half will be coming out of that book. the web site is patriot's history usa.com, the author, larry schweikart, this is booktv. >> c-span, created by america's cable companies in 1979, brought to you as a public service by your television provider. ..

[applause] >> thank you and welcome. thank you for the lovely introduction. it is good to be with gavin today. we have had a conversation through the years and i don't want to give anyone too big of a shock because i'm sure many of you didn't realize how handsome i am. [laughter] people have been saying to me, did you see him on the show where that? [laughter] the book "citizenville" is featured on the stephen koger show. i am bringing this up for a

reason. he said at the time that he needed a translator. and they said he was the only official the knew what the fbi was. you realize that a lot of elected officials really don't understand the digital world. i just did a show about the obama administration and i thought that many of the experts who have been working here for many years, many people are calling in are saying that they don't know what they are about, they really don't have a feel. it's one of the biggest challenges.

>> thank you all very much. i am humbled that so many of you took the time to be here. thank you for taking the time to say the wonderful things that you have. it is truly remarkable and it's so wonderful to have you do this. thank you for coming here to take your time. i'm grateful to everyone i am not happy that you brought up colbert. [laughter] to let me try my best to answer that question. let me ask a question that you can ask. [laughter] it is true that if you want to move the mouse, you have to move the cheese. you want to move behavior, same thing. there hasn't never been strong incentive for focusing on information technology and in general. it's not lost on everyone.

technology isn't like lining up in buses, demanding more information technology. so the challenge for governmental leaders is to realize the potential and the possibility and the meaning and purpose. that being said, last week there was a big headline in the l.a. times, and they gave up on a six-year effort to issue licenses. we have our to spend more than half the money. it is not even close to halfway done. is it is nice and a view that

the court system in california in 2004 identify the 260 million-dollar upgrade that was to be complete in 2008. $260 million. today the estimate is $1.9 billion in a case management system with no expectation in sight but it will be done before 2015. if you upgrade in california, the contractor was also fired and got less attention a week ago than the dmv. they consolidated the data center into one. everyone is now more upset with the consolidation than they were previously. if we fixate on something that we all know in california, a few

extra million dollars in the recreation and parks department that we didn't spend, but the money is still there and it wasn't used during the downtime. i would argue corruption as well. >> many with the state parks come i didn't even know that it was their. >> they deserve a lot of attention. i could go on and on. those are just really true. >> it's not focused. >> allright somewhere to the citizens come in? >> increasingly my argument in the book business the importance

of dealing with technology and social economic issues and providing access to broadband and high-speed and a public housing is increasingly beginning to take shape. the cost of that is devices dropping precipitously. you see the access now around the rest of the world. 63% of people in india have access to cell phones from only 47% have access to toilets. we are remarkably becoming out of touch. you can shop on amazon 24 hours a day and then you go to the dmv, go to the local building department. you pay a parking ticket and you realize that citizens are more engaged directly as we move

through social networks, mobility, localization of services and the access and ubiquity of the cloud. we are stuck with this pass down i.t. cartel mindset. this notion that we can build the systems in a world where you have this on-demand resource that you are getting the next best thing, the next best generation, yet we are still building and the government. >> so you're saying that it's no longer relevant to the world we are living in? >> no must sound like everything you talk about, engaging citizen dissident, we'll were talking about a virtual engagement, we? >> people are saying that i'm kind of fed up with local government, state government,

i'm tired of hearings end filibusters and i don't know what the heck that is, sequestration, who made that word up. but i want to solve problems, i want to engage and i want to make a difference. this generation may call generation of choice, the net generation,. >> i must tell you that in many respects and of course i work with them and so forth, perhaps maybe some of the confidence there is inflated in terms of optimism and many seem apathetic. they care about their own education, reforming government.

>> we are talking about it as a means to deal with our great challenges. this generation is more pathetic than any other generation it. this generation is more engaged in volunteering the data and it's one of the smartest generations ever. the iq scores are increasing not decreasing. getting into college is more difficult now than ever. sat scores are higher than ever. i am a little bit more optimistic. don't get me wrong there are some arguments and people think they can tweak the constitution and so forth. >> you hit a tipping point where citizenry is concerned then you get into some kind of citizen apathy. >> the apathy comes. let me back up. let me just make an argument what this is all about. i have been thinking a lot about the issue of leadership.

the private sector into government, and years ago one of my favorite authors was tom peters. he had a bug where he talked about what martin luther king and nelson mandela thought. at the peak of their influence, they had one thing in common, that was jail time. [laughter] he went on to expect these things. they exercise their moral authority. you think about that. the peak of their influence, changing the world. this whole idea of leadership was challenged. you can even argue if you look at this that after they

formalized this, they actually lost a little bit and you can argue about the influence. it got me thinking about the world of elected officials that have this formal authority. >> you haven't done time, have you? >> no, i have not done time. but this idea that we have to wait around for the white horse. i have been waiting around and somewhere expecting it was arnold schwarzenegger. he married maria shriver, that was good, then he got in and president obama had been under that notion to the notion that we had to wait around for someone else to solve our problems. it got me walking down this path.

what is happening with these popular movement here in america, occupy movement, the tea party, et etc. there is an energy out there. >> we are talking about estonia, south korea, a lot of people in search of innovation at the head of what we have. they're places throughout the globe that have a learning curve in terms of what you're talking about. >> he's going to come down to the valley, the president of estonia, he did the proverbial meeting. at taxpayer expense and he came by and i was going on about the great initiatives and our parking meters and our on our cell phones and i was talking about wifi and all these wonderful things. and i knew he spoke perfect english.

but he kept looking at his translator as if something was lost in translation. instead of having this translator respond. he said we have been doing all of that for decades. and here i was trying to say this and not, that, how it is. and i realized quickly that in 1991 they came out of the soviet union. we are stuck with these old legacy systems. these old five and 10 things and it is 200% penetration rates, parking tickets from all of these things for years and years. it depends on the day of the week, it had broadband download speeds. honestly you can't make this stuff up. we are stuck in this industrial

mindset, this top-down hierarchical mindset that is being challenged by what i call these armies of david that aren't using slingshot. they are using technology increasingly. i just think that the reality for us is we have to and we cannot deny that the contours of this change are taking place. media, blogging newspapers, it is obvious in hindsight. but a lot of us did not see that coming. all of a sudden, this industry is we are not buying albums anymore, we are having a wonderful debate about online education, k-12, and higher

education with these wonderful people. >> you are serving and what about the education system? in terms of changing citizenship in young people. is not the responsibility of the institutions to vote in california? >> i have a daughter and i was telling you this before. and a few with kids or grandkids, you all have that experience. he she is discovering things that i didn't know existed. i thought many knew that she was a prodigy. and here she is. >> did she spend time with that?

>> i looked around at every single one of these kids. it is this evolution of thinking that got me saying that you can't educate my daughter like i was educated. her brain is not wired the same. it's talking about the generation of choice and customization. with single subjects in this mass education environment and expect that she is really going to be engaged, this notion of having people based on being lined up his as comedy. >> had to learn about this dedication to change?

>> we are talking about reforming dedication and people we are looking at the gains we have. you go almost anywhere nowadays and you see kids and adults looking at their iphone or their computer and that is where we have to meet people where they are. >> you have probably spent more time as a kid playing these online games, 53 hours a week if you're eight years old 18 years old. and it's true. it's not just young folks. 42-year-old women as well. it is not just that, but it's

all these things. yet we are cultivating this virtually and spending money to do so. you could not make that up a few years ago. [laughter] so how do we meet people where they are and educate them? >> i remember schoolhouse rock. we all remember. we were educated and entertained. except for the persuasion industry was left out, the lobbyists, but everything else made sense. but that whole idea of educating and entertaining. >> that words have been retired a long time ago. [laughter] >> i'm with you. >> the idea is fundamental and that is the risk that is talked about in "citizenville." >> so what does it have to do with making government more transparent? i was struck by the ideas of how

it is viable and how it works. >> the default in government is the secrecy. it is arguably the most transparent in our nation's history. it is prone to that on the issue of drones. >> he said that he was going to be transparent. >> well, it's a good example. if the government is going to find transparency, they are not going to find it from the government. >> information wants to be free and ultimately it will make its way in public. we live in a fishbowl society, a glass house. i learned this and it's folks like you that hold us to the freedom of information act and the local government here in california talk about sunshine

laws. i know that i am in serious trouble that is part of the mercury news today and it is just we are this way. wiki leaks was a reminder of that. but the issue of secrecy is your privacy, generally. my argument has to do with the. >> i would like to think that there is, but i argue that. privacy is being used as a currency because you can buy your way to more customized

services using or giving up privacy. i argue that you must be more transparent. there's a lot of informed consent. you have now to subscribe to all kinds of things mostly for benign or pieces. and we have allowed, especially my age, a lot of folks, learning this language, we would rather spend the extra dollar and not give up that privacy. but i do believe privacy have become less elegant. it is your taxpayer dollars. not our information.

you subsidize it, you pay for. it reminded me years ago that one of the fathers of this movement may have been unknowingly ronald reagan. in the 80s when he gave up all that satellite information, every single one of our beneficiaries. that information is public information that is being accessed by this remarkable taxpayer investment. your weather information on your smartphone is accuweather, weather channel, this used to be in the hands of noaa. even though you subsidize and paid for it. it is not just about some on schedule or overtime but what exists in the recreation and parks department and the building department.

the department of public works. all across this country, cities large and small. to take that information when they trust it has purpose in the engagement. >> i am onto active citizenship, not voting every two or four years. we turn your voice is on. just think about president obama trying to reconcile this. think about what happened in 2008. 35,000 self organizing communities come together for barack obama.com.

this remarkable e-mail campaign, all of that energy, one crescendo is keeping the voices amplified. the president said that i want to hear from you, no one-way conversations anymore. organized communities come together, we were engaged in this conversation and we don't believe in the broadcast model anymore. you will, we decide. >> the president has a big town meeting, people submit their priorities, iraq, afghanistan, war the war on terror, climate change, financial service meltdown. if communities came together and the number one priority would be

to legalize marijuana. the president did exactly what you did. you made some flippant remark. and you may remember that people were seriously upset. check out change not government check out change.gov [inaudible] he is trying to reconcile that with organizing for action. but it is still a political thing to get you to activate for the agenda as opposed to a two-way conversation. you will notice in the private sector.

this notion of one-way conversation is very bad. you need to be prepared to do it. you may recall 5000 signatures, the white house will respond to you. jay carney will have to respond. folks came together doing a death star. then all of a sudden this issue of newtown, connecticut, radical announcer, he was named piers morgan. he should be deported, says the gun rights advocate. so they had almost 100,000 signatures and what the heck are we having this conversation for? so they raised the threshold.

missing the entire point. it is not about petitioning government. it is about creating mechanisms allow others to govern govern themselves more effectively. this notion of government as a vending machine. you put in your dollar taxes or you put in a trillion quarters. if you don't like what you get, you shake the machine. >> a two-way conversation. >> well done, michael. [laughter] it was about making their voices heard. the reality is when you are

talking about the importance of this two-way conversation there are so many ways. people can organize things that really matter. >> that is true. >> i had al gore on and both we are talking about the importance of getting money out of politics and all this new technology and so forth. but the reality is it's not happening, it hasn't happened, many people are pessimistic because they feel it won't happen. >> as much as you can galvanize citizens, what can you do about citizens united? i mean, the fact of the matter is it is there, it's the law,

and now maybe congress can do something about it. >> i think that it is better with a few folks than 500,000 folks, and it's rather distressing. but that doesn't mean that you give up. but this is part of the conversation. serving money is a huge one, respectfully the party system is another. and the tribal nature of the party system. it is one of the reasons we have this today. there is no incentive to good behavior. we have only to go through the sequestered for the worst thing we can do is work with the other

side. we're talking about ted cruz. i said this on "meet the press." poor john cornyn. the number two republican. he is on what they call cruise control. because he can't even exercise his independence because he is scared to death that a guy like mr. cruise is going to run against him. >> and then there is speaker boehner doesn't seem to really have mastered any kind of control. >> but of course, if the technology can make things move forward, as you suggested, the technology can have a role in this and you can actually make legislators move and you can somehow make this glacier move and go someplace. >> i have a lot of trouble when i say that i kind of admire the tea party.

>> because many have stepped up and step down and they have remarkable influence. it's kind of proven that it can have an impact. it doesn't have a long tail like that people are. >> the challenge is multifaceted. the whole issue is something remarkable and you all know this. something extraordinary is happening and you are seeing the contours of this change. when i got a little soundbite and about colbert, i learned my

lesson, but this nation that big is getting smaller and smaller is getting big, as individuals, self organizing, bringing down the government. the challenges in this age is age of amateurs. not necessarily good at transitioning and formalizing a governance structure, someone said you can't tweak a constitution. well, maybe not. but this is a difficult transition and the technology is enabling force to galvanize and organize and have people come together across their differences and it is profound. i think the government is still operating with a vending machine model. not this platform notion that steve jobs ultimately dance. remember that he came out with less than a dozen applications.

the whole idea of third-party developers he is big on this and let's be prescriptive on how we solve these problems. but government be a convener of sorts. we need to solve some ever vexing troubles. >> [inaudible] we were talking about sending

these messages from times square, sending them and maybe something will galvanize people. maybe it being an exception, like you said. galvanizing people since the civil rights movement. we had an antiwar movement, many were part of with the civil rights movement but there hasn't been anything like that since this. those that can get the public square out there. and what they realized as it was in their own interest it is possible at this stage in my life.

i don't trust centralized power. maybe i just know how we exercise it. i would like to decentralize that. i would like to actually talk about evolving and will have more choices in government. i say that not as just a taxpayer, but most importantly i want to engage citizens in government is not an election we are being treated as government and not citizens. we have kind of forgotten night. we have forgotten our collective responsibility to engage.

i don't want things done to me. i want things done with me. i imagine when you are a customer business, you feel the same way. you allow us to do things to you. not with you. i don't understand it. we have kind of accepted that. and it's just an evolution of thinking. i want to put this thing around, it is not that machine of thinking, it is a hierarchical thinking. >> it is organic. it is just a whole new mindset of thinking and i think it transcends the ideology that is out there. you can find aspects of this and the ability to find a squishy middle. so that is what is going on.

i just think that technology is driving us down this path. >> okay, the 64,000-dollar question. it's about today's inflation. how do we get that kind of money out of politics? in terms of technology, how this technology help us? >> [inaudible]

>> so why have we not gone the route of main? >> well, actually, it means that i have to start with john kennedy, kind of a contemporary example. it's crazy. what we need to do is open the airways. there our airways after all. so we can level the playing field. otherwise you're not going to get the choices. the idea with social media is that begins to change. one should not believe that we're there yet. it's moving in the right direction, but thinking about rick santorum and where he is today, it was tv that destroyed his primary campaign. general elections are a little bit more difficult because

everyone knows a little bit more about the two candidates. but the challenge, i will say that the obama 2.0 campaign was extraordinarily sophisticated, as you note. with the next generation. the challenge is it did not necessarily amplify more voices but just strategically the right voices. to connect more precisely to you. not to necessarily the masses. you cannot necessarily translate that into a governing philosophy. because of the various medical philosophy. >> so talking about obama 2.0, suddenly the numbers went down, suddenly he was in a fight for his life to regain the presidency.

politics is a form of making people get to like you, get them to vote for you, coming off this committee. >> politics is also active for ugly people. [laughter] >> that as well. [laughter] >> we have to take a context that this was in, that media has become like this.

[talking over each other] [talking over each other] >> this book has become -- well, i am biased. i believe that one form of government that still works well is local government. when you don't like the way that the world looks, stand on your head and go local. remarkable things happened. i am a big part of the city administrators and supervisors. and i remember that imagine what michael were to say if i came out with a democratic win in san francisco to clean up graffiti. he would say, what are you talking about. or his colleagues came out with a plan to sweep the streets. it just makes no sense at a local level. board of california politics, pragmatism at the local level. i have always said that ideologues make lousy mayors and the opposite is true. you have to get things done. one of the nice things is proximity has a little bit more legitimacy. a little bit more locally optimistic than state and

federally. >> politicians make lousy mayors, but you are the opposite. [applause] >> thank you. >> i would like to thank you for these, by the way. we have to make real change like the tea party dead in a top-down approach sadly i would like to take its dissipated debate, the debate about the sequester, and folks have changed their behavior. they have become hostage to that

ideological legitimate. but you know, i have gone to great lengths to compo complement the movement. folks took over four out of five weeks. i have so much fun i went over and join them in a circle. i got a sense of the vibrancy of the movement. >> one example was undermined by those who are out there and you can have the same thing with the technology. it happens all the time. those who subvert the technology and try to use it to their own advantage. our member when i was a kid, i was appalled by the fact that we have the all-star voting and i was a kid in cleveland. and all the cincinnati reds got elected because they just had a ballot. >> that's what i'm talking about. that's a great example of medical marijuana. the issue of legalizing it is

that you had the king of the hell scenario hill scenario where folks come in and took over. examples of sites that you have to have and there is a real participatory framework. there are new rational conversations that allow than those that hijack and get hijacked by the loudest voices. >> facebook can connect a billion users on this platform like no other. why not get the i.t. system in the future for the state. >> you got it. [applause] >> you all had this experience. looking at government, you had something called an rfi, and that is a response for information, a response or questionnaires, response for

proposal. it took procurement cycle, most responsive bid, and then it goes to more public things and start over and people want to have this and that. that is the i.t. examples i gave. now, it's a possibility. because of 260 million to 1.9 billion. people were fired. they come and go, the companies themselves merged. the example started with a company out of texas, hp purchased them, and then it's a division that did not necessarily perform as they had hoped. that being said that you have the counter example of your 13 year old niece who over the weekend, for nothing, but together some fancy website. how is that possible? when we just went through a procurement over two years with

$3 million. >> not when you have an application that can do that. it's all about engagement. we have to move away from this inside out thinking to this outside and thinking. >> please talk about climate change. how technology can stimulate action. >> okay. i love that debate. the sum total is local consumption. the first time since 2005, more people were living in rural and urban centers combined 30 million and have people. this is essentially urbanization. 75% of gdp, when you look at the

politics nationwide dominantly becoming part of this popular vote. the issue of climate change, not getting lost with a top-down perspective but bottom-up. what are those specific decisions that drive the consumption habits and the energy-efficient habits? >> that is why i remember this. you have fun with me and that was controversial. >> sending the garbage police to show that my egg shells were being appropriately put in a green band and not a black man. my point of saying all this is technology. >> but you never said how much we had to drink?

>> no, i thought of it, this nanny state. sean hannity, it didn't go so well with some of these ideas and some of that. but i believe ms and i believe we can advance some of these principles. this is the big idea on technology. issues like finding a recycling center, the open applications were that we did called eco-finder. we put the information out in the downloadable way. the first application we did, some guy said we care about recycling and now there is an application for that. you can download it for free. ladies, it was right after the composting decision. cisco came to us and they have their new program called connected cities and they said that they wanted to connect a

bus and they did that and converted it and you can read how much consumption you are using an alternate other information where it is transparency. an application they created for the city. not as where they took the idea of your zip code and neighbor to neighbor what your energy consumption is, you can care and you can start having a competition. some companies that are creating citizen engagement and more use of transparency in this context of designing data. you can download this and it's wonderful that they take the census data, all these numbers, and at these guys to originate. you saw it was designed by these

guys over there. and if they take this data and help us designer. create a story about this another is a website that literally designed that in a way that is meaningful and relevant. that is the way that we can process this change in behavior. >> it's interesting to hear you speak about that. i'm reminded of something else. in regards to counterterrorism, i will be talking to the secretary of state on thursday. there's a book about climate change and let me get a broader response for the question, contingencies that are unforeseen, talking about some pretty serious consequences that may happen as a result of climate change, leaving people to come in significant numbers in the united states, trying to

get entries here. talking about places that are vulnerable, it's a reality, how about the new technology just in terms of earthquakes and disasters and a flood of refugees. >> peter schwartz is a futurist and we played out these scenarios for the government all around the world. this is very realistic, scenario plans actually organize indiscipline ways in terms of the potential prospects of those things. >> folks say why should we waste of time and the united states with all this stuff. with china, that's what china is going to do, what is the point? and they just sort of make the case. this is all just a waste of

time. plastic water bottles, don't waste your time. all of these things. my point ultimately is that success leaves clues. and you have to be willing to demonstrate this in a requirement that all the taxicabs need to be alternative. other green building standard not just new construction or energy efficiency strategies. some of the most sustainable cities in america and the most economically sustained as well. when you go over to that, they say, you know, all the leaders

there start thinking differently and ultimately acting differently. so i'm thinking that these folks should be able to have a better impact. >> again, we are still trying to -- 40-year-old technology at the dmv. and you want to talk about cybersecurity. >> hacking into google, hacking and probably everything that's down here in silicon valley. >> you got it. >> we are so ill equipped, water sources, all large and small. this is serious stuff. a lot of this stuff is being organized and we spent 10 minutes here and there and you

say, okay, you start reading through it. [laughter] >> i'm glad you brought that up. because i was always struck by this and many people probably know that there is a willingness to take risks or punishment is concerned. supporting the spanish-american war, everyone said why are you out there, if you have the commitment that you should have come you should be here in jail. >> okay. what you are saying to people in some respect is take risks. the technology allows you to take more risks. >> guest comment politicians are inherently scared of risks, scared to be exposed. in my business i have a failure

award. i give a bonus to the person that screws up the best comedy when a bonus of about $800. >> let me briefly explain what i'm talking about. we don't have a great air conditioning, so we leave the doors open in the hallway. so i had one of those crazy nights as folks come in and apparently i wake at the late check-in and take off at six in the morning. a different kind of person. this guy said that i have an idea before you came to work. he had purchased a bunch of catfish and he said that he knew all the source of these mosquitoes, there are ponds around the hotel. the next morning, my phone rings and i get a call, he calls me

and says i don't know what just happened. he said that it is in the morning and no one explained to me, but there are dead fish all up and down the hallway of the hotel. it is the strangest thing. i don't know what happened. we thought that the guy took initiative to the initiative to try to solve a problem, and it turns out that the raccoons had a field day and were in a frenzy and were running up and down the hallway. [laughter] >> that was worth $800. [laughter] fail forward fast.

so it must be that they feel humiliated. but i succeeded in ultimately discovering 1000 ways of not doing something. >> this is winston churchill. he said the secret of all success is moving from failure to failure with enthusiasm. my goodness. so you try to do wifi and you fail. you are just all hogs and no cattle. you can deliver a darn thing. it's terrible. the whole thing is risk-averse. standard operating system. the only way you get fired, this is an exaggeration of privacy.

but one way you get fired is by not doing their job effectively and trying to do the job of someone else effectively. those of the standard operating procedure. we had this and i was stunned by this. >> listening to the radio, performance abuse and disciplinary records. performance. it can't not be considered with regard to the promotion. it says the performance cannot be considered. you are automatically eligible for promotions. you could spend 27 years and had

an exceptional job. that person may not be promoted. >> your predecessor said we gave too much vehemence, we gave too much because we were democrats when things were riding high. and it's regrettable because we can't make it sustainable. >> now we are getting into deeper territory. we only have a few minutes left and i would like to actually talk about the. >> i'm happy to have that territory. >> i think the biggest challenge is income inequality. you cannot have a vibrant democracy without that upward mobility in the ability for people to have a framework of expectations they can move out. the california dream, the american dream. that concerns me more than anything else. it is not surprising to me because you have seen the labor

movement as we have seen the growing increase in that divide over the last 30 years. you know, there are stickers that say folks gave us the weekend. not just for the members, but for all of us. market to market, the wages that the private sector pays as well. they may not be collectively bargaining for your grocery store, but ultimately it creates pressures. i'm not arguing this inefficiency of overpaying, but i am arguing for the importance of collective bargaining and creating some pressure in a world where there are no wage expectations as we increase productivity because of technology. and we see it flatlining because of wages.

.. >> yeah, i think it's all interesting in san francisco because it's the worst nightmare of the right. because every single thing they say is the end of the world as we know it. [laughter] we've done every single one of them, and we're glad. [applause] we're outperforming almost any big city in the united states of america. i mean, this city's vibrant.

you know, we have universal health care. we already did that years and years ago. not universal health insurance. mistake. health care. profound distinction, and one that still concerns me about the broader implementation of health insurance reform. but this city, i guess i'm pointing out these values are not so bad. they're not -- they're not socialist ideas -- >> san francisco values according to sean hannity. >> i know. i have a soft spot for sean. i feel sorry for his argument. >> well, i've got one final question here. [laughter] >> this is on c-span, isn't it? i'm in trouble here. >> this is the last question. what plans do you -- no, no, let me actually ask another question. [laughter] without necessarily being a, quote, knight on a white horse, when might you run for president, please elaborate. [laughter] >> my little niece is here.

yeah, no. i am struck. i mean, i really am, by this notion of formal and unformal authority. i think of all these folks, gordon mayor, think of the impact those folks have had on the world and a lot of those folks that you forgot about that were formerrer mayors, governors, presidents. i don't know. i remember last year, and i know our time's almost up, but we had a deal in california with the republican leaders and the democratic leaders to do a version of pension reform, we were going to legislate it. governor brown did a masterful job putting the deal together. the deal was done. it was extraordinary. we could prove we could govern. we weren't just focused on finding a crowbar and putting it in the spokes of the wheel of the other party to trip 'em up. we were actually working together. it was more important than deal itself. the democratic leaders and the republican leaders both went back to their respective tribes

and expressed the deal. and immediately the persuasion industry moved in and shut that deal down. and it got me thinking, it's not about the guys or the gals in office. of it's about the system we've set up. in many ways the governor was talking to the wrong people. he should have had the persuasion industry in the room and negotiating with them directly, and then they could let the politicians know how to vote. [laughter] same with -- perfect example, this whole sequester thing. obama and boehner had a deal, we're told. at least woodward claims that's the case, right? but then they went back, and it got crushed. it's not about the people, it's the system. and so, you know, i can sit there, you know, and blame this machine thinking, this vending model we have or start to make a case, as i am here, to reinvent that mindset, to open that up. government as a platform.

not a scarce model where we're delivering services in a limited manner, but a framework of abundance and limitlessness. real,ive citizen engagement -- active citizen engagement. that's my case, that's my argument, and i'm grateful you all took the time to be here. >> thank you all. ms. . [applause] >> a few days before the event in california, gavin newsom attended a party in washington, d.c. to celebrate the publication of his book. booktv followed him as he greeted attendees. >> nice to see you. >> what did you title it? >> dedicated friend and adviser or. >> dedicated friend and adviser. [inaudible conversations] [laughter] >> that's all that i can tell you.

>> there you go. >> i can't say what he does can because he's got -- >> no one knows. >> oh, they know. they know. [laughter] >> but now i really went to find out what the heck -- [inaudible] >> yeah. of sean, sean is a dedicated friend and adviser too. and many other friends. >> many other friends friends. >> friends you want on your side. if you need anything. and if you don't need fingerprints, i can say that, right? >> i wanted to can ask you a question. i'm a ravens' fan. >> why are you rubbing it in? >> i'm not. >> you just did. you did. [laughter] four running plays, four tackles. >> no football game. >> okay. >> but the -- [inaudible] baltimore has by far the most -- [inaudible] >> you know what?

you know what doesn't surprise me just anecdotally? the 49ers getting back to the super bowl because they're such an ip dell bl part of our history in the '80s and those wins and bill walsh, but there wasn't the energy around the super bowl that i recall as a kid. and others marked that as well. and i think the only argument to suggest why is we had two world series or victories in the last three years. >> yeah, yeah. got tired -- >> and so, no, you get to a point where you start taking some of this for granted a little bit. i don't know, maybe -- that's my only explanation. >> it was a great team. >> yeah, fabulous team. two years in a row, it's been turned around. but i didn't know that, that's interesting. >> [inaudible] >> there was a lot of that. i mean, the last few days kind of everyone -- but, you know,

the world series -- 2010, i was still mayor when we won that, and we were in third or fourth place at the all-star game, and we were just all -- a million people showed up. and, by the way, wasn't one of those exaggerated million people. million-plus people, last minute parade, 80-degree weather, not one arrest. not one arrest. people from all over the state of california came in, and it was magical. next year we lose, we're devastated, we don't win again because we think, wait, this is the greatest team ever. and then all of a sudden miracle happens again. but the intensity was there but not at the same level, but there was this sort of this doesn't get better than this, so when the niners -- oh, it doesn't get better than what we just experienced. so we're sort of that era of -- >> yeah. >> that's my take. [inaudible conversations] yeah, okay, good. thank you so much.

i really appreciate it. thank you. >> the young woman from the hill. >> okay. >> you're micked, right? >> i am. >> ellen is here. >> hey. >> lieutenant governor, how are you? >> i hear you're a little under the weather. >> i have a little sore throat, but i wouldn't miss you -- >> honestly, you could have made a million excuses. >> no, i don't. and you know -- [inaudible] >> oh, my gosh. great to see you. >> look at that. >> my daughter is on her way here. >> is she coming by? >> i don't think so. >> she's on her way down here. >> oh, good. a bus from new york? what about the train? >> $90, takes four hours, and you go from penn station to union station, $20 -- >> that's more like it. >> i've never done it before. you can use your laptop -- >> oh, that's not bad. that's good.

>> i'm getting used to the train. philly, new york, d.c. i've been here for a week. >> [inaudible] >> oh, thanks how do you do that all the time? so early in the morning? >> [inaudible] >> 5:30. we did colbert last night which was a little more -- >> oh, i think slow him. tivo him. >> it was a little tougher. >> was he tough on you? >> he was good. he was good. >> everybody likes you. >> it was fun, it was fun. >> i didn't realize that -- [inaudible] >> most importantly -- >> you're what? >> yeah. you didn't -- i like that you talk up my athletic side. >> absolutely. >> yeah. i know. and so you can imagine how excited i was to still be mayor for that brief moment when the giants won that first world

series. you know what? i had my -- >> [inaudible] >> by the way, i tried to get in spring training this year. come on, i used to workout with the team. i'm still working that. but one of the great gifts without overindulgence of the topic, i had my little tv show, and it ended january 31st, but my last guest, and i tried for a year and finally got him, he agreed, was willie mays. i spent an hour and a half, edited down for an hour. he's up there. and he momentum do these interviews -- he doesn't do these interviews. he had a book a few years ago, did one little charlie rose segment and a stewart selling. , otherwise he'll just focus on espn sports, but this was his entire life from new orleans, harlem moving to the army, coming back -- >> classy guy. >> -- fascinating.

it was awesome. so anyway, baseball. >> can we get a shot without the coat rack in the background? >> oh, good. be in the middle. >> that works. that works. [inaudible conversations] >> thank you. sweet of you. >> well, i'm coming home all the time now to do -- i'm on the board of livermore, you know -- >> yeah. >> and it's great. it's great. yeah? mountain view too. >> are you? so what, i mean, but you're mostly here. >> mostly here, but i'm back in california -- >> do you miss, honestly, do you miss being in the -- [laughter] >> be i'm still there. >> many okay, i got it, i got

it. how many years were you -- >> i was in my seventh term. and i had -- [inaudible] with hillary, it was amazing. got the treaty with the russians. >> i know, that's right. [laughter] >> that was one of the things you did. right near the end. >> it was cool, really was. >> still strange that you're not still in it. >> well, i'm on the -- >> you are in it -- [inaudible conversations] >> but i'm always for you, you know that. >> thank you. it's good. i'll tell you, that transition from mayor was more challenging than i thought. it was. i mean -- >> you know each other. >> and i was still in that

mindset of i wanted to get my hands in everything and realizing different job. >> you and jerry doing okay? >> yeah, i think -- he's doing well. i mean, he's just -- i mean, he really has. he's got the state operationally back in the black which is funny, who would have guessed? there's a little bit of -- [inaudible conversations] the taxes are a little higher. >> l.a., all they talk about is taxes. >> they're taxed. >> nice to see you, how are you? [inaudible conversations] >> exactly. nice of you to have me. >> thank you for leaving california for us. >> i know, thank you. i don't want to forget california. >> be we had mike murphy on last week, and he was all mad about the tax, he says i've got to move to new hampshire. >> the retroactivity -- yeah, yeah, yeah. >> never advertised. fair point, that one should be lifted. no, we're not -- our tax rates

are not competitive. >> that's what he said. [inaudible conversations] >> new hampshire, i've got to figure out how to spend seven months of the year there. >> all going to vegas. >> yeah. well, it's not -- there's no mass exodus because it's more disgruntled. >> yeah, yeah. >> but there are a few that i know are on their way out. who else -- alex is on -- >> alex or, yeah, alex -- [inaudible] you know, he's great. >> i like alex. admire the -- >> i don't agree with him, but he's nice. >> really is. >> he's a nice guy. and he's, you know, when he does kind of the opposite, he has a good way -- >> he does, he does. >> yeah, he really does. >> and carly fiorina. and chris matthews. >> oh, that's right. chris is back -- that'll be good. well, thank you. i really -- [inaudible conversations]

>> who was the other one? >> chris matthews. >> chris? oh, that'll be a first. >> it'll be good. >> the last time i was on -- [inaudible conversations] he was probably looking going, not again. [laughter] >> chris is -- [inaudible] "meet the press" appearance today. >> my book is the key. -- [inaudible] [inaudible conversations] thank you, thank you. >> you should have it on sunday. >> i never knew that, but -- "meet the press" has the highest concentration of book readers and buyers than any other broadcast on television. >> love it. >> their ratio of people that

read and buy seven-plus more books a month. >> oh, really? >> yeah. [inaudible conversations] >> we sell a lot of books. >> that's why i like it. [inaudible conversations] >> diane sawyer. >> give me one second, i'm getting pulled away. thank you for being here. what's up, buddy? >> now you know -- >> look how well coifed you are. >> thank you. i see you're wearing the uniform. >> i know. ties are overrated as a governor. i'm now learning to -- freedom. you've dumped the tie? you had a tie. >> they asked me -- [inaudible] >> oh, they did? and nick said, no, you're not going to new york tonight. that was night. >> oh, god. >> so then i got this e-mail saying who was going to be on, and i said, oh, damn. [laughter] >> sorry. [inaudible conversations]

it's too early, how do you do that? well, they pick me up at 5:30 or something, and then you wait around. you know, i'm a west coast guy. so do the math, 4, 3, 2 -- >> you get a nap? [inaudible conversations] >> were you able to -- >> no. >> you're running on fumes? >> it's all good. you do that, that's what you do for a living. >> it still hurts. >> are you on call? i mean, is there a kenneling for you -- schedule for you that's consistent or is it just, jonathan, we need you here at 3 or 4? >> yeah. >> that's hash. >> you know what? i got up this morning, i forgot to set the alarm, and i woke up -- [inaudible] [inaudible conversations] for