era in politics in which we don't have to attack each other or demonize one another in order to disagree. >> you've said you'll tone down your rhetoric. >> i absolutely will and i made that promise to kirk adams, the speaker of the house, made that promise to the governor, made that promise to majority leader tobin.

i said if i have ever done anything to hurt you in the past, please for give me. i beg your forgiveness. and if i ever do it again you call me on it and i will make amends immediately and i intend never to do that again. and i hope that every member can do it. but i know that i can only control my behavior and i will do that because i believe that our democracy deserves nothing less. and this is the threshold we have crossed last saturday. where we can come together once again as a state and lead the way to the rest of the nation to come together as one nation so that we will solve our problems and we'll do it together and we won't just be yelling at each other about it. >> we're talking with state representative steve farley, democrat from tucson, from his phoenix office. i believe you're in phoenix. >> i am. i'm about to hit the road as soon as this interview is over and get back to tucson. >> and we're in studio with jeff rogers, the chair of the fema party democratic party. we'll be talking seen -- pima party democratic party. mark kimble will be with us live, an aide to congresswoman giffords, suffered greatly over

the -- over losing, obviously one of the great people of southern arizona, gabe zimmerman, who was the aid to -- aide to congresswoman giffords and ron barber, one of the aides who were shot and the innocent who were there, to attends the rally for congresswoman giffords on saturday. again, pima county sheriff will also be in studio with us live. his remarks have stirred political debate. what do you hear from the capitol? you have the state senator from southern arizona saying that he takes exception with the statement, if i, sheriff dubnick, that we have become a mecca of prejudice and bigotry. also we have a situation where there's no question that jack harper, the republican from sunrise, said the sheriff was partially to blame for this. should have been a deputy at the event. and he bears some of the responsibility for the shooting there. some of the -- of those remarks from the capitol. what's been the reaction to those in phoenix?

>> well, i don't react to the blame game. i think that we all have blame for what our dialogue politically has become and we have to change our behavior, each of us individually. and whether or not, i mean, i think ultimately we know there has been a climate that has not been good in many situations. we know that gabby has come under personal threats. many times in the past. her office windows have been shot out, we had targets painted on her district by certain national figures. there's been a lot of stuff happening that leads to a climate that seems to tell someone who is unhinged anyway that this sort of stuff is tolerated. and i'm not saying this is a political act, in no way do i think it's a political act, because this guy isn't capable of acting politically. this guy was crazy. there's no way around it. but the fact is that people like him, these loaners who are

deranged, are looking for some way to belong to something that's larger than themselves and unfortunately they'll jump onto these people giving as it its permission for violent acts. by calling for angry retributioner to things they disagree with and we cannot do that. we cannot do that. and -- but it's important to emphasize because some folks on the right have been saying that somehow we are saying that he did it because of the political climate, because of the tea party, i don't agree with that at all. i think he didn't do it because they did it, because it was crazy. this is an opportunity for us to highlight the problem that we already know exists and that gabby herself has talked about numerous times. tone down the rhetoric. >> steve, do you think there's any chance that this might help us derail some of the more liberal gun legislation that's being proposed? >> i certainly hope so. >> there was a big push by the n.r.a., they told us on our talk show that their highest priority would be to put guns on campuses across the state of

arizona. >> and i know jack harper is going to have that bill and he's going to be pushing that one. i don't think he'll back down about it. but i will certainly make the argument that that is not a good idea. we have law enforcement on our side and i think we'll have a lot of our people on our side. i think the public will be more involved. i'm very concerned that this guy passed a background check to buy a semi-automatic weapon. we need to do something about that. there's no question. but the more important thing is that these things -- this thing happened, regardless of why it happened, we'd like it to not happen again, but let's use this as something, a crisis that causes us to actually change our behavior in ways that is significant into the future. we don't respond necessarily very well to impending crises here in this country. but we respond very well to actual crises once they have happened and this is what we have. if we do not act now to transform our civil dialogue, then we will have wasted this

opportunity and it's hard to talk about a tragedy as an opportunity, but i think that's the way we rise above this. >> all right. all our phone lines, republican city councilman from tucson, in studes yo with us is jeff rogers. state representative steve farley. this is kjll. thanks for watching all across the country and the world and thanks for listening here in to youston. here's steve -- tucson. here's steve. >> thank you. first of all i want to thank you all for calling for a toning down of the rhetoric. i don't care about pointing fingers but we certain lino that we just came through a very nasty campaign and i'm not blaming one thing or another, but if somebody's on the edge and they're within a hair's breadth of going over the edge, then listening to a campaign

like that might happen to be the catalytic event that sends them over. thank you for calling for a toning down of the rhetoric. i absolutely agree with you on that. do i have a question for each of you, though. i don't want them to sound like [inaudible] questions but they are sper received. steve, you described the legislation that just went through, to deal with this nut case, this fred phelps guy. you can describe the language in it? could it have a first amendment vulnerability? then for jeff, a similar question, you talked about the insanity defense and you said you had -- you have to demonstrate that the guy knew right from wrong. i don't mean this to sound flip and but what if the guy says, i know right from wrong and i think this was the right thing to do? >> go ahead, first of all, steve farley. >> first, that's a great question and thank you for calling in, steve. i think you're a great example of how we -- how you personally are not -- do not engage in that type of rhetoric. i think that's great.

this bill is not targeting the west borrow guys, it's not targeting that church that's going to do that crazy stuff. this is specifically something that's already in place for 40 states. it's something where, yeah, this tragedy has spurred us to realize we needed this thing, because we looked around and said, we don't have anything like this and 40 other states do, but we're not targeting them. this is for any other funeral, any other memorial service that will be happening at any point in the future. we realized there's a little nudge for us to realize a big nudge for us to realize that we need to do this now. in terms of constitutional issues, no, we have a sixth circuit court from an ohio law and this is directly the wording from the ohio law, that does uphold this and finds it does not violate the first amendment, because it has reasonable time, place and space requirements. so the restrictions are reasonable. and they are specifically about the time and the space, the

distance and the place where it is. it will, i believe, pass the legislative muster and i don't believe they'll be able to get an injunction. >> let me point out that if they are able to get an injunction to stop it, which they have done in other places, then we will stand shoulder to shoulder along the route, all of us, and i've already talked with many community groups from the right, from the left, from the middle, from the nonpartisan, and we will find an unprecedented turnout of people, shoulder to shoulder along the route, to protect the mourning families and all of us who are attending that funeral from anyone trying to disrupt it because we will stand shoulder to shoulder on that and our unanimous vote on the legislature made sure that would happen. >> a city councilman on the phone lines as is steve farley, representative from district eight and steve, had another question about this insanity defense. >> many of these laws have been struck down across the nation

and it is pending before the u.s. supreme court a virtually identical law from a different state. so it's possible this could be a problem. but as steve noted, we have a backup plan. and that backup plan is to show what this community is about and i think across the state people will, as steve said, stand shoulder to shoulder. as for the insanity defense, most lawyers would recommend that a person in this dividend's case not testify at all. they have an absolute right to testify and a judge will quiz them over whether or not they're giving that right up knowingly or whether or not they wish to testify. if he did what you described in the scenario, steve, the jury would probably say, well, he's definitely not insane. we're just going to convict him. so that would probably not be in his best interests. as i indicated earlier on, perhaps you weren't on yet, the insanity defense is very difficult to prove before a jury. juries are very kept cal -- scrept cal of it. it's a difficult road to hoe.

>> i heard you say that. i guess what i was suggesting is, what if he said something that on its face was so be a sword that nobody but a crazy person would say it? >> it's very difficult to put that guy on the stand because they're going to say, well, maybe he's nuts knuts, maybe he's crazy, but he's not insane. the definition of insane is so strong, only those two pillars of it, you have to prove one or the other, and if you don't prove one or the other beyond a reasonable doubt, or raise it to the significant level, then a jury's just not going to believe it. >> steve, thanks so much for your call and your questions. we appreciate them very much. >> steve, thanks for standing shoulder to shoulder with us at those candlelight vigils for gabby giffords. >> no doubt and i'll be out there for the young girl on thursday also. >> the democratic chair of pima county on the front lines,

state representative steve farley. steve farley and the speaker of the house on the other line. i thank you for contributing to our show today on c-span and kjll. we look forward to another conversation real soon. >> thank you so much and thank you for telling this story. >> thank you. let's go to the speaker of the house of representatives, the honorable kirk adams. mr. speaker, thank you so much for being with us. you're on c-span 1 and on our radio show here in southern arizona. thanks, we appreciate it. >> you bet. >> all right, this piece of legislation, you authored it. it went through within moments, almost hours, here and i believe the govern already sign it. we have the chair of the democratic party, a lawyer here, jeff rogers. he was commenting on perhaps some of the difficulties with the law. if you would explain the law to the national audience ands to -- and to us and how it will apply to the funerals now. >> yes, thank you. first off, let me say again to tucson that our hearts are in

pain with the city of tucson as we go through this process of mourning for the victims of this horrible massacre. and that is why we felt this legislation was so important. so that the family members whose lives have been turned upside down can at least have peace, some peace, during the periods of time in which they are burying their loved ones. and having those funerals. so what this legislation does it we base it on legislation that's been done in 40 other states and particularly the legislation out of ohio which was upheld to the sixth district court and what it simply says is that these protesters have the right per the united states constitution and the first amendment to express their thoughts and their opinions as vial as and disgusting as they may be, but they have that right. but we also have the right to regulate the time, manner and place and that is what we

intend to do with the passage of this legislation. so what it will say is that one hour before the funeral, during the funeral and one hour after the funeral the protesters must remain 300 feet from the funeral. >> mr. speaker, we just had state representative steve farley who had been extremely laudtory on your comments as you listened to the governor yesterday, he thought your remarks were so appropriate. you talked about the political climate and he had pledged to you no more raising of the rhetoric of him as a democratic minority and i'm asking you, mr. speaker, will in fact there be less of this volume and perhaps a diminished amount of this volume of political speech that we've heard for the last couple of years in arizona over all kinds of issues from 1070 and now to this tragedy and perhaps a comment on the political climate, if you will, please? >> i certainly hope so and i'm

optimistic that we will see changes. you know, we will never really understand nor can we understand what would cause one human being to cause so much carnage like this. it's impossible for us to comprehend. but i don't think it's as important to discuss why he did it as to discuss what do we do now? and that was really the focus of my speech yesterday when i accepted the re-election to the speakership. we need to return to to a point where we can continue to have vigorous debate, one with another, because after all that is our political system. we have varying opinions and varying beliefs about what government should do and what government shouldn't do. but when we have those debates we need to always remember that it is a conflict of ideas and not a conflict of people. that in the end we all really want the same thing. which is to improve arizona and to improve our country and so

long as you remember that, that it's not about the individuals, it's not about the people, it's about the ideas, i think we can have a respectful and honest debate and respect the opinions of people and value others seen when we disagree with them. and in a tragedy like this, john, just as we have tragedies in our own personal lives, i think it's a moment of self-reflection for all of us. a chance for us to examine how we are living our lives and how we are conducting ourselves. and if there's anything to learn from a sudden loss of a loved one it is this. sometimes you never get a second chance. to speak to them again, to tell them that you love them, to seek their forgiveness. whatever it may be. and i think that's true as well with an elected officials and those of us who are trying to serve the public in such a public way as running for office. we develop friendships and we

develop relationships and there are times where we disagree with each other very strongly. but even in those moments we must always keep it to the ideas and not to the personalities. >> we're talking with the speaker of the state house of representative, kirk adams, we're on c-span 1 and this is the john c. scott talk show from kjll. my comments yesterday and our commentary was the fact, yes, there was a mad man among us, but there were heroes as well that we did not recognize until that tragic day of saturday. you honored one of them on the floor of the house yesterday. with the gathering of the senators and representatives of the state, daniel hernandez, who was the aid, -- aide, of course, to gabrielle giffords, whose actions may have saved her life as he cradled her in his arms and placed a bandage on her wounds that perhaps

stopped the bleeding and has diminished the amount of damage done to her brain from the bullet. but that was a remarkable time to remember arizona not just as a place and a home of a mad man, but a place of many heroes, that turned out on that saturday morning to risk their lives for others. >> yeah. you know, this is a great state, it's a beautiful state, but it's filled with great people like daniel hernandez. and it was an honor for us to be able to honor him and the courage that he showed in a moment ff incredible fear, i can only imagine. and to do what he did and the other heroes that were there that prevented additional deaths and carnage, and you're right, john, we need to remember not only in this time of pain, if the individuals and the families that have been impacted, but also the heroes and the acts that they took and daniel ranks right up there and we were just honored that he was with us yesterday, it was a

very emotional time and he received several standing ovations during our opening day ceremonies and was mobbed afterwards with well wishers and people who wanted to shake his hand and thank him for doing what he did for gabby. >> mr. speaker, thanks for communicating with this audience and the c-span audience across the globe and around the country. i think it's very important for people like yourself as leaders of this state to speak openly about this horrible tragedy and where we go from here. mr. speaker, thank you. i appreciate you being on our show today very much. >> thank you. >> you bet. the speaker of the house, the hon rational kirk adams. i want to thank jeff rogers for being with us and we'll be following people preventing people from disrupting these burial services. we're going to go to mark kimble, communications director for gabrielle giffords. he's scheduled to be in studio with us.

also the pima county sheriff. also on our hotline will be u.s. senator john kyle. he'll be talking to us. brian miller, the chair of the republican party in pima county in studio with us. as we will have perhaps we've worked diligently to find the governor and see that she'll be available to our audience. this is the john c. scott talk show from kjll tucson. c-span live across the country. for those that have just joined us, we want to update the situation with gabrielle giffords. some incredibly great news out of the university medical center. after surviving the gunshot wound to the head at this political event, representative giffords remains in critical condition but it was a significant time for her and her recovery as the brain tends to swell most of the third day after a traumatic injury. it was a very good sign that she has made it past the third,

now the fourth day. dr. black, chairman of the department of neurosurgery in los angeles was involved in treating giffords. she has now breathing tubes to protect her lungs and of course dr. michael lamone, chief of neurologist and neurosurgery at the university of medical center had a news conversation and has said that -- coferingse and has said that ms. giffords has been responsive and they're very, very pleased. sara, representative of congresswoman giffords' office and of course mark kimble, former citizen editor. and now an aide to congresswoman giffords. both of you, you'll have to move over to the microphone, we're sharing it here. but sara, if you will, this has been such a traumatic time for the staff, the people that were so close and are close to gabby, i can't even imagine what you've gone through. but perhaps you could tell this

audience on see spands and here in southern -- on c-span and here in southern arizona where you are now as we try to put this together and find it almost impossible. go ahead, sara. >> sure. right now we're just trying to cope with this week and take it day bidet and also try to still serve our constituency who's also been hurt so hard by this. we lost an amazing staff member, gabe zimmerman. he was an integral part of our staff, but also an amazing human being and helped serve so many people and we've just been -- we opened yesterday and we just keep taking the constituency, they want to leave their sympathy and we are happy to take that. it's a great deal of support to know that the community is there for us and have been leaving flowers and signs as well on our corner and, i mean, we're distraught and it's kind of an emotional roller coaster right now but we're just trying to function and stay positive with the positive news we hear

about the congresswoman and our other staff members. >> mark kimble, obviously as long-time journalist, editor of the daily newspaper for so many years, you have written these stories of carnage and bloodshed and of course somewhat as we all have been who cover these stories, detached from it. this came home to you. this was people you know, people you worked with. people you loved. this was your family. i can't even imagine what you've gone through. >> well, to say it was the worst day of my life is just a real understatement. sara and i were up there on saturday morning looking to help people as was gabby and this was the furthest thing from our minds. many of these events have been held in the past and they had all gone well. people were excited to see gabby and she was out there

doing what she really loved which was meeting people that she represented. and there were a lot of people out there excited to see her and this was just such an unspeakable tragedy. >> perhaps it is not unusual for congressional staff to become attached to their particular boss, to their political figure. but in your office there's always been a sense of family about this. gabby has chosen people she feels so close to and those that would be close to her. they are her familiar. you are her family. i think that was illustrated when daniel hernandez who just joined this family not too long a-- ago cradled her in his arms, pressing against her wound and perhaps his act saved her life. ron barber who was shot, his words were not, you know, help me, his words were, take care of gabby, take care of gabby. i think that's reflective of the staff as i've known it. each person that we've talked with, both of you here today on

c-span and on kjll, always speak in terms of just -- of love. just not a job, she was just not a boss. >> i'll let sara talk about that, too. but i think all of us considered a very big honor to work for gabby. we are proud to work for her, we do love her and i know she loves all of us. we're all very close to each other and this was something that just really tore apart a very, very close knit group of individuals. >> by the way, sara, if you'll comment, too, the office is open for constituent services, for comments. it's open to serve the constituents of congressional district eight. you didn't shut it down and put a wreath over the doer, you simply said, this is what gabby would want us to do. i've heard that expressed numerous times. keep the office open, keep doing what we've been doing. how you do that in the midst of this tragedy is far beyond my

comprehension but the work goes on, does it not? >> it does. time doesn't stop for this. and we have constituents who still have problems, you know, who might be having severe health problems and need veteran services, who need social security benefits in order to take care of themselves. i work specifically with immigration issues. people are waiting for loved ones to come from overseas and they have interviews and they have appointments and that work still has to go on. we've gotten tremendous support from our congressional offices who have offered to help us with the constituent work that's going on. but as mark said, we are a tight knit group. we're a -- we were a family before this and we're still family. the people there are so caring and we care so much about each other and it's definitely -- gabby would serve her constituency and our chief of staff said, you know, don't feel you need to come into the office, if you need to be at home, be at home. but i knee on sunday night, i knee that -- i knew that everybody would be there because that's just how we are.

>> mark kimble, quickly, if you will, you might comment, we are in the national, international spotlight. obviously we're on c-span, across the country, across the globe and across southern arizona. we did falk with jeff rogers, the chair of the democratic party, and state representative steve farley who is still in phoenix as the legislature has moved to try to protect the integrity and privacy of the families who will bury their dead, the six that died, but obviously the president of the united states will arrive here for the memorial service on the campus of the university of arizona. that speaks so highly, i think, of not only recognition that gabrielle giffords has obviously met across the country, across southern arizona, but across this great nation as the president comes to pay her respects as well as to honor the dead and those wounded in this horrible tragedy. >> it does mean an awful lot having the president come and i

think that reflects very highly on gabby. i also think it reflects very highly on gabe zimmerman, our very much loved staff member who died in this tragic event. the flags at the capitol are flying at half-staff because of gabe this week. it also i think reflects on john roll, a federal judge who had enormous respect in tucson and all across the nation. who just stopped by on saturday to say hi to his friend gabby and was caught in all of this. >> we're talking with mark kimble, aide to congresswoman gabrielle giffords who is fighting for her life at university medical center after an assassins attempt. sara humble is -- hummle is with us as well. there is no question, mark kimble, that this community has had an outpouring of grief. it's time to deal with it itself. no one could ever have imagined

this could happen here. to someone we know, someone we loved. had this happened someplace else we would have been obviously satnch -- saddened by it but it just comes home to a community that literally is wound around the university of arizona, we all are wildcat fans, we all do basically the same things and choose this town because of its sunshine and its friendsliness. but i've never seen such an outpouring. i've never seen an event that has brought so many people together as this terrible tragedy has. right, left, republican, democrat, independent, i don't care who you are, all are saddened by this. >> i would agree with that. on saturday sara and i heard a large number of people including law enforcement officers express shock over this and say, this is not what we do in tucson. this is not tucson. and that is really true. and the outpouring of well

wishes and the memorials that have sprung up, the shrines in front of our office, in front of the university medical center, are unbelievable and are very, very touching. and i think that represents the real tucson that we know. >> well, mark kimble, i know this is a very difficult time. i appreciate you coming to our studios, not only for c-span but for ourselves, just to obviously speak for the office staff and for gabrielle giffords. i think people should realize that this congresswoman is still a congresswoman, will be as long as she wants to be. and i think everybody prays for her recovery. they want to see her on the floor of the house again. they want to see her constituent events. that's what people are praying for. the recovery of this remarkable woman. and perhaps that will happen. i think all of us are praying for that to happen. >> well, john, i think those working for her know it will happen. gabby is the strongest person i think any of us know.

and she will get through this. she's a fighter and she'll be back. >> mark kimble, thanks for taking the time to come here. i know it's been a deluge of requests for you, but to come here and to express your thoughts are very important to us and to this audience at c-span as well. thank you very much. we want to thank mark kimble and sara hummle from the giffords' office as this courageous lady fights for her life. we'll take a break. what we want you to hear now is a talk show host at this radio station who arrived on the scene just moments after the shots were fired. he found the dead and those wounded in front of him and these are his words that so poignantly described the carnage that was there. we'll go to the top of the hour. the next, the sheriff of pima county will be with us live in studio. this is the john c. scott talk show. this is c-span 1. here's mike, one of those arriving on the scene moments after the shots were fired.

>> i'm at the supermarket at the southeast corner -- corner. medivac helicopters have just arrived. all kinds of fire and rescue personnel. congresswoman gabrielle giffords was holding a meet and greet here in the parking lot of the safeway supermarket and a man opened fire with apparently small caliber handgun. congresswoman giffords was shot , she has just been medivaced out, probably a half a dozen or more other people also shot, at least three dead. it's absolute pandemonium here. ivepk been giving c.p.r. for the last 20 minutes to two

different people. that's why i'm sure there are at least three dead because those that i was helping i think will end up being declared dead. i didn't stop doing c.p.r. until i was relieved by a paramedic. i don't think there was any point in doing c.p.r. to the people i was doing c.p.r. to. >> welcome back, ladies and gentlemen. this is the john c. scott talk show. c-span 1, kjll, the jolt, want to thank jeff rogers, the chair of the democratic party, for spending time with us to begin our show. state representative steve farley was also on our live line. calling in, steve, the republican city councilman. and the speaker of the state house of representatives, the hon rational kirk adams, was with us with his thoughts and piece of legislation to protect the privacy of the families who

will bury their dead this week. mark kimble, communications director for the gabrielle giffords congressional office, sara hummle who provides services for the constituents in congressional district number eight. with us, the sheriff of pima county, a long-time friend and a long-time -- we've admired him for his work in law enforcement and speaking his mind. thank you for being with us. we truly appreciate you being with us. >> thanks for the opportunity. >> please explain to this audience across the nation, across the world, as well as in southern arizona some of the law enforcement responsibilities and how they are divided between the federal government and state authorities. we talked yesterday with the pima county attorney who may press charges leading to a local investigation of the shooting. so perhaps the division of responsibilities of law enforcement, if you will, sheriff. >> well, we had two very serious crimes of murder. one is federal and one is

state. the judge and the shooting of gabby are federal crimes. and the other individuals who were shot, the other, well, the staffer also, so what we have is the f.b.i. being responsible for the investigation of the federal crimes and we have our department, the sheriff's department, responsible for investigating the state crimes. but i can tell you that within an hour, a very chaotic scene, there are about five, six, no seven or eight law enforcement agencies, four from the federal government, like a.t.f., d.e.a., f.b.i., are present, there are five municipal jurisdictions, including the city of to youston and our department -- tucson and our department and so forth and the

fire, several fire agencies, including the city of tucson, and a lot of medical and emergency support people. within an hour a very chaotic scene was brought under control , a command post was set up and an incident commander was in charge and it was as if one agency was doing the entire investigation. the people in this community, the enforcement agencies have practiced and practiced and worked together for years and this one came together as though it was just one agency doing the entire thing. >> you've seen acts of heroism before in situations similar. i don't know whether you've seen so many people risk their lives, the elderly lady who took the gun magazine, daniel hernandez who cradled the congresswoman in his arms and held a bandage to her head as much as he could, a makeshift

to stop the bleeding, the elderly gentleman throwing himself in front of his life. his wife is taken, his wife's life is saved, the mother who pushed herself in front of her own child. . they saved numerous lives, because he had just finished firing 31 shots from an extended

magazine that he had and he was trying to incertificate another extended magazine that he had, plus he had two other magazines. he had spent 31 and probably had 61 other rounds and probably would have used those had he not been subdued. >> your comments following this terrible tragedy. you talked about the rhetoric and political climate. never backed off of that, even though you have been criticized for it. you talk about mecca and bigotry and others have asked you to withdraw your remarks and you have not. >> i was expressing my anger and i still feel that way. i'm still angry. i learned about this when i was leaving palm springs for a law enforcement event when i was present at, when i learned about this. it was like someone kicked me in the stomach.

i was in shock and disbelief. and more i learned that the people i admire, respect and love the most were victims, then , i got quiet and i started getting angry and closer i got to tucson, arizona, the angrier i got. i arrived and i said what i felt. >> you are not withdrawing your words. you believe that the political climate may have contributed to this slaughter. >> no doubt in my mind. no doubt in my mind. many people feel precisely the way i do and i know there are thousands of police officers that feel that way. but everybody is afraid of, for example, the national rifle association, they are afraid of legislators and afraid of what the government may do to them.

and you were in the legislature yourself. and you know the power they have. people are reluctant to say anything controversial because of the backlash they are going to suffer but i have been a cop for 52 years and i'm 75 years old and maybe i can express myself. >> there is some blowback and some say you bear responsibility for the tragedy and should have had a deputy at that event. >> it's an interesting point but a point that is being discussed intensively, not only here but in congress, because when the people like gabriel are in congress, in washington, they have tremendous security and they go back into their communities and they have four, five, six, seven events in one day and we don't even know they are having these events and no

loument presence unless we have some intelligence there is going to be a problem. >> she never asked you for security and never notified you where she was to be or never checked with your office as to public events. >> if you are feeling guilty, you reach for strauss. >> a state senator says he takes exception to this. the sheriff of pima county ought to think of this. but people are praising you for having the guts to say this. >> no doubt about it. for years, some talk radio hosts, which certain people listen to, 24 hours a day, seven days a week and some have their motive to inflame the citizenry. they make money doing that and there is one party that benefits from it. >> there were billboards that

were taken down that says straight shooter. >> he has no responsibility, right? >> you have obviously the situation where i think everybody is evaluating what theyr what they say and what they do. people think it is the lull before another storm. there isn't any question about it. there are people out there that are unstable and can't reason with them and can't control them. their behavior is irrational. and they are trying to rationalize what is irrational. than you can't do that. all of us know as a matter of common sense, when you inflame people, particularly troubled permits that they may do wellly bad things as we saw in this case. call our phone number and we are on c-span and on kjll and our

caller, a question or comment. >> i wanted to sheriff to know i support his statement. first of all, happy birthday and i support his statement and i really feel strongly about the gun law. i support guns at the university. i think it's a very stupid idea and we need to do something about it. >> thank you. our next caller. go ahead, rick. >> good afternoon. i think sometimes we take yourselves so seriously we lose what is the more important part here, we have victims that have been devastated because of this crazy behavior. i would wish we would focus on these people transition on to these people becoming survivors and doing things right instead

of beating ourselves up side the head. >> sheriff dupnik, very quickly, there is no question. there are acts in the legislature today, and the governor will sign the bill to protect the privacy of those that wilburry their dead in tucson all six. your reaction to that piece of legislation and the quick action to sign this piece of legislation. this nut case was coming to disrupt the services. >> takes a shame to get the republicans, democrats and the governor on the same page. and i'm grateful. if these people show up and they violate this law, they are going to spend some time in our jail. >> you're calling for consideration of the political rhetoric that has been so much a part of our discourse, since 1070, no one can suggest that

that did not ratchet up the political feelings in tucson, arizona, as well as the attack on ethnic studies and pending attack on the 14th amendment. there is no doubt in your mind that this political climate is an unhealthy one and i ask you the same question, you believe it could have contributed to this madman and they acts against the innocents. >> i don't think it's not just me but all the experts agree with those things. it's not just dupnik. >> very quickly and i appreciate the time, i know you are worn from these interviews from all across the country, but in the past year in pima county and democratic -- democratic representative gareds' district, we have -- gabrielle giffords' district.

this is something you and i talked about many, many years. it is thing that create these kind of environments. if you identify who may be a danger and you cannot do anything about it until they harm other people, these are quirks in this society and the structure by which we live. in the legal system we have, common sense gets lost. and that's what happened here. and going back to your other point about the tenor of our society, you look at the gabrielle's campaign, which i was involved in, you have sarah palin in the crosshairs and reload publicly supporting her opponent. her opponent is going on tv that start with, i know you people are mad as hell at washington and so am i.

that was her opponent, endorsed. and he had one event that i know of where people were allowed -- he showed them how to shoot a semi-automatic rifle after the event. >> the association of guns in politics has led to this horrible tragedy. can't separate it from this event or this tragedy of six dead, 14 wounded and the congresswoman fighting for her life. we now have the legislature so willing to come together as one and try to probing the privacy of those that we're going to bury. the majority committed to opening up guns on the campuses of the arizona universities. your response to that, putting guns in the hands of students and faculty. >> the legislature ought to stay out of it. we ought to let our college presidents decide. and the idea is insane. you put a bunch of guns in

students' pockets and teachers' pockets and when you get an unstable personality that becomes angry, all they have to do is become angry and start shooting. >> you might these gun magazines. he had 31. previous to just a few years ago, you couldn't have a clip -- you could acquire them, but the idea he could kill and wound so many in a short period of time because of the length of that magazine. your comments on some gun control in america. >> the politicians today both right and left are fearful of their jobs because of the influence of the national rifle association. >> you're not fearful. you have won seven elections and you are one of the most popular figures in southern arizona and haven't been seriously challenged for sheriff. do you speak going to the ballot

and letting the people decide. >> absolutely. >> just take some time, please, and i want this audience nationwide across the world and here in southern arizona to know your relationship with gabrielle giffords. it was one not just friendship, not just political alliance but one of real deep friendship, was it not? >> not only friendship, but deep admiration and respect. this is one of the finest creatures that god has ever created, really. that's not -- i say this not to exaggerate a point. and john roll, the federal judge who was assassinated have been personal friends. he is the brother-in-law of one of our homicide lieutenants and he is the guy that went to mass every day and he was a fairest brightest judge that i know of. and it's just horrible. >> sheriff, we are going to go

through this together, but you were so close to her and close to this whole situation because of the continued circumstances such as this one where we ask you what do you think and what's going to happen, but this has been a very difficult time for you, hasn't it? , >> very difficult time. national discourse on this issue of anger and hate and prejudice in our society. it's time as we as a nation decide we are going to stop this. i think we need people, good leaders at the national level to take this issue up and make recommendations on how we can bring some of this to a halt. we realize there is free speech we have to deal with, but i think free speech doesn't go without responsibility and consequences. >> sheriff, thanks for being with us. been a long four days. sheriff dupnik will have some comments for you.

>> thank you for listening. i want to thank our guest on the john c. scott show. jeff rogers, chairman of the pima county. speaker of the house of representatives. adams spoke to the house and two staff members that continue to keep the doors open and of course the sheriff, sheriff dupnik and u.s. senator john

kyl. your comments, perhaps you could tell us of how you learned of how this horrible tragedy in your state and your reaction now. >> i was traveling back from washington, d.c. to phoenix and just as we landed, i was handed a note and immediately opened my blackberry as soon as i could and it was flooded with news. it was unfortunately the first news, so there were misreports. when i got to the end of all the messages, the news had been corrected, although we didn't have any reports as to how several she had been injured. but i was aware that judge roll had been killed and others and i made my way to the office and staff and we began to put it all together and the events then unfolded as everyone is aware. >> senator as i might recall, i

might be incorrect, but you went to iraq with her, facilitated her trip to the middle east and perhaps you could tell us about that. >> a little longer that. right after she was elected, i invited representative giffords to go to iraq with me and i think there were two other senators, maybe one other representative, i forget who was on the trip, but we went to iraq and couple of other places in the middle east and that was her first trip, of course. and i invited both representative mitchell and representative giffords, they were newly elected and had an interesting trip and we had the opportunity to know gabby and i together and i worked closely with her. >> obviously, no matter what political side of the aisle you're on, she was -- she is an

incredibly charming individual. i doubt if she ever saw you, senator, without smiling. i can't imagine that happening without her coming up with a huge grin and perhaps even a hug, even though you differed on politics and did so obviously as strongly as either one of you could. i can't imagine meeting you without a smile. >> that's right. and we had many opportunities to work since then and you are right about her personality. and that outgoing personality is a reason why she enjoyed meeting with constituents and didn't surprise me she would be out meeting her constituents. >> we could get into other issues. we are here to pray for the recovery of a congresswoman but i assume obviously, you, a public figure of long-standing, i'm sure there have been times when you looked over your

shoulder, looked through a crowd, perhaps remembering our history of violence towards our own elected official and now after this, what is the security level that should be in place when folks like yourself and gabrielle giffords, congresswoman and others are out meeting their swepts? what should happen now to perhaps protect the next life? >> first of all, i don't think most of us would want to be smothered in security or kept from our constituents. we want to lead normal lives and don't want anything to get between us and our constituents and i don't think anything will change except one thing and that is when we have public forums and probably not as small as the one gabby had, but when we have events where there are 200, 300 people, local law enforcement will be advised and she did

advise the sheriff's department and they'll send a couple of folks over to make sure nothing gets out of hand. unless there is an explicit threat, i don't think first of all, there aren't the resources to provide the kind of security that would protect us and even then, there is no way -- look at the shootings of the president. >> you have some protection do you not because you are leadership? >> five members of the house and five members of the senate who are in the succession and continueance of government and by statute, we are provided that kind of stuart. and i can tell you that aren't enough people to provide security to everybody --, well, you know, even during workdays. it is a risk that all of us are willing to take. and ordinarily it's not a problem. i would note that judge roll was a good friend of mine and he had

round-the-clock protection for a month when he had a lot of threats and that's what happens when there is a threat and there is one outstanding on me, for example, whenever there is a threat, we are provided protection until the issue is resolved. and obviously what happened to judge roll was that he literally was in the wrong place at the wrong time intending to visit with representative giffords and no longer with us. but there is not a finer public servant than judge john roll. >> thanks for spending a few moments with us. i had asked for the speaker of the house, and john rogers and the sheriff to comment oh, yes, we are a community of madmen and at least a madman who took the lives of the innocent and

helpless and defenseless but we are a community of heroes, the two men who tackled the killer, the man who stood in front of his wife as he took the bullets that could have taken her life, the mother who sheltered her child, these are people that happened without to their own safety and in a moment of terror and terrible confusion and terrible carnage, i know you are proud of them, senator. >> they did what they thought was right and didn't think about it before they acted and to add to that list, people who helped those who were wounded. i think gabby may find that she can owe her life to not only the people who helped her right there at the scene but the speed with which she was gotten to the hospital, the skill of the surgeons who were prepared to do this kind of thing.

there are a lot of people to thank. and in representative giffords' case, we hope and pray she will have a full and speedy recovery, but they have made that possible by their ability to take care of her and by the way, the others who were wounded as well. one by one, they are being released and we are being grateful. >> there has been immediate legislation passed by in a nonpartisan by every house member and senator in arizona, bill taken to the governor that will be signed and become law before the sun goes down here in arizona protecting the privacy of those that wilburry their dead during this week after this carnage. i'm sure you would suggest that is appropriate. other states have these protections as we have this nut case from toe peeka that will come to try to destroy the solemn occasion, but also the names of these -- the innocent that died. i think it is appropriate, is it

not. there must be a moment of privacy and if disruption has to be limited to some extent, i would think. >> i think so. i'm not aware of what the state legislature did. i'm greatly aware of a court case to withhold these demonstration. but it is the most unseemly republic hence i believe thing i can think of. and there are people in tucson who are prepared to attend those funerals early and line up on the sidewalk just to keep these other people from out of state to disrupt the proceedings and i appreciate the thoughtfulness that happened -- i appreciate the thoughtfulness of those who are willing to do that. >> we'll talk about political climate and other things. i know this isn't the time.

you wanted to talk about congresswoman giffords and offer your prayers as the congresswoman is and for the heroes that were there at the moment of need for their neighbors and for the unfamiliar that were around them. i thank you for doing that. i accept this interview with some limbtations and wish you the best and i want you to comment on gabrielle giffords for those who did not know her. i think from the other side of the aisle, there was admiration and affection for in remarkable congresswoman. >> you described her accurately and i appreciate the opportunity to do that. and also, frankly to mention my good friend john roll who is going to be sorl, sorl missed as one of the favorite people on the federal bench in arizona. every practitioner and every judge. he will be sorely missed.

we will talk about those issues at a later date. >> senator, kime, -- senator kyl, thanks. >> jeff rogers is here. state representative steve farley spent some time for us and republican counselman and speaker of the house of representatives kirk adams who moved this legislation to protect the privacy of those who wilburry their dead and representatives of the giffords' office. their office is open for business and they are accommodating people, constituent requests as well as those who are offering theirs -- their prayers and seeing to it their voices are heard and praying for the survival of

congresswoman gabrielle giffords shot in the head on saturday and the killing of six others and wounding of 14. also would like to thank u.s. senator kyl. sheriff dupnik was with us and did not back off from his statements and said the political statement in a arizona following 1070 and rhetoric could have been a contributing factor to this madman and killing spree. he said we must take a look at this. he mentioned gun control and mentioned about mental for people and is it available and could have prevented. in studio for our audience is the chair of the republican party in pima county, brian miller, thanks for being with us. >> obviously, you were a candidate in the primary to run against gabrielle giffords. you were campaign to take her on

in the general election. let's talk about your election with giffords, you said you would be a better candidate. but others that were running, you had respect for this congresswoman, didn't you? >> i absolutely did. and got to meet gabrielle giffords one time behind the lights and the cameras and we had a nice talk, i don't know, 20, 25 minutes and i can tell you in that short amount of time, you can tell what kind of person you are dealing with. i would like to think so. and i can tell you, she is a good, decent, hornlable and dedicated servant and nice and gentle nice woman. >> you are a pilot and flew in afghanistan and continue to train pilots here. >> yes. >> you were recent little elected as chair of the republican party. >> pima county republican party.

>> one of the first things that has happened here, pretty informal on c-span and on our show for that matter, i believe you were contacted by rogers, the nutcase from kansas, the idea he would call the dead vicious names and attack gareds lying wounded fighting for her life. he has been known for disrupting military funeral services across the country and looked upon and said he would come here to disrupt and protest. you join jeff rogers, the chair of the democratic party as well as well as the tea pearlt movement and said, look, we will all join hands and stand shoulder to shoulder to prevent these disruption of the mourners at these funerals and you did not hesitate as i recall. >> jeff rogers and i and trent

hum fridays, we stand arm in harm committed to minimizing the impact this this group has on the dignity and respect that our community deserves and these families deserve. wer like you said, we have yet to bury the dead. people are mourning and this is the human aspect of it and can't be overlooked and we will do what we can to minimize their impact. i don't know the details what has come out of phoenix in the state legislature, but regardless of that, there will be a unified effort to minimize their impact. >> well, brian, new law will prevent a particular distance from which these protestors can travel toward the mourners and will be enforced. if it is not enforced, you will be there to see to it that these people will have the dignity to

bury their dead in the privacy of their mourning and i know jeff rogers will join you. that is one thing that all of us can agree on. there is no question, in your campaign in the primary, there was heated rhetoric over immigration, gun control, abortion, all kinds of things. you weren't willing to participate in this hate talk. i don't want to suggest, although it might be appropriate that those who were more than willing to do that, preach fear, prejudice and hate, to do that to get elected and i won't draw attention to them. you refused to do that and you said that is not appropriate. you said it during your campaign. >> i did . i'm very proud of the -- i was always proud of the way that we ran my campaign. and the reason it was always like that is because i do believe in the integrity of the

process. i believe in the goodness of the american system. and in order to do that, you have to take, i think it is required, to take the personalization out, to talk about policy, not personalities, to talk about the issues on the table as oppose todd the characters behind them. it's not the -- sometimes not the most effective way to politic, because you try to take the emotion out, but i believe in the long run that is what gives us a healthy system. i think that this is one of the learning points, i suppose, of an event like this, is it recages us to what is really important and allows us to see, i hope, that people that enter life of public service, you cannot forget their humanity. yes, we are always going to criticize people in public service but remember to criticize their arguments or

their ideas and never to go after them personally, demonize them, because it is dangerous. i do not want to insinuate that that led to these events on saturday. i and the pima county republican party will lead by example. we will not cast blame or point fingers because at this point there is conjecture, there is an ongoing investigation and it is irresponsible to do so and we will continue to push for a time of healing and not blaming because we are in the human aspect of this where people are still clinging to life and people are burying their loved ones. brian miller, the chair of the pima county republican pilot, candidate for the primary in congressional district eight and won by gabrielle giffords who

fights for her life at university medical center. there isn't any question that this is going to come up about the rhetoric, but i think perhaps it's an opportunity to change. speaking with the speaker of the house of representatives, he suggested it is time to lower the level of the talk and no question that steve farley said, i apologize and i'm sorry if i crossed the line. it may be an opportunity, including me, i have the microphone to call people names and i have. perhaps it's time to say we have to eliminate the personalities and talk about the issues. we will always differ on issues. there are many opposed as to how we deal with illegal immigration. it is an emotional issue and it is an environment of race, death

and those who die trying toll come across. these are emotional issues. how this legislature will deal with the budget deficit that may go back to cutting more of education funding k-12, cutting 300,000 people off access of health insurance because of this budget crisis, there will be heated debate and many will disagree with how to solve the financial crisis of arizona. hopefully this tragedy will bring us to a point where we can discuss it without the name calling. do you see that as a possibility? you have been in the middle of these debates and name calling. you didn't participate in on it but you have seen it and i have as well. >> you always try to learn lessons from events in life and something as tragic as this, there are bound to be many

opportunities from that. and i would say if we take what you just described from this, that would be a plus. but, you know, somehow we have to learn that and i think it would be appropriate and i hope that we can continue -- you know, i made the comment recently, i hope we get back to the heated rhetoric, i mean heated debate, but like i said, i never been comfortable, never been personally approved of the personal attacks and that sort of thing because i think it is counterproductive and i will lead the republican party to the best of my ability in that direction and i know a lot of them agree with me. i did get elected as the chair and we are headed in the right direction and i hope jeff rogers will do the same on his side. >> i'm sure you never heard from the republicans since saturday that said anything but, my, god,

and i hope and pray that gabrielle giffords recovers, that we can comfort the families of the dead and pray for the survival of those wounded. and i know that's what the number of calls -- i mean i have followed politics here for 47 years. and i'm positive that's what the phone calls -- i don't want to be a public relations voice for the republican party. i don't want to answer but what was the reabsence? >> people that knew of my dealings in politics, they would come up or it was at church, running into people at the store, sorry republicans, some not affiliated with politics,, but there was a huge outpouring of emotions. people outside the community, if you take away the professions,

judge roll and representative giffords, this was an aassault in our community, in our city and we are dealing with it on personal level and i think the people here in tucson get it and i'm very proud to be a member of this community and i think we will continue to allow these families and friends to grieve with dignity. >> by the way, i'm sure in your military life, you have seen heroism, there are those that would step up to protect their comrades. i have tried to emphasize throughout all our talk shows, that, yeah, we are a community of a madman and there are crazies out there and perhaps we failed in not only we disburse our guns but mental health might have been able to deter this individual. we don't know and we need to

talk about it on talk radio or c-span, but there were heroes there. and you know, there is another point before we get to the heroes, when we talk about gabe zimmerman and here was this spokesperson for gabby giffords' campaign and for her office that died in the line of duty. these people, this congressmen and women are in the line of duty and he died in the line of duty, perhaps not on the battle front? >> reading about the events, reaction of the crowd members, the heroes that stopped the gunman the other day, i don't think you can look at that and not get choked up about it, about the willingness of these people to risk their lives, to put an end to that madness.

on the front of the "arizona republic," we have this pick and it says my friend's dad was shot. and that's what we have to remember is the fact that our community is hurting and i appreciate that you are willing -- that we can discuss these politics later. and believe me, there is a lot to discuss, a lot of things has been said that i cannot wait until the time is appropriate to address them. but for now, we must focus on this, focus on the fact that that this girl's friend's dad was shot. >> the heroism, too, and those in the military like yourself, train and fly an a-10 are trained to go into harm's way. it must be something in your mind that says how much you admire these citizens, the

elderly, the 75-year-old woman grabbing for the magazine and knowing he could have shot her. and the wounded man with the crease across his forehead was on top of him and another man who obviously did not realize that the gun was not secure, that any moment the gunman could have inserted another clip and shot 31 more people. they were on top of him. and i hashingen back to the man who threw himself in front of his wife to protect her and the mother who grabbed her daughter to protect her and was shot three times. and then, of course, the idea that daniel hernandez ran toward the bullets and grabbed gabrielle giffords, hugged her and tried to treat her wound and stop the bleeding, that is an astounding situation, those are

beyond those who are trained to react to a war situation, but they did. so. it's just amazing. and as a trained military pilot, your admiration must be amazing. >> it's off the charts. when you train for something like that. at a certain point the training takes over. but if you haven't been, i can only stand back in awe at the actions of these people. >> very quickly, there is no question, the politics will continue. you and i both know that. but a dialogue should be here. we are a progressive radio station and have been throughout this evolution of political up-al in the state of arizona but we interview more republicans than we do democrats, but ought to be a place on talk radio, a place

where people can come and share their differences and ask for understanding about their particular point of view. if we don't have that means by which people can address their grieveances or talk with people and i fear that elected officials may be more foreign to us and not available to us because of security reasons, we will lose a key in our democracy, won't we? it will be several damaged? >> one of the things we must guard against immediately and i hope no one misunderstands, i'm going to compare it with september 11, 2001, not in scope, but in the potential for overreach or pennsylvania bad reaction by politicians and with good intent. we must remember that we are

individuals were rights, natural rights, civil rights that must not be trampled upon by the government and i don't want to get into the individual politics of it, but inevitably, whenever there is a tragedy, we must guard as citizens and stand together and say that we can take care of these things because i will also advise this, no politician, no law, no policy, no nothing can ever stop the incidents of random, isolated violence. there has always been a case in the history of humankind and there always will be. i think this event is more a reflection of culture than politics but politics reflects culture and the responsibility lies to be really affected in each individual in the community, in our churches, in

our synagogues, in our clubs, in our gatherings, because sometimes we have a little bit too much trust in the ability of politicians. >> we are talking with brian miller, chair of republican party in pima county. i want to thank u.s. senator john kyl and called us from the phoenix capital of arizona and thank sheriff dupnik who did not back off he against his comments and thank steve farley who is a democrat, who was a part of the law-making body in phoenix that moved today the arizona legislature to pass an emergency act to protest within 300 feet

during funeral or burial services. passed unanimously through the state house and senate as a measure to prevent a planned protest against the memorial services and funeral services. and even the democrats joined in with republicans to do this. a state senator said we have joined together to provide small nesh of comfort for the families grieving. and the state shall not allow picturing or engagement of protesting activities and shall not cause activities to occur within 300 feet of a property line of any establishment during a funeral or burial service he. other states have been passed these laws. it shall be enforced in tucson, arizona,, as the families bury their dead. we will talk with the governor

of the state of arizona who spoke before the legislature and limited her remarks to the terrible tragedy in tucson saturday but also in speaking with other engagements as well as a news conference calling gabrielle giffords her friend and sharing the emotion of sadness and of grieve that all of us feel here in arizona. the governor certainly, a very -- somewhat popular and many respects governor in 1070 and received

we can learn from this horrible, terrible tragedy before we talk with governor brewer. >> just remembering that everybody engaged in politics i think at some level for their entire level, they were trying to do what they believe is best. this is the humanity of it. we disagree on policy and ideas, but we can never forget that we are all just fellow travelers and i hope we can remember that going forward. >> that will come sbool play as republicans talk about their political agenda, which differs obviously from the democratic one. arizona is faced with an incredible amount of obstacles. our debt may be as high as $2 million and severe cuts within our school system, health care. there is no citizen of arizona

that will not be affected by the enormityy of the economic challenges of arizona. a state harder hit than any other, from a housing decline to the terrible destruction of our economy, unemployment rate still at 10rs and perhaps many people believe it to be higher. but we have terrible obstacles and challenges and must overcome them. brian, thanks. we need to go to the governor. >> and i know the people of arizona will rise to the challenge. >> brian, thank you soich much. here is the governor of the state of arizona, the honorable january brewer. governor, thanks for being with us today. >> good afternoon, john and to all your listeners. >> from your victory and election you were expected to lay out an ambitious policy agenda, but in the wake of this

terrible tragedy, you deferred your annual address to call for prayer and mourning for the victims of the mass shooting, the target was gabrielle giffords. i was moved by your touching remarks following the shooting. you spoke of gabrielle giffords not just as a fellow political figure, but as a friend. >> absolutely. and a friend she was. she i is a friend to everybody in arizona but especially to her constituents. this is a terrible tragedy and we need to continue our grieving pro -- process, certainly, and i believe postponing my presentation on the state of the state, we delivered actually what the state of the state was, we were in pain, deep pain and we are going to come together

and not let this bring us down and right from all of this. it has a horrible, horrible tragedy. one that anyone could have ever imagined in their worst nightmare. >> you will sign, if you have not already, this legislation passed in an emergency act barring the protest activities within 300 feet for a funeral or burial service. >> absolutely. i'm on my way back to phoenix, and if it is on my desk, i will put my signature on it. >> you must have felt goodall coming together to protect the privacy of those who mourn the dead. perhaps it is the beginning of a more, i think, civil discourse about our politics. certainly, it was an act of unison, republicans and democrats saying, we can't solve the problems, can't understand perhaps this horrible tragedy but we can protect those who

mourn our dead and we will do that in arizona. >> absolutely. and it is the right thing to do. and we will come together again on other issues. philosophically, we will always have our differences, but in regards to this particular issue, we will come together and we have in the past, john, you know that. but this was an important piece of legislation that we get it done quickly and they have done that, i understand. and as soon as i have it on my desk, you will have my proud signature on it. >> governor, i know that your time is limited here, but there is absolutely no question that are tucson is in the spotlight once again of a terrible tragedy. here we are on c-span, all across the country, all across the globe and speaking to people here in southern arizona, what do you say to people who might be concerned about this image of

arizona after this mass killing and our debates over illegal immigration legislation and other issues that perhaps divide us. what do you say to the people all across this country about your state? >> i think after seeing what happened and the city of tucson and arizona, the people across america have seen the resiliencey of a community that is supportive of each other, that are decent, good people. i just came from the hospital. saw the people out there with the vigil, praying, showing their courage and they saw our fire department, our paramedics, our e.m.s., u.n.c. hospital, staff, emergency room doctors and staff, everyone working together. they saw a community that is

loved and is loved. and i'm so proud -- it's an unfortunate situation what has happened down here on saturday, by it's not going to bring us down, john. we are going to rise and learn from it. and that was an assault certainly on our republic and our democracy. it's not going to bring us down. we are going to rise together. >> governor, thank you for your comments today on our show and thank you for your comments on c-span and the rest of the world. i appreciate this opportunity to talk with you. this is now something that we all have to come together to not only to learn to deal with, deal with our grieve, our anger and come together as a state that can overcome this horrific, terrible tragedy. governor january brewer, thanks for being with us. >> thank you, john.

>> we had members from the arizona legislature. we had the communications director of giffords' office and a constituent services representative of gabrielle giffords' office, expressing love and support for their boss. we want to thank sheriff is dupnik. and thank senator john kyl for being with us and he spoke to us about security of the public officials not only across the nation. brian miller, chair of the pima county republican party and governor of arizona, honorable january brewer and go to democratic senator from phoenix. senator, thanks for being with us, your comments on the

bipartisan approach to protecting those that will mourn the dead here in tucson after this tragedy. >> it's my pleasure, john, and i have to say extend my thanks to the senate president and speaker of the house and republican democratic colleagues for joining me in supporting this legislation which we passed today in both chambers and is on the governor's desk. it is not a partisan event. there is time for politics and time for prayers. j.d. hayworth said that. we agree. we need to provide comfort and protection so they can be free from harassment and intimidation. >> i talk about heated rhetoric all the time and take tremendous exception to what is happening in arizona from an and log that i disagree with. i don't think i will stop that. i will be critical of a republican majority that may do away with insurance for 300,000

people of arizona. i don't know how i will continue to do it. you have been one of the more outupon critics and this is a role you will continue to play. this has changed us all. i'm not quite sure and may lower the level of our discourse and may bring us back to more civility. but i'm not sure, what do you think? >> it is too early to tell but you and i have talked about it many times. even before this great tragedy, we talked br the need to return to civility. i believe very strongly in the things i believe in and ready to speak for that and continue to work for them, but i have done so and do so in a way that is respectful and find compromise and consensus and do it without the intensive rhetoric that we have seen escalating in past years.

that is not partisan but both sides of the aisle have said so and so is a terrorist, not patriotic, and those are the terms we don't need to use but we should talk about our differences in policy instead of villifying each other and adding to this boiling pot of rhetoric. >> we ought to eliminate this association with weapons in politics. you know, i really think that no matter this climate caused this horrible tragedy or not, when you associate guns and automatic weapons at a gathering of the president in phoenix or the association of targeting, i think somewhere there ought to be a line drawn. i only have 40 seconds here, senator, but guns and politics, please. >> gosh, that's a tough one. this is arizona, so the 2nd amendment is probably one of the most important amendments to our state, but we have a duty as a

legislature to provide some reasonable regulations to protect the citizens of our community and we can have a honest discussion once we get through the difficult time of fighting and supporting gabby and the other survivors and mourning those whose lives have been lost. senator, i appreciate you taking time with us. we have had many guests from the arizona state legislature and giffords' staff. thanks to our

in washington, d.c., this is all little less than an hour.

>> i want to welcome you all here and senator leahy. he has been here a number of times, i think because we have the biggest first amendment sinon the world. right out there with all 45 words of the first amendment. senator leahy is such a champion of the first amendment. he cannot go by pennsylvania avenue without looking at it. we appreciate you coming back here today, senator leahy. in this very room, president obama held a town meeting. the week after next, the supreme court justice breyer is going to come here to talk about matters of the judiciary and public issues. it is a delight that the newsuem to serve as a place where the members of the executive branch, the legislative branch, and the

judiciary branch in come here and hold civilized discourse about public affairs, about the media, about the things that abydos, and the things that bring us together. it is in that light that the newseum is delighted to welcome senator leahy today. i am going to turn the program over to the dean of the georgetown university law center, welcome, bill. [applause] >> it is a pleasure to be here. our speaker come at it become a tradition to begin each new congress with a report on the upcoming priorities of the senate judiciary committee which he chairs. the georgetown university law

center has been proud to play a partner in role and chairman leahy's others and we are especially place and see is one of our most distinguished alumni not only did he earned a law degree in 1954, but 30 years later, we were pleased to recognize his service with an honorary degree. in the united states senate, patrick leahy offers a unique combination of experience, expertise, and currency in some of the most significant issues of our day. he is a blend of old school and new school. now the second most senior member of the senate, he also continues to lead on cutting edge technology issues. as the "new york times" have dubbed him, for is enthusiasm of the internet. he has that passion for civil liberties, the devotion to the rule of law of a former

prosecutor, and the enthusiasm for technology of a 16-year-old. [laughter] he is often held congress bridge the gap between security and privacy, taking the lead in writing checks and balances into such laws as the communication assistance for law enforcement act and the first and second patriot act. if patrick leahy was elected to the united states senate in 1974. he remains the only democrat ever elected to this office from vermont. at 34, he was the young this united states senator ever to be elected from the green mountain state. a graduate of st. michael's college in vermont, he received his j.d. from georgetown university and served for eight years as state's attorney in a can county where he gained a national reputation, and in 1974, he was selected as one of

three outstanding prosecutors in the united states. he has been a champion of an independent judiciary and open government and the public's right to know. the son of a month per earlier printing family, in 1996 he was installed as of freedom act hall of fame, and the is one of only two politicians ever offered an award. he has partnered with republican senator john corn and to offer several improvements, including their open government act, of 2007. he was also the lead sponsor of the protection act which addresses flaws in the capital punishment, and in 2004, he offered provisions of law to require dna testing and better access to competent legal counsel to ensure that innocent people are not executed. long known for his work on congressional oversight, he led

the judiciary committee's 2007 investigation into the massive firings of u.s. attorneys and the political influence over a decision making. he is voted on the nomination of all current supreme court justices and he oversaw and chaired the hearings of the last three confirmations to the court, justice sotomayor, and justice kagan. he is also a member of this agriculture committee and his long cochaired in energize the work of the senate national guard office in its efforts to modernize and adequately equip the modern national guard of today. he has three children and five grandchildren. his home is in middlesex, vt., where they live in the 19th century farmhouse in the midst of their farm. senator leahy. [applause] >> dean, thank you very much for

the introduction. it's hard being away from the farmhouse, but charles, i thank you in your superb staff. hosting this discussion means a lot. you and i have worked together on these issues over the years. i must admit, when i started preparing this speech, press: and others in my office, we were talking about it, things change. over the weekend. we can talk about the tragic events of these past week and for a moment. they call us to reflect on the parlance of our democracy, and our responsibilities as beneficiaries and stewards. as we enter this beautiful program today, many of us passed by these magnificent words of

the first amendment. charleses' carve them into marble on the facade. their 74 feet high. congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof, or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press, or their right of the people peaceably to assemble and petition the government for redress of grievances. parents used to say that everything we needed in a democracy is in there. it promises diversity, practice any religion or nine if you want, to speed can be protected by your government in your speech. that guarantees diversity. you guarantee diversity, you guarantee a democracy. the day before she was in the attack, congresswoman giffords, a member of the house of

representatives, whose role was to recite these words on the house floor. in a free society, the society that we americans must always want our country to become a government should not and must not restrain free expression. but we learned this children, with freedom comes responsibility. couple flowering of democracy relies on the self restraint of each citizen, organization, and group of citizens. the blog post and the twitter feed all have the power to inspire, to motivate, and to inform. but they also have the power to inflame and in sighcite.

the seating rhetoric has gone too far. the demonizing of opponents, of government, of public servants, has gone too far. our politics have become incendiary. we all share the responsibility the temperature. that is a responsibility to keep our democracy thriving. the 535 members of the house and the senate have been at elected to represent more than 300 million americans from all walks of life. we have responsibilities within our borders, but we also have responsibilities outside our borders. as our nation charts its way into complex and often very dangerous world. it is time to stop polarizing and to work together on the

substance of the many challenges we face as a nation. otherwise, our country, a blessed, bountiful, expansive nation, which survived a revolutionary war, a civil i cannot accept that. neither should anybody in this room. you know, i am the only democrat elected to the senate in vermont history. i was introduced that way once shortly after i was elected.

he carried every state except maine and vermont. shortly after that, franklin roosevelt came to vermont. my father told me the story. across the street from us was the national life insurance company. president roosevelt went by in an open car and my father was standing next to the president of the national and everybody wore hats. the president went by and the head of the company took his hat off and held it direct my father turned the women said, i never thought i would see your -- you take your hat off for president roosevelt. he said, i tip my hat off to the president. think about that. we should show respect.

the sheriff was in every man for this tragic moment. we need to work together for the good of the country and the american people. after oklahoma city, after the horrendous a tax of 9/11, we came together. we need to come together again. the tragedy is -- on common ground. it is easy to appeal to resentments, distressed, and selfishness and hate. leaders should appeal to or better angels. one common ground remains elusive, we must respect the rights of others to express their own views and beliefs. one more thing -- we must not

allow any assault on representatives of democracy to succeed in thwarting or meeting people's access to the elected representatives. i am committed to work with the new chairman as well as the president and the attorneys general as we face the problem confronting our nation. i look forward to working with the new ranking republican. we served together since he came to the senate in 1981. we know the value of bipartisanship and civility. i began meeting with the senator last month. i will make sure they include those that are important to both of us. we have taken a keen interest in -- the first bill we

considered last congress and one of the bills we signed into law by president obama was the recovery act. working together, we also strengthened and we made sure that taxpayers would be protected from fraud. in the new congress, we need to build on that progress. i will focus the first hearing of this congress on fighting fraud. on our january 6 -- 26 tiering, we plan to learn more about the recovery of more than $3 billion of taxpayer dollars in fraud actions by the department of justice in the past fiscal year alone. that is our taxpayer -- tax dollars coming back into the treasury. the administration has been a partner and our crime-fighting

efforts. we want to make sure that the new provisions are having the intended effect. i can tell you that these kind of investments will pay taxpayers back many times over. americans are worried about their budgets at home. we need to protect their investment. fighting fraud and protecting taxpayer dollars -- these difficult economic times, we need to continue that. of bipartisanship. we also have to talk about focusing on american jobs. last year, the senate judiciary committee unanimously supported bipartisan efforts to stop

online criminals from stealing our nation's intellectual property. it cost the economy billions of dollars every year. barring -- our intellectual property based businesses are one of the most productive in our economy. they are part of our best sources of export dollars. we cannot stand by and see them ravaged. we cannot have americans consumers subjected. we will renew our efforts on this this year. among our top priorities is the patent reform act. this bipartisan initiative to modernize our patent system has received considerable attention in the last several congresses. there are days i feel that i hold schedule revolves around that. we have been updating our antiquated pat and system will

keep america -- patent system will keep america the forefront of innovation. it protects jobs. it does it without adding a sense -- a cent to our nation's deficit. he agrees that patent reform is sorely needed. again, this is something more democrats and republicans can work together, can help the country, and help lower the tension. we work together over the years in confronting anti-competitive business concept, especially in agriculture. the last two years, the justice department has become more aggressive in protecting competition. competition -- this is a very interesting thing.

we will build on that as we talk about the concentration and agricultural businesses. i hope congress will finally repealed the health insurance industry's exemption from antitrust laws. there was bipartisan support for that in the last congress. there is no place in our market for anti-competitive abuses. repealing this antitrust is a good way to start. it is in the health-insurance market. there are many ways in which the committee can help our economic recovery. we can strengthen programs. it encourages foreign investment, spur is job creation.

i would like to see foreign money come in here to create jobs in the united states more than american money going abroad and creating jobs in other countries. we will look at how we can move forward toward immigration proposals spurted ways to approve of the subprograms. -- ways to improve visa programs. there are some good economic science finally. democrats and republicans should be working together on these measures. the american people expect us to work together. the american people expect us to make the country better. -- we have also seen the last decade encroach on

america is privacy. there is no other decade in our history imperative of security, the proliferation databases, the spawning of interactive social media combined with earlier expectations about having the choice to be left alone. i will tell you a story. one of the few things i have kept -- is friend of my wall. -- it is sprayed on my wall. it is a short piece on that profiled me. we live on a dirt road. the family has known me since i was a teenager. it is saturday morning, and at a

state car drives up and sees the old farmer. he says, the senator live up this road? the farmer says, are you a relative of his? he said, no, i am not. are you a friend of this? not really. is he expecting you? never heard of him. [laughter] we believe in our privacy. in the digital age, a time darkened by the threat of terrorism, we face a difficult challenge of protecting the nation's. we encourage american innovation and we respect privacy rights. the jury committee will continue to work to of state electronic communications privacy act. i want security agencies to have the tools needed to keep us safe from cyber threats. i also want to have federal

privacy laws to keep pace with advancing technology. this is not an easy balance. i think it can be done. we will examine several emerging privacy issues and a growing concern to me and many americans. including the invasive full body screening and our airports. the tracking of americans activities online. i want to work with the obama administration with senators on both sides of the aisle to revisit the communications assistance to law enforcement act. it bridges law enforcement needs with citizens' privacy rights. i remember writing that law in their early 1990's. we cannot even have imagined that it has changed. we have to update the law. we have to have the same

consideration we had in the 1990's. balancing privacy rights as well as a legitimate need for law enforcement community to gather valuable court ordered surveillance information to keep the nation safe. the aftermath of 9/11, we passed the patriot act. i am pleased that attorney general walter agreed to implement the civil liberties oversight and reporting improvement i suggested. it is a good solid step forward. we have to take the next step and extend certain provisions of that act that are slated to expire next month. there is another area in this annual reports. chief justice roberts recently wrote about the urgent need to fill the federal decency --

federal judiciary vacancies. they have reached historically high levels. that resulted overburdened courts. litigants' are unable to have their cases heard. i will try to work with the senator and the senate leadership of both parties to lower those vacancies. unfortunately, this is another instance where private -- partisanship has been a destructive influence. we need good and capable women and men to be willing to serve as judges. to protect the rights of all americans and appalled blog -- and uphold a rule of law. we cannot to ask people to take on the public servants -- service of judge ben expose them to accumulating delays in the process. we can protect our national security and our constitutional

liberties, but it takes care and foresight. this is not an area where we can use symbolism. we go to substance. do we want to be saved? do we want to protect ourselves? of course we do. let's be honest. it is going to take work to have that balance. at a time -- we need care and foresight. we continue to face the threat of terrorism and violence. the american people expect us to do no less. the government of the people, by the people, for the people must be accountable to the people. we need a commitment to vigorous oversight and government transparency. when we can join together, republicans and democrats, -- a

conservative republican from texas, he is joined with me over and over again to strengthen and expand the freedom of information act. we share the view that open government is not very democratic issue or a republican issue. it is an american value. we will continue our productive partnerships. i will reintroduce the act, a bill to establish a bipartisan commission and improve the implementation of. we will do that later this year. you also have to do it by example. i will pledge that the proceedings of the committee will continue to be web cast, available to all americans in real time. like internet access to hearings and business meetings. i know it works.

i get back to my office and there will be a call, what did you mean by that? the important thing is that it is open. it is a special honored to be at newseum on pennsylvania avenue. i am the son of this paper publishers. we drove down today and i thought how my parents would have loved the idea and the reality of this great museum. i'd been mom and dad would have embraced the incidents -- indispensable work of free speech and a free press. do not ever stop. it is so easy to argue for censorship for just this one issue or just this one issue. no.

open, free debate. i think the constitution project for their interest. review in the judiciary committee's priorities is becoming a tradition. i like this kind of traditions. just last week, members of the congress were sworn in, pledging to uphold the constitution. with its new term comes a responsibility of governing. as john f. kennedy said, to govern is to choose. i served in the majority and minority. three democratic president and four republican presidents.

i know that we can be productive. i worked with republican house chairman. i worked with the republican senate majority and republican president to extend the voting rights act. to enact the innocence protection act, which provides dna testing for those wrongfully convicted. i look forward to continuing this tradition. this is a new year. this is a new congress. the year started in a very tragic and troubling way. every year is a year of promise for america. in our committee, we have a challenging agenda. we have the challenge with some

of the most capable members. we pursue the goals and make good artist a more perfect union. i thank you for listening to me very sad -- to me. [applause] >> he will be glad to take some questions as time permits. he will take questions from the audience. many of you may have asked questions -- past questions to the aisle. ok. questions from the press? >> thank you, senator. in the wake of the shooting at fort hood, there was a push by the president and others to

withhold judgment about the man's botas and intentions until more was known. however, in the wake of the most recent shooting, there was no shortage of accusations that the two-party or talk-radio was behind motivating the individual. why is there the lack of caution on this particular incident? >> the president withheld judgment in the first situation. it implied that he did not in this instance. the president has taken the same position on both. he has withheld judgment, as he should. i prosecuted lot of murder cases. i have arrested murderers. i withhold judgment until the evidence is in. the president has done this in both cases. president obama is right in doing that.

it is a heinous crime, terrible crime. i want members of congress to be able to meet anywhere in this country with their constituents. this is part of our open government. the ability to petition congress, to speak to congress. i do not want that to change. let's find out what happens. let's not get a tragedy mixed up in politics. the president has not and i have not. i am more interested in finding out what was the motivation of the person who has been arrested. my heart goes out to the families of those who love lost members, a nine-year-old girl, a husband who died protecting his wife, a super qualified member,

a highly respected member of congress fighting for life. those are the things we should be concerned about. >> the first question from the audience, do you believe cyber security legislation will move ahead this session? >> thank you. i think cyber security legislation has to move ahead. we are losing billions of dollars because of the fraud on the internet. a lot of it is from overseas. we pay -- are real questions of our security. so much of what we do is done via computers and internet.

think about the heating systems when it is five below zero in the northeast or other parts of the country. think of the devastating consequences of a cyber attack. think of the billions and billions of dollars counterfeit goods are sold and many of them coming from overseas. people have lost life savings. people have had their bank accounts and their credit relent. -- relent. -- ruined. my guess is that if we can -- i am working with governments and with industry, with users, consumers. i am trying to bring them all end to make sure that everybody is that the table.

i can guarantee that if we read the most perfect bill this year and pass it, it a couple of years, we will have to revisit it. i want to write a bill that can be updated. the types of problems that we are seeing and the types of attacks is amazing. >> we have two more questions from the audience. the first concerns patent reform. you're a minute to the pop reform act was seen as a strong and widely acceptable compromise on a complicated issue. you mentioned your conversations with their house colleagues. police star with a blank slate? >> -- will you start with a blank slate? >> when i began working on padded reform, i had hair. [laughter] i do not want to go back to a blank slate. we have done an enormous amount of work.

we have brought an end -- we have brought in every state culture. -- stakeholder. we have had countless meetings with all the stakeholders. we have worked with the patent office and others. i think the bipartisan legislation we put together is a good step and it is a good place to begin. i will not start with a blank slate. i will work with both republicans and democrats in both the house and senate to try to have a good solid bill or we can begin. if it comes to the floor of the senate, it will pass. i would like to do it now before we get tangled up next year with presidential elections and everything else. >> a few more questions. what do you anticipate the

senate will do in reaction to disclosures by wikileaks? >> i wish i knew the answer. i know the justice department has already had subpoenas' out. we have been revealing what the law is. -- revealing what the law is. -- reviewing what the law is. i believe in an open government, but i do not believe in putting good men and women in danger. we have had to bring people out of other countries where they were serving at great risk to their own lives, serving to protect your safety, my safety. they were very valuable in doing that and we have had to remove them from those countries because they had been exposed.

we have seen people in some countries who have faced the death or have been killed because of that. that is not responsible. i will also ask the obvious question. i had lasted so many times in my office. what in heck do we have all this material or a private to first- onto could download it cds? who made that can -- and of made that decision? -- who made that decision? >> what are the specific plans they considered to strengthen

eb5? >> it is a program where investors are able to come from overseas, invest in businesses in the united states and they move forward in the immigration process doing it. that is the shorthand to it. it is being used in many places. it has been used very effectively in my state. there been some questions whether it has been misused and other places. in most places, it has been used well. i think it should be made a permanent program, but with some very specific oversight. government and congressional oversight to make sure that it does best -- money comes in to the united states, creates

jobs, americans are being hired for those jobs. frankly, as an american, i would wrapped -- much rather see money coming from outside this country coming in and creating jobs. >> we have three questions on the nomination process. the first is -- what did you schedule for nomination hearings? when will mr. -- when will the atf nominee will likely have a hearing? >> especially those who went through the committee unanimously last year. they should not have to go through it again.

i do not know how you ask someone. you put them through a humiliating to lead. i am urging all of us to back away from that. the president has gone across party lines. he has saw the advice of republican senators and democratic senators. we have to get away from that. i will put on the agenda very quickly those two of already been confirmed. the president sent most of those names back to us. we senators are dependent on our staff. they do the work. we will get them through.

there are so many vacancies. we had 85 district courts with vacancies. 16 circuit courts. first president bush's two years in office, the democrats were in charge for a year-and-a-half. in a year-and-a-half, we went through 100 of its judges. i just happen to have these numbers here. [laughter] we were able to put through only about half of that, just over half of that. we have to get away from that. you have good men and women who are willing to serve. let them do that.

be a judge is a prestigious office. it is a very hard working office. it does not come without risk. as we saw this weekend. >> the final to questions also concerned delays in the process. what can be done differently to speed up the confirmation process for judges? the delays in confirming federal judges to a tragic toll. meetttended congresswoman's and greet. what will the senate judiciary committee to do -- due to honor his memory? >> that was a leading question.

[laughter] i am going to both democratic and republican leadership and say, this is a new congress. what's that back. let's do something similar to what i did in my first two years. let's move judges through quickly. we will have been heard in in committee and they will be confirmed their carry it if you have somebody who has been confirmed unanimously, the tradition has always been -- you

take 10 minutes of debate equally divided and to roll call them. they go through unanimously. i want to get back to them. let's have a debate on them. and then vote. but vote yes, vote no, do not vote may be. >> we have time for two more questions from the press. >> you were the target of an attack in 2001. i am wondering if you could talk about whether that attack or this one will change how you interact with constituents or other senators. >> i had an attack on myself shortly after 911. i received one of the deadly anthrax letters. people died because of letters addressed to me. i still wonder who sent it and

why they sent it. i will wonder that for the rest of my life. for a period of time, the capitol police were superb, providing security. i felt i really did not need it. i felt totally safe in my state of vermont. it is this a this state in the nation. i know our local and state police in vermont have procedures for public meetings. i am very satisfied with what they are. i will not go into the details for security reasons. the capital itself is very, very secure. when i think about what it was like at law school,