basically you could see that as an emergency intervention if the government had done it and gotten out that would have been fine. unfortunately they stayed too long. the comparison that we make is to katrina there's emergency aid and then basically people get up and get back on their feet. unfortunately, the government has used the financial crisis as an excuse to expand itself and expand its control of the economy. >> at what point would you say the government should have stepped out of the emergency? >> they didn't allow banks that wanted to pay back the money. obviously they were making it difficult. they made them keep it and try to force it on banks that didn't want to take the bailout in the first place. so, basically, some people have argued with of the fact we basically make this point the

bailout was necessary. but basically they went too far and certainly afterwards they used the financial crisis as an excuse to overregulated with dodd-frank, et cetera. >> we are interviewing you year of freedom fest in los vegas. do you find a lot of opposition to the idea? to some of the ideas in the book including the flat tax? >> i think that that is what this event is about. it's about three people and free markets and people understand what is in this book and that is the whole idea that you best serve the needs of people by the free enterprise. that's what it's about and what these people understand. the understand the entrepreneurial business. the understand the fact the you create jobs not through government but through innovation. innovation has created the most

jobs. it does the government and with the automobile? know. >> elizabeth ames, what is it like to write a book with steve forbes? >> is a great learning experience and in a way it was sort of like a higher education. >> customized better. >> one of the themes we have been talking with here through the best of all about is the amoral as of capitalism. is there a moral component in your view? >> yes there is and that will be the subject of the next book coming out at the end of the month at the end of august. capitalism is immoral because again, it is about meeting the real world needs of other people and its a free-market transaction as a reciprocal exchange but it's each person provides a benefit to fielder. george gilder to why so you

interviewing talks about it as giving, each side gives to the other. succumb to what was on, basically people who are -- who don't believe in the government they see the free-market transaction as a one-sided transaction that is exploitation but each side gets the benefit. it may not be ideal but there is benefit in the transaction otherwise it would not occur because in the free market no one is forcing you to enter into this exchange and that is what makes it, that's why there is a benefit to both sides if you are being forced the unilateral transaction is one that takes place between the individual and the government. >> what is your enthusiasm level for mitt romney as a candidate? >> well, i think that he is great to be very good president.

i think that he gets it and he's moving forward and he's saying the things we need to hear. >> you mentioned a new book coming out. what was the title of that? >> freedom manifesto why they are moral and big government isn't. estimate and that is co-written by you and steve forbes? >> yes, it is. >> it is a little card. some of you got your bags over their. >> how capitalism will save us and here is the new book by elizabeth and steve forbes freedom manifesto and the subhead this spare why they are morally and big government isn't. >> big government makes decisions and tax the actions based on political agenda based on its selfish political

interest meaning its own political selfish needs and free markets are meeting the real world needs of people. >> as somebody that follows economics and the financial journalists and something that some opinions on this issue bernie madoff, jaime dimond, in your view were those to treated fairly by the federal government? >> he was treated roughly. i wouldn't even put them in the same breath actually. he got what he needed to get. i think of him as a serial killer of capitalism if you don't condemn the whole society because of criminal elements and street crime you don't say r. dee should be in jail because he's got criminals peplos system of the free-market system is going to channel peoples' self-interest into the most constructive activities that benefit everyone.

>> and he called before congress because his company lost money? >> there's risks i think he did a very good job and those hearings pushing back and explaining. people who don't understand the market for don't leave markets are demonizing risks. when you invest money the whole point is that you may or may not succeed and may or may not work out and that is unfortunately what happens and if you don't have risks you don't have rewards and if you don't invest you can't -- all of these great companies that have grown up today was a risk at one time risky investments and the work dhaka >> this is book tv on c-span2 wan loss to be a publication of las vegas freedom fest talking with elizabeth, the co-author of this book how capitalism will save us and the co-author of

this upcoming books, freda manifesto why free-market our moral and big government isn't and we will be talking with the kuhl author steve forbes as well about the spoken >> we have a lot of discussions about the bidding. i wasn't happy with the product and in the movie obviously you have a process that is ten weeks long this distilled down into two hours. out of necessity some of the time lines are rearranged but it's the true story of what happened. on the question of the bidding we got to the end of the process and senator mccain had determined who he wanted to pick we had the realization we can't win with any of the candidates has is displayed in the movie. he's an extraordinary difficult set of stance is that we're good

to be outspent by $200 million. the president, president bush his approval rating was in the 30's. barack obama was speaking to crowds of hundreds of thousands in europe. there was a fervor for his candidacy on the part of the press, and trying to field how to win. i'm the person that said we should take a look at sarah palin. >> are you proud of that moment? that moment freezes and slows down in my brain. [laughter] we spent a couple days of the jersey shore and i remember everything, every aspect of the moment i could smell the smell of long beach island, the salt air the cars in front of the house divided up the call and i

said we should take a look at sarah palin. i said to rickets very important. he was in charge of the process that should be fully and completely embedded and what can we do with ten lawyers and a couple of days we've done with three lawyers over a couple of weeks for all the other candidates. you can do a documentary on this alone. spud but we are not going to. >> i do want to make a part about the double we are talking about. but and there's a lot of context on this. the first part was the tax information, the medical records and all that stuff and was clear. the second part is depicted in the movie where we have a discussion operatina