bill noss "don't ask, don't tell" so there were two goals in doing this project and it's a huge success. ..

>> my book argues actually the most effective governance by the national government over our history is hidden in plain sight. >> what is the context of hamilton's remark? >> he wrote to to a correspondent it was in the context of how do we get to the new nation to appreciate

the importance of government. we were founded on republican government by the people without a crown with a strong executive branch but hamilton was very interested in how we get the people to respect the army or the foreign powers to respect us. if we don't have a powerful army or the trappings of authority people will never really bite into the government. >> host: he was wrong? >> i think so. the most effective forms of governance from the national

government through mechanisms of taxation other countries used excise taxes reduce the tariff imbedded in the price of goods see you cannot see the cost broken out and where do we correct those? literally offshore before the ships arrive we had customs houses but they were confined to large metropolitan areas and that agents were littered the meeting the ships out of sight. >> host: what years duke cover? >> roughly 1770 through 1910. however the boca syndications for today. >> host: in the period

that you cover would dart examples of the government in sight? >> the best is the size of the u.s. postal service towards the front of the british and the tocqueville when he came over in the 1830's was stunned in the american words people are better informed because they got the news carried by the u.s. postal service. the next question is how come we accepted the u.s. postal service?

a couple of reasons. the postal service was laundered through local officials. and the person end sitting in the store who collected the mail was often a relative of a person in a key political party. it was very a much as joint operation. even though the funding came from the local government we use a lot of contractors. those to carry that male. that provided a lot of jobs and incentive for people to write the postal service. we know the story of the

pony express private sector ingenuity, the pony express is a set up job to get contracts carrying the mail. the reason they rode the horses out west was to get the long term regular contract. it is that kind of ongoing relationship between the localities and the private sector, churches, a charitable groups, in conjunction with those groups that is our americans like to govern. >> host: you write

professor for most americans living in the mid-19th century but it was civil society that forged the nation and america is history that capped government at today to create a national unity. >> bright. all those factors hot were important but americans thought the market was natural especially moving into the second half was a construction of the national government especially the court system. take something as simple us across state lines. we're familiar with the

story of corporate hackers and farmers come with a large meatpackers operating in chicago beginning to process the fan package to send it across state lines. local poachers were not so happy. in a number of states, they argued it is on healthy. cattle needed to be inspected on site to. state health inspections inspections, along held prerogative only when the supreme court decided late 19th century fair interpretation of the commerce clause that beef

could be shipped. no supreme court decision, and no armor, this is a key industry after the civil war. new supreme court decision or known national market rescinding so important. another decision that is very relevant today, one that interpret the 14th amendment and intended to give the freed slaves a full

set of rights. that was applied to corporations probe the supreme court even with our explaining why simply decided the corporation are people giving a full set and allow them to extend their power to create a national market. which made america great. house you can around states' rights in the tradition of individual rights? without the supreme court decisions we would not have the national market. >> host: how did people react or adhere to the supreme court decisions? if you are an ohio?

>> ruutu that i talked about there was very little reaction even though it defied along standing set of obligations that should be regulated. there's a lot of protests by local butchers that are not happy of the national meet processors but the court system had a mechanism that was called the district court system. those judges were products of the political party. they helped to ameliorate to

split the difference between the strident nationalist and interpreted key cases to maintain local preference to seven what was the effective for national unity with the war of 1812? >> if i had to have one factor with the visible growth of the state is war. with the war of 1812 i would

cite to two things jefferson felt americans would rally around his plea that they remain neutral and not trade with the warring enemies of britain and france. american pursues the self-interest so jefferson and needed to impose an embargo. this is like rick santorum and imposing a draconian income tax. jefferson was supposed to be against government regulation the one who wanted to get government out of your life rieti had to impose the embargo and draconian step for one who

did not like the interference but after the war a more important development of former democrats and republicans came together around the american system built on national funding for roads and canals to help create to that market that was national federal subsidies to build the roads and canals the help to create the market as americans can come together in support of a strong national rose economic development of course, we were all about that. something else it did

although not terribly visible, to make way and secure how? remove been the zero were killing in the hands. talk about a week's date we forget the powerful role the there replaced with in the in removal. up becomes secondary to the natural expansion of population of the market. the pressure for expansion was there heavily subsidized through lots of loans and

the thinking about the baking and credit crisis what happened in the panic of 1820s when the settlers could not payback the federal loans? of chris voted for extension after extension. today that is the equivalent not just bailing out to the auto companies but bailing out individual mortgage holders. we would do that if we felt it was essential to grow our economy are the severe rachel crisis. >> host: rihanna's of think about was a fair

economics and rugged individualism? >> no. was a fair economics we think of the gilded age from the end of reconstructions through the 1890's. the philosophy of laissez-faire was prominent there was a talk about it and an effort to implement and sort out the public and private with these categories and it failed miserably. by the beginning of the progressive era it was understood the read needed to play a role in transportation and definitely in for a policy

to ensure the regime of free trade remained to actively open in places like china so it argued that era that we think about the baseline is one of the most exceptional moments in american history. back to colonial times you have hundreds of regulations you cannot dance or play cards a lot of economic regulations were their prices? we move forward in the 20th century of the

emergence of a mixed economy where the government takes computers. you have a laptop or a smart phone. computers were the product of federal research and development during world war ii and the internet is the product of administration research program. the developed the internet because i'm sorry because they wanted to communicate during a nuclear straight straight -- nuclear straight for our i am here to tell you how gore did not invent the internet with the military did. >> host: at what point* to restock referring to ourself

as virginians were as americans? >> here in the commonwealth plan not sure we ever stopped but the vast majority? i think they began to think of themselves as americans first between the spanish-american war and the late 1890's and the end of world war i with that national intervention abroad most thought of themselves but what powers that corresponds to the rise of

the american economy belt expanding overseas and a more continuous a gateman to with the world and we are more likely to think of ourselves in contrast. the other is the telegraph and of the wire services. the associated press could carry the same story pretty quickly to mississippi and concord and hampshire had an important impact to think

themselves as one nation. nothing like television or cable or satellite television that brought the 24/7 coverage right now we think yourselves less as americans with the instantaneous basis if not c-span bet on blogs and on twitter. >> host: we're talking with university of virginia professor brian balogh "a government out of sight" we're on the campus to seven rihanna grounds of the university of virginia.

how with the ball or the federal government used as a political issue 1770? >> there was only one issue that was debated of the government through 1865 which is the very no issue was debated more than the proper role of the national government the debate started is the united states bank constitutional and carry through the end of the 19th century of what really constitutes a corporation can they conduct commerce across state lines?

should the national government provide welfare? user hotly debated issues including should it provide pensions to survivors of the civil war? we did that and magnanimous fashion but implicit was we provide it to the norris but not the south. >> host: what is on the cover of your book? >> then national capital early 19th century. definitely an artist's rendition. i wanted to pick an image to convey the fear of

losing -- looming presence look at the bottom half of the book you see trees. than a fence than cows grazing on the lawn. >> host: what do teach year? >> u.s. history, and he chain a lecture class called digitize saying america and it looks at the key developments 1983 the lens of the information revolution. >> host: teaching contemporary but right about 19th century?

>> i set out to write an introduction to a book and i remember i was a fellow at the woodrow wilson center. i was not a scholar but courted would an early historian was there i called him professor would. i am writing a book about the 20th century and introduction of the role of government of the 19th century. could you recommend a few books? he said don't start of the 19th century. you never get to the 20th century. it is true. if their readers barrault or by the book and open the

pages they will see it is written to address the real debates we have today over the proper role of government to put into historical perspective. >> host: brian balogh and the author of "a government out of sight" the mystery of national authority in nineteenth-century america" this is booked tv on c-span2 >> joining us now with the director of education for the intercollegiate studies institute. what it is isi. nonprofit foundation bill buckley was the first president. and mission is to educate for liberty to go to college

students to provide the intellectual foundation of their conservatism. >> host: but you publish books? look at this one reading the right boectual foundation of their conservatism. >> host: but you publish books? look at this one reading the right book. >> he has done a huge service a lot of students don't know why they are conservative to say to be a smart conservative you need to read these books ideas have consequences to name a few teeseven matthew spalding has a book out. >> we are excited because it is not only important tremor

but we still hold the truce that we hold to be self-evident? why 40 percent of happiness. he is a senior scholar at heritage linking principles with current policy teeseven how do publish books? >> people said us proposals we have been publishing 20 years. one of the big books is from rick santorum it takes a family but he was a senator from pennsylvania wanted to put forth his vision how to make