white clients or very few. most black people don't have a lot of money, and if you have money and you're black, you hire a white lawyer because white lawyers are mow effective in a segregated society. ...

from book tv recent visit to georgetown university here in the nation's capital. we talked with sheryll cashin about the agitators' daughter for generations of one extraordinary african-american family. this is about 15 minutes. >> the agitators' daughter is the name of the book and sheryll cashin as the author and the professor of law at georgetown university. who is the agitator? >> my dad, dr. john, jr. may he rest in peace he passed this last year. >> what kind of agitator was he? >> am i data found it an independent space party in alabama when the regular party was dominated by george wallace in the dixiecrats.

despite being a dentist and a two-time valedictorian his abdication was agitation and he poured hundreds of thousands of dollars of his own many in the 60's mind you and the early 70's into this political party so that alabama could vote for lyndon johnson and the newly registered black voters would have people to vote for and couldn't just go to but also run for office said that as who's lifework and he was very much committed to recapturing the greatness of african-americans in terms of political participation and he was in the area of construction because his grandfather had been a reconstruction legislator and he grew up hearing about his

grandfather while he was coming of age and a radicalized him to be living under jim crow in alabama while hearing about the fact black people used to have political power and be in office including his own family. >> who was he? >> he was my great grandfather, handsome man, isn't he? she was the first black lawyer in the state of alabama and architect of reconstruction. i grew up listening to my father repeat this over and over. as a teenager my eyes would roll and in this book i go off in search of the source of my father's passion and find the outline but he was admitted in 1878 -- >> to the alabama barp? >> not the first but the fourth colored lawyer in the state and he did serve in reconstruction

during the reconstruction surfed to terms in the alabama legislature as a radical republican. my father always made it clear as a radical republican. he was in the architect by the time he got elected reconstruction was already closing down. but my great grandfather, the gentleman in the picture for the next 40 years never stopped giving up on this idea people of color have a rightful place in politics say he continued to be active in the national republican politics attended the republican conventions and raised a family and my father grew up hearing about him and was determined to honor and restore black people to their rightful place in politics in alabama that is what my father was all about. >> why did you write about your

family? what made you take it this far? >> i got tired of hearing my father say he was going to write a book excuse my french but dammit you're not going to like this book. i was terrified that this would die with him so in the mid 40's, early 40's i should say, i got tired of hearing him talk about it and i took off a tape recorder and started interviewing him. i wanted to know everything he knew and make sure it didn't get lost. i interviewed what he knew about the family but also the political party and everything he did. it took on a life of its own and i started researching how much was true and it became an obsession. >> what did you find in how truthful it was?

>> be careful what you wish for because if you go to search for your family history you will find some things are true and some are not. a huge part is that we descended from a bell benevolent irish man who was never a slave owner, a white man, irish immigrant. he and his brother james camel fur during the potato famine. one was a slave owner and one was not and we did descend from this guy but inconveniently he was a slave owner and not only of the father of my great-grandfather, his father who was also named john was one of the more prominent owners and augusto so here i had to contend

with not only by descend from slavery but from considerable wall for born of slavery and i could tie my family's history of relative to advantage, for generations of educated people. my great-grandfather had a classical education in philadelphia. i can tie that to the slavery that is new in the revelation and i reconciled myself to that history hot by what my grandfather, great-grandfather chose to do with that. he chose to go back to the south which he didn't have to and he worked on the uplift of people of color and he chose to identify with people of color when in fact several of his siblings were pale enough to pass and they did pass.

so, he was a bit of an agitator as well so that is one thing that was discovered. >> professor what was your life like in alabama? >> i had a wonderful childhood. my mother, jo carpenter, took me with her in her arms to a sit-in. virus 41 sold and she gets herself arrested with me in her arms coming and that was a turning point in the sit-in movement in huntsville alabama and within a few months of the outcome of the negotiated in non-violent desegregation of public accommodations, two full years before the civil rights act, before the water hoses in birmingham. >> did it help that huntsville was an educated city that there

was in northern alabama. did that make a difference? >> what helped i think more than anything is that huntsville tied itself to the industry and there were coming you know, there were a lot of people, a lot of engineers and scientists descended on alabama, and the city wanted to diaz's seagate itself and that helped them to negotiate this quietly. so yes, from the beginning -- my parents were civil rights activists and after the voting civil rights act passes then they turn to politics. i grew up licking stamps from the national democratic party. i have memories my father ran for governor against george wallace in 1970 and i have th