paycheck, you don't understand how government can affect a small business and job creation and experience that firsthand. that was one of the things that led me to think this would be an useful idea a book. >> host: overall, how do you see the role of government, the role of congress, the role of the president and the economy? >> guest: basically this boat races and answers the question. we need government to create a stable environment for businesses to function and create jobs. when government battles, too much into the economy, government and its decisions and policies are by politics and markets are driven by the desire of companies to meet the needs of the real-world needs of people. so you need government to protect guys from fraud, from

wrongdoers. there are wrongdoers and government can protect us from them. but overly meddlesome government goes too far and you end up suppressing enterprise and innovation and job creation. hosts are the 2000 financial information in the so-called bailout, are you supportive of that government intervention? >> guest: reraise and answer the question of basically you could see that as sort of an emergency intervention. if government had done it and got now, that would've been fine. unfortunately, they stay too long. i think the comparison we make is to katrina. there's emergency aid and basically people get up and get back on track. the government has used -- the financial crisis as an excuse to expand his salt in control of

the economy. >> host: at what point did you see the government should have stuck to an emergency a dance? >> guest: banks that wanted to pay back the money, obviously were making it keep it. i did want to take the bailout from the first place. so basically. people argued with the fact that we basically make the point that the bailout was necessary. basically they went too far and certainly afterwards they use the financial crisis to overregulate with doc frank on a saturday. >> host: we are interviewing you have freedom fest in las vegas. do you find a lot of opposition to this idea, to some of the ideas in this book? >> guest: now, people are very much -- that is what this event

is about. people understand what's in this book. the whole idea is you best serves the needs of people by free enterprise. people trying to meet the needs and that is what it's about a mass of these people understand. entrepreneurial business. they understand the fact you create jobs not through government, but through innovation. innovation has the most jobs. the government invent the automobile? now. >> host: elizabeth ames, was at right to read a book with steve ford's? >> guest: a great experience and it was almost in a way like higher education. >> host: one of the themes we've been talking with authors on freedom fest is the moralism

or a moralism. is there a component you agree to capitalism? >> guest: capitalism is moral because it is about beating the real-world needs of other people in a free market transaction is a reciprocal exchange. but each person provides benefit to the other. i sat in interviewing, talks about it is each side gets to the other. so capitalism -- basically people who believe in big government see a free market transaction is a one-sided transaction each side gets benefits. it may not be ideal. but there is benefit always been a transaction, otherwise he

would not occur because it's in a free market. no one is forcing you to go into this exchange and that is why there's benefits on both sides. if you're being forced, the unilateral transaction is one that takes place between the individual and government. that's where it's unilateral. >> host: what is your enthusiasm is a candidate? >> guest: well, i think he -- i think is moving forward and doing things you want to hear. what is the title of that? >> guest: it is for the manifesto, why big government is sent. >> host: we've got a reader -- >> guest: the little card. we want to show you the current

book will elizabeth ames fishes that out. "how capitalism will save us" and here is book by elizabeth ames and steve forbes. freedom manifesto and the said title is? >> guest: why big government is bad. why isn't the government moral? >> guest: the government makes decisions and action based on political agendas, based on a selfish political interests. it's really about meeting it sounds needs in free markets are made in the real-world needs of people. >> host: a seminar follows economics and journalism seminars opinions of this issue, bernie middaugh, jamie diamond, in your view, with those two treated fairly by the federal government? >> guest: i wouldn't even put them in the same breath

actually. i think bernie middaugh scott what he needed to do. i think of him as a serial killer of capitalism and you don't condemn a whole society because of criminal elements of street crime. he does say everyone should be in jail. there's bad people in all systems, but the capitalist system, free-market system is going to channel people's self-interest into the most constructive activity that benefit everyone. >> host: jamie diamond called before congress because his company lost money. >> guest: well, there is risk in market. they did a good job pushing back and explaining. i think what's really scary right now is people who don't really understand markets or don't like markets are demonizing risk when you invest money. the whole point is you may or may not succeed and it may not work out. and that is unfortunately what

happens. if you don't have risk come you don't have reward. if you don't invest, all of these great companies were somebody -- they were at one time risky investments and they work out. >> host: this is a 10 on c-span 2 on location at freedom fest. we have been talking with elizabeth ames, co-author of this book, "how capitalism will save us" and the author of this upcoming book, freedom manifesto: while free markets are moral and big government is bent. they'll be talking with the co-author, steve forbes has about this book. >> host: here's a look at books being published this week: