1970, he had a body of work that had been resuscitated from a sort of literature like god bless you mr. rosewater and titan, the other night, cat's cradle, he had a purpose of work suddenly before he had been just somebody that wrote peter back books that ended up in drugstores and bus stations next to mr. lucky and conan the barbarian. now suddenly he's the next great literary thing. ..?ú?úg

i think many of you know it's oliver who is the problem. [laughter] so in order to introduce oliveira, we are going to see it initially a four-minute film grail of his work, just to acquaint you. prepared by the savanna film festival. okay guys, one. b. is not -- does not -- ♪ ♪ ♪

♪ >> you don't want the war? we don't want the war.a%i$ the vietnamese don't want the war. so why is the war? >> you intend to cooperate with senator irving's committee? >> mr. president, mr. president! >> teeny-weeny -- >> we've got a position in.

>> the point is, ladies and gentlemen, greed is good and you mark my words, will not only tall darth vader, but that other malfunctioning corporation. thank you very much. news not >> never forget on any given sunday. >> yes, the world is a terrible place. these knock -- news not ♪ >> say hello to my little friend.

♪ >> i guess i've always been sheltered and special. i just want to be honest like everybody else to do my share for my country. here i am the. guys nobody really cares about. >> not everybody becomes a united states marine. we want the best. we will accept nothing but the best. >> what i'm saying is i want to be treated like a human being. i am a vietnam veteran. i talked to my country. ♪

♪ [applause]

>> oliver fought for your generation, for our generation. the vietnam war was defining war. of that. and memories remain, even the younger generation. so what a thank you to tell us is how you personally got involved in that. i mean, i know there was ag draft. you were drafted, but something more than that. >> i came from new york city and went to the public library. i personal problems and i wanted to get out of the system that existed at yale. bush was in that class, george hirsch as well as many people of that type. i would say entitled. i dropped out and i consciously went over there to teach love m father was a republican.g

make a long story short igo communism. volunteered for the draft and baltimore would really mean. i disagree with on one thing. i don't think it is memory. job of hiding it and covering it reagan when he was president embarrassed, didn't really want

so let's not kid ourselves. i made three movies about the see what is coming now, coming i do not sense it has been absorbed as a lesson and that's a key problem in america. >> i think the way in which history is just raise in the minds of u.s. citizens, especially over the last 20 years or so it's very different than what used to be because the big difference about the vietnam war was that all factually reported every day on your television screens. i mean, we used to see some of those images in britain. i mean, repudiate and cbs. in describing a village being earned in saying that dan and this is what we're fighting for,

freedom and democracy. and you see a village being burnt and women on fire screaming and running out. and what they have done since that war is the country is very controlled and by two have shown is what they want you to see. where it is in the vietnam war that couldn't complete the control the stuff coming out and i was important. and of course the place where the fourth and forgotten at all is in vietnam. they will never forget it. so in america they forget it because you move onto the next war. but the people who actually fought for it -- i guess even some of the younger generation people protest worldwide to 50 million people countries. he was minimize two centigrade

looked like 28 days after, it cleared the streets of london. ver happened life. protest clearly. very clear to those in hours. >> the lessons of vietnam have been very bold and for you because you've made a about

vietnam. and then jfk can't be argued controversially with many remember, many people criticizing very strongly for that, that kennedy was possibly assassinated by the intelligence agencies because he was thinking of pulling out of vietnam. we'll come to that in a minute, but there is one scene at jfk, which i found when i first saw it quite hypnotic. it was about a 17, 18 minute talking heads seem, which in itself is quite remarkable for cinemark, today show talking heads, occasionally illustrated, making a very strong argument about what happened. we can't show you the 18 minutes today, but we'll show you a three minute clip. >> i never realized kennedy was so dangerous to the establishment. is that why?

>> it's real question, is that? y, the highlander who is just a journey for the public. qb, nokia, keep them guessing like some kind of polygram to as the most important question, why? y was kennedy curled? who benefited? who has the power to cover it up? who? >> in 1961, right after the bay of pigs, very few people know about this. almost 55, 56. it is a crucial document, classify, top-secret. physically in them, he constructed the general chief from here on forward the joint chiefs of staff would he wholly responsible for all covert paramilitary action peacetime. this basically ended the reign of the cia. jay jfk ordered the military to

help them do it. this is unprecedented. i can't tell you the shockwaves that the sum of the corridors of washington. this of course in the firing of general charles cabo, all of them sacred cows and intellisense for edward to. they have been very upset people here. kennedy's directors are never really implemented because of bureaucratic resistance. but one of the results was the cuban operation was turned over to my department as operation mongoose peered mongoose is pure blackouts. it was secretly based in the south campus of miami's university, which is the largest domestic cia nation, budgeted annually over hundreds of millions of dollars. 300 asians, 7000 select few minutes, 50 feet businesses who wish nonstop war against castro, industrial sabotage and all of

this came under the control of general one. he did the distinctive roles and brought them into this country. and the motivation and don't underestimate for the march of 63. and 25 states, 21 overseas basins. were talking big money. nearly 3000 so far. bell helicopter. who on spell? lewis had a bankrupt about developing about the f1 11 fighters. who owns that? the defense budget since the war began. 75, going on a hundred billion. in 1949, no war, no money.

keep organizing principle of any society if mr. kerry garrison said as war. the authority of the state over his people resides in its war policy. and kennedy want to end the cold war and a second term. when i took wanted to cost them ingrates in favor of cooperation with the soviets. he refused to invade cuba in 1962 and and a sedative to which vietnam. all of that ended on the 22nd of november 1963. [applause] >> is quite an amazing scene. the question is, as a true? >> i know some section, but it's based on facts. >> a lot of these facts3 >> a lot of these facts came from fletcher crotty who is a colonel in the air force and they worked very closely. he was an officer, but he was a

focal point and did a lot of and he worked with them since he would provide the hardware. hardware. he would provide the hardware, guns, planes, drops. so he used to go to dulles and weeks and he knows them all. in fact, he never pointed his finger at allen dulles, but the older i got, i do believe he was the man who initialed davis, who gave it. i think it solis and i think it and go the supreme. jim james of the counterintelligence chief who was slightly mad and paranoid and richard holmes was the deputy. i think those three guys that say now before i go to my grave where the real copper is here. >> know what commenced in your mind that eventually it was the

intelligence agency that organized it? >> well, we could talk about it all night, but there's just no way to a pulled off -- it says very clearly we do this consistently. we did it well. we were able to do with it very successfully. lisa zycher ran in guatemala and so forth. and then we ran into why not bring it here? if you have such a gigantic base in florida and guatemala against the cubans come and make sense to creep into our country. and to cover it up, too. the losses on the commission on todd. >> was that book you gave me come to the author's name? >> james douglas. >> book on the kennedy assassination. >> kennedy and the unspeakable. a book came out two years ago. james douglas assassinated. it's a beautifully written book. >> is very convincing i have to say. i read it back on the flag and

it is pretty convincing. but the opinion is he recommends and focuses content, when will this ever come out, if ever? someone must know. >> you know, you're asking for magic solutions to history. it doesn't work that way. generally the bad guys cover up and went. >> it's a pity that there's a wikileaks at the time. because then they might as gone quite quickly. >> so we see in that scene again the vietnam factor that you argue are they argue for the pharmacy gave you the same argument that one for bumping off kennedy was he was going to come out a great man. and in this next clip that we are going to see if what they

actually did in vietnam, which presented in iraq and afghanistan. what is funny when we were talking before, i told you that why you're fighting in south vietnam, i was north vietnam being bombed by u.s. jazz. her private peace mission sent by two philosophers to investigate all crimes and had to spend quite a number of nights and bomb shelters all over the country in days. and the lesson we were told and this is always happen in south vietnam, what you showed in the film. and it is so apprentice that i have to be honest with you. we did one day assist propaganda of north bbc's sanest and make us angry. they don't need to because we're angry anyway. but can this be happening? mns the archives and this particular clip i thought was very revealing that goes, this is a clip, which could be made

about iraq or about afghanistan. so let's see it, too. >> fire in the hole. >> fire in the hole and!

>> get out of here. don't do it.

you don't belong in the non, man. you don't get it, do you, man? you just don't get it. get out of there. come on, guys. let's get out of here. just back

because the vietnam war was loved by people, whether they volunteered or were drafted, it meant that the whole of american society was involved in it and if you manage to bribe your way out of not knowing or being away to canada or burnt your draft card, which many brief people dead, but by and large, every family in the country was the fact it, which man but around the breakfast table, families not politically discussed the war in vietnam. and because middle-class and upper-middle-class families were a did as well, and meant that

she had a huge movement against the war, which spread to the gis as well. and that is dissent in american society during the vietnam war, while the worm is being fought to talk to the high moments of the political country that people felt they couldn't go along with it and some people do crazy things. like the weather people. but i am large, the motives were to try and stop this war from going on. and that we have seen repeated. could it be because the draft is no longer they are and everyone has to volunteer for war? the people who matter in a way don't volunteer? >> are talking about the launcher army we have now? >> more than in iraq and afghanistan. >> this is roman garb. what is the word for? roman legions have a special praetorian card.

trained. of the united states. soldiers, which concerned the pentagon in 1972 or three there comparing the attitude of the i and there was a nervous draft resistance in england. popular. by world war ii, that's a wars against asian and whether and how to behave and there was

more racism in the philippine war and certainly the korean war, as much as in vietnam. they kill koreans indiscriminately from south and north. >> there is no protest. >> i remember once when i was in cambodia and vietnam grenade to the sisterly journalists on my way back from north vietnam and 67. wilford urchin met at his house in north vanden said was that bad? i said yeah, it was really bad seeing people dying every day. i said it's bad. he said yeah, it's bad. i've been there. but it's not as bad as the korean war because i was there. he said with a finished bombing pyongyang, there were only two buildings left in the entire city. and in fact, throughout north korea, every single building was destroyed during that war except the building and pound a job

think we show convincingly that the japanese didn't know the carpet bomb the experience were were killed. as just another bomb. they reacted when soviets bombed the chariot. the soviets were heading towards al qaeda, which is sacred territory of the japanese. so we tried to show his soviet entry into the far east that made the japanese give up, not states. very strong.

these days the thing that if you had a dissenting voice doing the hero dies on bombing the fourth of july because of terrorism and locked up in prison without trial for many a long month. so it's worth reminding ourselves that civil liberties have been curtailed very drastically since 9/11. so if we could just see that scene. >> what you have to say to these people? idea lack >> this war is wrong. this society lie to me, led to my brother. the people in this country going 13,000 miles to fight a war

against people who have a proud history of resisting. we've been struggling with the dependence for 1000 people, the vietnamese people. i can't find the words to express the leadership of this government. it sickens me. people say -- people say if you don't love america, then get the out. while i love america. boom of the people of america very much. but when it comes to the government stops right there. when it comes to the government there corrupt, a bunch of robbers. we are here to say we don't have to take it anymore. we are here to tell the troops they are killing our brothers in vietnam. we are here -- idea lack idea

lack idea lack [inaudible] are real cares for memorial day on wheels.

i mean, that is what happened. they voted. if the bankers run them, the german state will give up the money to bail out. a lot more. >> tariq and i have gone around on the subject mattered. he says that very clearly. my father raised me.

so we are on different sides of the sands. i would say the only sane alternative to the environment is polar opposites is what ron paul has been talking about. he talks about the concept of corporatism and and of course he differentiates from corporatism from what he calls the free market. and of course the free market is he believes the larger these corporations become, the more powerful, the mark of an integrated in the government access with corporations and banks and insurance companies, the harder the system becomes and the free market can no longer operate in a healthy way. ..

state intervention was out, public utilities had to be privatized, private capital entered the most hallowed domain for supervision. we were told all that, so don't even talk about anything else. then the minute the market begins to collapse all these same people have been telling us that please, help us out, so the state isn't allowed to help the poor because that is not permissible. [applause] but the state is about to help the big bankers and the corporations. i mean, his criticism certainly on the entire and even on the big corporations, but what is

this alternative? how can you -- the free market has never operated in reality in any country. there's always been externals help to it. you can't have the free market if you have monopolies and giant corporations controlling the were talking about. that is the separation that can be controlled. it's a question of controlling and that's where the governments have to be referees or of the government becomes a participant, as it does and socialism, they're becomes another form of corporate some. they haven't solved the health care. the cost of health care is achieved enormous proportions, and we should not half arrived there because it has been a collision between government and medicine and pharmacies and insurance companies, and i saw the fair market can work. >> but listen, if you look at the health care problem, the costs of health care in the

united states or more than in those european countries where you have the state funding health care full stop. here the costs are very high is because they won't break with the insurance companies and the pharmaceuticals. they paid an enormous amounts of money in order to get some health care system functioning which isn't really functioning that well. and i mean, in my opinion the only way to have a proper health system functioning in any country is that health should be free, no one should be able to profit on the health of citizens and poor people, which means -- [applause] which means essentially that the pharmaceutical companies in particular should not be allowed to make these profits, and in

countries where you have the state pharmaceuticals as you know full well in cuba the medicines are cheaper, and when the brazilians produce the medicines themselves, they are much, much cheaper, so it's not -- you have the state industry actually producing cheap medicines, and cheap also in parts of canada, you know, for different reasons, which is why so many americans buy medicines from canada, and many will buy medicines from cuba if there are no sanctions on that country. but then let's move to that part of the world which you and i both know well. in the south america where the state actually has been intervening to try to lift the poor up from poverty, and huge attacks have been made on them in the western media for attempting to do that.

and the president's you talk to in south of the border, one of them in particular was very interesting. he's the one who actually be faulted. he said they are not going to bury the money we owe. can't pay, won't pay. we pay a tiny proportion of it. finally the banking institutions have to accept it, but he made a different point, which was very startling, and i now wish we would have made a lot more of that. we did it, but we should have gone on a bit more, and that's six. >> the president pushed that day, that night. >> [speaking in native tongue]

[speaking in native tongue] [speaking in native tongue] [applause]

>> the late president of argentina and died not long after that film was made. then from this he was very cogent and intelligent, but it is astonishing that bush actually said this. that is what the character says in the movie in the organizing principal of society. >> it seems our system has been based in it since world war ii increasingly since the eisenhower regime. >> eisenhower actually warned about it. >> he warned about it, but he did the most to let it grow. >> but it doesn't work. it's not accurate because the united states has now been involved in large wars spending billions and billions of dollars on the war in iraq and the occupation of iraq, and billions of the war in afghanistan, and

billions on the bases, military bases in the arab world, and yet it doesn't seem to be helping the economy. so it's quite interesting contradiction that is growing up, and now you have ron paul for one, but even other voices have been raised saying that the war is costing us too much, they are not actively keeping the economy growing. so that's an interesting shift from that, and i think because the country has been largely apart from the military side of it, it has been deindustrialized over that. >> you know, a lot of stuff is bought from china, india and the far east, so the north can't help the american economy. as they could. you know, when 9/11 happened american capability was so weakened that the chinese had to be commissioned to produce hundreds of millions of stars and stripes that couldn't be

produced in the united states itself. it's quite symbolic. when you need them to go to china and think how many can you produce and how soon? but that is the symbolic that is happening to the american >> you're feeling when you travel to cuba and most of these important, argentina and brazil, they're has been a surge since the -- from 1980 to 2000, the economic development of that region took a negative hit from the ronald reagan era called the washington consensus realism, of elections and space elections, although it's not economic policies and was developed in the region is a new consensus, where the united states is no

longer what it was and has -- we have seven to eight pieces in colombia. this is the tell what you have the south american command, which is aggravated the brazilians as well as most of the south americans. there have been actions with columbia and the old columbia under the old president against ecuador. you know the history as well as i do, probably better. this area. they took a huge role as did chavez. is of another nature. it's -- and that's why it is true me down there to make this the kimmage results of the border because we are not getting the straight story, and i think americans deserve better mark worked with me at the center of economic policy research. he's doing an accurate policy on the south america. that news doesn't make it into the mainstream press. >> and related to that is the

countries which are in a mess where you have had virtually no reform at all, one of course is mexico, the neighbor to the south, where you now have a virtual breakdown of society. and the economy heavily dependent on drugs, which raises the question to be fair ron paul again raised this question of legalizing drugs, legalizing -- >> we agree on that. >> you will agree on that, too. [applause] >> welcome that is a free market actually. [laughter] >> well, maybe it is. it is a free market. and it's -- i think it's correct because in countries where they had legalized these drugs like holland, where you can walk into a shop or a cafe and buy your

favorite weed, you can sniff it like you sniff a glass of wine before you drink it. and the middlemen and street crime on the drug issue for this has gone right down. the statistics are very interesting. and so the big lobby, which is the big lobby again legalizing drugs in this country do you think? and why don't want to do it? >> you have the prison guard system and the unions and the people who benefit from the drug war which is the dea, which has grown into a 100 billion-dollar egullet a war, the budget is the change the money about ten years later and call that the war on tehran drugs, it becomes a war on terrorism in a strange way and they merge. >> the mexican situation according to virtually every report and books being published in mexico is not totally out of

control. and, you know, it's obviously given the border and given the trade with the united states in this field. it is affecting -- >> they did a lot more, that's 40,000. we agree the drug war has been plenty. but the nafta agreement that clinton signed a 92 did the balance of the mexican agriculture and a lot of the trade, and it forced people into these ghettos where they made more money they made just enough to survive. so it's actually a very predawn did situation where you create work but the work is such that its sleeve labor -- slave labor. >> let's come down to -- >> the greatest boom in the economy is revision in the united states. it's apparently been one of the biggest adjustment in the immigration is the mexican

population coming north and it's actually the biggest bill in the history of the world i think. and it outdoes johnson's war on poverty. >> this is true. and migrants, especially first and second generation migrants do this all over the world. send money back to the country's from where they've come. it's had a huge impact on india and pakistan, the migrants working in the gulf and britain and west indians from the caribbean. >> a huge amount of money going around the world. >> but first how did your own interest in the fiscally developed, and when did it develop? >> i think it is a great story. it's a story told, it's the biggest example we have a factual things that happened you learn so much from it to the always loved it and it was well

taught to me. but as i grew up, i felt like which is america was the moral good in prize speech, and i believe that. this way wish to support it and i thought it was my time to actually as much criticized as i've been for distorting history, i really wanted to go further and get my feet wet and so i went -- i not only called you but i started to work with peter, the studies at american university in washington, d.c., and we are completing this ten our series and he with me has substantiating what we have done in the television series which is coming out i hope in may of this year from showtime.

but i think it is something i can leave behind to my children and i think it is the most ambitious thing i've ever done. spec the more i've seen of it from the end -- you sent me on the episode on wallace. there was quite astonishing that in order to prevent -- >> george wallace. there might be some confusion. >> wallace was the vice president under roosevelt for three terms, and this was the fourth term, and roosevelt was dying, and wallace was considered the too left wing, too progressive to become president if roosevelt died. and so they were organized to prevent him from being nominated at the democratic party convention, and all sorts were

made. a guy that had it seemed a majority to be elected, they delayed the convention by one day because the chicago democratic apparatus, not the most wholesome and the world. [laughter] switched off the lights, cut off electricity to the democrat party convention so they had to delay and that might they were spent browbeating delegates which is shown very incredibly. i was taken aback and had no idea that the it gone to that extent in order to subvert the will of delegates and the convention and, you know, we still don't know everything they said to these delegates or what intelligence agencies were used to try to prevent wallace from becoming rows of's successor. he would have been president instead of truman. the difference that would have made, we still don't know but judging from the policies, he

was well to the left of most democrats, and including roosevelt himself. so they were very nervous, and this was known to the generation that was around during the second world war. it's then he talked about today this particular episode in his discover wallace? >> he studied henry wallace all his life. it's a cool story. it's a movie on to itself. he was mr. smith goes to washington. he was naive, he wasn't jimmy stewart quality. she didn't drink, didn't smoke coming he used to study foreign languages and stuff like that. but he was an interesting and beautiful man, and actually was >> thank you. [laughter] and an enlightened one, very expert. be that as it may, it was a very dirty business, and it's

actually come down to one night in july in 1944. we document that pretty accurately, pretty scary at the moment when he is about nine seconds away from being nominated when they cut the lights and cut the power. the world would have been a different place. it's the way things happen that the difference would bring day, and truman has a reputation in this country and we go after truman, and in a very fair way we question so many of the things, the mythology around harry truman as the common man than more as the idiot man. [laughter] >> when is the untold history going to hit the streets? >> he had the lowest poll

jr.. [laughter] he had that bush quality, that touch. [laughter] >> we haven't really talked about the current president, largely because you haven't yet made a movie about it. [laughter] that can wait, i suppose. but, i mean, you know, the -- i was in the united states during the big election campaign remember people so energized by that campaign, and then i was here, you know, after words, and the disappointment. people felt it. they felt let down, they felt betrayed. of course the supporters say he never promised what these people wanted, and that's true to be fair, but he did excite them. but when you think back on it, you know, some of the slogans were a bit and and sort of pr

slogans that have come out, change we can believe and of course can mean anything. it can mean no change at all. [laughter] but i think there is of

course -- >> like the times of india -- >> he was not able to go to switzerland because of the indictment he would be facing from the icc. he's conscious of his foreign travel. >> well, he's careful where he goes because in some countries the war crimes lawyers are tough-minded and it would be very embarrassing for the united states if they indicted him. so i think he could legal advice before he travels. but in the of course has no problem at all on this front. >> said like a true pakistani. >> i mean pakistan would not pose a problem on this front either actually even though we've got just a set of all into skating the army and the government a hard time. but i don't think they would've

gone forever. in any event, that is where he said that. what is your take on obama? >> your take on obama. >> i'm very, very disappointed. i voted for him on the basis of his iraq vote. i met a few times, thought he was progressive. i was wrong. he wrote a book about it, you studied -- i didn't. i believed him. a nightmare and mccain would have been a worse nightmare. on that basis, is the continuation of the warrant terror that is most bothered me, sacrificed his principles to the country. surveillance state has grown larger because he's a wolf in sheep's clothing. he's been able to settle this.

what i thought was a temporary become a permanent state, a condition wherein our rights, my right. feel i live in fear. if a president has the authority to detain me or you can have me assassinated on the basis of his own judgment and we are willing him that right and i'm living here on a way of her, and living here in america on a waiver, i find it very scary. >> it is. it's quite interesting that even during the american civil war the people who were involved trial. >> the indefinite detention and even mentioned the nda, which puts us on military footing. the military can come in on the president's offer and take over

any situation a demon anti-combatant situation. protest, your involvement with the business organization. for example, i couldn't believe he kept going with the business organization. he's been the worst president whistleblowers never cared for five indictments under the espionage act. this guy is a serious him with whistleblowers, who by the way keep the government straight by jessica -- somebody would know in the audience, the beautiful defense lawyer at the justice department to try to defend the rights of john walker lindh was not allowed to. there's so many cases of government malfeasance that have been protected by the concept of what a security -- national security. it's frightening.

>> and from that, it's a very easy transition to federal national security. >> oklahoma terrorist and that anthrax or nukes. i swear, beginning to sound like chamberlain. >> don't sacrifice me. >> you think with all your tip will not make this you can appease islamic sashes to hitler. i see a world where an about 25 years america deserves our gun. the man is at 30, 40% in way of two oceans blocking us from the world reserves. you think we're going to have allies than? >> i present the world's

population. we use 25% of its energy. you think russia and china are going to help us out when they need those resources themselves? >> 80% of the world's future in a reserves their right here in eurasia where the prize ultimately lies. oil, gas, water. iraq alone, 10% of the world's reserves. 60 of 80 oilfields >> and probably a hundred gallons in the western desert are floating in a sea of oil. >> we have bases in more than 120 countries which include iraq. it happens. >> were the fertile chokepoint of civilization. euphrates is the biblical credo. we trained a swamp like don says. we rebuilt it. we develop its resources.

>> they own it, we run it. pipeline, they resources finance the reconstruction. >> the power that will be broken in my lifetime if we stick to the plan. >> what is the real exit strategy clinics >> there is no exit. we stay. >> spoken like a true oilmen. you're part of the plan back in the 90s. back to our dominant weaponry you agree with never allow another military economic writer to emerge against us again. so i don't understand. >> i try to hit and a half and i wasn't done. we invoke preemption, the right to use nukes whenever we see fit

and i guarantee you, we'll be in a forever war, three, four words at a time. that's not the new world order. there's got to be some global cooperation. >> no one against cooperation. we're calling the shots which gets us back to reality. lest we forget, where d.c. latin american presidents? greg denier. what. what is missing? >> durand. the mother lode, third largest oil reserve in the world. 40% of the world's oil goes right through here goes right through here. comptroller brand, keisha, control the world. empire comes a real empire.

>> pitfalls. you go out here in the scare people when you talk like that. what can you think about oil? the 9/11 terrorists, wmds, talking freedom and democracy and talking access to people. >> sera come the u.s. attached, not i. >> you know when i was coming up, it was a dangerous world, but we knew exactly who that they were. it was us versus them and it was clear who them was. but today were not so sure who that they are, but we know they are there. and i'm not going to negotiate with myself. i'm a gut player. always has been.

thank you so bone tired of saddam who's always been arrested and i don't want our soldiers invading that guy at the desert. we've got to go this war going. d.c. go now and tommy can start mobilizing. with 300,000 troops by early january without creating a stir. >> keep a tight lid on it. >> for the record come this is totally against the spirit. we agreed with our allies to let the inspectors do their job. >> as yogi berra said, déjà vu all over again. >> sundaes got to teach at a place in texas hold them. you just keep selling our friends at the u.n. whatever they say in the end, final decision is mine. >> s. commissary. are you with us on this cold? >> i'm with you commissary. >> all right, gentlemen.

let's close this down. [applause] >> i mean, it still horrifies me when i think what happened in iraq, which to be honest, the euro-american citizens have not grasped what has happened. i mean, a million iraqis died. even this current government says there are 5 million orphans in iraq, 2 million wounded. the entire social infrastructure of that country destroyed. political parties put into power by the united states who were

taken away rights with iraqi women which they had enjoyed before. iraq was the most hated country in the middle east in terms of men and women finished, san diego, to put and then obama announcing a troop withdraw that it was a noble mission. that is not the way the scene in the middle east. you know, even by people who are very hostile to saddam, including some of his jersey said what they did to us was horrific, absolutely horrific. but the business come in the business goes on and now they are talking about a war against what do you think i'm either going to war against iran?

>> yes. i think obey an election issue visa and travel. romney has come on with who is going to be the more patriotic, who is going to be stronger in the usual american muscle. i think iran will be already assassinated or israel is that you are supporting. and it's a very dangerous time. the nuclear issue is the same people out there, even the iaea come in the international atomic engine hasn't infiltrated by us with the japanese style. we put this guy in india suspect he tested his commitments commitments to us. her rady, egyptian who was anonymous and endless out and this is a very dangerous situation and the israelis providing a lot of the information against iran, which makes it like the wmd information, suspect. but what we are seen as it can be solved to the american public

on the web is this television works. you keep mentioning iran has the bat guy. it just sinks into a consciousness. says a political state. who think obama is a politician and he's going to run a whatever gets them alike did. the same way you'll never elect cuba because he has to win in florida. >> so what you're saying of course there's quite a few people believe that. my one sort of doubt is that still now the pentagon is not in favor of the war. all the material coming out of the pentagon and the defense intelligence agency leaks or statements sometimes but canady even gave me the feeling that they are not at all happy with the politicians playing their part, but that military men know exactly what happened, the war against iran would mean destroying their nuclear tears.

these nuclear reactors are not conveniently in one place to be destroyed. they are all over the country, including one is very close to the holy city that the iranians. and if the israelis are allowed to go on a bombing raid, which they won't do without u.s. permission because it's a very ayyç1 iranians do?ayay!qayayay or let's say the u.s. joins witq the european union joined sense that the collective bombing raid, it's a declaration of war. i think that they will fight back in the effect of which will be to strengthen the clerical regime and earnestly for the country will feel we are under attack and they're being right. and then what did they do? they will then take off the gloves in afghanistan, take up the cause in iraq, take up the gloves in lebanon where they have support and make it a warrant through four different

fronts. it is not even a big secret. they talk about it if you read what the iranians are saying how they would respond. close the straits of formulas, blockade them, drops it and stop them from functioning so that the oil flow to the west is cut down to get the economic crisis that's not a surge of minor threat. and knowing this easy i think the pentagon doesn't want to get into it. it's the politicians who are pushing on that particular front and the pressure here is coming largely. just to be fair because they don't want the nuclear monopoly to be violated. so it's a very tricky one. i don't think the u.s. establishment has quite made up its mind on that. >> i wouldn't underestimate the factor of petraeus' military men being at the cia. i do think televisions isc

distorted. we know we thought tenetc distorted. we thought go back to the bush senior airman team b. was distorted about the sovietc union. but the cia is the petraeus tha the hamas running, as you know, predator strikes everywhere in the world. there's a predator strike in the united states cause some domestic dissidents so to speak and i don't know if you read that about a cow war. it's interesting. when greenwald went after it, it wasc quite amazing using drugs drastically for police surveillance in the country.c but the issue is i wouldn't quite believe the pentagon on anything because their budget is going to take a severe cut in the state to pull out of iraq, did you have troops in kuwait, troops in qatar. they put a lot of privateboco contract is that i work in iraq. we basically had the consortium

are often u.s. there's a lot of u.s. oil interests that are still there. so we have our finger on the button name. we want to control that area. well, this thing could get messy. and if china doesn't play ball with us, then we are putting pressure on china as it is than all of this out china sea because the naval lanes we put our military fleet they are. we could have a two engagement were with iran and china. >> is very serious d.c. this is a question they have to think about very carefully in washington. >> you want to pay my taxes to the liberal establishment. this is where we feed them. we give them money to centralize government to make war, which is what some of them said earlier. the central problem. liberal republican action makes it different at this point. the liberals have been making more wars.

>> a war in iran would have a huge impact on the chinese economy because the chinese signed a 30 year trade deal with iran to get gas and oil from them. and if there's a war in that region comes the flow of kosovo full text not just the west, but to china. if the chinese economy goes into a depression, then it really is doomsday because they are heavily, heavily invested in the interdependence between the chinese and the american economy is of course very well established. so it's a dangerous thing. that is what i'm saying. but if there's no one telling the administration that this is an absolute disaster if you go to war in iran, it's quite frightening. you seem pretty convinced. i'm less convinced. >> i hope you're right.

if obama is threatened by our army for aggressive worktime, he will do anything to get elected clearly. at one point he did say want to be a one term president if necessary i will stand for my purposes. >> well, that's a joke, but -- [laughter] let's go to discussing the origins of how iran became a so-called problems state. ♪ >> the first thing that was done when you select in iran with nationalized the oil. he said this is not going to british. and at that point, the united states decided to back the british and the cia and intelligence organized the toppling of the regime, bringing the shower back to iran he fled

and mobilizing religious people in iran. we have one adamant that enemy as common as some and everything justified. >> all attempts by nationalist leaders to breakaway from the american embrace purely to defend their own country and to take rights away from the american corporations to favor for people in these countries will seem as a communist outrage. >> topple them, get rid of them. >> if there means linking up with the worst elements in south america or iran or asia, we will do it. >> and that was the first real leader to emerge from the arab world who had a stream of

unifying the whole world again, it were a being defined by imperialism and colonialism. it used to be one world. you could move from jerusalem to cairo, cairo to a mod, mod to damascus. it is a world of cities. and when the british empire backed by the scratch is a subsidiary decided to fight a world, to draw artificial boundary lines, to create boundaries, they then make the base essentially for what we now know as the middle east. and that there was determined to burst that process and create them. nation. >> so nothing changes really in different ways. empire, empire beard who's going to change at? ukiah tharp.

you know, i mean, all the changes that will have to come i think there's no way the united states can never be defeated military and rather than be defeated military, now they will destroy. so the only hope -- i always say this and i mean that, if people in the united states. new generations, all generations. not everyone can make more, that things have to be done to do something. i don't accept this view that the american empire is on the decline. it is on the economic decline, but not on the ideological or military decline. it's still very top i did enable use force and not politics to keep control if they have to unless there is a movement beard

and that is quite frightening. and what you said just now that it's not just america, closely your the u.s. parties at the centerleft and center-right to do exactly the same thing. no difference. i mean come a few certainly want differences usually on cultural issues with issues, there are differences obviously. but on the major issues on the world stage with the economy, during a real difference difference is that all and that is frightening because that affects the functioning of democracy. if you don't have an alternative , you know, however limited it that alternative doesn't exist, then what is the price of democracy? what happens to democracy? and i've heard many americans really emirs in texas say, i really have. the chinese have got to justify the right.

when he was interferes with ernie's democracy just interferes with ernie's democracy just interferes with ernie's democracy just interferes with youth never been tempted to make a film by china because they now come your films are very internationalist. >> hear a lot of people on wall street in new york, this is a new threat they say. i disagree, but the chinese have, you know, come along. the very economically powerful. their economy will not implode. they have such leverage over us at this point. but the people account, the wall street types have a lot of influence and money. they talk about china as the next challenge to the united states and they move past the middle east now. it's derived and contained them they can handle and keep the oil flowing inward a good position in the near east and eurasia. but china is a big issue.

so you know, i do think china -- you have to look at the history. history is crucial. i'm not talking about tibet, which is the big issue, but i don't agree with the chinese webpages at all, but they have no history of expansion or aggression outside bears bears bears. the russians have no history of aggression outside. the russians have no history of aggression outside a limited landmass. the knives dates, british, french, the ottoman empire has history of that. do you go by history. china is not the threat we make it out to be. the chinese can be cooperative. they're smart, practical, deal. they're not written by an ideology because the now time is gone. they want to make money. they want to succeed him into a pretty good job of stimulating that were created and continuing their own power.

at one point we tattooed caster about that, as to why you could not hand over your power and take the economic chinese model. and he said he applied. i don't think he say to me, but he implied that could've gone another gone another way at that point. the chinese model can work. if we could learn to live without the aggression we have, the world will go on. empires change. rome declined, but there was a [roll call] that existed for 600, 700, 800 years. >> yeah, but the romans really never realized that out there in the distance there was china. there was a mediterranean empire. >> i don't know if you're michael parenti's book but it's a fascinating power of a the senate and the oligarchs of them

and how julius caesar was much more of the liberation for a populist than he's given credit for. but he made the point that you could live very well and the outer reaches of the empire. increase you had this this life if you are roaming up about 700, 800. >> if you are in a right. >> inconstant noble did go along. imperiled. >> media always talks about the decline and fall. they talk in these germanic absolute and that's the way of characterizing things. it's not good to the process of history, which is slow, deliberative and frankly generous. history has been far more generous than they make it out to be. >> i mean, the chinese are a bit apprehensive because an old acquaintance of mine was a professor of history at

cambridge and he was invited by the pink tank of the chinese bureau, which was people who leave the country to give a talk. and he set a date talk about this, that and the other. they said no, no, we're not interested that. they want you to give a talk on how the peak of its industrialization the british avoided a revolution. >> so they know what they want. and they know what they're fearful of because the base of modernization and capitalization has been so huge that we still don't know what's going to happen in that regard this country. you know, building these medium-size cities, some of them remain populated. i think the 21st century is going to be a century of both america and china in each of them are quite accessed with the other in her ways.

so we shall see what happens. and a, i think the time has come to end this session, which i certainly find very interesting. the conversations continue a different part of the world. and thank you very much for coming here. [applause] >> in a very special thanks to our friends from the the new yok public library who organized this event. [applause] and oliver and i were given the privilege, which is really privilege. all of you can do it is going up in the documents for a where they are rare and old documents

and we were shown quite interesting things. president jefferson's account for all the money that was spent by his household and then to my astonishment they showed me obviously an intelligence document from pakistan in 1963, which then that the united states was extremely concerned that pakistan was not a loyal enough alley, so nothing changes. thank you.

>> the red river cam payne was the only campaign in that pivotal year of 1864 and they didn't want to write about it. it was embarrassing. and the south is in no position to brag on because they were the process of losing the war. so it sat for about a century. only the locals appreciated and then research really started taking a centennial of the water

and a few historians have touched and i spend a lot of time on is just trying to figure out the new ones ended the campaign needs to be studied. i was writing this book on the red river campaign and i kept on coming up with things that wouldn't work, but i wasn't really there. and then i found this wonderful quote from general airman who wanted to leave this campaign and yet another sign that sent in towards atlanta. and reporter -- he didn't get along with reporters, not at all. but a reporter asked about the red river campaign was just completed. he said "one damn blunder from beginning to end" in a new tab is it. the red river campaign of 1864

was one of the major union press to try to end the war. and unlike all of the others, which are heading for the core of the mississippi valley, either northeast or southeast, this one was going in the right direction. it is going northwest. and everything on paper show that this campaign should not have occurred. there are some specific goals they try to achieve, none of which they did. it was designed to take out an existing confederate army operating in northwest louisiana and in eastern texas. it was designed to take a confederate castle of louisiana, which was in shreveport.

it had a naval base. at the military headquarters here did at the legislature for louisiana. all good reasons to take his place. when the rest of the war is moving across the heartland to the east and you've got an army going into harm's way the northwest, it doesn't really make much sense. so why did they do it? local pressure. an absolute political need. the economic pressure in both of these trumped military theory. the political need this because president lincoln wanted to and believed upon receiving a lot of it halogens information that he could repatriate to bring back into the union louisiana and maybe even texas without a lot

of problems. its great success in new orleans you did great success in baton rouge, very minimal effort, loss of life was very small and they thought perhaps shreveport would be the same way. didn't work out that way. members of president lincoln's cabinet were telling him that if they could just get an army into tech says that the german democrats would then have a counterrevolution intake state back. president lincoln really wanted it. he was looking forward to the fall elections of 1864. he needed friendly faces in congress. he's got some problems with certain segment of the republican party. so that's number one. has to be. the second thing is in new england there hundreds of

thousands spindle that textile fact very but are not working. the libs are not making cloth. there are lots and lots of people, particularly in massachusetts that are out of work because they cannot get the cotton fiber to make the cloth and that's what they did here is the president again is looking at a way to increase employment again anticipating the follow-up at the general hospital at as the head of the department in new orleans is the data banks was from massachusetts. a long, long history of working in cotton mills, textile mills, working with thinkers. it's very popular in the northeast, arguably in that segment, more popular than

president lincoln. and banks wants to run for the president the were at least for the republican nomination. for the fall election. for him, it is do or die for a political career. and he has had a pretty good political career. three term governor of massachusetts. he was former speaker of the u.s. house of representatives and it makes sense for it and he certainly wants to. banks had a problem securing the military but jury. every time he tried, something happens. he's a political general. he is not a good field commander. he has some good people under him and on paper this weekend been books like is guaranteed to win. if you don't understand the geography, if you don't understand what is up against,

simply look at his plan. the red river campaign should be, as he said, three bound. one down to the red river. second batch of alexandria and mementos date that they are too shrewd port. so how did it happen? beginning in late 1863, banks has made several attempts to get them to test and they have all had problems. banks was getting pressure from washington, major general henry allen sukkot red river, do something you president wants to and so he does. he's going to play in this wonderfully intricate game. he doesn't have full command of all the forces. washington would not allow him to have that.

he is a department commander, but it's got to bring people together come in. he has an overall command, but he doesn't have specific commands. he cannot order certain segments of his supporters to go from point a to point the. they're going to be people coming out from arkansas. there're going to be others coming down the river but the navy and then coming up and then he has to untreated some folks. here's 42,500 men under his overall command. they're not all the same place. they're going to be at three separate rounds. second thing is that the navy, the u.s. navy is going to bring in the past will look at this brown water port and the navy, which is the mississippi squadron under admiral david

dixon porter. porter is a friend of general sherman and general sherman thought he was going to these days. so when the navy commits to sherman is for us to back out, porter scott. now this river that shreveport is on, the red river is long, thin, maybe come slt and in 1864 of us relatively shallow, about nine feet would be a good constant idea. and so admiral porter is going to bring up vessels from five to nine feet, meaning that is heavy higher costs are going to scrape the bottom of the river as they come up. that is not a good way to

operate. and it's going to be 104 vessels of the red river. he's an hundred four vessels are marvelous in their complex the and in their ability to project firepower. but it is very much a case of the river to shallow, too far and how do you get them out when they get us in trouble? and they will get into trouble. so beginning march 10 of 1864, with plans written out fairly common about 400 miles distant from the different points of the lead, the campaign begins. general sharon has flown 10,000 men from the mississippi valley campaign to really protect the navy from being abandoned and

daily vicksburg and come down to the red river and have trouble coming into the red river. once they cross, daytime ascend rapidly. they, todd is forward is still two years before by the confederate was designed to hold up words in the tradition, maybe 5000 men. nearly 200 men -- between 20300 men and they are going to take this pretty easily. sherman's banner going to sneak in behind the fort while the navy is going to try to pound it from the beginning and not those of papers in new york, washington, philadelphia, described this as an armageddon like battle, they then make a leap forward and they send one of their ironclad monitors to

osage, on a river to alexandria. write the middle of the state. and alexandria follows a better shot to this very formidable ironclad. the captain that it, kenneth mander sends the carrier back by boat to admiral porter, saying please come back here. they don't know that they can take this. as they get into alexandria, porter is waiting around for banks who is supposed to be there. hanks is nowhere to be seen. there is no communication. there's no open telegraph lines. it's all guys how do we start seeing the whole campaign became to become bread there at that point. also, porter is rather amazed at the water in the river falling

and a 16 page letter says i do not understand why one of the stream in this region are and capitalizes each letter. he underlines three times to read is falling, sometimes an inch an our common symptoms in it today. he has no clue and he never wrote to the end understand what the day understand that the confederates are doing. still no banks. banks has decided not to come up with his men marching across south louisiana. he is delaying as he inaugurates the new union governor, michael holland who has been a union senator from louisiana. and he's just a studious with all of these. these wonderful goings-on tried to show that louisiana is going to be a fine union state. at the same time, 20,000 of his

men are slogging across south louisiana. they go by rather those from algiers across new orleans to what is today morgan city then brazier city by rail. and then they have to march through the south louisiana swamps, buckshot black dirt gumbo. my grandmother used to collect rotella that because she'd walk through it and it sticks to your shoes and you grow taller. they march all the way across to the little bitty town of washington today in saint andrew parish. and then from there, they head north east to alexandria. and it takes them a week to do it. it's miserable. it's raining. the roads are bottomless mmn get

muddy. and banks says give them orders. if you will not go into the city if they let die. so they have to stop and clean themselves a. banks is not a military man. they march in to alexandria seven days off their admiral porter and they look good. i'm sure ms. men who westerners and look like they are westerners in their uniform or ended and they just don't look good, but they're really prodigious fighters. they think these eastern guys have had an easy time and there's a lot of animosity between easterners and westerners. banks was sent on a boat called the black hawk and that was not a good move because that was the name of admiral porter's flagship admiral porter thinks he did it because the peninsula.

yanks had no clue. also waiting for banks is a letter from general grant, now taken over as the commander of union forces and assist banks, you will go to shreveport where you will not to shreveport. if not you're going to stop. you're going to come back here to quenneville it just enough bad and you and the bulk of your force will take mobile because you have to protect general sherman on his campaign to take atlanta. this confederate army operating around mobile and the union does not want to have to deal with that coming in behind on his side are you so it's an mission. well, thanks ignores it. and since a letter to the president and general crabs

happily say things are going great. i may take shreveport any specifically been told and great disquiet to go ballistic in generalities going to go ballistic. and president lincoln has in the notes of his secretary has the most interesting and telling, perhaps. she says every time i have had a general lewis told me that things are going so well there has been a disaster. inveterate can't have a war unless there's always two sides. the confederates are based out of shreveport. west of the mississippi river in being run, operated out of shreveport in western louisiana,

if you put every confederate underarms that would be available, you can have about 25,000 men. though never be more than 12,000 at one time. commander of the department is three-star general lieutenant general at and kirby smith. he's a native of florida. he has sort of a checkered career, but well thought out and brag contact. yet been sent down to louisiana to stabilize the end make sure they're paying wasn't going to succeed. he arrives in march of 1863 and he has almost exactly one year to prepare. he builds forth. he said matt mover. he loves to build forts and he

builds them up and down the river valley. underhand he has three department commanders. in the local commander, and what is termed the district of western louisiana. louisiana west of the mississippi river is a major general, two stars for richard taylor, brother-in-law from his first marriage at president jefferson davis, graduate from yale. tremendous leader, one of the finest tactical commanders that the confederates have. kirby smith and richard tyler do not get along. every time kirby smith does something, taylor believes and toddler son in. taylor spent his time getting ready. he's built supply depots with the help of a creole black man named carol jones in western

louisiana. and he can supply his forces if they can get to them. this banks importer, the river. taylor has ordered his armed forces in a.i. are in the mississippi river across north louisiana. and also in texas all the way from the texas line, just west of shreveport downs to not accord day. everybody gets together. it's a gathering. so it takes a while for these forces to come. there resupplied. they're ready. nobody believed that the yankees could move that quickly and they did. and so, every time the texans try to come across at a predetermined point, the yankees are already ahead of them. it's like a big raise. one side coming up the red river. the texans coming up what is today the equivalent of highway

59, u.s. 59 in texas. and they will cross into louisiana desoto parish. louisiana troops have come from central louisiana hud's louisiana back to northwest and the tax observatory under walker have been in the south part of red river valley and they come out. although no one realizes that the time everyone to shattering the end and the union has no clue that that the confederates do not have a clue. taylor knows that if he couldn't fight closely -- as close as possible to shreveport and still detect it, he'll do his job. he can get people to come in. he doesn't have to worry about a long supply line. and so, being stupidly, but one long road and he's going to find

when he gets away from the river and be candid in vb which will do that there's only one road he could use that he will accordion this young column out to 30 miles and that is not a way to run the military. at the little town of mansfield about 40 miles south of shoot port, the single road and lakes in the three rows of banks will have three avenues of church. so he's going to stop at. it's going to be an armageddon like do or die battle for the confederate man and although the union does not understand it for them as well. so taylor marshals his forces then began to work on his plan. kirby smith in shreveport doesn't come down to see what taylor is doing.

but i think finally decides to move forward out of his and cam that in alexandria. he importer that their forces together along the river and in the river at two nafta -- come a little place called granby court. 120 hyatt, sheer cliffs and that is where they decide what they're going to do. quarter is amazed that the river is falling and he has to leave a lot of his heavy vessels in alexandria is also going to have to leave the budget grand court. what is happening is the confederates anticipating what come back a. inside channel and agent

channel. in the side channel is called toad scalia said they had prepared a trap, very elegant trap peachtree portal of water once they love this town are the river will be diverted through the site channel and red river will fall. reporters seized in the sense that letter to sharon and is that the dm is working with the blog game is working on the waters pooling up to the last in his vessels are about to be high and dry if he's not careful and he will not appeal to distract them. quarter will go as far north as just above the southern line of bush or perish, to the stiff caddo and he will come within two miles and the confederates had placed a large steamboat

across the river and it loc. cit. and they left a plaque. and then that that says that admiral porter is now invited to a ball in his honor in street port importer thinks it's hilarious. he can't move this facile and there he sits for a little bit waiting to figure out what to do. banks marches inland away from mass welcoming sight of large canoes to wes on the el camino real for about 12 miles and many cuts. it's not sure he can do this. his maps are somewhat wrong.

but many coyotes to the northwest on ways to louisiana highway 120 many guys were into shreveport stagecoach road, which is louisiana highway 175. any start seeing confederates, calgary, texans and they just started slowing down. they're not going to bring on the battle, but they do delay it. on the morning of april 8, 1864, the union column sets out again and moves the last miles until they come to another small streams and this one is even smaller. they run through a set of words, and others said a voice with a couple of open pastures and then they're then they're at the bottom rate toshi bridge called funny