.. brian: left-hand linda, author of "the lobster chronicles." you say that the world's most dangerous profession is fishing. why? linda: well, i think mostly it's because of bad weather. you're definitely, you know, out in the weather, especially sword fishing, i've done all different types of fishing but fatigue is often a factor but i think bad weather is the biggest factor.

brian: how many friends have you lost over the years from fishing? linda: close friends, i've lost nearly a dozen. but there's this real sort of fraternity among fishermen that when you hear about someone going down or being lost at sea or being killed aboard a boat, you may not know them but you do feel some connection. brian: how long you been fishing? linda: i've been fishing since i was 19 years old and i'm 41 now, so 21 years. brian: why do you fish? linda: i am passionate about fishing. people always ask me, what do you like about it? i like the way i feel when i'm at sea. brian: so when you were 19, where did it all start? linda: i started as a cook on a swordfishing boat and at the time it was a summer job to help pay my way through college. brian: where did you go to college? linda: i won't to colby college in maine. >> this book called "the lobster chronicles" is what book for you? linda: book number two. brian: what was book number one and when did it come out? linda: book number one was "the hungry ocean" and it was published in 1999. brian: about? linda: swordfishing, the book

is structured around a 30-day swordfishing trip to the grand banks of newfoundland. brian: and what's your relationship with the whole perfect storm movie and the perfect storm story and sebastian junger? linda: well, i suppose most people, if they've ever heard of linda greenlaw recognize my name as the woman who survived the perfect storm. i was the captain of the andrea gail's sister ship, so most people make the perfect storm connection right, you know, very quickly. i was running that swordfishing boat the last six years that i swordfished and because of the book -- people always ask you how did the perfect storm change your life? the weather event didn't really change my life a great deal but the book by sebastian junger changed my life from fishing to writing. i started, because of the very generous portrayal of me in that book, started getting a lot of attention from the media and got some attention from publishers. brian: what year did the -- did you start the writing thing then? linda: it took me one year to

write my first book. so i started in 1998 and finished in 1999. brian: now when we record this -- we're reporting this in august, your book is number two on the new york bestseller's list. do you ever expect that linda: no. i've been so surprised and thrilled that this has happened. brian: why do you think this is happening? linda: i have a theory that i think people are really generally interested in reading nonfiction written by someone who has done what they're talking about. because i -- so many people coming up to me signing the book and saying really they felt like they were on the boat with me and they feel that it's a very genuine story and people seem to find that very refreshing. brian: now when i looked at your book tour, it's enormous. the number of -- how many places have you gone? linda: my original tour was supposed to be two months taking me to 60 bookstores and now the tour is being extended to a foliage tour so i'm going to go home for a little while in september and then go back

on tour for maybe just a couple of weeks in october the brian: how are your crowds? linda: they've been great. identify been, again, very surprised, not so much at the crowds in maine. when i'm in maine, it's my home state. i was anticipating some really nice support, and i've gotten that but identify been really genuinely pleased with the support that i've gotten outside of maine. brian: why do you think they're all coming out to the bookstores, and what are the first couple of questions they always ask you? linda: i think people are genuinely interested in meeting a fisherman, because that's not really -- not everybody knows a commercial fishermen, so people are genuinely interested in that. the first couple of questions, people usually ask how did you go from college to fishing for a career and how did you go from fishing to writing? brian: stern fabio, just grab that one out of the middle of your book. what is that chapter about? linda: stern fabio is an endear. almost -- an endearment almost

for a young man showing up on the island looking for work. asked me for a job. i didn't really need a sternman who is the person who works in the stern of a lobster boat because my dad works for me but this kid was so persistent and, you know, you don't even have to pay me, i really want to try it, been my life long dream to go fishing that i immediately liked him. he was a nice, nice kid and took him fishing and through the course of maybe a month of having him work for me, i discovered some things about him that weren't that good and so he fooled me, which was not the most pleasant thing, but -- brian: how did he fool you? linda: well, i really like the him and i thought he was a great hard worker and a nice person and in the end it turned out that i wasn't such a nice person and he neth up -- ended up not showing up for work which was bad because -- he's probably just late, we'll wait a little longer at the dock to see if he shows up and then to be stood up is sort of hurtful to put confidence in someone

and hire them and have them be on the boat and then have them be a no show. brian: why the name stern fabio? linda: well, he was very handsome. brian: how old was he? linda: young. i would say he was early 20's. brian: where did he go? where did he end up? linda: well, i don't know. he disappeared from the island. he ended up -- he went ashore to do something and he ended up stealing my vehicle that i have on the mainland, and disappeared for a couple of days and word got to him that i was not very happy, and he never showed back up to work after that. so i haven't seen him. brian: where is the island? linda: it's isle au haut and it's in penobscot bay seven miles off the coast of maine. brian: ok. we need more. close to what? how do you get there? linda: the closest mainland is stonington maine and to get to the island you either have to have your own boat or travel by mail boat which is a privately owned boat that has a contract with the postal service to bring the mail back and forth from the island. so it's not the easiest place to get to.

it's a beautiful island and it's physically beautiful. the people are great. islanders are, i say, quirky and i mean that in a very nice way. we're a little bit of an odd group. brian: is there somebody on the island named rita? in actuality? linda: there was someone on the island named rita. i used her real name and people always ask about rita and, you know, -- the way she got into my book. i was 2/3 of the way through the writing process and my editor called me and said, linda, you can't love everyone. you know, you're going to have no credibility here. you're not writing a fairy tale, isn't there anyone out there that you genuinely dislike? and i said, oh, yes, there is and i wrote more than he cared to hear about this person rita. brian: who was she? linda: one of my neighbors for two years when i was back on the island and she was a major nuisance. she would come over uninvited. less herself in, even if i wasn't home she would be in the house using the telephone without permission and i would

ask her time and time again please, you know, don't come in if i'm not home. we don't lock our doors on the island, we don't lock our vehicles being we don't take our keys out of anything, so to have somebody very intrusive, it was sort of hard to deal with. islanders are very noncontroversial, we don't like conflict so it's easier just to allow somebody to abuse you or use you badly, than it is to actually say something, so it's just easier to say, oh, whatever, it's rita. brian: whatever happened to her? linda: she moved off the island , less than a year ago. and she now lives on the mainland. i'm sure she's annoying somebody else now. brian: what do people do in situations like that, on an island where you're very close? linda: for the most part, nobody says anything. nobody wants to confront anybody. it's just easier to sort of sweep it under the rug or ignore it. somebody could be driving you nuts but you certainly would never want to make waves or mention it to someone. it is such a small close-knit community that most everyone is

aware of what's going on, but things just aren't talked about. brian: the main reason that we wanted you to do this program was it's kind of a subtheme in your book. it's not prominent but it's a subtheme and that is regulation and the law that has something to say about fishing and lobstering. and i made a bunch of notes about things that directly affect, you know, by the -- from the state's standpoint. the lobster pot itself has -- the laws tell you what you have to -- how you make it up. linda: sure. there's a size restriction and there are these escape vents for small londons to get out of . it's very legal. there are some real tricks on what you can put in the water to try to catch a -- real restrictions what you can put in the water to try to catch a lobster. brian: who tells you the lobster pot has to be a certain size? linda: the state of maine. there are federal regulations and there are maine state

regulations but i'm governed by the state of maine. brian: so if someone wants to be a lobster fishermen, how do they start? linda: really hard to start right now because there's a moratorium on all maine state lobster fishing licenses. a young guy wants to go lobstering, forget it, you can't just apply to the state of maine and get a license. that's relatively new, maybe the last four or five year, that's come into effect. so now you would have to be an apprentice for i think it's three years and do a lot of paperwork and have marine patrol people sign off on all these days that you have spent as an apprentice before you can actually go lobstering yourself. brian: do you have a license? linda: i do. i have a maine state license. i've had it since i was a kid and i, fortunately, renewed it every year, even when i was swordfishing, i kept my maine state lobster license so when i decided to go lobstering, i was all set. brian: what does it cost a year to have a maine state lobster license? linda: it's not a lot of money. the license i have is like $217 or something like this for a season, for a year, so it's not a great deal of money.

brian: how many lobstermen are there in the state of maine? linda: good question. thousands. i wish i had the exact number. thousands. there are so many people on the coast of maine who make their only living or most of their income catching lobsters. brian: how many women are there? linda: not all that many. there are a few who have their own boats, like myself, and there are more and more sternmen or women that work in the sterns of boats for a father or a boyfriend or an uncle. brian: why do you need a sternman? linda: well, you can get a locality more done with a sternman. it's just much easier. you can haul more gear with some help. if somebody is in the stern of the boat picking the traps or taking the lobsters out, baiting the bags, a mesh bag we put the bait in, it just goes a lot better. it's safer to have a sternman with you. fishing alone is dangerous if something happens, you go overboard, there's nobody there to at least knock the goat out of -- the boat out of gear. brian: you say that lobstermen are undemocratic by nature.

linda: i think fishermen in general are undemocratic by nature. it is a very self-reliant, self-sufficient group. there's not a lot of voting or committee type solutions to anything. it's about the ultimate of being self-employed. brian: what else is controlled? we're talking about the -- the where you catch the lobsters having regulations. what about the boat size? linda: the boat size is not really controlled by your license. not in lobstering. in other fisheries it is, because the license, the federal license that you have, let's say for ground fish, is all, you know, by the size of the boat, the license fits. lobstering you can fish any size boat that you would like, but there are, you know, some boats would definitely be too large, it would be too expensive to run them for the fishery and some obviously would be too small because you couldn't do the work. brian: what about the size of the lobster? linda: size of the lobster, in the state of maine we have a lobster measurer that has two sides.

one size measures a lobster to make sure it's big enough and the other side of the measure measures is to make sure it's not too big. so we have an oversize and an undersize. so the bigger lobsters get thrown back as breeders and the very small lobsters obviously get thrown back so they have a chance to reproduce and get to a legal size. brian: what is the size that you can keep? linda: it changes so often. i don't know what the -- i don't know what the exact measurement is, and i wouldn't dare say on television because i would be off by a 16th of an inch one yea -- one way or another. brian: i remember reading somewhere about three to five inches, the body. linda: right, the body -- it's measured from the eye socket to where the end of the body meets the tail. brian: why does the change -- why does the size change all the time? linda: it changes as a lobster molts or sheds. every time it grows a new shell, the legislator grows anywhere from -- well, up to a half inch every time this

happens. brian: does the state change the length of that measurement all the time? linda: yes, the state does -- it's been for the last few years increasing. the measure increases so the lobster has to be bigger to keep legally, which is good. it's good for conservation, it's good for the reproduction of the lobster, it keeps the lobster stock healthy. brian: who makes that decision in the state? linda: there's a -- a state -- there are state agencies that, you know, control all the fisheries. there's not like a lobster person, but there -- maine marine resources mostly does that kind of thing. brian: do people look -- i mean, do they come around where you're fishing from the state and check out your gear and all that stuff? linda: yes, there are observers that go on boats to do studies for the state, and there are also wardens and marine patrol people who, you know, patrol the area to make sure everyone is in compliance with the laws and regulations. brian: anybody ever check you out? linda: sure, yes.

not unusual to be boarded, have a marine patrol person come aboard your boat and measure the lobsters in your tank to make sure you're not keeping undersized lobsters. make sure you're not keeping any egg bearing female lobsters because it's illegal to do so. >> if they find you doing something wrong, what happened? linda: generally if it's a first offense, you may get a fine. second or third offense, you could lose your license which could be devastating for someone trying to raise a family if the only thing you do is lobster fish, if you lose your license. brian: any regulation on how many traps you can have? linda: there is. the state of maine has an 800 trap limit and different zones in the state of maine -- the waters are chopped up into different zones. i fish zone c for instance. we're allowed 800 traps but there are other zones who have committed to a smaller trap limit. there are zones who fish 600 traps, for instance, as a maximum. brian: is there a time of day that you can fish? linda: yes, you can only fish the daylight hours and during

the summer months you can only fish six dizz a week. citizens are no fishing -- six days a week. sundays are no fishing. brian: why is that? linda: i think there is no fishing on sundays so keep some of the part-timers out of it or the people that would just fish in the summer, sort of protects the bottom for the people who are really making all their living lobstering. it's harder for someone to put their feet in the water if you only have one day, saturday, to be a fisherman. there's only a quota on lobsters. only a quota on the hours you can fish. as many lobsters as you can get in those hours in those days. brian: the normal lobster fishing day for you begins at what time? linda: daylight normally would be when you would go out and go to get your bait aboard the boat and as soon as you can see your first buoy, you should be hauling. brian: so what time do you get up when you have to hit the first light, let's say it's the early part of the summer, it's 4:30 in the morning and you

have to be out there, what time do you get out? linda: get up around 4:30, 5:00. go shake my father out of bed, have some coffee and go get our bait for the day. normally, we try and haul 200 traps a day, and that's not a really long day. that's a pretty comfortable day. we, you ow, start early and be done by 2:00 or 3:00 in the afternoon. brian: not you say haul, what does that mean? linda: when i say haul i mean actually the act of hauling traps from the bottom of the ocean, getting them aboard the boat to pick them, rebate them, and set them back. brian: how heavy is that trap? linda: oh, 30 pounds. one lobster trap was around 30 pounds. traps come in all different sizes and configurations. they have bricks in them to weight them to make insure they land right side up on the bottom of the ocean and some people believe in more bricks. some people believe in fewer bricks. i like smaller traps with fewer bricks because they're just easier for me to handle physically. brian: what's the largest the trap can be in the state? linda: four feet long. brian: is there a smallest it can be? linda: no. there's no legal limit to how small a trap can be but it's

advantageous, fishingwise, to efficient biggest traps that you can because there's more room in the trap for the lobsters. brian: when did you wrie the last word for this book, what was the date, do you remember? linda: it was this past march. >> march of this year? linda: right. brian: and the season you're talking about in here, which you say was a rotten season -- linda: it was a rotten season for me. i'm writing about my first lobster season, my first year moving back to the island because part of the book is about going home after being gone for 17 years. so i'm writing about my first season. it was a really slow, slow start to the season. it did get good very late but then something happened that i sort of lost interest in the season, so it was a terrible season for me. brian: so when year was it exactly that you're writing about? linda: would have been 1996. brian: so how did you go about writing the book? how did you recall all these stories and -- linda: well, most of it was just from memory. i didn't have an outline. i don't keep a diary or log or

journal or anything like that, but i had been fishing, when i started writing the book, for four years so i knew the basic, ok, we have to get the boat in the water, we have to get the gear ready, the gear has to go in the water, we're not going to catch anything early in the season. hopefully it's going to get good. the end of the season, it did get good at one point so i knew the structure was book was going to be a lobster season which was very familiar with at that point. brian: what part of the year does a lobsterman fish? linda: where i fish we fish basically may through december 1, but the bulk of the lobsters are caught in july, august, september, and october. brian: and what happens in the other months? what are you catching then and what months are there the sledders where they're not full meat? linda: basically any time we're camping a lot of lobster which is july through october, we're catching mostly sheders, the soft shell lobsters. earlier in the season we would be catching more hard shell legislators, the ones very full

of meat. brian: what what kind of money do you get paid on a normal basis for every pound of lobster that you get -- do you have a co-op? linda: we do. we call it the island lobsterman's association. i sell to the co-op and right now we're catching mostly sheders. sheders aren't as valuable as a hard shell. the price is around $3 a pound. later in september, the price will drop a little bit more. simply because there are more lobsters being caught and a lot of the seasonal places that serve lobsters are closing down at that time of year. brian: so if you're a lobster eater in this country, what's the best time to -- when you go into a restaurant to order a lobster and what's the worst time? linda: all right. well, pound-for-pound, dollar -for-pound you're better off eating a hard shell lobster i think in the winter time. lobster is more expensive because they're less abundant, because of weather and seasons, there aren't as many people fishing so it's more expensive but the lobster is really packed into the shell so you're getting more for your money. personally, i prefer sheders. i like the soft shell lobster.

if i'm eating them, which would be at home, i wouldn't eat one in a restaurant because i make a real mess, i would rather eat three or four sheders than one hard shell any day. i think the meat is sweeter. easier to get into. don't noticed all the tools. brian: the last year that you can remember the statistics on how many lobsters are caught or pounds of lobsters are caught in the state of maine? linda: i couldn't even begin to tell you. brian: well, i've seen a figure. i've seen two figures. one at $300 million in lobsters were sold in the last year and $57 million lobsters. linda: i was going to see probably a million pounds would be a great season. so the three million -- brian: no. 300 million. linda: yeah, maybe after it's gone through a few middle men but not to the fisherman. if the fisherman is getting $3 a pound, the consumer is not getting a big break on the lobster. someone is making a lot of money on the way. brian: how much does a fish

lobster fisherman make a year? linda: makes a really good earning but he's fishing really hard, year around, hauling a lot of traps and has a big investment. probably has a bigger boat so he can fish in the winter, probably has the biggest traps his money can buy, bigger traps are more expensive, anything from a really good living to real part-timers, kids that go just during the summer in a skiff hauling by hand. brian: are they allowed if they don't have a license? linda: they have to have a license to do so but there are student licenses and recreational licenses that people can get to fish five or 10 traps. brian: you didn't give us a figure. in the book you say a good lobsterman can make $100,000 a year? linda: sure. i'm sure not that's unusual for some of the high liners. very good lobstermen that go really hard -- yeah, i consider that a really good year's pay. >> on your island you have a man named payson? linda: yes. in my opinion east the best on the island. i think he works the hardest.

>> if you're the best, what do you do that the not so good don't do, that makes you a success? linda: well, i think when i say payson, whether he's on his boat or ashore, he's always working. he and his father have a fish house or a shop where they work on their gear. they're there constant lip any time of day i go by, no matter what the weather, they're there painting buoys or rigging new line or going over traps, it's a constant job. brian: in your book you say your dad is 71 at the time. how old is he now? linda: he's now 72. >> and your mom had cancer? linda: yes. my mom was diagnosed with breast cancer just about a year ago. and three days ago she had doctors appointments and this is a really good time because it's the first time in a year that she's been declared cancer-free, so very good. brian: why does your dad work with you as your sternman? linda: well, he's a retired suit and tie guy, and it just happened quite naturally. i was looking for someone.

he was very willing to go as a sternman. he couldn't be happier this i'm on book tour because now he's running my book and hired his own sternman so it's worked out very well. i've always been a tomboy and had a great relationship with both my parents but as a kid was sort of a daddy's girl because i liked to do the hunting and fishing over the boat stuff and it's been nice to go home and reconnect with my father and work with him. brian: where were you born? linda: stanford, connecticut, and lived there for three months, and moved back to maine with my parents where i've lived ever since. brian: what's the relationship of your family to this island? linda: my dad's family is from the island. i am fifth generation on the island. brian: and when did they come there in the first place? under what circumstances? linda: well, everyone who moves to the island, let's say the settlers of the island were all fishermen and it was attractive to live on the island let's say in the 1800's because it was closer to the fishing grounds. now that changed somewhere along the way with the

invention of steam engines no longer sailing to the fishing grounds, don't need to be as close now because, you know, we have these engines. also high school education made it so that high school kids on the island had to move off the island to go to high school. no high schools on the island, so the island sort of depopulated between the two things, between kids having to go to school, maine state regulation, and gasoline and steam engines. brian: where did you go to grade school? linda: i went to grade school in topsam, maine. a very small town. brian: there is a school on the island still? linda: a one-room schoolhouse. one of the few remaining in the country and one of very few on these remote outposts of islands. kindergarten through eighth grade. i think there will be six students in the school this year. brian: why didn't you go there? linda: i was a summer kid growing up. my father worked at a ship building company in bath, maine, so, you know, dad is going to work, we're going off and going to school. brian: did you go off the island every day to go to school?

linda: no. we lived -- we lived off the island. i was really a summer kid on the island. it was always my life long dream to live on the island year around. as a kid i always hated leaving the island in the fall so i always had the great memories of summers on the island. brian: where did you go to high school? linda: i went to high school in topsam, maine at mount arat school. brian: what were you interested in school in those years? linda: i was an excellent student. liked school. i was into sports. i was sort of a weekend fisherman in the summertime with my parents. my parents were always sort of avid fishermen and i grew up in the summer trying to catch anything that swam or crawled around my home and always liked school. always a good student and enjoyed that also. brian: your brothers -- one brother and two sisters? linda: one brother and two sisters, yes. brian: what are they like and what are their ages compared to yours? linda: a younger brother and sister who are twins, eight years younger, and one older sister who is two years older. brian: where do they live? linda: everyone lives in maine.

we're all in maine. my younger brother and sister both live in portland. my oldest sister in topsam which is where we went to school at kids . >> what do they do for a living? linda: my older sister is a housewife. my younger brother is a marine engineer. went to maine maritime academy, shipped out for a while. now works land based job and my younger sister is an executive. business woman. brian: what do they think of their sister the fisherman? linda: well, they don't want to be me, but they -- you know, they very proud of what i've done and my accomplishments or whatever. i mean, i'm very quick to say this i've also had a great number of failures, but everything i've done has been hard work, whether it's been success or failure. brian: what have you failed at? linda: oh, i'm a real wannabe musician, i can't play anything. other things. just fishing in general. i've had some really bad years and some really good years. it's all work and sometimes it's very good, sometimes it's very bad. brian: how did you originally get into swordfishing? linda: i started as a cook on a

swordfishing boat at the age of 19 as a summer job to help pay my way you there college and that was out of a place called orrs island, maine. brian: and what got you there, though, in the first place? why did you think you could be a cook in the summer? linda: a very good friend of mine's father owned a swordfishing boat so i knew of fishing. i went to kids whose parents were fishermen and i knew that it was an opportunity. i needed a good paying job to pay through school, so fishing was good money when i started. brian: how regulated is swordfishing by the state? linda: oh, i think any u.s. fisherman, whether it's commercial or recreational, we are the most highly regulated, managed and monitored bunch of fishermen in the world and that's not to say that that's bad. i know that regulations are needed. i'm a conservationist. i like to know that there's going to be a future in commercial fishing. it's probably the oldest industry in the world. or it may be the oldest industry in the world. the problem is the regulations

are so strict that a lot of fishermen have been regulatesed out or forced out of the business. now the regulations have worked in many, many species -- the new england fisheries, it's become regulated by litigation almost, these conservationist groups are suing the national marine fishery service so it's no longer fishermen and scientists making rules and trying to do what's best. now it's other groups stepping in and getting the federal government to step in and force laws on fishermen that are really too stringent, in my opinion. brian: how many -- for how long is the swordfishing boat? how big is it? linda: the last boat that i ran was a hannah boden and that's a 100 foot boat. brian: when you were cooking that summer, how big was that? how many people worked on the boat with you? linda: when i first started at 19, i started on a 70-foot boat and there were six people on the boat. brian: how long would you be out at sea? linda: generally about a month. swordfishing trips, we try and

time around the moon or the lunar cycle. the fishing is best from the first quarter through the last quarter through the full moon, and we try to do our steaming back and forth and our time at the dock during the dark moon or the new moon. >> when you have a fishing day on swordfishing, how long is the day? linda: a fishing day is long on a swordfishing boat. we set the gear at night, because swordfish are nocturnal. they noticed at night. we set the gory at night. leave it for a few hours. daylight the next morning we start hauling this 40-mile piece long aboard boat. daylight is 3:30 in the morning, so it's an early start to the day. takes most of the daylight hours to get this 40 miles of gear back on to the boat. brian: so you say you worked as a cook in the summertime to go to colby college happen did you study at colby? linda: i studied english and government. brian: why did you do either one of those? linda: well, at the age of 19 when you're supposed to be declaring your major, i don't know what i thought at the age of 19. i thought attorney sounded good. i wanted to be a lawyer.

so i thought english and government. that's pretty close to prelaw, and it just sounded like a good thing to do so that's what i studied. i enjoyed both of them. but i knew after i start the fishing that i would not be going to law school. brian: by the way, when you told your mother you weren't going to be a lawyer and that you were going to be a fisherman, what did she do? linda: yeah, she wasn't very happy, and i write in "the lobster chronicles" about one scene in particular, very vivid memory of my mother breaking like every dish in the house, she was so upset that i was like, throwing my education away, wasting my education, for years my parents never really gave up on the law school thing . when i graduated from colby and told them when i was going fishing. when it was a summer job it was a good idea but for 17 years i sort of endured the well intentioned advice of parents of getting a real job, you're wasting your education, and i do a lot of speaking now since i've gotten notoriety from the perfect storm. i have an opportunity to speak

to students often and one of the things i always say is my education has never been wasted. regardless of what my parents thought in the past. i've used every bit of my education every day whether i've been fishing or writing or book touring or interviewing, it's never wasted. your education becomes you. you'll hear people say education is a tool. no, you know, education isn't a tool. it's not lick a screwdriver that if you're not droiching a screw it's laying around dormant. you're using it all the time. it's part of you. brian: by the way, the scene, though, you get the impression your mother was picking the plates off the shelf and slinging them and throwing them and everything. linda: oh, she was. she was throwing them down on the floor and breaking them. yeah, she wasn't very happy. brian: was it normal for your mother to do things like that? linda: i wouldn't say it was normal but it wasn't the first occurrence so i wasn't totally surprised when it happened. brian: are you like your mother or father? linda: a little bit of both, i suppose. do i break dishes? oh, yeah. brian: so let's go back, you graduated from colby in what year? linda: 1983.

brian: have you worked on the swords fishing botes every summer? linda: i had. at the age of 19 i started, fished my way through school. after i graduated, i started fishing year around. brian: 17 years on a swordfishing boat, did you buy your own boat at some point? linda: no, i didn't. i was always like the hired gun. i ran other people's boats for them. very typical. there are a lot of -- there are very few, i should say, owner-operators. there are quite a few people who own boats and hire other people to run them. brian: game seven a range on what somebody can make. -- give us a range on what somebody can make as a swordfishman. linda: as a person working on deck, you get paid by what you catch. you get a percentage of the catch. it's called a settlement, and if you have a very good trip, a person working on deck could make $10,000 a trip. that's $10,000 a month. really good money for a college kid. brian: how many years -- i mean, how many months a year can you do that? linda: well, you can swordfish year around but the grand bank

season, which i think is always the best, is may through october, and then some of the u.s. fleet will travel down to the caribbean and fish the winter months. >> are you regulated on that boat by the government? do you have tv a license to fish? linda: yes, you need a federal license to fish for swordfish. and there are all kinds of gear regulations and closed areas where you can't fish, and, you know, size restrictions and all kinds of regulations. brian: what kind of money can you make if you're running the boat, if you're hired to be the boss? linda: well, if you're running the boat, generally you would make about twice as much as one of the crew members. brian: every month? linda: every month but, you know, there are so many months that you would make nothing, too. there's a thing that we call a broker when which is going for a month and making zero. some trips when the fishing is very poor, you're very lucky to pay the expenses. it's an expensive fishery. you leave the dock with $40,000 of things aboard the boat that are going to be thrown away during the trip, the bait, the fuel, that stuff is gone at the end of the trip, $40,000.

brian: so what's the worst thing that happens when you're out at sea for 30 days? linda: the worst thing that could happen would be a combination of bad weather and poor fishing. really hard to deal with. one or the other, you can kind of handle. like poor fishing if the weather is nice, well, this is fun, but coupled, you know, bad fishing and bad weather, really tough to deal with. really hard to stay up and optimistic. brian: did you ever think you were going to lose your life? linda: oh, sure. i would be lying to say i've never been frightened at sea. we fish may through october had is also hurricane season. quite often we're 1,000 miles from the dock. brian: talking now about swordfishing? linda: right. you're not subject to the weather as much with lobstering but swordfishing you're far from the dock during hurricane season, and yeah, it's dangerous. brian: what do you do to prepare yourself for that? do you stricken? linda: not so much training but it's more -- i think that good seamanship is like 90% experience and 10% just a gut

feeling. i've been on a boat a long time. i know there are certain things you do if you know bad weather is coming. ways to secure the boat, and just boat handling skills, to keep the boat as safe as it's going to be. brian: do more people want to swordfish than there are positions for them, or the other way? linda: i think nowadays it's the other way around. i think that it's very tough for a boat owner to get a good captain, a qualified, experienced captain. there are -- there aren't really many new people, because of the regulations and restrictions. it's not somethi that young people are jumping into. the money is not there like it used to be, because you can't catch as many fish because of regulations. you can't fish year around, can't use this area, can't use that type of gear, it's not an industry that there's a lot of young blood rushing to. brian: is that all regulated by the feds? linda: mostly it is the feds, yes. brian: is there a lot of grousing among the crew about how much involvement will is government? linda: oh, sure. it's disconcerting to be subject to all these

regulations and seemingly a lot of them are sort of wasteful. i can give you probably the best example of what i think a bad regulation is, and i said earlier, i know regulations are needed, you know,. it's the fisherman's job to catch the fish and catch the most the fastest. so eggs ares are certainly needed to restrict people, but the best example of a bad regulation that i can give you is the daily quotas they have on ground fish or let's say cod and happened ok. -- haddock. no matter what they set the quota at, there will be boats who unintentionally exceed the data and throw the dead fish overboard and it does nothing for conservation, it's wasteful. brian: what year did you decide i want to go back to the island and be a lobster known? linda: in 1996 i decided that i had, for a number of reasons, i felt like i had reached the top of my game swordfishing, didn't see any way to improve my lot, the nicest boat, the best crew, doing very well, government regulations were making it increasingly hard to make a good living year around, and i

was ready to go home. i had been gone for 17 years. late 30's, ready to go home and start a family so seemed lick a good time to move home and still have an ability to work the water with lobster fishing. brian: so what happened to the family? linda: well, it seems that moving to the island was not the best idea to facilitate the family plan. i say in "the lobster chronicles" that there are three single men in residence and two of them are gay and the other one is my cousin. so i've taken a little bit of flak about that but i stand by it. brian: you've taken flak from? linda: from a couple other single guys on the island who know they aren't my cousin. brian: so how many names in here are the actual names? i know you say in your introduction that you use isn't no, ma'ams -- use synonyms? linda: i have two composite names george and tommy and i changed one name. >> island boy repairs was about what, who are those two men? linda: two sort of men who came

to the island to vacation, fell in love with the island, and decided to stay and i call them the quintessential island suckers because they take and take and take and they don't really add much to the island. they're the island's handymen or self-proclaimed handymen who really seem to screw more things up than they actually fix. brian: are they still on the island? linda: yeah. these are composite characters. there are people like this on every island i've learned in my book tour that i go, people say, oh, yeah we have people just like that where i live and these people seem very familiar. we have these same characters in the small town where i live. brian: now just from your survey, being on the island, how many of the people who live there, you say 40 who live there permanently, have read your book? linda: i would say most everyone has read my book at this point. i got to a point right before the book was available at the bookstores how would the islanders see it, would they see it as an invasion of privacy? so far all reports are very positive which i couldn't feel better about obviously. i love the island and i love

islanders. was very nervous about it. for a while, until i started getting some good reports and some good feedback brian: so if you get in the car and you're at the maine border, how many hours does it take you to drive to stonington and then, what, you have to take the mail boat over? linda: right. from the maine border it would be about a four-hour drive to stonington and then a 40-minute boat ride. brian: and how often can you go over on the boat ride? linda: this time of year there are three boats that go over, one morning, one midday and one in the afternoon so pretty easy for people to come us on the morning boat and hike around and check the island out. half of the island is a national park so there are a lot of national trails to hibling, a lot of beautiful things to see and then get back on the boat and go back to the mainland. brian: are there places to stay on the island? linda: there's one. the keeper's house. bed and breakfast. they're booked a year in advance. a beautiful place and they do a great job. good food, you know, beautiful surroundings. they have no trouble filling the rooms. >> and you say it's expensive? linda: well, i think it's

expensive. i guess -- brian: $300 a night. linda: well, i've just come from new york city and now think maybe it's not all that expensive. everything is relative . >> in the summertime is there a noticeable large increase of people? linda: yeah, the population swells from let's say 40 year around to maybe 300 in august, you know, the middle of august probably the busiest time on the island. it's interesting, though. the summer community for the most part, the summer people have been coming generation, generation, generation. a lot of the summer people have been on the island longer than some of the year around people. so there's none of the animosity or sometimes, you know, you hear problems between the year arounders and the summer people. we don't really have that on the island where i live. we get along quite well. brian: you said at the beginning you've lost about 12 friends in this. tell us about the 1983 incident. linda: the 1991, the perfect storm? >> no. i'm thinking of the one with the five -- between the islands. linda: ok. sorry about that. now i know what you're talking

about. yes, i was a senior in college and was watching television one night and heard this news flash about some young people from isle au haut being lost at sea and, of course, got very concerned. i was to find -- was trying to find out what was going on. five young people left the island to go see a movie in the early spring. went on a small outboard to the mainland to go to a movie, and on the way back the boat capsized from heavy seas and three of the people died, died in the water. brian: did you know them? linda: i knew o of them. i knew one of them very well. one of them an adwaints and the third i didn't know at all. -- an acquaintance and the third i didn't know at all. brian: now when you're lobstering fishing, how do you know when you have a storm problem? do you have ways of keeping in touch with the weather? linda: sure. every ishermen has a weather radio at home and you listen to the weather before you get in the boat in the morning.

also the radio we use for communication has weather channel on it. it's a continuous recording of, you know, weather reports. so -- well, even with the radios really the best indicator of what your weather is going to be is a boat maybe a few miles west of you, weather moves from west to east, so what they're having, you're going to get. weather is not really a factor where i fish lobstering. if i get up in the morning and the weather is bad. i don't have to go. i don't have to get in the boat and go haul traps. i can stay home. if the weather is going to be severe. i'm never more than 15 or 20 minutes from the dock, so if the weather does get bad or looks like it's going to be bad, i can scoot in. brian: so go back, we were talking about a day in the life of a lobsterman. you get up and you get out at first light. how long do you stay out on a given day? linda: well, a long day would be first light to 4:00 in the afternoon. the nice thing about being self-employed is that at any point in the day when you feel like you just want to stop, you can. as i said, my father try and haul 200 traps a day. now if things are going really

well, like we aren't tangled up with other people and everything runs right and we don't get any line in the wheel or the propeller, we can be done by 2:00. brian: how many traps do you have in the ocean at any given time? linda: i have a license to fish 800, which is the maximum in the state of maine. but i only have 400 in the water right now. brian: and what's the biggest catch you've had in any one trap on any given day? linda: the biggest catch in any single trap, i had 15 keepers, so let's say pretty close to 20 pounts in one trap. that's very unusual. brian: how often has that happened? linda: that's only happened once. that's only happened once. i say, you know, in the best of times for me, if i'm averaging three pounds per trap, that's very good. brian: what's the biggest lobster you ever caught? linda: the biggest -- of course we throw the big lobsters back, legally we have to. you know, 20 pounds. i spent three winters fishing offshore with a much bigger boat and the lobsters sometimes are much bigger offshore so i've caught some real large lobsters.

brian: and what's the worst day you've had, or do you have many days where you get absolutely no lobster at all in linda: i've never had a day where i've not caught a single lobster but i do remember the very first time i hauled traps in my lobstering career, just moved home, couldn't wait to go, bought a bunch of gear, hauled for 17 lobsters. at the end of the day we had 17 lobsters. it was not a good day. brian: what's a gear war? linda: a gear war is what happens -- it's something this escalates. it starts off as something so simple as a newcomer comes to an area, lobstering is very territorial, and somebody comes who is not welcome in an area, and it starts with basically cutting a few of maybe his buoys off so he knows that's a warning to move his gear out of the area. if he retaliates and doesn't know who to cut and he just cuts anybody, then those people who get cut don't know who did it and they retaliate and cut anybody and before you know it, everybody is cutting gear and it's very expensive. brian: have you been been you there one? linda: i've not been through a

very serious gear war. i have lost gear that i suspect has been cut away, and i would be lying to say i never cut anybody else's gear but it's never escalated to a point of what you would consider a war. >> is this the kind of thing that lobstermen don't like to admit? linda: well, it's illegal so, of course, nobody wants to admit to cuttinsomeone else's gear. there are a lot of people saying i lost gear and somebody cut me, but you never hear somebody saying i cut that guy out of the water. brian: if you have 400 trps and 200 buoys, is that right? linda: yes, that's correct . >> two traps per buoy. what color on the buoy do you have and who determines what the color is? linda: each fisherman has their own colored buoy just to distinguish their own gear from somebody else's. the fisherman picks the color, the buoy color, him or herself, when you apply for your license with the state of maine, part of the application indication is what is it your buoy pattern, so mine is orange, yellow, and white. brian: how much of the co-op -- or how many fishermen in your

area belong to the co-op you have on the island? linda: there are about a dozen who are full-time lobster fishermen who belong to the co-op. brian: how much of what they do is controlled by the state law? linda: as far as fishing? brian: yeah, just the way they operate. i know you say that -- i mean, the way the co-op works, the bonus that you get is usually -- it comes out around tax time or after tax time. tell us about the bonus and how that works. linda: right. well, the bonus that we get is a result of pounding lobsters or when we catch lobsters in september and the price is very low, we have a real natural pound, it's called. it's a salt water area where you can put lobsters to store while the price is low, and then take them back out in the winter, lets say february or march when the police is back up high, and -- when the price is back up high and the extra money or profit is divvied up among fishermen as the bonus . >> and at a given time in i normal year, how big a bonus is it? linda: anywhere, since i've been back to the island, we've had anywhere from a 50-cent per

pound bonus to a 75-cent per pound bonus and it's a bonus not on what you put into the lobster pound yourself but it's a bonus on what you have sold to the co-op all season. so if you catch 10,000 pounds for the season, your paid on your -- you're paid on your 10,000 pounds. brian: when does that check usually come to you? linda: right in april, at tax time so it's a good time to be getting some money because most fishermen have been all winter making nothing. you have uncle sam to deal with, and it's a time of year when you need to spend some money to revamp your gear. you know, you need to buy paint for the boat and buoys and maybe some new traps and new line and other things that you need to -- for the new season. brian: in your book you say i have been caused all my life of keeping too much inside -- accused all my life of keeping too much inside. i thought you spent a lot of time talking about yourself in these books. has th been hard? linda: yeah, it was such a difficult book to write because

it was so personal. really difficult to write about yourself and difficult to write about relationships with family and community and so difficult to articulate this very deep and profound love of place. it was a real tough book to write. brian: what about this about yourself? you tell us in there you want to be married, you want to have children. linda: right, i do and people are sometimes a little surprised. i can't believe you're so candid about your personal life and your desires to get married and have children. i think, you know, it's not something i'm ashamed of. i'm not, you know, ashamed to say, yeah, you know, i'd like to have a very traditional family. >> so how are you going to do this if you're on the island all the time -- don't have much choice there. has it helped being on the book tour? linda: well, book tour has been interesting because, you know, i get a few cards from people or generally if i go into a bookstore to do a signing, one of the women who works in the store will say i have a guy to introduce you to but it's not really -- you don't really get a chance to meet anybody on book tour for more than five minutes because you're here and then gone to the next place so that's not the best way to meet

somebody, i don't think. brian: so what's next after this book? is your life going to change again, two successful best-selling books? linda: i've signed a contract to write a third book, so i know what my immediate future will be. brian: what's that? linda: when i'm done with my book tour i'm going home to finish the lobster season and when that's over, i'm going to start writing a third book. i would like to write a novel. brian: about? linda: well, i don't have a plot but whatever i write, all i know about is fishing and boats and islands, so i have a setting and that's about it. brian: why a novel? linda: i am so sick of writing in the first person. i am so sick of linda greenlaw. i think it might be refreshing to not have to really feel compelled to stick to the truth and wondering how people are going to feel about when you're saying about them. i think it might be a relief to maybe let my imagination play a bigger role in my writing. brian: how did it work after your first book came out, and by the way, can folks still buy it, is it still in stores? linda: yes, yes it is.

it's available in paperback. brian: and it's called? linda: "the hungry ocean." brian: and then how did the second book come about? how did it work with your act, how did it work with the book publisher? linda: because the first book did well, i was approached by the same publisher, hyperion to write a second book and i said, yeah, i'd like to write a novel and they said, no, we would like for you to write another nonfiction. so they gave me a two-book deal which was "the lobster chronicles" first and the third book hopefully to be something of my choice. brian: this is private but are you going to make a lot of money off this book? linda: well, you know, my pipe dream is to make enough money through my books so that i can fish just because i want to and not because i have to pay bills. certainly the books have been successful. i hope to make a lot of money with them. that's -- brian: how many of these are out there in circulation right now, your books? linda: well, i think the last report i heard was that we were up to 185,000 in print. how many are circulating, i don't know. brian: and the timetable on your next book, when do you have to have that done? linda: well, i started this

tour in new york one nothing and i signed a contract to extend my deadline so apparently identify already -- i've already missed a deadline. haven't even written one word yet. i would like to think i could get a major portion of that done this winter. brian: how did you write it? where did you write it? linda: i like write long handed in notebook and make all my corrections on the paper. you know, arrows and things crossed out and pages stuck in and when i get a section or a chapter to a point where i think i'm not going to be able to make it any better, i take the time to type it in to the computer. i'm very slow typing. that's the last edit that i do of something before i send it to my editor. send it to the he had tornado and within two or three days i get a call saying this is good, that's not. more of this, less of that. keep going don't go back and rewrite, just keep going and i basically got through both of my books with that process. brian: so where did you write it? linda: i wrote "the lobster chronicles," i wrote most of it on isle au haut. i wrote a little bit in portland, maine, had an

apartment in portland for a little while and wrote there. brian: by the way, you're saying isle au haut and for those who have never seen it, it's isle au haut. linda: that's right. brian: how do you get from what looks like anything like isle au haut to isle au haut? linda: it means island of height, french. it's the first island that you see from offshore because it is so high. many people pronounce it isle au haut and i've heard so many different pronounces. -- pronunciations. the year round population says isle au haut. brian: wt's it like year around living on an island? if. s i like it but it's not for everyone. it's a tough existence. you need to be self-sufficient, self-reliant. you need to not have a problem spending a lot of time alone. brian: and do you have any time ever being alone? linda: i enjoy my time alone.

i also learn through trying to write on the island my first winter thinking, oh, this will be great, no distraction. just write, write, write. i'll get this whole book done. i have learned you need communication with people, or i do anyway. brian: when you live on the island, what about simple thing like newspapers? do you get any, do you watch television? can you hear radio from where you are? linda: we can hear radio. we have no local newspaper. there's no newspaper delivery service to the island. some people now have satellite dishes so they -- they're able to see television, you know, whenever they want and see whatever they want. most people have computers and there are phone lines so you can have internet access. i think the things that are tough -- we have the technological advances. things that are tough, there are no service people on the island so if you need a plumber or electrician, you're on your own or try to get one from the mainland to come out. it's tough. brian: so your boat is how long again? how big is it? linda: my lobster boat is 35 feet long. brian: the name?

linda: duffy x duffy is the manufacturer of the boat and the name of the boat is the matty bell, named after my grandmother. brian: your grandmother on what side and what was her full anymore? linda: my dad's mother who is mattie bell robinson. >> and there is a robinson name on the island, isn't there somewhere? linda: yes, there is. a robinson's point, which is where the lighthouse is. brian: so when you go out fishing, do you have a cell phone now? linda: i do not. i'm a dinosaur. i'm probably one of the only people on the planet who does not have a cell phone but i have a v.h.f. radio. brian: can you talk to your mother, whatever -- ifrl i can. i have a hand held v.h.f. at home that if my mom needs to get in touch with my dad or i, she can call us on the radio. brian: how long do you think your father will continue being your sternman? linda: i hope a long time. he's 72 now but he's in great shape. loves working every day. he can work me under the table so i'm sure he'll be going strong for some time. brian: when deretire from his

other job at bath iron works? linda: at the age of 65, normal retirement job. brian: the book is "the lobster chronicles." our guest is linda greenlaw, and the book looks like this. this picture on the cover was taken where? linda: that was taken aboard my boat, right in front of the lighthouse fishing off isle au haut. >> women in hezbollah, that is one of the most interesting aspects of this society that hezbollah has managed to create. i like to say that the women of hezbollah are really the

cornerstone of the movement and are what has turned it into something that has such an enduring and resilient bedrock, so each time there is a war. 1993 and 1996, 2006, there were massive amounts of destruction. people's homes were destroyed every time. peoples kids would get killed, and for it to happen once anything can happen once. for people to be willing with good cheer and high energy to volunteer again and again for this requires something that hezbollah managed to do which is buy-in at the level of household at home and the women in the households who hezbollah has worked hard to reach and teach and advocate into their view and these women become the bedrock of the ideas and of the willingness to fight for that.

so, i write about this a fair amount in the book. he smothers, and martyrs for example have a very different flavor say or psychological profile then mothers of martyrs and men in god on the west bank. these people i met in lebanon, they were grieving for their children. not a single one of them has ever said to me i am happy my child died in the service of this war but they did say i am proud and i am proud and i would send another kid to do it and they work with their surviving children to install in them a sense of pride for the martyrs and their family. and it is the thing that makes, that make says the love sort of people who are willing to die such a staple part of the movement that they can count on. and, you know, in some ways it

is breathtaking sophistication of the social networks that hezbollah has built up around this idea. so, when a young fighter let's say guys and becomes a martyr, the party sense psychologists and social workers around to the family to work with them, make sure that they deal with their depression, make sure the kids are doing okay and adjusting and succeeding in school. this is for two reasons. one is because they care about their members and they want them to be okay. the second reason is they want people in a society islamic resistance to see the families of the martyrs are the one who thrive the most. so, if you have a martyr in your family, the martyrs foundation is going to make sure surviving kids go to the best schools. they are going to encourage the widow to remarry and usually to someone of high status within the party