that is what i am hoping to read this summer. >> for more information on this and other summer reading list visit booktv.org. .. this is about an hour and twenty minutes. [applause] thank you. first of all, doctor greene,

thank you for the invitation to be here tonight. dr. west and i are in the mission across the country for the new text for the. rich and the rest of us. when we were asked to consider making one of our stops here, to support this great work, we immediately accepted. in part because we belief in the work that greene is doing and dr. west appeared at the conference before. i was just at the writer's conference this year, in fact. as a matter of fact a couple of weeks ago. i'm back in new york city. a couple of weeks later. we have been delighted on the tour to have about half -- i guess about half of our just over half, actually, of our tour stops have been to support through fundraising efforts those kinds of causes and

entities that we believe in supporting. whether it's feeding america, with all of the food insecurity that exist in the country, or the national black writer's conference. we found ourselves traveling on the tour libraries, nonprofits, to corporations, to colleges and universities, and to churches all across the country. we've been talk about the issue of poverty. and so we are delighted tonight to be here to support this work. obviously, we happen to be african-american writers. most people prefer writers who are african-american. again, we are delighted to be in new york city tonight. and to offer of or support have a via your presence for the great work. thank you again for being here. i know, he thanks you in a second. thank you for showing up tonight. i want to talk about the book and set the stage for a greater

talk from america's leading public intellectual. the person i regard as the new boys of our time. dr. west. i learned a long time ago, twenty five years ago we became friends, he is the big brother they never had. i'm the eldest of ten kids. the eldest of ten, i obviously have never had a older brother. i at least i didn't have one until twenty five years ago. we qebted. he is the younger brother of clifton west ab and never had a younger brother. twenty five years ago i became the younger brother he never had. he became the older brother that i never had. we've been running for twenty five years together. [applause] a lot to be shared. delighted to be sharing with the stage with descr. west. we look forward to your question and answers and questions q and a with you in adjust little

bit. but i've been fortunate for twenty five years as his younger brother, and his friend and his radio host on public radio international. smiley international almost two years old. we tried to do significant work being true to our vocation and our calling and our purpose. tried to do significant work across the country for the last twenty five individually and collectively. for that matter, around the world. but for all the work that we have done together, we have never written a book. i was actually stunned the other day, we were on somebody's program and somebody count the books i had written. counted the books he had written and the total was almost forty. between the two of us we written forty books and edited others. we have never done a book together. it represents the first book we have collaborated on. it makes sense to anyone who knows the work we do the subject

matter would be about the least among us the issue of poverty in the country. the book is called the rich and the rest of us. a poverty manifest tow. it's been fascinating. i'm going to take my watch off i'm going to filibuster. with two mikes in front of me, anything is liable to happen. been fascinating. now that we have a week under our bets, or almost. for what is going to be a three week tour across the country. we've been out for almost a week. there are refleshings that i can share about the book and how it's been received and what people are saying. one of the things that dock and i have been struck by. what i didn't expect, maybe i was nay veef nor not expecting it. i was struck by the conversation that kicked up about the title of the book. doc and i had no issues whatsoever and didn't spend any

time whatsoever thinking that the title "the rich and the rest of us" would be controversial. if he did, he didn't tell me. i didn't think about. i thought it was a great title because it was an accurate depiction of what is happening in the america. there are "the rich and the rest of us." i thought the title was good. and the subtitle lets the reader know what the issue is we want to tackle in the pams -- pages. i didn't know until we got on the road there would be an consternation, shall we say, and such controversy about the title of the text. but i don't know any other way to describe what's happening in america right now than to say there are the rich and there are the rest of us. and what are arguing in book debate i way make way for doc west. we argue in the text that poverty threatens the democracy. now, i did believe and did think

that some would find that a by hype bollic. we might be accused of being a little bit over the top with a book that suggested that poverty threatens our very democracy. we believe that to the we believe at the core of who we are. that the very democracy is threatened by the issue of poverty. we further argue in the text that not only is our democracy threatened, it is in part threatened because poverty is not a matter of national security. that is how serious the issue is as we sit here at hunter college in new york city tonight. one out of two americans, and people ask us, you know, they'll say you say one out of two. we don't say, the census bureau says. it's not like we made the numbers up. we had a wonderful researcher named sal vester browne jr. who helped us navigate through the

issues and your reis we had about the case we wanted to make in the text. but when our government tills us that one out of two of us is living in or near poverty. that a crisis. i'm not a math major it means that 150 million people in this country are in or near poverty. when you take the -- you take the new poor we argue in the text that the new poor are the former middle class. so you have the poor, you have the new poor, and you have the near poor. folks who are a paycheck or so away from falling into the poverty. you put those three groups of americans together you talk about 150 million people. who are wrestling with the issue of poverty. either trying to get out, or trying to make sure that they do everything they cannot fall in even though they're on the edge and on the cusp. our friend susie orman who we

quote in the book. there are a number of people. suez has a great line and the line is simply it this. there's a highway into poverty for too many americans, a highway in, but not even a sidewalk out. and that's the problem when it comes to poverty in the country. it's easy these days for tokes 230 fall into poverty. once you get stuck in the poverty, it becomes very difficult almost impossible for so many americans to pull themselves out. one of the things i found interesting and fascinating about our tour today is the fact that so in people in these conversations want to talk about the plight of the poor these would be the middle class. they want to talk about the middle class and what happened to them. they want to talk about whether the middle class is entire disappearing, how it happened to the middle class. all kinds of interviewers and conversation list want to talk

to us when we talk about the book about the middle class. we're happy to do that. we believe in argue the book. the data a that the former middle class are in fact the new poor. it means that once again find ourselves in a place in america those who have been persistently poor. those who have been poor are still stuck right where they are. and that nobody is really committed to having a conversation about those persons who have been systematically and over sustained period of time stuck in this poverty abyss. we talk about in the book in chapter one, we lay out a chapter one, a portrait of poverty. we thought it was important before we got into the subject matter to remind people how we arrived at this place. what has the journey been in this country. that allowed us to arrive at the place where we've never seen it as bad as it is right now.

what you discover when you read the text, we discovered in researching it we have ebbs and flows in this country when it comes to our courage, conviction, and commitment to address the issue of poverty. the reality is the last time we had a sustained conversation in this country about poverty, was during the johnson administration. you know this well, the war on poverty. now, that means there have been a lot of democratic presidents, maybe -- that's a stretch. a whole lot. it means there have been democracy ins the white house and republicans in the white house neither of those mrs.s, none of those administrations, rather have taken the issue of poverty as seriously as nay out. we argue in this text, that it seems to us, at least, there has been and still is a bipartisan consensus in washington that the poor just don't matter. the bipartisan consensus that poverty is just not an important issue.

so how do we get traction on the somebody how do we make poverty a priority in the country if the two major parties and the heads of the parties don't make getting america out of poverty a priority? we remind the audience and reader that four years ago, when we exercised our right to vote in a president issue election where barack obama was elected president. we immigrated that. we did 65 different events to help barack obama get elected president. for those persons who never seem to quite understand why he wants to hold that president who he fought for to get elected accountable, to progressive policies, just remember, that he chris crossed this country from california to carolinas to get him elected. who better to hold him

accountable than in the first place. in the last election of 2008, three president issue debates between barack obama and mccain the word poor or poverty doesn't come up one time. obama doesn't ever races it. mccain never autoers it. the moderators never ask about. three president issue debates takes place at the moment our economy is tanking and there is no conversation about the poor, no conversation about poverty, in this country. you fast forward four years later, half of your citizensy is in or near poverty. we unapologetically aside that we can't abide another campaign for the white house where the issue of the poor in the country not addressed. we can't go from here to november letting barack obama and letting the republican

nominee romney get away from having another con test or the contest asian of poor people's humidity is the order of the day. so we put this book out now, again, deliberately to do our small part to remind the nation that we cannot render poor people invisible. we can't treat them as an gast thought we can't treat them as a political calculation. we argue in the book, that it is the telling of truth that allows suffering to speak. if nobody tells the truth about the suffering of every day people, if nobody highlights the poverty that is so rampant in the country, it gets rendered invisible. it never gets addressed by the body politicking. how do you do that? you hop on a bus in the summer of 2011, and grow to eleven states and 18 cities on the

poverty tour bus as we did last summer trying to get an understanding a firsthand understanding an understanding what the so called great recession has done or did to the american public. we released a few things on the tour. in no particular order. we realized that the condition of poverty in this country is so dire that a simple or slight uptick in our economy is not going to address the crisis. there are some who believe that when the jobs numbers come out and unemployment goes down a half of percentage point and they start break dancing in washington. it dropped a half of a personality age point. we learned on the tour that poverty in america is so extreme, food and security is so real, gingrich can make jokes, bad jokes all he wants about obama as the food stamp president when congress just this week -- friday night here

in new york city. two days ago on wednesday, the agricultural committee in the house of representatives tight end even further restrictions on who can apply for food stamps. just another example of the wrong headed notion that us austerity is at answer at the moment like this. tightening the belt on poor people. further demonizing them, further criminalizing them, further treating them as invisible suspect going to solve our problem. we learned on the tour that things are so extreme and poverty is so deep and dire and a slight uptick in the economy is not going to address what we saw. we learned on the tour not that we ever believed otherwise we now know for sure my grandma would say we know sure enough that poufty is not color-coded in did country. we want -- we seem to color coat poverty in the conversation. we talk about or think about it

we think black and brown. that's what we mean by color coating. the truth of the matter is all americans race, and breeds are falling faster into poverty than ever before. specifically women and children. weapon talk about in the book bill clinton, whom i like and respect. he's a friend, i think. sense i've said it a few times over the last few weeks, maybe not. women and children are falling faster into poverty than anybody else in the country. the deal that bill signed 15 years ago. peter the husband of freedom fighters, has a book out now called so rich, so poor. we're not the only ones. we don't have a monopoly. we're not the only ones talking about it. there are folks who have been long distance runners before i got in the race talking about

the issue. peter famously predicted years ago it was going to reaping some dire consequences if bill clinton passed this law signed it into law fifteen years ago. he resigned his high post in the clinton administration in protest over this issue. fast forward fifteen years, i have news for you, peter was right. that's why we see women and children falling faster into poverty than anybody else. what does it say about the nation that allow the women and children oftentimes most weak and vulnerable to fall into poverty faster than any other group of americans? so we solve saw that poverty is dire that a slight uptick in the economy isn't going to solve the process. we saw that isn't are it isn't color coated. so many poem in the country right now are trying to hold

into the dignity. we believe dr. king believe trd is dignity in labor and work. and when you have half of your population struggling to hold into find a job, you have a dignity deficiency and where there is deficiency of dignity, you have problems. i was watching an episode of 60 minutes a few weeks back. they had a panel about dozen people, most of them white americans. who had once been in the middle class, making six figures and the 401(k) and the savings account and the things that come along with having access to or realized the middle class or more american dream. all of them had lost their jobs. mostly a white americans. it was fascinating to watch this. it is on the book, and i'm watching the story on 60 minutes. i think scott pellly did the story. it was a great piece.

i remember vividly a particular woman having the last word in that conversation. and she said to scott, i'm paraphrasing, i'm beyond the embarrassment of having lost my job a few years ago. i'm beyond the embarrassment of having lost my 401(k) and savings account all of my savings. i'm beyond the embarrassment of having lost my house. i'm beyond the embarrassment in front of family and friends who know how long i've been unemployed. all i'm trying to do right now is hold into my dignity. that hit me. and it took me back to the poverty tour last summer which was in part of the genesis for the text to to ohio. we sat in a room full like this, a room full of military veterans who had put their lives on the line some of them injured to

protect and preserve our freedoms. here they are back home now, and they've been unemployed for two, three, four years unemployed. one guy in the room, though, who told us a story that had me in tears. doc was slumped in his chair. he and his wife were having a difficult time trying to make it after both being laid off. that after twenty five or twenty seven so years of marriage, they had to split. not because there was any trouble in paradise. there was no trouble in the love relationship, but they couldn't -- they didn't think they came to the own conclusion they couldn't make it together. they had to split to try to make it. and he's living in an all-male shelter, all males.

she couldn't get in. she's living across town in another all-female shelter. they had to split because they couldn't make it together with the extreme poverty they were enduring. and we saw these kinds of stories all across the country. we went -- we started the tour on a native american reservation. doc west and i i asked native american brothers and sisters what the great recession done to them. they replied, what recession? we have forgotten about them. we've treated them, they don't feel the impact of no recession. these are depression-like conditions we live in day in day out. decade in decade out, year in year out. so americans, again of all races, color, creeds are suffering in a way that many of us have never suffered. the time to do something about it is right now. before i bring dock west up.

the book lays out in a simple format, first chapter is a portrait of poverty. how did we arrive at the place? second chapter is called the poverty of opportunity. and we talk about why there is such a deaf sit, why there is a poverty of opportunity in the country including the greedy corporations who are making money at home and sending more jobs abroad. that's one of the reasons why there's a poverty of opportunity in this nation right now. but beyond the poverty of opportunitying with here's how we want to challenge americans to re-examine their assumptions about poverty. to expand the inventory of ideas as it was about poverty. to look at poverty through a different prism. we want to challenge folks to do that. what it is, what it is and how to reduce it and eradicated it once get a more authentic answer about what it is. the next chapter is a poverty of

are fir make. we talk about that compassion. a poverty of vision in this country. a poverty of imagination in this country. and we waved throughout the chapter the people we saw and spoke to. we spent time with poor people not just talking to them. we staid with poor people. we stayed with a family with ten kids. a the dog and -- two dogs and three catses. we stayed with them in mississippi. we stayed on the -- sleep slept object sidewalk one night sleeping with our new friends. we talked to one of them a couple days ago. we try to stay in touch as we best we can. we spent the night on the sidewalk in the nation's capitol not too far from the capitol. we spent the night on the streets so we could get a sense what they were enduring. with spent time with kids in detroit who had nothing to eat and they were part of a food program sponsored by feeding america.

we didn't want to just go and take our cameras because it came a one-week documentary on pbs. on a national television with our film. we wanted to really understand what these persons were enduring. we know there's a poverty of are fir make. beknow compassion. vision in this country. we know there is a poverty of imagination and we also know near the end of the text, there's some lies, just bold outright, demonic lies. that are told everyday about poverty and about poor anemia country. we want to debunk those lies. finally in the poverty manifest tow we play out our plan and agenda. it matters. it doesn't take long for the interviews. after a couple of questions with the conservative friends, what's the plan? what's your solution? we have one. [laughter] we have 2011 of of them as a matter of fact.

there are twelve ideas we think have to be wrestled with right now and at once if we want to be serious about reducing poverty in the country. it can happen. this is not a steal problem. it is a will problem. do we have the will to make poverty a priority in country? other countries have reduced poverty because they came together with a national plan to make the reduction of poverty in the societies a priority. we believe that poverty threat ins or democracy. we believe that poverty is a matter of national security and to tell you more about why we believe that, i want to reduce the smiley west radio cohost. the leading public intellectual boy of our time. my friend who has a heart full of grace generated by love.

please welcome cornel west. [applause] first, i am blessed to be here. and any time i have a chance, to spend time with my brother travis smily, i have a smile on my face. as he said before, twenty five years ago, i met this brother, we decided we were going to give our lives and give our legacy for the martin luther king jr. and diane nash and author think day and others who had a deep and profound love for people and especially poor brothers and sisters of all colors and all

this falls short. we made a cough net. not a contract, a covenant which has moral and spiritual dimension to it. we were going to put whatever skills god has blessed us with to keep alive the tradition. we believe in the -- [inaudible] that we refuse to move forward with without first looking back ward and and staying in contact with those who shaped and molded us. travis is so unique in american culture. he was working for the mayor of los angeles then got the dine mate job on b et and lost the job on b et. our dear brother bob johnson who had a mass demonstration. myself -- it was just myself and

brother jamal brian. we met at the mcdonalds saying we were going to march anyway. i love him. i'm a christian, i try to love everybody. but i was disappointed, i had my critique and brother travis lost the job and we went into deep prayer with my brother clifton, i said you're going to bounce back, remain true to your calling not your career. don't become free occupy! [applause] with your -- don't become preoccupied with your job. have sense of what you live task is. don't obsessed with your profession. be tied to your vocation and be true to the people who have been

enslaved, jim crowed, hated and despited who lift every voice, do not ever become an -- [inaudible] be true to yourself. and he was down and out. and broken the ten command financially at that time. and he bounced back first black national public radio first, first black national public tv. travis smiley foundation, 13 years now he and i meet for a week every summer with young black youth, young black, leaders i should say inspect in the making thousands of them. we have a number of them at princeton. and we probably have some here at huntington college. we don't know. we have to hunt them down. and of course, the grand exhibition america i am books so on and so forth. i get upset often times when i

hear about travis smiley somehow he doesn't have his focus on serving others because he is so successful. and because he owns everything that he does like prince, he believes in control his masters. [applause] i just say to the world, i know this, brother and he finds joy in serving others. he's highly successful, he comes from a tradition that echoes mark 10: 45 he or she is greatest among you should be your serve vent. he doesn't confess success with greatness. what is the quality of your love for others? what kind of sacrifice will you really make? what price will you pay? you're not this trying to be particular. martin luther king jr. died with

a ton of descriewf disproving him because of he loved poor people and he was critical of the mesh occupation of vietnam. that's the tradition that we're talking about. we was there with a smile on our face. when i think it might be a -- dr. professor -- and her magnificent work at med gar everies. i want the world to know the support the work and the struggle at med gar eve veries. give them a hand. the professor columbia law school and one of the great hip-hop writers of the time. i'm blessed to be in the studio with him. give the family a hand. i want to world to know and the center for black literature, the only constitution fundamentally

committed to preserve the talent and genius of towering figures like wendell brooks and tony morris and richard wright and young brothers like kevin young. you all know we had a black sister who won the pulitzer prize the other day. give them a hand? ! we love them. she had was my colleague at princeton. i'm not saying that because he's an fellow. i'm saying this because he's an artist. the last time of the revolutionary pamphlet of 1821 po yet of the unacknowledged legislators of the world, is not talking about verse fiers. he's talking about all human beings who have the courage muster, their em pa think and imagination to conceive of a world different than the one we live in with more love, justice, equality, more democracy and do what you can, use bitter reality

it might be language it might be your body if you're dancing. maybe it's wrong material as an architect whatever it is use your imagination to attempt a make this world better by conceiving of some alternative and transform this present world in light of a better world. that is the best the literary tradition in the black literary tradition in particular that puts at the center the dignity of those every day people. those the late great james cleveland called ordinary people the democracy way of being in the world with a elect affinities on the vanilla side of time to ralph. ralph em hers. walt witman, the jewish sister who built on the tradition here

in new york city concerned about the dignity of every day people. -- of last but not least. i want to congratulations smiley books, as my brother has a publishing company. we have the legendary cheryl here, please stand, stand sister. the legendary plays an important role. she is so shy. we want to acknowledge her, and the other sister too. she's somewhere here. i wonder where she is. and brother raymond to be here without him. why do i spend so much time. i believe always beginning on a note of grad constitute to be a black man in america 58 years old, i'm happy and partly still

in my right mind. [laughter] when i grew up, i had a brilliant young black brothers and sisters much more talented than me. you look at the first grade picture, i'm the only black male living in that kitchen. i'm 58 years old. that's the damage done. that's the wasted potential. that's the humanity overlooked. down plays people often look at me and say professor, you are so talentedded. you didn't know the brothers and sisters i grew up. you think i'm such a giant. you've never met my father. i'm half of a person. you never met my brother clifton. i'm one-third of the person he. somehow i made it through. i may not be here that long.

i might snap tonight. do you see me on the corner homeless. that's what happened. i got a whole lot of rage and righteous inside of me if it wasn't for the kristin convention trying to qebt it i'd be in deeper trouble now. we have major trial in a few weeks. think pleasant. we may end up in jail again. that's all right. i have the cemetery clothes on. i dress in black every day. why? because much like the poverty it's a love tour. the brothers call it caravan of love. because when you love poor brothers and sisters you can't stand the fact that they're

being treated unjustly. you know they're being treated unfairly. if you don't know something, they're going to cry out. past the tradition that we're trying to open alive. very difficult these days when poor people are criminalized and demonized especially on the chocolate sides of town including the white brothers and sisters and appalachian of poverty. you would never know poor people even exist if you looked at the corporate media, you would never know poor people even exist if you kept track of the dialogue between our politicians so obsessed with the hidle class. who is middle class? working class folk -- [inaudible] that's who we're talking about. but it means so you to cut radically against the grain.

and to talk about "the rich and the rest of us," and we did there was one month before occupy brothers and sisters, and i want to affirm the occupy movement talking about corporate greed and wealth inequality. we told have been talk abouting it thirty years ago. we shouldn't have been talking about that a long time ago. one% of the population on 42% of the wealth. in 2010, one 1% of the population got 93% of the income gross. that means 99% of the rest of the population dealing with 7% of the income growth. what is that? pit us against each other. ! fighting for the -- [inaudible] 22% of our children living in poverty in the richest nation in the history world. it's a disgrace. and let us never forget our indigenous brothers and sisters. they are pressure like each and every one of us no matter what

color, culture, civil dedication or or generation. the latinos living in poverty. 39% of black. young people 100% of the future. and yet, obsession with middle class, they're the voters. poor people don't vote. poor children don't vote. they vote but not at the same rates. we refuse to put up with that kind of sense sensibility. we give so much money. we gave $500 million as martial plan in the last 25 years to the central come flex. we find the money when we build jails and prisons in the criminal justice system.

we cut when it comes to education. when it comes to job, we can't find the penny. we have to outsource. when it a comes to decent housing, falling down school systems. we can't find a penny. when it comes to drones with yes, those real special powerful, unmanned aerial instrumentalities that can kill folk thousands of miles away, supposedly killing terrorist who we've killed so many civilians. nobody is keeping track. it's about 850 minimum. we brag about killing osama bin laden, he's a gangster, yes he is. he killed them indeed. and debate whether we should have killed him go back and forth. when you kill his daughter,

that's wrong. no justification for collective punishment. no debate about it. what'ssoever. now we have the national defense authorization deal which president and executive powers can detain u.s. citizens with no trial, no due process, no judicial process whatsoever indeferently if you are defined as being hostile to the or being tied to terrorist groups. i say to myself, i went to south africa. they booted me out. it was a compment. i knew the underground police was tight. nelson was on the force for years. nobody is going stand in the way with me being in solidarity with nelson against the appear tie in south africa.

under the same act, you'd be drag me off the stage. i'm a terrorist. and i say, i'm a militant. a militant for sweetness. a militant for kindness. like brother martin used to say, i want to be an extremist for love. that's how we roll. [laughter] it's true. it's what we decided to do. [applause] i was bed to write a song with a artistic genius. his last album capitol of the world. we wrote it in the basement in cincinnati, ohio. when love is a threat. anybody who loves poor people in america is the threat to the

status quo whether you're christian, jewish, buddhist, hindu like gone i did, secular agnostic. you really love poor people and poor children, you're going to cut against the grain for your whole life. you're not going to be well-adjusted to injustice. you're going to be mild adjusted to injustice. you're going to be what the great -- did jewish brother and the playwright that he was. in the play misfits. brother travis and i decided you see it in the text that we are misfits. we refuse to fit into the wide spread indifference to the suffering of poor people. we refuse to view them in any way as invisible. we want to put them at the center of the death corp. why is it to difficult?

to be associated with black people. that face on poverty black face on welfare. any time you put a black face on any issue in america, you can rest be assureed that less value is placessed on that issue. because the history of america and the vicious legacy of white people city is black life has less value than white life. brother, you sound like you are antiamerican. i've been here 13 generations. i'm antiinjustice in america. not antiamerican. that's why the text is to rooted in the best of america's prothreatic and progressive traditions. but our prophetic and progressive stray diss up until the occupy movement has been so

weak and feeble in the last thirty years where they've taken place just a thought an tack and working people on treed unions. on poor children. in the face of what, power from above. look at our political system. dominated by big money before the super pacs. look at our political system. a republican party, for the most part, deeply conservative version of rule. riewlt of the wall street bigbacks and big corporations. democratic parties, neo liberal version. so much better than the republicans. doesn't take too much. when it comes -- [laughter] to the treatment of poor working people. better than the republicans. i can say better than job stew wetter when it comes to song

book. give me the jazz. somebody who can really sing. why we set the bar so low? the democratic party, they move year in and year out we're better than the republicans. '02 not saying too much -- you're not saying too much. we're not talking about political expeed city here. we understand that a very critical of any of the republican candidate including our mormon brother romney. right wing as he can be, spirited to the poor indifferent toward the suffering of the weak and vulnerable. barack obama so much better certainly better. no doubt, that's all we need to know. that's the beginning of the conversation. not the conclusion.

that's expedient city. let's talk about the truth. why is that both parties are extension of -- at the top big, big money big banks and big corporations and why is that working people and poor people feel so help less and power less and feel when we organize and mobilize we are dismissed or crushed or infiltrated by the fbi. let's just be honest about it. in love. love not -- that's what this is about. the tell the story. it's to allow suffering to speak. and that un apologetic love justice is what love looks like in public. why is it that we have been so muted in raising our voices

individually and collectively up until occupy movement in terms of the treatment of poor and working people. to be able to speak the truth, try to live the truth, listen and learn from others and then conclude poverty is the moral and spiritual issue of our time is not simply matter of politics and economics and there's no way that american democracy in all of the laws will be able to survive let alone thrive if we don't not just wrestle with poverty we call for the elimination, the e eradication of poverty. we're ab abolishes nist. look at the history of the united states. after we so cronkically mistreat our brothers and sisters. violated their women and the men

and the children, that became land base for the american democratic experiment. then we enslaved the africans. it became the labor base for the democratic experience. the first thing was what? build monarchy because we began as a colony. i'm an antiimper list across the board. i'm in solidarity with the anti imperialism to see slave holders like george washington. critical of the slave holder. but the british empire, yes, the monarchy, they did. it became slavery. we needed a second american revolution. civil war, 620,000 dead to do what? fighting over 4 million enslaved africans. social depth at the mist at the democratic experience. one for the 200,000 black

soldiers that joined the union army. we are going to be on the union side. sometimes i see the white southern brothers and sisters in the south thinking maybe we should really have won. we don't have to worry about smiley and west. keep the kneeing grows under -- blacks under strict control. we broke the back of slavery. here comes jim and joe. slavey by another name. want to break the back of the slavery by another name until the 1960s. the kind of second moment in the second american revolution after breaking the back of white supremacist legalized slavery. here we are now fifty years after breaking the back of that american appar tide, the second american revolution. what we need is a third revolution in america.

it's peaceful. everybody thinking he's a revolution. that's right. i'm a deep democrat. peaceful revolution. we need a fundamental transformation of our economy. a transfer of power for all -- [inaudible] control of resources to democratic accountability. the ordinary citizens [inaudible] not a demonizing of [inaudible] not a demonizing of plot carats, it is now the fundamental issue and tie to poverty and tied to the vast social conformity in america in which what? everything is up for sale and everybody is up for sale as long as you can bought, you will never be willing to straiten your back up and tell the truth about the circumstances which we live. poor people will find themselves

continually tide into the buying of selling of drugs and guns trying to deal with the survival of the slick west no possibility of the kind of organizing and mobilizing necessary for the third peaceful american revolution that allows for democracy, the flower and flourish and calls -- [inaudible] into question. that's where we're. poverty is the new slavery. and they are the new kings. [applause] if we have energy from blow. maybe we have a chance working with insiders. the bernie sanders. keiths, steve cohens, go on and on. maxine waters. then we need outside. we need folks who are willing to

put their hearts and minds and bodies on the line. and the streets and the jails organizing mobilizing keeping love and justice not hatred and revenge at the center. martinmartin luther king jr. died called himself a revolutionary christian. we shouldn't think of celebrating his legacy if we don't come to terms with that love supreme that john plead enacted in the movement of fannie lou heyman and travis and i write the book to keep the tradition alive to ebbs extend that each and every american of every color who recognizes that we're not in a crisis, we're in catastrophic conditions. and with don't fight for love and justice. we're going slide down a slippery slope of hatred

revenge, and chaos. [applause] [inaudible conversations] thank you so much. thank you for raising our consciousness. thank you for putting it on the agenda. it is time to hear from you. i have questions from the audience. we have a number of questions, i think it might be best if i just ask the questions and whoever wants to respond can respond. the first question is, what are your thoughts on student debt and poverty and is debt forgiveness the answer? >> we know that student debt now has exceeded credit card debt. it's reached dollars. it shows what kinds of values we put on the young people forced to go to school. making it difficult for very

talented poor and working class students to gain access to education. and yet, at the same time when they apply for a loan, they have to pay high interest rates. investment bankers get nearly 0% interest rates. wouldn't it be nice if students were treated like that. getting access to loans with hardly any interest rates at all. again, you can see, the hypocrisy in terms of how the well is treated and the working people. more and more students are coming to this conclusion. and i think that not only relief for a student -- i would say the same thing relative relief when it comes to the mortgage given the kind of predatory lending of the powerful based on the ordinary people toward the catastrophe. that kind of perspective ought to be part of the discussion. keep in mind, nothing i say is

definitive. it's a voice in the democratic conversation connected to public interest and common good. and it goes to argument, contest situation. that's the kind of voice i would raise in talking about our precious students. >> just to followup, we talked about the melds middle class, the raises of the middle class. what needs to happen to end poverty and recreate the middle class again? it is another question. >> the last chapter in the book starts with a telling story about a conversation that president obama had with the late steve jobs of apple. and he was talking to steve jobs about a program he wanted to roll out and ultimately you recall he rolled the idea out. the idea for insources american jobs. he talked about it in the state

of the union address. at some point prior to the speech, of course prior to mr. jobs' passing away. the conversation had a conversation with steve jobs we recount in the book. he was asked jobs about the american jobs that had been shipped abroad and trying to get steve jobs to talk about how the jobs can be insourced. and he wanted to pick his brain about this. steve jobs about president and said without blinking an eye, those jobs are never coming back. this is america's celebrated ceo, corporate ceos. who said to the president those jobs are not coming back. dr. west and i in write of the book, wrestled for days, at one point, trying to come up with a single for why any american corporate ceo would be incent

vised to actually hire back the thousands of workers who have been laid off. i'm sad to report, at least you know, you're going find it in the book, we couldn't up with a single reason. the only reason why any major american corporate multinational ceo is interested in hiring back all of the thousands of folks they laid off, is if the demand for your product is so high that you have to put more people on the line. you got bring more people to the pipeline to get the product made. but your shareholders all they want is profit. and that's why you fired, downsized laid off all the persons in the first place. there is no reason to bring those persons back on. if you're making more money at home. shipping more jobs abroad, have been able to shrink your outlave

cash. what's the point of bringing them back on? that's the reason why. it sick ins me. that's why president obama is. begging the same corporations, the same banks who we gave all of our money to, we bailed them out, and you know this. they're not sitting on a trillion dollars they will not reinvest back in the economy. so we gave them the money without any strings attached and now we're begging them and asking folks in washington to come up with ideas and ways to inventize them to pump the money back into the economy. we gave you the money and now you're sitting on them. . .

fashion a national plan to reduce poverty over it five, 10, 15 years. these programs and ideas exist. steve jefferson of columbia in new york city has one. the defense fund has one, catholic charities has one, jim wallace of sojourners has one. again this is not a skill problem, it's a will problem. we have the ideas and we have the ways & means to put together a national plan to make -- poverty and reduce it. i don't know how you bring the middle class back if we can find a way to make jobs, jobs, jobs

with a living wage a priority and i don't know how you incentivize with greedy american corporations sitting on money and shipping jobs abroad to be serious about that. that i don't know. >> can i just add, one of the reasons has to do with the fact that, 40 years ago 9% of corporate profits in america were made by banks. today 42% of corporate profits are made by banks and what is the difference? look at the difference between mitt romney and his father. his father was the head of american motors and had produced products that people could consume. mitt romney made his money with banks. produced bills. you don't produce products. and you introduce deals and make money by cutting workers so you don't produce things to be bought at all. its casino life. you are generating big, big, big money, billions of dollars at the top with no productive value for the society as a whole.

so you end up with lives of the rich and famous and luxurious and the cultural celebrity hood and people want status and wealth and power and we see it of course throughout our culture. we see it in the hood, the ghettos. we see it in the middle-class. we see it in our corporate television. rec it critiqued on alternative tv. we see it in our news shows. the aim is, stimulate, bottom line, keep the frenzy. thank god tavis smiley, amy goodman and the others, we don't want stimulation, we want information. we want elimination. we want analysis of what is going on. [applause] the only way you bring the jobs back is massive job creation programs. that's the only way you do it. rebuilding infrastructure and rebuilding the bridges and the sewers, rebuilding housing across the board and providing

jobs. it's not just public sector, can even be a combination in that regard but that is one of the reasons why it's so difficult to talk about jobs with a living wage and one of the reasons why it's so difficult or our leaders to really tell us the truth. the truth is steve jobs before he died, god bless his soul. >> related to that is the question of the belief that destroying the middle-class is middle class is really not an accident. if the rich want to eliminate the poor and are using policy and poverty, trying to understand this -- though they are using it in order to perpetuate the idea that there should need no middle class and it's not really an accident. it's a very conscious decision. can you comment on that? >> i think it's greed run amok. and they don't want to deal with the consequences. we live in a society that is so

obsessed with the instant gratification, instant stimulation, instant success. that is why i was making that joke. do you know what i mean? you could be a highly successful singer and he cannot sing. [laughter] >> that is true. that is true. [laughter] >> because it's not about quality. it's about appearance. it's about spectacle. appearance and spectacle. that is why jill scott and angie stone and anthony hamilton and glenn jones in the late gerald laverne, great singers, met less success than folks who were superficial, who made big money. some of them won grammys. i won't follow through on that one. [laughter] >> i want to add very quickly, in the book we talk about this a

little bit. i don't subscribe to the notion that the rich want to do away with the poor. i don't buy that because there is a whole lot of money being made on poverty. rich people are rich in part the codes of poor people. there is a lot of money made on poor people. in the back of the book we debunk these 10 myths about the poor. one of them is that the rich pay more. last night we appeared on our friend stephen colbert's program in colbert has become famous over the last few years for the word he uses all the time, truthiness. and we quote colbert in this particular section. it's tricky when you say the rich obtain more and wealth. they always find a way to not pay taxes, loopholes. something is wrong with you and i and i'm on public television and public radio. i don't know what you do for living the something is wrong when a couple of years ago general electric paid more taxes

than you did. ge this city, paid zero taxes. not a cent, not 1 penny of taxes for an entire fiscal year. because they know how to manipulate, find the loopholes and work the process where they pay nothing. >> the ceo happens to be head of the commission on jobs. >> not to demonize jeffrey immelt that is true. >> this will drive you crazy. >> president obama elected him. >> the rich make a lot of money off of the poor. it is not altogether true that the rich pay more and one of the reasons and we talk about in this in the book as well, we have a number of national conversations that i've moderated for c-span because

c-span -- c-span is here today as a matter of fact. [applause] i have been fortunate to moderated number of conversations broadcast live on c-span and for that matter we have repeated broadcast on pbs about this over the last couple of years. we were in new york for a conversation about women and children in poverty in america. earlier this year in washington george washington at washington university, nbc conversation that featured michael moore and others talking about remaking of, how to do that where poverty has run amok. very quickly, michael moore who we give space in the book to share his particular beliefs explains in simple and straightforward detail how and why the housing crisis came to be. he is a documentarian and obviously he has studied this and then work on it in the simple answer is what is the one thing dr. green, that the middle-class has that we can rape and pillage? their homes.

the one thing they all have, the one thing they have all equity in is their home and he goes into deep treatment about how in part, in part, we got into this housing crisis by going after people who were in the middle class and trying to get into the middle-class. we know homeownership is the surest and safest most secure way in america to start to create wealth and that was the one thing they did that had not figured out a way to rape and pillage and they figure that out and the rest as they say is history. there are some deep stuff in the book about the middle-class. >> you can follow the steps because first you have to have two spouses working just to survive and impose burdens -- spouses working but you have to have a credit card because you don't have the money so all of a sudden now you are in debt and then the only thing left is your wealth, your house and then your house is gone. what is left? now they go into other parts of the world. that is greed running amok. i'm not trying to demonize

agreed israel. i have been agreed inside of me. i'm just working on it but when that greed runs amok, the system itself begins to feed on itself in an ugly way. >> most important thing to me is what happens to the children. >> just to follow up on that, you talk about how the poverty cuts across racial division and the question is, what is the role of continuing racial division and maintain lang political discourse? poor blacks, poor whites and poor hispanics have much more in common with each other but racial separation keeps them from right rising and acting on their shared interests. how do we cross this divide and generate the power of the poor? >> divide? i thought we were in a post-racial america. [laughter] >> the reality. this is a doctoral asking this question. is a reality. >> i will let the one with a

doctorate degree response would. >> sometimes a doctorate degree can -- james bowen grew up right here in new york didn't he? he didn't go to college colleges but two colleges went through him. a lot of folk go to college and still -- [inaudible] they don't understand the difference between deep education and cheap schooling. they just want to get schooled. they don't want to really be educated and challenge. i think that question about how is it that we can come together and acknowledge these issues about male supremacy and anti-semitism, anti-arab, hatred,, hatred and the divide and conquer strategy, those powerful persons often reinforce so that the possibility of coalescing and uniting become very very difficult. we saw this here in new york with the occupy movement.

those are just young sisters and brothers from the other side of town. talking about corporate greed and inequality, does that affect you? very much so but i'm not used to spending time with them. okay but keep in contact with the truth. if we don't come to terms with that, then we have got another divide and conquer, let's connect police brutality, let connect stop and frisk. harlem and other places, let's tell the truth about that. but do it in such a way that it is broader on moral vision to allow us to come together and that is in part what they are trying to do with the poor people's campaign and that is why he was viewed as the most dangerous person in america. we have got to build on that. speech one of the questions, and

this is the last question, the whole concept of poverty is a matter of national truth. can you elaborate on that? how is poverty a matter of national security? [laughter] i save that one for last. >> usually of course we are talking about national security and we are talking about foreign policy and wars. but, we know that people who wrote the history of a civilization in the history of social regimes in the history of empire, it's usually the result of internal rot that empires collapse. it's not external threat. and when you look at the internal rot in america, all you've got to do is look at the prison industrial complex. all you have to do is look at the schools for poor children and privatizing efforts and

taxes on teachers unions. no serious commitment to it. all you have to do is look at the workers, the workplace and how many people are not just satisfied with their jobs but feel as if they have some fulfillment on their jobs. why is it that so many of our fellow citizens find some instant gratification in self-medication and addiction, pervasive across class, cross race. those are all kinds of decay and decline. and so, we should talk about national security and national security. its internal. that doesn't mean we shouldn't have foreign-policy but that is precisely what we are trying to deal with -- >> to add to that briefly what i say as a matter of national security i suggest in an addition to what dr. west just

offered, my read of history suggest there is no empire in the history of the world that is some point did not fall or fail. every empire has its day. every empire has its moment. i don't know what it is about us as americans and i will be accused of being anti-american. i have many times for even suggesting this but i i don't know if it's our narcissism, our arrogance, our hubris, judaism, nationalism. whatever reason we don't even as americans want to consider that we could be on edge, that we could be on the precipice, that we could be on the verge as doc said as imploding from that internal rot. and we take this, we take it head on the in the book. this whole notion of american exceptionalism. and there are so many of us who

still believe that we are the biggest, we are the baddest, we are all that and then some because we are the united states of america. and the data just doesn't bear that out. one out of two americans is either in or near poverty. don't talk to me about american exceptionalism. i was reading an enchanting article the other day about president obama giving advice to the morgue confident on -- confit on the campaign trail, to be more, to express more enthusiasm about our future. you've got to be more reaganesque. to change the narrative. dr. west said earlier and i agree, when you love people you tell them the truth. what the american people are not being told now is the truth and i cannot abide in another campaign where we are lied to or we don't want to deal with what is really happening in this country. and doc is right, were not going to go on there.

for all the talk about terrorism this country is not going to go under due to an outside force. our military budget is still -- we can protect ourselves. that is the main were not going to get hit again that we have the military might and the wherewithal to protect ourselves. that is not what is going to take us down. what's going to take us down is right this right here on the inside and the fact that we do not take the issue of poverty seriously in the fact that we don't see it as a national security issue, the fact that we don't see it as the moral and spiritual issue of our time. it's not just a political issue. it's not just an economic issue. this is the moral and spiritual issue of our time. and to the extent we make like the ostrich and put our head in the sand, and more what all the signs are telling us, we are going down. because every empire eventually goes down.

so we can put a happy face and act like we are all that and then some but this is the reality we are dealing with. we are not the first one and we are not the only ones trying to wring the along. trying to sound the bell. there are a whole lot of long-distance runners on this issue but in this presidential election season and where i began at least, we cannot go to -- we cannot endure another campaign by the white house for this issue just gets ignored. and all the data just, you know, we act like it doesn't exist. and so, that is why for me it is a national, a matter of national security. that is why for me it is the broadest issue in our time and be on the poverty to her. we did the poverty tour last summer and they knew that it couldn't stop after the tour and we did a documentary for five nights on pbs and we knew it couldn't stop there. we did remaking american renewal couldn't stop there. we came here to talk about women

and children in poverty and we knew it couldn't stop there. and we are committed as we have been in raising our voices on this particular issue. but there is no time like the present to get serious about this. i say to people all the time that poverty robs the spirit. poverty robs the spirit of its vision. and where there is no hope for the future, there is no power in the present. when you have half of your citizenry running around, trying desperately to hold onto their dignity, when half of your populace is trying desperately to hold onto their humanity, you see where this ends up. there is a reason why egypt exploded and there is a reason why tunisia exploded and the reason why human exploded and we just don't want to come to terms or wrestle with again how new

age we are. we have to make poverty a priority in this country. it is an honor for you to have us here tonight and we celebrate your legacy. >> thank you very much. [applause] 's been more be more from wichita next on booktv. robert owens the author of mr. jefferson's hammer talks about the origins of american indian policy. >> jefferson is a very interesting character in that he has these really ambitious goals but he also hates conflict. at the same time he likes technology and so when i was trying to come up with titles, william henry harrison became the perfect tool for jefferson to wield when it came to indian policy on the frontier because basically harrison was willing to do the dirty work that is going to get jefferson what he wants. lots of indian land purchased very quickly and very cheaply. harrison, i think he is more

interesting for the fact that he is so typical rather than unusual. he is the son of a grand virginia family. his father had signed the decoration of independence and so he has the sort of inherent leadership instilled in him and he had at the same time like a lot of those virginia planter families they hit hard times after the american revolution and so harrison basically, he has the characterization of being a new plantation later but he doesn't have the money to back it up and so an entire generation he is going to seek his fortune in the west. he initially starts out as a teenager and goes to medical school and pretty quickly decides he does not care for that. and then he joins the army which he actually likes a lot, and he loves soldiering. but, andy gets into his early 20s and he marries, marries a

woman named anna sims whose father was a big land speculator and a judge. he finds that as his family grows the army patry just isn't cutting it even if he gets promoted to captain and basically, for him it's the perfect solution to go into a political career. he gets status and power and influence and also hopefully a steady paycheck. >> what is the first major political office that he held? >> he was secretary of the northwest territory, which in many cases the actual governor at the time a guy named arthur sinclair, was gone a lot so harrison and the doing, he basically is the de facto governor of a large territory north of the ohio and then he is, where he really starts gaining is he is elected -- territories at that time didn't get a voting member of congress but they did get a representative and harrison becomes the northwest territories representative in congress. this really allows him a year or two to hobnob and sort of lobby

people and also make connections and the fact that he is a good family name, again a classic virginia family of leaders, that really sort of helps to bring him into the public eye particularly for people who have power and influence. towards the very end of john adams' presidency, they carve off part of the northwest territory into what is eventually going to become the state of ohio in the creative new territory, indiana. john adams needs an experienced hand, someone he can trust to administer that territory and he picks william henry harrison. after john adams appoints him it has become clear that jefferson is going to be the next president and harrison is showing some good political sense and sends feelers out to jefferson saying hey are you going to kick me out of office? when he learns that jefferson isn't going to do that, he could then -- agrees to take the job as governor of indiana.

>> the first year and a half in indiana would be from probably up to about 1802 and there is not that much going on. but, in 1802, rumors start swirling about that the french are going to retake the louisiana territory just west of the mississippi river and this basically, and of course this is napoleonic france held by the spanish who are not particularly aggressive or militarily competent by this point and the idea that napoleon might be taking over the territory since jefferson into a panic and from late 1802 and 21803, he writes a secret private letter to harrison, basically telling him to do almost anything he can to buy up indian lands on the mississippi and the ohio river as quickly and cheaply as he can. jefferson's idea is, and this really becomes heartened by 1803, jefferson's ideas we want

to buy that land and get as many white settlers on it as we can because they will service a militia who are going to stop moda polian which is kind of an optimistic goal i would argue at this point but anyway, this is when he basically gives harrison the green light to sort of do what -- any means necessary to negotiate this treaty quickly and cheaply. what is fascinating as with any year the united states has purchased all louisiana territory and so in theory that desperate need for quick land acquisition is gone and at the same time jefferson really likes buying up land cheaply in the sort of fits his broader goals and harrison turns out to be really good at this, not necessarily doing in a way that is going to make the indians happy but he is very effective at buying up this plan quickly and cheaply and that is the name of the game and he basically continues in that mode. the way usually describe it in classes i will take three random students and get their names and then i will play the part of

william henry harrison because i'm wearing a tie. i will pick two of the students and say of go hey would you mind coming to my ending counsel and i would like to buy that third student a desk. would you first to students be willing to sell me the third student the desk for $500 a year and of course they say yes because it's not their desk and they really don't care. then you invite student juan and student three and asked them if they could buy student number two a desk. it seems sort of like a silly reductive exercise but it's basically have these treaties work. harrison was very good at figuring out which indian chiefs were willing to play ball with him, which ones were desperate enough enough for annuities and other government perks that they would basically agree to sell their neighbors land whether they had claimed to them or not and as far as harrison was concerned, as long as i get indians to sign on the dotted line, it's perfectly good and jefferson was more than willing to accept indian treaties like

that. early in an 18 60's there is this odd period between the treaty of greenville in 1795 which basically ended widescale warfare north of the ohio river and of course in a way henry harrison was not only in the army that led up to that treaty but also in the treaty negotiation and i would argue and other people would argue he got a first-hand lesson on how to suggest indian treaties in greenville and for the next decade or so you basically of the indian population north of the ohio river in really awful straits. the napoleonic wars had killed the first trading economy. alcoholism is rampant. they are very much a dispirited defeat of people and prior to 1805 it is relatively easy for him to do this. is after the year year 1805 where we start seeing religious revivals among the indians north of the ohio, most famously a guy named -- or the shawnee prophet. when his four-year brother tecumseh, that is when harrison

have to change tactics a bit because they basically hold to the idea that no indian should sell any land to the united states under any circumstances and that is directly opposite him so he pointed out and adopted number of tactics and tries to win the profit over and start saying he is a tool of the british and we have to watch out for him but basically there isn't any real -- flareups or maybe threats of force but you really don't have actual combat until 1811 which again most historians would probably argue as far as the ohio valley goes to to a war of 1812 starts in 1811. >> how long was he in this position and then wended his presidential aspirations come into effect? >> this is one of the things i found interesting about him. i would argue his early career, he was in office for about a month. he doesn't actually do quite a lot during his presidential days. i guess we would say.

his earlier career is much more fascinating and he has on a much greater impact on american society particularly our western expansion in western policy. i think what got me interested in william henry harrison is i started in tecumseh and the shawnee war chief who is a pleading this confederation of indian fighting against the united states in the war of 1812 and tecumseh is one of these readily made, he rose and he actually gets oddly incorporated in the pantheon of american heroes because in many ways to our way of thinking he's is case is so incredibly honorable. he sticks by his guns and he is very principled. he fights for what he believes in. he was actually one of the few native americans who strongly objected to the torture and killing of prisoners in a time of war. that was also seen as very honorable. in high school in college reading about tecumseh but when it came time to graduate school baradar de been really fantastic