you don't see any significant consumer groups that are funded by some of google's rifles coming out -- rivals coming out and raising concerns about this. and that silence, i think s is very important. >> host: gautham nagesh. >> host: now, google has also expanded into many new areas, and that's raised a lot of the complaints we're talking about, specifically with the case of yelp. their ceo was referring to copyright violations in their view or intellectual property violations, we've also seen concerns with regards to google books. would it be fair to say that google pushes the boundaries of existing laws in terms of what they view is private or what should be in the lick domain? because that seems to be one of the concerns is that we're in unchartered waters, companies like google and facebook have what they believe the conceptions of what these issues will look like in the future. so are you, do you think google is forward-looking in the way they treat these areas?

>> guest: i think when you take the example of the google book project in which google has scanned in millions and millions of books, so if i'm a young girl living on an indian reservation or a young boy live anything inner city los angeles, i now through the google books project can have access to a library as significant as the library at oxford, i think they deserve tremendous credit for being extremely forward-looking and thinking about how we can go and overcome the information divide. and in that respect i think they, their conduct is very laudatory. >> host: and what about services like yelp that complain that when google uses their content or if google introduces a service that mimics what they already provide and places it on the search page, that essentially eliminates their bids? is that just a consequence of doing business on the web? >> guest: you know, i have to answer the question from a consumer's perspective, and from a consumer's perspective, you know, having greater rivalry, having google go and create a

product similar to yelp's, coming up with their own local search products, that's competition. and competition also benefits consumers. >> host: now, the concern usually with monopolies is when they expand into new areas, they're able to use the area where they're dominant to boost those services. so in your view, that's not a concern here? google's search market is not the reason why products like google maps are more popular than mapquest nowadayses, for example? >> guest: i think that's correct. >> host: david balto, you were around when microsoft was in the antitrust hot seat. is there a comparison to see between these two sets of hearings? >> guest: yeah, there's no greater comparison between that and myself and matt damon. so the -- look, microsoft, first of all, microsoft charged consumers excessive amounts of money. i don't know about the two of you, but i've never gotten a

bill from google. second, microsoft lost -- if you wanted to go and switch from their operating system, you had to go buy another operating system, try to install it, and microsoft created incompatibilities so it was difficult to install. you know, microsoft put chains around computer manufacturers to make it difficult for them to go and offer, um, other kinds of operating systems. you know, to paraphrase lloyd benson, you know, i know monopolists, i've sued monopolists, but google is no monopolist. >> host: but wasn't that not's right as a entrepreneurial company to develop their own system? >> guest: they simply went too far. the develop was, of course, perfectly fine. but in denying consumers choices, denying them from being able to switch from something else, that's how they went afoul. please note google isn't doing anything that denies people the ability to search from one

search en-- to switch from one search engine to another. >> host: their revenue model is different from a software company like microsoft in the sense they make their money from advertising. we see in the other areas where, most notably in the media where firms make money on advertising, there are competition laws restricting the relationships between paid advertisements and disclosure of editorial versus opinion content or sponsored content. would something like that be appropriate this terms of approval? because that seems to be what mr. cleland is asking for. >> guest: the message of the hearing yesterday is one of transparency. is there adequate disclosure so consumers know? and, please, keep in mind, you know, this isn't something where it's the one newspaper you read or, you know, you're in a one-newspaper town because you can readily switch to other forms of search to figure out if you're getting the fair search from google, and i think that forces them to keep things fair. so i don't think that kind of regulation would be necessary. >> host: david balto, if you'd

been working with google and advising eric schmidt, how would you judge his performance in front of the committee? >> guest: i thought it was tremendously candid. these questions are really complicated, but both the committee and mr. schmidt deserve a tremendous amount of credit for highlighting an issue that consumers really care a lot about and, you know, helping to clarify what's going on in the market. >> host: david balto, former policy director of the bureau of competition for the federal trade commission during the clinton administration and a longtime antitrust attorney. thank you for being on "the communicators." gautham nagesh has been our guest reporter, he is a technology reporter for "the hill" newspaper. the hill.com is the web site, hilicon valley is where you can find gautham's materials. thank you, gentlemen. >> guest: thanks. .. finish

assumption that a politician or a ceo is saying something, they

are not telling you the truth. they may be telling you the truth but the burden should be on them to prove it. >> he's an eagle scout, editor of "mother jones" magazine, directed and produced three of the top 10 grossing documentaries of all time. and also a best selling author. his latest, is here comes trouble. sunday on in depth your chance to call, e-mail and tweet michael moore. >> the c-span networks provide coverage of politics, public affairs, nonfiction books and american history. this month look for congress to continue federal spending into november and putting funding for recent natural disasters. keep tabs on the deficit committee as they formally a plan to lower the debt and follow the presidential candidates as they continue to campaign. it's all of able to you on television, radio, online and social media sites. search, watch and share all our programs anytime.

we are on the road with her c-span digital bus and local content vehicle. bringing resources to local communities and showing events from around the country. it's washington your way, the c-span networks. created by cable, provided as a public service. >> again live coverage of the wounded warriors and families daylong conference coming up. until then this past friday iraqi president said iraq supports independent statehood for the palestinian people and endorses the path to go for to the united nations for full recognition. the iraqi president spoke about security and economic stability in this country. he spoke before the united nations general assembly. >> mr. president, allow me at the outset to congratulate you and our brothers, the people of the tarmac on the occasion of the 66th session of the general assembly.

our presentation will be of assistance to you in performing your duties. we are confident that your experience and vision will be an important factor in the success of the general assembly. our thanks also goes to your predecessors, for his presidency of the general assembly and his outgoing session. i would also like to congratulate on his reelection for a second term as secretary-general and wish him all success in his work. mr. president, it is an honor to stand in front of you one more time to brief you on, as it works, build a modern state that lives in peace with its people

and neighbors. iraq is building a homeland where everyone is at peace and stability, regardless of sectarian, ethnic, a system where the rule of law prevails. and lives are respected and the system that is based on democracy and peaceful transition of power. this is the basis on the past in which we embark. and events that are currently taking place in the upper region have proved the righteousness of the past we have followed and we are now following. the practice of change and reform which iraq has and will always continue to call for have become an essential part of the

aspirations of our people for freedom and for their ability to choose a political system, a system of their own on the basis of democracy and human rights. we have come a long way in the building of our political system, which iraq has started to restore the elements of its strength, the strengths that were lost due to war, internal and external wars conducted by the former dictatorship. and the international isolation ascension that iraq experience. and as well as the collapse of the situations at the outbreak of failure, that threatened its national existence. after the collapse of the former regime we began to overcome these negativities, and they

became, thanks our determination and hope of international community. develop and having witnessed improvement in the security in iraq were we are relying on the five year plan for the year 2010-2014, announced by the government of iraq on octobe october 2010, and the licensing around that were held between iraq and companies, and oil and natural gas -- >> we will leave this event. you can see it in its entirety on our website at c-span.org. go to the c-span video library. live now to the ronald reagan building here in washington for the u.s. naval institute and the military officers association conference on reintegrate severely injured military members into civilian life. speaking is norbert ryan, the president of military officers association of america.

>> almighty god, beneath the canopy of your power and grace, we ask your blessing upon this gathering of those who share in the sacrifice and commitment of service to both god and country. may you work well with your and swathing devotion to fill the gap in honor of those who have gone before in pain so great a price for the freedom we fully share. guide them in their actions to empower the resolve to forge ahead on behalf of those who now serve so far away. may your grace sustained them, their families and their mission. on to this end we give thanks and say amen. >> thank you major. please be seated. well, we want to thank all of our sponsors for supporting the defense forum washington today. this year, especially we would like to thank our executive

sponsor, u.s. aa, and we're pleased to have with us from usaa brian cotton, mark hildebrand, tina garcia, among others, so thank you to usaa. [applause] >> i also want to thank the american physical therapy association for sponsoring our breakfast this morning. a couple of other quick notes. we applauded the honor guard at how about a round of applause for are currently serving men and women and their spouses who are here today. [applause] i also want to note two of our keyboard members from both the military officers association and u.s. the institute are here with us today, our chairman of the board, admiral, thank you for being here, and doctor london i see from u.s. naval institute. doctor, thank you for being here today. i also want to say hello to a special friend that is here at table number two, chairman chet

edwards. nice to have you here. thanks. [applause] >> we'll be introducing various vips as we go along, but i see one special friend, a navy veteran, matt is here today. he is the white house director of veterans of wounded warrior policy. matt, would you way too everybody? thank you. [applause] the issues we'll discuss today are very important and we're pleased to have such a great turnout. throughout the day you have a chance to ask questions of the speakers and panelists. our goal is to address as many as possible. cards and pins have been provided at each table to help you shape your questions, getting to the point, allowing time for a good answer and more questions. look for volunteers when we get to the panels, and opportunities for questions. they would be walking around with microphones during the

questions and answers, and we will be collecting your cards. okay, we are a little bit ahead of schedule so we will go ahead and start out. is my privilege now to introduce our first speaker for the day, dr. john nagl. john is the president of the center for a new american security. easy graduate of united states military academy, and has served in numerous positions and responsibility as detailed in your program, culminating as operations officer for an armor battalion task force during operation iraqi freedom where he earned his combat action badge and brown star. he has earned recognition at numerous schools to include the george c. marshall award as the top graduate at u.s. army command and general staff. he is a doctor from oxford university, a rhodes scholar, and his top national security studies at west point and in georgetown university security program. he is also served as military assistant to deputy secretaries of defense and he still has a

full head of hair after that duty. he has published numerous books and articles and has been featured in newspapers, radio, television and news programs. he is giving to other talks today and is on to other tv shows, so if you see them later in the day you will know he earned his pay today. it's my pleasure to welcome dr. john nagl. [applause] >> thank you, admiral, very much. thank you all of you for your dedication to our soldiers, sailors, airmen, marines and all those who love them, though they are now serving and those who have served. this last decade of warfare has been truly a revolution for the united states military. we have adapted to a very old kind of warfare for which we were not prepared. we develop new tools to defeat terrorists, and most of all we see truly extraordinary determination and courage from a new great generation, i think the new greatest generation of

young americans who for the first time since the revolutionary war have fought an extended campaign, purely as volunteers. truly an extraordinary accomplishment. as these wars begin to wind down and the country struggles to pay the bills it has accumulated, we must ensure that those who have borne the burden of these wars are not forgotten. we must ensure the nation remembers and cares for our veterans and their families as they have earned, and as they deserve. i'm going to go back in time a little bit and talk about how we got two where we are and where i think we are and then where we need to go from here. and i'm going to start in the years following the collapse of the soviet union and the victory over saddam hussein's iraq in operation desert storm. when as part of an army that took the fourth largest army in the world and turn into the second largest army in iraq, the period of about 100 hours. after that warned we focused on improving our capability to fight a conventional war against

conventional enemies. even though there were few to be found. when the attacks of september 11 struck three of therefore targets, america rightly attacked an afghan government that it shielded al qaeda, toppling the taliban in an innovative campaign that relied upon special forces soldiers, some riding horseback, calling in the sport of the world's most powerful air force. unfortunately, this innovative campaign failed to capture osama bin laden, the leader of al qaeda, who escaped into pakistan. tragically, it also failed to provide stability to a shattered country that was reeling after a generation of war. the taliban regained strength across the border in pakistan and soon began returning to afghanistan as gorillas, that america was focused elsewhere. the invasion of iraq in march 2003 was a replay of the afghan campaign on a much larger scale. again, a tremendously successful initial invasion was not enough

to build a better piece in the aftermath of war. in iraq, american decisions to disband the iraqi army, prevent members of the baath party from serving in government, and postpone local rule ignited fuel that burst into flames during the hot summer of 2003. my u.s. army tank unit was preparing for conventional combat against another armored force when we suddenly received orders to deploy to iraq. we arrived into town, iraq's wild west. it despite the almost exclusively by sunnis who hated the shia-dominated government that had assumed power in the wake of saddam's departure. the town's police chief was assassinated the day we arrived. the second to fall into six months since the invasion. we struggle to build a police force that would protect its people and develop local government. in order to translate the need for the people into which we could understand and programs we

could find. we fought bitterly against enemies we could rarely identify. our town was in great neighborhood sidgwick between the provincial capital and insurgent hotbed of run amok in the city of falluja, where privacy contractors took a wrong turn to the death in the spring of 2004. the american reaction to the killings was swift, powerful, and sadly poorly informed, spurring a national uprising that unified the sunnis and shia's against us for a short time. supply convoys ambushed come in many units went on half rations. in my experience a suitable metaphor for the next two years of the war in iraq, the destruction of the golden mosque in february 2006 was the final straw, the insurgency metastasize into a full-scale civil war. in november 2006, president bush replaced both his secretary of defense and his commander in

iraq. and many thought it was hopeless. the new commander, army general david petraeus, had been preparing for this day. he implemented counterinsurgency documents and focus on understanding and protecting the population, taking advantage of an army in berlin court that he learned a painful lesson about what works and what didn't during previous tours in iraq. the results were dramatic. violence dropped rapidly with progress accelerated by the decision of the sunnis to join with american forces in what became known as the awakening. by december 2008, it was clear to those on the ground that something fundamental had changed. the timing was fortuitous as the situation and america's other war, was moving rapidly in the wrong direction. president obama tripled u.s. forces committed to afghanistan during his first year in office, and intense fighting swiftly resulted in soldiers and marines struggle to implement the clear,

hold, and build counterinsurgency doctrine that have been battle tested in iraq. america poured resources into building and training an afghan army and police force, and effort was hampered more by the recruits inability to read than by their own willingness to fight. american troops, already serving as aid workers and local political advisers, found themselves teachers in a campaign against afghan illiteracy as well as fighters against an elusive taliban enemy. the americans were held by an improved intelligence system that had evolved from one designed to understand the other tank armies to one that worked hard to understand local tribal power structures and political relationships. and buy a new weapon of war that put taliban leaders at risk where ever they were. armed drones. these unmanned aircraft provided real-time intelligence on enemy operations and precise firepower that did great damage to taliban chain of command. drones are part of the apparatus

that located osama bin laden in pakistan, in 2011. it was, however, special forces operators who used the intelligence they and other sources provided to kill him, marking a critical date in the now decade-long war against al qaeda. as impressive as all these accomplish our, alerting army and marine corps, and air force the increasingly allowed up on unmanned aircraft to rule the skies, the navy seals and other special operations forces to conduct literally dozens of operations every night, to me the most remarkable fact of the past decade of war is that every soldier, sailor, airman and marine who has served has been a volunteer your wind america create the all volunteer force at the end of vietnam, it could not imagine within a generation of volunteers would fight 10 years and protracted irregular wars and with no signs of flagging.

recruiting and retention remain strong. with all services regular meeting their goals for volunteers to fight for our nation, in her hour of need. we have asked a great deal of the volunteers pick many have served multiple combat tours putting a strain on their families and on their own mental well being. suicide among military veterans now exceeds the rate among the same age population as a whole. and the veterans of our current wars are now unemployed, and succeeding dose of the population. we have a solemn obligation to these veterans who have volunteered to put themselves in harm's way, and to their families, which also carry the scars of the decade of war. while many are stronger for the trials they have endured, all have been forever changed. many with visible wounds, more with the damage that is invisible to the naked eye but no less traumatic for being unseen. as we draw down our forces in

iraq and afghanistan, handing over control to increasingly capable local governments and security forces, and as we continue to pursue a damaged but still dangerous al qaeda to the ends of the earth, we must hold in our hearts those who have paid a heavy price so that the rest of us can live in freedom. they have borne the cost of war, and we can never adequately repay them, but we can and we must do all in our power to ease the burdens and thank them for their service in this time of war. your efforts today are an important part of that, and i am immensely pleased and proud to have been able to thank you for the work you are doing on behalf of our veterans and their families. thank you all very much. [applause] >> dr. nagl, thank you very much for your outstanding remarks. and i'd like to present you the naval institute press book, the

captain who burned ships. >> harder to do now. [laughter] >> thank you very much. [applause] >> thanks again, dr. nagl. my counterpart whom he will meet, peter daly, admiral peter daly of u.s. new institute, has given me the privilege of also introducing our second keynote speaker for this morning. so it's my honor to introduce the honorable mrs. terrie suit. she was appointed by the governor bob mcdonnell to the position of assistant governor for commonwealth preparedness in janet of 2011. subsequently she was appointed as a secretary for veterans affairs and homeland security where she works to make virginia the most veteran friendly state in the union. as part of our responsibility, she works with local, state and

federal officials to develop a seamless coordinated security and preparedness strategy, and implementation plan. prior to her appointment by the governor, she served as a member of the house of delegates, worked on business development and government affairs director for the law firm of williams, bold and. and additional positions of responsibility. she has received numerous rewards from several organizations, most recently in 2010 she was selected as one of virginia lawyers weekly's influential women of virginia, and she certainly is that, recognizing her outstanding efforts in all fields, including law, business, health care, education and the arts. please join me in welcoming the honorable mrs. terrie suit. [applause] >> well, what a great gathering. thank you, admiral ryan, for

that introduction but i really appreciate that. great to be at this point representing governor mcdonald with so many accomplished and distinguished leaders of this military and civilian community. i understand that you're going to have some members of congress here today, as well as representatives from the white house. and health care practitioners and, of course, our outstanding men and women of the united states armed forces his dedication to the country provides us with the motivation to be here today. helping those wounded warriors who sacrificed so much. and do every single day today, along with their families. it is truly an honor to be with you, and i thank you for your service. governor mcdonald has made a public commitment to make virginia the most veteran and military friendly state in the nation, and his commitment comes from years of personal experience as a military child, as an army officer and as a military dad with a daughter who was a platoon leader in iraq and

combat. so i've had the honor to serve side-by-side with the governor both in his previous life, as a member of the virginia house of delegates, and now as a member of his cabinet, focused on these really incredibly important issues to us and to you. it is an absent privilege to work with a boss who shares my passion for our military. the governor often quotes the nation's first commander in chief when talking about the importance of caring for our nation's warriors, and i'm sure you all have heard before when general washington, then president washington said the willingness with which our young people are likely to serve in any war, no matter how justified, shall be directly proportional to how they perceive the veterans of earlier wars retreated and appreciated by our nation. so it's always great to start my day here in the nation's capital, washington, d.c. reminds us all of what our country stands for and the enduring principle by which we

live. i grew up as an army brat, living on bases all over this great country, and overseas. and from time to time living in the civilian community that didn't quite understand what military families were all about. my father who retired as a lighter in a nice states army reservist, tommy at an early age never to take for granted the freedoms of america. and with that in mind i can think of no better way to keep ourselves from becoming complacent and to give our absolute best effort to those who put their lives in harm's way each and every day to keep this nation free. as a navy wife, i have had a profound appreciation of the ups and downs but family members live with when their service members is deployed. you can never really retired once you've been a part of such a close-knit community. the obligation to advocate for those who continue to serve is

overwhelming. and it is a family commitment, one thing i've always found heartening about our modern-day military is the universal inclusion of the service family, both during active duty and in retirement. the people of our great nation have come a long way in their appreciation of military servicemembers and their families, and our veterans. it wasn't always that way. there was a time when those who disagreed with our country's policies took that disagreement out on our servicemembers but and i experienced those days for the eyes of a child, not understanding the anger directed at my father, who i was so proud of when he returned from vietnam. and in those darker days, moaa, or as we knew, intro, was there. you are the voice advocating for servicemembers who could not politically advocate for

themselves. and some of you experienced those days firsthand, and you were motivated to get involved to make a difference because of that experience. you got involved in order to change the way that our military members and veterans retreated, and you did change things. as a wife, i supported my husband through multiple conflicts. the gulf war, haiti, the kosovo. america was supportive but not complete ignited. i still felt that our voices were somewhat muted. in 1999, i ran for office as a navy wife, never as a seal why. that is a very, very important in our community. you never exploited being a part of that special operations group. so publicly it was just a navy wife. which is fantastic to be a navy wife. and i want to see the first time out in the virginia legislature. my mentor was our current governor, bob mcdonnell. i was really motivated to make a

difference and to be an active voice for military family members. and you know what? moaa was right there by my side as a partner in so many initiatives that we were able to muscle through together here in virginia, well, across the river in virginia. we are very close. you can see us. we made headway, but it was a tough fight to get legislation passed to help our families with issues like school transfer, car registration, professional licensing for spouses and tuition costs. there was still a few of the military families as transients. i heard that word so often. they are transient. they are not local voters. they are not permanent members of our community. then in 2001, everything changed. america woke up and servicemembers were given the heroes recognition that they have always served. our policymakers woke up as

well. and as my husband deployed to afghanistan in 2005, i deployed to the state capital. it took tragedy to finally get legislation like in state tuition rates for military families past. and you know we've always been real careful not to exploit tragedy, but sometimes it's a little issue to ask for forgiveness than for permission. and when we finally got that bill through the virginia state legislator that a patron to give it in state tuition, it took them, it took some effort and it took some real-life experience, and when one of those members on that committee said to me once again, they don't pay taxes in virginia, and i reflected on the loss of 11 steals his helicopter had been hit by an rpg, and waiting for four days ago if my husband was alive, i looked at that member and said, they pay ultimate tax. for crying out loud, give these children in state tuition. [applause]

>> well, from there it became a pretty easy ride to get a lot of those great pieces of legislation passed, not what they would get in state tuition for the kids, we got for the active duty. dispatcher but if they tuition pass for every single veteran that wants to come to virginia. [applause] >> so over the past 10 years america has embraced our servicemembers and our policymakers have recognized the importance of doing more for those who sacrificed so much to protect this nation's freedom. we are a popular cause which makes the charge from or perhaps a little easier. at least for the surface again, the softer ball. but what about the future? that will change to make a . tough fight our head. as worst drawdown, as america

becomes desensitized to the plight of our military families and veterans, the fight will be much, much harder. the benefits we have gained will become easier, targets for cuts and reduction. as the american voters move onto other issues, moaa must continue to carry the banner for a military servicemembers and families issues. and our veterans issues. remember, they cannot advocate politically for themselves when they are on active duty. you are the voice. you truly speak for those who pay the ultimate prize to protect the political freedom of america, and yet are not positioned to speak out politically for themselves. as the ranks of our disabled veterans grow, the financial burden to keep america's commitment will grow. as our retired ranks grow, the keeping of health care will grow and policymakers will look for ways to contain that caused. you are the voice that will fight to make sure the popular

promises made during wartime are kept during times of peace and complacency. so, today you are focus on our wounded warriors. so let's talk about that just a little bit. unfortunately, for many families there warrior comes home scarred from battle, or, times i want to have encountered in theater. still others are injured in training or by accident which happened every day in military life as we prepare for war. one of our main goals must be unrelenting villages in finding ways to bring a sense of normalcy back to people who find themselves in the toughest situation as a result of their military service. so i was asked to share with you a few things about the ways in which the commonwealth of virginia is pursuing these laudable goals. and that pursuit always starts with listening to the advocates. in virginia we have a unique organization called the joint their chip council, a service organization, together they bind

their voice and they speak jointly. mo is a tremendous leader in this veterans service organizations leadership council. they come together. they form an agenda each year and then jointly 23 members now but there are more organizations out there. jointly they go to the virginia hill, and to advocate for these issues. they were critical, critical when we did the fight for in state tuition. moaa was talented pools of leaders such as sam wilder, don tyson, i'm not sure any of them are here today, but they have succeeded in helping to shape these veterans voices into an extremely effective organization and their legislative record has been very, very impressive in virginia. and through their efforts some of that legislation we passed are things such as allowing localities to form special advisory councils to the judicial system so that the judicial system has some reach back capability to try to

understand veterans issues or when a veteran is in court, ptsd, behavioral issues, things that might be connected to substance abuse that resulted from this ability acquired through the service. these are things when it have a better understanding of and we've been able to pass legislation to form these council. legislation provided for in state tuition rates. we've talked about that. legislation this year that change our entire constitution and allow for a real estate tax exemption for those who are 100% permanently and totally disabled. due to service connected disability. [applause] >> and, of course, moaa was key to getting past the virginia wounded warrior program. [applause] spent and going to talk about that in just a minute. some of the highlights of this year's package that's going to be coming before the governor of the general assembly, state dmv

issued a veterans identification card, one of the things we have learned, are homeless veterans can't even get into a center to get care because they don't have id. you can't get into a federal center without an id card issued by a government entity, we are working on that issue in virginia. a sales tax incentive for veterans service organizations. we'd like to see that get past the increased access to information about the unclaimed cremated remains of veterans. we want a list of the unclaimed remains so we can run it against our veterans list and make sure everyone of those veterans is buried and on it and a virginia veterans cemetery. and proposals to address homelessness. that problem is only going to grow. as you can see, the joc is been very successful and very aggressive. so let's talk about the wounded warrior program, one of our most important legislative and programmatic achievements in virginia than has been this program. moaa was key to the program's

birth. in 2008 trend once owned colonels led the effort to champion the legislation which created the program. and the program, a cooperate with department of behavioral health and development services and the department of services monitors and coordinates the behavioral health and rehab services as well as providing support to an integrated comprehensive system of public and private partnerships. the goal of the program is to facilitate these services for virginia veterans and minutes of the virginia national guard and reserves, and families affected by stress related conditions of traumatic brain injuries resulting from military service. this is all done under the leadership of our great navy captain, retired catherine wilson that operates this program across the commonwealth. café, stand up. where are you? kathy does a phenomenal job for us. [applause] >> kathy has and the price was

$2 million a year budget that came out of the general fund in virginia which is incredible in and of itself. i cannot tell you how incredible it is to get your funds out of a budget. the wounded were program established five regional programs with regional coordinators, most of them are veterans our veterans and family members. at the local level they are assisted by veterans resource specialist, pure specials, families are specialists and clinicians. they work with a consortium of local mental health abuse providers, of representatives of the va hospitals in the regions, a veteran centers and community-based outpatient clinics, brain injury service specialist, veterans service organizations, and any of the public and private organization they can identify that will do outreach to veterans and their family. they assistant va services enrollment is needed, shuffling people over to our claims officers in virginia. we have state paid claims officers with a disability filings, provide individual counseling, family housing, pure

support and engage in community activities. since its first year of operation commits within a couple of years, the number of veterans served has tripled. and you know as our veterans come off the war, it's going to grow more. in the last fiscal year staff present education at which programs to over 20,000 people in virginia. they also visited the commonwealth military bases to educate members about the inevitable community services, speaking with over 6500 people in briefings just last year. the program has been very successful in partnering with state agencies to obtain federal grants which in turn provides a robust training programs, expansions into the rural areas, very hard to serve areas and specific train capabilities for the criminal justice system. in the fall of 2010 they sponsored over four, three hour workshops covering the assessment and treatment of post-traumatic stress disorder.

presented at the workshop provided in the of research in science on the origins of ptsd, its symptoms and the latest evidence-based practices for therapy and treatment. they have had numerous national resources which have cited them and their clinicians for use in the practices of all which feeds into the desired goal of providing tighter help for our warriors. and in the spring of issued a partner with the department of the virginia department of behavioral health and the departmental services and the department of health to present seven summits across the commonwealth addressing the issues of suicide prevention. this summer included a presentation by the programs regional coordinators outlining services available from the regional consortium as well as suicide prevention resources of the virginia and other partners. one thing kathy has taught me is there are a lot of resources out there that people don't know about. a big gulp of the wounded warrior program in virginia is to bring people to those

existing resource big not to create them again, but to put them in touch with what resources exist and make sure that getting help we have help for them. in order to improve access to the services, the issue they unveiled a statewide public information campaign entitled we are virginia veterans. they launched their website, www.we are virginia veterans.org. with an interactive site that has blogs, forums and statewide information. they do messaging, public service announcements and display boards as they produce a variety of forums including national and state of this, yellow ribbon reintegration events, golf tournaments and many other events. so as you can tell, we are pretty proud of her wounded warrior program. it's on its way to become a national model. we've got a lot more work to do and it's going to take more resources, and just like the fight at the national level, at the state level we are going to have to continue championing the

cause even as the cause starts going down a few notches in popularity as of the issues as the more popular issues. in closing i'd like to do events like today's conference give us all a chance to reflect and highlight the great achievements being made throughout our nation. helps us to learn from what others are doing and what we can duplicate to adapt in her own communities. i'm extremely encouraged by the progress being made in the hope that next year we'll be back here to talk but even more outstanding work that is being done. no measure of gratitude could ever be enough to show our thanks and appreciation for what our servicemembers and veterans have done for us, and for our nation. and we have to keep advocating for these service members. the fight will only get harder as the population of veterans increases, and you are that voice for that community. for this community, for our community.

you are the men and women to make a difference in impact the lives of those who have served. you are the ones making sure that our young people will continue to serve in our nations military, because they perceive that those who served before them have been treated well and have been appreciated by this nation. so please keep doing what you do such a phenomenal job at, keep looking out for our military and their families, and our veterans. because they need you. thank you. [applause] >> thank you, secretary suit, for those terrific remarks. and thank you for your passionate on authentic service leadership, and that of your great team, headed by kathy. just a fabulous job. we all know we're here today because we need to continue to raise the bar and support our

entire military family, and particularly our wounded wars and their families. we're very grateful for your leadership, very grateful for helping us kick this off, terrific remarks. and our behalf of moaa and u.s. naval institute would like to present you with the u.s. in night edition of the military advantage. >> thank you very much. [applause] >> okay, we are right on schedule so what we like to do now is, before we bring up our first dynamic panel, take a 20 minute break. i like everybody to be back here at 20 of 10, if that's okay. 20 of 10. thank you all. [inaudible conversations] [inaudible conversations]

[inaudible conversations] [inaudible conversations] [inaudible conversations] [inaudible conversations] >> so as you heard, a short coffee break, about 20 minutes in this comp to reintegrate severely injured military members back into civilian life. it is hosted by the u.s. naval

institute and the military officers association. coming up next a panel on reorienting injured military back into local community. remarks from the vice chief of staff of the army, general peter chiarelli. he will be followed by discussion on hiring injured military members, and i will be followed by a closing note on veterans benefits. i will start at about 2:35 p.m. all that coming up from the ronald reagan building here in washington. right now remarks from the president of iraq on security and stability in his country. and this country support for palestinian statehood. from the u.n. on friday, he spoke for about 20 minutes. >> mr. president, at the outset to congratulate you and our brothers, the people of qatar on the occasion of your presidency of the 66th session of the general assembly. our dedication will be of assistance to you in performing

your duties. we are confident that your experience will be an important factor in the success of the general assembly. our thanks also go to your predecessor, for his presidency of the general assembly in his outgoing session. i would also like to congratulate mr. ban ki-moon on his reelection for a second term as secretary-general, and wish him all success in his work. mr. president, it is an honor to stand in front of you one more time, to brief you on the developments that iraq is witnessing as it works on building a modern state that lives in peace with its people and neighbors.

iraq is building a homeland where everyone lives in peace and stability, regardless of ethnic or factional ethnicity. where the rule of law prevails, and human rights are respected, and a system that's based on democracy and peaceful transition. this is the basis on the path on which we embark. and continue implementing, events that are currently taking place in the upper region have proved the righteousness of the path we have followed, and are now following. iraq has and always will continue to hope for, have become an essential part of the aspirations of our people for freedom and for their ability to

choose a political system, a system of their own on the basis of democracy and human rights. we have come a long way in the building of our political system which is based on international collaboration iraq has started to restore the elements of its strength that were lost due to more than three decades of internal and external wars conducted by the former dictatorship. and international isolation ascension that iraq experienced. as well as the collapse of security situations and the outbreak of strife that threatens its national existen existence. after the collapse of the former regime, we began to overcome these negativities, and they became history thanks to our debtor nation and the help of

the international committee. our developments having witnessed the improvements of the situation in iraq we are still relying o on the five year plan for the years 2010-2014. announced by the government of iraq and enforced in 2010. and licensing that were held between iraq and major companies, and oil and natural gas investments to improve our oil investing. this was done to spin the wheels of development and push the economy to advanced levels. the five year plan will include about 2700 strategic projects, in different sectors with a cost of $186 million. that plan would provide about 4 million job opportunities. that will help the unemployment

problem in iraq. it is hoped that by the end of this plan that per capita income of the iraqi citizens would increase to $8000 per year, and poverty level would decrease. we are able to get, we were able to get rid of ascension in iraq as result of the invasion of kuwait basin security council resolutions of 9056, 1957 and 1958, adopted on the 15th of december, 2010. iraq has been liberated completely from all the restrictions. prevented the country from taking advantage of advances. iraq has gained its sovereignty on its final choices. as of this important stage in building our state, we have the impression you are taking firm steps on the road to democracy

and the government, and that's where, and you are opening the doors wide open to investments in iraq. therefore, the economic, the economic posse of iraq is based on encouraging investments and providing the appropriate legislative environment to protect investors and their capital so iraq can become a safe investing environment in many essential sectors such as oil, natural gas, electricity, construction, infrastructure and economic sectors. from this i call on all countries to open collaboration channels with iraq in the field of investment and to take advantage from the available. we have witnessed important developments in construction, economy and culture and other aspect. thousands of people that were destroyed by the former regime were rebuilt.

cities and towns are modernized. the region has more universities with more than 100,000 students, over the past we had only one university with under 2000 students. at the end of this year that united states forces will withdraw in accordance to the agreement signed between the two countries in 2008. during this year our forces proved great ability to combat terrorism and provide stability. these forces are capable and efficient to -- and that will promote the iraqi national ability to keep what has been achieved in iraq. however, they need will push the government of iraq to keep numbers of american experts and

others to benefit from their experience in the field of training building in accordance with iraq's needs. on this occasion, i would like to express on behalf of the government of iraq, our thanks, the governments and people of iraq, our thanks and appreciation for the united states in other nations and united nations who provided assistance to the iraqi people and government. i avail myself of the opportunity of being here in new york to express to the people of new york, and to all americans, the feelings of sympathy and solidarity on the anniversary of the service attacks in september. on iraq's international, the constitution of iraq and the national program, for the current iraqi government, the

general basis of our current policies, is to provide that iraq is an effective member in the league of arab states and committed to its charter. iraq is also a member. on this basis iraq is working to hold the arab summit at the end of march -- hosts the arab summit at the end of march 2012. iraq expects the principles of good neighbor and committed to non-interference and internal affairs, seek to solve disputes with peaceful means establish its relations on the basis of common interests and reciprocity, respect its international obligations. this is why we invited the two neighbors, turkey and the islamic republic of iran to resort to the primacy of dialogue to solve the issues and to stop bombing the iraqis into

kazakhstan region which is causing many victims among innocents and civilians. .. nuclear chemical and biological weapons and shall prohibit associated equipment material, technologies and delivery systems for use and development

and use of such wet days. on this clear position in commitment to iraq, to national disarmament, the security exhausted december 15, 2010, resolution 1957 wish lists on iraq. we would like to confirm the legitimate arrival of peace to nuclear and technologies according to google and relevant international conventions. this arrival constitutes one of the foundations of the disarmament system and non-proliferation. within this approach and with regard to the nuclear issue of the republic of iran, we believe that in the arrived to use those

nuclear energy for peaceful preface this comment this is guaranteed by the international instrument at the forefront of those at the proliferation -- the non-proliferation safety. there is portentous reaching a peace perforation and dealing with this issue, counter diplomacy at the best means to achieve this goal. on the other hand, any other will preface the interest of all parties of the security of the reach him at great risk. iraq's concern at the tragic situation of the palestinian people as a result of the israeli practices, which are incompatible. what international rules and customs and international human law, iraq is doing everything in its power to support the struggle of the palestinian people and getting all those status inalienable rights to establish its independence on his homeland.

with its capital in jerusalem and disregard iraqi forces since it poured the palestinian authority to go to the united nations to achieve full international recognition of the palestinian state during the meeting of the current session of the general assembly calls on the international community and all peaceloving forces to stand by the palestinian people and the legitimate struggle and achieve its goals and demand the israeli government to fully withdraw from all arab countries occupied in 1957. that's what contributes to the sentiment of the arab-israeli context and to bring comprehensive and peace in this item region of the world. within the middle east are weapons of mass distraction crucial to achieve peace, security and stability. this requires israeli to join the npt and put its nuclear facilities and the safeguards it

stands at the iaea. the countries that the arab world are witnessing significant developments and unprecedented reforms and political changes. the effects of those will be affected on the future of the whole region. it will extend to areas beyond the effects. iraq is initiating the change in support struggle of the people of the region in order to gain their freedom and to choose their political system, the right to peaceful demonstrations and protests in the so-called arab spring. we hope that the changes will contribute to regional stability and security and avoid any threats to the canadian sovereignty of the countries that the region or strive of ethnic competence. surviving international cooperation, iraq worked to develop cooperation that starts

with us and the stability of the ongoing political process and in reconstruction. we look forward to the state of america and to the european union while we mention the two parties can only imagine them not because they are the only ones that stood iraq, but because we are linked by mechanisms of action that should be implemented. many others who stood with that in the difficult times we witnessed. we will remember this and develop relations of cooperation within following the workshop of the united states forces from iraq by the end of this year, we will work to enhance and expand this cooperation based on the strategic framework agreement i signed the two countries in 2008. relations according to this agreement will be for the long term and will cover all aspects of life.

the same is true for the european union as they finish the partnership and cooperation agreement between iraq and the european union and the possible signing of the agreement in the near future and signing a memorandum of understanding on the strategic partnership and the energy between iraq and the european union to cooperation between the two parties will take a broader scope in various fields covered by this agreement are economic, political relations with the people's republic of china are expanding relations with neighboring countries, arab countries, india and pakistan are also proven. our relationship at the united nations will continue and the approach of constructive cooperation with the united nations bodies in the security council and the general secretary and will keep the equipment they need.

i would like to take this opportunity to express our association for the efforts made by the special generations by special that corporal and i wish him and his family success and results. i will then continue to secretary general and we will continue to cooperate with him in a way that will enable him to carry out his task and resolutions of 1970 and the sequined revolutions. the united nations assistance will receive all forms of support and in particular during the next fee. we will do our utmost to provide the perfection to staff the premises. mr. president, we look forward with confidence and optimism to the future. we are working to make iraq rather an emergent democracy.

iraq was a country with national and human resources and port regional stability, security and prosperity of the theme and that democracy, federalism with different ethnic and secretary of goals. i thank you very much for your attention. [applause] >> both the house and senate are gasoline in today. the house for a pro forma saturation. a legislative work is scattered today. they are in at clock at this 2011 beginning hour later and the procedural vote is expected about 5:30 eastern. see live on c-span and the senate break here on c-span 2. >> most all of google's problems are self-inflicted because they don't play by the rules of the game and they don't obey the

law. >> if you wonder whether or not you get an honest result from google all you have to do is move the mouse a good debate, yahoo! or facebook and you can see whether or not you get the fair result.

>> and we are back live again for a daylong conference on reintegrating severely injured members into civilian life. posted by the u.s. naval institute and the military officers association. attendees on a couple minutes returned from a 20 minute break. here's what's coming up. a panel and we are aiming injured military back into the community and will be remarks from the vice chief of staff for the army, general peter schiavelli. after that, discussion on hiring military members will be followed by closing on veterans benefits located on way about 2:35 this afternoon. all coming up from the ronald reagan building in washington. [inaudible conversations] [inaudible conversations]

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[inaudible conversations] [inaudible conversations] [inaudible conversations] [inaudible conversations] [inaudible conversations] [inaudible conversations] >> ladies and gentlemen, if everyone could take their seats, will stay right on schedule. come on in and sit down. [inaudible conversations]

>> gaffe, come on up. yeah, yeah. come on up and sit down. will introduce the panel. [inaudible conversations] [inaudible conversations] sound not

[inaudible conversations] [inaudible conversations] [inaudible conversations] [inaudible conversations] [inaudible conversations] [inaudible conversations] >> okay, please go ahead and sit down. absolutely, absolutely.

[inaudible conversations] >> okay, ladies and gentlemen we will get started. hope everyone had a chance to get some coffee and juice. it's now time for a purse panel discussion, community integration, challenges back home. directing is a moderator, national security moderator, katie mcfarlan. she appears on fox news, fox visit is a numerous programs. she's also goes to host of fox news.com.com three, was the internet's most possible security shows. she has served on national security pose for several presidential administrations to include president nixon, president ford and president reagan and received the highest civilian award for her work in the reagan and distribution. she's a graduate of george washington university, oxford university and massachusetts institute of technology, concentrate on nuclear weapons, china and the soviet union.

she is the mother of five, proud of all of them, but i understand that one of her daughters is a recent graduate to designate of the naval academy and the surface warfare business on the west coast. ladies and gentlemen, is and is distinct pleasure to introduce ms. katie mcfarlan. [applause] >> thank you for being here. you may not recognize me but i'm the burnett from fox news. last back [laughter] to finance foreign on helping wounded warriors and their families transition and the panel this morning is going to take a look at the issues of community integration that challenges are better at and especially our wounded warriors and their particular needs. you know, i am of the vietnam war generation. is anyone here is lotus im, the

vietnam era? more than anything. after the vietnam war, we treated our vietnam shamelessly. it was an unpopular war and it didn't end well. instead of blaming ourselves, we think the military. when they came home and in 1870s, we did not honor them for their service. we did not adequately care for their families and give them the support and medical attention they need it. it was a war we wanted to forget that we forgot about them as well. in the 1970s, after vietnam, programs for community integration were few and far between. veterans and families suffered from it. it was on the soul of america. when i went into the pentagon with the reagan administration in the 1980s, not only have a hollowed out military force, which ships that could fill,

planes that couldn't fly, cannibalizing parks and they didn't have training hours. the most shameful thing of all was when we went around the country and that our veterans inside a man who lost limbs in people who couldn't get to veterans hospitals because they were too far away. people with medical and psychological injuries we pretended weren't there and was assigned if we miss in the most shameful thing was that cap weinberger and that's a very junior enlisted, they are paid so little that they qualify for food stamps. we promised ourselves as a nation we would never let that happen again. so here we are today with our returning veterans from afghanistan and iraq have any sympathy three and four and five tours of duty. we've been a war for 10 years and many of our returning warriors have serious injuries and disabilities. we need help not only integrated society that significant medical care for the rest of their

lives. as we learn from our past mistakes, the good news is we do want our national leaders of both parties have pledged to care for returning warriors. there is a new general recognition of the country to some of our vets come back with injuries on the outside as well as on the inside. they will be with them for the rest of their lives. our military culture, which is often as they don't have to tell you suffer in silence. it's more proud. our military country and offer treatment never available at your previous wars. there's a focus on medical attention and programs to help the transition and reintegration civilian claimant for veterans when there were none before. and we're going to talk about some of them today. this afternoon's panel focusing on employment. in a lot of ways, the integration task we face after the wars will be more difficult.

acting forces as well as reserves have denmark combat tours more frequently than they were designed to do. our guard and reserves have not been used as militia, but uses rotational forces. many of our military families, husband and wife are both conservatives and that family is double burden. our women particularly as they return half of our women are mothers who have left their children behind to fight. that's an integration issue. our all volunteer force means that servicemen and women we have a duty want to be there. they've signed up, but what it means is they are isolated from the rest of society. only 1% of our citizens served in the military and less than 10% of our systems even know family or anyone in the military. that's a small minority and in politics the worry is out of sight, out of mind. and so with the pressures that we now all faced with government

spending and cutting, many servicemen and women worry, probably rightfully, that this time the budget ax will fall and then as it did in the 1970s, but with greater intensity and immediacy. so this morning session is one of those are events where everybody, that means you, me, dan learned from each other. our panelists have been carefully chosen to cover the range of challenges and opportunities for returning vets and warriors and family space and the programs available to them. we have a wounded warrior family, tom markham, sergeant tom barkin and displays it in the middle of the panel will talk about the unique and difficult journey they've had from a perspective of what a family goes through. now, you're all going to have an opportunity to ask questions, but the way this will work as i'm going to introduce the panel, they will talk about the programs they represent, that

their community software community software and then i will grow than news style and then bullet you grow them. and i think by the end of this what we want to do is go for a couple things. what are the roles and responsibilities of the government? not just the defense department, but the other regencies. what is the demobilization process and disability evaluation system? where did the programs we have fall short? where the gaps in the care and services that adair from your credit redtape, budget shortfalls for their poorly designed programs? we want to talk about the yellow ribbon program committee g.i. bill of educational benefits. that will be an issue that comes out. finally, how to wounded warriors and communities react to each other? they come back. it's not world war ii. they are not coming back to parades, but they are coming back into the communities and what are the opportunities they have and what's the reality?

whetted like to do now is introduce the panel is that you know who i am, the only brunette at fox news. i want to introduce general todd -- okay come with all switched around because they wanted the marcum to sit in the middle of this. i'm introduce major general james adkins, the guy with the ribbons in the press. he is the 20th general of maryland who receive 702 2000 soldiers and men in civilian volunteers at the maryland military department. he sells a very interesting because he's a tool hatted guide release has been. he was a secretary of veterans affairs as well as the adjutant general, so he knows both sides of the equation. we also want to introduce todd hours. raise your hand. sergeant bowers is a former marine who served two and iraq and one in afghanistan. he was part of the fiercest comeback in the iraq war, battle

for falluja in november 2004 when he was hit by a sniper has lost 80% of hearing in his left ear. he was firmly with the iraq, afghanistan veterans association, the largest veterans association from that war with over 200,000 members and is now working in new york for jpmorgan as part of their community outreach and philanthropic programs. so although his last 80% of the hearing and his left ear, he has amassed left to hear what thinkings had to say. david around, yeah, david brown used to be a brunette. [laughter] so he tells me that he thinks that's a good enough reason that he should ultimately end up at fox news. but he is with the office of the secretary of defense, clinical psychologist and expert on recovery and reintegration. a former army sergeant, dr. crown deployed with good

u.s. army to work with survivors of ethnic cleansing and genocide and he is not the office of the secretary of defense. before that he was the defense department's lead for recovery care and support centers of excellence. lieutenant colonel rod lewis, the guy in the end now wearing his uniform works at the white house and is a former air force -- is a current air force c-17 pilot, former commander of the fourth squadron, which handles the countries to sensitive cargo, the prime nuclear air force and has recently joined the white house staff in the east wing and the first lady staff of the joint forces initiative. that's a national program to mobilize all sectors of society to support our service members and their families. that's the mother ship. we nicole casey who is from little rock, arkansas. she is a kernel and the reserve and served as an army combat

medic. today she is behavioral, health officer and team leader of the veteran center dealing with posttraumatic tress syndrome. and finally, we have sergeant tom in april marcum, and they thought it was important to meet a friend close and personal people at dell with these issues. the market and said that as long at times difficult journey through the bureaucracy. sergeant marcum suffered germanic brain injury with vision, hearing and cognitive deficits, chronic migraines and short-term memory loss. his wife and caregiver is going to speak for the family and shall talk about his experience getting snarled and read kate and getting adequate treatment for tom and how his injuries have impacted not just him and their marriage, but their entire family and children. so i'd like to get started by going first to rank and we are

going to ask general atkins if you like to talk about what the programs that he's in charge of in maryland in what they're offering. and then we'll go to everybody. they're going to talk. i'm going to ask questions and then u.s. questions. i'll sit down and turn this over to general adkins. ..

>> i was in iraq. we have 6500 troops in maryland and i'll tell you that the generation of service members today stands as tall as any generation that has ever going before. where our nation should be extremely proud of their service this week. you know, we've been at war for a decade. using the guard and reserve at a level not seen since world war ii. tens of thousands of mariners have served in combat and have continued to do that. there's a lot of lessons we have learned in our past that maybe we have not used and we need to capture the lessons we are learning now as we build systems for the future. and i would recommend the greatest generation comes home,

this book that i read as a secretary of veterans affairs to identify issues based by returning veterans. some of you may know that general omar bradley was the first director of the va. and then he was quoted right after world war ii saying it's a vast dehumanized bureaucracy immeshed in mountains of red tape and i think we have to evaluate our nation and how far have we come in the 60-some years after the end of world war ii. another interesting quote from general bradley was, you know, looking at the va system after world war ii was that it was a world war ii load on a world war i chassis. in other words, the system supporting the va, the veterans was not efficient for those world war ii veterans coming home. and i think as late as last week, at a senior army meeting i heard an army four star make the

comment that we are operating now on that world war ii system. and we've been kind of over the last 10 years trying to build a system like working on a car, building a car, maintaining a car and repairing a car as it goes down the road at 65 miles an hour. so i think there are lots of lessons learned and one last quote from general bradley, as we look out at our nation is that the problems of our veterans cannot be resolved by washington alone. those problems are solved as they rub shoulders with their neighbors and where the friction occurs in the communities as they return home. there is a tremendous cost to war and as we apply military power we must never lose sight of that cost, and it's not just fuel, bullets, those who make the ultimate sacrifice. those who continue on for decades to bear the wounds of

war. and i think that these wars that we're in now, for the next five, six, seven decades our nation will be dealing with issues related to these wars. and i tell you that because when the war came out, the ken burns film, i was in the room with a bunch of world war ii veterans after that film and post-traumatic stress disorder came out of those veterans after decades of not having issues and i've seen it with individuals i've served with. came out of vietnam extremely strong individuals and as they get older that post-traumatic stress disorder comes to be. so, you know, we need to -- our focus is that the war is not over as it was in world war i where they got out and got charged and were given $30 and a train ticket to go home. the war is not over until those individuals are fully integrated back at home, with their

families, with their friends and their communities, back at work or on the college campuses. so i think that -- i guess we need to prepare for the next war. we need to look at our systems now to identify those lessons learned and work on building that system that's going to support the needs of the nation for our veterans in the future. thank you. [applause] >> thank you, general adkins. i would like to turn to the wounded marine who's now in new york listening to those bankers, todd? >> thank you. you guys hear me okay? all right. i'd like to point out that the general is using an ipad and now we're switching to the marine who is reading off a note pad with crayon. [laughter] >> so clearly there's going to be some differences in the things we discuss. but on a good note, as i

mentioned -- as was said i've always been in the marine corps reserves. it's something i'm very proud of. i've always considered myself a marine and it wasn't until may i completely dropped off. i have about a year to decide if i want to go back on day 364, they're probably going to be getting a phone call from me. but during that time i did four tours. i had the honor of serving with multiple patalions and the battle of fallujah and spent some time sit down in south america and recently returned from afghanistan. it was during these times in between my tours that i was serving as a veterans advocate for the iraq and afghanistan veterans of america. what better job for someone serving in the military. you're seeing the resources that are available. you're seeing the benefits that are provided. you're understanding what the issues are at hand and making sure to focus on yourself. but i was not. it was something that i did not handle correctly looking back on it. and i'm trying to pinpoint on the reason why. if i knew all of these resources were available, why did it take me until last month to finally

step foot into the va and say, wow, it's time to start taking care of todd? it took me a really long time for me to soak these things and understand while i'm so busy doing what the military did a great job teaching me which is taking care of others, i wasn't taking care of myself and it's something i think that's very noble within the military but it is something that also is sort of a detriment to the individuals themselves. so even though now i wear a tie and i do all this other stuff i'm still a veteran reintegrating. as i went through the four different levels of tasks throughout my multiple deployments i saw the transition assistance program over the years. sometimes for better, sometimes for worse and it was made very clear, hey, you just got home from war. you are different. it's time to start taking care of yourselves. and what did all of us do? we took the death by pamphlets and we put it in a bag and stepped away from a minute. and we don't focus -- and the general is exactly correct that it takes years for these things to start manifesting. you start questioning why you're not sleeping correctly.

you start wondering why am i having a tough time getting along with my friends and it was literally two months ago where all these things came together at just the right time. i look back on it as a blessing but social issues combined with work issues combined with marine corps issues -- they all sort of piled up onto me and it wasn't until i made that call and called the vet center which i'm very excited that we're going to hear from someone from the vet center today and i said i really need some help and the va was here in a heartbeat and they took me under their wing and got me squared way and i convey this publicly to a lot of the service members that i've deployed that with because i say that simple step, that small piece of communication on the battlefield -- we learn that communication is key. you've got to communicate as well. if you're on the radio and you're just hearing message traffic and you don't ever respond, then you're not accomplishing your mission and that's very hard for some folks to step up and do, myself included and having made those changes now, i realized that life turned around. all of a sudden i got a big

fancy banker job now. i have to wear these things. they're called ties. [laughter] >> i thought they were fabric belts of some sort for a while. and when i look at these things and the capacity that i'm in now working on philanthropic givings jpmorgan chase is basically a big company of some sorts, focusing on their philanthropic giving and something that has been said to me by folks that we need to focus -- and you mentioned it too, general that the sea of goodwill that is out there that we will rely on service members when they come back. this is not a job that the d.o.d. and the va can handle on their own and we're going to be looking into the future at that outreach. what are the tools that we can use to get to these folks to say hey, it's time to make sure you take care of yourselves and it is the community-level organizations that are able to reach out to these folks and become civilian. they will be able to communicate and say are you stepping into the va? are you having difficulties with housing? va has programs with that.

that communication is going to be critical to move forward. and i have to applaud the va right now 'cause they made some amazing steps in doing their outreach for the younger generation of service members. they're on facebook. they're on twitter. they're on multiple levels of social media really doing the best that they can from the mother ship here in washington, d.c. to reach out to the vets to the places they are. i was joking on the crayon and ipads, but in all honesty i have a smart phone in my pocket where i know if i need to go through some counseling or something of that nature, it's a couple buttons away. and it's just making sure that i know that it's available to be able to step into that. so the going forward, you know, one of the things i think we're really going to have to focus on is that every service member is different. everybody reacts differently when they come back. we can't do a blanket powerpoint presentation when they come back. i'm a young single somewhat stupid, you know, combat marine. i'm very different than some of my other friends, you know?

and so understanding how to communicate with these folks is really going to be critical and i look forward to seeing how it goes forward. thank you very much. [applause] >> thank you, todd. and now we're going to turn to nicole who's somebody is familiar with all those programs at the local level. nicole is a colonel in the reserves and she's head of the va and vet centers in little rock, arkansas. nicole. >> good morning. i want to thank the doctor the leader of the readjustment conference center to be letting me be here today and my boss who's actually a retired social worker in the army reserves -- or actually army, i'm sorry. it's one thing come prepared to talk about one thing and come that you talk about another. all the ladies in the audience who heard single, that are single, he's your guy, right?

[laughter] >> and i just want to interject -- i'm married to a banker. they have good jobs. so he's not only cute and eligible but he's probably a good catch. >> my number is on the back of the pamphlet. [laughter] >> he said he used crayons, i used pen and a pad. that's army. in order to understand the context of the situation we're dealing with in regard to our returning or transitioning service members we got to remember the differences between the military and the civilian culture. and i just want to point some of those out. in the military, it's a faster pace although anybody who's in the military would dispute that if you stand in a line for any length of time. but in the civilian life it is a much slower natural kind of pace on day-to-day. there's hyper eehypere eer --

hypervigilance. you have to be aggressive and you have to be paranoid in order to survive on a battlefield. now, hypervigilance doesn't work so well in the civilian sector. it will get you fired. it will get you reprimanded. it will get you booted out of your house. in the military you have use of targeted aggression. well, that creates kind of a hostile environment in the home and in your workplace as well. in the military, you give and receive orders. it's an environment of obedience. it's also one of a maturity level that is somewhat different than in the military. and it's more inclusive. in the civilian sector, though, you have to make decisions and engage in critical thinking all the time. in the military you forever teamwork and interdependence. and if you could -- those of you who haven't been in the military will have a hard time understanding this, but there's a symbiosis, there's a

psychological symbiosis to people who happen who enter the military. we go from being an i to a we. and when we transition back to the civilian sector, going from that we to an i has incredible psychological ramifications. we have to -- interdependence in the military, and independence and self-sufficiency in the civilian sector. we answer to a chain of command. there's no chain of command on the civilian side except you include your spouse, that might be your chain of command. and the military is a very closed system. and that's very evident if anybody's tried to find or access an army reserve unit. where are they? how the hell can you get in to them? is it and in the civilian, it's a very open system. and lastly, that i want to point out, in the military, they foster stoicism.

you have to be tough. you have put your best face forward. whereas in the civilian sector you require -- it requires emotional investment, emotional relationships. so what are the challenges we face? it's difficult for the military to provide community support, especially, if you're outside an installation. again, we're more of a closed system. there are fewer clear pathways to assistance and information. when a person goes from the military to the civilian world, there may be an increase or a decrease in respect one is given. you know, think of being a 21-year-old squad leader who get out of the military and does not have a job. that's a real shift -- it's a real shift in the mindset that's really hard to get your head around. there's a lack of knowledge of benefits to the reserve component.

a lot of people here -- well, i don't know what the reserve has. i only know what the active component has. and there's a big difference between reserve component benefits and active duty benefits. and there's constantly changing military and veteran policies and benefits. i know that every veteran that i see that walks through the vet center doors, i have to know them individually. i have to know when they served, where they served. i mean, there's so much i have to know about them on an individual basis to even begin to understand what their benefits are. not everyone has the same transition they are sent out. there are changes in significant relationships. i mean, how many people do you know on the civilian side undergo a tremendous relationship stresses that our military members go through?

there's feelings of being left behind when you transition out of the military. and also we forget that in the civilian sector people have a limited capacity to listen. it's hard for others to listen to another person's story because they're all caught up in their own life. reserve components, they have family readiness groups but they're geographically dispersed and many of them don't have the same understanding of military culture and command structure. you have to understand before this war started, you can have reserve folks that were in the military for 20 years and retire and they would tell their spouses that they didn't even get a paycheck for going to reserve duty. it was one of those guy things, you know? websites are hard to navigate and they give the impression

that they don't care. there's difficulty getting benefits because you don't know where to go. you don't know where to go. this death by powerpoint, this death by brochure, nobody listens. their mind is elsewhere. it's hard to really reach out. we can have a discussion about that, but there's probably a lot of factors that lend to that. there's a variance of policies and procedures among active duty, a reserve component. and the services and with veterans. one big example is for a reserve component at least in the army reserve you have to have a line of duty in order to get your military health care needs taken care of. if they're related to the military. if you don't have that line of duty, you got to pay for it out of pocket. whereas, the active component does not need a line of duty. and believe me, not everybody knows how to fill out a line of duty. what works for the rc during

peacetime does not work during wartime. soldiers that transition, service members that transition face feelings of isolation, disconnection, confusion, frustration, anger. isolation is a killer. fort hood is a really good example of how the installation really rallied around a very traumatic event that occurred. but ask the reserved components that were stationed there. ask the family members of the reserved components that were stationed there and how much rallying was around them? health care skipping, when you go from active -- when you go from reserve from civilian to reserve to active duty back -- i mean, it gets really confusing on who do i go to for what? and who's going to cover what? now, the va appearance wonderful five-year health care program but not everybody wants to go to

the va. and there's also the challenge of being dual-status. am areserve member? am i a veteran and actually you're both. and outrage, outrage is a big issue. more later about that, i guess. in order to successfully transition, service members have to have a strong sense of community. they have to have meaningful employment. they have to have a strong healthy sense of self and they have to have support. i'll say it again, isolation is a killer. solutions. everybody needs a readjustment plan. why aren't we providing transitioning service members readjustment planning? we have t.a.p.s and other things. why not ask people face-to-face,

where are you going, what are you doing? what are your plans? do you know about your benefits? all too often service members are told go to the va. where's the va in my community? and when you get to the va, where do i go? as good as it is, we still need to do better regarding navigation of these systems. it's best to help those of us who are veterans -- we are, i think, are the ones that are best to help other veterans. one thing about the vet center staff over 72% of the vet center staff are veterans. 47% are combat veterans. 31% are g-wad combat veterans. 42% are women. big brother-type programs might help out, too. i know canada has a wonderful

veteran program -- a kind of peer-to-peer where they actually train their older veterans, give them two weeks training so they can mentor young veterans that are coming off of military service. we need to expand the concept, the team concept and we need to expand support systems. and we need to foster relationships with veteran-owned businesses. mental health services for service members and veterans and not family members is not effective. we have to strive more to provide services for family members. we need to make our systems and processes easier. most of all, we need to make sure every service member, whether in the service or as a veteran are welcomed, respected, and are given the respected privacy and our gratitude for

their service. we get a lot of calls asking about how to careful for dogs and cats and -- at least several times during the day. but i am one of a staff of 6 at the little rock vet center. we provide counseling services to most of the state of arkansas and anybody who's from arkansas realizes that it's a very ruler state. we do have areas in arkansas that are very underserviced and we do have veterans in these underserviced areas. vet centers were established in 1979, thanks to max clinglan and we were specifically established to provide counseling to veterans thanks to our vietnam veterans. they really spearheaded this program because they stopped going to the va because of the treatment they were getting. we're community-based. we're safe. we've grown from 187 to 232. we have 50 mobile vet centers out there that will go where

they're needed. and i got to wrap it up and we have -- anyways, i'll be happy to talk anybody more about vet service centers. thank you. [applause] >> thank you, nicole and so now we'll turn to dr. david brown who is with the office of secretary defense where he's the -- an expert on suicide prevention, recovery, and intagra-i guess and -- but before that he was the lead in the department of defense for recovery care and the support centers of excellence. dr. brown? >> thank you. >> so i'm going to lean -- i'm former army and i'm going to lean into the colonel here. i feel comfortable if you don't mind. we had offered up our seats but we didn't think about the mics. i would like to take a minute or two about help-seeking behavior. and possibly encourage some of the conversation in that direction. prior to coming here to dc i was overseas for 15 years. i was the lead psychologist in

bavaria, over seven bases there treating people, you know, the whole slew of what you have from being in the military. part of that grass is green on the other side issue has come in. all of my career was very active duty-centric and what we would hear with the guard and reserve things work much better because once they deploy they go home and they're back with their families and all of their support. whereas, when you're overseas active duty you don't have a lot of those support networks that we have set in place here. shifting over i'm now in a nonclinical role. i've learned that is not the case for many individuals so i'll highlight a couple areas with regards to care for caregiver well-being and employment. before doing that, what i want to do is speak briefly on a program we created in europe called soldier 360. and what this was about was the help-seeking behavior and trying to bring treatment to individuals who were let's say maybe resistant to seeking that

out. when i was active duty and was deployed i was in a tent sleeping 10 inches from the next person and you knew who was getting letters from home and who was sleeping and who was eating. when you pull back, they stick behavior in the back corner of the base and nobody can find us. with that said what we decided soldier 360 is let's create this program where it's an invite only a best and the brightest and you're hand-selected from your company commander and battalion commander. we had these guys who were screened and they did not meet any criteria for treatment and lo and behold we started to realize -- this was somewhat of a trojan horse. we talked about four hours sleep is not sufficient contrary to what their chief would tell them. they would heat skittles or mountain dew for a couple of

weeks while in the striker because it was a funny thing to do. and they say i'm kind of impulsive and irritable. the course they went through you received three college credits for this course by the way and we had a lot of great success with this. this encouraged us then with reaching out in bavaria now for the army they embed primary cares in the units and they provide providers in the school systems and we're seeing great benefit in that. with regards to the help-seeking behavior i recalled there was a time i went over to the wtu and we were encouraging folks with this help-seek behavior and we used it in soldier 360 which is humor. we went off to the harvey bentsen center and we learned the benefit on a one-hour instruction on humor and i tried using humor with the wtu folks and there was one gentleman i recall who lost a portion of his foot and after we really got

going, this guy was just cracking us all up and he said, you know, it's been almost nine months and i forgot how to laugh. i forgot the things i used to do and i used to do very well. he had us going like -- you remember the dean martin roasts. you're talking vietnam so i'm trying to relate here. [laughter] >> do you remember the dean martin roasts. this guy had us going and he says, you know, doc, he says i may have lost a portion of my foot but i still have my hair and he says, you know, go seek help for that. and he just had us going. and, you know, taking some of this -- these insights and opportunities i've had to learn from others and coming here in an nonclinical position. it's interesting, i was presenting on polytrauma at the national institutes of health and we really were focusing quite a bit on care for the caregiver. and the fact that, you know, we were just hearing here many times we focus on the other and we don't focus enough on ourselves.

we're not taking good enough care on ourselves. this is a focus from polytrauma. i think it's important for all of us to really take time and look at ourselves and we're taught not to. we're taught about selfless service, loyalty, duty. and i think it's a big challenge that we're now going counter to our culture with that. well-being -- we've been focusing quite a bit on well-being. those of you who aren't familiar with the gallup studies. there's a lot of different studies on well-being but gallup when you look at national guard and reserves, the active duty folks when they return they still have a job. guard and reserves, when they come home they might not. and to show you how important well-being is in employment, employment that is, the gallup studies focused on employment and have noted that your well-being recovers faster from death of a loved one over a course of a year than it does from prolonged unemployment. that's something to really think about. that's what wonderful about moaa

and others. they bring employers and the other businesses in. and lastly, i just want to shift to one more lesson learned. if you're not familiar, the work of thomas joiner, the psychologist. he speaks about suicide speaks about two components in particular. a sense of belonging and a sense of burdensome. i had a soldier had suicide attempt with alitoan means and i went over the paperwork and i had an idea what he was going to say. when we release you from the hospital we make sure you're okay before we release you in the unit and can you give me a heads up on what brings you here and he said i killed a soldier. and i was thinking oh, my goodness this is going to be an insanity board. i wasn't prepared for him when he said that. perhaps there's a mishap of the

paperwork. i said can you tell me more. and he said everyone had a chance to take a break during the deployment. when the first sergeant came to me i'm putting a substitute that substitute died as a result of an ied. and so i killed the soldier. he's carried the guilt from him and he's returned from his third deployment at this time and it's still eating at him. and he had a new spouse and before he left, the primary concern was family planning. and she said, you know, when you come back we'll work on a family. well, that wasn't working. not to change the topic here too much but i've shared this story before. she could see in the morning it looks like in the morning but when he tries to engage it's not working. he's still down range. and i brought this information to the soldier 360 program and said any of you guys experiencing this? these are guys in their 20s, upper 20s, young 30s.

and 70% of the soldiers had reported, yeah, i thought that was kind of normal. i didn't ask him a show of hands and just to ask them a piece of paper if you're experiencing this. the gentleman shared with me i shared my team down range and now i'm failing my wife i'm a burden and i don't belong and that's when he had attempted suicide. not to leave you on a somber tone here, there is a positive side here to the story. after going through treatment and doing rather well, they are now -- well, they have three children so he's going well. the wife looked at me like, i'm going to kill you. [laughter] >> but, yes, with regards to help-seeking behavior i think it's rather important. i think it's good that we focus on that. and what we do when we reintegrate back to society. so thank you for your time.

[applause] >> thank you, doctor. i'd like to now turn to the white house and lieutenant colonel, rodney lewis. this administration seems to have come in and they have a particular interest in not forgetting our military families. would you like to talk to us about the joining families program that you have at the white house? >> absolutely, k.t. first of all, for u.s. i and moaa thank you for having me here today and it's a privilege to have me on the panel to speak to you and have a conversation. i would be remiss if i didn't say the executive director captain brad cooper would love to be here but, unfortunately, he couldn't be here. and you get the second team as you get to know me a little better, i think that's worthy. i am an active duty air force officer, lieutenant colonel graduated commander and in the spirit of best practices i do have my crayon, my pad and paper

and my ipad. [laughter] >> so, you know, us air force guys, we're always prepared. but in all seriousness, i've been in this job and i've seen some amazing things in terms of watching our -- not only our government but the private industry all galvanized to come behind what we all know is a force that's been fighting for over a decade. and the first lady recognizes that as well. as k.t. had mentioned earlier, you know, 1% of the individuals are out there serving our country. and i think the stat that she put up that only 10% know of a service member. well, the first lady is trying to reach the other 90%. that's what joining forces is. it's an awareness campaign. traditionally the east wing is not the policy side of the white house. that falls within the west wing

and it falls within all of those agencies that the president owns, the va. the dod, and it's a unique privilege for me to be on the east wing to watch the first lady really try to bring a nation up to speed in terms of awareness. that's what joining forces is. after many conversations, the first lady traveled around and seen many military members and specifically talking to spouses. i heard a recurring theme. these are places in areas where we need help. these are places where you can help us as a first lady. and pinnacle point of that really is on three pillars, the employment, as transitioning members needed jobs. that was something the first lady and dr. biden heard a tremendous amount so that is one of the pillars. the second pillar, education.

and we can kind of go back briefly to the employment piece. what she heard was the fact that military members were changing locations so much that the spouses were being left out. now, a personal story, i've had five different assignments in seven years. so my spouse who is a college graduate has a master's degree, the last location we left she had a wonderful job but when she transitioned to the next location, she couldn't take that job with her. those are the issues that the first lady had heard and those are issues that dr. biden had heard and that's where, you know, the employment piece came in not only for spouses but, obviously, for veterans transitioning out of the military as well. so it's been nice to watch this come together with agencies really focused on a specific task.

education, there are issues that can be there when military families, pcs, you know, using my example. i don't have high school children but imagine five different locations in seven years the transportability of records, the transportability of -- just having a consistent education basis. my parents -- when i grew up, my dad had a job and he was really proud to have his 35 years in working for the state of oklahoma. i lived in one house. i had the same friends. i had the same teachers. i knew the school that i was going to before i went to them. so it's a different environment. so education in terms of military families, that's an important piece that we are working towards trying to improve with great agencies like the national math and science initiatives, with the initiative of military families who do advanced placement courses for specifically military schools or

schools that support military members. and then finally the third piece was wellness. that was an area where the first lady and dr. biden really saw a need when they were talking to the spouses, the military members, so the way i like to think of it is a tripod. employment, education, and wellness. and like any good tripod, if one of those legs is broken, it's not going to stand. so joining forces is a program and you can go to at joiningforces.gov to learn a little bit more about that. it was started by the first lady and dr. biden to really go out and hit those areas, in the community and faith-based and more importantly in the private industry to be able to bring

resources to bear on an issue that all americans should be aware of. so the first lady has been doing that through her program, joining forces, and i think that's it. we'll open it up to some more questions. >> thank you very much. [applause] >> now, we've heard at the national level, at the state level, and at the local level the programs that are being offered and a lot of the challenges that our military and their families face but there's one family that i really think that we should spend some time listening to and that's the markam, tom markam and his wife april who is sitting in the middle. april is going to speak for the family and i spoke to her -- i've spoken to her several times and i was particularly moved by first of all what an amazingly courageous lady she is. and by her husband who i think is not atypical of the military

men and women who have injuries and their reluctance to admit that they have a problem. and then finally, the difficulties that the markams had navigating the system. so april, you've got a statement you'd love for you to read it, please. >> thank you. as i look around me i said the ipads and the pen and paper and everything, i have mine typed up double space and everything because i am the teacher. [laughter] >> tom and i came here today to share a story with you not necessarily to bring attention to us but to help the men and women who are in the road where we were two or three years ago. so this is our story. when my husband deployed to iraq in january of 2008, i had the usual worries of any spouse. how long is he going to be gone this time? how will i keep up working with full-time, parenting our children and the demands of running a household but this is not our first deployment and so

i did what thousands of what thousands of military spouses did. i dug in and i did what i had to do. so when i received the phone call from my husband saying that he had been working on a mobile armory when a mortar exploded 35 yards away from him, my first thoughts were oh, my god, are you okay? he downplayed the extent of his injuries to me and told me he was fine. i'm fine. he said he had a bad headache and his ears were ringing but the medics told him to take it easy for a few days and rest and he would be fine. when he came home a few weeks later, after spending nine months in iraq, it was easy to see that not everything was fine. he still had the same headache. he was confused at simple things. he had short-term memory loss. the last straw for me was the day he called me on his way home from work. a base where we had been stationed for three years and said i can't remember how to get home. i made sure that we called the

doctor. the local medical community including the air force medical clinic doctor seemed to be reluctant to help. tom's primary care doctor implied that tom was trying to get out of work. tom -- this felt like a slap in the face to both of us because he served 15 years of active duty without ever complaining of multiple deployments. then the doctor made the statement, i'll write you a prescription for motrin but you really need to suck it up and go back to work. after that we both felt like there should be somewhere for us to get the medical help tom needed and we made an appointment with the medical group commander and then his primary care doctor after that appointment decided tom should probably go through a medical evaluation board. this process was long and overwhelming. but my husband finally ended up at a polytrauma unit in tampa, florida, at a va medical center where he received outstanding

medical treatment. the medical team found that tom had a traumatic brain injury caused by an orbital blowout fracture in his right eye. his shoulder needed to be repaired and he had hearing loss and vision deficits and they suggested he be evaluated for ptsd. at the time my husband went to this hospital at the polytrauma unit it had been over a year since he had been home from iraq. in may of 2010 the air force placed tom on temporary disability retirement list status, which is also called tdrl. and told us that he would be reevaluated every six months to find out what they were going to do with him. over a year later, in june of 2011, tom and i had to travel to san antonio, texas, from our home in south georgia. we paid for the entire trip, minus airfare out of our own pocket and had to wait for the air force to reimburse us. the total for that trip was over

$750. more than our mortgage payment. we've had yet to hear the determination of what they're ultimately going to do with tom. as of now, we travel over two hours one way to get to a va medical center that has the right set of medical personnel to treat tom's injuries. we do have an amazing, caring team of professionals that we work with at the va. i would love to name them all by names but i will just tell you that his primary care doctor is amazing. his neurologist has been instrumental in his care. he has a psychologist that understands him and does not take his crap. [laughter] >> we have an ois nurse case manager who has been helpful in getting us the appointments we need. and not making us travel more than the 2.5 hours we already travel. in this we are truly blessed. the challenges over the last

three years have been many. and not only have we had to get used to a new normal in our home because of tom's cognitive and emotional deficits, but our family has shouldered the burden in other ways. while waiting for a va rating, because tom was placed into tdrl status with no joint rendering when he left the air force we were in a financial crisis. not only did i have to quit my job to care for tom but he had a significant pay cut as well and we were forced to dip into our life savings. by may of 2011, it was totally gone. our youngest son was diagnosed with secondary ptsd. he began to act out at school and at home and had terrible nightmares. i myself felt depressed. it seemed like the weight of the world was on my shoulders and i had no one there to help. i had to take care of my husband and my children and try to figure out how i was going to pay the mortgage all at the same

time. but not everything that has happened to us during this time has been negative. we have grown closer as a family. my children have matured under the stress and are growing into fine young men. both tom and i have met some amazing people and made lifelong friends that we never would have met otherwise and some of them are in this room today. it may seem strange but i am thankful for the trials in life. am i saying that i'm glad that this happened to my husband or i would not rather have the old tom back? no. but we have accepted this. i have accepted this. and as a family we have accepted it. and we're proud that my husband served his country well. i want to say god bless america and god bless the men and women who suffer. [applause] [applause]

>> i think everybody in this room -- everybody in this country feels that none of our veterans should ever have to go through something like that gun. i open up the panel and you all represent the integration and care community. why this this happen? and what can we do to make sure that it never happens again? and i'll open it up to anybody. and if nobody volunteers i'll start calling on people. [laughter] >> general, how about you? you're somebody who has seen both sides of this, not only active duty and reserves but through the veterans administration and through the -- as an general in

maryland. >> i wish it were the only story like it but it is not. and i think it gets back to that system under the burden of dealing with a nation at war for 10 years, not prepared to handle the t.b.i. or the post trauma stress and as we get in the resources that we build a system to be prepared to handle future cases like this and to ensure that it doesn't happen again. there's a lot of work to be done. you got to get beyond the turf battles. you got to identify what's important, in that reduced resources environment and making sure that whatever we do works to prevent this case -- this type of situation happening again. >> anybody else? doctor, i want to ask you, you

know, one of the things i think that is so upsetting is that the first place they went to their primary care physician fell on deaf ears. is this why again with this happen? is this something unusual? and how do we prevent that from happening again? >> to reiterate what the general said, unfortunately, this -- not to say it's common but you hear of this occurring. we have -- when i showed up in germany, they had transitioned a striker unit out there. and i was one of the first resources to show up. on my first thursday i had 17 people who are walk-ins who are either suicidal and homicidal. this is 2007. i can't tell you how many other people were there to be seen within the year i think we hired 42 new providers. those 42, 5 of us were veterans. dr. geist from health affairs, the principal deputy for health

affairs had shared that the va put together a wonderful dvd on the military culture because many of these providers who come in don't understand military culture. it's analogous to someone who's never drank alcohol in their life treating an alcoholic because it's a different culture and to learn some of those nuances is rather important. a concern that i have is i've had the misfortune or the benefit of going through eight joint commission accreditation inspections for hospitals. and i've seen all the work that goes through to prepare a hospital for a joint hospital commission and then many of those people transition out. the next joint commission that happens you have new people and they say what are all these documents? what are all these forms and they discard them and you get hit with, you know, not passing the inspection. my concern is that we don't forget these lessons learned as

thee conflicts dissipate, as we wrap things up, that we keep our infrastructure in place and that we never forget. >> i ran for the united states senate in 2006 in new york, and i would campaign around upstate new york where fort drum is and i found that women would come up to me, mothers, sometimes younger women and they would say, you know, who do i talk to? my daughter-in-law or my son-in-law has just come back from deployment and he never used to drink and now he drinks all the time and won't get out of bed. other women would come up to me and say, you know, my daughter has come home because her husband has come back and he has anger management issues and he's hitting her and they said to me, where should she go? i had no idea what to tell them. and i think todd, you said when you came back you had all the pamphlets you tossed aside. and what does a soldier do and

the family helps them to take the first step. i'll throw that out to everybody. >> i'd like to answer that question. one of the things they can do is find the nearest vet center and the reason i say that is because it's free. it's free to combat veterans. it's free to families of service members that have been killed on active duty. and it's free to veterans who are sexually traumatized while on active duty. we are community-based. very informal. you can walk in. if a counselor can't see you immediately, we will make sure you have an appointment scheduled within three days. we are kind of there on the front line. we're separate from the va hospital. our records are kept separately so we have more of a -- we have more of an ability to be private. but we have -- it's peer-to-peer. you know, we have a lot of veterans on staff that can relate to folks coming through the doors. we welcome veterans as they come

through the door. we give them a cup of coffee or something to drink and we just make them feel at home. and it's a good first stop because then we can refer them to other resources that are not only available in the va but throughout the community. >> i'd like to ask you, doctor, one of the things that seems to come up time and time again is the idea that if you're in the military, you're the kind of person who does suck it up. who doesn't complain. who doesn't say i need help and particularly, if there are psychological issues. is there any way to convince people or convince their families, you know, what should -- what should families look for when families come home and how do you change the mentality when they have certain characteristics and when they come back with different characteristics to intergrate. >> i got a lot of mileage to bring their own soldiers. we're not the best keepers of

the record. i brought this up last year at the defense forum. i can't tell you how many times i had a spouse come in and i'm asking the service member, you know, have you experienced that and no, everything is fine. well, you can't remember your mother's phone number or you drink too much and you're having nightmares. i spoke to the association of counties in the -- i think it was march or april. a large concentration of world war ii and korean war vets and vietnam. and i had mentioned this about people coming back and wanting to turn to where they were and that they've changed. our society is much different nowadays. even though those world war ii vets were greeted with parades they weren't necessarily greeted with the opportunities for treatment. and one lady come up to me and said every fourth of july my husband doesn't engage in fourth of july. he used to drink too much on fourth of july and he would have nightmares and mumble in german.

we're from des moines, you know? and you can't start to see that there are cultures that really met criteria for these diagnoses. and they didn't have the opportunities. so i think community outreach, peer-to-peer programs -- we've got tremendous programs out there. last count i heard there was over 5 -- at the peak over 500 different resilience programs in how one defines the resilience and we've learned the lessons and we're doing well and doing better. but there's still a ways to go. >> todd, why don't you add to that. as a former marine. you i'm sure have had different experiences. >> creativity is going to be the key for a lot of these spouses out there. i'll give one of example of a friend of mine who works at a vet center who came up with the idea when these friends were coming because they didn't know what the signs were and they didn't know what to contact. a simple concept of a piece of paper on the fridge is he not sleeping so well, is he not drinking too much.

is he having a hard time, don't think twice, call us. plain and simple for the whole family to see. for them to understand these are the issues and this one single line, one number to give a call. and that was the vet center that he was employed at. it's genius and just thinking of the ways around and sort of communication, how to, you know, lay out for those folks like it's all right. this is normal. this is normal behavior. if anything to combat with someone and they come home the exact same person they were before combat, then there's something wrong, all right? these are extreme circumstances that individuals are dealing with that it's just difficult to readjust. and making that very clear for the family members is really going to be very key overall. >> i want to turn now to -- sorry. >> i'll add to that context a little bit more as well. one of the things that i think is really important and we've kind of hit on it as well is the aspect of not only -- it would be the member's family who understands that but it's a wider context in terms of the

community so raising that awareness would say first responders. they would come in contact with an individual and they need what to do. we send them to the va and what services are available. so that's something that's being looked at and it's extremely important as well. on the policy side, not on the east wing but the policy side. in january the president, psd, strengthening our military's families. and i think being an active duty air force member is a watershed moment because every single service cabinet member signed that document. every cabinet member that i was going to look going to look in his or her department and agencies and determine how are we doing this to go straight to what general adkins said. >> are we utilizing our resources effectively? so that was signed in january. and if you haven't read that, i think it's a document that's well worth the read on the

policy side. so it's a part of government. it's a part of private industry as well. community. and it's definitely an education piece that goes with that. >> general, since you've got two stars on your shoulder, and you obviously know what it takes to have a successful career in the military, is someone who comes either as active duty or former -- if they admit to having any kind of, you know, psychological problems that you can't see like a broken arm, is that something that would be detrimental to their career as they intergrate in the civilian world or as they stay in the military? >> no. and i think you have to understand that we've been part of a journey for the last decade. and i have to tell you that from the experience within my own family, i had an uncle who committed suicide after world war ii. and it did not come to me to understand the issue until i

visited the behavioral health, mental health ward at walter reed where the real challenge is to get them to sleep so the mind has the opportunity to rest and that uncle -- and we probably all had those uncles in our families after world war ii who went to the vfw or the american legion and they self-medicated down there with fellow veterans. and then if that didn't work, they got to the point -- that's the challenge we see now and i think we're changing -- we have changed the culture. we've had senior officers in our army come out and admit that they have issues. that's where we need to go in the future. and i think that in maryland, for example, our lieutenant governor was anthony brown, a iraq war veteran, came back and put a focus on making sure that we had the behavior safety net in maryland for our returning veterans and for our guard and reserve.

and the focus on the families to get them to come forward and identify the issues is critical. they see them first and to make sure that they understand that there's a place that they can call, that we're there to help. we all have to understand that there's tremendous costs to war as i said earlier. and these are natural responses to the unnatural environment of combat. >> i think at this point it's time to open up to the audience any questions that you might have. we have microphones set up here and here. and if you'd like to ask a question, we'd ask first you identify yourself, where you're from. and then if you have a specific member of the panel that you'd like to address, please do that as well. and i want to warn you, i'm from the world of television. we believe in sound bites. not speeches. ..

>> we're not working within the state and within the state employment division, and they have veteran representatives to work specifically to work with veterans. as far as employers come into the vet center, they don't. >> i see it as a challenge to hire disabled veterans. i'm one of 16 veterans on my fathers side, and my wife's side of the family. and i work for the department of

defense, and i reached out to hire some veterans. i wish more people would. i know, i know with veterans to use the g.i. bill. they go to college and universities. i wonder if that would -- i think we need a gateway to help veterans. their unemployment is what, 50% and the rest of the country is nine. >> it's even higher. when they go back to rural areas. >> it's just a challenge for all of us to try to help these veterans. use the g.i. bill if we can get veterans to go there to the college university, career counseling office and say i'm looking to hire a better is a national resource director, all these things. i hear a lot of what? i don't hear a lot of how. i guess i'm a little frustrated because i don't like veterans being unemployed. >> i think the afternoon panel is going to specifically address the issue you are talking about and we have representatives from industry. we are talking about -- >> thank you.

>> ask it again this afternoon. >> let me just say, in maryland, something as a simple as identifying and our job bank when a company puts the need in there, to put in their a little minuteman think i'm interested in hiring a veteran. and then for resumes of veterans and guard and reserve, putting another minuteman on their resume so that an employer can see that a military person. i would like to have their skills working in my organization. >> in the center, the lady in the center. >> can anybody hear me? 's. let's go to the far end and we will sort that mic out in a minute. >> first of all let me say thank you for serving your country and containing your service to our nation's veterans. my name is jennifer, i'm a staff sergeant in the army reserve and i.t. deployments under my belt so far. and i also work for an

organization called a national resource directory, the gentleman before me mentioned it. we have to try to connect veterans, their families and servicemembers to over 14,000 resources nationally, and community-based to help connect veterans with the help that they need, make their integration and healing. so that's out there as well if anyone wants to look into that. but my specific question is at, you start off saying protect veterans or service memos when they come home, and to get their jobs back, but it seems like it would need an update to protect student veterans who might get called up in the middle of a semester, or maybe even family members who have to move several times with their service member, and make more jobs affordable for the family members. that's not always available for the spouses. in any of you spea speak to tha,

please? >> i guess, let me address a couple of those things. in maryland we had to establish an employment office within the national guard to focus on getting individuals coming back from their tours of duty, employment. and as many of you know, as the adjutant general i have to sign off on the readiness of the unit before it deploys. and i did everything on that unit. we also have now started getting briefings on returning units in a by name listing of individuals who need employment when they get back. so we are looking, you know, 90 days out and identifying the needs, and bringing them home is just, more important than sending them or just as important. so i think that, you know, you've got a good point. there's lots of different resources that are critical. in maryland, for example, many of you serve in the military, your spouse, orders to move, your spouse had to quit their

job. maryland changed their law a few years ago to allow that spouse to get unemployment insurance. up until that point they could not get unemployment insurance because they said it was not related to losing their job. so maryland recognizes that change. we are also looking at changing licensing in the state of maryland to make sure that those licenses are reflected, are accepted as they go from state to state. this is a few examples of how we are working on that process. >> and if i could just add any real quick. i don't jennifer for years, and she is a purple heart recipient, and recently new mother of probably the cutest baby in the entire country, and she's probably one of the strongest female advocates for servicemembers who have served in iraq and afghanistan. so if we could, police. [applause] >> cell yell at me later for embarrassing her, but we love you spent a nice shout out.

>> i will add to that real quickly as well. credentialing, reciprocity, those are all things that are being talked about right now. so that is key. i know we will talk employment in the afternoon, but with a joining forces campaign, the first lady has been able to leverage her position with many private companies to provide job opportunities. we have teamed up with the u.s. chamber of commerce, and they decided to put on over 100 job fairs. and that's moving, you know, quite well. so there are some opportunities out there. there are places to go. i would encourage you to go to joining forces.gov. >> yes? >> my name is christy, i'm going to taxes question because i think we will be asking about the same things. april, you talked about your son

having secondary, and your own challenges with mental-health. one of the biggest concerns that a half, both as a military wife and advocate is we are just not addressing effectively the mental health challenges facing the military families themselves. right now we really have no standing operating procedures on what happens if a family member of tents or commits suicide. with a working model that we use for the military member, but that does not, that does not apply to the family member. and i know there are a lot of challenges with hip and all that kind of thing, but it's a huge issue that i don't think we really understand at this point up with all due respect to the general, i do think that there is a stigma for a reason but it's not just perception-based stigma in regards to come if it's going to affect your career. we have seen it affect our husband's career and i was going to get services, has had some

negative blowback picks i do think there's a big perception issue that we can help with education. but i also think that intel that never happens people will err on the side of caution. so karen, did you want to bring up jessica may be? >> actually, mine was also to april. >> get a little closer to the mic. >> i was talking to a young lady the other day. her husband is also tbi, 100% disabled. she went to a caregiver group out of the hospital in jacksonville, and said i need help. i need to talk to somebody. and she was told we are full up. we can't take you. we can't help you. now, i've never been so mad in my life, except with jessica and with a couple of other instances of active duty spouses who have committed suicide and were completely ignored. but what, what can we do and how

do we make sure that there is enough help for the caregivers? because if you are told we don't have room, when you are the sole caregiver for your husband and three kids, there is something severely wrong. and i'm wondering, april, did you find that, to? or are you still sucking it up and pulling up your big girl panties and all the rest of its? >> april, why don't you address that? >> well, it was really difficult to find health care for my family at first, the mental health care. one, because our base that we are a sign to was very small, and the mental health unit there was allocated mostly for active duty people who had problems and needed to be seen right away. that didn't leave a whole lot of appointments for the rest of us. so i had been following with an off-base provider on my own, for

a while. the difficulty that came with that is because we do live in a rural area is that there's not anybody that specialized in trained indian with family members have gone through, not audited my husband have an injury, but the things, even if they come home with no injury the things that they see and do and hear and smell stay with them forever. so, they are not trained to deal with what i live with on a daily basis without purse, or, you know, refusing to take his medications because he up and demand he's a man, he doesn't have to take his medication if he doesn't want to, that sort of thing. the biggest problem where i live in a rural area as not having adequate clear just -- adequate care for specialized. i was telling dr. brown when it came to my sons problem, they

were significant and i will share them industry because they are very private. but he was behaving in a way that no little boy should be easy. and there are only two mental health providers in the town where we live that are capable of dealing with children. and when i called they told me it was a four month waiting list to be seen. i begged and i cried on the phone and i call back the next day and the next day and the next day, and begged and told them this is what's going on in my house every single day. and they were able to put us on a cancellation list and luckily we don't -- we didn't have to wait for months. we waited about three weeks but it was a long three weeks. we definitely need more mental health people who are trained in dealing with ptsd, and the people that deal with the people that have ptsd. because i am a have ptsd from

the way he acts sometimes, you know? [inaudible] >> yes. [inaudible] >> i think also even if everything in dod and va worked perfectly and we all know it's not an we're all working to make the intro changes, i get all that. but even if it was working perfectly recently do not have the resources and the culture for that matter a lot of times, david, you talked about to do with what comes after 10 years of war. april, you said they never come home to saint. that means no famine is ever the same. and so what regulations do we need to change internally, whether their joint ethic loss or whatever to let those organizations like some of these nonprofits that can step in and filled a gap. i did not know about that organization until after i wrote an op-ed to the "washington post" and i'm sitting in the white house. that was the first time i heard about it. what we need to do internally to open the gates and integrated safely, but we need to get it figured out, a way to connect

those dots. >> doctor, is this just come we don't have enough resources to do this or is it an attitude and culture? >> it's complicated. with that said, there are a great many resources. unfortunately, a great many resources haven't been vetted. and trying to coordinate this is daunting. now, with that said as well, we're working quite a bit and chrissy, i appreciate you bringing this up. and i've had many a conversation with the general perrelli who will have, we'll have the president hearing him speak. he's a phenomenal men. he really gets it. we are reaching out to all respective services, and then also the ngos and the civilian organizations, you know, to do what we have to do to bring that in. that said, i really don't have a clear answer for you on that.

we are not doing it. i've taken your drum and i'm beating it and the pentagon, as you are. so, and the wonderful thing is there are people out there who really understand, really care. their heart is in it. their mind is in a. their intellect matches their passion. and it's just a lot of work, and i think people wash their hands and give up, so stay tuned, please. >> you to have been waiting very patiently. >> colonel jim mutter, retired marine. i have, first of all, i want to concur that i've experienced the same thing, although my plate is nowhere near yours, of the va saying the problem you have is beyond our capability to take care of with the number of visits that you're going to have to have and the time you're going to take their you ought to go out to the civilian world.

you're going to have to go out in the civilian world and pay for it yourself, if you don't want to be, have this thing going on for eight or 10 years. but the big reason i came up here was to suggest one of the problems i think that the hospitals all have, at least three that i have attended and gone to, is that i see people like my two brothers, one who serve in the navy and one who served in the air force, and a very good friend of mine who had two years in the marine corps, none of whom ever had an injury or scratch or anything else, all of whom served over 40 years a ago. and all of whom who get right in front of anybody else. they get an appointment to the va listing for service, just as

though they were 100% or 90% disabled. and i know the va has regulations and a prioritization scheme of one through six or seven, as i recall. but it's not being in force anywhere in the country. you know, people walking, at least it's not been enforced in salt lake city. it's not being forced in d.c., and it's not being forced in indianapolis. those are the three hospitals that i have attended. free va's i have attended. so, there's got to be, i know, we say certainly on active duty your sickness can be any greater than mine, your health is no more important than mine. and as an officer, we always, i anyway, always would stand at the end of the line and just wait, or come back after sick bay was almost over before i went back in. but you don't have that opportunity in the va hospitals.

your clinician sees you. they said i need to see you and another two weeks. you go out to get an appointment. well, they are filled up for the next four months because there's all these people that are in there that have had probably little too, they are probably class five, six or seven and are taking the same space as they are taking, all the spaces up just in chronological order. >> we only have a few minutes left, so colonel, i just want to ask him is there anyone else who was waiting to ask a question, a related question to that? >> no, but i would like -- >> go ahead. >> thank you. my name is sondra and i'm from san diego. from 2006-2009, we had a program for the wounded warriors. and i'm hence be explained to people that is? >> it's an energy work that research shows it improves

healing 40-60%, very effective with posttraumatic stress. we were very successful. we did that for almost three years, over 500, and what i saw was before they even got out of the military, once they got out of their bed in the hospital, we could see, and i'm not a psychologist or i'm not a doctor, but we could see all the problems. and the problems with many of them wouldn't go to see a therapist because they didn't want it in the record spent we just address that. i think that is a point. >> but what even will come as much as we try to encourage the therapist to work with us, there was absolutely no interest on the part of the medical group. after walter reed hospital, they close down the program, fixed of the places, and then we haven't been able to get back in. >> maybe that's something you can address, because -- >> but we are talking about the

problem, the problem is before they get out of the military. because we understand the problem with the va, but as a community, support, how can we do it when we are constantly told no. dr. brown -- >> we do have a solution in place. >> let's hear a solution. >> we do have a solution in place, and it is, in fact, the law of the land. and it was created by all the military services about two years ago, and if it is implemented with the leadership oversight and accountability and data to back it up, the recovery coordination plans, and federal recovery coordination plans and the screening to identify every serious and severely injured service member, and a plan that addresses the needs of the family members also, and integrates the community assets, where the people live, we

prevent that kind of thing that april our andrea or pam, or the other spouses of families and the kids have to go through. we know how to do this. and it is a statement that is still out there. and it is unacceptable that it takes leadership, and it takes accountability. legislation is in place. the instructions are in place. the tools are in place. and this should not be happening anymore. >> all right. anybody want to address? >> may i take you out -- piggyback on that for a second? i know you guys by saying wow, the brain-dead guy is not talking up there so i'm going to go ahead and talk. [laughter] [applause] >> i'm not quite completely brain-dead. but i think one of the big issues that i hear, and i just want to piggyback is, you are exactly right, ma'am.

everything is put in place. i have heard from, from people in the navy, from people in the army, from the marines, from the air force, every branch of the unit has something put in place. the problem is, they are not talking with each other. [applause] that's the problem. if the air force would talk to the army, and the army would talk to the marines, the marines would talk to the navy, the navy would talk to the air force, and if everybody would talk to each other, and say you know what, this is what everybody has, and make one huge big collaboration, this is the perfect plan. then we wouldn't have this. that's what i think. [applause] >> tom, you probably said about the worst thing anybody has said all day, thank you.

i think we have time for one more question and i will go over here. >> i was just wondering, my understanding, i served two tours in the non, and i've got ptsd. and one thing i would like to see the va do is to give a good tool which is called the wounded platoon, google it and pick it up. everyone working for the va, that is not my with what they are trying to help, helping people with ptsd but have no idea what the ptsd is. if they would show them mandatory that video, i think that would be a big help to make them understand what they got is dealing with it comes to see them. because pbs, it shows what happens to people who have ptsd and comes home with it. without care. >> well, i think i foresaw we probably have gotten to the end of our program. i know there are other people

want to ask questions. you have all waited very patiently. can i ask the people on the panel, would you be available for a few minutes afterwards if any of you want to, and talk to the people? this is the 18 year, and so if you have any questions, i would say, right up afterwards but we do have to break. if i could just summarize, i think they're a number of things people have said, mental health is a bigger problem. we are addressing it. we've never really recognized in previous conflicts, whether it's been world war ii or vietnam, but we are at least identifying it but we still have a really long way to go. secondly, is a stigma attached to a? third would be the whole issue of families. is their support for families, the people as abel said, that caregivers are getting the care often have a lot of problems as well as the result of their wounded warriors coming home. and then tom probably said it best. we do have the programs out there but everybody needs to talk to each other.

so thank you all very much for participating in this panel. i think we've learned a lot. i sure learned a lot, and i want to thank everyone here, doctor bowers, general atkins, the cute single guy for anybody -- >> am i a doctor now and? >> sorry, dr. brown. sorry. comment april marcum, lieutenant colonel from the white house, thank you so much for participating and educating us. [applause] >> we're frustrated we don't have more time but they have all the creatures they appear. a little bit of housekeeping. i will give each of them and award, a book for being up here in being part of this bill. i would add one thing, hearing the markham's struggle with it is we have just got to find out how to execute better on the evaluation process. and the hear the financial

stress and strain it's putting on you. hopefully general chiarelli and some of the others can talk more specifically about what's going on there, but that is still something that the devils all of us and it the devils too many of folks here. so i hope we can take advantage of that. i will present the books right after we break year but i wanted to let you know that lunch will be available in the atrium where all our exhibits our technology will come around to the tables and we'll try to get as many folks out there as quickly as we can. caci is international, sponsored a luncheon to i mentioned dr. jack london is here. jody brown from international. we will give you a round of applause before we sample lunch because we appreciate you. [applause] >> as i mentioned general chiarelli will be here at 12 chart to talk. he's i think en route with his wife, so please make every effort to get to the lines as

expeditiously as you can pick would like everybody in the seats by 11:55. if by chance some folks don't get the chance, general chiarelli will be done at 12:30 p.m. will open up the lines again and keep the food warm and hot, and either put up some better stuff through 1:00. [laughter] so why don't we go ahead, go ahead and break now. will start hitting some of the tables out and i'll make some presentations while people are getting a head start getting out to lunch. [inaudible conversations] [inaudible conversations] [inaudible conversations]

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"washington journal" continues. host: josh keating is the oshte editor over at "foreign policy" magazine and is here to talk about the 2012 republican presidential candidates and their views on foreign policy. welcome to the program. guest: thanks for having me. host: during one of last week's republican presidential debates, it featured an increased discussion on forei >> on foreign policy. which candidate benefits most from a focused shift from domestic issues to foreign policy issues? >> guest: i'd say that's

probably, john huntsman who's not really a major figure on the race right now. he's probably in fourth or fifth place but, you know, he can really run on his record as ambassador of china and as somebody with a large amount of foreign policy experience which, frankly, the other candidates really don't have. >> host: is there any particular aspect of foreign policy, for example, the mideast, the far east as you mentioned with john huntsman, borders with europe that one candidate can separate himself or herself from the rest of the group? >> guest: well, rick perry has been talking a lot about immigration and as a border governor, obviously, that's sort of his core area and he has a very different take from the other candidates. i mean, he sort of thought of as this rock ribbed conservative but he's the only one in the debate who's saying it's not practical to build a fence on every inch of the border as some other candidates are saying. he supported several programs,

head start type programs to help immigrants and the texas educational system he was kind of getting hammered in that in the last debate but it's one area where he kind of -- there's some daylight him and the other candidates. >> host: is the obama candidates that the candidates and the candidacy are going to be focused against. >> guest: the words you will hear leading from behind which was an comment an obama advisor made in a story to the new yorker this year to describe how the administration is responding to the revolutions in the middle east and obviously leading from behind doesn't sound very presidential and it's the kind of thing he's going to get consistently hammered on. i think what's important to remember is that, you know, whether you're listening to president obama or these candidates, the foreign policies they run on don't necessarily tell you much about how they're going to govern. president bush ran on being humble abroad. he was -- he spoke out against nation-building and, you know, embarked the u.s. on one of the

largest nation-building projects since the end of world war ii. president obama if you had to define him early in his campaign it was on his opposition to the iraq war. on his, you know, stated willingness to talk to autocratic governments and sometimes anti-american governments and we've seen him both scale the war up in afghanistan and, you know, participate in an intervention to remove moammar gadhafi and call for al-assad to be forced out of power in syria so, you know, it's important to remember that often foreign policy they're responding to crises and their stated positions in their debates don't necessarily tell you so much. >> host: we're talking about the 2012 republican candidates. their thoughts on foreign policy. here to discuss that with us is josh keating, foreign policy magazine editor. if you would like to get involved in the conversation the number is 202-737-001 for

democrats. republicans, 202-737-0002. independence 202-628-0205 and you can send us emails via email trier and our facebook page. throughout the discussion we're going to be showing clips of various republican presidential candidates and what they've had to say regarding either their views on foreign policy or how they perceive foreign policy as been exhibited by the obama administration. i'd first like take a look from last week's debate with former governor romney about president obama is euro-centric and we'll take a look at that and get a response from josh keating. >> what president obama is a big spending liberal. and he takes his political inspiration from europe and from the socialist democrats in europe.

guess what? europe is not working in europe. it's not going to work in here. i believe in america. >> host: josh keating? >> guest: well, this isn't the first time romney has used this line of attack. he actually used it in his speech where he announced his candidacy. he used the word european several times for president obama. it's a convenient shorthand because it was a domestic and international component. it denotes both big government liberals pseudosocialists and a certain like timidity in foreign policy. it will be interesting interesting to see how long he can really keep up this line of attack because, you know, interestingly european governments are, of course -- most of them are embarking on austerity programs and cutting and we've seen the french government in taking the lead in intervening in libya so this kind of shorthand of european as pacifists and socialists i'm not sure how it holds up anymore.

>> host: when the republicans candidates talk about issues like phrases like terms of foreign policy is it more of a domestic issue for them or a view of foreign policy or a little bit of both we're talking about trade? >> guest: i think it's mostly a domestic issue. several of your callers on the last segment talking about the outsourcing of u.s. jobs overseas. and, you know, that's always going to come up -- especially with the rising china, mitt romney in particular has hammered on his part that he's not going to allow chinese currency malnipulation. and the last debate to see john huntsman kind of counter that and say, you know, that the least productive thing we could do right now would be to have a trade war with china. >> host: our first call for josh keating comes from pennsylvania. bill on our line for

republicans. you're on the "washington journal." >> good morning, gentlemen. >> caller: josh, i have a question for you. >> guest: yeah. >> caller: you said that obama and bush were unable to keep to the foreign policy that they campaigned on. do you think ron paul -- if he were elected would be able to keep the foreign policies that he's presented? and also why is it that these other two guys and so many of them can't keep to their foreign policies that they campaign on? >> guest: you know, it's general rule in u.s. elections is the candidates are elected on domestic policy but get remembered on their foreign policy. that's generally true. the last election was a bit to that exception to that rule. president obama was first distinguished by his opposition to the iraq war. and john mccain was, obviously,

a very experienced on foreign policy so that election did turn quite a bit on foreign policy but generally speaking, in these races candidates are trying to appeal to a domestic audience and sort of sell themselves on domestic concerns. whereas, when they get into office, they're responding to crises and situations that erupt and the sound bites that don't work anymore. you mentioned ron paul. ron paul is a real outlier in this republican field. as somebody who favors large scale defense cuts and sort of pulling back u.s. bases overseas. and quickly ending the wars in iraq and afghanistan which in fact other candidates have really committed to, you know, i don't know if he would be able to stick with that if he were elected but it's been very interesting having him in the rice and how the other candidates respond to him in these debates. >> host: ron paul during his

time on the debate last week talked about linking the currency reform and also a tougher line on immigration all together. i'm going to take a look what he had to say and then move on. >> countries that distort currency and they lead to capital controls and they lead to people control. so i think it is a real concern. [applause] >> and also once you have these data banks, the data banks means that everybody is going to be in the data bank. you say, oh, no, the data banks are there for the illegals. everybody is in the national data banks. that's your id cards and you'll feel cautious when you feel comfortable. blame all the illegal immigrants for everything. what you need to do is attack their benefits. no free education, no free subsidies, no citizenship, no birthright citizenship. [applause] >> and that would get to the bottom of it. economically you should not ignore the fact that in tough economic times money and people want to leave the country.

that's unfortunate. >> host: josh keating of foreign policy magazine. sort of a mix of foreign and domestic policy on ron paul? >> guest: he made up a statement where a fence at the border could keep the immigrants out and americans in which was a surprising remark. you know, i think he's sort of staked out a very clear immigrant exception a lot of candidates are trying to outdo each other on these immigration debates, you know, it's interesting to see that the candidate with the sort of most experience on border issues rick perry is sort of very different from the other candidates in this regard and also governor huntsman as well. you know, i wonder to what extent they're sort of going back to george bush's immigration policy which was not quite as exclusionary. he was looking more at long term in demand graphics and the

degree to which latino voters will be a major factor in u.s. elections in the future and potentially republican voters and, you know, it's interesting to see none of these candidates are really looking at that saying, you know, maybe this is a constituency that should be addressed as well. >> host: merrimack, new hampshire, keith is on our line for republicans. go ahead, keith. >> caller: hey good morning, thanks for c-span. i just got some facts here. i'm kind of fed up with everybody saying how the republican vision is going to cripple -- cripple the country. january 3rd, 2007, was the day the democrats took over the senate and the congress. at that time the dow closed at 12,621. gdp for the previous quarter was 3.5%. unemployment rate was 4.6%. the annual budget deficit was $161.5 billion. >> host: keith, we've moved on from that discussion and we're talking about foreign policy now

and the republican presidential candidates. >> caller: i was holding for a while, guys. >> host: i understand it but this is what we're talking about. >> caller: very well then you don't got to hear what i say that speaks volumes. >> host: let's move to baton rouge, louisiana, tyrone an independent. >> caller: good morning, gentlemen. is >> host: what do you think of the republican candidates and what they say on foreign policy. >> caller: first, ron paul didn't want a fence. he was the one who said if you put a fence it not only keeps people out but it also keeps those who are in from leaving. second point i want to make is about the israeli policy in the middle east. ron paul is the only candidate that don't want to give israel an open key to the candy shop and we're just not going along with anything they want to do.

i recognize israel and i recognize them as a country. but he is the only one -- when he mentioned the rights of the palestinians, he got booed but his own republican counterparts. and my thing is if you just -- if you don't address this and have a broader mindset about, you know -- a more fair and balanced approach to how we deal, that's never, ever going to get solved and i would like his comments for that. and i thank you for c-span. >> host: josh keating? >> guest: that's true. and ron paul does have a sort of very different policy especially on aid to israel. and we've seen the other candidates pro on israel. and mitt romney said there should be no daylight between the u.s. and its allies and now, of course, all countries have, you know, somewhat differing interests as it's pretty much impossible to have no daylight between them but we're going to continue to see israel as a

major factor in this campaign. president obama at the u.n. last year addressing palestinian statehood and he has taken a pro-israeli stance and the u.s. will probably veto the palestinian statehood bid and it's interesting to consider how much of what's driving his consideration a campaign issue. to what extent the u.n. was partly a campaign speech either. >> host: telegraphing either officially or unofficially with officials in israel as to who they'd like to see as the republican candidate or where they continue dealing with president obama? >> guest: well, i think prime minister netanyahu has been listed with the republican party in the past in his visit to washington. he had very warm meetings with republican leaders. it's obviously not been quite as close with president obama.

as to which candidate, i don't know which would say. and several candidates have visited israel. >> host: back to the phones and our discussion regarding the republican presidential campaign with joshua keating of foreign policy magazine, new york, new york. eleanor, you're on "washington journal." >> caller: yes, good morning. i just want to comment on the candidate -- i think it was for immigration. this country is built on great immigrants and to say we're not going to close our doors and not accept them in any kind of way it sounds like foolishness and we need to accept better policies to accept those who have stayed in america and made an honest living and tried to be productive. a lot of their children have graduated high school and are

college students and many of them good members in their community, never committed crimes and did anything wrong and they had to come here in a difficult way because of the things that were going on in their countries. our doors have never been closed. that's what lady liberty is all about. so we need to create better policies and rules. yes, to control the things that happen along our borders but at the same time, those immigrants that have made a good standing. there needs to be laws to protect them too. they shouldn't to have live in america and be afraid, and they have families. >> host: that's eleanor in new york. last week in the debate current governor perry and former senator rick santorum talked about something similar when they were slugging it out over a discussion on mexico volleying back and forth. we'll take a look at that and then we'll get a response from josh keating. >> one question for him, have you ever even been to the border of mexico.

i'm surprised if you have but you weren't paying attention because the idea -- >> the answer is yes, i have. >> you are going to build a wall, a fence for 1200 miles and then go 800 miles more to tijuana does not make sense. you put the boots on the ground. we know how to make this work. you put the boots on the ground. >> but it's not working, governor. >> you put the aviation assets in the ground. >> it's not working -- >> is it working in texas. >> the federal government has not engaged in this. when i'm the president of the united states i'll promise you -- >> it has worked in texas? >> we will put the assets on the ground. >> you said you have. >> let him finish. [laughter] >> and we will stop illegal immigration. we will stop the drug cartels and we will make america secure. >> host: josh keating, foreign policy magazine, what did you think? >> guest: well, it's interesting as the second tier candidates in the race try and make a name for themselves in these debates and rick santorum is better known for his domestic views and

social policy views has really been kind of the defender of maybe bush-era neoconservatism in a lot of these debates not just on border and it's santorum is the one who has been engaging them on it and sort of getting into these long back and forths on foreign policy. i wouldn't have expected he would be the one to take up that ground. >> host: this morning on the "washington post," one of the editorials talks about the tightening border and they said gop should take credit and start talking seriously about immigration. they write it's worth asking republicans a few questions. is it really worth spending billions of dollars to build a fence across the 2,000 mexican border as several gop candidates have said. would they really revive the project to construct a so-called virtual electronic fence which was abandoned last year after

$575 million was spent to erect a camera and radio towers covering just 58 miles of the border in arizona amid criticism that the system never worked. the overall thought here from the "washington post" editorial group is that the republicans should claim victory and move on to something else. >> guest: well, it's hard to build any fence that can withstand the forces of economic need and, however, advanced we build up the border it's not going to stop the flow of immigration into this country. so, you know, i think there's definitely a need for a someone more nuanced discussion on this issue rather than just build a fence higher. >> host: on our line for republicans, joann in san diego, california. you're on the "washington journal" with josh keating. >> caller: yes. joshua, my concern has been ever

since president obama spoke in cairo that he wanted to recognize weaken the role of the united states in the world and we saw that kind of in libya where he's taken a step back where initially he had tried to find a way to get gadhafi out within a few hours and may have avoided all of that. but i'm concerned that republicans are becoming more isolationists and i think we should be supporting democracy in the middle east and we should -- this war on terror i sort of view like the cold war. it's for half a century. the american will was so strong and we got to get back to that and i think we need a republican leader that will stand up and say, now our problems in yemen -- we're going to help fight terrorism in yemen. this is a global conflict just like the cold war. and we have to be in it for the long hall and we need a powerful republican leader that will say we're not going to cut our r & d in defense because we can never

make that up. >> host: joe ann in san diego, california, go ahead. >> guest: well, what's interesting to watch here is the influence that the tea party movement is having on the republican party. you know, of course the tea party is mostly focused on domestic concerns and economic issues but, you know, if we're talking about measures to cut the deficit and cut government budgets, the question becomes, is defense funding going to be on the table? traditionally, the republican line has been more in terms of what you discussed, that strong military and a strong u.s. presence abroad is a priority and that, you know, those parts of the budget should be off the table in terms of these discussions. but increasingly, when you see people like senator rand paul and his father ron paul talking about putting military spending on the table, you know, i think that that's going to be a real tension in the republican debate going forward. and i don't think we fully see how it's going to play out yet. >> host: you wrote that paulson says there's a difference between military spending and

defense spending. what's he mean when he's talking about that and how does that work in with his foreign policy views? >> guest: well, i think there is a distinction and, you know, it's not just when we're talking about weapon systems and, you know, i think he views a lot of military spending as really a form of discretionary spending. that a lot of it is meant to create jobs and it's sort of as much a domestic program more than anything else and he wants to sort of separate the notion of building those high tech weapon systems from what's, you know, really addressing u.s. national security and i think that's the distinction he's trying to draw here. >> host: josh keating has been an associate editor at foreign policy magazine for two years and if you want to see more of his articles and writings you can go to their website foreign policy.com and he also blogs at blog.foreign policy.com/blog/68

and you can follow him on twitter at joshua keating and also follow us on twitter at c-span wj. jacksonville florida, for independents you're on the "washington journal." william, thanks for waiting. go ahead. >> caller: i just have one thing. whatever happened to all the informants that america had on these foreign countries because we be losing troops consistently and also the presidents like obama and george bush and they have no ideas that those countries are run by tribes of people. will we ever get a president for candidate who studied the country before he just goes running over there and getting americans killed? >> guest: it's been really striking to see how the war in afghanistan has not been an

major issue in this election considering august was the deadliest month so far for u.s. troops. we recently saw an attack on the u.s. embassy, the assassination of a former president and the major figure of the negotiations of the taliban. you know, obviously, the economy is going to be the major issue in this. you know, it's going to be jobs that determines who's the next president. but considering how long we've been at war you would think this would be a major reaction and i think it's been striking the degree to which, you know, the question of what these candidates plan to do to bring the war to an end if indeed they want to hasn't really been a major topic of debate. >> host: in the debate last week huntsman and santorum clashed on the u.s. role in afghanistan. huntsman said leave, santorum say stay. this is what they had to say. >> i believe after 10 years of fighting the war on terror, people are ready to bring our troops home from afghanistan, rick? [applause] >> they're ready to bring our

troops home. this country has given it all. what remains behind some settlement to collect intelligence, special forces capability and we're going to have to do that in every corner of the world but we need to fix this core and get serious about what the rest of the 21st century holds for this country. >> senator santorum, just very quickly. >> just because our economy is sick and it doesn't mean our values are sick and we're going to stand up for those values every opportunity to do so to make sure that our country is safe. [applause] >> bottom line is, that you just mentioned is we should be wars to win, not fighting wars for politics and this president is fighting a war in afghanistan with one hand tied behind our generals, not giving the troops what they need. not giving the authorities, rules of engagement to allow us to be successful and unless we change those rules of engagement and make sure our folks can win then we are going to play politics with our military.

>> host: joshua keating. >> guest: i think huntsman is trying to position himself as the moderate thinking man's candidate in this race and, you know, somebody who's not as much as a fire breather as michele bachmann or rick perry or even mitt romney to a certain extent. but, you know, if you listen to a lot of those candidates, they all say eventually we're bringing the war in afghanistan to a close. they talk about we're going to start bringing troops home when it's prudent. when u.s. commanders on the ground say we should. and i frankly wouldn't put that much stock in a lot of what we're hearing in the debate in terms of afghan withdrawal plans. i think it's going to be determined by conditions on the ground and by political factors and, you know, really there isn't that much room between them on this question. >> we continue our discussion on the foreign policy views of the republican presidential candidates with ken calling this morning from new york, new york. go ahead, ken. caller: my kwekz will we ever

have piece in the middle east if we like rick perry advocates giving question support to israel. i'd love to see peace on both sides in israel. but whenever we seem to get close to peace, there seems to be something that israel does. for example, the time when we were so close to peace and then ariel sharon marched through jerusalem to humiliate the palestinians. i don't see any reason why we criticize president obama for trying to negotiate from the 1967 borders while the israelis seem to put settlements in that -- put settlements into the palestine territories. >> host: joshua keating, go

ahead. >> guest: well, i think israel is a very potent political issue in the u.s. and that's something that candidates will stake out the possible position on in order to criticize the president. how much daylight there really is between how republicans and democrats has approached israel over the year i'm not sure there's really not that much difference. but in terms of rhetoric, i'd certainly agree the two parties are pretty miles apart at this point. >> host: next up david in glen cove new york, david, you're on the "washington journal." >> caller: yes, have a couple of comments. i don't see anybody from the democratic party running against president obama or with president obama or against the republican party, which tells me a lot. it's either barack obama or those republicans. i don't believe that president obama can defend the border with

mexico and i don't think he can defend the border with israel. he's not capable of doing it. it's not issue, but it's israel's issue? >> host: dave, this morning we're talking about the republican presidential candidates and their views on foreign policy. >> caller: well, their foreign policy is to tighten the border. it's not a party decision. it's a domestic issue. >> host: move on to randy in spokane, washington. randy, you're on the "washington journal." >> caller: good morning, thanks for taking my call. well, with the republican party none of them are really going back to isolationism or closing down our borders. it's just a matter of getting rid of the people coming to our country and already breaking the law. it's important we have to remember that. it's not to prevent new citizens from coming in.