newsstands. >> host: this is your second book conspiracy theory. jesse walker is the author ian here is the cover. . .

>> it's an honor and exciting to be with my old friend chris, talking about her beautiful book. i love it so much. i thought maybe start with what got you on to the book, which means let's start with the most difficult emotional. can you talk a little bit -- you do in the book. >> great! [laughter] >> talk about what got you thinking about foster care and what happens when childhood is disrupted? >> there are a couple of things, first of all, thank you for being here. thank you to the strand for having us. thank you everybody for coming. okay. difficult stuff. so -- >> make it funny.

>> okay. funny, difficult stuff. [laughter] okay. i grew up in a crappy family. so that happened, and i wasn't removed, although i did -- i lived with a mom and i left her when i was fourteen and never saw her again. and i lived with that guilt and that pain for a long time. i -- there was no foster care intervention. then i moved with my father, and there was child welfare did contact -- did come in to our family, but i was never removed. i was always terrified they were going come back. i had a sort of dual-fear, i was like, i needed to be removed at some point. i was afraid of being removed. i really didn't want to be

removed. i just wanted to sort of get through where i was. i didn't know, i mean, like a lot of kids, i feared foster care. i didn't know how to think about it as a kid. at 28, i became a foster parent. that was a complete accident. hi. that was a complete accident. my -- here comes some more people i know. and adam knows the story, because we were both living in l.a. at the time. there was a girl -- i was a high school teacher. she was my student, and she got in some trouble, and she was sent to a probation school. she's transgender and none of the kids knew that she was -- that she was -- hi. she was assigned a boy at birth. one of the guards found out this and he told the other kids that she was -- that she was born this way. and they threat tonight kill

her. they would have. they were tough gangster kids. so what happened was she called her group home and said, hey, you better pick me up. they're going kill me. and they said, the van is in use. it's always about a van. foster care is always about van! i was thinking about calling the book "the van ." the van was in use. it's true; right? right. so she ran from her -- she ran from her school, which was a violation of her probation, so they called the cops. when they called the cops, they put out a warrant for her arrest, they closed down her bed, she didn't have anywhere to go. i said, she called me. so i said, all right, i'll come get you. we'll figure it out. it's outrageous. i'll come get you. when we got in touch with her probation worker and caseworker said we don't have anywhere to put her. you want her?

that's how chris kristina came about. through that, i really started to think about how is this system that is designed to protect children and supposed to take care of them doing so much harm? i really wanted in to look in to it more deeply. that's how it came about. >> it's a beautiful masterful book. it took you five years. it's rich with you're the powerful deep stories. and lots and lots of statistics. obviously i want do you go through a lot of your favorite statistics. >> adam, i asked you not to do this. i said i can tell stories, don't make me remember the statistics. i'll start making them up. don't do that? >> you didn't in the book. >> no. they are true in the book. i double checked, double checked, double checked. >> so i am interested in the reporting process, because you spend five years sort of in and

out often very intimately in these lives. can you talk about maybe what the -- that seems to be the family you spent the most time with. maybe describe a bit what their situation is, and what you saw unfold? >> okay. the greens were a family i knew a lot of foster families. i talked to a number of families and interested in finding families that loved their kids, and wanted to do right by their kids. because we know -- we know there are a number of mediocre families. we know there are good families. we know there are great families. we know there are terrible fan families. they make the news and makes go we need to change the system! i wanted to find a family that was great so we could see with the system has cracks. it wasn't really the family's fault. we could see where the system isn't working. i heard about the family, the

greens, they are a family in brooklyn, and nay have eleven kids. four biological, seven foster, they adopted some. and i was interested in them because they came to foster care the way a lot of people do. any of us might the father of the family, his sister couldn't care for their kids and the agency said can you take them? they said yeah. it was a family foster care situation. he took in the kids and the family decided we have room. we want more kids. let take in more. they had a good experience with their nephew to take in more. by the time i met them, they had seven foster kids. and were a little overwhelmed. the way they managed their overwhelm was become strict. they are a religious family with good, deep values. and dhaidz had a lot of trauma. so in this way it's the not

unusual. and with the kids with a lot of trauma. they had been through many homes. one of the girls i have followed has been 22 home before she landed with the greens. her dream was to become adopted. a couple wanted to be adopted. some had good relations or some relations with their biological family. some didn't. what i did was i just followed happened through five years. >> would grow -- sometimes it seems like you're there a lot. >> i was there a lot. i was there a lot. and so i just hang out with them on weekend and weekdays and then go to sports event with the kids or, you know, hang out with them after school or just be with them in their house. then i also show up for important event like adoptions or case court -- or court dates whatever. i would show up. when something would happen, like, when a child would go back to her biological mom. i would use it as a moment to look at the history in foster care --

it's not a static system. i think that's one of the problems in reporting, is we think about it often as, foster care is a sort of static disaster. it's not. it really changes with time. and it's certain point history it's favored biological. and other points it's favored the, you know, removing the kids. so i -- >> driven a lot by news. >> driven a lot by news and scholg theory and various trends and culture. so that's what i found. i use the moment that happened in the green to pan back and look at things historically. i was interested in the story and come back to the story. so that's kind of howdy this. >> it's very effective. i mean, the fact they're not perfect. there are times reading the book you want to yell at them. they're also not heroes but they're doing very heroic which some of us don't do.

>> right. >> which is take particularly the older kids. the kids who are not cute little six month old or 2-year-olds. >> right. >> i would say the hero of the book, mary and youngers -- >> yes. >> is that mary in yonkers? >> yes. >> okay. all right. i thought so. >> how did you guess? [laughter] >> well,let -- let talk to mary. talk about mary. when you it's sort of amazing. it really is an amazing thing you do in the book. i think it's just when we need it most. we have gone through the journey and through the greens we're -- you don't get lost in the sensationalist of the worse

cases. i would say a solid b plus family doing the best they can. you get how agonizing this is. and just it's almost too much to bear the pain of a solid b plus family. i can't imagine a c minus family. that's when we meet mary. i'm sure mary isn't a hero. but she is a hero of the book. and tell us a bit about her story. >> mary is a hero to me. mary is -- right? right. [laughter] because you know what you keep hearing again and again from the kids and i know this from my own daughter, i know this from other -- from talking to so many people is you -- what kids need and what often the agencies don't support.

i'm not trying to demonize agencies. there are amazing people within the agencies. i'm talking about sort of systemic approaches. is this sense that people are really interchangeable, and people are interchangeable parts. and it's a whole system of interchangeable parts. we need to find a kid a bed. >> in the right classification. >> in the right classification and going the kid is in the wrong classification. got move the kid. and get another van and put the kid in another van. you know, and what once the kid reaches a particular age the kid is done and we sign the papers and the kid is out. and mary really defies that logic. what thinks about is attachment and attaching to the kids. what she does is has this big house that the kids call a mansion, and it is kind of a mansion. it's very --

it's big. it's big. it's not really that fancy. so don't think like mansion fancy. >> you describe it as a acoustic guitar. >> yeah. it's kind of an acoustic guitar mansion. it's soft and comfy like that. but mary lets the kids stay as long as they need. she lets them stay way past the 21st birthday. there's no cutoff date. that's important. because we need family beyond our 21st birthday. think about your first breakup and first job loss and first -- when you cry, and you are at the loss you don't need things. you need people. and that's what mary provides. she sort of gets that. there are other people in the system that do too. mary really shows that in a way i found powerful. >> there's something in

describing mary's home where the kids might come in really it didn't even occur you could think about adoption and mary does i guess with small but important group of people to call moral adoption even if the legal system doesn't provide it, you say i'm taking on the responsibility of you -- of a relationship with you permanently. >> yeah. >> reading the book, you have these kids who sort of enter the world of the book, which is later in childhood. 14 or so, when they are still sweet, goofy kid. >> right. >> and some of the kids -- by the end of the book are in their 20s and are -- would be classified as scary. as threats to the, you know, there's one child -- one guy who doesn't want to talk too much about it. but clearly, you know, robbed people -- >> right. >> and it's and this is a theme

throughout the book how foster care just undergirds the population that foster care is supposed to address undergirds so much of societal enter -- ill, they enter the system as a young children and the system ejects them out. if they're not lucky enough to meet a mary along the way. they are no longer institutionalized through a quote, unquote caring system. they're in the penal system. can you talk. i don't want to get too far to the statistics. talk a bit about it. the homelessness, the prison population that foster care is really -- it's too much of our society does see it as that's just about childhood. but it's tie to the rest of that. >> yeah. i think there is a -- there is a link between the child welfare system and the criminal justice system and the systems. we spit it out. i don't know that i have answers

as to why except that i think it's deeply rooted, from what i see, i think it's deeply rooted in from what i have seen in the book. there's a lot of people that study and know a lot about it. i do think that a lot of it has to do with trauma and lack of repair. there's all the stuff that experts will talk about in terms of a lack of resources that kids will get out of the system at 18 or 21, and they don't have resources and they don't have connections so they have to turn to various things crimes and whatever. that's how they end up in the criminal justice system. but what i've seen is that, you know, when a kid is removed at five or six or eight or ten, and put in to a stranger's house,

it's so traumatizing. i mean, we really, really need to think about when we're removing a child and what that means. that just -- imagine being taken out of your family home. even if there's neglect. like, even if it's not the greatest home. imagine being yanked out and thrown to a stranger's house. how terrifying that is. so then, what do you do? you start wetting the bed. that's, like, pretty much number one. so many kids i've talked to got taken out of their first home because they wet the bed! right. they wet the bed and get sent back to the agency. what happens? they hardin en. they get freaked out. they feel unloved. they feel like they if something wrong. they feel like they did something wrong the first time because they are a kid. they get sent to another a more restrictive home and put in to institutions and by the time they are 18 or 20 they feel

pretty unloved and pretty unwanted. they don't really have somebody reflecting back to them, you are here -- here is who your best self is here who you can be. here is -- it's partly about lack of resources that everybody talks about. it's also partly about being wanted and valued. and i think that is a real reason we see at lack of voting flow between the two systems. that's my perspective. it's a little soft, but i think it's there. >> yeah. i mean, i think sort of the shadow in the book is the thing sadly horribly missing which is just a good enough childhood. people who have not the greatest parents in the world. but just sustained attachment over their whole childhood. >> right. i mean, i think that, you know, it's true that bureaucracy and love make strange bedfellows.

love is really what is missing and what is most needed. >> right. >> fundamentally. >> so i studied economic issues for a living, and -- >> with love. >> with love. with a lot of love. [laughter] and, you know, from an economic standpoint it, unfortunately, it makes sents it would -- sense it would be a neglected area. the foster care system, as you describe it clearly imposes a lot of cos on us collectively as a society. it does them in a defuse way it's hard to allocate the cost properly. it's something you want government to be good at, but is often not good at. and it's hard to think of any private actors who other than, you know, people like mary who take it upon themselves. it's hard to think of systemically how private actors could take that on.

but -- >> is that why there's little in a economic story. you're spending $22 billion, you know, and i think why is there not more outrage it's not being managed in a more vibrant and interesting way. why aren't you covering it all the time if. >> i think from a political economic standpoint. if you a politician and genuinely take on the issue that will make the world a better place and also get you elected this would be a terrible one to take on. let's say you come up with a solution. the benefit would be diffuse, hard to measure, and take place over decades. >> generations. >> and so, you know, if i want to win an election next year, the fact that there will be fewer arrests in 2040 or less homelessness in 2035 is a hard

thing run on. plus, it's a constituency that frankly is less likely to vote. less like likely to -- i don't mean to an almost potentially depressing conversation several degrees more depressing. i think what you're doing by articulating the many areas in which, i mean, you do describe how unifying the foster care system with at juvenile criminal justice system has a perverse and negative outcome. at least looking at the costs throughout society so that at least we're aware of it. i could see as moving people -- >> i also think that foster care isn't a discreet or child welfare isn't a discreet pod with discreet edges. i think child welfare is actually -- touches all area of society. so that actually when we're thinking about or writing about

or talking about all kinds of public pots. we're actually touching child welfare. one of the problems we've had is that we've only been talking about child welfare as this issue over there. that something is affecting only these people in this one area. actually it's impacting all of us. not only on the negative way, but in all kinds of ways. we talk about child welfare. we talk about issues of education, we talk about issues of race, we talk about issues of poverty. we talk about issues of -- we're talking about, like, all kinds of issues that affect all of us. they don't think is just discreet thing. you're right in it's not like a politician can go in and build building and say see, i built a building, elect me. one of the ways to change the conversation about child welfare is talk about the ways it is part of our culture overall. you know, if that makes kind of sense. not sound like politician.

[laughter] >> i'm vote forking you. >> thanks. >> so we're going go question very shortly. >> okay. >> i sort want to know what happened to you during this journey. >> i made a lot of charts. i made a lot of charts. i -- at one point my editor -- i have some people here -- i have written 500 pages. and my editor was like you need write the characters and the issues and lay it out. i had bulletin boards. my partner was like, oh my god, it's everywhere. it's taking over the house. i got very disorganize and very organized. and i really, i mean, i've always been interested in teenagers. i really, really thought a lot

about the teenagers most of all. i saw -- what i really saw was in looking -- i thought about a lot of thing. the teenagers and the way numbers changed since 1997 when clinton passed the adoption state family. it brought the number of foster kids down. that's what everybody has been cheering about. it's something to cheer about, definitely, but we shifted the numbers. there are fewer little kid but we really -- what has happened it's back system about the older kids and getting aged out. i don't know that systemically we've addressed that chris, you know, how to manage it. there's a ton of studies about the kids and what happens to them. there's barely any about the foster parents. really hardly any national study about foster parents. behave -- we have a few in a few states but mostly ante-dotal. we have little data about who is

taking care of our kids. roirchg there are some gaps. >> we're going go to questions. if it okay. i wouldn't mind hearing with mary a little bit. >> mary is a hero. >> yes. [laughter] >> yeah, mary! >> want me to say anything specific? just answer questions? >> i would love hear -- because i found reading the book that i both -- it made me -- which i have never thought of before want to be a foster parent and also think, wow, that seems really, really tough. can you talk about what -- explain how many foster kids you've handled and have in your home right now. and what it's meant for you. >> i don't use the word foster. i have kids. i have youth. i was in to teenagers. and that's really what my passion has been. and what i realize is --

i began as a foster parent. i didn't know what i was doing. i was naive in the beginning. what i learned -- actually the kids taught me. they're the most powerful teach. they taught me they needed one person, me, to care about them and be there for them regardless of what they did. you know, they had different behaviors and stuff like that. it was really about just they needed somebody who said they were a value and as chris talked about. they don't come thinking that. and it's difficult. i don't minimize that and i don't recommend you take as many as i did. it's also the most rewarding powerful thing you can do with your life. i don't think there's anything that beat it is in term of satisfaction rewards. they're not -- the media and they're not even maybe long-term. they eventually, you know, if you can survive it now because my kids are really, you know,

mostly grown. there's just -- there's really nothing but the gratitude pouring in and stuff like that. it's not what i did it for. there were many years, this year is thirteen years when it wasn't the case. but it's still, you know, i did it right reason. i want to help kids i was originally interested in helpingless bee began teens and that didn't happen for a long time. but eventually that did too. and i have a mixed bag of kids. i recently i said i claimed 12 kid, but that number has now gone up. some kids claim me. the number increases regardless of what i try to do to stop it. but t the most powerful thing you can do. what i have done is increase the age of youth i work with. my first child was 14. every year my ages went up. now it's 21, 22. because i find them again with

nobody. you know, they do. they leave the system with nobody, and it's a constant stream of kids that are aging out with nothing. no resources. it's tragic. i mean, really it's tragic what we do our kid. >> i think if you can survive it, it eventually gets you back. i don't know if that's the greatest. >> it's true. and surviving is not that difficult. if you're not caught up in needing instant fratification and it if you're not doing it for the wrong reasons and you're really doing it it's a very selfless thing, and if you can get through it and not take it personal. it's really what you usually say. if you get caught up in taking it personal it'll destroy you. if you can maintain distance and old on to your sanity. the kids will be okay. and you'll be okay too. and, you know, again, there's nothing better than you can do with your life. >> thank you, mary.

[applause] >> are there questions? >> hi. my name is simone. we do foster care for pregnant and parenting teen. i have a quick comment and a question. the comment is that it's true if you're a politician you cannot easily tie advocating for restructuring the forecaster care system to your flat form; however, in new york state with the paid for success bonds. i personally think there's somewhere a way to tie it to decreasing homelessness rate in the shelters. if anyone is working on that. feel free to come by and say hey. the question for you, chris "barack obama: the story" in your book based on tonight's talk are tender and nuanced and

rich. what do you want the book to accomplish? >>? are a couple of dreams. i wanted to turn up the volume on a couple of conversation so people might not hearing the conversation could hear them. to sort of broaden the landscape of who is talking about foster care. so that it would open it up a little bit. bring more air was my goal. i would love to -- i think child welfare is an important vital parent of our culture. i wanted to have more dialogue

around it, really. i wanted more people to be reading about it and understanding it and thinking about it. because it's so -- t us. it's really all of us. yeah. i wanted people to think about it and talk about it and bring in more voices, really. and have it be taught at every school. [laughter] >> and she wants each of do you buy a copy. >> hundred of them. >> hi. >> so you talked a lot about the problems. i know, foster care is a pretty big subject. i wondered, you know, if any particulars are state are better at handling it than others or more broadly other countries that have model to look after that are maybe do it differently than the united states? >> you know, i think there are places that have some interesting models. i think there's stuff going on right here that is actually quite interesting. i think that. i have at lack of voting hope in

-- lot of hope in the waiver system. i'm curious about it. florida has done the biggest thing. it's the way the foster care is funded. i'm sorry if i'm telling you things you maybe already know. it's essentially if funded on per diem basis. every day, you know, if i take jennifer here; right. and i put her in foster care. so i have to remove jennifer from her family and put her in faster care in order get any money for my agency. i don't get any money until i remove from care. until i see what kind of bed. she has some special needs and has to go to a residential home. she can go to -- she needs to go to a terrific so she gets a little bit more money. i figure out what kind of bed

ghets. i have to as an agency request the money from acs, from the city. the city has to then take my request and request it from the state. the state has to request it from the federal government. this is a lot of counting beans; right? and most of the time in foster care, a lot of time child welfare is spent counting beans. basically. it's a lot of expense. time consuming expense requests. and the reason that we do it this way for one thing question track where each child is, and how much a schield costing. because they are public none. we want to make sure the money isn't being misspent. but a lot of people say we are spending more time on paper than people. what florida did and what some cities and counties have done has said forget it. let take waiver. a flat sum and don't have to remove jennifer to get the money. we can just gate flat fee.

so they did it to a tune of $140 million a year for five years, and what it means is some caveat. it's more complicated they can take the $140 million and put to front-end services. they could, you know, do domestic violence treatment. they could put money to the neighborhood and do front-end stuff and not have to remove the kid upfront. some people say there's a perverse incentive to take the kids out in order to get the money; right? so florida's numbers went down. it looks kind of good. obama opened up in 2007 and said, more states can apply. so now there are 30 states and cities that applied, and we're going it see what happens. it could really change way foster care looks. we're not having the per diem system. i think that is really hopeful. i do think that we're getting away from group homes in general. some states are not so much. but we are overall. sort of getting that group homes

institutionalize is not great. families are better than group homes, i think. so i think there's movement. i think that here we are getting it. there are organizes that are amazing. that are going in and doing -- i don't know if it's the primary role and doing mostly oversight with agencies and cities to say how can we redesign what you're doing more child-centered. i think there's exciting stuff happening here. i don't think like we're ohio i god. there's negative incentive fop do fewer services. >> yeah. the risk with flat fee if we go, all right, jennifer looks pretty good. let -- sorry to single you out. jennifer is our average kid. let make the services fit jennifer and not not thinking

about pat. and pat is the, like, super freaky kid we really have to take care of. pat's needs are the going get need. we're thinking of jennifer as a basic. that's a risk with the flat fee. the overall thing with child welfare it's one message. so you to think about every single family of individual. every single kid as an individual. if we can do that, we would be a million miles ahead where we're now. rather than trying to find one model to fit everybody. >> that is pat, if you have to believe. >> he's the other hero in the book. he deserves another applause. [applause] a question back there. [inaudib] >> thank you. >> congratulations on the book. >> thank you. since the book being released, what kind of hitses have you got on your e-mail regarding from

readers? what kind of remarks are you getting? >> that's so interesting you asked. did i say who you are? >> sure. doreen is another star in the book. [applause] dor, en lost a child when her child was 23 months old. is that right? and doreen is a very powerful woman, and we met how many years ago? [inaudible] six, five, six? seven years ago. >> when you were teaching. >> yes. she was a student of mine. and so what kind of comments? a lot of comments. a lot of people have been writing saying, like, they're like you saying i lost my kid. i want to know more. or, you know, where i i heard

you on the radio i'm interested. what i've been happy with. i haven't -- it's been, like, parents, foster parents, adoptive parents, child welfare workers. administrators i've met some parents that i think are bad guys. there's no bad-guy role, you know, i haven't had any, like. most of the people have been pretty interested, and, yeah. yeah. thank you. >> good question. >> because you know about foster care before you started writing the book. >> yes. >> what would you say surprised

you the most after the five years in term of what you learned? >> yeah i was surprised at how little is known about foster parent. in some states we don't have to train them at all. they have zero hours. some states we have to give them a lot. leftthere's no consistency in that. i was surprised at how -- because it happened with my own daughter. how consistently -- and i thought she was amom -- how consistent sayly they need stay connected with their biological family. how i saw it again and again and again even when it's destructive to them. even when they know it's destructive to them. they will go back.

i think the system doesn't make a lot of allowances for that and doesn't necessarily train the families for how to manage that. it's something that needs to be talk about more. yeah. i was not surprised by how directors and commissioners and things people in acronyms that are completely incomprehensible. yeah. and i was -- there are so many really smart people in here in the field. really, really caring dedicated, smart creative people doing really great work. mostly what they're bucking up against is bureaucratic gridlock . that's really what i found. yeah. >> do you know if commissioner richter has read the book. has he commented? because i think the comments

that you made there is no wrong person in the system. i think the system is scary in itself. but i think that most people are on the same page. >> right. >> when i think about the commissioner with the changes he's trying to make starting with the close home, starting with what he's doing in prevention with the evidence-based program. it feels to me like what he's trying to do are keep children in their homes and not separate them out. i'm wondering if he's read your book. he knows about the book. >> he knows about it. i interviewed him. >> you did? >> i did. he was -- [laughter] he was very careful. there were two media people in the room whriel he -- while he talked. they had a lot of hand signals. he was being very careful when

he talked to me. i couldn't quite get him to be extemporaneous. i didn't really get him -- i have sent him the book. because he's read it -- because he was in it. and i was in the book. i talk about close home, and i question it's been a movement to bring the kids that rupp in rtc the residential treatment center outside of the city. it's to bring them to the city. that haven't committed crimes not being brought back.

i question why it's on the kids and not on the foster kids and why the foster kids are staying in the rtc. and, you know, i have personally i would be curious to see what you think. i personally have some questions about -- about the they merged juvenile justice and acs, and most people think it's a great idea because it's -- because it's they say so many kids are -- they can get both services. there's presupervision of a foregone conclusion. it's a little bit upsetting. what if we combine? it's me being the idealish. what why is it all this kind of

model? i think commissioner richter is very -- he has we can't tell yet in my sense. i tonight think he's a bad guy. i don't personally think he's a bad guy. but it's hard to tell exactly. i think he's a politician '00. >> thank you. hi. >> i'm terri. >> hi, terri. >> i'm an interested bystander. great. thank you very much for the work you're doing. and i have a question. you've been getting us a sense of the public. one of the reasons we can't get more system energy from the public because there's no vote in addition to the fact kids aren't voting and the where are we in term of someday the

general public will say i've had it? do so you any sense of that. if it's a clear question. >> please , ma'am say enough with the -- >> yeah. the general public people who don't know about foster care. >> some of you might have a better sense of that. does anybody feel like people will rise up? >> i have an opinion about that. >> go ahead. >> i might have heard it on your show. i don't know whose show it was on. [laughter] on one of the npr shows, about how politicians -- it depends on the committee they're on, and how easily re-elected they are going back to the idea. and the education committee from the federal government. those people who sit on the committees get the least amount of donations. they're not sitting open the energy committee getting all the

petroleum dollars. they're not the mover and shakers. who is funding the education system? definitely not exxon or due point or, you know, i can't remember what program program. i think it speaks to exactly what you're saying about -- how do we look at the system. who how do we as individuals look at the system. who are we going entrust inside the federal government to actually listen to us because we don't have those kinds of funds? there's a congressional caucus on forecaster care now. that has it's mostly representatives.

it's charlie rankle and michelle backman. >> is she bipolar. no t bipartisan. we're not spreading rumors. [laughter] okay. these is a foster parent, yeah. yeah, she is. but, yeah, they have done a congressional listening tour which has gotten some attention. they did new york. they have done florida and seattle and l.a. they have done miami or maybe i'm making that up somewhere. and they're going around. that has been -- i don't think it has big bucks but it has a lot of people. and that is the first time happened.

>> decided for some personal reason. i remember spending a day at capitol hill lobbyist for haitian government. nobody wants to talk to lobbyist from the haitian government. they have no pull in the world. they needed to find those senators in congress people who happened to have visited haiti or had a -- had a staff member from haiti. and but when they found those people and got them together, they could sometimes get them to use a tiny sled of power in the good direction. >> on that tip. i think that's what this book really taught me. that's what is true about foster care. it's not a distractions. it's not a system out there. it's about the person connections. that's when it works best when you know somebody. when you're pulled in to care or when you become a parent. it's because know that kid and care about that kid. that's when it works. that's when the magic happens.

and where we're going to actually see some change. it's not about really changing like the system in a big way. it's not like we can sort of rebuild the building. it's about knowing someone individually. which is probably why we have gay marriage. i hate gay people and then -- oh. , i mean, i hate my brother but not -- i would like to ask one question i think we are running out of time. you know, i found myself which i have never occurred to me before maybe i would like to be a foster parent. what is involved? [inaudible] maybe pat can talk about the remarkable program which is a little different. can you -- maybe pat can talk a little bit

what does it take? >> it's a practical thing you have to take different state by state and city by city. it's ten weeks of classes and some hours. it's it's practically not impossible. that's not the hard part. what is amazing about this program you have to believe is that they start with the kids. nay start with who the kid knows. >> that's pat's program. >> the idea is homelessness prevention rather than thinking about it as that's why i found it interesting. it's not an agency that said no here is a kid here is a crisis. let put the kid in an available bed. what they said is a kid who does the kid know? the kid knows somebody. and all the families i know that's how i came to my daughter. she was in trouble. i said we have a bed. oh. wow. you love each other. let's make it work for a long time i cared about her and

committed to her. it lasted. that's the way the program functions. they find kids through all the agencies and then they say who do you know? from they work with the parent and give support. i might not be explaining in the best way. want to give it a shot. >> that was very nice. but the other thing is still interested in the general public from a learning experience. we made wonderful connection with people. young people they previously didn't know. and it's because we actually have them sharing the same time and space during the education process. >> it tarts with a class? >> yes. i would say sign up immediately. >> like right now. >> and we're doing so -- that. >> bring your wife with you. and just -- there's no commitment to take a learning experience. and we've had a lot of people from the general public were connect with the kid.

because they became acquainted with them through the learning experience. that's what we encourage everybody. everybody in the room too. learn about it. and a good significant percentage even if it's 20 percent will wind up going go ahead and doing it. that's what we need. >> and so you -- is that typical you would start with some kind of training program then you get certified? >> yeah. you take class. usually in new york, they last ten weeks. i know. it's a few hours a week. it happens in every state. somebody comes to your house and making sure your house -- it happens if you're adopting through a private agency. it's the same process. they come to your house and make sure that you have a bed and you have the right number of square feet and a door that closes. they make sure -- they do a background check and make sure your house looks fine and you check out fine. pretty simple. [inaudible] yeah.

this is to legally do. it you tell them what kind of person you want and it goes from there. it's pretty -- you adopt it, it's not that hard. what happens is when the kids come. then, you know, it's a story. the set up is -- [inaudible] wonderful we have come to the a lotted time for the evening. thank you so much for joining us this evening. [applause] thank you also for you guys for being here. if you haven't already, make sure you check out a copy. have a great night! >> thank you, thank you, guys. [inaudible conversations] we would like to hear from

you. twitter.com/book of tv. the pub publisher called "12 ." we are previewing some of the fall 2013 title. i want to start with "dallas 1963". it's a book we're excited about been it came in our first thought was assassination of jfk anniversary. we've not touching it. we brought the proposal home. we preeveryoned the next day. it's not a book about assassination. it's a biography of the city of dallas and the three years leading up to the assassination. it shows what was going on in dallas made it inevitable in the city. you had the head of the american nazi party. the head of the american kkk in dplas. you had walker who can be admired in dallas trying to run for president. you had a conservative

right-wing political fashion there. the hero of the book is actually stanley marcus new nieman marcu. he had too step up. it takes you to the day. >> this is coming out november 2013. >> it's coming out the end of october to lead to the 50th anniversary of kennedy's assassination. >> who are the authorities? >> they are two major type of guys. they are universities now. he's most famous for writing the first biography of george w. bush. just after he was governor of texas.

the program threat was being handed out in dallas the day kennedy was coming. >> "dallas 1963" coming out at the end of october. "call know burrow." >> it's the first biography to actually em pass his entire life. believe it or not february 2014 will be the centennial. he would be have been 100 years old. he's one of the premiere biographers. he's basically had access to all the paper, archive and interviewed anyone alive at the time or before alive he interviewed allen ginsburg and others. >> who was he? >> he wrote "naked lunch." one of my favorite things after the man script.

he was the famous in the first season of saturday night live. he made experimental films. they were very popular. his influence on american culture is unpress precedented. your october title. >> "the crash of 2016" look at the cycle of boom and bust times in american history. and argued the crash of 2008 was just a prelude to the big crash coming in 2016 and how that's the -- this is a preview. booktv on c-span2.

you can see past program and get our schedule on our website. you can in the conversation on social media sites. up next author and columnist ben shapiro. the editor of breitbart.com talk about how hollywood influence and the type of personality voters want in a u.s. president. what he said is the tendency to -- he's the author of five books. gloition from your newest book you write president obama was elected at least in part because he was black. it was a positive for him. many americans believe that america needed to elect the first black president to move beyond issues of race once and for all.

instead, they got a champion race bully,s mas qer raiding as a racial unifier. what do you mean? >> >> guest: president obama came to office on the great wave of the american approval. he was going unify the country along with racial lines. swhapped that the president has suggested in multiple ways not only the continuation of american racism. but that is one of the most serious problems still facing the country. we have seen it man test in everything from the george zimmerman trial to the continued focus on voter id. the attempt by the obama administration to paint it as a racist thing as opposed to a voter fraud. the questioning motivation of the american people or his opponent is something that the president obama likes to do on a frequent basis and pays tremendous dividend in the only sector of the racial population. they showed in number far outweighing. it's wonderful they showed up.

fortunately a lot of folks showed up because they were convinced by voting president obama they were stopping a great racist tide that was swum up to the surface against president obama. >> host: when you hear the term post racial what does it mean? >> guest: we live in a country where everybody is free to make their own way. and the obstacles folks face should be a identified and targeted on an individual level. i think we have a ghost hunting pretty quickly. we tart talking about constitutional racist. i don't think that's true in america anymore or my generation and the continued push we saw for example at the 50th anniversary of martin luther "i have a dream" speech. the greatest obstacle facing young black folk is white racism. ..