would be hungry today if not for the workers food bank and similar organizations week by week. >> if the current trend continues food bank reckons by the next election they will be feeding half a million of our constituents. might i therefore -- before we complete his engagement today he might plan what the government might do to counter this terrible trend and report back to the house? >> let me join you in welcoming what food banks do and the work that they do and i visited one of the sites myself to see what they do. ..

>> one thing we also agree about is the need for public sector pension are sustainable and affordable. but in that context judges are being asked to pay 2% of their salary towards their pension come where's the taxpayer pays 33%. that's neither affordable nor sustainable. given the increases, will the prime minister make sure we apply the same requirements on judges they? >> my honorable friend makes an important point. what i would say is judicial pensions have always been treated separately. >> why? >> because judges do for our country. but in terms of public sector

pensions more generally, what we have managed to do, what we managed to do -- >> reply to a service question. let's hear it with a degree of respect and restraint. >> a separate judicial bill under the last government. what we have done more generally is reduce by half the future cost while maintaining a public sector pension system that is more generous than people are able to access in the private sector. as for his earlier remarks, i've got planned for the honorable gentleman. [laughter] >> mr. michael mckeon. >> mr. speaker, mr. speaker -- [laughter] >> order. the house will be relieved to know i don't intend to go any of that. but i do want to hear the question. >> mr. speaker,. [inaudible]

before he was prosecuted and sentenced for some of his crimes. a constituent who was abused would suggest senior figures in the establishment knew what was going on. the cbs refused to pursue these. [inaudible] mr. speaker, they were abused by the state. does the prime minister agree with me, to make sure justice is done? >> i think the first thing that the honorable gentleman should do, and i'm sure he already has come is make sure any evidence he has of abuse or of coverups of abuse or compliance with abuse is given to the crime prosecution service and given to the authorities so it can be properly investigated. the home affairs select committee on which i sat looking to this issue in years gone past made a number of recommendations on look carefully what the honorable gentleman said and see if there's more advice i can provide. >> order. i have a short statement to make.

colleagues will be aware that the prime minister has extended a formal invitation to nobel prize winner and newly elected parliamentarian, to visit the united kingdom next month. at my request, as the lord speaker, she has kindly agreed to address members of both houses in westminster hall on thursday the 21st of june at 3 p.m. further details about applications to attend will be sent to members in due course. order. statements for prime minister. >> thank you, mr. speaker. and can i welcome the announcement you just made. she is a remarkable woman, ever so many years has been effectively imprisoned in her own country and it's an incredible testament to change in the country that she is now able to travel and to speak freely, including in this parliament. with permission, mr. speaker, i

would like to make a statement on the g8 and nato summit which i attended in america last weekend. the common theme across both so much was economic stability and international security. at the g8 we reached important conclusions on dealing with our debt, growing our economies and dealing with the risk in the eurozone. i want to take each in turn. mr. speaker, deficit reduction and growth are not alternatives. you need the first indoor to deliver the second. there was no debate about this. and it was, indeed, france will balance its budget as a faster rate than britain. britain in two years would've cut the deficit we inherited from the last government by more than a quarter. and our approach has been endorsed again by the imf this week and also by the oecd. at a time of tight budgets, a proper growth plan requires not just a credible fiscal policy which secures the low-interest

rate of speaking about just a moment ago, but also structural reforms to make our economies more competitive, active monetary policy and -- our hard-won credibility ensure investment and long-term infrastructure. we're taking all of the steps in the uk and we are promoting them across europe as well. and in every area we need to do more. prime minister monty and i have gathered 10 other e.u. leaders to call for the completion of the single market in digital and services. classic structural reform to our economies, presidents, ford create a proposal such as project bonds and as the house knows in recent months the ecb is help supply liquidity to european

to continue the good work of the g8 on development and to support the arab spring and the promotion of democracy and reform. on development the new alliance for food security and nutrition is an important initiative that aims to help 50 million people lift themselves out of poverty over the next 10 years. for country to receive help they need to show a real commitment to transparency and good governance. and in return they get substantial support to generate private sector investment in food production. this is i believe a great combination of promoting good governance and helping africa to feed its people. i will be building on this with a major event on hunger during the olympic games in the uk. encouraging the private sector to great jobs is one of the best routes to sustainable growth in poor countries. but aid it does other vital role to play.

for the first time the about of a given by the world's richest countries to the workforce countries has fallen back. promises are being broken and this is wrong. britain continue to honor its commitments. other nations should do likewise and in the g8 which we'll be cheering next your we will reduce the report which shows who has and has not kept their promises. the g8 also reached important conclusions on libya, iran and syria. specifically on syria it was backing for the unmanned plane ever for the u.n. measures if it doesn't change course but it was significant the russians agreed to the stacks. i raise burma and the need to support foundations of a reversible transition to democracy and i want to make this a feature of our g8 next year. i'm sure the whole house will afford to welcoming when she addresses parliament next month. let me turn briefly to the nato summit. some people write off near as a relic of the best. i think it is vital to our future security. the threats nato countries face largely come from beyond our borders. failed states, terrorism,

nuclear proliferation. because of this it makes sense for nato to be prepared, to link up with partners around the world, to act out of area and to spend less on weapons of past conflicts like battle tanks and more the technology needed for tomorrow's conflict. all of these were agreed at "the sun." that's not to say nato should take steps to defend europe and north america. it should. we declared at a summit with the inter- ballistic missile capability is now operational but it was particularly could have a special session with partners who work with nato around the world and in particular the 50 countries that make up the nato-led alliance in afghanistan. nato military commander said on a process in the campaign. attacks by the insurgents are down, transition to afghan control is on track. over the next few weeks we will reach the point where 75% of the population will be living in areas where afghan forces are in the lead for security. the vital next steps are to deliver the final stages of

transition, to continue to build up of the afghan national city to forces, and to ensure they are properly funded for the future. britain is pledging 79 pounds, $109 a year but it is right out of the country should step up and contribute to the future of afghanistan irrespective of the role they have played so far. this summer i believe was a turning point with almost a billion dollars been pledged to support the afghan national security forces. mr. speaker, britain has played a leading role in this alliance for reasons of her own national security. three years ago some three quarters of the most serious terror plots against britain had links to afghanistan and pakistan. i'm advised it is down to a happy our aim is an afghanistan there's able to take care of its own security without the need for foreign troops. and afghanistan that can prevent al qaeda returning and posing a threat to us and to our allies around the world. the tremendous hard work of our courageous servicemen and women is making this possible. after 10 long years our servicemen and women will

finally be coming home. i pay tribute to them, their service and their sacrifice is beyond measure and we remember in particular all those who have given their lives in this vital task to keep our country safe. and i commend this statement to the house. >> mr. ed miliband. >> i'm grateful to the prime minister for statement and let me start with the nato summit. on afghanistan we welcome the summit's confirmation that the transition of full security responsibility reminds us to afghan national security forces is set for completion by mid-2013 and the in the british combat operations by the end of 2014. let me echo the words about how our troops, then served heroically in afghanistan for over a decade now. we owe them enormous gratitude. and a joystick for the whole house the prime minister when i say we want to see them home with their families and home in the right way, the professionalism they've shown and the sacrifices they have me. to that income the prime minister give a clear indication for the drawdown on bridge combat troops between now and

2014? can he tell us how many british service personnel he expects to remain in afghanistan after 2014? which services they're likely to be drawn from, and can you confirm this warning under nato command and control structure? can you also tell the house when he had discussions on the poor nation of land access across pakistan that is so vital for british military and isaf supplies? turning to political situation in afghanistan, does the prime minister agree to honor the sacrifices and bravery of our troops means taking the political challenge their answers as we take a military challenge? given the final stages and that her campaign is now underway, what concrete steps will not be taken that were in place before the chicago summon to secure a political settlement within afghanistan and between afghanistan's regional partners? does he agree with me that the international committee has been talk for long time about talks about talks relationship of clinical settlement we need, and we do need far greater urgency

in seeking this settlement to be therefore when our troops come home. let me turn to the g8, mr. speaker, on syria and, indeed, burn. on syria we join with the government and calling for an end to violence to stop into budget and i join with remarks he made about burma. mr. speaker, on the issue of the global economy, what we desperately need was a plan for growth. a plan for growth for europe and the plan for growth for the international community. i have to say he did anything this side of the house with his description of the presence new best buddy. given that -- [laughter] given he endorsed his opponent in the most fulsome term, he told him, nicholas arcos has my support. i secluded. now, mr. speaker, and the foreign office were a bit perturbed about this so they started briefing about and he said, we put all the chips on

one card and it turned out not to be the ace. it was an error of judgment and not what was advised. can he tell us when he was advised to see, refuses in place within a said this, i think we concur after today, mr. speaker, the prime minister has a habit of shooting from the hip. i think that's certainly true. the reality is that the reason why we didn't get the conclusions of the summit on the action we need is the international community is divided, it's divided between those who believe we must have a decisive step towards growth the president obama now joined with others believe the answer lies in more of the same. the german chancellor and the prime minister. for two years he has been the high priest of austerity. he's been telling the world that austerity alone isn't the answer. but now, of course, but now, of

course the recognition has dawned that it isn't working. he finds himself on the wrong side of the argument. that's what he is desperate to scram it around. recovery turned to recession, no growth for 18 months, 1 million young people out of work. i do say, i'm quoting the imf report from yesterday, the thing he didn't quote is what this team the guard said, growth is too slow, unemployment, youth unemployment is too high. policies -- [inaudible] spent hold on a second. before low growth becomes entrenched are needed. those are not his positions but his position is more of the same. so we have the ultimate irony of the prime minister who has a double dip recession lecturing other people and how to get growth. what does he achieve at the summit? we do know some the things he did. he watched the football.

a nice pictures, nice pictures. he went to the gym. he even squeezed in some sightseeing. but mr. speaker, the only thing there isn't a photo of of him making a difference to the world economy. [shouting] in other words, in other words, during his job, now look, at the gateway last november the prime minister signed a communiqué that said this, if global conditions materially worsen, countries will take action to support domestic demand. well, global conditions have worsened. where is the action for growth? where is the decisive ship when it across the global economy? what has he delivered a? because he doesn't believe in it. he is making things worse, not better. last sunday the chancellor went on television and said the speculation about the breakup of the euro was damaging britain's economy. he said this, it's the open speculation about the future of some countries in the euro zone

which is doing real damage. so can the prime minister when he replies explain why he decided to do just that last wednesday and say, makeup or break a? mr. speaker, it may have rhymed but doesn't he understand it did nothing to help our economy or anyone else's? and mr. speaker, given the seriousness of the position in greece, does he really believe that for him to give an ultimatum to greek voters over the weekend about the elections was really such a good idea? i would've thought after his experience of the french election he might've realized it wasn't such a good idea. finally, on the european summit tonight, eurobonds are important to a stronger firewall would make a difference. but the crucial, but the crucial thing is demand. doesn't he accept that without a plan for growth and a plan for japan and europe, we can get a solution on deficits across europe which is sustainable? the problem with this prime

minister is he can only offer more of the same. he can't be part of the solution because he is part of problem. all he offers is more austerity. it's not working in britain. it's not working in your. it's a failed plan from a failing prime minister. [shouting] >> five minutes, and absolutely no plan. nothing positive to say. i thought, it is a good joke about suckers but let me say this. we all have our faults but i would rather have a reputation for being loyal to my friends than knifing my brother. now, the honorable gentleman, the right honorable gentleman started with nato, he started with nato, he asked some serious questions. let me give you some serious answers. he asked why clear indication of the drawdown. we're going down to 9000 troops by the end of this year. clearly we need to set out a pathway between now and the end of 2014. i want it to be based on the

conditions on the ground and how will the transition is going into three provinces where responsible for. and i will keep the house updated on how those but we don't want to cliff edge at the in. he asked what would be left at the end of 2014. what we made a clear decision about is president karzai asked us to provide an officer training college in afghanistan and we will be doing that and have the assistance of the australians and new zealanders for the. i hope others will join. that is the baseline of our commitment but clearly we listen to any other requests. he asked whether there will be a nato-led operation in terms of training. yes, it will but there won't be nato combat operations after 2014. he asked about the relationship with pakistan and this vital issue of the ground lines of control, so-called -- is essential that they are real been. i spoke to prime minister gilani when he visited the uk about a week or so ago. i spoke to president zardari after the conference. i'm confident progress will be

made. he asked about the political challenge. is right about this. i've said all along alongside the military surge you need a political search. we are working hard with the afghans and pakistanis to try to deliver this. we have made it clear offer to the taliban if they lay down weapons, join a political process than the process will be open to them. but i would say we have to be prepared that the political process won't advance as far as we would like. that's what we must make sure the build up of the afghan national security forces goes to plan so we can hand over in good order and i believe we will. on president along, let me make this point for the president said something which i think he should adapt he said the national debt is the in the of the left. and the enemy of france but we've not heard them say anything clear like that. if you look at what come if you

look at what the president is doing, he was asked how his statement growth. he said this, that means cannot be extra public spitting since we want to bring again. so he asks -- asks about our approach on growth. we agree with the italian prime minister, we need structural reform in your. we agree with the french president we need a more active monetary policy in your. we agree with the german chancellor that deficit reduction is vital in getting interest rates do. the properties europe hasn't had all three but we support all three of those things. finally, i would just say to him, that nobody i can find in europe, not even i think probably the last wing -- left-winger increase backs his idea of an extra 200 billion pounds of borrowing into the british economy. that is the labour policy. it would put up interest rates, rec our economy can record prospect which is exactly what they did in office. >> sir peter tapsell.

>> did anyone at the summit, g8 summit, emphasize that the basic cause of the economic and political crisis in europe is not the greek debt? it is the single european currency and its lack of a lender of last resort, which is now a threat to the global stability of banks. and may i put it to the prime minister that until the leaders of the great nations grasp that fact and act upon it, that the turmoil in europe will continue? >> i think my right honorable friend makes an ago the important point which is that a single currency requires an active interventionist bank, central bank behind. and i think this realization is something we've been saying for a very long time as one of the

reasons, frankly, why i've always been skeptical about the single currency but i think there is a growing realization that alongside plans to deal with deficits so your fiscal credibility you need a more active monetary policy. that is what we have in the uk. just as the uk has a single currency between our nations, if you're going to have a working single currency in europe unique that monetary policy, too. >> mr. speaker, whilst i welcome the change of rhetoric over the weekend, particularly from the prime minister recognizing that austerity a little won't work, at least from his point of view in europe, might apply that here, too. could he tell us whether not the german position has changed at all? because it doesn't seem like it and until the german position does change i find it very hard to believe the euro zone is going to come up with anything that is convincing incredible before the greek elections of the 17th of june. >> i have great respect for the right honorable gentleman. i would say that the german

approach is changing to an extent because the germans know that alongside deficit reduction plans in a single currency you do need to have greater coordination on that single currency. their concern is they don't want to take the foot off deficit reduction until they have more of a political system around a single currency. i understand their concerns. it's one of the reasons why i never want to join a single currency because i've always believed a single currency and balls a sort of single economic government. so i think that is the struggle is to try and convince countries in europe that alongside deficit reduction you need a more active monetary policy. european central bank stands behind the currency, and, of course, the structure from such as completing a single market that we've always argued for. >> i welcome the emphasis. does the prime minister agreed the bank of england and the banking regulators in the uk need to amend the method of

operation in order to ensure sufficient money and credit available to fuel the private sector recover and not just more cheap money to stay? can they not learn from america which is doing this very well, and avoid the problems which europe is plunged into by doing it far given that we are doing a? >> i think my right honorable friend makes a very important point. when i say active monetary policy i didn't simply mean a central bank

they have complex politics and they need to be given the space to resolve some of these issues and the need to know that their friends like britain will not leave them after the afghan conflict is over but are there

for long-term partnerships, friendships and support. >> mr. speaker, of course i associate myself with colleagues with attributes to our serving forces, particularly in afghanistan, and those have given their lives. but on the global economy, with the prime minister continue to make clear we are not in the eurozone and shouldn't wish to join the euro zone. it is in our interest that we support the other countries in europe that are in the euro zone including as the father of the house indicated, by supporting their structural reform. and an increase in the internal market across the whole of europe is in their interest and ours, and construction at home is the best way of getting us into the growth that we need in this country. >> i think my honorable friend is entirely right that it's in britain's interest that the problems of the euro zone are dealt with. we have made consistently a whole series of suggestions about firewalls, about

strengthening banks, about consistent and strong contingency plan. the point of is making in the weekend was it's become urgent to make this contingency plans because, frankly, it's not in our power about whether greece will decide to stay in the euro zone or out of the eurozone. we have to prepare for every eventuality, however difficult that might be. >> house william. >> this morning the european parliaments by a very large majority passed the call for financial action taxpayer can the prime minister foresee what the substantial be under the leaders meeting this evening? >> my view is very sober against the financial transaction tax for every simple reason which is the up and commission a piece of research into the financial transaction tax and found it would cost hundreds of thousands of jobs. lot else like it is taxing the bankers and the rest of it, actually you end up going up the cost of people insurance policies, the casa peoples pension policies and actually

driving all the activity offshore. i'm not surprised some of the europeans country support because they see as a good way taking a lot of tax out of the uk and spin it in your. i'm not falling for it. >> mr. william cash. >> there was increasing pressure for political union between certain member states. whether this is by corporations or as separate treaty or by other stealth measures, does my right honorable friend except that a respected of the european union act passed last year that such a fundamental change and the relationship between such member states of the european union and the united kingdom would necessitate a referendum? >> i don't agree with that position. i think the right position for the uk is that if we were to pass power from westminster to brothels, if we were to join some new treaty or political construction that involve the passage of the power that, of course, we should hold a referendum. but where i disagree with the

honorable gentleman exclude the single currency has within it the seeds of greater political -- political unity. went to work out in the coalition in our political party, how to respond to the and of to get the best deal for britain as that situation developments -- develop. >> you talk like continued importance of nato and some of the things that have been agreed. the changes that have been agreed are largely peripheral and the need for reform is pretty profound. is there not a danger that the understandable focus of the economic crisis is sucking the life out of the need for reform in nato? will he focus on that, and not withstanding the understandable needs of the economy, make sure that the change program that is so badly needed to get decent

and proper ability within nato doesn't lose its momentum? >> well, the right honorable friend speaks with great knowledge of the subject i would be more optimistic in that there has been one nato reform which i know which is try to cut down on the bureaucratic and headquarters boasts around europe. and to be fair to secretary-general rasmussen, i think is that an excellent job in delivering that. we've also delivers the ballistic missile defense capability but i think that is an important step forward for nato. were i'm perhaps more optimistic than and as i think the reality of the situation is going to drive us towards reform. everyone faces tough budget. the fact that america is now providing almost three quarters of nato's funding and assets is unsustainable. so frankly other countries are going to have to step up to the plate, look at the arrangement, cooperate more, deliver more of the teeth and less of the tail.

>> may i warmly endorse prime minister's view that nato is vital to our security. and i congratulate him on a very positive role he played at the summit as a leader of one of his most important countries. would he agree with me that they secretary-general's program for smart defense is key to the future of reform of nato, and the right honorable gentleman spent a great deal of time. >> i think my right honorable friend for his remarks. the truth is that there is duplicated capacity all over europe in terms of defense, and much of it is not deployable. and what we need is for all countries to undergo the quite difficult, painful things we've done in terms of strategic defense review is to work out what are the weapons of assistance you need for the future. recognizing that we're less likely to fight land invasion and data but much more likely to begin with failed states, with terrorism and so the capacity you need is different. but even that won't be enough.

we need more cooperation i think particularly between the leading members of nato and that's what we're working so close with the french. so that we can deliver complementary capabilities, and as result get more done. [inaudible] specifically made a recommendation that the uk banks float up their acquisition of buffers, thereby producing more money available to british businesses and small businesses. does the government agreed with that recommendation and will they work with the bank of england to implement as soon as possible? >> i think the honorable gentleman raises an important one. this is a difficult issue to get right because here we are rightly discussing to problems. one, the need for growth, the other the need for financial stability and making sure you are safe with the headlines of the potential eurozone storm approaching but i think the best approach is to work absolutely

hand in glove with the bank of england bank of england and the financial services authority to get that balance right. that's what the government will do. >> i congratulate the prime minister on his stamina. i would hope by the evening he would've done three summit in five days and two continents. >> here, here. >> but can i reiterate the point made by the member of the coventry? if we have to press on nato members the conclusion of the campaign in afghanistan is no justification for cutting defense budgets. what we need, and it's essential we have a review of nato strategy with a full-blooded commitment that all these members. >> i first of all thank but ought right honorable friend for his remarks about my symmetry. i think by the end of tonight that will be enough summits for quite some time. e.g. 20 will soon catch up with his big what he says about nato is right. we need is refused by all nato countries to go through their

budgets, to work out what is actually necessary for national defense, but what more we can all do to make sure nato has capacity for the future. >> our national spirit and the need neatest demo and the technology of tomorrow. on the issue of cyber terrorism, which is posing an ever greater threat and can the prime minister assure us that there will be the intense focus and resources giving in nato to that very, very big and growing problem across the world? >> icann certain essay for the uk's part one of the things we did in the strategic defense review was some of the savings we may, i remember, i think 900 million pounds into a cyber defense program. that has been corny with others but also involving the private sector but it's a capability we hope to work with other nato members to make sure we are sharing best expect annett davis but that should lead to savings for us and to others. >> mr. peter bone.

>> mr. speaker, monti python's parent, it's no more to seize. it has expired. so why does the euro elite continue to claim that it is alive and well? isn't it essential that europe -- breakup of a eurozone before the markets forces economic tsunami? >> what i would say to my honorable friend, i've always been a genuine eurosceptic am skeptical about the your that's why didn't want to join a. but we have to recognize what is now in this country's interest which is for the eurozone to sort out its issues and difficulties. i believe that would involve greater fiscal transfers but i think must involve overtime eurobonds. i think it involves a more active monetary policy in europe and we should be encouraging european partners to go down this road to make sure the system works properly. we do have to be clear that

although, there are real dangers in terms of this organize exits from the euro, because it's not just that countries would devalue and that would've an impact on his commute to think about the impact of financial institutions and banks around europe, including british banks but it's very important that the eurozone takes steps to put in place the contingency plans to keep them safe. >> mr. dennis skinner. >> now that his dash to his election greece for the need of growth and we need a little bit in spain, so he says, and also in the eurozone, for the sake of clarity, can we get to the bottom of this growth here? repeat these words after me. i'm going to drop the austerity plan and go for growth in britain. >> i'm afraid i don't agree. i don't agree with the honorable gentleman. i deeply regret, as well as

individual with them, was a bit more sharp than it should've been and i accept my dash the i hope he accepts my apology for that. is a tremendous gentleman to the south and always remains. i don't agree with him because i think is deficit reduction plan is desert to deliver the low interest rates we need that is essential for growth. i to make this point again. when this government can't about our industry is witnessing a spin. today ours is less than 2% of those are over 6% to one reason is because we have a credible fiscal policy. >> could my right honorable friend give the house and assurance that while he is prime minister, this country will never ever join the euro? >> i'm very happy to give that pledge and i know that the leader of the opposition said it depends on how long he will be prime ministers whether or not we'll join the euro.

>> some people see their -- [inaudible] they feel distress when they see huge unemployment rates for young people increase in spain. will the prime minister say specifically what discussions he had with the g8 colleagues about infrastructure development as part of the global plan for growth? >> we did discuss the issue of infrastructure development. it can be part of what needs to be done. the rise of unemployment is tragic in any country but when you look at the figures increase and in spain and elsewhere in southern europe, they are high water figure. 80% of young people unable to find work. as i said i think the eloquence of the plan we needed on the fiscal credibility issue the low interest rates. the active monetary policy that supports demand in the economy as it has done in the uk. by the need to be combined for reform and its -- there is a need for proper structure form

so they have competitive economies. and then i think the extra element is using the credibility we've earned, the strength of the government's balance sheet to try to deliver finance into things like infrastructure and into credit. and that it's an option to open in europe as well and i think that's what president hollande is talk about. we have gotten in the uk. we need them in europe as well. >> with my right honorable friend and agree that when we look at the scale and timescale of the burma of that fell on west germany, and german reunification, we get a sense of the awesome challenge we could face any german chancellor in trying to achieve fiscal union in europe? >> yes, i think my honorable friend is entirely right. this is what i think when some people, and was employed in the question from the former chancellor, implied that german stubbornness is unreasonable. it's understandable.

obvious the acting for the success of the eurozone we need everyone to adopt the sorts of approaches i've been talking about in terms of monetary policy, and the rest of the. but it is important to understand people's motivation is difficult as it is because that's what lies behind the current impasse. >> it is good the russians shared in the motion subsidy but even aside the rig elections there are major human rights abuses in russia. [inaudible] and, indeed, by many organizations in russia. he tried to get an appeal for the. it was turned down not only last week by judge alexander, who is not an ordinary judge but a military judge. he is in the military chain of the supreme court and when the decision was handed down to be no appeal, it was done on the russian armed forces website. doesn't this just shows that russia has a great distance to

go yet before it can really embrace being a part of this humanitarian of nation's? >> obviously we discuss rightly with russian coats the importance of freedom and human rights, democracy. when i visited russia i've met with suicide or decisions to discuss these issues. i think it is very worthwhile having russia in the g8 because when we're discussing issues like iran and syria where russia has an interest and, frankly, we want them to join in the efforts we're pursuing, i think it's helpful to have them there. >> thank you, mr. speaker. in the absence of progress towards a global trade deal, and a useu u.s. deal could be a decent second that, to limit tariffs today. can the prime minister give a timeframe for the club kashmir for the conclusion of such a deal and perhaps how much the uk economy in particular might benefit from a? >> i thank the honorable friend

for his question. i think there's something salvageable still from the doha round which is all the omens of trade facilitation. helping reduce customs, times, charges and the rest of it, rather than the bigger doha package but i think we should precipitate in terms of the e.u.-u.s. potential deal, we have a conversation at the end of the g8 what we agreed to go and look at sort of issues paper for the g20 about whether there was small enough distance between the e.u. and the u.s. to close that would make a deal worthwhile. britain is one of the most open trading nations. they are our real concern to both sides. you have a french position on agriculture and an american position on many services and other issues. but i think with a good look at apogee 20 and see if we can then fast-track it. >> is the prime minister aware that greece spends 50% more on defense than ourselves and friends or turkey, the biggest arms importer in europe?

that you anticipate any in tax, the greek -- [inaudible] so when he talks to greek prime minister kan he asked to scale defense spending? the churches pay a little bit to solve the great crisis because i think the honorable gentleman makes a good point. which is common how ever much one can look at the greek situation and feel for the suffering people have in terms of unemployment and living standards, but is this crying need for genuine reform increase and for a more straightforward and, frankly, honest politics and keeping with these problems come making sure people to pay the tax, making sure industries are competitive. the asia about defense spending is more complex because of the relationship between greece and turkey. but as we are now both nato members, there should be an opportunity to decrease greek

spending on national defense in that way, but, of course, encouraging it to be a good nato member at the same time. >> at the g8 summit, did any of the leaders make the argument that keeping with the deficit and supporting growth are alternatives, or did they argue that you need to support growth through monetary budget supporting the banks, getting trade going? and was there anybody who made the argument that you need to borrow your way out of debt? >> my honorable friend makes importantly. there. there was no one suggesting somehow dealing with deficits in getting growth are alternatives to the are complementary. you need both. that is the view of everybody around the g8 table. there's only one group of people that got their head in the sand our complete deficit denies them and that's the people who gave us the deficit in the first place. >> the prime minister quite rightly joins -- over 50%.

and the economy -- [inaudible] he has preached austerity in this country and all around the world. that is exactly what has been done increase and that is exactly what the result is big is he prepared to put pressure on the european central bank as far as he can to stop the austerity of oppression on greece and start supporting the need for very ordinary people to work very hard and don't deserve this misery? >> where i part company with the honorable gentleman is in this kind we very consistently said you need to deficit reduction. that delivers you the low interest rates. it also enables your central bank to pursue an active and expansionary monetary policy which is what we've had in this country. and at the same time you need the structural reforms to make sure your businesses are competitive and they can take a more people and grow. that is what we're seeing in britain with 600,000 more

private sector jobs. that is a world away from what is happening in greece or in many other parts of the eurozone waited of monetary policy accompanying the fiscal policy and having undertaken the structural reforms we are in this country. >> mr. speaker, i'm sure my right honorable friend will agree with me that it is indeed the crisis in eurozone. but almost parallel to that is the possible pending crisis in the middle east. with the darkest days in baghdad. did my right honorable friend manage to find time for the we can to speak to the russian and chinese is to emphasize the importance of their employment of try to make sure of a peaceful outcome? >> my friend is right to raise this and a good portion of the g8 was spent discussing the situation in iran. and specifically talking about the talks are underway in baghdad today. it was heartening that the russians signed up to a pretty tough texan terms of iran, and i think that the path is very

clear. that europe has rightly adopted these oil sanctions but the pressure is beginning to tell the iranian economy this is the moment to maximize the pressure to encourage other countries around the world to join in with the sanctions and to say to the iranians, there is a different pathway. you can't have passionate you can have a better relationship which had to give up the ambition of enriching uranium to such an extent it could deliver you a nuclear weapon. >> mr. speaker, whatever the structural deficiencies, the problem is not caused by that pic is caused by banking and economic crisis. the suffering and austerity that is taking place increases on a scale of a complete different scale than what was in this country. [inaudible] was the prime minister not go back and speak to the euro partners and say look again about what we can do to bring about a different path and

remind the traffic of greece is a very proud nation. at the very important ally. they stood by us alone in 1941. we should do what we can to help them. >> of course i agree that greece is important ally. we have very strong relations between britain and greece and the historical analogy makes, he's right. i don't agree with into that the problems increased are only caused by the euro or by the banking crisis. they are deep and profound problems in the greek economy that do need to be dealt with. so i think of as i said, the recommendation is you need to have the deficit reduction plan speak you need to have an active osha policy. you need reforms to the eurozone and unique structural reform. in the end it will be for the greek people to decide whether they want to do these things inside the euro or outside the euro. clearly a disorderly exit would be bad for britain but we should do everything we can to avoid that but we need to plan for every eventuality and have proper contingencies in place.

>> in the absence of much-needed supply side in the eurozone, just as they are wrestling -- [inaudible] countries leaving current block and the vast majority of those cases, those countries have benefited. does the prime minister think it is the time we should stop talking that needs to stay in the euro because this can be disconcerting? >> no my honorable friend makes an important point. i'm not entirely sure i agree. you have examples of course of countries that have left the currency pegs and suffered in the short-term but then recovered. i think there is, and also get countries like czechoslovakia which split its currency into, actually manage that process will. i think there is a substantial difference when you i should have a currency zone, and should have a break, a potential break

way from the single currency. i think this is a different situation because the banks are so intertwined and that's why we have to think very carefully about it in terms of the contingency plan. >> jim mcgovern. >> i thank you, mr. speaker. the prime minister pay tribute to the troops who come home from afghanistan. [inaudible] to the prime minister assure me -- [inaudible] my family and my constituents that there'll always be a watch? >> i very much one is to keep the regimental structure that we had. i think it is very important. at the same time we need to deliver this big change in our armed forces which is going to deliver actually a larger army, but a better balance between a

professional army at a territorial army. and we are looking at exactly how that can be done while saving the important regiment that people rightly and need to feel so strongly about. >> at the g8 summit, they discuss development. [inaudible] could i urge the prime minister to do more on microfinance in, the way of creating long-term and sustainable economies? [inaudible] they get in 99% return on them if they give to women. >> i think the honorable lady makes an important what the of course we are committed to aid in development. we're committed to expanding this program that barack obama launched in terms of the new lines for food security. but i think the point about microfinance is important because this not only helps to grow small businesses. it also means empowering women which would make an enormous difference to the success of

development. >> was there any discussion about the situation in yemen? the prime minister will note on monday bomb exploded in the middle of a celebration killing 96. half of the population are going to starve to death. i appreciate what the prime minister and british government has done. however, acknowledging your role in shaping the cause in burma, can you not find it in space for yemen? because a stable human is in our interest. if we don't support this country, al qaeda will take it over and would lead to death. >> the right honorable gentleman knows i agree with this. my contribution in the g8 talking about the next g8, i said it's very important we look for the security and development priority of the future. and i think yemen and somalia

are both squarely in that bracket. in yemen, he was extremely distressing what happened in terms of that absolutely hideous bomb attack and the loss of life. i think we have to focus a huge amount of effort. there's also an enormous amount of national security assistance that we need to give that country and i discussed the and my bilateral with president obama as well. >> mr. andrew stevenson spent cannot at the with the primacy said about our brave servicemen and women who continue to strive to bring piece and stability to afghanistan? and a great it wasn't -- the supply was to pakistan someone is the prime minister can comment more on this and the role of pakistan is a key ally in leaving afghanistan on a stable footing at the end of 2014? >> i think this is a key point. we need to make sure we ignore the returns will and a good meeting with the president to discuss that issue.

in terms of pakistan, of course honorable members are a fully entitled feel frustrated. we are not aid dollars to pakistan the graphic strong relationship with that country and it is frustrating that the lives of controllers still close but i think we are ongoing discussions are underway. i'm confident they will be reopened and we do have to show an understanding about how this country suffered from terrorism, about the complexity of his politics and the need to show real respect for its sovereignty and its democracy. and really the message with to give to both afghanistan and pakistan is long after this war is over we are there supporting both of you asked strong independent countries, diplomatically, politically, through trade, aid, through all the means we have and we will not desert them. [inaudible] in that amazing country. but the all party group which i

chaired have a lot of british businesses about logistical challenges and security concerns. [inaudible] so while it is a good step was support with the prime minister pledged to british companies looking to invest so we get a win-win for both growth and british business and food and jobs for nigerian? >> first of all when i went to nigeria, i met the uk team in legos. auch usually impressed by work, dedication and also the incredible links there are between british nigerians and nigerians british as a were working between the two countries. we work very closely with the, in terms of security because there are real challenges, particularly in the north of the country. and i think it's one of those areas were security training and counterterrorism cooperation between our country and nigeria can really help major dividends for the country but also for trade investment as well. >> thank you, mr. speaker. given the increasing exports,

the urging economy is a key part of the growth strategy of many of the g8 nations, can the prime minister update thousand any discussions he may have had with other european leaders on progress on the pending trade agreement, free trade agreement between the e.u. and india? >> we had a number of discussions about the free trade agreement because there's a series of ones from the indian one, the canadian one, the chance of getting one going to japan. my view is all of these are good news. the korean won has been a success and we need to drive them all forward. and we're certainly in the vanguard of doing that. >> can i join with those colleagues who express concern that the scale of the cuts and the entrenchment forced upon greece, the ordinary people of greece. can i suggest to the prime minister, while agree with him we need structural reform as indicated, wouldn't it be better to have a bit more flexibility, a bit more european solidarity

to end up forcing greece in a situation which leads not just to the collapse of the country but indeed to ms consequences for the euro zone and the entire world economy? >> we are not a participant in the euro zone of greece. we are supporting greece through the imf. i think the point that he has to consider is that other european countries and euro zone countries, some of them are not particularly rich themselves. have had a series of agreements with greece about what needs to be done, what money will be put in. and effectively he is asking you to go back repeatedly to their own parliaments and say what i said i wouldn't ask for anymore from greece but here i am again asking for more. so it is very, very challenging for them. this as i sit in the end will be a matter for the greek people to decide about whether they want to stay in the euro and keep the undertakings that they are given or whether they want to choose a different path. is for them to decide. we must be clear in bigotry we would support all and any

contingency plans to make sure that either scenario can be safely delivered. >> prime minister in a statement, e.u. and u.s. together make up more than half the world gdp. would he accept this may not be the while -- the last generation for this is the case and, therefore, is more important than ever we reach out further and faster into developing markets to support our exporters, build on our strength as a country? >> i think my honorable friend is right. the share of world trade commissioner of the world economy taken by the e.u. and america together as china and india rise but i was always taught in business, going back to your best and biggest customer to get that extra deal is often a very good strategy, and so we should be thinking exactly about that in terms of e.u.-u.s. trade. ..

to scrutinize in the same way spend ages. >> i think it makes a series of sensible suggestion and i think we should look carefully at them. again commend for what he has done in terms of reforming the huge number of command posts and headquarters post in nato. i expect more to be done on the in front as well. [inaudible] 3% on the european market could the prime minister confirm how completing the service market is for british services. >> i think the point of it is

completing the single market in digital services and energy. each of them, can add, i believe over a percentage point on european gdp. it is a area britain excels at not terms of financial service but everything from construction and what have you. from other countries and there are a a a number of countries that are currently in breech of the undertaking. the pressure for a country like germany should be great. [inaudible] >> mr. speaker, on greece we the expression give a man and he can eat for the day. give him a rod he can eat for life. why in greece, is the money used to pay down the debt intest of invests so they request bring energy [inaudible] and universal broadband it can greece to the world. we have the politically acceptable and economically

accident sustainable solution instead of putting one fish on the table so they are angry and hungry by lunchtime. >> the point i make is first of all, the greeks had a special deal in terms of an enormous private sector haircut on the debt. that has actually asked creditors to take a share of the burden. also, if you take the last decade and look that the money greece has received from the european natational bank european natational european unit you union. the problem in the parts of the eurozone. the early parts of the euro was used to see ladies and gentlemen -- wage made the countries more competitive. >> glen david. >> it seems that the speaker has a possibility a strong possibility that greece may be forced after the eurozone we obviously concerned about the

imaibt on impact on the economy. as i friend prime minister agreed we need to discussion with our european partners and discuss plans to assure the imaibt has minimum impact possible on the united kingdom. >> i think my friend is right. it's not something we want to see happen. it's in our interest that the eurozone deals with the issues, strengthenings the banks a seen high interest rates in europe come down. it could be irresponsible not to prepare for the contingency plan. that's what treasury and others have been. whether greece stays within the euro is not within our power. that would be difficult it was a disorganized exit. >> [inaudible conversations] >> thank you, our country has invested a lot in afghanistan, a lot of fake sacrifice and a lot

of resource. along with many other are now increases the concerns of progress with the critical issues of politics in governments in afghanistan. which nearly alln'ts accounts are getting worse not better. will he reenergize the process and entity post 2014? and ensuring that our efforts are not sacrifices are not wasted. >> i respect the gentleman views. he served in the military and knows about what he speaks inspect in terms was political surge in afghanistan. i think he's being a little too pessimistic. if you take the province, we've been responsible. you have seen a excellent government and made real steps forward. you have district governments in all of the providences now. you have see a huge amount of progress in wheat seed distribution in terms of building school, hospitals, and

providing basic levels of [inaudible conversations] we need to do more. it is clearly what is going to be happening politically and reconciliation that will term the nature of what we achieve in united afghanistan. >> i welcome the declaration of the nato summit about the stabilities about the defense. russia, however, remains hostile to escape. and has the progress been made in persuading the points in the scheme is to protect europe from the right nations -- rogue nations and not from russia. >> t been a difficult discussion between nato and russia. but i think there is a level of understanding that the point of the -- it to protect europe from potential threating iran. that's point of having a missile shield. it is important to remember this is not nuclear deturns. it sits along nuclear deterrence

which remain ascii event. >> it is optical for a report published yesterday the imf corn firms that if we needed it confirms they are not delivering growth eventually the number of recommendations many of which have been talked about around the chamber today. some will be implemented overcoming months. the report then goes on to suggest recommend even, a plan b to growth, to cut taxes. is the prime minister listening? >> i listen very carefully to what the ims says. two me two things stand out. -- over the medium terms remain essential. they said the u.k. has made substantial progress toward achieving financial. say long side the situation we inherpted made thing shiver.

the second thick is the u.k. will grow faster this year than france, germany ow the eurozone. they're not predicting things will get worst. they're predicting things will improve. [inaudible] >> come home from afghanistan one of the key issues is the sustainability long-term of the afghan economy. i think has been in the past has been the poppy crop which fueled the illegal drugs trade. however, the same product could be used to alleviate medical suffering. what consideration has been purchasing the poppy crop so we can use it for the medical and advance the state of the economy. >> i have lookedded at issue in some detail. i think the key thing is if you can deliver in a country proper government, proper rule of law, proper transport networks then you can consider what you might do with a country's ability to grow poppy.

that's what happened in turkey. i think if you suddenly introduce ad poppy purchasing prompt now. you buy one, produce another one. i don't think it would work. i believe the afghan economy can work. that's one of the reasons why we're spending amounts of money on the economic development in afghanistan and clearly that is going to be key to the future. [inaudible] >> thank you mr. speaker. recent i met with afghan seats in any constituency. on the taliban forced to wear yellow ribbons and were prohibited from cree mating their loved one. theywomen's freedom in afghanistan. could the prime minister update the on the house on any discussions taking place in chicago on minority rights and women's rights so we don't see the -- progress.

>> i think she raises an important point. i had a meeting in president char sky in chicago. one of the things i made with him the quality of afghan democracy, rights, and justice will be key in delivering success. the afghan constitution guarantees basic rites. it. the taliban put down the arms and stop fighting they can discuss a political role. but they have to accept the baiivelgt ten nets of the afghan constitution. >> i'm proud of the international commitment to international aid made by this country. the concern about the levels of on the other meths of the g7. can i ask the prime minister to use remind the government any commitment. >> bide delighted to do that. one of the strengths of the g7 it produces the accountability report and i will make sure copies is put in the library. because it is very excelling.

it really hold the countries the promises may made about aid, spending and different bits. you can see it in black and white who met the promises. we'll continue to do it next year. >> nearly 25 million beam unemployed across the e.u. at the moment. economic demands is continuing to fall on the eurozone. it's rising this year in america. the prime minister told the leader of the u.n. and japanese governments and the advice of the ims yesterday and bring forward spending to boost infrastructure and get instructions. >> we said we want to use the hard won credibility we have. the low interest rates we have and the balance sheet we have to encourager the private sector investment. we made a series of is not functionen. i would say with reference to america. if you look at the deficit

reduction plan. they have plan to reduce the deficit. >> mr. speaker, does my friend agree that g8 -- will help arab spring countries cap into the international markets bringing them stanlt and prosperity? >> i think he makes an important point. it is a net bonus to the world. we need the wealthy countries of the world and the european union to get behind it. one of the problems we face the -- set themselves free they were told in the pass free enterprise economy. they have been having a capitalism economy. we need to work hard with them to make sure the economies grow for the future. >> can i welcome the prime minister's alert on aid levels from the richest to the poorest

cups. and following through the on the commitment to sustainable hunger. will he promote support for smaller older farmers so they can and their families can grow more and better food, and employ others helping communities to strive. >> i think he makes an important point. it was part of the presentation given to the g8. through the proper use of fertilizer and things like exchanges, you actually make sure the smaller farmers become more sustainable and can be the families but can also build a small business. >> west must hear from the voice of -- [inaudible] >> i'm pleased to hear the prime minister announce a day for discussing global hunger during the olympicses. does he agree that the agenda should not cover food security

and food production but also the hidden crisis of malnutrition which literally stubts the growth of 70 million children around the world. >> it seems to me while the eyes of the world on the britain and many african leaders will be coming to support their olympics teams, it's a good opportunity to bring people together to say here we have a great initiative in the near lives for the food security. let's take it to the next level. let's encourager more countries to join. let's make sure we lift more people out of hung and poverty. the point she makes is crucial for the planet. >> thank you. i thank the prime minister and colleagues. statement the chief secretary to the treasury. -- with politics and public affairs. weekdays featuring live coverage of the u.s. senator. on public policy events and every weekend the latest nonauthors and books on book tv. you can see past programs and

get our schedules at our website. you can join in the conversation on social media sites. now a discussion about how journalist cover china. the executive editor of the "washington post" and former china reporter for "newsweek" discuss the adult difficulties in dealing with china government. who arrived on saturday. this is an hour. [applause] for assembly is mystery mayhem and the media the challenges cover in china. this is one topic that never seems to go away.

maybe april, since you have just won this nice award, why don't you tell us what kinds of changes you've seen in the time that you've spent in china particularly covering china. in terms of the media and the ability to cor that country. -- to cover that country. >> it's in some ways it's difficult as ever. there's so many -- put the most obvious legal issues it's really hard to get a journalists coverage. as most people know, you have get accreditation. you have to submit an application in order to do interviews legally, and i don't have that, a lot of people don't --

there's a -- there's never beyond that, there's even more possibly even more pervasive as a challenges just a sort of social opposition to controversial journalism, a lot of -- a lot of -- i would say that because there's no -- not so much freedom of speech, there is -- it's just that a critical, skeptical curiosity is not welcome in modern china. >> do you think it's cultural as much as political how do you analyze that? >> i think it's definitely. i make people nervous. everyone makes people nervous just by asking questions about

politics. you know, especially older generations don't feel comfortable about talking about politics in restaurants, and i think that the internet has done a lot to increase this course. >> around the times you much p -- really watched the broad sweep of journalist and as an editor. how do you analyze the forces that are improving and maybe the forces that are more retrograde. how do you see the picture as e roving -- evolving. >> thank you for organizing the pinal and thanks for invite me. congratulations, april, your stories are wonderful. you know, i think that's the right way of framing the question. because i think that you can look at china and snapshot as or as moving picture as anything.

you can look at china as a snapshot, all the i thinks thises april is describes and observes are real, genuine impediments to. getting a visa, i seem to be the editor getting reporters visas. sometimes not. getting a vie is a is critical -- visa is critical. you have to assume that you're being followed. your phones are listened to. people you talk to get interview after you interview. if the snapshot,st the dynamic picture is if you compare it to the days in the '80s when the journalists were there, it's for a different world. i mean, people are willing to let their names be used. reporters -- one 6 our report one of our reporters in china has basic has a assistant monitoring twitter

in china. and there is a lot information is abundant. and that's on the sort of -- that's on the political social level. on the business or economic front, you know, when i first moved to how hong kong there were the [inaudible] hong kong. who works out the -- they've been evicted by the economist in 1949 and gone to hong kong. they were trying to report out of china. they gone to the rail for information, look at the grease on the train wheels being vestibules and try to pig figure out the state of chemical in china. that con traps quite -- it's a huge contrasts today with what bloomberg does. they have people dedicated to cover the chemistry in china

today. the society is vastly more open. reporters have way more access. that's not in any way to say it's easy. i sense, and maybe people like april are able to confirm this. i sense there's a closing down of access. china is getting impatient with the ways of journalists and i guess that's my picture. >> it's of a-- it's sort of astounding that the president of china has been in office for a decade. he's never given an interview. >> one of the things we'll will happy to see is whether the incoming president is more open and outgoing. i heard somebody who was at the lunchen in los angeles saying he didn't sit and wear his dinner. he walked around and met people. it's a unlike the current. pres. maybe he'll get more personality the next time around.

>> i've been through a few generations of leaders. there's always a certain amount of hope following the 0 passty. -- >> that's true of any leader. you always think the next president in the united states is going to be nicer to reporter than the ones before. [laughter] you know, at the risk of sounding like the panel, i remember when i was kind of -- i i didn't have a visa either. and it was sorlt sort of fun and fly below the radars. it makes you pick up on the stories that the officially spents spents are wasting their time. you don't bother you go straight to the new generation that is making change. i felt like that's what you did. it's maybe sort of a bless. i'm sure it's a -- sometimes inflects your coverage to be on the outside. that's a good thing. >> you went from china to russia. >> i did. >> what kinds of revolutions did

you have in that sort of comparison. >> well, we did the same thing. we were all -- the thing about the russian website they love to talk. so easy so conduct interviews with vush russians. you couldn't get them to stop talks. chinese are harder to pull stuff out. people are so unused to foreigners, and you had to spend such a long time talking about the fact that you were a foreigner. and you spoke chinese and had to comment on that for a long time. before you could start requesting any questions. so mostly, i think russia in the time of -- was more open than china in the 1980s. i don't know about that ted. today. as marcus said you have nonfunctional -- or chinese publications that are doing interesting things. you have the internet absolutely transformative.

you can't get into bet, you can't get -- as the areas. >> one of the fascinating things the uprising in they thought -- i'm guessing they didn't say this, i'm guessing because the violence seemed to be districting against the chinese. they could get the kind of press if the foreign press came out. >> interestingly set up a press is the protesters in the village that rose up against the local officials. they had an underground railroad for foreign correspondents to get in. i think that's a interesting development. even chinese villagers recognized the foreign media and the reporting that foreign reporters can do about events in chinese is significant from for people inside china too. that's a new development. that level of awareness of the

foreign media and to the san sophistication was unthinkable. [inaudible] >> and yet in many ways the reputation within the west, i'd say has suffered much damage in the last twenty years or so. and i think in a certain sense, many americans finds themselves almost agreeing with the chinese that the media is in a certain sense a negative force. >> well, yeah. [laughter] april, do you want to handle that one? >> that's how a lot of -- tend see the situation. but i would -- speaking from you know, was

there with these activists who had organized and captured the attention of the international media and as a result made the chinese government, the central government, or at least the government take notice and it was -- i think that -- china still has very few people do read the foreign media in china. they say that you to really understand china, you have to learn english. [laughter] but local activists have gotten and the government have gotten so much better at working with the foreign media. i think that one case with -- another is chen guangcheng and also, actually, both realize

such -- it was so interesting to watch the coverage of the downfall of the mayor. because there were just these really crazy story dhas came out in the first couple of weeks, and about somehow i think the chinese government somehow diverted the media the international media's attention to this affair between and the british guy who got her son into boarding school in britain. and it seemed to go, you know, the chinese government has often done that with the own people. blamed -- after of the downfall of the leader they'll scapegoat the wives to maintain the integrity of the and the reputation of the leadership of the party.

so as they took the sort of attention off both them and put it on the affair. it was sort of similar to what -- and they put his wife on trial. i thought it was really -- one of the most, like, most interesting times when you can see the chinese masters manipulating the international media. >> i want to note that -- the pols tear, the pea bodies and they're all today. i don't know what cosmic con conversioned landed this day. there are still a lot of good journalism being done. but let's not weep too hard. april is one great example. [applause]

an interesting question the role in such play in a society to encourager good journalism. because certainly if you sit on a jury, you realize that the papers would never invest that kind of money unless there was such a possible celebration of that kind of work. mark, if you look at our coverage of china, did you find the paper has trouble now financially justifying it? >> well, i kind of dispute the premise. i think there are some newspapers that pursue pulitzer. >> we're not going to name any names. >> i think across the country there are such newspapers, and -- but i think that is not generally what -- , i mean, i think