that the story says road his horse up the front stairs beat his horse out of the this as part of the side board. now, the comment was that he probably should not be feeding his horse in the governor's mansion and his comment to them was, i have had to feed more people in this home with probably less manners than my horse has. >> watch for book tv and

american history tv in jefferson city, missouri. july 7 and 8 on c-span2 and three. next on book tv jen mar low talks about militant who have after the bomb he and his friends exploded was imprisoned by the streellies. following a ten year incident in prison, peace center for coexistence in injuries lem an organize that brings together slawl between the two societies. this is about an hour fifteen minutes. [applause] good evening, everyone. it is wonderful to see you all here. it's wonderful to be here in such incredible community space as writers and books. i was telling this to joe earlier so many of my friends and contacts when i was e-mailing about the event, i

heard what a treasure it is. it's a great honor to have a chance to be with you here tonight. it's an honor mixed with a little bit of sadness because my coauthor sami al jundi would absolutely love to be standing here with me tonight. he would give everything to be able to with me because, for same, one of the main reasons we wrote the book is the deep belief in necessity in engaging with dialogue for communities. for sami al jundi the opportunity to be here and hear an response your thoughts, your ideas, your questions, that's the whole that's what it's all about. and the reason that sami is not hear. he has not been granted a visa by the u.s. government. sami applied for the visa on mar 20, 2009. and he has been waiting since then. he hasn't been rejected, he also

hasn't received the visa. it's been in, i think in administrating processing was the term i got from the consulate when i was inquiring about it. it's both a mystery and not a mystery why sami has not gotten the visa. the reason it is a mystery he received multiple different visa each for fife years. he's been to the u.s. probably a dozen times if not more. every single time it's been furthering his peacebuilding work. either he became he was accompanying israeli and palestinian youth to go to a summer camp where they engage in intensive dialogue. he was furthering his own peacebuilding education like when he went spent a summer at the eastern men night. why particularly this time when he applied he's been delayed and being processed is unclear. but the reasons that the u.s.

government and the consulate gave him or what became of in the questioning of him is because they were concerned about the security records. because sami spent ten years in israel prison from 1980 to 1990. and he was in prison because of an action that he took as an 18-year-old kid. as an 18-year-old kid, sami who was committed to wanting to fight for his people's freedom and dignity only knew one way to go about it and by becoming a fighter and militant. you'll hear about this as the evening progresses. when i was 18, he and two friends began building a bomb they intended to use against the israel police. the bomb exploded prematurity. one of the friends was killed on the spot in front of his eyes. sami and his other friend were greatly injured and they were taken by the hospital from the israeli security service,

interrogated, tortured and ten years in prison. when you'll hear, of course a lot more about it. it was in prison that sami realized that he was as committed to fighting for his people's feefm and fight for the people's dignity the choice how he wanted to fight for it is through nonviolence. that became the life's words in the two decades since -- now it's more than two decades since he got out of prison in 1990. so for some reason, that's not clear to me, the u.s. government choose to focus on the action that he took as an 18-year-old kid rather than the decades of life work that he spent since then trying to build the possibility of a peaceful and just reconciliation between palestinian and israelis. i would think and hope that members of our government would support and encourage and want voices like samis to be heard in

this country. and would want stories like sami's to have as wide a platform as possible. because sami himself couldn't be here. fortunately, there is a clip of him featured on a documentary film. it was made by an incredible organization called just vision and just vision's entire mission is to use media to support the work of grassroots palestinian and israel peace builders. some folks might have seen or heard about it. i think it's playing here in roch cherer in film festival in june. it previewed a few weeks ago called "my neighborhood." he was in the first one. i want to start off the eventing since sami can't be here in person at least givingout experience of meeting him through film and getting a little bit of chance to hear from him in the own words looking into the face, a snippet of his life story. and then after the clip, i'll

read a little bit from the book and talk more about the process of writing it with sami. one moment for the projector to warm up, and we'll be ready to roll.

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[speaking in foreign tongue] speaking in foreign language] [speaking in native tongue]

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you got a little opportunity to meet sami in the video clip. and i want to talk for a few moments about how i know sami and how we embarked on the journey together which ended up in the memoir and ended up in the hour of sunlight. i worked with sami for four years in the program you saw in the video. we were colleague for four years in juries lum. it doesn't describe my relationship with sam my. friends doesn't describe it. sami and his family became my adopted family when i lived there for four years myself and the notly crew of american colleagues of mine who were doing the peace work, we were treated as honorary members as the clan. and my colleagues and i spent hours and hours riding around with sam my in the battered blue

ford driving all over israel all over the west bank picking kids upbringing them to each other's homes to celebrate holidays with each other. bringing them to each other's schools. bringing them to the center we had in jiewrps lem we had for joint projects. while we would be riding with them we would hear the bits and pieces of the life story. some of the bits and pieces you saw a little bit on the video. you could probably tell that his mother is blind. his father is also blind. so sam my is one of 16 children 12 who survived infancy rough few fujis being raised by blind parents. you can imagine some of the hilarity. we hear some of the stories. we heard bits and pieces of his

experience in prison. and we heard about the choices he made after prison when he decided he was going to commit himself to nonviolence and reconciliation. whatever we would hear the stories, we would say, sam my you should write a book. he would turn to us and just dismisand us and say what are you talking about? write a book? there's nothing interesting about my life story. it's all very ordinary. he would say, it was all very ordinary. i'll get back to that statement in a little bit him saying the life story was order. but the book, you know, we sort of encouraged him and he didn't seem interested. it was years later in 2006, we met a disappointing ending with the organization we worked with. in sam my's case it was more than disappointment. he met with a great detrail and

he was really low at the time. he was struggling with the depression and i was talking to him a lot. i was back in the states i was talking to him encourage him. during the conversation he said you the know book that you said that you and all the friends said i should. i think i'm ready. i think i'd like to write it. are you serious? is this something you want to do he said, yeah, i'd like to do that. we talked for a little while longer. we decided i would fly out the next month and start working with him and start developing the book with him. and at the time, when i made the offer to go to jerusalem, at the time i did it because sammy was someone i loved and i knew he was hurting, and i wanted something for him to feel good about. i knew that writing the book being able to look in the eyes who were mocking him because the peace organization they never believed in and he defended had

now fired him and treated him in very humiliated ways he would be able to look them in the eyes and say i'm writing a book now. that's what i'm doing. and so initially when i made the offer, i made it because i wanted to do something for sami al jundi my and of course i had no idea could have anticipated what working on the project with my would do to me. very quickly i became incree belie passionate about the book and the life story for entirely different reasons than i first offered to go to jerusalem. one of the reason is wrapped up in the own statement when i was dismissing us and saying my life is very ordinary. there's nothing out of the ordinary. because of what i realized as we deviled deeply into the process some extent he was exactly right. his story is in many ways, a quince circumstantial palestinian narrative.

i because probably every single one of us sitting here probably embody multiple narratives just in our own lives, of course, any people contains multiple narratives. but so many aspects of his life story are a window into the larger palestinian experience. from the fact both of his parents were refuge agrees from the wars in '48 both from villages from depopulated. his mother from zach rei ya and the father from another place which is the site of probably the most infamous massacre in the war of 1948 it was before israel was declared. it was before the army massacred roughly 100 civilians and that's where his father is from. it's just in the entrance going jerusalem. for folks who know where it is,

if you're on the road heading to jerusalem, right at the entrance it's an israel neighborhood. that was his father's village. so many of his family's experiences in 1948, sammy's own earliest memory being driven from his home in the old state of jerusalem. he remembers fleeing from the home under gunfire taking refuge in the underground bakery with 100 other families until the war ended. we'll talk a little bit more. he spoke in the video what ended up happening to his home. his years in prison, in his generation and enormous of percentage of palestinian men spent time in israel prison. in those days you could go to prison for 18 months if you were caught chucking a stone. or waiving a flag in a demonstration. so sami's prison experience is part of the narrative.

in many ways it is a very ordinary palestinian story, but it is most at story we have a lot of ax excess to in this country. it's not a story we have a lot of exposure to in this country. in the u.s. we are so much more exposed and so much more familiar with the jewish narrative and the israel narrative and especially for those who like me grew up as a jewish american, i was em hersed in the literature, i was the kid who was reading the diary of ann frank and lying in bed and imagining i was her and imagining what i would do. i was a high school kid who was enraptured by the exodus. so i think particularly for jewish americans we were immersed in the narrative. it's true for all americans. a friend of mine who is a professor who often speaks in high school she does a poll raise your hands if you've read any books or know anything about the holocaust.

the vast majority of kids raise their hands. she asked okay raise hand if you know about the palestinian the catastrophe. that's the palestinian term for the displacement that began in 1948, and the destruction of palestinian culture and life in the wake of creation in the state of israel. maybe a smatter offing kids raise their hands. there's a huge gap of knowledge and acceptability to narratives. so although sami was right, it was ordinary. it was exactly that reason i was so passionate about bringing his story to an american audience. and then the other part of it, is that sami himself is so extraordinary. and out of that lived experience, out of that narrative, came someone who is so deeply committed, not only

about the possibility that there could be peace could be reconciliation between israelis and palestinian. he's not unique in that he is seeking nonviolence. i know, many pl and israelis who are committed to the principle of nonviolence in their work. many people say well, here we do not want to kill each other. we have to find some way to live together without violence and with peace. so in that sammy embraces nonviolence. that's not extraordinary or out of the ordinary. he goes beyond that in the absolute conviction and absolute belief that if things -- if the situation could be one where there is quality where everyone's right and needs and dignity were equally respected not only could israelis and palestinians live together, they

could create an incredible society together. that the land that is now, you know, the very broken holy hand could be an absolute the best place in all the middle east and maybe in all the world. that there is so many to learn from each other and so much to gain from each other if the partnerships could be predicated truly on equally and equal rights for everyone's needs. and, you know, sammy said to me once, he doesn't even recognize there's a distinction between your children and my children. and that was how he treated the kids that we worked with at the see the peace. there was no such thing as one side's children and other's children. they were all our children. so the combination of very quince essential life story and the very extraordinary human being with the extraordinary vision that came out of that

life story, that's what made me so incredibly passionate about writing this book with sami. and i realized that i, i mean, it was a four-year project. door to door from the first trip to jeer reduce lum when the book hit the shelves it was a four year process. i spent a good chunk of four years inhabiting the place of sami al jundi pain realized that i began to blur, i began to lose the distinction sometimes between myself and him. i literally i'd be in jerusalem taking friends through the old city and find myself wanting to point out the places that were important in sami's childhood. i found i was telling the stories as if they were mine. and this is where i played marnls, and no, i was never a 7-year-old palestinian boy growing up in the old city. i'd have to remember there was a distinction there. they were blurring in my own.

head. sami used the word spirit yule describing the connection we formed in the project even though before we began the project i considered him as close as a brother. and i thought i knew some of about him and thought i knew so much about his life and of course, i realized it only been the tip of the iceberg. and what i want do is read for you just a few samples from sami's book and rather than reading one long passage, i selected a few from different points of his life that you can get a sense of a little bit of the journey that sami continues to be on. hopefully we're in the mist of our own journeys. you can get a little bit of sense of transformation. and story that i want to start with, actually, is from when sami was about five years old, and this was -- amentioned this earlier he was living in the old

city of jerusalem when the war in 1967 broke out and they were hearing the yelling and the gunfire and fled to the bakery. the passage i'm going to read is when they got back to the home got back to the home after the fighting had ended and it was safe to go back to the homes. it was before soldiers later came and kicked them out of their home because the whole neighborhood was being torn down and being rebuilt as housing for israelis. in the war of 1967 is when israel occupied east jerusalem the west bank, gaza strip, sinai, and before the war began and the dumb beat to war started to picking up in volume and intensity. rumors starting flying. he was the 5-year-old kid. the whole world was his neighborhood. the dividing line between east and west. it was already part of israel, east was under control before

the 1967 war but the wall that celebrated east from west, just maybe 20-30 merits from sami's door. it could have been a million miles away for all he knew. i'm bad at geography. it was really close. i don't know exactly. the kids he was playing all the rumors started circulating about the jews that lived on the other side of the wall. one rumor fascinated sami in particular was what the kids were telling him that the jews on the other side of the wall had tails like a cat. sami thought that was cool. he was 5 years old, he never seen anybody who a tail. he wanted to see one. then the war happen, they were hiding in the bakery. the next morning he ran up to the room. the jews are coming to count us. they're two houses down. my mother was agitated.

my father tried to calm her. it will be okay, the fighting is over. just answer the questions that they ask. question gathered in the courtyard when the jews arrived. two of them were dressed in soldiers uniforms. they entered our house. what are they doing i whispered to my brother. probably looking for guns he whys beered back. one man remained us in the courtyard. it was tall and wearing a khaki pants and shirt. i had had a floppy hat. how many people live in the house he asked my father. we have two families here my father answered. floppy hat started with our family. name and birth date he asked any father and mother. he jotted it down. why are you writing this my mother asked nervously. so we can issue identified cards as he began recording the names and ages of the children. as he was writing sam mere's birthday he turned to my father,

what is your son doing? my father sensed immediately that i was not next to the rest of the family. sami, get over here. i had been behind hat trying to exam his bottom. [laughter] i cent back to my father red faced. what were you doing my brother whispered. i wanted to see his tail, i whispered back. what does it look like? i don't know couldn't find it. when he turned around, to count the other families, we craned our necks we could see nothing resembling a tail. maybe he tucked it inside his pants i whispered to him. then we would see some bulk he pointed out. perhaps there was something a matter with the jew i told myself. when the soldiers came out of the house we saw no sign of a tail on them either. i was bitterly disappointed.

[laughter] the ps to the story happens years and years later after he was out of prison, and while he was working for the palestinian center for the study of nonviolence. he and colleagues started a dialogue group for palestinian and israelis in jerusalem. it wasn't the work with the seize of the peace. it was people of sami's own age. during one of the early meetings when they were doing introduction. he shared the story and israel guy from west jerusalem about the same age started latching. he said, you know, we heard the exact same rumors on our side of the law about the arabs having tails like a cat. the next segment that i want to read is quite a few years later and he was now 17 years old. and and the friends

my job was to deliver sections of cabinets to the next destination on the assembly line shuttling back and forth with the small forklift. i wrapped the finish cabinets in thick plastic preparing them to be shipped. they barked orders and shouted at us. the word arab was added to whatever adjective he slung at us. there was only one nonarab

working with us. an old balding iranian jew. he was quite, gentle and a bit strange. he commed his thinning hair with a tooth bush. he did not spare the abuse. he was east in hebrew, it was a term used for jews. he was middle eastern jew one step away from being arab. more than hating him, i hated working in israel factory locate there. where is your job, sami people in the old city asked me. i had to tell them, aren't you from there? i lowered my eyes and slugged. my grandma visited from jordan. tears sprung to her eyes. is your uncle's house still there? i did not know how to tell her that only a few buildings from

the original city remain and the israelties turned them into a insign assign limb. my grandma gripped my arm. brig me a fig. i walked to the hart of the city. i watched the crazy people wandererring in the yard. when no one was watching, i plucked a fig and the lemon. i gave them to my gram mother to that evening. she held the lemon to the nose. he cradlessed the fig to her cheek. the figs she said there doctor no figs in the world like those from that city. the next day, i wrapped the cabinets, stairing out the large window overlooking the valley covered in fruit trees. all the workers here were nothing but traitors and i was the worst of them all. we were disrespecting the blood that been spilled here maybe the souls of the massacres were

hovers in the village. how could i justify myself to them. before wrapping the next cabinet, in the thick plastic i carved words across the face with the screwdriver. i did it again the next day and the next. the following week, i plugged the forklift back ward into the charger mixing the signals and bloiing out the circuits. each time shame overwhelming me i found some way to sabotage the work. my neighbor figured out what i was up to. sami you have to stop this. you're going cause problems for all of us. i looked straight into his eyes, i center no idea what you're talking about. the manager began to receive phone calls from europe about the defective cabinets. it was obvious i was the culprit i was the only one with the stages. you piece of rubbish. i'm going fire you i'm calling the police. i shouted back you want to call

the police? fine, call them. you can't fire me because i quit. i stormed out of the fact i are, and never returned. but i seniled, each time i imagined customers in bell gym and italy unrapping the new cabinets only to find the arab words i carved deeply across the doors. made in my city. one amazing thing about how about my hearing this story we set up a three stage prophis to the writing and go oned our own have clab lair. one was him are are narrative. i tried to write it word for word. we wanted me to be writing because we wanted the feeling we were writing the book together not that i was interviewing him and writing the book. it was, you know, there would be satisfaction at the end of the

day looking how many pages we had done that day. and we would go back and figure out where we needed to fill holes. that was the next stage where there needed to be more information and the final stage we called adding the spices. it was the all small sensory details. when e were in the stage of filling holes i was going over and i found the story. as he told it to me, when i was just him are narrating the story went something like this. i worked in the cabinet making factory for six months. i didn't like it so i quit. and it was only like, i year and a half later when i highlightedded that and made a note for myself. ask sami more about that. the next trip i said that cabinet making factory. can you tell me more about why you quit. the powerful story came powering out. it wouldn't have if i haven't identified that as a whole. it makes me whether or not

wonder what other holes i missed. what other times i didn't each or red flag there was more to a particular story. the next piece that i want to read, actually, is again, a few years later. it comes from during his time in prison. and, you know, in the video that you saw. it was clear that sami spent some of his time reading and that books had a tremendous influence on him. from the video you could imagine that he made the personal choice that he wanted to engage in reading and that's how he was going to pass the time. what i learned what was fascinating for me to learn was that the palestinian political prisoners in israeli prisons set up an absolutely incredible community amongst themselves. it included an education system, it included all different forms of solve governance, democracy, leadership they had. one time sami saw the news

committee. they meant they the contraband radio and listen to it softly at night and write down the news. in the morning, the janitor, who was a fellow prison would take the paper which was the paper from droll cell. that's how the prisoners got the news and the education system was what sami talked the most about. it was very, very i want candidate. there was four levels of courses he had to pass. there was time when the cells could design a lesson together. there was a neat system how books in the prison library were copied. they brought one book and it was in high demand. they would pass out a piece of paper, blank piece of paper and pencil. they would copy the page. someone who knew how to bind it, they bound it back together. they had two copies. fascinating, fascinates details. but there were only two hours a

day that two wakes houring a day that the prisoners were not sitting on the mat and reading or sitting in a circle or discussing what they were reading and engaged in reflection on what they were reading. one of the hours was the hour they spent everyday in the prison court are yard. it was the hour of sunlight they got every day. and the name of the book, actually, comes from a poem the preimminent palestinian poet. in the poem on the earth we have on earth what makes life worth living. the final days of september, a woman keeping her apricots ripe after 40. the hour of sunlight in prison. that was the hour in the. and the other a day was the hour the guards would play over the loud speaker a song. it was a famous egyptian

singer. say the hour because each of the songs were one hour long. i was home sick whenever i was sick. our hour each evening with the singer had a similar effect. we sat in the cell listening to her voice emanate from the loud speaker. each of us in the separate world. it was the one time of day we allowed ourself in indulge in memories. i sat on my mat, knees bend, my head bowed down closing myself off from my cell mates. i thought about my mother. she loved me more than anyone else in the world did. by getting myself locked away in prison, i had broken her heart. as the rich voice filled the prison and penetrated each prisoners heart i wondered if my mother was thinking about me. i cursed myself for the times i

shouted at her because i did not like the food she prepared. i imagined her warm voice as she could caution me. you need to take care and be agenda l and kind with ore people. words coming from her mouth sounded like prayers. before i left the house each morning within she would ask god to protect me and remove any bad person from my past. and then pressing her hands against my cheek, forehead, lips and nose she could make a copy of my face to store in my mind. she knew my touching my face whether i was happy or angry or sat. sad she read my face like brail. braille. i felt the same soothing breeze as when my mother read my face. i forced my thoughts to classmate. some of them might be in university others married and starts families. what do they think of me? ask they see me as a hero or had

adisappeared from the consciousness entirely? the singer made me yearn for the old city streets, my school, the cuke, the home, playing cards. the song finished and the guards shut off the loud speaker. we sat for a moment in silence and shook off our feelings and returned to the books. and the final that i want to share tonight years later 1997, he had been out of prison for seven years at this point. and he met a jewish american young man who had been a counselor at the cap in maine. the summer camp that brought israel and palestinian kids together. and they came to jerusalem, they wanted to get followup program. cease the peace was a camp in maine. the kids got back home, there was nothing for them to continue

their process. and he got jerusalem ended up meeting sami and he thought it sounded like exactly the kind of thing he wanted to be doing. they started working together in the start. and developing this program. and the passage that i want to read to you. comes very, very early on in both in sami in the relationship. and in sami's doing the work with the israel and palestinian youth. he called me one afternoon. you met your ab i had. it was dark haired, funny and spit out words quick. he invited us to the family pass over tomorrow night. are you up for it? i've never been inside a israel family home. in the cease the peace -- i looked guard to the opportunity to enter interability with the family from the heart of the israeli society.

my wife was never happy was work was going to keep me away from work and children. she knew i was excited. my parents were happy so long as i was involved in anything that did not lead to me in prison. i did not mention to my brothers and sister where i was going. as i left the old city. the parents welcomed us at the door and showed us in. there must have been fifty people crowded in there. they squeezed over to make room for us. i slid into a chair and looked at the face. the siblings, cousin, parents and uncles grandparents. the grand parents spoke hebrew. each generations of israel at the same table it reminded me of meals with my entire family. itbooks were passed around the table. i flipped threw mine. it looked like a children's book

telling the pass over story. i was surprised when the grandfather started chanting. it was not holiday sufficient nears. they part of an important ceremony connected to jewish ridge yule. we tasted items on the table according to the construction of the book. bitter herbs, i tried to pay attention to everything. what 0 foods we were supposed to eat in when. why we were dipping eggs in salty water. i knew from the qawrn here in the -- gave me new details and a different perspective. it was difficult to hear the whole story because gossip, laughter and conversation rose louder and louder. nobody seemed to mind that the grandfather was still in the midst of changing and he certainly appeared undisturbed by the voices and the clatter of dishes.

the food was delicious. the father was a supporter of this the largest right-wing vealing political party. the conversation with him was intense. but it was passionate, open, and warm. our voices were raised, but that was mostly because there was so much competing voice. nobody took anything personally or got upset. there was no uncomfortable silence. there was no silence at all. at the end of the meal, the entire family sang with the book once again while banging on the table. they were wonderful. yesterday i had been in a jerusalem supermarket when i answered my cell phone in arab being, the other shoppers staired as me. the day before, a 19-year-old soldier demanded to see my i'd in the manner that communicated he many the power and that i was barely tolerated. those incidents did not connect to my emotions sitting around

the table with multiple generations of this boy's family. i felt safe, welcome, wanted. i needed to brings adds many palestinian seize the peace participates as possible to the israel homes. if i had the opportunity at their age, how difficult the rest of my -- different the rest of my life might have been. i have a few comments to make at closing. but i want to invite whether it's che questions or comments or thoughts or responses. i think we're a small enough group, i think we have an opportunity to have some conversations. so joe has a microphone, and if anybody has a thought or question or comment, please raise your hand. when you get the microphone, please share. >> many israel and palestinian

that are opposed to the type of work of bringing together people from the both sides. and recently, within palestinian society, there's a lot of groups that are opposed what they call normal decision, which is, i mean, it's defined differently it's bringing israel and palestinian together when palestinian see that the israelis aren't already accepting certain palestinian points of view or parts of the palestinian. what is your experience dealing with the israel and palestinian that were oppose to the type of work that you were doing when you were working with seize the peace in jerusalem and sami's experiences over the years doing this type of work? >> it's a very complex, it's a very important question that you ask in a complex one. i'll do my best to try to answer it in a pithy of way as i can. there are absolutely israeli and

palestinians who are opposed to dialogue-based work. and i guess, the definition of what's considered nor lal decision in palestinian society they find the most -- like i said there's different definition, the one they usually use is that the criticism about the programs is that when there's such a power in balance, and there are programs that are focused on relationship buildings without directly confronting the power and balance that you're actually normalizing the occupation, that the criticism that those programs that the endanger of reinforcing the power structures by creating by focusing on the relationship building rather than focusing on the structures of power and privilege that are so unequal and that need to be addressed. then, of course, the counter argument of that is how are more and more people going to be aware of the fact those power

structures are still unequally specifically for the israeli using with i know dozens of jewelries that's what made them aware. that's what politicalized them. that's what got them doing the work. i very much understand all sides of that argument and for me, myself personally, and i'm not speaking for sami, i'm speaking for myself. right now i choose to support work that's more active than the dialogue based work. i choose to support work that is joint israeli palestinian but who are using engage and direct action nonviolence against those power structures, and so every week in villages where the wall has been built, and the west bank there are demonstrations of israel and palestinians and internationals together. it's the palestinian-lead movement of nonviolence. they asked israel partners and international partners to join them. that's the work i'm drawn to. sami continues to pay a high price for his deep belief in

necessity of dialogue. and in his deep belief in order to build the army of people that's needed to confront the reality to confront the is a us quo and change it ha to come through a mutual using and that could only happen through dialogue. and i hate speaking for sami. that's why it's important he get to speak for himself but i believe that's what he would say because of the conversations we've had. and he faced a lot of opposition, and he was, you know, he was called the kick of normal decision with great scorn by people in the community. he paid a very, very high price. he in many ways cashed in the political capital when he got out of prison, he was a hero, he had been a freedom fighter. he spent ten years in prison. and, you know, he staked all of that capital on his very, very deep belief in necessity of

dialogue and the necessity of meeting each other and equal human beings as the first step towards being able to rectify the underlying problems of power and privilege that's so unequal. does it answer your question? >> [inaudible] >> you probably know. sami, the soldier. and one of the possible titles we were tossing around for the book was soldier for peace playing on his last name. it is the soldier. >> jen, i read the book and appreciated it so much. but i have to say at the end, began to be very concerned for sami because i felt so attached to him. so i wonder if you could tell us what is sami doing now?

>> so the end of the book -- the bookends at the point where sami is, you know, and i mentioned at beginning of the talk that he really went through a deep deposition when he meant with the end at cease the peace and stagedded so much of his whole life and reputation and was treated in the humility way from the organization -- that was extremely painful and devastated for him. and the end of the book is right in that moment. i hope it ends in a little bit of hopeful possibility. sami today, i wish i could say that everything is wonderful for sami. but he's still struggling. he's still, right now he's working as a cash cheer at the grocery store in east jerusalem. he works seven days a week, nine hours a day. that's not what he wants to be doing. that's not what he should be doing in terms of united stating the tremendous -- using the tremendous resources he has, the

internal resources, and what he's committed and what he's passionate about. but with ten-year prison word in israel prison, it's hard to get other kinds of work. i think he began to have a lot of question marks about some of the international organizations that were doing peace work. there is, you know, much like there's the humanitarian aid industry is an important life life saving industry. there's problems how it operates. the same could be said of the peace industry, the international peace industry in palestinian, israel and other parts of the world. i think he began to feel skeptical about some of that. in some ways, i think he feels himself to be stuck. but i think he also feels like he's keeping the embers going because he wants to be able to still contribute all his passion and all his energy. and sami's a poet and writing poety is one of the ways he

continues to express what he wants to say and make the mark. recently, we learned that the poems one of sami's poem at the end of the hour sunlight it's being published of poets who responding to the palestinian-israel conflict. he's thrilled about that and continuing to find ways as engage as he can and keep the four kids fed, and keep himself moving, you know, in the direction that he wants to see everyone moving in. what lead you to the work? i'd be interested in anything you care to share about the what happened just before you started your lecture tonight. what drew you into seize for peace in order to be in a place to meet sami and write the story? >> i had very, very little background or knowledge about

the israel-palestinian conflict aside from, i mean, i grew up as a jewish-american in the reform jewish movement, which some folks might know very much as social justice system. and that was the part that always inspired me. i was in the youth group movement an the summer camp movements and i was drawn to the social action aspect of it. the social justice aspect of it. looking back what i realized or how i analyze it looking back, i think there was a real maybe i can say crisis in how the reform movement was trying to deal with the israel-palestinian questions, because they -- in my memory of or experience it was absolutely ignored. i never -- i don't remember ever being educated that all arabs were terrorist or anything like that. i also certainly was not educated about the -- we were marching about appar tide in south africa. we were involved in so many

social justice issues. the whole israel, palestinian was ab sees on that. i credit as social justice training grounds. i received a fellowship from the foundation to live in jerusalem for a year. they give fellowships to 15 americans every year. i think i might have been two days in jeer jerusalem and i was wandering through the old city. i was wandering through the market i actually remember feeling like e never heard it about it before the detail how the occupation was impacting human lives. and i remember this was in 1997, and i remember i think i spent five hours that day talking to one person after the other and

one of the merchants said to me, there's going to be another war and going to start this year. you should leave because, you know, foreigners shouldn't get caught up in that. and '97, it was during the peace process. it was the hopeful people, i had no idea that these were hopeful possibility that the reality for palestinians was that more check points were blossoms up that seattlements were eating up more and more of the land. that reality was actually worstenning. it was the first i was hearing of any of it. it was a little bit wrong in terms of the timing. it erupted not that year, but a few years later in fall of 2000. but the sentiment i was beginning to touch was right on. and for me, it was a -- just my eyes were open and there is

quote once you see it you can't unsay it. i saw it, and then i needed to respond. .. and let me back where i then met sammy and everything else you've already heard.

>> i have two questions. one is if you could say something about the betrayal, and the other thing is did you write in arabic was the book written in arabic and what language was it written initially? >> the great questions, the first question was about the vitriol written about exhaustively in chapter 14 and to give a brief overview it isn't so different from a lot of other organizations that have very inspiring mission statements but in terms of how the organization functions. there but respecting the dialogue and organizations often function in ways tha the trade

what happened in the piece is not a unique example of that. i also think part of what was going on is that in some ways the organizations that were operating in the context of the middle east conflict began to reflect certain aspects of the conflict so the power dynamics that were playing out in some ways more a reflection i believe of some of the elements of the conflict that were playing out at that time, and i think there was a whole confluence of different sources that we got caught up in the was a broad brush stroke. the second question of the language was written and should have been written in arabic and the reason it was in this because i don't speak arabic, you know, modern conversational arabic but english is the least fluently which, so for sammy he was carrying his story to me and

in his most difficult language although even in english he is quick and had it this way of expressing his points that are so beautiful even when he has to do a work around in terms of the vocabulary. we wanted to have someone else in the room with us so he could speak fluently in arabic and have an interpreter and he felt very strongly, and it was his choice, but that would interfere too much in the dynamic and there are so many parts of the book that were for him to narrate he was the telling his experience of torture where he would be shaking at the end of talking about it, and i think that the trust that we had initially and the amount of that trust and relationship grew through the process was part of what allowed him to expose so

much of what he exposed. the part about building the bomb, sammy isn't proud of the action he took as an 18-year-old, and he talked -- there was a point he really had to decide whether or not he was ready to exit rows that to the world come and he was incredibly courageous and he decided that he was ready to but when he finished telling me that episode and he was sitting and shaking and he said i feel like the service are about to come in and grab me right now, so there was a lot of revisiting of the trauma that was a part of the process, and i don't know that he would have felt safe doing that if there was another person and you would create a sacred space for those conversations.

>> yes, go along with the previous question, i was watching on the film the activities he got together with the young people, israelis and palestinian children, and i was trying to think of how our ways people in that place can have a common bond? is everybody in true islam bilingual, and can every arab understand hebrew, can every is really understand arabic? when they meet together, how do they work out which language they are going to speak pucks is english ever used as some kind of a neutral language? what are the communication levels for the people? >> that's a really excellent question and i think i'm so fascinated with some of the dynamics of that language

because in many ways they reflect so many dynamics in the conflict. jerusalem is a very divided city in every sense of the word. there isn't a physical wall running down. there's other places now. but, you know, there might as well be a physical wall in terms of how separated the communities are. and they do not all speak common languages. and most of the activities we did were in english with the idea that there was a neutral language. but that was problematical so. generally they have access to better education the started english at an earlier age than the palestinians did so we were working in a language that one group had better mastery of them another group, so there was problematic and is also problematic dealing with interpreters for the same reason the question you just asked there is a fear the party kind of interference and the ability to really communicate directly.

one of the most fascinating experiences i had dealing with language had to do with a group that was all citizens of israel, but palestinian citizens and jewish israelis. they did all speak fluent hebrew because they are citizens. it's required that they learn hebrew. the israelis are not required to learn arabic. everyone learns english then as a second language they have a choice between french or arabic. and there were some palestinians in the group that insisted on speaking in english even though hebrew was actually better than english, but because of the issue of dominance of language because the palestinians were in some ways making the point like we have to learn your language come you haven't had to learn the hours. speaking in your native language, even though that might be more fluid than the third language, it's still not my mother tongue and there was an

act of resistance about that by choosing to speak in english. so, so many fascinating dynamics around language in the conflicts that's really an excellent question. >> i think we have time if there is one or two more questions. >> one of the things that struck me about the book is our accepting he was when he got his prison sentence, just it was ten years about what i expected and that is the exact opposite of what you have in the country regardless of how guilty your for the crime and i've wondering if that was indicative of his peers or if that was something special just for him. >> i'm not really sure how to answer that question in that i haven't had the same level of conversation. i've known in a lot of other former prisoners my sense is that it was pretty expected and before he got his sentencing he had been for a year and a half

in the process of the military trial, so he had a lot of contact with older prisoners who told them a lot about what to expect from the military process and from his eventual in prison and and there was also a great deal of status involved. he talk about the distinction between people in prison as criminals because they had jacked a car or something like that versus the political prisoners who were in prison because of acts of resistance. there was a great deal of status and in some ways the longer you're prison sentence the more sort of cache you have as a freedom fighter and he was still and 18 year old kid so he was caught up in some of that as well. but i think that he was pretty much expecting that would be what the sentence would be. in conclusion, i want to tell a story and then a comment that

kind of comes out of the story. the story some of you have read the book might remember the story about. i was talking a few moments ago about palestinian citizens of israel which is a community that a lot of people don't realize. and in fact when people talk about the palestinians is really conflict and the frame it as the two sides, palestinians verses israelis, then it doesn't leave space in the framing for 20% of the israeli citizens who are indigenous palestinians and these are the palestinians that live within what has been the border since 1948. before the occupation of the west bank and gaza and they were able to stay or manage to stay in the village when so many other palestinians fled or were expelled from their villages. and one boy that was one of the star participants his name hoff sommers was a 17 year old and it was just his whole life since he

had been 14 he was totally committed to this piece work and to doing this work with his israeli and palestinian peers and colleagues to be amazing kid with a 100-watt smile is how he was described and i met him at the camp in 1990 and worked with him in 2000. when it broke out in september, 2000, deborah doud also in palestinian villages inside of israel, mostly in the north and there were demonstrations near the village. he put on his green feed the peace t-shirt and went to see what was happening to the demonstration and when his parents heard where he had gone to try to bring him home and they were scared for him and he climbed up a small hill and they could see him because he was wearing the teacher that he wore almost every day he was always wearing said they saw the police

climb over the guardrail and charge towards him. they saw him turning towards an olive grove and beat him on the back with a rifle and they saw him stumble and fall than they were in the way but they heard the shots and the doctor exam and him when they were managed to bring him into a clinic which was very hard because the ambulance couldn't get in because of closure so they were sort of flying checkpoints that get set up and dismantled. they said it looked like he had been shot point-blank in the back of the neck as he was sleeping face down in the olive grove and he was dead on arrival at the hospital. the israeli government was actually one of 12 palestinians there were killed in october 2000, and october 2000 is known as black october to the palestinians citizens of