who jeff duncan is. duncan is really the protagonists of my book in a lot of ways and on a couple of levels i think he is worth considering first is one of the more conservative tea party freshman he is distraught that serves the drink and the 100 told congress, but his experiences that other guy who is learning how to make himself known in the institution of a body of 435 and is clamoring about for a way to be more than just one of 435. so the tension between being powerful is a group in trying to absorb himself as an individual is present in the book. ..

he is the vehicle through which we learn how a bill is passed, how one who tries to exert oneself on a committee and the additional dimension of him becoming being voted by heritage action as the most conservative member of the entire body of 35 houses of representatives is to make. >> did that surprise you? >> not especially, no. she's from a very conservative

district, and when he ran for congress, he ran on a set of principles. all of these guys ran on a pledge to america though his was ratcheted up in the right to bear arms, the belief that god should be routed out of government what should be an enjoyable part of it so no, they were pretty clear to me. >> what is his view right now about 112th congress and the legislative process? >> guest: i think he was frustrated by it. he believed the republicans compromise too much, and that in the debt ceiling deal for example he didn't vote for it, didn't vote for a number of the continuing resolutions to use to fund and the government because the government was still spending too much, needed to be slashed more. in of this he parts company from

his own leadership, and what makes him relevant is that she's from a conservative district and that's fine he should represent them to the best of his abilities, but beyond that a couple dozen or so during conservative republicans have succeeded in dragging his entire party to the right to the point where the point they have passed have had to satisfy a lot of these conservative republicans and stand very little chance of being ratified by the senate and passed on for the president's signature. >> host: what is his view in the view of the republican freshman class of the speaker? >> guest: i think the are ambivalent. duncan is a little bit more charitable than a lot of the liberty party freshman who might spend time with. don genex banner personally but he doesn't feel any more than the other key party freshmen who

are of particular allegiance and this is where the 112 congress is different from say the congress that we saw during the new gingrich revelation. when he came and we had 70 something freshman. these guys were utterly beholden to read the contract with america, the tapes they would listen to to learn how to fund raise and message were completely absorbed by them and they were reliant on him. he was their fearless leader. boehner was not. he took note of the wave and he could either be crushed by you or surface and so if he did, to the point he became speaker of the house for the minority leader of the freshmen are well aware that he is not of that movement and that tension has also been present throughout the legislative session. >> host: we are talking with robert draper, this is his

newest book what we do in the u.s. house of representatives talking about 112 congress. the numbers are on the screen. mr. draper what is the number about alan west plays in the congress? >> guest: equal opportunity offender. west is without question the most famous of the 87 freshmen. he was a tea party sensation before he was every elected because in 2009 he gave his so-called bayonet speech in which he exhorted his audience to pick up their bayonets and charge the enemy to victory. but i say equal opportunity offender because even though he is very much a tea party freshman, i should mention he's from the fort lauderdale florida area. he wasted a very little time of setting a leadership. in fact i met with on a set of

"meet the press", and while we were doing this, david gregory of nbc asked him what things should be cut and he said everything including defense cuts. no sooner had we gotten an office that his cell phone rang and there was buck mckeon, the chairman of the house armed services committee saying what the hell are you talking about? and, you know, he wanted to be on the committee but nonetheless said i know where the low hanging fruit or. there are things that need to be cut. as soon as he did get to town, he took a look at the calendar that the majority leader had put forth by what involved for this session the congressman spending less time in washington and less time in their district, and he announced this is exactly backwards and we have so much to do and of course canada was

offended at that, too. but finally to your question he plays a role to the surprise of many and perhaps even to himself of convincing a number of freshmen there's no point in looking at the 100% solution, 70% is better than nothing and he was instrumental bringing freshman on board for the debt ceiling deal among others. >> host: a lot of sports metaphors, movie metaphors and military metaphors. >> guest: he was a colonel in the army, he was discharged in fact after a harsh interrogation that nearly led to a court martial imprisonment and i note in devotee of the time he was sworn into office he turned a different way. he would just be winding down a multi-year prison term in fort leavenworth, and i think he's a really remarkable guide for all the outlandish things that he says nonetheless he still sees

everything through the prism of the military, walks around with all of his information and all of his books and briefing papers and a helmet bag, still has the bearing of a guy from the army, and when he said qualms with leadership he's often compared them flauntingly to the military leadership that he himself has experienced. >> host: why do you devote a chapter to sheila jackson lee? >> guest: because i think congresswoman sheila jackson lee is emblematic first all of the progressive dynamic of the democratic party, so i think more than that, this thing that i pursued throughout the book of how entrepreneurs all try to get their piece of the pie. sheila jackson was very controversial in washington.

she isn't even well-liked among her democratic party in part because she insists on speaking on every subject and fifth on amending of rebuilding a republican or democrat which is democrats when they put their own bill out and expect full support and here she is fine-tuning everything. and also, she's pretty tough on her staff, and so she's not well liked and she's a very effective spokesman for the district in houston and his beloved and has won by margins of ranging from say 50 to 70%. so she, to me, is a good case study in how you can be sort of effective at home and thus remain in the house of representatives even as you bring all your own allies. >> host: this morning reporting on speaker boehner's appearance on state of the union

on cnn. job more difficult all the earmarks to pass out. >> guest: there's a number of them in my book in which he says that same thing, one of them to the oldest congressman, and there's a point during the vote in which she comes up and says you know it's not the same without year marks. we can't herd the cats the way we used to. there's also the moment senior members of the appropriations committee are registering their discontent because so many freshmen and so many more senior conservative members have been voting against continuing resolutions bills that the appropriations committee had worked very hard to put together, and the senior members, senior appropriators say to speaker boehner you can't let them get away with this need to punish the minister of them of their assignments and the

vacation overseas trips and she says no we can't do that that will only make martyrs out of them. speaker boehner has an expression that he says when you say follow me and you look over your shoulder and no one is behind you you're not leaving you just take the loss. it's temperamentally suited but it also sort of is emblematic of how difficult it is for him to leave. >> host: how would you describe the relationship between speaker bonior and nancy pelosi? >> guest: they have a working relationship, but let's face it, things have been so divided right now that it's not as if -- i mean there were times during the shooting of gabriel giffords when they were in coordination,

whenever there are other sort of housekeeping duties relating to the body itself, the two and their staff or in communication, and this is evident throughout the book, they are the only time that the republicans reach out to the democrats when suddenly a last minute they realize they don't have a vote and it's not boehner communicating to pelosi, its house majority whip rather plaintively to the house minority whip steny hoyer. >> what are the takeaways from people that read the book? >> guest: i set out to do a book that was experiential as much as anything else. i was on election night in the midterm so struck by the 87 freshmen who would be taking office is only a third of whom had no political experience whatsoever had never held

elective office. so to chronicle mr. smith goes to washington kind of way how these guys would fare, to what degree they would change the institution. i spent a lot of time sort of in putting myself on the freshman as well as the senior members and members of the democratic side of the aisle. but along the way, in covering their experiences, i covered the more sweeping narrative of the 112 congress, and i think there's almost no way to interpret that narrative as one of jay terrible -- one of a terrible dysfunction, and that was particularly present in the debt ceiling standoff, and in the book i think there's finally sort of a case study in that while the same time being a pretty vivid narrative of all of these congressmen who seek to

put their imprint on an institution. >> host: finally before we go to calls how would you describe the relationship between the house democrats and president obama? >> guest: it's better now. yet it has been better since his jobs bill now speech to the joint session in september of last year. previous to that, it was lost a good relationship. i shouldn't say it was a bad one, but the democrats felt they were giving away the store. they certainly felt that during the debt ceiling a deal but even before then, the president and january of 2011 gave a speech about winning the future and investing in america. the was the narrative the white house was trying to peddle but they basically lost their grasp of that narrative within days and what became the prevailing narrative was instead cut. democrats were very dissatisfied, democrats and the house. the head president obama so

quickly lost his edge and basically was trampled narrative lee speaking by the push by republicans to roll out the government. >> host: robert draper is our guest do not ask what could we do inside the house of representatives is the book. previously, mr. draper has written another best seller, did certain, the presidency of george will you bush, longtime correspondent for gq contributing writer to "the new york times" magazine and to national geographic now. first call for him, jacksonville florida on the democrats' line. good morning. >> good morning, gentlemen we have the republican congress, the worst congress in american history. okay, proceeded by the worst presidents in american history, there would be george bush. let's look at the track record for the republicans.

they come in with their little places, grover norquist we aren't going to raise taxes on anybody first thing they did, george bush tax cuts raised by $4 trillion. >> host: why don't you bring all of this to conclusion. where are you going? >> caller: the problem i have is if they don't want to raise taxes, okay, they have the right and budget cuts four or $5 trillion. they got 90% income you're not going to cut that. >> host: robert draper come anything to respond to? >> guest: as to the republicans and what they were up to in the 112 congress, the

argument has been made, certainly is an argument they would make that they were responding to a movement and to the will of the voters in the 2010 the election that basically had a mandate as a result of the voters turning the house back over to the republican party to roll back the obama administration. they said what the voters were saying was enough. too much government. the $780 billion stimulus, this massive health care bill the democrats can't even explain or much less defend is much more than we bargained for, particularly in an economically difficult time. they interpreted that, the result of the mandate to be just as i describe it. the problem is that it was divided government. it's not as if the government

exclusively over to the republicans the democrats control the senate and of course barack obama is a democrat as well, so with the pri believe the republicans proceeded to do rather than attempt to govern or to pass legislation out of the house would likely gain the approval of the senate and the signature of the present day pass legislation for to the right about anything the democrats could stomach and as a result the majority leader harry reid but those bills languish in the senate and essentially it occurred. >> host: after spending the time you did in the house of representatives, do you leave with the same amount of respect, less respect, more respect? >> guest: in a lot of ways, peter, it's a good question. i am ambivalent as the average american. on the one hand, i really like a lot of the congress that i spend time with on both sides of the

aisle. on the other hand, i was dismayed by their performance and continue to be as dismayed as most americans, and i thought a lot about what the solution might be. it is a real paradox that house is the most space institution that we have come and yet it is perhaps the most loath institution that we have and it's reached a record low of 9% approval rating in this past december, october inspiring john dingell who served in the house longer than anybody and its history to say i think even pedophiles could do better. when the public registers such a discussed in institutions and allows this behavior to continue when it has an opportunity every two years to change the makeup of the house is something of an electoral puzzle.

it's been a while. the millionaire team party must legislate anything that will touch the bottom line. i think the american people have seen with their corporate agenda is and i think they will have a difficult time working against the average american citizen they've been legislating for the top 2% as far as their tax policies and everything else. >> guest: you may be right some of these guys will get voted out of office but the republicans got lucky that the 2010 elections coincided with the national census and thus the

reapportionment that takes place and with it congressional redistricting. as a result of this most states are controlled by the republican state legislatures and they got to redraw the congressional maps and they did so in a way the would benefit a lot of these republicans including the so-called tea party freshman. along than a guy that i spent a lot of time within this book in corpus christi the one in 2010 in the district that had been, had a democratic representative solomon ortiz for something like i think 14 terms, 28 years. the district is 70% hispanic and ortiz himself is hispanic. but in 2010 the hispanics largely stayed home until prevail by something like 800 votes as a result of their great tea party support.

but now in 2011 and in 2012, would have to somehow figure out how to appeal to all these voters that are likely to turn out in 2012 was we thought. instead of redistricting took place and he's now been handed an altogether different district one in which the hispanic portion has been sliced away and that a republican can comfortably inhabit the next ten years. so he's kind of an example by regardless of their performance a lot stay in office. >> host: marcus is a republican in pensacola florida. you are on with robert draper. >> guest: good morning gentlemen. i enjoy your show quite often and i am enjoying listening to you this morning. i think the tea party is getting a bad rap. people are very misunderstood.

my question to mr. draper this morning is in reference to congressmen west. do you feel like congressman west was a good running mate for mitt romney, and at the same time, why does this democratically controlled senate seemed to have such an accord for getting our house in order in this country, they seem to vote down every good bill that republicans, along with. >> guest: related to alan west what isn't going to be the running mate, the ranch that i don't have and furthermore, congressman west and i have talked about this at length, not interested in being president or vice president right now still learning the propes and from

florida, florida obviously being a big state he tends to say things off the cuff that make more news than the mitt romney campaign would like to suffer from a running mate. as to the other question relating to the senate, it's a good question, the senate was through the 100th of congress has been thoroughly infuriating to the republicans in the house. harry reid, senate majority leader made a strategic decision early on that rather than negotiate with the republicans in the house, he was likely going to let all of their bills languish. why? first because he really believed there was no point in negotiating with them and he believed that they were intent on dragging america further to the right to then the democrats

could abide but second she believed on the messaging level it made more sense to leave the republicans out there and frame them as extremists rather than dignify them as it were as negotiating. by understand the frustration of not only members of the republican house but also americans as a whole for that strategic decision it seems very cold and cynical. but we will see in november whether or not it's effective, whether or not harry reid will be punished and his fellow democrats for basically stiff arming the house legislation and whether that effort to paint republican legislation as extremist legislation is going to bear fruit. >> host: robert draper's book is published press do not ask what could we do where did you get the title?

>> guest: from a title named fisher ames, the great orator of congress served in the first federal congress in four terms overall. he's from massachusetts and crafted the final language to the first amendment to read he was in failing health but large part due to the stress put on him in the house and decided he wasn't going to write any more and he wrote to a friend of his talking about the partisan disagreements in the house and he wrote do not ask what could we do that is not a fair question in these days. in choosing the title of wanted to underscore that the partisanship and division have always been with us. nonetheless back in the days the managed in the first session despite fights between the federalists and antifederalists to stand up and executive branch, federal judiciary and

payback the war debt and then for good measure to write and pass the bill of rights so they could get a lot done in spite of their disagreements whether that is the case now. >> host: does representative boehner need to watch his back with representative kantor? >> guest: that's a good question, and it's a question that is central to ian anecdote within my book during old debt ceiling standoff when a number of allies in the house come to him and say you need to be careful with your negotiations with obama. if you come up with something that can only manage to get what say half of the votes of the republicans in the house, then there's a good chance there could be a mutiny against you and don't think that eric cantor wouldn't like to see that three of his staff is already spreading rumors about you and trying to foment divisions and john, you were running during the new gingrich days when there

was a mutiny against him to read it only takes a dozen or so to do it. i think that ultimately canter and boehner have been on the legislative matters and i think that he has watched himself a great nabil board than the approval ratings the house has accumulated. he's been far less aggressive, even obsequious. nonethelessve, even obsequious. nonetheless, does he know that he's an ambitious guy the would like to be the speaker one day? absolutely. >> host: without kevin mccarthy? you seem to spend a lot of time with him. >> guest: the reason is kevin mccarthy, the majority whip was a guy tasked with hurting the cats as it were particularly the freshmen. the whip is a guy that tries to get people together to vote on the republican legislation, to try to get the requisite 218 votes to pass a bill and this became a very difficult job and

all the more so since we were leading to before, peter, they don't have the carrot and stick of earmarks and things like this to move people. i was also interested in mccarthy because he himself is an ambitious guy. hard to say exactly what his game is i'm not even sure he knows it, but she's only served in the house for two terms before he became the third most powerful republican in the house of representatives and so i was interested in his letter claiming as well as his struggle to bring the freshmen together to convince them of the virtues of teamwork and unity to get republican bills passed. >> host: to describe his relationship with john boehner? >> guest: i think it's a pretty good one. he has worked hard to cultivate a relationship. they've known each other since mccarthy was actually the district director to bill thomas, a powerful house ways

and means chairman republican, and furthermore, he's well aware that mccarthy knows the freshman better than anybody else. he recruited a lot of the freshmen and has used his office as an unofficial flophouse basically for the newcomers to hang out, and so boehner takes the temperature frequently of mccarthy to find out where the rest is.

dave obstruct good american people and this is from day one. all these lives on president obama and everything. a black man became president. they have done nothing. they have done nothing. they have done nothing our leaders spirit host of days, we our leaders. a host of days, we got the point. robert draper. >> guest: for one thing, dave, you're writing about a prologue i thought about the type of place about a meeting of about 15 or so indeed all white males. congressman, senators and other

republican leaders put together a freight lines and newt gingrich. it was held at the caucus room. this is not meant to be some dark conspiracy. it was republicans look in their weapons, drowning sorrows. and they had just done that the inoculation and they're awestruck from a partisan standpoint devastated. these 1.8 million people wondered now we can show nothing. what are we going to do? in the course of this meeting of its kind of like the seven stages of dad, five stages of death. they sort of went through denial and then recognize that they have lost their way, that they been on principle and then finally began to talk about how they would dig their way and the way to do so with the unified in their attacks against the obama administration to attack

vulnerable democratic congressmen, to attack cabinet members. and again, due to the negative side unanimous manner with the hopes of in 2010 taking over the house and then using the house as the pitchfork or whatever is the point of despair against the obama administration. and you mentioned grover norquist. norquist is mentioned in number of times in the book is key because of his no new taxes pledge. because of the freshman, no one had to put a gun to their heads to get them to sign a no taxes pledge. these guys are very anti-tax and were determined to lower taxes, roll back government spending,

eliminate obamacare appears to norquist was in lockstep with them, but i don't think he had to be the least bit coercive. >> host: you described three kinds of congressmen. what are they. just go this is going to be a rick perry question. one is a congressman who is a congressional leader. who is like saying canter or mccarthy. another is a committee chairman who uses one of these house committees as their kind of easton, that the third is a congressmen who just been this content to represent his district. and that elicitation of the three types of congressmen with given to me actually by tom delay, who himself had been a leadership guy. but i use it in the vote to apply to john dingell who had been for 30 years the most powerful democrat on the energy

and commerce committee and had used energy and commerce and really built up that committee into one of the great fortresses of power, but then he was challenged and ultimately take note of leadership by his fellow democrat, by nancy pelosi and henry waxman andrew estevez dolts had to content himself with being a congressmen at the third category, a guy who basically was in charge to his district. but as the book makes it clear come at the ripe old age of 85 stillness etiquette inkstand. >> host: mike on the republican line. robert draper as their guest. >> guest: compliments to you and c-span on brian lamb. you guys do a wonderful job. mr. draper, good morning. i wonder if you have a candid opinion of representative in arizona. the district depending on her district, do you have new note david schweiker? >> guest: i don't know him

well. he's now one of the guys have focused on, but schweiker was -- he was kind of a born and insight aside to republican leadership and in fact had been on the wiki man was kicked out because he voted one way, even as his majority with kevin mccarthy was asking him to whip and convince people to vote the other way. i also mentioned in the book -- wait for an gabby gets hers got along well and that in fact as one of her last acts as congresswomen, she happened to run into schweikert and gave him a two at the capital and then went home the next day and of course the terrible tragedy occurred. but beyond that, those are -- i think those are the only mentions that schweikert gets. >> host: isn't he in a primary right now at dan quayle?

>> guest: i don't know when it's scheduled. it's interesting because the dan quayle was elected largely by saying barack obama is the worst president of my lifetime came in congress, nobody thought he would be thrust into a primary where he would find himself having to defend his conservative credentials. it was clear the sky was a conservative but schweiker managed to get to his right and so the results of that had been one of the more emotionally wracking for the republicans within the house primaries that will be saying that kerry met with the scheduling. >> host: here is the cover of the book, "don't ask what good we do" robert draper is the author. chicago won the democratic fine. you're on the air. >> caller: mr. draper, i want to comment on my assessment of the current house. the republicans are still showing that they really have no idea about how the government is

going. i think he did speak to senator reid's position on how to deal with the house. but i think they confirmed his action by what they did with the debt ceiling. they created debt ceiling crisis and in the end they could have a carrier vote to bring it to resolution. the democrats had to carry the boat on the debt ceiling crisis that they created. you have a house -- republican house to get legislation passed. they have no accomplishments for the time they've been in there. there's a syndication of where i know you disagree, but there have to be able to get things accomplished in a don't have a clue on how to do that. >> guest: let's talk about the debt ceiling situation because it demonstrates the quandaries

therein and the desire to in fact get things done. when despite what the results might indicate. when the 87 freshmen went through their orientation, frank luntz the pollster and this is all detailed in my book happened to us for nepal show of hands come he says how many of you people, incoming freshman congressman would raise the debt ceiling? for people raised their hand. he said okay. how many would under no no circumstances should the debt ceiling? the other 83 raise their hand. leadership means eric cantor, kevin mccarthy, john bandar knew this was a problem. they knew whether they would say so publicly or not been as boehner said in a republican conference, a closer conference of the armageddon if economically speaking they fail to raise the debt ceiling. and so it he came a great exertion on the part they had

these listening session in which they would try to explain to the freshmen republicans with the debt ceiling was and what concessions perhaps they could extract from democrat to pay in return for voting to raise the debt ceiling, despina carrots along with the state. it still didn't take them two weeks before the august 2nd deadline, the republican leadership was sufficiently to earn that a lot of the freshmen as well as senior conservatives were getting the message they brought in a former treasury official in the third george herbert bush with jay powell and heidi exclaimed passionately what would happen, august 2nd if they fail to raise the dead feeling and sort of took them through the narrative of all the

federal prisons would be closed in people's work is just her seriously skyrocket. about a third of the social security recipients would not receive paychecks on and on. and then people in the conference stood up and began to scream and say how dare you give this presentation. you should be talking about the evils of spending. you should be talking about the need to live within our means, not talking about all this stuff. so this is that the republican leadership had to deal with. you can't feel too sorry for them. speaker boehner would be minority leader boehner at the work for these 87 freshmen who won in 2010. at the same time be careful what you ask for a situation that these guys were much further to the right, much more extreme in their thinking than leadership knew what to do with vis-à-vis the debt ceiling and it took a

lot of heavy lifting to get the votes that they did get to finally raised the ceiling. >> host: robert draper wrote it drove the republican party must await under stood languidly, shrugged his shoulders come in the seats at the capitol hill club were all part shows with the cycling paths and the general acted as if the rights of nancy pelosi and barack obama was all part of the plan. he was never going to be an advocate of uptight discipline like his lieutenant eric canter, for he hurled virginia lawyer who is tight with calculation and poised as a cobra. during his january 5, 2011 speech on the house floor to introduce the rules that govern the body at the 112 congress, canterwood proclaimed that the republican-controlled congress would hold ourselves accountable by asking the following questions. are our efforts addressing job creation in the economy? are they cutting spending? are the shrinking the size of

the federal government for protecting and expanding individual liberty? if not, why are we doing it? >> guest: yes, and in that very areas of questions that became a plaque that she would find run the capital republican offices in the day about it cantorial rule. and canterwood said things were hotwired to the tea party than boehner was and he recognized that this was a conservative movement that to some degree was the tiger they had a detail, but something they could exploit. boehner recognize that, too. owners of the debt ceiling as a moment in which they could extract dramatic concessions from the democratically controlled white house and he could play the tea party freshman as a bargaining chip. i didn't find any examples have

been explicitly saying that book i got a bunch of hot-blooded guys over there. you're going to love it as follows. if you really want us to vote for this guy to give us an things. this was explicitly said that eric canter. there's a moment in night book and was stranded the biden talks with her discussing revenue increases, canter says that it is something we are prepared to do it all. biden says than what do we get out of this? he says you you get a vote in the debt ceiling. that may not sound like much, but the fact we have a lot of members who feel like failing to raise the debt ceiling is exactly what we need. kantor says with assumption grahams were working to educate our guys. >> host: judy, please go ahead with your question for robert graber. >> caller: my question is simply on the idea of compromise everyone is always talking about. i would just like the mental

image and i want to go to use them he wants to go west. where is the compromise? we can go north or south for straight up or straight down if they're not going to get us where we want to go come over bester land land where we are and not go any place until we can figure out. and so compromise is not necessarily a good thing if it gets is constantly going to the wrong place for nobody wants to be. and i see that when people talk about legislation, why don't they compromise? i hurt them say if anyone is happy with this compromise in a current thinks it bad, it's probably a good thing. i thought no, you probably just have the worst allen and instead of the best that might have made both sides a little bit happy. and so it do-nothing congress is not necessarily a bad thing if it stops us from doing the wrong thing. >> guest: the analogy

appealing to a point bb does not apply. often people refer to the craft of legislating as stated more akin to sausage making. it's not a particularly appetizing to look at. the reality is the nation's business has to be tended to. for example the house control is the hers. they have to decide on a budget or if they can't decide on a budget they have to at least be able to pass a continuing resolution said the government can pass. maybe you'd be a great thing if they shut down that the government has shut down before. if you shut down overlength that time, it would mean the federal prisons would cause and there'd be no infrastructure and people would feel to receive their social security checks, et cetera. the reality is that costs money to run a country.

so i'm doing this, when there is a divided government, when there's democrats to control one of the sides of the legislative branch and the other controls the other they have to compromise. there is no getting around it. having settled that, i do take your point that there are -- there are a lot of people who believe it is exactly the sort of compromising that is endemic to a good old boy system where everybody gets a little bit of what they want and to god about the public, but often mutual back scratching is basically part of the problem. a lot of freshmen believe this as well. they believe that in fact one of them said to congresswoman joann amerson, who is a moderate republican, she was upset by

this attitude that the debt ceiling didn't need to be raised and she asked us one of the freshmen, what is this about exactly? at a website to make is dangerous because it will make me angry. was the tea party position? the explanation is that he spent too money. if this is the consequence we have to bear, so be it. there is the sentiment they are, but amerson's point of view is okay, that sounds like really teaching us a lesson. roiling the financial markets and causing us to default is maybe not the prescription. >> host: robert draper is less returned to jeff duncan in the in god we trust to be. >> guest: yeah, while the counter rule is we should be focused like a laser on the economy and reducing the size of federal spending on tax reform cannot thought we should be doing.

otherwise what exactly are we have two? that is the cantor rule. then comes in god we trust, the legislation put on the floor by one of the virginia congressman and it's not actually duncan who talks about it, but allen west. allen west was perturbed by this spirit he thought this this is exactly the the kind of thing that makes congress as a whole, even the republican leadership as well a laughingstock. the y with 9.19% unemployment at that particular time and y with other issues that we even bothering with the law that would ratify in god we trust? and in fact, allen west gave a speech on the floor of congress in which she apologized to his constituents and to the nation for the lethargy, the lack of focus that his own leadership was expanding. >> host: charles republican

shreve work, robert draper is our guest talking about the 112 congress. >> caller: god bless c-span, god placed the tea party and allen west. there's $16 trillion. we have got to get our hands around it, democrats and republicans. that is all there is to it now. we've got to get it worked out great going to be the downfall of this country. my next comment, are we going to have a follow-up book on the people leaving the democratic party? i'm talking about mr. shula said he could not be a democrat no more. i would love for you to read a book on now. you are more or less just a democratic hack now so let's get that out there. >> guest: i'm actually a registered independent you could argue i'm a hack of, but not

enough tack. i'm not sure that sheeler said he couldn't be a democrat anymore. what he did say was that the democratic party wasn't as hospitable as it once was to blue dot democrats such as themselves. schuller, we spent a fair amount of time with for this book with the administrative cochair of the blue dogs a fiscal conservative, moderate on social issues. and he was chagrined very much so that nancy pelosi remains the house democrats and registered his protester on the phone. i do long conversation with about it and ran against kerry. however, he is not raining anymore because it got redistricted by the republican-controlled state register in north carolina to an extent that his sword at -- the

progressive crown jewel, asheville and i know this because i used to live in nashville has been stripped away and would've had a lot of trouble getting reelection. so recognize the growing that moderate democrats have had in his wing and he has other things he can do at this time from the sheeler to bail out. >> host: is there a second book? cc followed up after the 2012 election? >> guest: i don't know. i've become really interested in the institution in the history of the institution as well and did a lot of research that could make it into this book. as engaging as they found a lot of characters, it's also dispiriting to read about bodies that does not function. i had figured that would be 87

freshmen coming and that there would be aliment of attacking the obama white house that the house might come to that resembles the road wrestling federation, but he still did not think that it would be a body of stalemates to the degree that it has been. it has been the characters are really colorful, but the outcome is a tough one to cover. whether or not for that matter readers could stomach another 300 or so page narrative on that remains to be seen. >> host: greensville, north carolina, you're on with robert draper, author of "don't ask what good we do." >> caller: thank you. i think that we really recognize the significant have been

needing that the top 15 republicans. i think they actually do have said their one goal would make this one president failed one of the things that looked like they decided to do this is a record about how un- everything the president and only if the goal was to make the president failed and people didn't make any difference in the end. >> guest: well, the goal was to regain power. it's a distinction without a difference. pentagon, i've reported this at length in my book truth is that

the reporters have written about this before, but it's a paragraph here come the paragraph there. i interviewed most of the 15 participants and that a granular sense of what happened. again it wasn't business areas needing her the great power inserted behind the curtain decides what's going to happen in america. it's a bunch of guys who have gotten their kicked lately and as frank went bad when he gathered and several relevant hourly mansel weakness will sit around and be with all of it together. but in the course of these guys been politicians and competitors began to talk about how to get their power back. yes, it is true. nowhere in this conversation was let's find ways to work with this president. those incentives find ways to undercut him. i make that in the prologue by saying one thing not mentioned during the course of this four-hour dinner was a state of america at that time and of course to be fair to the republican, the democrats in

many ways in 2009 behaved as if they didn't care. passing a cap-and-trade out of the house, which was maybe a politically ill advised things to do because it is destined to fail in the senate seems patently dissident to moderate democrats who were wondering if people are worried about the job situation. they're worried about the economy. what does passing a bill that has to do with greenhouse gases is laudable, but maybe there's a time for her. democrats didn't care either, which played right into the republican narrative that was fashioned that evening on an inaugural night, which is what are the democrats going to overplay their hand clinics they will be too exuberant about dean in control over everything and allow us to say that the democrats really don't care about you and hard-working struggling americans care about the government agenda. the democrats walked right into

it. >> host: book grade would you give president who promised congressional management skills relative to other presidents? >> guest: relative to the president is trickier, but assuming that all grades have an element of relativity to them, i would give him a c. minus maybe. he certainly had tried to fashioned deals with speaker boehner, i don't think that there have been nearly as much out reach with democrats. i should mention as well that he even has upset progressive democrats would think would've been right in line with them such as the congressional black caucus tonight to go to go someplace in the book would have a chairman of the cbc, emanuel cleaver has dealt with a lot of frustrations during the course of the 112 congress, not least of them dealing with alan west having a republican in the midst

of the cbc, particularly this republican he made offensive about another abc member, keith ellison happens to be a muslim. but what exactly were the most was that the obama administration, even without the explicit prating of the republicans was cutting back on creative block grants and thinks he felt were really important to minority communities. and furthermore there is a program that chairman cleaver was instigating along with several republicans to address areas of persistent property. and when he took this to the president and said speaker boehner is on board with this, budget committee chairman paul ryan is on board, the president tried to dissuade him, cleaver from passing the persistent poverty initiative.

and so progressives in other words have also had problems with obama as well as republicans. having said that, that should see the difficulty. key to sit here and say you should do a better shot, but there's a limit to congress to try to deal with. >> host: one of the fun tidbits i found in your book is emanuel cleaver of japan ceiling are good friends. guests at japan ceiling as the chairman of republican conference, an up-and-coming texas republican has done on the super committee. maybe people hold that against him, maybe not. that emanuel cleaver would've been the mayor of kansas city grew up in texas which is about 35, 40 miles outside texas. i know more about this stuff than i should. it's were very close.