on christmas day and we never hear about the bad twin the only the good twin. so imagine the story of what the other guy did. that is write-up my alley as a recovering catholic i am looking forward to reading that. . .

after i read this book i came across a few facts i want to run by you because i think it sets up the discussion pretty well. according to some data that i've just seen there are over 1200 government organizations across the country involved in intelligence, counterterrorism and homeland security. we've got about 850,000 people with top security clearances, and the intelligence budget since september 10th, 2001 is now 2.5 times the size, of 75 billion. and yet, if you read this book, you have to conclude that we are

not intelligently assessing the islamist threat to this country. all of that having been said, what are we doing wrong? desk phone number one, first thing you for taking the time to be here to do this. number one, we cannot identify the enemy. terrorism is only a tactic to read there is a well-defined well-established ideology that motivates the terrorism. i described in the book i have sat down with al qaeda terrorists face-to-face. associates of osama bin laden who told me we are not doing this because of poverty, we are not doing it because of the israeli-palestinian conflict we are doing it because islam texts command us to do it. it is politically incorrect. this is no time to mix words as you know and this is not me saying it, it is the bad guys saying it themselves. we showed in this case at least we should heed their words. it's the first rule of the war know your enemy. something this administration

and the government cannot wrap its head around. >> host: why not? first as you point of the chapter you talk about, this is the ideologies, stupid, and you do point out it's not illiteracy, it's not poverty, it's not the palestinian homeland, those are convenient ploy is who are supposedly of a growing islamic revolution or revival or whatever you want to call that. but what it always has been is a deep commitment to islam and from what i can tell strict islam, surely all. as you define it and let me ask you you'd be great description in this book of what it is. why don't you tell us what the sharia law is and what undermines all of the video what you just talked about. >> guest: first of all sharia, and this is the fundamental thing to the member, sharia is inherently incompatible with the u.s. constitution. >> host: that is what faizal

says of ground zero when told he was demoted. why is that? if we have people telling us that it is compatible in the constitution, why? >> guest: there is not only a religious component to sharia, this is an all encompassing ideological system that controls every aspect of the muslims life and if they have their way it would also control every aspect of and on muslim's life. sharia no freedom of speech, no freedom of religion. women's rights of the window. gays, stoned to death under the sharia society. jews and christians, second-class citizens. that's only the beginning. there's also a mandate to wage violent jihad conquests. it's not a spiritual struggle as you mentioned would like to frame it but jihad as a violent ideology of conquest. this is mandated under sharia

law. >> host: okay. if that is true and they are telling us they are following a strict adherence to a religion they all believe mandates sharia law and insurance to sharia law, in my command to talk about this in the book as well, why does our government and most of our media will get somebody like nidal hassan or carlos blood so or mohammed, the guy involved in the shooting of little rock, why are the lone wolves? why do we continue to assume that the vague, and i love this term, our self radicalized? >> guest: the case is you mentioned are all part of a broader global ideological movement and that's another way. the subtitle of the book is how the government is deceiving you about the islamist threat and to frame these guys as loan extremists which in every case the it fort hood, the christmas day underwear bomber, times

square bomber, in every case the obama administration frames them as you said, lone wolves, loan extremists, no broad connection to a global movement, where we had nidal hassan cut the fort hood shooter exchanging e-mails with amar al-awlaki, the al qaeda leader in yemen. yet the underwear bomber trained anwar al-awlaki, the times square bomber inspired by amar al waukee a taliban pakistan, yes of there are broader links but there's a few things that work here. number one, a crippling political correctness. absolutely crippling. another thing, quite frankly, is it is very difficult to recidivist mom is not a religious peace. say sharia is a threat, that is a very difficult thing to come to grips with, because that means that you are at war with a good slice of the muslim population who does follow fundamentally. who does follow sure we get to the tee. that is a very scary thing to admit for our government.

>> host: i want to go back to that because no less a person of george bush after 9/11 says it is a religious peace. right after the close of a radical muslim walked into the airport in frankfurt and shot a couple of american soldiers, barack obama said islam is one of the world's great religions. my sense is we want to believe that because we are a tolerant people but you have got quotes in this book from known terrorists and conspirators and collaborators who say no it's not. it's about submission. it's about jihad. if we do not believe their own words, how are we ever going to understand the threat? >> guest: we can't, and that's the bottom line. we are starting off politically incorrect off the bat. right up my alley. [laughter] if you are an intellectually

honest person, you cannot look at the koran, the cortex. any intellectually honest person cannot look at them and say they espouse a religion of peace. any intellectually honest person can't look at the exit of islam's profit mohammed and say that he was a man of peace and espoused peace. look at is on's history, current, older this is not a religion of peace and it's intellectually dishonest to say that it is. >> host: let me ask you this because the term that crops up in this discussion somewhere is moderate muslims or if you prefer personal jihad. and i want to go to a couple of people that you quote in this book, john brennan, the president's chief counterterrorism advisor and james clapper, the director of national intelligence. clapper said in front of congress muslim brotherhood come secular organization kind of like the club of greater cairo, and of course brennan has been saying chehab is a good thing

because it is like a personal struggle. as you interviewed people and studied this, if you take the average muslim immigrant to this country, do they believe that or are they inclined to be strict which is jihadists not a personal struggle it is a global struggle for dominance and it's not achieved until people have the book christians and jews and other non-beavers are either submitting to us or are dead. >> guest: not every muslim believes that think got to really worked with many in washington, d.c. who don't want jihad and they are truly moderate. but look, the polls show and i point them out in the book that some -- this is it you research poll, doesn't get more than pew, some 14% of american muslim supporters of the side of bombings in some shape or form. that raises to 26% when we talk

about young american muslims. that's very problematic to say the least and if you estimate ten to 15% of the world's muslims which critical ball estimates show time and time again, ten to 15% are radicalized and to follow the osama bin laden brand of islam. you have 1.6 billion in the world that's roughly 157 muslims. that is very problematic. moderate muslims in my experience and god bless them they are brave and i worked with them that many times the moderates, genuine muslim moderates i meet are muslims who do not follow shelia. they don't follow the koran fundamentally to that t.. i believe if you fall of islam fundamentally the cortex to the t, fundamentally you cannot be moderate because they are not moderate text. >> host: lots to get rid of example. you talk about the somali community in the twin cities in minneapolis and st. paul, which has now been proven to be

actively recruiting other young men to work for al-shabaab, the terrorist organizations. but if you are on a london or a member of a mosque in the tri-cities, income you just believe what you just espoused, i'm going to take life and hold it at arm's length. are you not in apostate? is that fought a tough case to make inside the mosque, inside the enclave communities whether it is in minneapolis or shall be dealt tennessee and other places that you talk about? how do you hold that view publicly and espouse and to others without some kind of reprisal from the religious infrastructure? >> that's a great point and you do so would a great personal risk. in the book i outlined several cases of genuine muslim moderates who are not only outcastes now in their community that were physically threatened. one brave individual named jamal

internals oklahoma of all places, the heartland, tulsa. al qaeda carried out the new attack. this was 2007 when they released a new videotape threatening bloodshed was outraged. they said these people giving muslims a bad name. so the next day he went and wrote an editorial in the world newspaper condemning al qaeda saying the distorted islam. the next day he went to his local mosque in a large center in a tulsa oklahoma, the largest. he was confronted on only by average worshipers, the mosques leadership physically confronted him and threatened and called him a traitor because he wrote an op-ed condemning al qaeda. she literally feared for his life. this is in the american heartland. that gives you an idea of what truly peace-loving muslims are up against when they do speak out. >> host: i'm glad you brought up the question of mosques because this is a mother figure that jumped out in this book.

since about 2000 or 2001, we've gone 1200 mosques to about 10,000. the number of these religious sanctuaries is proliferating around the country at an enormous rate. in your view are these legitimate sanctuaries' or are they battalions as they are actually describe in some of the islamic writings that were uncovered the holy land foundation trial or i even know the prime minister of turkey had a poem that he used to quote before he became a legitimate -- >> president obama -- >> host: great said mosques are battalions. what is it? are these now a place where a moderate muslim can either be brought into the fold and become a potential terrorist or somebody like carlos bledsoe who doesn't have any connection at all can be implicated,

radicalized and turned on his own family and country? >> guest: absolutely. i describe how i have been in the mosques from coast to coast in america and europe i've been in the mosques and interview the e mom's do it i'm not just sitting in an air-conditioned office i'm getting on the ground these are my first hand observations and experiences, and i have to tell you far too many times in american mosques which by the way it is estimated some 80% of american mosques have saudi funding behind them. very problematic because it is the epicenter of this global jihadist strain. 15 of the 19 hijackers yet they are funding mosques, building mosques from coast to coast even though we can't build a church in saudi arabia. but i've been in the mosques and the literature in this country literally stand on the back made in saudi arabia. it comes from saudi arabia. it comes from muslim brotherhood groups i know we are going to talk about the brotherhood.

this is right in the mosques and you talk to these he moms and not in all cases but many cases they can't tell you they recognize the right to exist. they can't condemn hamas and hezbollah as terrorist groups or say that surely a is a bad thing for america. and this is a common strain in mosques in this country and real quick i interviewed a former ar member of the revolutionary guard corps. this is the most radical vanguard of the regime to date he told me we've and operations out of the mosques in new york and the d'huez and i outlined several cases of terrorism funding coming from american mosques. >> host: this is the deep covered by that you talk about in the book? >> guest: post of the reason i bring it up is because as you probably know the chairman of homeland security committee and the house peter king has begun writing a very gingerly a series

of hearings of the requisition of american muslim communities he's been vilified by the press and the organizations we will describe in a minute or tearing into him. but in your view, can we understand this threat, can we keep from being deceived without going into the mosques and finding out exactly how deeply involved they are because that is what this is. the last time i looked there was still a crime. guess could you can't hit a firm grasp of what is going on in the community if you don't have a presence. as intelligence and the mosques, you simply can't. a mosque is the center of the islamic community and that is a strategy for groups like the muslim brotherhood and that's why you bring up those numbers yet what hundred mosques just ten years ago the number has doubled in just ten years. it's not a coincidence. the strategy for the saudis for groups like the muslim brotherhood. and i've seen this. i've been in the enclaves

throughout the west built a large as we call them mega mosques, multimillion-dollar projects stretching over several acres and city blocks. that becomes the center of the activity for the local community. much more than a place of worship. it's a meeting place in some cases it's been a plot in place. in moscow is built many times the property around the mosque is bought. muslims move into the homes and will result in the store fronts, everything is in arabic and you say this neighborhood has changed pretty rapidly. but this has been the blueprint in europe and all of a sudden you have a self segregating islamic enclave within the major western city. not in all cases but this has happened time after time i've witnessed it firsthand in britain, places like sweden people would never believe there are no go zones for police in these large muslim enclaves in europe and even a place like deer born in america developing into that. but - hub, the center activity

in the cases is yes, the mosque. >> host: you mentioned there going of the country. one of the things you talk of it is the islamic center of murphy's work tennessee. we've been fixated on the ground zero mosque in manhattan large facilities in northern virginia. but this is on 52,000 feet in a tiny suburb of asheville. why? what is the strategy? because you spend a lot of time talking about this in the book, and i had a guy from the defense department when i was doing a briefing on this tell me this is very much in keeping with we used to call the war of position. you move through the countryside, and you lean deposits of your belief and ideologies and infrastructure, and by the time you get to where you want to go, you've essentially got beach heads everywhere you want to be. is that what is going on in your view?

>> guest: i believe so absolutely. the broad geographic scope of the mosque, the mega moscow building in this country, murphy's third tennessee, this is the buckle of the bible belt alaska just broke ground on the first mosque, of rural wisconsin, kentucky, places you'd never expect and the key thing is they have very small muslim communities. norti sprigg tennessee which it is cutting the but i was on the ground at the mosque there is no more than 250 muslim families in the whole area. yet they are building as you said a 52,000 square foot moscow over 15 acres of the income multimillion-dollar projects come absolutely massive. i was there on the ground in salles they are going to do and there's multiple buildings. why? why do you need such a large structure for such a small community? and that is the question in the mega mosque projects. i investigated and an outline them in the book. why? what is the endgame? what is the goal? i talked to local activists and

murphy's bergen they said look, we feel like they are targeting us because this is kind of the center of the bible belt. nashville is a place gospel music goes, they feel it is a direct premeditated assault on the heart of christian america. >> host: if that's true why does the council approved the mosque? visible dollars and cents, political correctness, combination of the two? >> guest: it's a combination of political correctness and ignorance. i interview them a year of rutherford county tennessee where murfreesboro was located, and he didn't know the first thing about islam, about the muslim brotherhood, didn't know anything about the funding sources to this moscow because they still not come clean about where the money is coming from and that is a common theme in all of the mosques going of the controversial mosques they can't tell you where the money is coming from, and i saw the

congregation in murfreesboro. this was cabdrivers, college students, some professional types. i hate to stereotype but i didn't see the means to raise millions of dollars. it just didn't seem to like it was there. i see the same thing in a humble church community in d.c. i just didn't see it and i asked where is the money coming from she wouldn't go on camera but he told me it is all locally raised in such a small community, not an affluent muslim community. i just don't see it, fred. you look at the saudi funding as i said 80% and their must be a bigger force at work. that isn't conspiratorial. it's the facts. >> host: you point out in the book about 80% of the mosques built in this country are probably getting some kind of infusion of the saudi money. if they are in essentially the money people, or the operation

people, the communication, the public relations infrastructure, the so-called chief operating officers of this growing infrastructure in the muslim brotherhood is that fair to say because i want to talk of the muslim brotherhood. you mentioned in the book that seems to be part of the threat we either do not acknowledge or know about but won't talk about this to the saudis provide the money and the brothers for the archaeology. that's the way that it's worked the past 40 to 50 years. the muslim brotherhood is the ascendant in egypt and who may very well gain control in that country in the 1950's, 60's the egyptian government for the brotherhood was found it the crackdown, killed several brotherhood leaders, and arrested them come executed them, some of the leading lights of the brotherhood of them relocated to saudi year libya and a refuge from safe-haven and hooked up with the saudi government, and from there to

put their foot operatives flush with saudi petrodollars spread out across europe, across america, the mosques were built, the enclaves were created from so while the brotherhood and the saudis don't see eye to eye without a doubt, they've worked closely in the islam of the west. >> host: does that mean that their goal was to complete islam of the west whether we are talking about your love for the united states? in other words, they want -- i don't want to put words in your mouth, but in the book, you indicate the goal is nothing less than for the united states and for that matter the western world under sharia law which is subsequently an ethical to the way we live our lives. >> guest: china, japan for the muslim brotherhood or al qaeda on his block, shia, sunni, doesn't matter. the endgame is not just the shelia states but a world governed by sharing a it it's

not just me saying that, that is their own statements which i outlined in the book. the endgame is a world governed by shelia and what they call the caliphate. that is basically an islamist superstate. all of the nations together in one united bloc to take on the west, take on all infidels and subvert them to the law of sharia. it doesn't matter whether it is the brotherhood, al qaeda, that is the shared in the endgame. >> host: let's talk about the means to that end because of the muslim brotherhood is an overarching holding company if you will of the strict ideologies, would it be fair to say that some of their tactical units would be organizations like the council on islamic organizations of the muslim student association or north american trust, you know these because they are part of the holy land foundation trial

proceeding. but how much or how little should we trust these organizations? from my experience, they are the very astute politically in this country. they know exactly what to say and what to say it and how to take i think a legitimate criticism of perhaps a threat and turn it into a slide against religion and culture. >> guest: islamophobia from the groups like the first thing you have to remember what the groups, the whole alphabet soup of american muslim organizations who purport to be the spiritual for the muslim american community from the islamic society of north america, nsa, the muslim student association, all of these groups or at least 95% of them were named in muslim brotherhood documents and the brotherhood's documents, not just me saying that but it's their own documents uncovered by our fbi to the detriment of red

gum adjustments from where we're sitting outside of d.c. during a raid in 2000 for the fbi uncovered a muslim brotherhood documents of northern virginia at the home of the leading american muslim brotherhood of british that named several of the groups you see on cnn, fox news, msnbc, reporting to the spokesman is a identify them as, quote, our friends, friends of the brotherhood. these are subversive organizations that have no place in american >> host: why are they so good at getting deeply -- i want to talk about the level of infiltration here because this is something the soviets dreamed of but were never able to bring off. however the infrastructure in law enforcement and the courts and education and the media and now the highest level of government if what you're sitting in the book is true indicates they are operatives almost everywhere we turn, how

do you get rid of these folks come and how do you begin that process? because from what i can say, neither party in congress and certainly this administration or the previous administration has done anything but say how can we help? >> number one come a few things to remember. how they have been able to incinerate and ingratiate themselves to the halls of power, they don't look the part. the muslim brotherhood operators in america they are wearing suits and ties, they are western-educated, eloquent, well spoken, telegenic, they don't look like raising the jihadists, and the tactics are different from al qaeda. tactics. the in the game as i said is the same. sharia globally including in america. the tactics, the brotherhood is very patient, very still see. they will wait 100 years to obtain their goal. al qaeda wants to blow you up now, tell you not to read the brotherhood says wait a minute we can do this through legal

means. we can do this by getting elected, buy getting jobs in the educational system, buy getting jobs in the media. we can do this legally. the final stage of courses while at chehab when they are strong enough there is a reason code osama bin laden ayman al-zawahiri, khalid sheikh mohammed, all of these outside us before they formed al qaeda as young men, they were members of the muslim brotherhood. the brotherhood is the gateway jihad as many muslims in america are discovering. but right now you made this point earlier, you talked about the kind of hot jihadists, al-shabaab, is that kind of a good cop and bad cops an area where the muslim brotherhood looking impeccably dressed and well spoken and the nicest guy in the room sitting down with president bush, president clinton and obama high levels of

the defense a profit or her homeland security saying look, we just want to help our community help you. and yet at the same time, you've got bin laden being killed and winning this war to read to me there seems to be a seóul subterfuge that makes us think we are winning when we are not to read is that true? >> guest: it's absolutely true. the movement as we were discussing osama bin laden just one part of it. al qaeda still lives and thrives but you have the likes of the muslim brotherhood and iran and hezbollah and the brotherhood many cases you don't see them coming. if they gain power in egypt is not only buffer israel, the northern neighbor, it is very bad for america because the sharia law will be the goal and i can tell you i was in israel, i was in jerusalem meeting with the government officials in february as mubarak was out the door, very, very concerned to

say the least that egypt will end up in the muslim brotherhood hand and you need look no further and the brotherhood spiritual leader. keyes and use off. i know we're offering a lot of names. >> host: al jazeera. >> guest: he's got the biggest show in al jazeera. he is the global spiritual leader of the muslim brotherhood. he is a guy that has said we will conquer the west. this is a guy with probably tens of millions of not hundreds of millions of insurance around the world who watched the show, muslims. he said he will conquer the west not for a violent jihad but through what he calls cross utilization. we would do it on violently through demographics. demographic jihad and once we are there through the massive immigration to the west we are building mosques and proselytizing. that's how we are going to conquer the west. that's what they're saying so it's great that osama bin laden, one of the leaders of the violent wing is gone it's a

great day for america believe me, but much broader than just him. and much broader than al qaeda. this administration has tunnel vision when they talk about the war on terror a call with against islamist fascism. the talk strictly about al qaeda. the brotherhood is the granddaddy of them all when it comes to the islamic terrorist groups and they are getting stronger and stronger. iran, another topic, hezbollah. it's broader than al qaeda. >> host: it seems the analogy that might work for people figuring out how the pieces fit is to assume in a world war ii if we said we are at war as opposed to it furthers a subdivision we are going after it's fair to say that all al qaeda and hezbollah and al-shabaab and some of the authors learning about certainly hamas which is agreed descending of the brotherhood are just that. their children. the parent is the muslim

brotherhood yet we continue to focus on the cuts. >> guest: as i said he belongs to the brotherhood before al qaeda and belong to that group for a reason. the brotherhood lays the groundwork and delete the groundwork for al qaeda and hamas in its charter identifies itself from some titles delete yourself identifies itself for the palestinian. hamas is the brotherhood yet president obama seems to be asking israel to negotiate with them. but look, the brotherhood is absolutely the satellite organization yet to the obama administration has made a conscious decision to work with the muslim brotherhood. it in power then and egypt. they had to know that when mubarak was at the door the the biggest beneficiary would be the muslim brotherhood. the had to know that any observer of the middle east and europe knew that the largest most organized most powerful opposition force was the muslim brotherhood. this administration thinks because the brotherhood isn't

blowing in the one not yet they can use them against al qaeda. >> host: but it wasn't just the administration. if you look at the mainstream reporting you've got the feeling was a bunch of kids of blackberrys in the square using google and facebook on their way to freedom. now, the muslim brotherhood from everything i can tell is a very sophisticated political organization. republicans and democrats should be vertically integrated as these guys are so i think what i am hearing you say is after the euphoria of the overthrow was over it is the people on the ground with the organization that will finish the revolution. would you say that's what's going to happen in egypt? >> guest: absolutely. i think the revolution of egypt is in some degree, to some degree took the brotherhood by surprise a bit. but once they called on, they caught on quickly, and these young blackberry toting facebook lovingly egyptians got less of them if they were quickly pushed

aside. the strongest and most ruthless force in egypt is the muslim brotherhood and they quickly worked through the system and they are getting stronger and stronger. and even "the new york times" who trumpeted the egyptian revolution as a great day for moderation and david spurring evin they are publishing articles now warning about the rise of radical islam in egypt courtesy of the muslim brotherhood we are seeking the christian churches throughout egypt the bird to the ground, christians attack committees are the fruits of in power in the muslim brotherhood and the obama administration honorable never forget the quote a few days after mubarak felker lubber gib is the former secretary, fred, said we want all parties in egypt involved in the political process. hello, the muslim brotherhood. this is madness.

>> host: i don't see them involved. i want to get into more of your thoughts on the end of spring in a moment, but i didn't want to miss the opportunity to find out how a young 25 year old freelance reporter in chile became so involved in domestic terrorism, the pursuit thereof and self or civilization jihad this is your book of business and pretty much all you do now. how did you get from their? >> guest: 9/11 was a watershed moment in our lives. i started out first of all, i did it hit the book to my father. my father was a paratrooper for the hundred first airborne patriot, loved the military, left this country, and freakin' in northeast philadelphia working-class very interesting dinner table conversations about the stalingrad, king david, alexander the great, he was the

most weld redmon i ever met he was brilliant and he schooled me on these topics. so i had this passion for foreign policy in the middle east and specific from a young age. >> host: well schooled but not intellectual. >> guest: know, my father was actually a high school dropout. self-taught. intellectual ferocious intellectual frisch as reader hafed. a self-made, self-taught electrician in philadelphia he would read and understand brief this stuff and covering sports on the next basketball player i was covering the nba and living in new york a few months before 9/11 and long story short sports writing didn't do it for me. i had the passion for the subject material 9/11 have been and a long story short, i threw everything i could 19/12 ipod a

koran. first rule, know your enemy. our enemy was citing the koran. i wish more members of the political class on both sides of the ogle did the same thing but sadly they haven't. i immersed myself in this and i studied intensively for your devouring everything i could get my hands on and got the point i said i'm a journalist and ready to throw my hat in the ring to read david horowitz gave me my first shot and it's been a fun ride since. >> host: you have to admit you are a small and elite group of journalists that go after this thomas patrick pool maybe a few others but you are a tiny coalition against a huge journalistic pale light that says no problem, not a problem. the problem with guys like

stakelbeck is to come from the position of intolerance, and yet one of the things i notice in this book is nothing that you see is not backed up by facts and many cases by forces within the koran. this has got to be frustrating for somebody like you who has been on this case for ten years and in many ways were further away from understanding of enemy from falling what you said we have to do. does that mean we don't understand ourselves in this country? >> guest: yes. you just summed it up. there is a complete -- we live in the greatest nation, the greatest civilization in the history of mankind. america but also the judeo-christian civilization. there is such sheen on the part of the western man, such guilt. we have oppressed of the muslim world. we are the injury list colonialist aggressor. we have oppressed muslims through the world and have been a force for evil throughout the

world. that is the mainstream line of thought for the political left and many of our elite institutions, universities and the government mainstream media and i hate to make a blanket statement but i'd seen it, i'm in the media in washington, d.c. in the halls of power and i see this self closing for the western civilization there is an attraction for anything that is not western so there's a natural sympathy of islam victims. the palestinians are victims of the western-style is really is. that is a stream running through, and young people are being taught this revisionist history revisionists islamic history in our schools, public schools and universities there's a lot of confusion and there's a lack pride and self-worth and as i outlined in the book by a

french entire chapter and in cautionary tales great britain is the center of the western suicide. >> host: bernard lewis has said it europe will probably be as honest by the end of the century. do you buy into that and think it is a possibility? are they moving with that kind of momentum? >> so rapidly and i think bernard lewis might have been too conservative. i've seen great britain and people are going to say you're crazy this is an alarmist. it's not just me saying this its leading scholars said this some say by the year 2015 will have salles segregated muslim enclaves living outside of the british common law and we are already seeing it. there are some 87 sharia courts functioning right now in great britain outside of the british common law and there are no those loans in that country where police do not venture. this is great britain and i can

tell you winston churchill was turning in his grave. post twice of a report recently then indicated there are no less than 50 shelia cases in american courts. most of them having to do with custody law and family law but nonetheless, that is a pretty shocking statistic for a country that supposedly says through the sixth amendment the supreme court will be the supreme law of the land dhaka and coexist with sharia? >> guest: people don't know this is going on under the radar screen it's great you mentioned that. and like you said, it starts out in marital disputes. divorce court type of thing. i want to divorce my wife, my husband, god forbid beats me, that's what started in great britain, and you have an e mom or tribal elder, one of the pillars of the muslim neighborhood in great britain or sweden or france basically acting as judge and jury literally handing down rulings for married couples in the west

and among muslim couples in the west acting outside of all of the host country and it happens very slowly but when you have lennon called them useful idiots in the political class and the archbishop a few years ago who said we have to accept sharia law in the communities of the top christian authority of great britain giving sharia an okay to act outside of the british common law? when you have people like that in the positions of authority if only hasten the downfall and the american plane people completely in the dark do not know this is going on. if they did they would be outraged and that is why i wrote the book. >> host: we have a director and member committee of this talking to my wife when she was carrying him on the interfaith counseling that is going on, and she said what about the muslim brotherhood? what about some of the assaults of dhaka christians in egypt and elsewhere and the reaction was

from an episcopal priest. it's their time. i mean, they -- the willful blindness and this is your term in the book is what may undo this country. if something catastrophic happens here, we will be accessories after the fact if not for coconspirators. >> guest: if history books are written 50 years from now, 75 years from now they are going to look back on this generation and curse this generation and shake their fists at us for what we didn't do as of this threat was rising to just accept this to acquiesce to the rise of the jihadists islamists suicide and i can talk about the political lesson specific. they don't know who they are getting in bed with pity the they don't know how roofless these guys are, how hateful and violent as they are. yet why go to the congressman's hearings which you mentioned earlier. every single -- i was there

every single democrat on that panel derided the hearings as a witch hunt, antiislamic reading from the same talking points provided by the muslim public affairs council. >> guest: the muslim brotherhood group. [laughter] postcode we hang with the same crowd. laughter could guess to we do. but think of 1979, fred, another cautionary tale. the irony in the revolution when the ayatollah khomeini came to power, one of the watershed moments of the modern history in a bad way, she was helped by the socialist, communist, the marxists, the left they were behind the ayatollah. democracy and change to iran. first thing he did when he came to power about three months after windup, roundup of the left, all of the socialists in iran had a big difference in jail or executed since the cautionary tale and word of warning for the left and you're going to that for the surely a

islam you don't know what you're getting into. >> host: let me go back to the ear of spring, a term i've always been suspect if i were to take three countries, egypt and iran and of course israel. as you look at what is unfolding certainly to the north and now to the south of israel is this the beginning of an air of a spring or a long islamic winter in your view? >> i think it is the latter. and if you look at each of these countries affected by the so-called era of spurring, the biggest most likely beneficiary are islamists. in each of you have the muslim brotherhood and libya and the brother of and al qaeda types. in syria, we don't know. i personally wouldn't be sad to see the regime go but there's a worry about the muslim brotherhood gaining power in syria. in bahrain as you have them benefitting and you have yemen and al qaeda conquered the two towns, al qaeda. so in each of the situations accept tunisia which is moderate

have seen some islamist strings in each of the country the most likely beneficiaries are islamists. so you could see i think even it sounds crazy but a push for a renewed caliphate if you see the islamist forces coming to power in all these countries in the middle east you could see a push for unity and i can tell you iran is looking to unify the muslim world against israel first and america second. america is the ultimate prize. >> host: you talk the saturday people and the sunday people. the saturday people would be the israelis, the people in the book where the christians were the sunday people with what is the future of israel under this scenario, and specifically if your benjamin netanyahu right now are you at a point you are going to have to pull the trigger first? because if he does, you know what the world reaction will be. >> guest: if he does, if it is an offensive operation or defense of operation, fred,

reaction will be an outrage and castigating israel perhaps even sanctions this time around. including this country. after 2012, when -- if president obama is reflective, post 2012, he has nothing holding him back from carrying out his full ms against israel. looking at the posture when he was sitting with netanyahu in the oval office last week when he was schooled by netanyahu. i will get to that in the second one to go back to your question about israel pulling the trigger first. with iran, yes. israel is facing an existential threat. this administration will not strike militarily. i don't see any scenario they would do that. they should i'm not a warmonger i don't want another war tied up iraq, afghanistan and for some

reason libya. but the only way you are going to stop iran from doing nuclear is a military force because the sanctions are great, but at the end of today they are not going to work. at the end of the day this regime is motivated by, again, and ideology. it is a messianic apocalyptic they truly believe that they will shape policy around this, the government truly believes that they can usher the end times -- >> host: this would be the 12th imam. >> guest: yes come he goes by various names, accused the islamic messiah, and this all sounds crazy, i know, but they believe this. the likes of ahmadinejad, and they believe if they strike out against israel and acquire nuclear weapons and a time of great chaos and the people what we are seeing right now was the reds' spring they believe that can hasten the return of the islamic messiah could lead to victory over israel and the west

so that plan nothing would khator them or dissuade them from the goal they believe it is divinely sanctioned from allah and it can tax of a nuclear iran because they will use the weapons. one of the precursors to the return of the islamic messiah, and i don't mean to get to into the weeds here, one of the treaty to precursors as conquer in jerusalem. that is one of the precursors in this in same system, belief system of the iranian regime. >> host: having said that one of the arguments and this is coming from the palestinian community, if you could just make an equitable division of israel and jerusalem, everything will be fine. but of course there was no israel prior to 1948 and the islamic revolution goes back to the year 708 d. so what about the years in between where there was a small

amount of violence, steam comes to mind, most of the middle east. >> guest: fred, you make such a great point. no one mentions right now if israel is blamed for all of our ills, al qaeda wants to blow us up because of israel because we support the jews, it's their fault if only israel would give more land and even give up the nuclear program some say they would like a nuclear-free middle east if only israel would cease to defend itself then we would have peace and the islamists would leave us alone when islam ruled out of the arabian peninsula until the year 1948 when israel was miraculously i believe reestablished 1400 years, we saw a wave after wave of islamist conquests in she hot against the west. israel did not exist in this period come in yet we saw spain, sicily, greece, the balkans,

romania conquered by islamists. we saw them try to central france and get to the gates of yemen twice. this had nothing to do with israel and nothing to do with shoes. israel is the canary in the coal mine in this fight, the first line of defense for the western civilization. >> host: let's talk of the defense and you and this book and i want to end the interview this week. a lot of people are going to read this and say what can i do as a citizen, what can my government do? gives us some suggestions to what somebody to picks this book up and goes oh my god what my role in this? >> guest: we talk about these issues a lot. that is always the question. i travel the country giving speeches and that's what i'm asked. number one, please come on in for you, get informed. you don't have to be a missile expert, by the book but you don't have to be an expert or

political junkie but please put down your ipod, turn off american idol or the game 15, 20 minutes a day, get informed on what is going on in the world. you would to yourself, your kids and grandkids. monumental changes are happening right now in the muslim world and you need to know because as i describe in the book is in your backyard. >> host: if you read conventional media, you're going to get that impression that if this is the dividend from generations of american imperialists how do you get around this? there are places people can do to educate themselves? >> guest: sang god for the web. the jihad watch.org is an invaluable resource and website. the drug report for the general great sight i highly recommend it off the top of my head. jihad watch.org is a great place to check every day join with like-minded people come you have

the social media. you can find people concerned about this islamist threat. think of the tea party, grassroots, there are groups come back for america is a good group that is devoted to this threat and atlas shrugged, a good site. did with like-minded people, making your voice heard, get in your congressmen, federal, local, state officials, get in their years, make your voice heard. i can tell you that when he fled their offices with phone calls there's a mosque being built down the street that is not a peaceful mosque that is peddling muslim brotherhood saudi literature getting your congressman to hear about that the pressure works. >> host: let me ask about pressuring congress because they seem to at least be very slow taking up the mantle. peter king notwithstanding but you talk about organizations like care or any of these groups that are affiliate's come subdivisions of the brotherhood.

why are the legal? and why are they getting tax-exempt status and why are americans able to put those questions to the members of congress who have complete jurisdiction over the tax code and tax-exempt status saying why are we indirectly funding terrorism if we are giving money to care which raises money for hamas? >> guest: this is the million-dollar question not only under this administration but under the bush administration. why are these groups even legal? the two largest and most influential muslim brotherhood groups in america, the largest terrorism financing trial in american history, the holy land foundation trial, 2007, 2008 which you can find online by the way, you can find all the documents and the evidence, the result of it, but both of these groups were named as unindicted co-conspirators in the largest trial in american history yet they have an open door to our white house. it's madness yet they are advising the fbi on the

sensitivity training for the muslim community. this is the socks inside the henhouse. >> host: didn't you write about the guy at fort hood after nidal hasan, advising a kind of caution? she is a member of the muslim brotherhood is he not? >> guest: he is the leading official for the islamic society of north america which is an acknowledged muslim brotherhood and a month after the fort hood shootings he lecture on islam the troops at fort hood. you can't make this up. >> host: if anwar al-awlaki was in congress after line 11, you have to ask yourself who is watching the store. but again, it seems to me that americans need to wake up to what this is. and it's difficult because they're seems to be pushed back from their elected representatives. local, national, even law enforcement. why is that? has the infiltration become so

successful that there is now a kind of bedrock core of islamists inside our infrastructure, government, media, education? >> guest: the infiltration is so deep, fred, and it is a lack of intellectual curiosity. a symbol who will search could give you information about the talk is of the muslim brotherhood groups and if you google the muslim brotherhood you will find everything you need to know, yet apparently our government officials and federal law in many cases federal law enforcement officials are not doing that background research, are not exercising that due diligence and in many cases the fact is they don't think the muslim brotherhood is a great threat. al qaeda violent jihad, muslim brotherhood -- >> host: let me ask about muslim brotherhood because it occurs to me if it is powerful first of all what should be illegal in itself but secondly,

if the art essentially underwriting sedition in this country which is an unlawful act, why can't we go after them using the same statutes, racketeering and otherwise we went after organized crime? clearly this is a greater threat than the mafia or john gotti or any of those subdivisions and those racketeering statutes are in place one of is that a legitimate way to go after them? >> guest: absolutely legitimately. the holy land foundation trial unindicted co-conspirators or on the right track but nobody's moving. the department of justice just broken a major story about a month ago, fred telehealth this department of justice eric holder department of justice throughout cases against muslim brotherhood operatives in america, threw out the window and said we are not going to pursue. why? >> host: i'm going to close this out by going back to your dad because it seems to me one of the things that may be

competing with our ability to fully understand this threat is there are not enough guys like your dad, not enough people that fought for this country, were received well when they came back or even had to deal with at first politics. is that true? are we missing a generation now who have perhaps so enshrined in our freedom that we don't appreciate what they 14? >> guest: i am a young guy 35-years-old but raised right. a strong family units and influences and raised the right way. nothing was handed to me. today there is a sense of entitlement in this country and so many distractions with video games, the internet, text messaging, everything, people are not as grounded. you and i are sitting here talking face-to-face, fred. sometimes someone will be across the classroom and say no talking to mature text messaging.

there is an attention deficit. who has time to sit on and read the koran or the attention span to do it? that is a probable but one word of encouragement at least, i travel the country and i talk a lot of times to young people and i seen this younger generation coming up. i see in a definitive glimmers of hope to read these kids are grounded and they're starting to get it, that is a word of encouragement before i go because there is hope, not coping change but there is genuine hope. >> host: one other group want to get to before we finish, women. it seems to me if anybody has a vested interest in keeping sharia law from coming at least consistent with our present statutes it would be them; would you agree? >> guest: absolutely. what about feminists? where are the feminists on this? i have a wife and daughter. i'm doing this for them. >> host: one of the places you can start is by reading the terrorist next door. erick stakelbeck, thank you for what to do. keep up the fight. god knows we need