fictional character. he told a great story about himself but the amazing thing about eric hoffer is the real life eric hoffer is more interesting than the mythic one. that is why i say he is the most fascinating figure of the 20th century. >> really liked the presentation. easy to pull out a few interesting characters from a period of time and give them their due. is there any evidence that on the aggregate, america was more educated than they are today? >> give you one example. you might think this is silly. i don't think it is silly but tells you something about our society. last year was the first time in

the history of hollywood that the top ten best-selling movies at the box office for only remakes, sequels or based on old comic book characters. we are living on the fumes of passed versions of us. there's a dearth of originality. not just hollywood. turn on the tv, never thought i would see hawaii and 50 in prime-time. listen to the radio. biggest song of last year. great song by this woman a dell. first time i heard it i thought why didn't i hear this song from the 1960s? new song. it is a real retro feel to and there's a lack of creativity. as far as giving these guys there do they deserve that and one reason i wrote the book, think of a guy like will durant who told us so much in the story of civilization but historians

are not interested in his history whatsoever. part of the reason is he wrote to be red and historians write to be slated. he was writing to regular people and they're not interested in this guy at all. there is not a book about will durant. there's a book coming out about eric hoffer but there has not been a real biography of erik hoffer and i can tell you he is a lot more interesting than so many other people who have many biographies written about them. the point here is non "blue collar intellectuals" have overlooked the "blue collar intellectuals" i wrote about. they're not interested in them because they were having a conversation with all of america and intellectuals tend to be interested in people who were having conversations with other

intellectuals. intellectuals love to write about other intellectuals. these guys not so much. that is one of the reasons i wrote this book. ray bradbury is not shakespeare but you think a guy who has written 600 stories and has a television show in the 80s and wrote for radio in the 1940s and a career spanning decades, that there would be more written about this guy. there's a great biography of ray bradbury but not a lot out there. i hope the very least with "blue collar intellectuals" to spark some interest in figures who haven't gotten there do and i hope i have given them their due in this book. thank you for coming out. [applause] >> booktv has 150,000 twitter followers. follow booktv on twitter to get publishing news, scheduling updates, author information and talk directly with authors during our live programming.

twitter.com/booktv. >> up next on booktv, marwan bishara talks about revolutions that made up the arab spring. he argues the uprisings have a long history that has been largely ignored by the media in the west. this event was hosted by georgetown university center for contemporary arab studies in washington d.c.. >> ladies and gentlemen. good evening and welcome to the central cities. i am prof. of history and director of the center and i am delighted to introduce our distinguished speaker, marwan bishara, senior political analyst of english. marwan bishara is a familiar face and voice to you as he is editor and host of the program and higher on which he examined

global powers and their agenda. he was previously professor of international relations of american university in paris and fellow at the society generale. he writes on global politics and is widely regarded as a leading authority on many of today's most relevant global issues, u.s. foreign policy and the greater released. his writings have appeared in the new york times beat the washington post, newsweek, the guardian and the nation among other outlets. he is the chairman of the galilee foundation to the u.k. based charity that provides 100 students with university scholarships. marwan bishara was born in nazareth. he lives in washington d.c. and i learned he has just flown in from cairo. we are pleased to have him with us today. he is the author of two books.

palestine israel, peace or apartheid and the work he will be discussing tonight, "the invisible arab" liberal promise and peril of the arab revolution. please welcome me in welcoming marwan bishara. [applause] >> thank you. good to be with you. i am not sure what you are doing listening to me but i love you too. i just flew in from 14 hours flight basically. i have got faith. they keep always telling me to field evaluation forms. out of all the people in the airplanes they always speak to meet to fell lot evaluation forms. maybe because i don't like flying or maybe i'd look scared

up there or comfortable. some of these forms are long and some of them are short. today's form was a short one. it was pretty instructive. reminded me of a number of things to talk about today. the assessment form in the airplanes they ask you, your point of the parter. how was the luggage? did you lose anything on the way? did you ask about security? did you ask about service? did you ask about delays? stopovers? rarely easy to do that. washington d.c.. a lot of the people over the last year that i have been

falling in the media especially have been evaluating what has gone on in the arab world as if it was an assessment of a flight. where did this start? everyone had in mind a point of arrival. i don't know why. oh, so egypt is not liberal democracy and so on and so forth by the twelfth of february. individuals should assess the revolution did not go very well. or that we project in tunisia our own ideals, we are all disappointed and we put the negative assessments. but what has gone on in the arab world, which ever way we will

hopefully discuss that you would want to determine certainly as i said, not an assessment of flights but i think that is what we have been doing. i don't want to say it takes patience but it takes a bit more depth more context, perspective, understanding and i sort of try to do that in the book. not just where we are but where are we coming from and where we are heading. the question was why is big. tried to explain why. but not in terms of specific point. some of those are retroactive to explain how we got here and revolutions can be explained. why we haven't figured them out

and all of a sudden -- there is no point so we don't attempt to do that. there's revolution to the revolution and revolution after the revolution and that is what the book tries to do. what i heard -- try to do more discussions with intelligence and bright minds at universities like georgetown and did i say thank you for having me? what i will do is take the simple way out. instead of doing a major thesis of sorts i will try to pick the word on the cover and explain them to you. the invisible and the arab and the promise and the revolution.

invisible. why invisible? there are two ways of looking at the invisible. there's locally in visible and invisible to the outside world. the people of that region have been invisible. the best saints of all that describes this to people in the outside world is one that says something about a falling tree makes more noise than a growing forest. people have been obsessing over the last ten years over the bin ladens of the world but no one pays attention to the growing forest. they pay attention to 300 jihadists or suicide bombers but not to the three hundred million others. the growing tree was not a media extravaganzas. then we had a history.

the arabs were invisible because the outside world, notably the west look for the prisons of oil, security and so forth, terrorism, fundamentalism or israel. this was the presence. we couldn't see what was going on because the perspective was through his real security and energy security and national security meaning through terrorism and so on so the arabs were not really looked at and i am not talking about specialized departments such as yours but in general terms. to the inside of the region, the

domestic scene in the region, the majority were made invisible either through censorship, imprisonments, you made sure anyone who had something interesting to see would not make it on state television or state media or state newspapers and most of the media was for several decades controlled by authoritarian regimes. if you had anything of interest to say you were in visible for the rest of the people. you were in prison and tortured and intimidated and you weren't allowed to be heard, to be seen. an entire generation would have to be heard. an entire generation was subject of a discussion but never

participant in the discussion. so that is the bit about the invisible. -- "the invisible arab". i asked a question at the end of the book. why are you only seeing these revolutions in the arab world among arab speaking people? we have seen inspiration with inspiration, we have seen occupy wall street and something about the arabs spring which says something about the arabs spring inspired and inspecting in their own ways about a particular macro but not the like of the revolution we see there. there was something exclusively arab about the arab revolution.

that is for many -- someone asked me what are you saying? actually even when you go to egypt and local preoccupation and so forth but something quite regional and quite arab about the arab revolutions. why is that? i am not going to take long. arab consciousness as many of you know with developed in the postcolonial era with specific commonality of language, of grammar. they not only share the same language, arabic, but the same

grammar. the same political grammar. an entire region was liberated from colonialism at the same time and developed common political grammar with assistance to colonialism and more or less the same grammar with israel. there was something is political language and collective consciousness that emerged. the arab dictators have tried consistently to break that and whenever they did it they simply played on it. peddled nationalism but never actually materialized, never actually cared for it. whenever the necessity came up it was always egypt first and jordan first and united arab emirates first and so forth but

by rulers not really concerned as much about internal rather than external instead not prescribing -- the collective consciousness or collective interest. arab media, since the mid 90s, since the nbc of 1993 or 1996, satellite arab media broke the regime's hold on what people listened to and what people watch. with every satellite dish on

every rooftop and every refugee camp and every the lot in the arab world made it possible to start materializing that political grammar or collective language. and the perverse globalization meaning regionalization. people no longer listen to michael jackson at the time. no longer had to watch american television or americans series but watching arab series. but not watching their own. something happened in the 90s where people start shedding a virtual public fear that the arab world became a satellite network. everyone came together as listeners or participants. as television was in the arab

world -- 6 or 700 of them made it possible for the arabs to start having deepening more and more collective consciousness. i start the book by sharing with readers a note i wrote to the editorial board, what we call strategic planning. in november of 2010, i wrote in my notes about the upcoming season and it was titled hot wings. was not the arabs spring that

came about. from the perspective of 2010, i share in my notes with al-jazeera, basically looking at the region. everything looked so dark. lebanon was breaking up and iraq was breaking up again. iran, u.s. golf was on the verge of something new. the old promise of mutual respect and mutual interest was going down the drain. palestine, israel was failing up. everywhere you looked in the arab region things were getting worse. yemen and somalia and sudan. things never looked as stock. after finishing the note i was so distressed i left charts. i invented something to do and

went to china. so in december i was in china and japan. very interesting that in january and february i saw that afterwards there wasn't a word about the arabs spring. there wasn't a word was going on in tunisia. as the saying goes, the brightest -- life comes after the darkest moment of the night. when everything looked so dark, a new horizon opened up and a new horizon opened up by a generation that everyone, and here i mean everyone was considering a burden, a

demographic burden. enlightened ones who were answering the racist remarks, building a reservoir. trying to defend the arab youth, making them into extremists. the whole sociology was built with an ideological framework that those young arabs are demographic threat and political threat and strategic front end their own people and the west. most of the sociological studies done were within that ideological construct. i am sure in some departments there was the work being done. no doubt about that. in the overall -- the youth was

-- surprised himself. turned out not to be all extremism. more enlightened than their elders and farm more interesting things to say about their present and their future and far more will and capacity to affect change than they had seen before. it was distilled into what i am saying in an innocent way as much as possible but it was distilled here in this city into a google executive. which is amazing. i asked several hundred people i

met in egypt, made a point of several hundred people, if anyone among the youth movement in egypt, that was made public. i don't know why -- president obama made sure to mention it in his speech and secretary clinton mentioned it in similar speeches. all of a sudden this wonderful young man, 28-year-old activist by the name -- became genetically -- everything seen from the new york times and washington post was this wonderful western youth reduced to a google executive caricature of sorts. and couldn't see that this was

pluralistic and this was part of the bigger picture, people with a history of an older generation that made it to prison and was tortured and with the people's revolution. not a media construct of the use being protected from london, paris and washington. anyway, that is a promise. brought everyone's hopes up. made it almost impossible and i was one of those -- i wasn't myself at all. about everything that was going on. because when you saw what they were doing in yemen, the country was sixty million pieces of

weapons of personal arms could go on for several months in an upheaval, revolution, without the use of arms. peaceful. when you saw people of egypt -- the threats were made. they were local. the whole revolution had been done peacefully. they insisted on liberating themselves. when that opened up, the reality was not as dreamy but that was not as rosy.

the miracle generation that we would have wanted to be. that was common to the region as much as each and every arab country, they commit major crimes liberal and opening the door reading to arms conflict complicating the picture. something similar happening almost in yemen, syria and many of you -- country couldn't break through other regions. in a chapter called fasten your seat belts you look at the specificity of the country and

the attitudes of the regime's terrific pain on their people. being practiced by a number of regimes and even in countries where they had more peaceful transmissions. the transition to a different system opens up a pandora's box. a pandora's bought for those who were in prison resisted those to the more impoverished part of society, and even those among them. making major inroads, egypt and to a lesser degree to nietzsche

and yemen we have seen more of that complicating the picture. and so-called constitutional liberal between big bracket democracy and freedom, becoming more complicated. all of which -- why someone asked about cairo. why make it singular rather than floral? will leave that to the discussion. we had a major discussion. we call it spring and everywhere i go, some of these -- our colleagues and academics. i am not concerned with what is going on. is important to get the

definitions right. [talking over each other] >> what do you mean a weakening? it was an awakening before. it is not an awakening. you lose contact. you lose track of what is going on because you are so busy -- instead of looking at what is going on and studying what is going on, they chose from the discussions with al-jazeera i was one of those. in arab history or muslim arab history. it is not exactly the common place. the rulers not exactly

commendable. the whole idea of revolution was not exactly something from history. the iranian revolution which was sort of had its own specific shiite revolution in iran, took on a more positive qualification of change against a ruler -- anything but islamic. they were never excited about that and those who turned out to be majority in egyptian parliament, not exactly majority. but tunisian parliament but these parties, political islam will get to that. they were not excited about it. they were always about reform. i sat down last two weeks with

the head of the tunisian party. i asked specifically about that. even though the revolutions happen then benefit tremendously to support the revolution, posited the former -- not a revolution. anyway i am just saying that to make that exception but are still was thinking of the revolution because for me, that is what i thought was in common with the arab world. it is -- there was no bismarck although the saddam husseins of the world thought of them as bismarcks in esteban and destructive way. no one really united the arabs physically or through arms or constitutional sort or confederation. no one united them through trade and economy and specific way as

we know the united nations -- if united at all, not conscious and the revolution we have seen across the arab world today in 2011 is a revolution of consciousness. we will see eventually whig will happen. but i think a break with the past happens in the arab region. it is time for each and every country but the consciousness of a popular movement for major change for major break with the past has happened in the collective arab consciousness. some people might have in their mind the totalitarian revolution of the bolsheviks or whatever or

the iranians. define a revolution in how selective you are going to be. you can't be doing that in the arab system. so my approach, that is what i wanted to write. i wanted to say there are commonalities in the arab revolution as much as there are specifics. of course i say much more and i turn you to oliver stone's google. have you seen wall street ii? i have a three word for you. read my book. thank you. [applause] >> thank you, everyone. this was a very engaging stock that transported me off of the

empire. i forgot to open this up for questions but went on note that marwan will be outside for a book signing. i will ask you to identify yourself as you ask the question. go ahead. >> her am from board -- jordan. we have too much what makes a revolution. al-jazeera they being included, only al-jazeera bloggers ville only al-jazeera because the new media in country, besides the government, only al-jazeera -- the second things make a

difference between poverty and hungry. why? we have a bachelor's degree and a job. the difference between hungry and poverty. when i am hungry i can do anything they want. the difference between poverty day-by-day, other things like arabic and language and culture, they call it antiquity. anyone who has accommodation, make integrity -- this accommodation in arab culture, make things explode. also we have to blend the media with the media.

and president obama -- or king abdallah of jordan, a reformer, we have to deal with barry weiss -- last time we see hillary clinton after many years, ten years later. hungry, poverty, integrity and even today in jordan, 15,000, and people you must kill. when you go to the trash can take millions of dollars from jordan from the people, $5 million.

if i am hungry almost killed. thank you very much. [inaudible c conversations] >> hy em a student here at the center. i have a question about the role of al-jazeera in not supporting the revolution but supporting some revolutions. i was wondering what your thoughts were on al-jazeera's coverage of the syrian crisis

and lack of coverage. [inaudible] >> this is a revolution of consciousness. there has been a break with the past. but right now it does seem to be such a fragile situation. what do you think is going to happen in the long term? what will these young idealists prevail? will there be a democracy or theocracy in their -- >> okay. in the book i start with tunisia and egypt because there was something about how the revolution started there and more specific about them, the others and it was relatively more peaceful.

in both countries, in tunisia and egypt what we saw is a phenomenon that started in tunisia and criticized in egypt. that is interesting because there are two young people killed. one for political reasons. the need for political freedom. i don't know if you read this story but a young logger the deland activist, unemployed, uneducated. he was arrested -- not arrested. he was asked for his papers. people were looking for him.

two security people and the coffee shop, internet cafe in cairo. he knew they were coming after him. they beat him to death. it was quite gruesome. the interesting thing about it is they would kill a young man in an internet cafe. you don't do that because the word is bound to get out. there were too many bloggers watching their colleague being beaten to death. in tunisia a young man in his

own anger and frustration, being unemployed, and his car being confiscated and there was a story about -- expose the two pillars of the arab revolution and why they happen. political freedom and freedom from one. freedom of expression, freedom of movement and freedom from want. those were the two killers of the upheavals in the arab regime but the two pillars of what defined the commonality among the arab regimes whether they are totalitarian or authoritarianism. what is important about them is in the postcolonial era they

became repressive regimes politically and in the last decade they became more exposed if you will to a new liberal agenda that turned into open globalization, but corruption. you had at the same time total destruction of any thing called welfare state in the arab world and more and more oppressive regimes. i tried to describe in the book something of a duality of washington consensus policies with beijing consensus. quite repressive from the top and quite liberalized in a way that only allows for depression and corruption.

al-jazeera. we are all clear i am not speaking for al-jazeera. part of a discussion that goes on. i will be sharing with you some inside stories. we have meetings every day, every morning, every afternoon. weekly and monthly meetings and different voices are out in those meetings. my own experience the last six years is -- from the top or the top of top or whatever it is and what we put on the air. we do have this agreement within al-jazeera and i myself have to come out on the minority side, what has been taken. whether we call this that or

recovers this and how much we cover it but it seems that through it and open and changing discussion among the people of al-jazeera the personal why we would cover some things in certain situations different from others sometimes it is logistical. we are not allowed in syria. or bahrain. ..

the bahraini government threatened to sever relations with them. so did we pay enough attention to the 17 million egyptians are 18 million egyptians as we did the 300,000 bahrainis? probably not. probably we did much more. was there something taking on more of the sectarian, by default, not design necessarily or by design from the outside, not the inside door meeting saudi arabia and iran, perhaps. i'm not sure. was iran taking a different path than we have seen just before that in yemen and -- perhaps. did we not covered?

and ensure. did recover as much as i said before and others? no, we didn't. every decision we made and now we covered libya and bahrain the correct one to iraq hope not, otherwise to be divine. certainly not. i think we made a lot of mistakes. i'm not going to tell you which. but i think we made mistakes. human, right? it is 24 hours. it's not easy to fulfil all the requirements. anyway. by the way, short on the answers, can be. it's up to you. to in terms of the long-term question for egypt i came back from egypt having to spent the last ten days isn't. as i was saying earlier, i took -- i sat down for about an hour with the main islamist

brotherhood leader. i sat down also with a number of other leaders. i sat down with three, what i would like to think of as serious intellectuals. i set down with the three, you know, hands-on activists. and my impression is egypt is going in the right direction. my impression is -- and i keep telling that's, egyptians, some of them. upton mr. sometimes about how things are handled because of the way the supreme military council is dealing with this situation, as if there was no revolution. sometimes house certain ultraconservative islamists deal with the situation, speaker of football as simple, which, of course, you know, not a wise

thing to say anything to. the general impression i had is that there are many challenges that egypt faces today that have to do with forces that are highly democratic, such as the generals to, to a lesser degree the ultraconservative islamist. but i think they are on the defensive. the people in general -- and i would say the democrats in particular, the youth -- and i mean the ones who really want to break with the past and series the move forward. and i want to give you one example. thanks to the book had the chance to share some of my views with egyptian viewers on television networks. people don't think of it that way.

aided the general's and ultraconservative islamists are sincere in saying we want democracy, we want a civic constitution and support the civic state. there are sincere. i am comfortable with both. because in today's arab world, in today's egypt, if you must schmoozed democracy, if you must live that you really support democracy, if you must because that gives you -- makes you more popular, that's a good thing. insincere, that means they think of democracy, freedom, constitution, said the constitution or civic state as bigger than them, even though if you combine together you get something like 70 percent, for

example, of the vote in egypt. but questions of freedom and democracy. they need to continue to defend themselves when the questions of democracy and freedom in the civic state. that means they feel that their collective consciousness of the people on the question of democracy and freedom is bigger than they're electoral power. and i think that is a process that we see in the arab world. so if you look at the craft, if elected the graphic, if you look at the -- if you look at the evolution of how things happen of the last year so, what you see is the military council losing power. would you see is the internal, the infamous internal security service losing power. even today, a few days ago

interior square, down with the head. you know, the insults against the head of the military and egypt have gotten into such, you know, unacceptable levels that the whole idea of respect, the whole idea of a certain aura over political leaders is drawn. people just don't care. they're not afraid. they express themselves, and what these people to be just transitional. they do want to move toward a civic state. no one is lost party and no one military general is going to do with the government. a break with the passes happens. however happen, i don't think all, we are going to anything of a theological state, and all. i think egypt and the new generation has made a break with

the past and will not accept a repressive regime no matter how the college are what you college and under his name is. >> what if we watch on satellite dish. >> i like very much a presentation. level you have here. moving forward, not backward. but the idea with you in some sense that this is a break with the past. i mean, the genie is out of the ball now, and i don't think he can put it back. my other side, which is history. this is the fourth attempt at air revival.

the first was mama's. the second was world war one. the allied. then the second to -- the third came with this, not revolution. rather, i would call it to the top. this seems. ninety-one. end the 11. and now. now why this one, i can mention a few reasons why it's different. the new generation, a detachment of the old significant. it enhanced through technology

my belief. the old days there were saying, well, you know, the tv is breaking the airing generation from the old. so why this, in your view, would not assume the fee to for the first three attempts. >> a tip. there had a quick question. go back and forth. [speaking in native tongue] in different than her question the doe wants no but the connection. i had a wonderful experience.

i love shutting in the dark was a documentary, but i would like to hear your thoughts as to of the protest seems peaceful. why was there peace in the middle east, why would they cut out -- lots of threats going on as to why that occurred. the west intervention, all that kind of stuff, but i would appreciate your thoughts. >> i heard the other day talk about egypt. she was referring, saying that it was other revolutionary. it was back today top. that seems to be quite persuasive to me at this point because the army is still -- seems to me, to be in control of the oats manpower. you tell us a little bit on it, but if you could just expand on that.

>> on satellites. well, you know, i ask the same question. i am guest here. why isn't? i think probably cnn lobby against it because it will take over navy. certainly become more popular. there was an idea before. too hot, you know, to test by cable networks. maybe some of them, you know, have monetary interest. under insured. all i know is, again, i am not myself nowadays. as think we will be on the air in america said. already in washington and new york. our biggest asset is not how much promos' we do as people watch us. when people watch us as they have been in america you have

hillary clinton sang their real journalism. american networks need to catch up. so i think if you're here, you know, the sec be flattered. but i think certainly it will help. and the hope will be on their seen in america. you know, are you familiar jack the book throws you, the optimist. happy. ill-fated. pessimist optimist. so it is this tale of, you know, kind of a dramatic character sorts. but the idea is that in the collective consciousness of the

arab world because of some of the stuff he teston good news always pregnant with bad news. and that good developments are more likely to lead to bad developments or better results. always this idea that, you know, even when things get better, but somehow in the middle east reality, the most optimistic of all people, the arabs know deep in their heart there's something wrong. because of their experience, because of their collective experience i think maybe it's time to put it to rest. tennessee 1805 -- i see 1805 and the awakening.

i see in the 50's, i actually, positive developments. then again, you see, it's like no was using my antidote example. i don't think, you know, we need to think in terms of departure in terms of the revolution. but i can see there was a constructive developments. what happened in the early part of the 18th-century, what happened in the awakening of the late 20th century, these are important construction blocks, if you will, in the region. the general air of collective. and just as the postcolonial world, the 50's generation, the '40's and 50's's generation liberated the land, and a deliberate plan to.

this degeneration is liberating the human being. in between there was a defeat generation and the lost generation. so we have the liberation generation of the 1940's and 50's, the defeated generation of the 60's and 70's, and the lost generations of the 90's and the last. the post cold war era. now we have. i see that in terms of development of history. as i said earlier, passed in attendance in the book in the 1850's what he thought of the french revolution. he said, it remains to be seen. that was hundred years later. perhaps a joke. under insured. but certainly. [inaudible] yes. he probably said jokingly.

enough's @booktv done. [inaudible] >> this, but i believe the benefit of what's happening although i am worried about the contents. especially the prediction. we say when you predict those who predict the future there, in particular the middle east, through a crystal ball. so, you know, i'm not worried about this, but my memory is that libya, egypt, syria has into from any positive contribution. i do you are in their regime.

there is no colors. so this is worried about the presence. and will worries me more,. [inaudible] >> okay. that's fine. that's fine. >> an agreement. but the sense that idc -- and as i said, i don't end with, you know, roses and strawberry fields. i do and where fessing your seat belts. i see that it is going to be a speaking of the flights, this is going to be a lot of disturbance up in the air in the arab world. yet i see how they emptied the political life and how they put

together a political parties creating a civil society of sorts. i see that. but what i also see is that for the first time they're on the right -- and we must give some credit. i have a lot of hope with the idea of the new generation. i have been speaking to so many young people, and i say that in the open, jay z, egypt, yemen. there really have a lot to offer. i mean, it's amazing. the satellite media. new consciousness call whenever this. but i think this is generation has different ideas. it's not accepting more of the same shortcomings of the past. now, that does not mean that because, you know, they have good intentions that things a right to happen. all that i'm saying is that at least the region has broken with

the past, broken the barrier and now is going to start. now, let me share with you for me a very important thing about democracy. i've been working on this for many years. i just want to share with you just a quick, you know, know about that. especially because there is patronizing discourse in general . the question of democracy. democracies, since we know that democracy cannot be exported or transported on time, and since we also know that there is no such thing as waiting until democracy happens, and then when everyone is ready we conduct elections and put together institutions. that doesn't happen. what we know for fact is that democracy happens on the job. meaning, stalker see is a process. to you create democrats through

democracy, or do you need to create democracy to democrats? what we need to do, but that the same time. we can't wait for democracy. stuff like to come from nowhere. and we cannot -- we can recreate democrats out of democratic framework. so if we can start by making sure that we do have at minimum civic democratic constitution as we start of a tour processes. we allow political parties is a place. then, of course, the nine democrats and democrats, the religious and secular, but the marxist, communists, and liberals, but we are learning of the job. democracy is a process, learning curve, and we discarded it. that is better than waiting for democrats to put democracy to already for democracy to create democrats when it does exist. i like this dialectical process

of establishing democracy and democrat. there is no better time to do it now. exploiting, you know, the energy coming out from. on the question of, you know, i -- what i was saying earlier was that from what i have seen i think we covered this like we covered other situations. a question, and we're very careful about that. how we cover, what it means, how much is the revolution touching the question of minorities and so on and so forth. this deliver to the region because this cannot just be -- i mean, we are amusement. we are not an ngo. we should not be in a zeal.

there are developments in bahrain and there are developments in libya and syria. is not a question of whether the revolution is against their scenes. if you are, you know, because what is your television. we not. adult think we are. by default we might appear to be because as soon as you show the image of a child, you know come standing in front of a tank the viewer immediately from that image includes that, you know, this network can be very happy with the tank. by default. when you cover correctly repressive regimes, oppression dated a, barman of cities, when you lay of these images and you report that news you are, by default on the side of the people. in cases, for example, as i was saying earlier, syria, bahrain,

saudi arabia and ron are major players by design. the united states is a major player by design, the presence of the fifth fleet, you cannot discover that as if, okay, you know, how much are we with that peaceful diplomat. i don't think that -- we don't have that question. a recovering the story. howard covering the story. and these are the story. the give and the bad and a happy ending. the government and how we cover them. so i think we cover them, but as i said, i don't speak. from within let me tell you, we make mistakes, lot of them. the way we cover the news. thus normal as long as there are mistakes and not politics. robin weiss.

i was just with her. join us and so on and so forth. a revolution, and in the midst of the revolution there was. and that is why it's so complicated today. ally syria and libya family regime state and society. at least family regime as state is no one in the same. the people's power was so over sweeping this a with the ruling

family. they turned against. in the midst of the revolution that was clearly. so it did not happen of the blue. happen within the context of revolution, it's complicated. so the beginning, people were saying these are our soldiers, the great military, the military that is defending the revolution. so the military gain some time some credit for a short time, and that's over now. i tell you it's over. now, what does that mean? here is, again, another nuance. a sovereign country. egypt is that going to give up its army and military

establishment. a sovereign country. cares very much about the establishment. how the nuance of how to distinguish between a major establishment as 70 of the country and the generals and their associated and then another able to internalize the revolutionary change. and that's what the egyptians a dublin with today. how to make sure that the guard and military establish a because they need them for the future for their own sovereignty. this leaves of lettuce the clients of others. at the same time being able to move beyond the general and put the generals back in -- where they belong in the military offices of the street and out of the economy and of the public

and political life of the country. my sense this the military is on the defensive in such a way that it keeps -- it keeps explaining why it is these some privileges. the future just can't guarantee, you know, freedom from prosecution. they can just keep maybe some part of the economy where they have some privileges. the generals, you know. no they can keep controlling the government. even the government's going to go and a new one will come. they have to, you know, open the way ahead of the schedule. so the military is on the defensive. i agree. it was within the revolution, and i think now the revolution will overcome the generals.

>> on this optimistic, for the book signing. i want to thank marwan bishara. [applause] [applause] >> thank you. >> is there a nonfiction of barbecue like to see featured on book tv? send us an e-mail. or tweet us. twitter.com/booktv. visit booktv.org to watch any of the programs you see here on line. type the author or book title in the search bar on the upper left side of the page and click search. you can also share anything you see on booktv.org easily by clicking share on the upper left-hand side of the page and selecting the format. book tv strains live on line for 48 hours every weekend with top nonfiction books and authors.