and able to do. plus the fact we have and that open our needs to be. and i would challenge the white house on this because the president in his important archive speech pledge to go to congress to get the legislation, long-term legislation hasn't happened. and so his responsibility to the white house, responsibility on the hill to do this, we explicitly will not happen this term. but it's a serious debate to go to the question of what is the threat we're facing a mutter the authorities we want to deal with? >> i think there is a panel tomorrow that looks at the legal issues so people can dive deeper. why do we take some questions?

>> richard from the united nations. i'm interested to hear about the contraband extremism and initiatives. there's so many things you could do in so many parts of the world. ideas have your priorities and how do you measure the impact? >> is a really good question and there's been an evolution in the way we approach this issue. they think in the early days of a first or working under brad extremism that's an enterprise can they tended to be broadly based almost out of country level, often times related to counter messaging. some programmatic serenaded to some other tools and capabilities that we have. but over time, we realize the threat of violent extremism and radicalization is not equally distributed across a given country. we can to see hotspots of radicalization. disproportionate number of people that were engaged in recruitment, that were joining pipelines into iraq.

we had ted wong, why they don't case for your thoughts of people in morocco going out to spain, but also then going out to fight in iraq. and in eastern libya as well. now the adage for us is that we've now done is move to a much more surgical nuanced approach, where once we're able to identify a hotspot of radicalization, we can really understand dynamics within that specific location in community. we understand the key imports, what are the key developments, what are the local drivers of violent extremists and radicalization that appeal. and you know, bob go back and others at the state department lead and matter where they are able now to plan whole of government resources to target those very specific locations is just about every tool that we have. so it is no longer simply one intelligence agency doing it.

it is state department with nga, cia, dod, department of education where appropriate. i think what we are fighting right now is the impact tends to be more robust. also when you are focusing on a much tighter area, it's a bit easier to know what your impact is in control various other fact is i might be having something to do with radicalization. >> josh minor from the dell national security. it seems like what your strengths and ways a lot of military emphasis on the war on terrorism comes 11 years after 9/11 one of the components he seemed to be missing on the war on terrorism overseas and international law enforced in component. i think there's frustration on the port of law enforcement and counterterrorism. there really isn't a mechanism

overseas for arresting and extraditing prosecuting terrorists or the law enforcement community he was just wondering but you guys thought about that. part of that is obama said in the defense reauthorization act. >> josh, i would disagree with that. i don't disagree with the notion that early in the day's family had a military response. we invaded afghanistan, fighting al qaeda and i. but i would disagree. i think sean joyce would talk about the robust international relationships they've built. and it's not just the fbi. the department of homeland security and its components have not just relationships, but are now posted a brad. the whole notion of pushing borders that has led to customs officers at key ports of exit and entry. and so i don't agree. you also see, which is interesting is to talk about a

minute these threats, drug traffickers with hezbollah and west africa. the north african group ties to drug trafficking. in other agencies like the dea actually getting quite involved internationally. if you look and i know you know this, josh coming from your reporting over the past two, three years and the dea has brought to justice in new york taliban narcotraffickers, luring them to new york, luring other people at different places, including victor booth. that was an operation by the dea. so i would disagree because i think there is robust information sharing. the question of how you deal with long-term detention for dangerous terrorists, with whom you do have not evidence you can present in any course to keep them under custody for criminal purposes. that is the problem of guantánamo at its core. and that is the problem with this administration in the prior

administration had with how do you determine to do with these long-term? >> hi, do they truly are, senior fellow at the homeland security policy institute. full disclosure is to work for ken and the bush white house. there are many issues that are urgent, some of them are very important, some of them are not important at all in the grand scheme of things. but does not important urgent issues can consume an enormous amount of staff time and energy. so my question to can and want come as he looked at dinner time, what advice would you have two current and future white house staffers and other people in terms of maximizing committee and strategic refocusing on what really matters and not getting caught up in this hot inbox item with this little issue here or there that can really detract

from the overall ability to serve the president and the american people affect lake? >> yeah, i think you push your finger on an interesting point. david's staff secretary of sad sort of everything homeland security came through him. and that is something you have to calibrate a severe cad anywhere. you're constantly trying to look at things urgent and there's always an inbox full of urgent things he had to deal with right then and there. also long-term things you can take your time on and the dangers those get drowned out any never get to them because you're constantly dealing with day in and day out fires. sacco needs to start addressing these and this is where you're going, you sit there and get the churn. and i think of a couple of examples. for instance, dealing with the bio threat, towards the end of the bush administration, we spent a lot of time looking up what should we do to try to deal with the threat of bio warfare,

biological weapons of mass destruction. that's a real serious concern. the grand commission has been banging the drum for the last two years about how we're just not prepared to deal with that. because it wasn't sort of immediate comment on my category of long-term strategic business they need to be made. but in some ways those are the hard decisions to make because there's nothing like the good emergencies to force action here there's nothing on the horizon. it took a while to get that action. that's the calibration you have to have. if there is one answer to the security advisor for the president, you just make sure you got really good people around you who keep an eye on those because you as security advisor will get pulled away on all the craziness t-shirt and you'll forget about those things. >> just real quickly. >> ii think the trust and the professionals who are charged

with their duties is critical in ensuring that you keep focus on strategy. so category of activities we are not sure if it's important until you run through. the white house can't ignore. the best example is one that is personally involved in october 2005, radiological attack or in sri lanka goes off. something radiological coming out of the four. the problem is the department of energy put in the monitor didn't have the whole system in place. didn't have the camera, did not the tracking system so we didn't know what the heck caused it or where one is. for two weeks straight out of the white house are recorded in intelligence matters, diplomatic efforts. the navy efforts, coast guard efforts, entirety of the infrastructure to figure out what it's caused because we have whittled down to 17 ships in five ships and two were headed to new york. we had no idea what was on it and no idea if it was real

enough. at the end of the day the scrap metal or radiological material scrap metal. we didn't know until we had boarded all those ships that we had identified and took two weeks of our time nonstop. >> very quickly we have a minute or two left. >> a lawyer and vietnam vet now. going back to the president picking targets, everyone is familiar with president johnson spending a lot of time at this staff picking targets and of course the critique was that he missed the big picture. now we have apparently president obama picking targets and five ties and spending time on killers. and yet there is no particular search being pushed forward by the administration, head of military surge. but there doesn't seem to be any real political surge to bring this war to some kind of a reasonable conclusion. if you have any comments on

president obama's involvement? >> wow, i don't know about these involvements, but i think though what is the administration doing to bring this war to the end? i think by maximizing the use, per the ideas of having that impact. the proof is in the pudding base because of everything done since 9/11, including. >> one quick closing thought. you think there's going to be an increasing emphasis on the work you do, which is somewhat related to his point, the non-kinetic side. is that morris the future? >> its mechanisms and needs, but i think going back to the preventative side is very important because the groups that were going to be facing,

domestically and abroad are very likely to evolve and change. and the united states if the tax law enforcement officials, which we have throughout the country about what the violent extremism type they are most concerned about, by a sovereign citizens, violent white supremacist groups targeting local law enforcement. in any preventative work we do, it is a broad approach we can apply to a range of different threats. >> without i think we have to finish. thank you guys so much for a great session. [applause]

>> my brother scott last night called me up and said i watched the debate on c-span. you do great. you got your ascii braille the race. [laughter] [applause] where is lee ray? [cheers and applause] what a gentleman. what a gentleman, what a pleasure, what a delight it has been to debate leave right a dozen times.

[cheers and applause] >> let's get this guy elected. [cheers and applause] >> it is true, we made each other better candidates and i can't thank them enough. like i say, no one, no one could've been more cordial. no one could have been more gracious. no one could've been more articulate regarding libertarian ideals. >> later tonight, more speeches from third-party candidates like libertarian nominee, gary johnson. >> now, fairness in elections and participation lies.

panel members include south carolina attorney general well-settled montlake kansas secretaries of state. they talk about their states voter identification laws. the heritage foundation, along with about foundation hosted this. it is an hour and 15 minutes. >> and so, i am just going to introduce its founder and president. i will let her introduce the other speakers that she has assembled an i am a come back to this podium to pose a question or two unrecognized audience members. we want to welcome not only those of you here in our layer meant auditorium, but those of you watching on the internet from heritage's feed and those of you from c-span and cbs who are also watching today's event. the topic of today's discussion is a significant concern to all of us. and i might or might not i

suppose intergenic a few thoughts later. but i've also appointed by the house of representatives to be a commissioner on the u.s. commission on civil rights. it is a special duty of the commission on civil rights to examine voting rights, special charge in our statute. and i certainly agree with today's speaker that we can do a better job of improving the election integrity of the united states. but with this, i am going to kids and all too brief introduction of catherine ingo bratt who is the founder and president of truth about. prior to 2009, i think she would appreciate a pretty low national profile. she was primarily known of course as mom and a wife and a business owner, but in 2009, she did something admirable.

she in houston texas started the first of two nonpartisan organizations to increase citizen involvement in the election. and the second of those is true the vote, which is our cosponsor today. and that is a citizen led effort to restore honor and integrity to the electoral system. i recently, "politico" has listed her as quote, among the 50 politicos to watch. it's a pretty big claim she's had a few years, from the obviously important work of mother, wife and business owner to be so recognized. so that is because the organization she started first in houston, really fulfilled an important need. and that is to encourage citizens to be more active in helping ensure voter integrity. one of the simplest tasks of courses just to fill the ranks

of poll watchers. and those of you who have gotten engaged in politics know that that is a desperate need in our state electoral system. well, that mission has grown in just a few years to take a comprehensive approach to free and fair elections. truth about provide state training, technology and support necessary to help equip citizens to fill their role to help in election integrity. she can talk about her own organization and their needs better than i can. but i understand you are not active in about 30 states. and i wish that not only her organization, but others like you continue to flourish. with that, catherine, why did she take over. >> thank you. thank you so much, todd and

heritage for the great privilege to cosponsor this event. today we will hear messages from very distinguished leaders on the subject of election integrity. for why? why this panel, why now? why are you here? you know, you heard it said already from todd, but i would like to take a step back and tell you why i'm here. because as you rightly said, it are years ago, less than three years ago i was a wife, mom and frankly still am a wife and mom, but my role has changed and it was because of what happened in my life in 2009. in 2009 a small group of us in harris county are malicious where houston is, the third largest voting block in the nation. a big chunk of voters. and we wanted to do something. something that would give back to our community.

we heard there is a need for people to go look at the polls. but that that's simple enough. will work for a day and check that out for good citizen lesson move on to send e-mails. what happened though is really what ultimately sad truth about into motion. on that day we saw everything at the poll from confusion about the very process by which we cast and count our votes all the way through to which only be described as election fraud. we saw people who would come in and not show any form of of identification whatsoever he be allowed to go. and in texas you have to show something. some of the 50 states watch it online you don't have to show anything. in texas you do, but they were. we saw people coming in with multiple registration cards. the way that kind of plays out is voter purges the table, presents a registration card and installed the card has been voted in the present another

registration card they are told that when you can vote and off they go. we saw people who would come in and be told they had been cast by mail and then they would have the sort of blank look, like i didn't vote mailing. but what could they do? that vote had already then counted. we also saw people who would come in and prepare to vote, only to open the poll book and see their name had already been signed. but it wasn't in their signature. when you see things like that, and let me preface it by saying that wasn't everywhere. and the majority of the places we went and worked in 2009, we had great experiences. experience to make you proud to be an american and if you are really contributing. but there were enough of us had such similar stories that we recognized this might be something we need to take a closer look at. it made you wonder if this is

what is happening when people are watching. what happens when no one shows up? frankly that's an all too common problem that i've come to understand much better. we have about half the number poll volunteers across the country. it's a big problem we face because our system was always built around the expectation the citizens that get involved. when we abdicate our duty and leave the field, there's a void in that void is going to be filled with something. so whether we do with truth about? we build them at with that came ideally a place that looked at all the ways in which citizens can get involved in the practice and that we build systems that would support that engagement. super letdown is added to the voter registry. people who worked at the polls were well-trained and collect data all along the way so that

when our state legislative session came back in, if there was need for election code reform, at least there is data to support it. at least you have empirical evidence to point to and say we saw these things. these things really did happen. it begins to clear some of the fog of the conversation. we started out with the intention of working locally and hoping one day that maybe this would catch on nationally. but i guess it's just a sign of the times we live in, things have been very, very quickly. flash forward 2009. were active in 35 states. we're helping to support hundreds of citizen led election integrity organization, many of which contacted us out of frustration, having been similar things to what they see, in some cases much worse and wanting some aim to be a part of to help solve the problem.

you guys ever get sick of forwarding e-mails to one another and being generally outraged about this or that? true the vote is an opportunity to be engaged and make a difference. if our trend continues, if our rate of growth continues, we believe it is entirely possible we might mobilize to a million new volunteers between now and november 2012. and so that is what brings me here, my desire to true the vote, to know with certainty that our votes count and are counted. because when you peel back all of the politics, out to be the narratives, all the posturing, when you just have to average american voters, they are concerned. and that is why true the vote has become a national movement and the short period of time. there is a national consensus we must be able to depend upon accuracy of those elections

because the leaders then go on to lead our country. that is why these leaders are here. i suspect that is why you're here. something is not quite right and we know it. now, and the last 10 years there've been prosecutions or convictions in 46 states on counts of election fraud. margins of the area or type name, often deciding major elections by only a few hundred votes. global elections are certainly affect it, but subversion a process can and does affect national elections, too. in 2008, we saw an incumbent, senator norm coleman lose to challenger al franken by a margin of roughly 300 votes only to later learned that more than 300 votes had been illegally cast. the outcome of that election gave the senate a democrat supermajority that allowed passage of historically controversial legislation like

the affordable health care act of election lines not been broken wood that had happened? elections have consequences. and we continue to see the version of process, the insufficiency of safeguard. i don't know if you read this, but just yesterday and can tacky, there was a lot of news coverage about a new drugs for votes scandal, where people were being paid and drugs for the sale of their votes. reports out of new york, new mexico, virginia, florida, wisconsin, indiana and all reporting different types of frauds, diverting the process in different ways, but all with the same alarming implications. in april of this here come the pew research center released a report that estimated nearly 13% of our nation's voter registry is inaccurate. over 2 million dead voters on

the role and hundreds of counties with more than 100% of eligible population registered to vote, ladies and gentlemen, that is not good. according to a recent poll, 64% of americans think voter fraud is a problem. i can, something we should address. now, we are watching states trying to right the wrongs, to rectify the problem, restored and meet with what some may consider outrageous levels of resistance in many cases from the federal government. state governments are being sued by our federal government because the states are following federal law. in the root of many federal cases is the issue of photo voter identification. nearly 70% according to a rasmussen poll agree to voter identification makes sense. they wanted. but somehow there is a disconnect between what people

want and what some politicians lie, with some special interest into one. somehow the will of these groups who pretend to speak for the people have effectively muffled their boys. so we are here today to open a dialogue to discuss what is working, what isn't working and how we can listen to the american voter and restore their confidence in american election. there is a problem with lack of election integrity, but doesn't stem from a lack of ingenuity or lack of resources or lack of importance. much of it stems from the reluctance to have tough conversation and a political environment that is less concerned about supporting the sanctity of american elections than they are in many cases advance in the self-serving agenda. but there is leaders stepping up and speaking out because if they don't, then the very cornerstone

of our republic is at risk. a confident, engaged electorate leads to a united america and that is why it everyone on this panel and i daresay everyone in this room once. we want the united states. we want to be in agreement on issues of election integrity. we do not want the divided state and that is a path down which we are heading. so with us today are some of those leaders who have faced a breakdown of system and are choosing to speak out, to take action in their state and in so doing to protect liberty itself. we are so pleased to be joined by our distinguished panelists. i'll introduce each one and then each one will take the podium and share with you their own comments. the first gentlemen are they to introduce is subsidized kris kobach. a strong advocate of requiring voter i.d. at the polls and has

led the way an overall improvement of our electoral process by developing a legislative program that includes provisions for security and mail-in ballot, laws requiring proof of citizenship while registering to vote and requiring voters to show photo identification. his secure and fair elections program called save as a model that i believe should be considered best practice and election integrity and he has seen great success with it in kansas. our next speaker will be secretary scott gessler. secretary state of colorado. secretary gessler is fighting for integrity and his take on the front open records request in checking names against the state's voter registry database to improve the veracity. prior to being secretary of state, mr. gessler served a bipartisan election boards and commissions, including the election reform commission that

has made many recommendations to the general assembly. he sought election law at the university of colorado and has been widely recognized for his work and now i secretary of state, it is his responsibility to protect the sanctity of colorado selections and it is a task he takes very seriously. our third speaker today will be attorney general, alan wilson. general wilson realizes that vote fraud is a problem not only in his home state of south carolina, but across the united states. in his stadia sought to prevent criminals and the occurrence of voter fraud. wilson found that even 953 ballots cast by voters as today is dead, 71% of those ballots had been cast between two months and 76 months after the people that. voting onto a little over six years after their deaths. that's amazing. and our last speaker, former

representative artur davis of alabama. representative davis is a former member of the democratic party can assert in the house of representatives from 2000 until 2008, representing the southern district of alabama. representative davis is known to be inspired in the house, never afraid to challenge the left or the right. he's been a vocal advocate for voter i.d., demanding photo identification be required at the polls and i'm confident that each of these panelists will bring a unique of scene on the front lines out in the state. so without further ado, i will turn over the podium to secretary of state, kris kobach. [applause] >> thanks, catherine and thank you off for being here and the heritage foundation for hosting this event are cohosting this event. when i was sworn in as secretary

of state in kansas at january 2011, my primary objective was to set about drafting the strongest anti-voter fraud law possible in any state and to get it enacted and implemented as quickly as possible and we succeeded in doing that. the secured for elections act was signed by the governor at april 2011. it took effect, most of the provisions took effect in january 1st, 2012. as catherine heard dimension, secure and fair elections act make kansas the first state to combine three things. some states have done one or more, but we are the first state to have voter i.d. at the polls. equivalent protection for mail-in ballot so that mail in ballot has to have the bad application before sent out. and you have to have either a photocopy of qualifying photo i.d. for a full drivers license number and non-driver i.d. with the application coming in. and thirdly, kansas requires proof of citizenship at the time you the registered voters registered to vote.

the information presented to the state legislature to show the case for the safe act was pretty compelling at that time. 221 cases of voter fraud between 1997 and 2010 in our state that the number is now up to 235 if you count the 2010 election. and we now have some early results from a buffet fat has achieved in its first six months basically and the fact. we have had lots of local elections. a total of 53 county and local elections since the law went into effect. i'll share with your numbers, some of the statistics we've seen already. author a lot of numbers that shoe, but in a semi-coherent way. here are the kurdish foundation recently yesterday issued a study of some of those results. those are not able to copy numbers down, there are copies of his report outside of this

auditorium. 53 elections. in the cities are elections, over 68,000 people voted. it's a pretty huge sample size and you think about it. certainly bigger than any survey. 68,000 votes cast. of the 68,000 votes cast, 84 people commit grand total of 84 people showed up at the polls without a photo i.d. we of course have access to the driver's license database to the state of kansas. turns out the vast majority actually have a drivers license. either forgot to bring it or chose not to bright to make a political statement. if you look at the number, 84 out of 68,000, approximately one 10th of 1%. .12%. all of those people were given provisional ballots under kansas law have either six or nine days depending on the county to bring in a qualifying photo i.d. to the county election office and to move their pile -- their ballots in the provisional title

ii the shout be counted pio and make sure their vote is counted. 39 decided to go ahead and do that, roughly half. probably the rest decided they saw the margin of the election decided it wasn't going to make the difference, so they didn't want to do that. those numbers i think are pretty compelling, but that is just the beginning. as you go further, additional numbers debunk two prominent mints that critics of photo i.d. laws are propagating. the first myth is large percentages of the american public lack a photo i.d. most of us know intuitively from the people we meet and going about our daily life is that's not true. most people are hard-pressed to think of one person they know who? a photo i.d. in kansas, that's a pretty broad list of photo ids, including a 90s. at any rate, there's some groups it may pretty outrageous claims, like it and i do, that 11%? a photo i.d. based on a survey

from 2006 and a keeper line in the 2006 survey, which should be an indicator you want to stick with old numbers rather than get better numbers, more accurate numbers i should say. the percent of people who came in for the free non-driver i.d. that kansas makes available and all the other states is astonishingly small. between january and may 4, the last day we have numbers, only 32 people in the state out of a population of registered voters of 1.7 million, only 32 have come in and been able to sign a form that lists all of the acceptable forms of photo i.d. and so you don't have any ideas, please get me free non-driver i.d. that is .002% or 21,000th of 1% who have done so. there is a second myth and that made this photo i.d. laws will have a racially disproportionate in fact i'm some races more than others.

this is promulgated by none other than the justice department. again, numbers in kansas to reflect that. the people who ask for a free non-driver i.d., roughly reflect percentage of the various racial groups in the state of kansas. in addition to this, there is another falsethe meniscus loss to statistics and more just a general point. another false statement promulgated by people who oppose these guys. people only saw one form of voter fraud, namely voter impersonation did i come to the polls, give her name and try to vote your ballot. that is true. it also stops many other forms of voter fraud, specifically three types of voter fraud that it prevents. one is voter impersonation. we have a case of that in kansas. i'm sure it happens many, many times we don't know about. we do have one case we do know about. time assures we'll go into it. it also stops voting fraud

identities. we probably heard report in the 2000 election cycle from the organization known as acorn, specially states like nevada where there's any convictions registered these false, fictitious identities and many people said well, they're probably not going to vote this identities. while maybe, maybe not. one thing photo i.d. does this prevents the voting because you have to have a drivers license or some other qualifying i.d. that matches the fictitious identity in order to vote. so photo i.d. prevents that very pernicious crme for materializing into those election day. a third crime and the prevention of his double voting. this is extremely common in the united states. people are registered in two jurisdictions. or they go to college in whitaker wrote. they don't cancel their registration annual jurisdiction and a lot of people try to get away with voting in those states. it is much harder to do this or

i should say you can do it, but it's much easier to prosecute with photo i.d. law because one of the main defenses to the races they will say somebody else started my identity in my old state. that wasn't me. with a photo i.d. laws, you prevent the assertion of that person that was someone else. so there's multiple forms of voter i.d. laws prevent. time is short, so wrapped up my comments there. i'd be happy to share more examples in q&a at tapes of voter fraud we encountered and how the safe act is helping to counter. [applause] >> thank you very much. my name is scott gessler current secretary of state in the state of colorado. many people are familiar with a lot of the things that affect better integrity. and inaccurate voter rolls let it loose on on her system when

it comes to voting in this country, both in registration and voting as well. oftentimes, for example no photo i.d. required. overtime is seeing increased use of mail-in ballots, which while it has good things to do, not not enough for voter fraud. what underlies a lot of this and causes challenge is what i call sort of a culture of see no evil, hear no evil. and this -- this argument is ironically promulgated by some of the same people who see massive corruption when it comes to campaign finance system. massive corruption in the ballot initiative process. when it comes to voting in the polling booth, our hearts become peer without malice. but this you know we've no evil culture results in a couple real problems that we have and it's caused by some issues. first and foremost to see a real politicization of some of the

effort of maintaining voter integrity in the suit are certainly in the photo i.d. debates, where people who support photo i.d. are immediately accused of the basis motives and terrible things and drawing examples from problems we've had in american history, oftentimes, almost i was with no evidence whatsoever. you see sort of the level of politicization. i think he was to see from the culture of see no evil, hear no evil reflected in state election systems, where more often than not states have inadequate systems when it comes to the detection and the prevention of both voter fraud and error as well. although there are many protections in place, there are real glaring deficiencies, particularly in the collection of the data to be able to provide the basic analysis they need. a good example from colorado through the rulemaking earlier this week and one of the people

he testified, he won in denver, colorado said during the canvassing and after the election they identified in a nursing home, one of the major ones in the city of denver 14 people who had voted who had died in the past i moved away just in that one area. and i was a little embarrassed because that happened two years ago. i asked her about it from this woman was a friend of mine i've known for three or four years and she knew i was writing it was the first ever heard of it. she instead reported to a local reporter who did nothing. actually they did something, which was a prior local election official was accused of people who may does report so that in doing terrible things in suppressing peasant dance like that. so you see the lack of a detection system and collection of information and culture see no evil, hear no evil. part of the thing that causes is

a policy infrastructure that the people who support the culture had developed over time. very well-financed, very assertive in its arguments, willing to produce what i think is evidenced very poor quality, yet push this far. there is goodness i think similar opportunities and dynamics in first and foremost is the see no evil, hear no evil culture does not have a majority support in this country. i think we all want to believe everyone is of good faith in berlin to do the right thing come about americans intuitively understand that in any human endeavor and elections are hard, complicated endeavor. many endeavors a small proportion of people who will when tested to the wrong thing, when tempted to break the law. political power is gained through election as a temptation that tempts people to do bad things. i think americans intuitively understand that. so there's this predominate are no evil, see no evil thoughts on a foundation of sand so to

speak. and his seat during things going on. one is those who focus on election integrity are beginning to build a policy infrastructure to bring those forward. it is too late examples. it's beginning to change. the second thing we are seeing our policy breakthroughs. and secretary kobach is great evidence. what we see in the photo i.d. debate is a really good example. we have certain states. kansas is on. indiana, georgia who have instituted photo identification. were able to collect data and look at the result of that and the results in america are in many ways the same result all over the world, which is increased election integrity, confidence and election and

voter turnout substantial than a whole lotta good things. that shows some of this disenfranchisement hysteria is frankly silly. and then i think there is a third opportunity and that is the opportunity and what i am also coadministered of complexity. now i'm a cancer thursdays for example do not have a consensus for broad sweeping legislative changes. nonetheless, as i say, elections are difficult, complex things in her plenty of opportunities to make improvements. as i can elections almost a software. sometimes when software is released, sometime always there are bugs in the software, vulnerabilities that old abilities in our elections and sometimes those bugs are released and no one other types of them and everything is fine. and sometimes a run across a bug and you'll have problems and you have to shut down your computer

will have some type of inconvenience. a program to sign up for a while, so you know there's a problem, but it still listed accomplish your task. a mandate shutdown your computer, wipe your system is your data as a vulnerabilities in our election system and there's a problem. it requires getting at the nuts and bolts. true the vote is getting a semi-bad as theirs other states. and we find in colorado and i think you see that in the citizenship to weber we are identifying problems and making specific changes to address those within the administrative machinery. overall i am hopeful that this culture of see no evil, hear no evil will over time give way to a sensible culture, where we want people to do the right thing and we know the vast majority of instance that happens. we also know that human nature being what it is so have to continually be prepared to address the vulnerability and our system. new bugs, ones that come up in the old ones that have happened

repeatedly in american history. so thank you very much. [applause] >> when i was near to the prior is of law, an older member of the bar pulled me aside and said alan, the best way to be successful in litigation is to follow this rule. if you have that fact, pound the law. if you have bad luck pound the facts. if you have bad facts in babylon, pound the desk. and that is what i see going on here. if it has a lot of issues, but especially this issue. over the last year or two people attack the messenger, not the message. when you hear out there the implementation of voter i.d. and photo i.d. requirements taken us back to a time in the civil rights movement. when you hear people say there

is an intent to suppress minority votes. i find that very disconcerting. when you talk about having a solution search for problem for my sad about that comment as they sat on the plane. as i boarded the plane i bumped into the pad and said hello. i'd imagine, based on my observation, there's a police, are suspicious that this plane that crashed based on the instrument panel readings. i can tell you right now i'd want the pilot to have every tool and take as much time as he needed to prevent, to preemptively prevent this plane from crashing or having any problems. what we have here is data, evidence across the country can specifically in south carolina, but across the country issues are methods for managing elections, controlling data, managing roles come archaic antiquated data and the ability for someone to come and end

through fraud dilute the voting poll is very present. i want to be able to give our government the ability to combat that, to give them the tools. it is very difficult to prove a negative. if alan wilson goes and uses a fraudulent voter i.d. card in the name of john smith and i vote under john smith's name, you cannot go back in time and prove a negative. it is impossible. it's difficult to catch someone in the act. i hear countless stories of people who witnessed that. i also see folks on the other side, while they may be good people, i see them manipulate the facts and twist the data to come to a predetermined conclusion. so last year, it was determined when one of the comments was made that there are so many people in south carolina registered to vote, but don't have a voter registration card. there are actually a lot of people affected by having a voter i.d. and get a voter i.d.

in our state it came to the understand or 239,000 south carolinians who had a voter registration card but no photo i.d. while, the justice department made a determination that 10% of that number were nonwhite. 8.4% of that number were way. 1.6% disparity of how people could be negatively are adversely affected. the thing is they said in their refusal to preclear south carolina's voter i.d. law, minorities are 20% more likely to be disenfranchised or have those depressed. not a 1.6% disparity. they came up with that number because the number 10 as 20% higher than a .4. there was a twisting of facts. use the data companies out there using data from not likely voters, the people who were voting age. not likely or eligible or registered, but to use inflated data to get a predetermined outcome. when you look at the 239,000 people in south carolina to 10%

were nonwhite, 8.4 were white, we found out later on that 92,239,011 south carolina anymore. they are now citizens in another state. 37,000 of them are deceived and have not been taken up the voting roll. of that 37,000, 950 some odd had been shown to vote in the election after they were deceased. it may have been actually dead voters voting through fraud or could have been an error by the poll watcher. we are currently looking at those numbers. but the possibility, opportunity for fraud exists. our sister state in 2007 implemented their voter i.d. law. if you look at 2004, from 2,422,008, minority participation when a what people say that was because i was a special election neared it was

her first african-american president with a lot of enthusiasm. okay to those intent minority participation when it 44%. caucasian voters went up 11%. it went up across the board, but it were not statistically higher with minority groups. and no court case has someone been able to prove or show that there is actually someone who's been disenfranchised or have the right to go suppress. and south carolina's law, you don't hear this talked about a lot, but we have the ability if you show up without a photo i.d., it could be because you're 100 years old or sick or for whatever reason you can still vote. you don't hear that in the media. you can vote that day by signing an affidavit as you leave the menu the the turbo. you don't have to come back. there's one last thought that i want to sit down for questions or for the next speaker. a couple weeks ago i speaking to a group of african-american leaders in that community about this particular topic.

i actually got to tell them something they did not know. now, there is a case out there called kinston north carolina, which is subject to preclearance under section five of the voting rights act. in this particular community, 65% of the registered voters their african-american. they voted overwhelmingly to go from a designated retreat nonpartisan designated race. the justice department refused to preclear them. when i was speaking to those folks who are leaders and the african american community, i told them i never tried to attack someone's internal thoughts or intentions, but i'm not about using their words against them. i pulled out a letter the justice department sand. their reasons were as follows. the elimination of party affiliation on the ballot to reduce the ability to let candidates of choice. removing the partisan cue in municipal elections will annul it we had a laminate the single

factor that allows black candidates to get elected to office. and one member in the room says we are too to pick current candidates. i said if that doesn't offend anyone else in this room, it certainly offends me. when voter fraud is allowed to persist, it dilutes everyone's vote. not one party, not one race, not one group. in south carolina would do everything to ensure the integrity of the ballot box. thank you. [applause] >> thank you, ladies and gentlemen. i'm delighted to be at heritage. those of you who are watching us online and tv in the studio and the audience there's a wonderful young lady seated up front who is holding up cards that tells us how much time we have left and it tells us when to stop. so i will make a promise to her when you hold up a stop sign, i

will look at you and smile. that's kind of how we played it today. let me begin. i want to start by showing you some thing if i can. and it's obviously something that's kind of at the core of what it is we are talking about today. perhaps you can see it so well if you're watching us on the internet on television, but most of you in the audience can see it all too well. you can see how bad i look. this is a virginia driver's license, also known as a state issued photo i.d. it's very small. pretty innocuous looking, except for the good face on it. it's even sanded around the edges so online finance at the front of me or that has to have

in front of you come you can even cut your hand inadvertently. it's a very tiny little thing that will fit in a pocket, sit in a wallet, kind of carry it in your blackberry. it is not a billy club. i mean come if you look at it, that's clear. it is not a firehose. i live in virginia now, they come from the state of alabama and in the united states congress. and a little something about fire hoses. that's not his. it's not some kind of a weapon or club the southern sheriffs used to use to keep people from voting are participating. it is a tiny little photo i.d. but this tiny little thing i am holding onto my hand tends to do

very weird things to people. it tends to create some very interesting political arguments. several months ago, two very prominent leaders of organizations, civil rights organizations as a matter of fact and the need to for so wild a ride this thing called a photo i.d. that they went to the united nations and they went to be very particular place in the united nations called the human rights commission. and while i'm an expert on the united nations terminology, basically they filed a complaint status with the u.n. human rights commission and the basis for the complaint was incredibly devastating potential to suppress this thing and holding up or said they were told. now i won't even get into the fact that cuba sits on the u.n. human rights commission and cuba would not know a free election

ever walked in and did a burlesque dance in front of it. i won't get into the fact that china sits on the human rights commission and china has many great virtues and is a great competitor, but in china, unless you're one of a small group who actually do get to cast votes in some of their local races, china has never had a free election in any histories of dynasties in centuries. they make us look like a rookie as old as the civilization is there never had a free election. saudi arabia sits on the u.n. human rights commission. saudi arabia occasionally experiments with codeine. but if you are a woman, you are not part of the experiment. you get my point. not quite the group i would expect to judge her integrity when it comes to elections.

.. >> we were told the young people were so energy jizzed, led to believe in a way they were never believing before, and now four short years later, we're told those same motivated go-getters who were ready to take over the world can't be bothered with getting an id. remember when we were told four years ago about the seniors who

were in their 80s? never missed an election. who were so motivated to get involved in politics right now in this season. now we're told that those same people who were so fired up and ready to go and so motivated and cared so much about their country, now we're told they are so fragile and so weak and so marginalized and so isolated that they don't have an id and couldn't be bothered to get one. you take my point. reasonable people can differ about almost everything in american life today including this issue. reasonable people should not disagree on one point. we have had our share of suppression, particularly in the american south.

there's no question about that. but this is not suppression. this is a simple little device, and we use it all the time. when i leave here, i have to high tail it to the airport because i have to speak in salt lake city tomorrow. i won't get on the plane if i leave this here. most buildings in washington, d.c., including the department of justice that is filing lawsuits trying to stop these states from implementing voter id laws, if i were to decide that i want to go by the department of justice to try to get a meeting with anybody there, i couldn't get in without this, and timely, you know, we have our friends in the news media, and i love the definition of "objectivity" with journalists meaning i think the opposite of whoever i'm interviewing, and i did an interview a few months ago with a news organization about this

very issue, and they asked me what they thought were tough questions. when i went to the news organization to do the interview, the first thing that was on top of a security guard who looked scarier than this was a sign that said "photo id required, no exceptions." that's more than most states who make a number of exceptions. i'm glad to be here. make sure i don't leave this thing as i catch my plane. i'm glad to talk about this issue. in all seriousness, this is something democrats and republicans ought to care about. something conservatives and liberals ought to care about. something americans ought to embrace, the notion of voter integrity. thank you, all. [applause] >> thank you very much, and

thanks, everyone. our directer of lectures and seminars told me that i could exercise my discretion in extend this session, so i'll let c-span and other viewers now i'm going to exercise that. i'm going to ask the first question, though, and thank all the panelists for their great remarks, and i think i'm going to draw on a little bit of each of what you've said. i think it's great that secretary cobach is building a data base in the state, the law allowed that, and i know the secretary mentioned that, but he referred to the hear no evil, see no evil problem. i characterize it worse than that. it's not only that, but see no evil, hear no evil, and in the news media, it's report no evil. it's worse. it's to propagate a falsehood, whether they know it's false or

not, to deny there is a fraud problem, and when my colleague confronts the coffee, and i had discussions with other people, and when you bring up fraud, they say, well, it's not in this state. you bring up instances in that state, and well, that was in the last two years. elections are held every two years, and so the problem is that there is unfortunately a great number of americans, particularly the poor who have come to believe this falsehood, and that is a -- gives me great pain because it signifies to me that we needed to an even -- need to do an even bigger effort to try to dispel the myth, whether it's intentionally propagated by those who think it's justified because they want to stop what they think is a bad

practice of ensuring voter integrity, but the one thing i do want to ask you all to comment on is the data in one other respect, the proof of the pudding is in the voting so it's, you mentioned several of the other reasons to suspect that getting a free voter id is not a problem, that people have it, but in the 2008-2010 was an experiment in another way. compare state with newly enacted voter id laws and the states without certain types of voter id laws, and what the statistics show, and my colleague confronts this in publications, and others have shown, is the states with photo voter id had a higher increase in minority votes than the states without. again, the important statistic is not that the percentage of minority vote increased in that state because it increased in

almost every state in 2008 with enthusiasm for president obama, but that the minority rate increased more in states with voter id. they could trust the results of the elections, some have speculated is the reason for that. it was more worth it to them to go to the polls. i think that same result, fg -- of course, over many states in 2010. am i right, wrong? where can we go to help publicize that data if it's available? someone want to help me out? [laughter] treat it as a rhetorical question. >> i can talk just a little about that. it's a challenge in part when i was talking about the policy infrastructure, when you look at what organizations are out there sort of collecting and analyzing on a nationwide basis. the number of the organizations

is pretty limited. harming is one, and so what i think often times winds up happening and secretary and i both, you know, participate in the secretary of state conferences, is oftentimes it's informal networks where one of us or someone calls someone else and asks about the experience or hears about the fact, and we weave that into our own analysis or our communications or something along those lines. there's a real hole as far as, you know, voter integrity voter organizations that are doing the rigorous collection and analysis of the data because it's all kind of it that's out there. i mean, you don't have to look very far to find evidence of how voter integrity increases elections and turn out. >> okay. thanks. >> another point there, and that is as more states adopt photo id laws, some of them -- some of the states like kansas, don't

have to deal with the hurdle because we're not a section 5 state, and you have more and more data assembled, and so unfortunately, a lot of the states that adopted the laws in 2011 are being blocked by the obama justice department, but i'm still at the top of my head, kansas has now added to the mix, and as i mentioned with the statistics we already have, the big general election in november that gives us ainrmation. you have tennessee moving forward with theirs, and rhode island may be, i think, that's in effect. they adopted one. there's a number of states from all over the country, and secretary of states offices are by and large collecting that information. some put it out there more aggressively than others, but there's a lot of information that's showing conclusively that the claims made by the critics of the laws are not bearing out in the data. >> representative data. >> one legal point that needs to be made. if you tune out everything that

we say today, if you forget everything we say, please remember this little nugget. the supreme court has addressed the issue of photo id. they did it as recently as four years ago in 2008, and the guy who wrote the opinion was john paul stevens, who was one of the great liberal icons to serve in the u.s. supreme court and in the last 30-some years. a liberal justice wrote an opinion upholding voter id laws in indiana, and he made the point that because of the state's legitimate interest in combating voter fraud and because of the state's legitimate interest in verifying people as it does in many aspects of life. you know, verification is not a strange thing in our life, justice stevens reasoned because it was not string in civil life, it was no burden to apply it in

the context of voting. when that happened, there was a presidential campaign that was going on in this country, and campaigns bring out the hyperpartisan in us. this is not a partisan vent today. don't take it as a partisan comment. it's factual comment. i don't remember then senator obama who was the democratic nominee even issuing a press release criticizing justice stevens' ruling. i don't remember the dnc, i think howard dean was the chairman then. i tend to forget him so i could be wrong. i don't remember the dnc issuing a release even criticizing that ruling. now, i have a law degree too. i know that some people are thinking, well, indiana is not a voter rights act coverage state so a different standards applies in the south. folks, the voting rights act was crafted to give the federal government extra enforcement

tools in a region where discrimination used to be a part of life from the time you got up to the time you went to bed, from the time you were born to the time you were buried. that was the south we used to live in. today, indiana has fewer black elected officials than south carolina. indiana has fewer blacks voting than any vra state in terms of the number who are turning out and participating in the elections every year. the level of registration, fewer african-americans are registered to vote in indiana than i think one vra state. if your concern is, oh, we want to make sure african-americans have a full chance to participate and be included, wouldn't it be a little bit odd to say indiana's held to a weaker standard and african-americans made it to the dance when it comes to politics? one final point here. this is about a very simple

question. should we have two rules of law in this country? should we have one rule of law for kansas and colorado and indiana, another rule of law for south carolina, virginia, alabama, and other vra states? i submit we don't. >> sthawng very -- thank you very much. some say justice stevens came to the view on the inherent problem of voter fraud which states are lawfully allowed to recognize. some say it's because he grew up in chicago and knew a thing or two about the history of voter fraud. this is my id here, too. i have it. i'll now recognize those from our audience. please, wait for the microphone so viewers on the interpret and tv can hear. i think this is the first one i've seen. identify yourself, please. >> hi, thank you. can you hear me? i'm sarah, a voting rights

advocate, care about americans, and i'm an american voter. happy to have this opportunity. you know, every time that an american registers to vote, they have to check a box that says i'm eligible, i'm over 18, and i'm a citizen. they send in that registration form into the secretary of state who decides to put them on the role. this has been the system for many, many years, and it's working. my question is to you, you want to take it further. it's not with voter id with you. you also are talking about proof of citizenship. in order to register in your state, you have to show a birth certificate, a passport, or your naturalization papers. i ask everyone here, is anyone carrying one of those documents right now? i'm carrying a driver's license, but i don't walk around with my birth certificate making it difficult for me to register in your state. what do you say about the

barriers to voters that you are putting up? >> thanks for the question, sarah. a few things. first of all, that the -- we have a lot of evidence because, as you say, the system, you check a box or sign under the line, and that was the end of it. no one asked you to verify anything. indeed, county clerks in caps, when they had suspicion the person was not a u.s. citizen, they could do nothing. they had to register the person. one antidepressant -- one antidote. that comes from right across the state line, kansas city is divided by the kansas-missouri state line. the best election was in 2010 legislative seat. that seat traditionally was held by democrats, and whoever won the primary got the seat. that was between two people. rizzo and royster.

eyewitnesses observed one polling place, approximately 50 somalia nationals, walked into the place one at a time by the same translater, reid coach, instructed them to vote outside the polling place for rizzo. all witnesses saw this for an extended period of time. at the end of the day, rizzo won by one vote. that election caused great consternation in the missouri legislature, and i can go into the legal wrangling about that, but bottom line is those people were registered illegally, non-citizens, and they threw that election. i'm not saying that the legislator himself, rizzo, organized it, but somebody did. there's similar examples in kansas on ballot issues in cons. there was a hog issue in cams to have a referendum to allow the operation in.

the county clerk testified before the legislature those who were non-citizens according to her belief were allow -- were busted and registered to vote. now, does it cause a great burden? no. there's 12 documents that the kansas law allowed you to use to prove citizenship when you register to vote. the other interesting thing, you may know this, people may not, but after the real id act passed by congress in 2005, it required states to start segments your voter list into -- segments your driver's license's list into citizens and non-citizens. the reason you do that is because non-citizens driver's license had to expire when their period of authorized stay in the united states expired according to the federal law. you have aliens in the driver's license data base and citizens. the states are now requiring people who renew their driver's licenses and most states just starting this now, to provide proof of citizenship, a birth certificate indicating birth in the united states. in kansas, they collect that pdf

image of every's image as they renew driver's licenses. it's easy for those turning 18. when they turn 16, they got their driver's license in all likelihood. the birth certificate is on file, there's an image of it. we have the image transferred to the voter file so the person don't have to bring in the birth certificate. if they are not already in the group that had their birth certificate, and you can have your mom take a picture of the certificate with a cell phone, text it to you, and then you can text it to the secretary of state's office so that the image is translitted multiple ways at different times. we bent over backwards to ensure it was convenient for people to prove their citizenship. think don't have to do it at the moment they fill out the legislation card. >> yeah, and i like to address that to. you said the system works.

that assumes we are pure and operate from perfect knowledge. the system does not work. we have evidence of that in the state of colorado. within the last three or four years, there's been 430 people who have either voluntarily asked to be withdrawn from the rolls because they were non-citizens or attempted to register, and they checked the "i am not a citizen" box, but they were still registeredded. we have identified that. there's 430. some say that doesn't matter. winning the first statewide election by 90 votes statewide in the state of colorado in 2002, same year, at that time congressman won by 120 votes. there's a history of close elections. there's 430 there. we looked at immigration holds in our jail, and those are holds placed on people suspected of being illegal immigrants based on homeland security data.

we found, i think, currently the number is 185 people on the voter registration rolls. ultimately, we have to confirm that. that's high likelihood there is a problem with the folks. we also compared driver's licenses data base against the voter registration data base. there's a legal presence requirement in colorado. within the last several years, there's been 5,000 people who when they got a driver's license were non-citizens and are also on the voter roles. i understand some may become citizens, but i can't believe all of them have become citizens, especially in light of the real world examples in other states and the system's not working. most of the time it works, for the vast majority of the people because majority of people are honest and know what's going on, but there's a small percentage where mistakes and fraud occur, and in close races, that creates a problem. the system is not working. >> great question and great answer. i want to add that certainly

reasonable people differ on what procedures states should use to verify citizenship. i admire hearing the details of how far kansas and colorado have gone to try to make it easy, but federal law requires or prohibits non-citizens from voting in federal elections. states administer, both state and federal elections, and so i submit it is not responsible for states enforcing that federal law to do nothing, but the honor system. next question, please, again, make the question brief so we can get additional ones in. ma'am? >> hi. i'm new to the country. why have all of the laws cropped up quickly over the last year and not before 2011? how come they did not crop up

when george bush was elected in 2000 by a few hundred votes in florida? how can citizens, like me, trust the voter id laws proposed by all conservative legislators are not using politics to disenfranchise voters who typically vote progressive or democratic? timely, it's not just the voter id laws that cropped up over the last year. conservative legislators limited early voting days that increase the voter participation, and which have nothing to do with voter id laws. why limit early voting days as well? >> another great and challenging question. who is first? >> i'll swing first. it is a good question. thank you for being here. the voter id law was actually -- it was attempted to be passed in february of 2009, the first time. it took two years to actually get it to where it could even be sent for preclearance. it would have been attempted earlier, but there was great

interest in the indiana case that actually was sent to the supreme court before, the year before that. the georgia law was passed and precleared and challenged multiple times in the superior court, the u.s. district court, and the court of appeals for georgia, and those were all done during the bush administration. voter id laws preexist president obama. when i was meeting with that group of african-american leaders, that was one of the questions that was accident. what is the hurry? well, there was no hurry because we've been trying for two years in south carolina to do this. our law was finally passed and signed into law a year ago this past may, and we quickly moved to try to implement the law over a year ago, and in the justice department, i believe waited the full length of time to deny us preclearance, and then, of course, we went to the process of getting to hear, and so our interest in trying to move quickly has nothing to do with who is in the legislated office or who is running at what time. our interest is based on a fear

from numerous counts by numerous citizens in south carolina that they have eyewitnessing thes of voter -- eyewitness accounts of voter fraud in various elections. there's not so much a hurry. that was a good question because it was asked to me before, but understand the laws have been passed before this administration, and this is not something we just thought up a couple months ago. >> i have a quick point here. one of the gentleman on this panel comes from kansas. folks, kansas is so republican that a democrat wrote a book called "what's wrong with kansas." [laughter] i don't profess to be an expert on kansas politics, but i don't exactly think republicans need to suppress votes to win elections in kansas. they have been winning them under all circumstances no matter what. it's not a hot battleground state, and if that sounds like, you know, a flip point to you, it's an important point because there's a myth that is out there

the only states passing voter id laws are closely divided states where the election and whether it's obama or romney may come down to just a few votes here or there, you've got a better chance of getting kansas sitting in the world series than seeing a presidential ad this year. the baseball fans know i just have something there. rhode island passed a voter id law, and here's what you want to know about the voter id law. you know who put it over the top? black democrats. you know why they put it over the top? they actually had the audacity to come out, testify in public that they were tired of seeing voter fraud in their legislative districts.

they were tired of having to sit down every election and say, okay, i know that because i'm not the machine candidate that that's x number of front votes here added to the number of real votes, and i have to figure out a strategy to get the votes, but figure out a strategy to offset fraudulent votes. those were not republicans in rhode island. there's a phone booth full of those. [laughter] those were african-american, democratic legislators, and they deserve credit because they have been threatened with the primary in 2014 and told by the democratic party that don't look to us for help with a primary because we don't get involved. you know, they are so isolated right now. you know, the other time point to make, you know, repetition matters in pams like this. i'll repeat attorney wilson's point.

indiana's voter id law passed in 2004. the only supreme court case on this subject is indiana's law. ipse is a typically republican state that, yes, happened to very narrowly go for barack obama four years ago, but if 2004, it went for bush. they passed the law because they were not concerned that he nearly carried indiana, he didn't, but because they thought it was a problem in some communities in indiana. we cannot lose sight of one important thing here. the issue is whether it's an unreasonable burden to make someone produce voter id or some equivalent of photo id. we might debate public policy all we want, but when courts look at the issues, that's the only thing courts are looking at is an unreasonable burden, and the reason that we keep talking about the am --

am bikety is not because we are trying to debate a point, but trying to say that how can it be a burden to ask people to do something they do all the time? that's all this comes down to. how is it a burden to ask people to do something they do all the time? >> two quick points to add. regarding the passage of the safe act in kansas, two-thirds of the democrats in the kansas house voted for the bill, and three quarters of the democrats in the kansas senate voted for the bill. it was not a republican bill or a democrat bill. this is an american idea, a kansas idea. whatever. it is an idea of all people who care about the integrity of the system. one time point, two the initial observation, it is true that in 2011 there was an unprecedented number of states, more than half a dozen states adopted a form of photo id law or went beyond that as we did in kansas or something

else. it started back in the year of 2004, and ipse made the first big splash. the reason you saw so many states in 2011 is this issue didn't reach the public consciousness, in my opinion, department reach the public consciousness until after the 2008 cycle when there was focus that one group was just all over the news media and people started hearing about it, and then in 2009, additional reports came out, congressional committee up vest gaited, and state legislators are responsive than mbs of congress are to what people are thinking about. they go on doors. >> everybody's more responsive than the members of congress. [laughter] >> state legislators hear this, and they got the idea that, hey, i think that's an important issue, and so i think it's just elevated to the national consciousness in the 2008-2009

period and that's why you saw newly elected leaders in 2010 being very interested in passing new laws in 20 # 11. >> well, thank you, all. i know that one of our panelists has to leave to go to the airport with that photo id. please join me in thanking all of the panelists for their presentation. [applause]

>> my brother, scott, called me up last night saying i watched the debate on c-span. you did great. you got your ass kicked by lee royce. [cheers and applause] where is lee wright? lee wright? [applause] what a yes mapp. what a gentleman. what a pleasure. what a delight it's been to debate lee wright a dozen times.

let's get the guy legislated. [cheers and applause] >> like i say, no one, no one could have been more gracious, no one could have been more articulate regarding libertarian ideas and beliefs. >> later tonight, more speeches from third party candidates like libertarian nominee gary johnson. we'll show you remarks from the constitution party, green party, and reform party con conventions.

>> stories about medal of honor winners from vietnam and the korean war. this event is 45 minutes. >> it is my pleasure to introduce to you a business of character, and a man of integrity. he served in the navy after graduating from annapolis and serves as a character, and he has many medals, the highest civilian honor by the department of defense and the eisenhower award for more than 40 years of continued as much as to the american armed forces. please join me in welcoming mr. ross perot.

[applause] >> it's an honor to be with all of you. can you hear me all right? okay. this is all about general robbie, he has an up credible man and can't be here today because of severe health problems, but he asked me to give each of you highest regards and to let you know how much he admires and republics you. he's an oklahoma cowboy, flew p-37s in world war ii, selected by the air force to retrace lindberg's route in a jet across the atlantic after world war ii. that's a neat trip. he was an ace in korea. he's probably the last person that will probably ever be fought. he met china's top ace in the

air over korea. general mcarthur set this combat up. he decided in the middle of the fight to fight his opponent defensively because he had more fuel. china's ace had to go back north, he decided that instead of snapping him down where he was, he would go all the way into china to the man's base and shoot him down in front of his own troops. [laughter] think about that. that would be ultimate loss of face to china's top ace. i defined the warrior right there, and that's what he did. as he shot down the chinese ace, he looked down the runway, and there were 19 on the ground. he did a giant 360, came back down, and he got 14 in one pass.

[laughter] remember, now, because you probably never heard about this, president truman chewed out mcarthur for bombing the airfield north of the river. these are the details. there's not one black mark in his record. general mcarthur took all the heat. robbie came home, and i said, how did you only hit 14 on the ground? [laughter] you can imagine the response from him on that. he went on to vietnam. he was on the cover of "time" magazine, ran his picture, america's top ace in vietnam. nine days later, and this is very important that you understand he was hit by a missile, not another pilot. the vietnam knew who they had

because of "time" story. they put him in a box and kept him for five years. it was 140 degrees in the daytime in the box. he never bent, never broke, but instead, he inspired countless of prisoners, young officers, and other prisoners to stay alive by tapping on the box with a tap code. okay? now, how is that for leadership? how would you like to try making an inspirational speech with a tap code? he did it. after five years in the box, 140 degrees in the box, they decided to let him out. it took him just a few weeks to regain ability to walk and talk. he was the senior officer in the camp. he looked all around and realized that they didn't have church services. as the senior officer, he ordered church services which were strictly forbidden the following sunday.

pow said, we don't have any himmals. he said, just write them out on paper. the only paper they had was toilet paper, and they wrote out the hymnals. they were singing "on ward christian soldiers" enthusiastically in the chapel, and the vietnamese stormed in. when you can't go to church, you take every risk like risking your lives to practice your beliefs. this kept him alive. talk to any one of the men who made it through the ordeal, and they will tell you what a hero he was to them. he is still today. the vote -- vietnam came in to grab him to go back to the box. they were having church services. they were singing the star

spangled banner, and the prisoners who were standing with him stood proudly to honor robbie and sang a strictly forbidden song, the star spangled banner, and all were brutally tortured for singing the song. years later, when he came home, i said, what was going on in your mind when they dragged you back to the box? he looked at me, and his eyes were twinkling, he said, perot, with those guys singing the star spangled banner, i was nine feet tall, could have bear hunted with a stick. [laughter] now, you know there's a statue out here; right? it's nine feet tall with a stick at the base. that's the reason it's there. i don't know if you knew that, but now you all know that. i'm imlad glad you do. when we returned, he ran the air force base, responsible for the thunder birds, and brought the south vietnam fighter pilot in

prison with our men that vietnam used as a servant to embarrass him by having him do all the dirty work around the prison. the men called max, used that opportunity to smuggle food and medicine to men who were dying again and again and again. the highest priority of his agenda was to bring max over and honor him in the united states. he was brought over, honored in u.s. at 14 bases, and went back home. when saigon fell in 1975, robbie and curl rutledge, and captain norris were the first to go in to save him. they didn't forget max. can you imagine after five years in the hell going back in the box and all of that, to go back in to pick up a vietnam soldier? they did that. he did the right thing.

it takes a person with a lot of integrity to do that, and he has a lot of integrity. they were in the white house, heard about this, and sent george peatree, one of the raiders, over in a car, picked up max, 19 family members, to go to the airport, flew him back in the states, took him to the trunk of the car in the airport, though, and, of course, he's here in the united states today, and we did not leave our men behind. that's mainly because of robbie. i'll have a large canvas painting of him in the uniform next to the fighter jet that will be placed in a prominent place in the leadership hall to remind every cadet of who this man is and his outstanding

leadership. [applause] i'd like to tell you the story of lance, another story, big statue of lance, and one of the family members is with us here tonight, and so, thank you, so much for being with us here tonight. he graduated from the air force academy in 1965. he's the first one to win congressional medal of honor. he's -- and danny began pilot training and after his service in -- after his pilot training, he was assigned to the fighter wing stationed in south vietnam in an f-4 phantom pilot. on the night of november 8th,

1964, on his 52nd combat mission, lance was tasked with a bombing mission over north vietnam. his f-4c was engulfed in flames and plunged into the jungle. he ejected from the aircraft. he suffered a fractured skull, broken right hand, broken leg, and a rough landing. he had no food, little water, and no survival kit, but he evaded enemies for 46 days. that says a lot about him. he was captured by the vietnam christmas day, 1967. after being captured and tortured, he, who lost 100 pounds from his 6'2 inch frame, somehow overpowered a guard and escaped into the jungle before being recaptured several hours later. he was put in prison with the

other pows, and at one time, when he was near death, the men were planning an escape. he was nearly up conscious in the same room, and he raised his hand and said count me in. how's that for a great air force pert? unfortunately, he passed away a few days later. we have a statue of lance at the air force academy, and i hope that every cadet who sees the statue is inspired to be the same caliber of military officer that lance was. i want to talk about the long and difficult battle, many wounded, he was seriously wounded, continued rescuing wounded marines after he had been wounded, and finally, the wounded, including him, were taken to a medic hospital.

lieutenant murphy refused treatment until all the men had been cared for. that says a lot about his leadership as a military officer. freedom is precious. freedom is fragile. freedom must be protected. i hope that you always live the words when principle is involved, the deaf to expediency. you will be the leaders protecting our nation. i know you will do a great standard of excellent and set new standards. don't forget sergeants gordon who went back in again and again to rescue the helicopter pilot's chief warrant officer, michael durant in somalia. you saw them in the streets, earned the medal of honor, and god bless them, they got it. i want to talk about john alexander hotel who graduated

from west point in 1964, wrote his own o bituary and says i wrote by own obituary because i'm the best authority on my own life. i never look at that without thinking the phrase "duty, honor, country" printed in the "new york times" 1971. graduated 10th in the class, road scholar, earned to silver stars, killed in a helicopter crash july 7th, 1970. here are the words. i'm writing by own obituary because i'm the best authority on my own life. good reason to write it; right? i love the army. it nurtured me. it give me the most satisfying years of my life. the army let me live in jay pap, germany, england with experiences in these places

others can only dream of. i skied in the alps, i killed a scorpion in turkey. i climbed mount fuji. i visited the ruins of athens and rome, went to the town of gourdian, and there were another alexander challenged his destiny and earned a 345*ser's degree -- master's degree in a foreign university. i know what it is to be married to a fine and wonderful woman loving her beyond bearing the knowledge that she loves me. about 20 # years, i had that in my office. i decided that i should find his wife. i knew nothing about her. i found her. she's a nurse. she never had another date in her life. i talked to her. she said there could never be nip else like alex. he will be the only man in my life. i love him as much today as when he was here. i want you to know i'm very

happy. i could never be happier. i could never have a better life. you would think she just found a million dollars on the street, and that's quite a try butte to -- tribute to alex and her. alex commanded and income tax adviser, professor, and judge for 200 men at one time. i played college football and rugby, won the british national diving championship two years in a row. i boxed at oxford against cambridge only to get knocked out in the first round. [laughter] played handball through distraction, exchange student in the military germany academy, going to the jump mapser school, had three parachute jumps from everything from a balloon in epg land to a -- england to a jet. i experienced all of these things because i was in the army

i never knew what it was to fail. i never knew what it was to be too old or too tired to do anything. i did not die for my country. i lived for my country, and surely, if there's nothing worth dying for, there's nothing worth living for. can you imagine a better role model? here's a story of a little boy whose oping l had decide -- uncle decided to build his own airplane in the 1930s from a popular mechanic's drawing. built a wooden frame, and his grandmother, who, by the way, his mother, who was my grandmother, helped him cover it with clothe, and then he painted it over, and timely, he was fortunate to find an engine to attach to the wooden hull. there were no airports in the area, so he put it on a trick,

took it to a local pasture to test nigh it even though he had never flown an airplane before. his mother went with him to the pasture, and as he was getting in the airplane, she said, looked him in the eye and said, now, henry, you fly low and slow. henry took off and successfully flew the airplane. later he flew this same airplane from texas to alaska and back home. i still cannot figure out how he found air sources to refuel and all of that, but he did. later on, as a little boy grew up, this little boy spent hours sitting on henry's lap learning to fly. by the time the little boy went to college, he had learned to fly a single engine helicopter. a few years later, this little boy flew the helicopter around the world. single engine helicopter, think

about it. made at home. just to reflect for a moment how difficult it would be -- just think about finding places to refuel because of the short range of a helicopter. he made it home. it's on display at the smithsonian air and space museum. this little boy replaced lindberg as the youngest man to ever fly around the world. he later attended college, joined the rotc, upon completion of the bachelor's degree, he joined the air force reserves and became a fighter pilot. general had known the boy growing up after he came home from the experiences, and so he went to the ceremony where the little boy received his air force wings, and certainly, that's a day this boy will never forget. this limit boy later worked 15 years as chairman of the

committee to build the air force memorial. now, you've seen the air force me nor yal, or at least pictures; right? that was a massive effort, and he's gone op through his life to do a number of other great things, and i'm sure that much of the result for any of the successes is a result of learning to fly at the early age and learning the principles of leadership while receiverring in the air force -- serving in the air force reserves, and he's been a very successful businessman. you're probably wondering who is this little boy? this little boy is my son, and i can't tell you how proud i am of him and all the wonderful things he's done, and this goes on today that i thought i would just stop with the air force memorial. now, the first rule of leadership is to treat people with dignity and respect the way you would like to be treated. this has been validated again and again over thousands of years. it is nothing more than the restatement of the golden rule.

do unto others as you would have them do upunto you. the principles of this are tireless. human nature remains a constant. consider the prince. -- consider the principles. practice them, and your chances of becoming a successful leader is improved dramatically. a scout is loyal, friendly, courteous, thriftful, brave, and helps other the at all times, keeps himself physically strong, mentally alert, and straight, and the moe toe is be prepared. think what a great country it would be if we were all prepared. consider the leadership secrets principles. born in the beginning of the 5th century. by their own actions and not their words do leaders establish the morale, integrity, and sense of justice of their so board

nant commanders. they cannot say one thing and do another. don't talk out of both sides of your mouth. establishing a high spirit, a mutual trust, and leaders must attach value to high standards of pempsz performance and have no tolerance for the uncommitted. expect continued improvement in their so board nants based on new knowledge and experiences. all of these things are absolutely relevant today to the world you and i live in. leaders have to encourage creativity, dream of action, and innovation among so -- so boar nants. never misuse power, such action causes friction, and leads to

rebels. they must be willing to make personal sacrifices for the good of their homes. they must not favor themselves over their own when the supplies are short. they must encourage healthy competition among their people, but must contain it when such becomes a detriment to the tribe. understand that the law is greater than its letter. they must never settle -- excuse me -- never shred the cloak of honor, morality, and dignity. hold a profound conviction of duty above all ambitions. hopefully i've made the point that the principles of the leadership are timeless because in a rapidly changing world, human nature remains a constant. always use the word "leadership," never use the word" management." when referring to people.

you manage inventories, but you lead and motivate people. see these -- you must set the example by being a strong, effective leader, motivating the team to achieve at the full potential of the entire team. have an atmosphere of trust and respect otherwise nothing works. if they don't trust you, don't trust one another, you don't have much you can do. you earn this trust and respect by treating others as you would like to be treated. trust and respect are fragile. they can be lost in an instant. you must have an environment where there's no penalty for honest mistakes. these are learning experiences. they are like skinned knees. they are painful, but they heal quickly. when a member of your team makes an honest mistake, he or she feels terrible. don't chew them out. tell them about your hoppest mistakes. put it behind them, and move forward to constructive work.

make sure they understand that you have not lost confidence in them. in this environment, people will be open and candid. do not put people into categories. recognize there's something unique in every human being that tries out. i'm unique. i'm special. thers only one person in the world like me. do not treat me like a commodity. treat me like a human being. treat me with dig dignity and republic. keep the person challenged. each person challenged to achieve his or her full potential, and united teams win, divided teams lose, and remember the three musketeers, all for one and one for all. keep that in mind and your team is a roaring success. each part of the team is equally important. give your team strong, intelligent leadership. be the person they can trust, rely on, and republic.

recognize and reward performance. listen, listen, listen to the people who do the work on the front lines and you will get more information than you can get any other way. tell them what they are doing right. tell them what they are doing wrong. tell them how to improve. do not keep written records of evaluation. it's what you done lately that counts. judge people by what they have done lately. they may have made a mistake 20 years ago in a file. the answers are of of. live on the front lines, eat and sleep by the troops. feed the troops first, officers last. have strong principled leaders, and the first principle of truth of leadership is treat other people with dignity and respect the way you would like to be treated. this has been validated again and again and again in the last

2,000 years. it's nothing more than a restatement of the golden rules. do unto others have you have done unto you. it's timeless because in a rapidly changing world, human nature remains a constant. principles of leadership go back to the 5th century commencing with the knights of great britain. the codes were, you'll like this -- always be ready to defend the poor, those who cannot help themselves, be prepared -- that's where the boy scout motto came from, be prepared, maintain honor, do good unto others, and the principles of leadership were in the magna carta. no man should be banished, destroyed, outlawed, and we shall deny to no man justice.