so what i'm saying is that the analysis really requires where the interest lies. ..

interest groups, and to go back

to that, and they want to stand in the way of aggregate prosperity. and how do you codify this. raises a very difficult circumstance. the process could be perceived as being more of the spear. important point is an important distinction. the economics for any desire, the size of the policy, to

achieve the outcomes, and the acquistion is the society can do. it can -- >> and that is one of the big hangups. >> one example which is relevant is in thinking about issues -- there is often a discussion around and attack policy that often devolves into class warfare and the real issue, really want to address income inequality and the way to do that is what we do with tax

dollars is relevant for fiscal balance and variable to with the importance. >> two parts presentation. what are the lessons. second, put this country in a position in the interest of learning, and lessons from abroad. wouldn't have the grotesque system, what would be an example if the united states has already learned, would make you hopeful? >> we are both gathering our

data. sometimes you have to build it. evidence of things not seen. >> a small question, and -- i don't know whether you are saying the united states development program, anything in the area of economic growth, some of the things he said.

after three other things. the economic growth area, i can see a different event developing the underprivileged, legal system, the vital economy, talked about some of the time, my bigger question is, sort of an eclectic, that we have certain sensibles in development and develop questions, every

situation is quite complex. privatization is commonly used as the state runs everything, but selling the water system and my main question is about, with another example spring training. something we push very strongly. and in certain ways certainly not convinced by the abuse put the teeth helping economy is. and realize developing industries and protections. and it is some of these other --

anyway, and economic -- >> and -- the facts speak pretty clearly. the point i tried to emphasize is an ideological discussion, try to emphasize, what we know is on average, countries -- they tend to grow faster. and use resources more efficiently and for every

example of a country successfully protected. and so given the wealth of history, as a result of that. and the notion of the government of any particular industry specialized that would allow isolation. and pretty hard to make an argument. >> and discipline therapy and truth, do you see any song the

effect from this administration. secondly, president obama, the transition. president obama agrees with anything that is deceiving. and redistribution. >> and we all want the same thing. and there is deep disagreement at the moment, and there's so much disagreement right now. the discussion really

ideological points. one the best ways. and whether it can be many paths. and what we mentioned. and businesses, if i have a good one. and to be tactical, the question right now is whether -- pecan ground. >> quick question with regards to education. the nyu school of business.

i see from that for there are a lot of international students. from personal experience, obviously doing something right by attracting foreign students and go back and implement the things we talked about. are we doing the right thing? why are they coming and while we not going to north korea to study? >> that is the great question. one of the great things about the united states, higher education, and study. that is one of the reasons, if what we talk about facing the home's opportunity to bring back the society you go to business

school. doesn't matter what you talk about. and the benefits to the united states, and starting good companies. >> good evening. i was wondering if you could comment, developed countries, in a position where there will be lower than average and emerging

economies, asian population and increased energy costs and other factors as well and sort of a permanent feature of the world economy, going to be going slowly and increasing share. >> great question. short answer is for fundantal reasons related to the fact that origins are texting up and made this once. and if elected, do it right now. and pass the growth it is good for us. and if it emerges, asia, africa

as well. they knew about that. and all the way to win. and it is whether advanced studies, and trust that. >> very interested in what you say, it would be nice to see more, i wonder about the office

of corruption. and there would be developed countries. >> no question. it is important to be clear. when i say there are important lessons, talking about that. much work to be done. and there's work to be done on issues, for reforms on other areas, that we build distrust. in order to continue down this path they need to feel as though, and an important issue

in our society and the emerging world developing. [applause] >> the history of the conservative think tank foundation profiles its founder, the heritage foundation began in 1973 and is based in washington d.c. under the thousands of members on annual budget of $75 million.

be >> we have come along way. >> we are going to jump right into asking a question and getting wonderful lancers and open it up to you all, and the question as well. leading away, there will be a book signing. authors are irrepressible about selling their books. there will be a bookselling at 5:30 or something this afternoon. we will both be there and happy to do that as many times as we want. in leading the way i have revealed you almost didn't become heritage present. and the british philanthropist anthony fisher, what is that about and why did you decide to go with it?

>> anthony fisher, and economic affairs in london. and windon school of economics. and to get to know, with the office of economic affairs was about and to work on arthur seldom and i saw a think tank and how it could work and later ron asked -- thought was in washington. anthony fisher looked me up and said let's start getting these

around the world. -- media in washington. and talked about it very seriously. i was an outside director, and december of 76 and frank walton, the president of heritage reminded the board to take a two year commitment as president of heritage and he wanted to go back to california. not bad. and that was something else.

posted reagan california, this economy, frank, why would you want to do that? it involves heritage since the first day but did take over heritage instead of moving your family. i think linda was happy all photius the new yorker. totally missed the inside story. >> made the decision. >> and here we are. [applause] >> the funny thing was as you recounted in this book, anthony fisher's attorney was a very prominent new york attorney, 26 floor of the old pan am building and his name was william casey

as n ronald reagan, the cia. i have gone up with anthony fisher and we were close to signing on the dotted line. five years later, six years later, our father and i go out to a supersecret office of the cia and ask about their heritage for our tenth anniversary, bill casey looked very spurned, and across the desk, all right, that far out of the field. so kind of an interesting thing. so in the spring of 1970 -- --

[laughter] >> why? what was there about working at the beginning to say it was outside, but basically not that well-known, a little on the periphery of events, i can directly from the staff of house of representatives, and sentenced them, we thought we knew what it was and that is short, timely, incredible arguments, conservative perspective that could get directly to the policy.

everybody put books on their shelves, talked about free enterprise and how great it is and why the communists are bad but when it came to how could you vote or how should you vote on a particular piece of legislation that was next, the late bill raspberry, very liberal policies for the washington post told me over lunch the neat thing about the heritage background issues is they are short and i know i can rely on the fact of front to get the last page. i wrote that orip that off and away. bill raspberry was very enthusiastic about our policy. but the new what the ditch was in washington. the question was you have got to spend it. and the whole space seems to be

occupied. and impossible but very difficult. and a competitive motto budget, what was the reaction? what happened in terms of when they begin using the background? >> not much happened to be very frank and that is true not only in the earliest days but in the first days of heritage. it took time to build up relationships to individual members of the house and senate. one of the things we talked about and jim demint has been talking about with internal circumstances, credibility of the research, the numbers are adjusted or fixed, the minute you do that you know your

intellectual adversaries, we know your friends have gone over the line again. we knew that was the very first place that had to be covered and had to start sticking our issues carefully and some of those, i will never forget there will be an expansion of medicare proposed by senator ted kennedy that should be reason enough to have opposed it. we looked up the numbers and said this is in the $2 billion increase they say it is going to be. it will be closer to $10 billion. fear the good friends in the congressional budget office, send it over to the congressional budget office, they did, the congressional budget office came back and said the number was a little more. they justified our number, this president finished the number and said to people maybe we can rely on it and mandate leadership came along and fooled

that story and told it so well in the first paragraph. >> what release strikes me in writing about expanded is really a big cap again, fairly small, modest organization, and so forth, you made a commitment to the mandate for leadership before reagan was nominated. that makes you in my book a pretty big risk taker. >> a couple things happened along the line. we have a great board of trustees, william simon, secretary of the treasury, secretary of energy and energy, and jack eckerd was head of the general service administration and there is talking from the dinner table at one of our board dinners and they had very simple questions. if in fact we go in and take a high-level position in a new

administration, the first thing you've got to do is get your spouse down here and your kids down here and find out to sell your old house and put all your vessels into with trust and if you are worried about that and in the meantime you're going into your new department and the only people you are hearing from my the people who are already there and they have an interest in the status quo because they want to keep doing what they have been doing all along. all of a sudden you have been there for six months and you are the cheerleader for the guys you are supposed to be running and redirecting and it is business as usual, whether it is a nixon succeeding lbj or ricardo succeeding gerald ford. is business as usual. how do we make people think differently? how do we tell them what to

happen differently? that kind of germ of a discussion that led to the whole idea. >> extraordinary. 2,000 recommendations of which 55% to 60% adopted by the reagan administration that is a record that i don't think any of the think tank in washington or america or the world can talk about. not only did that make us credible in the washington scene, on the washington post best-seller list when it came out in january, always right behind something called the pretty hand book, never understood that. we were number 2 for quite a few weeks. and the neat thing about it if you go back and look at it is when we talked about for example

-- this was all done by volunteers, 300 volunteers, getting volunteers nominated to work on something before the guy had even been nominated little elected. this was pretty big especially with an unknown think tank like we were and that not only set here is what reagan has been talking about, here is how you would do it and here is how you have to restructure the department of the treasury that the current consistent secretary for tax policy becomes the undersecretary who is higher level than undersecretary, he will chair the interdepartmental meetings, he can call the meetings, he can set the agenda and kind of run it and make sure the right thing happens, not only did all that happen and the treasury secretary signed it in

one of his first quarters when he became secretary of the treasury he appointed the guy who chaired the committee, under secretary norman went in and froze the the 1981 bill that became law, that the reagan tax cut we are talking about earlier so it was a practical handle. the neat thing that you recount again five years later it didn't make a difference. four or five years later by 1984 there were 40 other organizations doing knockoffs of what the mandate for leadership had been. >> when i interviewed the president of other think tanks in washington d.c. brookings and c s i s and kato, i said what difference has the heritage approach to research made? all the difference in the world.

the brookings president said we now do what heritage first started so heritage really, and i say that in the book, change the think tank culture of washington d.c.. >> one of the neatest things that i can say among all of you, 25, 30 years ago when phil and i were just getting our feet wet at heritage there weren't 600 people in the united states who knew what a think tank was. 600,000 people have voluntarily supported us. that is incredible. incredible impact. >> glad you mentioned that because there is no other think tank in washington or the world which has the kind of base, membership base which heritage has. it is absolutely extraordinary and gives you a financial independence and editorial independence no other think tank

has. no corporation can tell heritage what to do. >> as you recounting the vote there have been occasions where individuals have come in and said won't you change your views on this or that particular policy, and when they say no, there is your donation, turnaround and walk out of the room and that happens with six figure gifts. that is one of the reasons we are so proud that we have a very large budget, but only 5% of the budget comes from corporations. the rest is from individuals like all of you, foundations, real america, not the big guys. we can follow the way.

so what difference do they make? >> again. one of the neat things i always believed, try to communicate to children and grandchildren, think about the history of ideas. because ideas matter. richard weaver wrote a book called ideas have consequences and they really do. that is the first, the idea. the idea of freedom. the idea of the individual being able to climb the ladder of

opportunity, where his ability will take him. that is the first of the three. the second is the individual. the individual who can promulgate those ideas or implement them, the idea, the individual might be a very learned person like milton friedman or might be a practical politician like the jim jordan we will be hearing from later today. in the third act. what seems to be missing sell-off on the conservative side is the institution. when going through the history of heritage, one of the recurring thoughts that he talked about, missile defense, welfare reform, social security,

these are issues that hang around washington and you have to keep refining them, you have to reach new audiences, you have to the reselling of all the time, day after day. that is why you need an institution. you can't be a one person bloging machine the treadmill saying the same thing over and over again. you have to have an institution that goes out and sells those good ideas. it has been seven years since dick cheney, sitting vice president, celebrated with us the twenty-fifth anniversary of ronald reagan's 1983 strategic defense speech, which is have obama say we have to beef up strategic defense in the northwest part of the united states.

52 years we don't have a fully deployed missile defense system. there hasn't been the soviet union, reason enough, we still don't have a fully deployed missile defense. 1981, the ranking republican in the house, the minority leader chaired the session was just asking me have you done this mandate, what is going to be your main context going here in the new congress? tell me how we can work together? i started talking about defense and john lehmann's vision for 600 ship navy and to the president's newly elected president reagan and his inaugural address and we talk about others things, social

security reform at that point and said we don't talk about training. by 2005, a president in the white house, but the dust go around the country, there's a problem. there's a problem with this program. and the way it is we have got to do what really

needs fundamentally changed how so how intertwined? what was your part of the vision back then when you got started with heritage thinking about the conservative movement? >> going back to my early formative time, the institute of economic affairs in london, the center for strategic and international studies downtown here, the hoover institution, fairly good idea of a lot of them, really important think tanks around the country, one of the things it seems to me is if they are on our side and we can agree on something, let's

celebrate, let's not divide and subtract. bring people together and figure out where we can strengthen each other in these arguments let's put aside the differences between the libertarian and pay no conservative, here is 85% of what we agree on and push that together, that led to that first dinner meeting in chicago after meeting in the philadelphia society, and around the first table from different groups around the country, let's figure out how we can work more effectively together. last year richard wagoner tells the 35th annual resource bank at colorado springs, 600 people, 32 different countries, 325 ceos of different organizations get together, days talking to each

other, always chatter about let's cooperate on this process or maybe we can work together over here and something where we agree. bringing that conservative movement together is one of the critical world heritage has played and we are not there to knock somebody else but to build up other organizations and figure out how to work together and be more positive. you know this from the lectures, seminars we put a, from times when a congressman or staffer, congressional and senatorial committee will call us and say we need somebody over here to testify on this particular subject and i will call derek morgan or one of our experts. we don't have anybody like that but out at the hoover is they have a guy -- we call him up and arrange for him to come to give a lecture for heritage to go over and testify or a professor

at carnegie-mellon r-texas a&m, bring him in and see how to add and multiplied or take those resources that is so diffuse the around the country and bring him into washington and make a difference in the policy in terms of working beyond the beltway. >> we have always been concerned that heritage about young people and one of the questions we have is what advice do you have for young people, young leaders? >> it is such an exciting time to be a conservative, to be able to communicate through exciting ways young people can communicate now whether it is bloging or tweeting but the first piece of advice and let do this every time i meet with incoming insurance, our intern program, young leaders program, it is more than the interns, 65

in turns, three times a year, 30 years we have been doing it. >> i will take your word for it. >> people who have helped form the ids, developed ideas in four institutions that you are now a part of. but read about milton friedman, read about what he chicago schools did in terms of converting economic towards socialism, crow principals thinking, and, read about russell kirk. and his emphasis of the roots of american quarter and what an ordered society means, why liberty has to be based on

tradition, and you see all of a sudden that milton friedman is reinforcing this because we want freedom but the fundamental question is what do you do with that freedom? and ordered liberty. and we have volumes, one chapter, each of the great thinkers of the 20th century, mitch that story is here right now, in the conservative movement to bring together so many strains of ideas. that is the first thing i tell young people. the second thing is don't be discouraged. if you were around post very cold water and you are where we as, finishing my nba, parents were afraid i was going to drop

out in pennsylvania, downtown philadelphia, strong goldwater territory. introducing barry goldwater, university of pennsylvania, robert strauss, who was 85, passed at age 102 but robert strauss was introducing it and one great political leader, i was introducing strauss who introduced goldwater. and real political indoctrination, and the young people who got this rich history, and the institutional base.

and friendly competitors all around, from whom we work, americans for tax reform. they are all fair. they were not there 40 years ago. the sunday before election in 1964 the philadelphia bulletin called me and said you are the highest ranking goldwater volunteer we could find. what is going to happen in philadelphia? pretty big stuff 22 years old. i said if we lose philadelphia by a 100,000 votes barry goldwater will carry the state of pennsylvania which was probably true. we lost philadelphia by 400,000, lost the state by million.

pennsylvania was not strong goldwater country. my point is that was tough politically back then. basically good guys have got control of one half of the congress, basically good guys, they need reinforcing, and so much better off and ideas are so much more mainstream than they were then. younger generation has to realize and appreciate how much luckier they really are and build on the bigger base we have given them. >> looking back on 36 years you have been president of heritage, can you single out something you are proud of, several of my friends here today. >> the policy side we talk

about, certainly missile defense, rebuilding the whole pentagon, go back, go back to basics, back to the constitution, four billion copies we distributed of the constitution around the country but the back to the constitution. the first thing the federal government is supposed to do is provide for the national defence for. it isn't to give preschool children a warm melted lunch. it is to provide for the national defence. if you are going to do freaks schoolchildren. why do we have 17 programs to do that? did we decide after 13 fat we needed to do 14? let's go back and look at them. anyway, i get off of that. number 2, welfare reform. welfare reform because welfare reform is not a case as we

pointed out at the time under bill clinton, it is not a case of the welfare queens driving around in their cadillacs collecting more checks. is reforming the basic unit of society, the family. is better to encourage families to stay together then to throw the husband hours so that the wife or the mother can get bigger checks. some basic things like that that we research going back to charles murray to what robert rector did subsequently and all the rest. those policy issues that are front and center in everything we are doing, what stuart butler did with enterprise zones, privatization, the biggest achievement as far as i am concerned is heritage is a

permanent institution in washington. you can't talk about policy options on capitol hill or in an administration. even in an administration without this, taking into consideration. that i think is the real legacy is that we can start celebrating now as we look at 40 years of heritage. [applause] >> what about looking forward? what about the future? what do you see in the future for heritage? >> i see a great future for heritage. jim demint and i had a great opportunity over the last couple months to be out and around the country. we have been almost 20 cities to get a meeting with heritage members and many of you have been with us in some of those cities around the country and talking and getting your input

about where heritage should be going but steady as she goes. heritage is built not only a nati cnstituency but broadbased of support among policymakers not only here in washington but in state capitals around the country as well. that is why we have got bob macdonald from richmond and paul the page coming in from maine and tom corbett coming in from pennsylvania, three great governors all facing very different sets of challenges. our son, daughter-in-law and two granddaughters live in pennsylvania and the biggest challenge in pennsylvania right now is whether the government is going to be the largest buyer of alcohol in the world today. the government of pennsylvania buys more alcohol than any other single entity anywhere because they have a monopoly of abc

stores. so the question korbut and the republican dominated state legislature is facing is is that good or bad? that is a no-brainer for most of us? it is a big issue and the governor has to be pushing ahead. in the meantime, so excited enthusiastic about the federal system, corbett and the legislature in harrisburg have been encouraging fracking. shale goes up from pennsylvania into new york. they have been encouraging to go into pennsylvania and you see new development coming, that is where the oil industry of the united states really started, pa.. they are encouraging it. the state line with new york, andrew cuomo and the legislators

up in albany. i blame this on jim demint because he is the first who said it. like the difference between southea andth korea. state line between pennsylvania and new york, pennsylvania is driving and new york is the press because they won't let them do anything. the geology is the same underground. we got these great chances now with the federal system. that is what we are really all about as our country. not every good idea is invented in washington. very few of them are. look out there beyond the capital beltway and let's learn from each other. >> you lead the way in so many ways as we were talking about this morning and building heritage as a permanent institution. helping to build the conservative movement to this vital force is a major force in american politics and changing the think tank culture here, not

only here but it can be said across the country and even the world. the question so many people here would like to have you address is what is next for you? >> the neatest thing and the first thing i want to say is thanks to jim demint and our board of trustees, they asked me to stay on and have an office on pennsylvania avenue, on the other side of capitol hill, 20% of the time, doing whatever i can to help preserve and advance the conservative movement that way. in the meantime i am looking at other opportunities to really so our message around the world, around the country, wherever i can. as you know there are a lot of organizations in our conservative movement like the philadelphia society that is going to be celebrating its 50th

anniversary a year from now. go back to the roots of the conservative movement. you were around shortly after but i am the only one around at the first meeting in new york city in november of 1964. the first time bill buckley amendment that milton friedman we revers, that is when we started the philadelphia society. next year we have our 50th anniversary. what that does is bring together a lot of the leaders of institutions and leading intellectuals from all around the country for that annual meeting and annual concept so there are a lot of things out there in terms of promoting our ideas and building the conservative movement that i look forward to doing. i can say this, it is thanks to linda shea put up with this for

the last 44 years, she does remind me still, she married me for better or worse but not for lunch. so i will be active and i don't play golf either. so i have got a lot of opportunities. >> heritage, the conservative movement, america is so very blessed, as a present leader, i am absolutely certain as a future leader in all these areas so thank you so very much. [applause] >> for more information about the heritage foundation visit heritage.org. >> visit booktv.org to watch any

of the programs you see here on line. press the author or book title in the search bar on the upper left side of the page and click search. you can share anything you see on booktv.org easily by clicking share on the upper left side of the page and, selecting the format. booktv streams live online for 48 hours every weekend with top nonfiction books and authors. booktv.org. >> we are at the annual conservative political action conference in washington d.c.. the author of "obama's 4 horsemen: the disasters unleashed by obama's reelection," david harsanyi. david is the editor of human events and former columnist of the denver post. you talk about four issues going into obama's second term. described them. >> dependency which is not just about welfare and food stamps and things like that but a general fundamental change in the way people react to each

other in government, the debt which is self-explanatory, the problem is a lot worse than the lead manager in, surrender, foreign-policy chapter, it is not a neo conservative argument, more a reflection of how we believe our place in the world and what it is and the debt is inevitable for most of us and is about abortion for the most part. >> this book is being published in march. how long did you have to put the book together and were you thinking of obama's second term? what was the time line? >> i didn't think mitt romney would win but i put it together rather quickly. i have been thinking about it but the book is not a huge book because how much would you read about the four horsemen? is a slim book-of-the-month to write. >> the budget situation, what are your thoughts on that? >> i think there is an

ideological divide washington that will be hard to come to any consensus or agreement on what to do. we are in bad shape in that sense. i like the paul ryan budget came out recently. i am a fan of a lot of ideas in that budget and republicans need more ideas and less latitude. i am happy in the direction that party is going. >> would you want people to take away in a second term. >> the politics matters and it is not just about popularity but policy and politics can be really destructive. i am libertarian about the world and my viewpoint so i think the book warns people that these problems are a lot worse than they think and don't just go away. >> tell us a little about what you do. >> i am a new editor and we put out one i like to think is acceptable but smart content about politics and culture and books and all sorts of things

that are going on and we have some great writers and we will be bringing new contributors aboard soon. it is an old publication, 1944. >> david harsanyi, author of "obama's 4 horsemen: the disasters unleashed by obama's reelection," thanks. .. >> scott spiker, he was a very young, at the time, navy pilot and the father of two, had a nice family started down in jacksonville, floda