can find the discussion online at c-span.org. we'll take you crossline to the american enterprise institute, a discussion that is underway for a few minutes now. the dalai lama, part of a panel looking at the issues of free market economics. also on this panel the former chairman of the president's council of economic advisers glenn hubbard. it's live here on c-span2. [inaudible] >> i think not like ancient times. some people come from outside. okay. america i think is like that.

moderation like that. this wonderful nation. but more or less this is america, so safe. that situation has completed changed. [inaudible] so thank you all. we and they is actually unrealistic. so we must think entire 7 billion human beings, we must consider. that is my honest belief. so no problem. as a politician --

[laughter] or that you see, a little bit of insane person. still same person, human being. [laughter] >> clear? >> clear. >> so the main purpose, you see, we have to sort of look seriously about future of humanity. at least this century. now, we already enter the 21st century. now, remaining the century, i think like -- becomes very, very, turning point century. now this century also should be. so in the past century, a century of violence, century of

war. this century should be century of peace. peace not come from the sky. since the violence we created, so peace, we must create it. piece only, through our action, not through wishful thinking or prayer. i've witnessed in my daily life, for five hours prayer, medicating. not all your wish will materialize through prayer. i don't believe. but as a buddhist, your action is most important. buddha cannot give you what you want. you must make happen. so buddha says you are your own master. of course then, believers

believe in greater. wonderful. my friend says we are all created by god. so we all have some spark of god. so that's concept really gives us self-confidence. and then what is the nature of god? if you read really believe that, you must be more competitive person. nobody says creator is full of anger. no. full of compassion. creator is such -- creatures.

follow, creators, example. wonderful. then nonbeliever, whether we believe in religion or not, we are human beings. the biologically, we equipped human affection. and also we, everybody, comes from all matter. so in our life, the beginning of our life a matter of affection is so important. i always tell to those people who received maximum affection during childhood, early life, i think deep inside, much happier.

that those individuals who early age, level of affection from a parent, whether from other, then i think that experience remains whole life. deep inside. some sense of security. so anyway, so believer or nonbeliever, we all have the same potential becoming more compassionate person. so our life starts that way to now for that i think scientists are the friend. i think through, throughout the experiment, they have more things to say.

i am also learning from them. [laughter] i am looking forward to discussions. that's all, thank you. >> we're going to turn now to our panel to promote -- provoked some of the wisdom from his holiness based on what their work is showing them today about our economic system, about the world economic crisis, about the morality of our system in a better world and we will start with lynn hubbard, the dean of the business school at columbia university. he's been the chairman of the president's council of economic advisers under president bush. he has held a number of distinct positions and is the author of many books. glenn hubbard. >> thank you very much, arthur. your holiness, i know i speak for the entire audience that we are grateful to you for this engagement. and are the, grateful to you as well because, frankly, your work is taking economics out of the dismal and bringing back the happy.

so that's a good thing. i wanted to talk about the five step argument that i've made at least in my professional career and research for the marelli and economic success of the free enterprise system. my charges in the university are largely young business people, but i confess to you that my favorite teaching is to slip into freshman principles of economics and talk to the and his students. i would say to them, i'm coming with two questions, and they were the questions that drew me to economics. the first is why isn't the whole world rich? it's a very deep question. it's easy to say, and the second is what can we do to achieve vast prosperity any society? i tell them if they hang with me will answer those questions together. the first point i want to make was that free enterprise economies have demonstrated both absolute and relative success in both generating prosperity and alleviating poverty. economist will tell you that the

first, second and third industrial revolutions were made possible economic institutions, by the support of property rights and the defense of individual economic freedom. we've seen that extreme poverty alleviation in china, in india, in sub-saharan effort, has been made possible not by government action, but by an opening of markets and the restoration of individual freedom and commerce. on the negative side we, of course, have the. >> tech of economic failure of the soviet union's collapse, and a clear case study of north korea's ongoing failure having started in the same place as south korea. second point i would make is that free enterprise is critical for the economic success that can find both the market goals that many in this room were gone, and a very important social goals that his holiness brought up in his remarks.

entrepreneurs are not people who are directed. they are people who have an uncoordinated search for opportunity. and market oriented financial systems due to great things. one, they advance prosperity by investing in firms that become successful, and, frankly, by allowing week are outmoded firms to fail, they advance society. this is about dynamism, to economists often talk about creative destruction, the new replacing the old. but i like to talk about nondestructive creation, ran into new things that create divisions. that is the source of innovation and wealth. it's also about happiness. my columbia college and nobel laureate in economics, ned phelps, has noted many times that satisfaction in an economy is highly positively correlated with measures of its dynamism. third point is i have many concerns for status economy today, the lack of incentives

for innovation, for a governorship leave both consumption possibilities and living standards lacking. traditional approaches to foreign aid in those societies, relative to encouragement of business or of entrepreneurship have largely failed. and large government roles invite went sinking and corruption. and by the way, -- rent seeking. but i would also say that capitalist economies face a number of cautions. we have been very good at generating average growth, but not everyone is average. economic inclusion by which i would mean the ability to obtain meaningful work is an objective that has to be maintained with dynamism. a social safety net is important, but what's all the more important is the ladder to get to work. work is a symbol of advancing economic mobility. it's also the symbol of

advancing social mobility. and free enterprise societies need to contemplate a marshall plan almost within themselves to advance the work opportunities of the least off. the final point i would make is that while economist, myself, often talk about economic efficiency or prosperity in economic terms, i think one can go back to adam smith and classical writers in my profession to make the defense a moral one. smith called natural liberty the power to buy and sell, take or leave a job, and make a deal with whomever you like. that's not just a feature of commerce. it is a feature of a moral society. dignity is also a symbol of a free enterprise society. markets promote mutual respect for each other's talents, for each other's energy and hard work.

arthur has said many times, and said it well, that earned success with the fruit of your own creativity is an important moral and satisfaction objective, not just about gdp. and i would leave you with a couple of thoughts. free enterprise societies tend to be societies that have more dispersed power. the power is spread out evenly in the population and not with a single controlling government or central planning. central planning systems are less likely to reform, to adapt, to be present in the modern world. and free enterprise economy has that natural buffer. to close were i begin, our goal ought to be to celebrate the success of free enterprise economies, but stretch the goal of success to an idea of mass prosperity. i think the goal is morally right. i also think it's economically achievable. >> thank you, glenn hubbard.

your holiness, doctor hubbard had told us that the free enterprise system is naturally the most moral of economic systems, but that we have much more to do to include more people in its blessings around the world. you agree with this? and how can we make it more effective? >> yes. first, when you mentioned -- [speakin [speaking in native tongue] translatetranslate d one of the questions you asked your students was -- >> you mentioned at the beginning. >> translator: why haven't we been able to make everybody rich, so his holiness was

wondering what sort of criterion are using their in terms of someone being rich? >> all i meant, i'll admit by the statement was the idea that why isn't the whole world as prosperous as the most prosperous country? why is it that the united states is a rich country, but other countries are not? what is -- it's a hard question. >> you used the word rich as the meaning rich, billionaire, that's impossible. ..

and china. so then to follow but that's modest. i think things have been very realistic so the reality, the change in the economy system, so that about a lot of prosperity.

at the same time, the capitalist country in the united states to get rich and poor. [inaudible] india -- levels of control by the government. and some change. so that is a fact of reality that shows thinking.

[inaudible] so now we have to find discussions. that we need more sense. and finally the sense of humanity. all of the activities did everything. it was construct if. they paid attention and changed. i myself don't know.

at least a few studies on the world economics -- [laughter] [inaudible] we turn next to the perspective of business who says the founder and chief executive officer of third point capital which is a hedge fund deeply involved in the system here in the united states has done work on the northeastern thoughts in his own life. he is going to give his perspective on what we see in the business community today.

today. >> i just want to say you are holding an incredible honor today and the leader to the people. i grew up with my dad who would have been about your age today. he would have been proud to see his son up here. i carry that spirit with me. it's also incredible to be with the spiritual leader of the capital, arthur brooks. [laughter] i'm not sure that my dad would be quite so proud of that. [laughter] i started my fund in 1995 with $3 million under management. it's grown a bit over the years but i started in june of that year, and i started practicing

yoga a few months before that. in fact my yoga teacher is here in the back of the room. and about five months after starting my business, the fiduciary had other people's money under management, my yoga teacher convinced me to go to india to study yoga with the master. it was an unusual decision. i got a call from one of my friends, a competitor in the business who said don't do that. it's a huge mistake. everyone's going to think you are a flake for leaving her business to study yoga for a month. there were no internet connections than and a cell phone service was nonexistent. but it was well-founded. so i went anyway and i had a great month and it launched me into a passion for spirituality, contemplation, meditation, and i

just want to say that contemplation and meditation are not just for monks and hermits but for people i think can improve our lives so i wanted to give specifics and talk about how contemplation makes us better decision-makers. i'm going to close talking about my experiences on the front line of the financial market and how this was together. it's been crucial as an investor decision maker. one of the first lessons you learn in yoga i think it said yoga [inaudible]

which means yoga quiet fluctuations of the mind and it's consistent with what his holiness says it can't be a happy person if your mind is not at. we put ourselves into difficult position. so you can preserve your and emerge ianti-emergency situatiog good choices. as with a navy seal last night he told me about his training in how it searches them like steel. that's probably the appropriate training but there's other types of training and certainly what the dalai lama teaches and what i've learn from your gut is applicable to all of us to be better decision-makers. if it is a question of getting

to the right outcome, one of the things we learn from yoga and this is from life is described as a wheel with many spokes that come out of it and at the center is your heart which it be your moral grounding and i think for all of us it is critical that when we make choices, not just from the standpoint of what is going to create a favorable outcome, but as the dalai lama said yesterday make sure we make decisions that do no harm and that are consistent with our moral framework, whatever that might be. so how is this helping me as a business person? on the one hand, we have the -- i look at three types of decisions that we make.

one is the very core foundational decisions which are easy. you are honest, you don't hurt people, treat people as you would like. do whatever your framework is. second is the decisions we can turn into a framework. they might be in sports, going down a hill. you know there's a framework for how you bend your legs into disrepute your weight in a certain way and you may have certain things you've seen time and time again and you can do things consistent with a pattern. then there is the third type of decision. some of them they might fall into a very consistent pattern that we've seen before and a lot of times it is new territory for us. that's where this practice enables us to be more creative and intuitive to make these better decisions. why am i spending all this time talking about decision making?

we are lucky as the dalai lama said we live in a system that favors the individual's. not all systems, not all countries give us those choices. so glenn talked about the dispersion of power. that's the key. having a system in which power is dispersed and pushed down to the individual makes for a more effective organizations and it's more important that you also have to trust individuals make good decisions. so here for the capital markets and why this relates in the business of making many decisions all day long about people, about markets, about the stock, about all different kind of things. i want to talk about the markets themselves and how they relate to this discussion of prosperity and flourishing and why the

markets make the world a better place. there is a common view that financial markets are good in the sense that if somebody has a new idea and there is a venture capitalist they can invest in the idea and that man or woman could create a business around that and innovation and get iphone's out of that system and get medical advances everything from fedex to the businesses that have been started into this framework and that's the key. everybody appreciates the importance of robust venture capitalist market. but that is just the tip of the iceberg. without a system that also provides for credit, that's another part because when you start the business you need

credit. they don't come out of thin error and it's not just by banks. institutions are by people and make decisions to invest in equity where there is liquidity for the person to invest $10,000 or $20,000 or 200,000 in a startup as a potential. and to go down the line the person that buys the share needs to feel comfortable that there's a rule othereis a rule of law as corporate governance and sometimes people look at these things in isolation. and w we took about two key concepts and that is liquidity. those two things are critical ingredients to the system that

we have. and if you have the roadblock and if you have people that feel confident in the system that we have. sometimes you will see situations where creditors are treated badly and you might feel like who are those creditors they are a bunch of vultures and they don't reserve to get theirr money back let's just change the rules now. you might say those are unappealing people biting the credit. the people that suffer are not just investors in that particular credit situation. the entire system relies on the knowledge that if they don't get their money back, there's a system they can rehabilitate and a structure whatever it is that they invested in. there's also the benefit of those that invest their capital. for example the people that in

best on the pension plans, the retirement funds from individuals providing for their future. they can create a prosperity thy that we have and the kind of innovation. it isn't perfect though. i want to close by saying we should have a marshall plan for this and the most important thing i see out there is education to get people included in the system. and for me personally, my philanthropic energy is drafted to words how do we get a broad base of less privileged people that have been written off by the system. i will tell you one thing i is a myth that poor people is the white rich kids.

we have a school on the board of the success academy and in the poorest congressional district in the country and number three in the state of 3,528 schools in math and one out of two were in the talented schools. we need to work hard on educating kids. there's a lot of things we can do differently. mine is education. but we need to bring as many people as possible into the system. >> one of the things he talked about is that for the free enterprise system to create listings for the most people we required the government regime to protect the property rights of individuals i know you travel

all over the world you talk to people in oppressed countries and free countries what can the nations d due to protect the property rights of individuals to bring more poor people out of poverty. [inaudible] i would say basically. it is interconnected [inaudible]

but the reality, everything is related. so, the proper way is that we have to look more holistic from the larger picture so first i think the individual initiative. that also entirely depends on the self-confidence, self-confidence and also the education.

then as you mentioned i see the whole system here in the judicial system and the rule of law. and among people, so the protection [inaudible] >> you can see many factors that are intertwined. >> as you mentioned the trust is important, so trust very much in order to trust honest and transparent, very important.

so in the, in that respect i think the more self-centered attitude -- it is possible to develop differences in the reality but something different but trust, so honest, transparent so long as others. so yes. all these things are in the rest

of the community. therefore, trust. first you hope for more trust. so this cannot produce [inaudible] the human nature for the sister and brotherhood and now education for the descent a quality. the existing model of education

is something in that respect. and rely on the religious faith. [inaudible] i think that for humanity we need more universal responsibility and commitment. thank you. now, i have more respect about

capitalism. [applause] [laughter] otherwise than exploitation. [laughter] >> we have learned over the past two days that it truly can be and should be a blessing in the lives of all people like the poor but every single one of us in the room notwithstanding the fact it will not be if it isn't on the basis if it isn't executed in practice on the basis of brotherhood and compassion and that is what we are learning from you these last few days. as of respect for capitalism was very solid coming in but the respect for the underlining principle that can live up to its promise before we start coming from you. we move on now to jonathan hyde,

a professor of ethical readership at the new york university school of business. he is also the world leading expert on the science of morality and has given these ideas from the dimension a great deal of thought. jonathan? >> thank you, your holiness. this is such a great day when a religious leader that is beloved on the left comes to a free-market think tank run by a man that seems every day to be arguing the most recent argument that conservatives should start fighting for social justice before it was a piece on the social safety ne net for this is scrambling all of the categories it makes me so excited that we might finally break out of what we have been in for so many years and i were arguments about the role of business and government. in my remarks today, i would like to tell you three stories about capitalism. his holiness, embraced the first

story until five minutes ago i discovered his moving on to the second story, which is told by glenn and dan but i would like to urge that he devotes his efforts to help us write the third story. so here they are. it is exploitation and it goes like this. once upon a time the work was real and authentic. farmers raised crops and craftsmen made goods. people treated these goods locally an and strengthened locl communities. but then one day, capitalism was invented in the darkness spread against the land. the capitalists developed ingenious techniques for bringing more out of the workers and they've been sucked all of the surplus for themselves. they used this to buy political power making the rest of us their pawns for ever. [laughter]

in the wonderfu wonderful recene white nations failed, it shows there's a great deal of truth to the story and most nations and at most times. economic institutions have been extracted, not inclusive and generative. this exploitation story after many of our deep and moral psychological circuits, one of them as we judge people based on their intentions and if people do something that is intending to help us we do not tend to give them much credit. this is what happens to business people who enrich our lives. but are we grateful clacks it isn't from the benevolence of the butcher, the baker -- was happening here. here. lets see lets be grateful for better technical equipment. okay it seems to be studying now. it's not from the benevolence of

the butcher, the brewer or the baker that we expect our dinner but from their regard to their own interest to read we may praise their skills but we never praised her virtue. in fact we see them as selfish and this is the view that was held until five minutes ago. i first met him at the university of southern california three years ago and at that time at that conference i asked him what kind of government would you like to see today if you could advise on the new government what would it be? his response was betwee between socialism and capitalism i am a socialist and furthermore i would describe myself as a marxist. in my mind, it is the only economic theory that expresses a sense of concern about equal distribution and that is moral. whereas capitalism is about how to make a profit, and in order

to get more profit if there is no hesitation to exploit. but what if we were to judge people and ideologies not by very intentioned but by their effect? that would take us to the second story. if i could abbreviate it it might go like this. once upon a time for thousands of years almost everybody was poor and most people were slaves. then one day some good institutions were invented in britain and holland, and these democratic institutions put checks on the exploitation of power where he leads that led to the creation of economic institutions that supported private property rights, risk-taking and innovation. free market capitalism was born and is spread across europe into the english colonies.

in just a few centuries poverty disappeared from the fortunate companies. not only that, but people got dignity and safety and longevity. a free-market capitalism in the story is our savior and marxism is the devil. in the last 30 years they have embraced our savior and kicked out the devil and if we can spread the gospel to the rest of the world, we will soon enter a golden age, the end. we talked much more able lead e. about the detail in the two previous speakers but it's important to note that these are sets of ideas that have been circulating through the intellectual class and through that political discourse for centuries now. let's see. free markets really are miracles and have come to see this as i joined the school of business couple years ago and i'm seeing how miraculous it is that you can turn water into wine.

vast quantities as long as the owners can get access to cheap credit and transportation networks with property rights etc. that accomplish miracles. that's because the free markets are astonishinglmarketare astone sometimes come to worship them. one of the basic principles of the psychology is that the morality binds and blinds. around a shared worship of a sacred object it makes them cookies and able to work together but it blinds them to the nuance and subtlety. pope francis pointed this out in his controversial last september when he said he was criticizing those that were used to the second story. he said the crude and naïve trust in the goodness of those wielding economic power and in the workings of the prevailing

economic system and this brings us to the third story about capitalism, which is a story that is not written yet, but it is one that we will be writing in the 21st century. it begins like this. in the 1990s were once upon a timtime in the 1990s, capitalism triumphed over all of the forms of economic organization and the planets begin moving towards prosperity. but we didn't live happily ever after. in fact, this period marked the beginning of a new chapter where we discovered a bunch of problems that we didn't really see before or appreciate before. the rich and poor in the nations began to shoot up. economic gains went to the rich who began to use their wealth to buy legislators and the law just as it was charged by the first story. the problem in global warming was first recognized, and just

as asia was "-begin-double-quotes real eyes making it harder to solve and leading to the apocalyptic forecast of the submerged cities all around the world, the crash in 2008 shook the capitalism's ability without a strong government oversight. and as the market value is expanded beyond the marketplace into medicine and education and family life, many people began to feel somehow cheated as though something valuable has been lost. so this is our challenge for the 21st century. we celebrate the fact that more than a billion people have been lifted out of poverty in the recent decades by the free market. yet we know we can do better without the prior speakers pointed out. if we can strip away being heard, the worship and the ideology we can look more openly at the capitalism and the ethical challenges and i take it that is what the panel today is

really about. we can see that supply chains that keep the shelves stock originate at the dangerous sweatshop that bangladesh and we can measure the polluted air and the empty oceans that we are bequeathing to our children. and we could have a more nuanced view of the quality of opportunity particularly here in america where will buy as your children a much better starting line in the race of life. let us be grateful to the butcher, the baker and the brewer even when they are corporations. let us look back at the political and economic changes that brought us to the first story at the second story at least in the advanced nations economically. and then let us work together to write this story that must draw on the insights from the

political left and right and from the secular thinkers and religious thinkers alike. is there a story about capitalism that could be increased by pope francis, his holiness and the rest of the panel? let's find out. thank you. [applause] >> your holiness, doctor haidt told stories about the capitalist system at odds and all three are calling today , and today in his conclusion is the capital system can be the greatest blessing in the history of mankind but they have certain dangers. the dangers come from ignoring once again as we talked about again and again today those that are being left behind. now, we understand that in

theory, but to understand in practice, those that are more vulnerable than we are, those that are weak, such that when each of us examines the conscience before we go to sleep we can say that everything i did today helped those that were weaker than me such that we can answer that question in the infirmity of what's practical advice would you give us to help enjoy the blessings of the free enterprise system that everyone in the room is enjoying today? >> i don't know.

[inaudible] and the particular meditation in life and the nature of one's self and also the phenomenon of these things. since of the things are heavily independent therefore in the own interest is that you have to take seriously. it's taking care of [inaudible]

it is taking care of others. the community's future depends on this nation, the development of the humanity. so the intelligence and the reality. then not selfishly speak to. they cannot survive, so therefore that is why selfish rather than foolish selfish, so

many problems they just don't care about others. taking care more of others. so that is the same message and of course the different message of forgiveness. and also in order to sustain too much greed purpose of the practice of content.

now these -- simply this very comfortable peaceful life so now we need the religious field in order to promote these practices we are using. now we must find a way. but this very life here is more peaceful, friendly. nobody wonders on the nuclear weapon or the war.

[inaudible] i think -- so these things easy love and life, friendly. we must appreciate trust. someone trusts you, you feel happy and develop response.

that kind of religious faith, not talking about the next life, not talking about heaven or hell or the fear, that is not very good. thinking more about positive. out of fear, not very good. anyway, for the self-interest taking care in the modern education is so important through education we can bring

these ideas and promote peace. so that is my view. [laughter] ladies and gentlemen we have more in store for you but i want to sum up the four planes we have summed up this morning and take a moment for gratitude. the four planes that we have learned and the wisdom that we've gotten from our colleagues and reactions are number one, each one of us notwithstanding the differences we have including each of us that isn't even here today rich and poor in other countries of the world, each of us has on which has onen 7 billion understanding the common man that he is the aces on which we can spread the

blessings on all the things we do and the second lesson we learned today is what we came here to discuss is a blessing but it has to be predicated on the moral living from each one of us. the third is that moral living as a practice of compassion and a sense of shared humanity. the fourth lesson is the good news that we have here today which is the principles and practices of the global sisterhood are in each of our hands to practice and to teach, which is an affirmative lesson of something that we can go away from from this important session today and each one of our lines of work and everything that we do to make a better world. this is overcharged and our privilege, this is our obligation and a very joyful sense and this brings us back to the subject of happiness which is going to be the next session from our friends at the mind and life institute.

a quick moment of gratitude. these programs that we've had over the past two days didn't come about spontaneously. they never do. we first have to start by thanking his holiness' amazing team from the tibetan administration and from the dalai lama and his own administration. is he here with us today? thank you so much. [applause] second, we have to recognize the central tibetan administration, the prime and mr. of tibet. he's not here today. [applause] aei collaboration with his holiness the dalai lama came about because of the vision of the edo free asia.

they contacted aei more than a year ago with just a concept. nobody ever thought of this collaboration. they thought of that and we want to recognize them for that, particularly libby lou with radio free asia. [applause] the intellectual collaboration you're going to see today between aei and the mind and life institute, you're going to be hearing from our friends at the mind and life institute and follow their session on walking the mind and even happiness. in just a minute i'm going to turn to the moderators who are all over to my counterpart, arthur, another arthur, who will be working with his holiness the dalai lama and has done so for several decades. so i will do that in a moment but we are thankful for the professionalism. intellectually, this could not have happened if it were not for glenn hubbard, stan and glenn

haidt. [applause] our wonderful trustees, scholars and staff and the entire community and especially today, my deep gratitude for all of his work for many decades it has changed all of our hearts, his holiness, the dalai lama. [applause] stay with us. we are just getting started. we are going to change up the program in the audience.

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>> welcome to everyone in the second session. my name is arthur. i'm the other arthur. i don't think that you will be too confused. let me begin by thanking arthur brooks from the aei with their kind invitation to join this distinguished group of presenters this morning and also distinguished audience. in order to explore things of deep importance in the common

concern. your holiness, as always it is a great pleasure to once again be working with you as we have over many years. it's been a source of great happiness and fluorescing you could say for us to be in dialogue for now nearly 30 years. many of you have asked what is the mind and life institute? i think i should take just a minute to say a word or two about it. act in 1987, his holiness the dalai lama was joined by a businessman at an angle in a kind of common interest and enterprise to join the best of the sciences of the day, what it is that you're a -- neuroscience, consciousness research to bring to the table to the traditions of asia,

traditions which also explore the mind and the nature of the reality around us. and so those conversations would last for five days. five days. you have a couple hours. imagine sitting in this very small room, his living room for five full days of dialogue on the most is that eric and interesting and important subjects of our time. not out of curiosity but out of the conviction in the source of suffering if we can come together across a normal divide, between science and religion that goes back centuries if we can bring those together, then perhaps together the insight and wisdom will arrive as is necessary for the time today. we came together not just out of curiosity or only out of friendship but those that were also there in our interest and friendship in each other for the

well-being of the most individual communities and ultimately the planet. so in the mind and life work from the beginning that has spanned nearly 30 years we have made our public offering at the mit and in the imagery we did so to the full array of the world's most foremost scientist, psychologist, scientists and the like and on the other side the scholars and practitioners from the various conclusions within work together in public in bringing these two worlds together. a kind of undivided life for the first time. we've had 27 such dialogues and we have come out of that 15 or 18 bucks still in production and

the wealth of the publications. most recently, the work has also begun to take a turn to look at the basic research that underlies the well-being and fluorescing the suffering that the mind and life has begun to work in the field for example on education, and ethics which is close to your heart work in the area of creating the desire and addiction in the area of mapping vision in mind. and working with them as well as 150 young people every summer for the last ten years. it's from this dialogue with you, your holiness and the kind of people that you will experience on the stage today on the meditative practice as

daniel said we begin with an intention. what is our purpose in doing this. is it selfish or is itself less? do we have the compassion and the connections between all of us that link us one to another as we articulated in that the dependence of central to our ethical lives. i would say this work that we are doing here today must also likewise have that intention. and so we enter into dialogue with good spirit and we have articulated the same kind of intention at the very close of your summation. so let us begin also the second session with the same heartfelt theme and mind. we are here because we care. we are here because we care. do we care enough and can we find the means and the methods for one another?

let me introduce to you the people on the stage with me. friends of all. of course there is richard davidson known to many years, your holiness, as a professor at the university of wisconsin and the director of the center for r investigating and he will lead the study of happiness and well-being and the florida shame based on the sciences and psychology and its implication for the education and the second presenter was for 14 years president of rosalie college. diana is also on the executive committee of the mit board of directors and she was the founding boar board chair of tht harvard so-called institute for genomic research and was extraordinary leadership and in fact chairing the leadership effort into so-called academy of ethical leadership at the mind

and life institute. finally, we have an added new participant, adam who works at mit and is the founder of the presidency institute and he will be speaking to the themes of leadership, mindfulness and the kind of things that can work and the complexities of our contemporary society. i will be acting as the facilitator, and it is a pleasure to ask richard davidson to begin the discussions. >> it is wonderful to be with you again, your holiness. i would like to begin by expressing my gratitude to arthur brooks ended the graciousness with which the aei has invited us. thank you. i'm here to talk about happiness and well-being, and over the course of the next few minutes,

i'm going to make several distinct points about happiness anthehappiness and well-being fm the scientific and particularly the mirror of scientific perspective -- neuroscientific perspective. we are just distinguishing between the different varieties of happiness and well-being. and the happiness of the subjective sense of pleasure we think now is distinct from well-being, which we define in the framework that has been described as you do money -- you in a which is the meaning and purpose of life having positive relations with others and having

a sense of personal growth that is being open to change and the constituents of well-being that have been studied in both of the psychological and the neuroscientific literature and one of the most interesting conclusions from the scientific work and the experience of happiness is observed by different circuits in the brain then a more enduring quality of well-being. so that's the first point, that the happiness and well-being are distinct. the second point is a point about genetics. and this is i think a very important point because i believe that modern research

leads us to a different view. according to the most recent into the very large-scale studies, these are studies that combine across the studies and we call them in the scientific literature at the meta- analysis. the studies showed somewhere between 20 to 40% as we say is in the very end and i will explain that in a moment. the 20 to 40% of the variance in the well-being is accounted for by genetic factors. the differences among people in their level of well-being can be attributed somewhere between 20 to 40% of their genes. these are inheritable factors. what conclusion can we draw from that? can we draw the conclusion that somewhere between 60 to 80% is

changeable and that is the percentage that is caused by our genes something that is an admirable and cannot be transformed. and here i would like to introduce the subject of the ft genetics -- epigenetics which is the finance regulation of our genes, and epigenetics -- epigenetics teaches us that each has a little volume control that can go from low to high, and that the volume control affects the extent to which they are actually expressed. the extent to which the genes manufacture the proteins that are designed. so, we know for example that we can take an orgasm which may

hav-- theorganism and if it is d with a mother who is very loving and is very nurturing, the very expression of the genes that are involved in the anxiety are transformed, so that it doesn't matter that there is a genetic predisposition for anxiety in that case. it is actually alter or to the expiration of the genes which are implicated in anxiety and shift that regulation. and so, from this perspective, the fact that a certain amount of the very end and the well-being is accounted for by the genes really shouldn't be a relevant consideration in discussing the potential impact of training and regulating in the environment and its effect

on the well-being. so what are the factors that can promote the increases and well-being? arthur brooks has talked about the four of them that i think are wonderful, and the four that arthur brooks does our faith, family, community and work, all of which i think there is substantial empirical evidence to show in fact they do play a role in fostering our well-being. and for the research, the modern research literature, there are two particular factors that i would like to highlight. they are more granular if you will. they all can be affected by the four factors that arthur brooks described. but they are generosityand

conscientiousness. generosity and conscientiousne conscientiousness. both of these turn out to be very important in the fostering of well-being is. and actually, his holiness has written about the secular ethics in several books, and his holiness talks about the ethics of free strength and virtue and compassion, and i think that the conscientiousness is being impacted by the ethics of restraint and generosity being impact by the virtue and compassion. so there's an interesting parallel between the frameworks into the conceptions we are coming up within modern science. but i would like to turn to the

notion that the measures of conscientiousness and generosity are the public factors that are associated with them early in life are very good predictor of and individuals development over the course of the early decades in life, specifically the research indicates that a child's capacity for certain kinds of conscientious behavior when they are four and five years of age predicts outcomes when they are 30 years of age including economic success. but also drug abuse, physical health and characteristics that are meaningful for living a life filled with florida -- flourishing. can we offer these qualities that are early in life and here is where we appeal to the notion

of plasticity. the brain is the organ in our body that is built to change in response to the experience and in response to training. and we know from neuroscience there are periods that the brain is sensitive and one of those spans the entrance of fluid that is between four to seven years of age. so the question we and many others are taking on his can we develop strategies, interventions, curriculum that are targeted in this earlier period that they foster the quality generosity and consciousness which are so important to flourishing over the course of development and we are able to get an answer to

that and the answer suggests that air is absolutely no doubt that these factors can be educated. and they can be educated in part because of our understanding of plasticity in the brain. we can shape during the early periods of development. in our own research, we have shown a gain of 20% on the measures of delay of gratification from the simple curriculum that we have introduced in the preschool period. this is an element of self control and conscientiousness. so then we are led to the conclusion and i will summarize there are three major points i've made. one is the well-being can be learned coming in from this we should think of the well-being and flourishing more as a skill

than a characteristic that is fixed within us. second -- the second is we know the brain is particularly plastic during these early periods of development and so we could take advantage to design interventions and curricula to educate the qualities, to educate generosity and consciousness. the third is early interventions provide a great return on investment and the nobel laureate economist from the university of chicago have calculated that for every dollar that we invest in the preschool period is an investment by the

individual is 30 years of age. so this is an issue that all of us from all political persuasions should get behind and establish the universal education during this period of time in ways that will make a fundamental difference in ways when the children develop. thank you. [applause] we would like to take a few minutes to pose a question. he speaks about the benefit of education and training into those qualities and characteristics of generosity and compassion. but to speak from your perspective of the practitioner your self what kind of education and training would you recommend

to be adopted in order to promote the quality of children and young adults? >> my long life friend, you mentioned [inaudible] >> he mentioned about the sensitive period up forthrough -- 4-7-year-olds. in my own case i think there is no interest about these things and even i think seven, eight, around ten there is no interest.

actually my daily lessons start -- or classes start. then age 12, 13, 16, gradual more interest. ..

>> even as a grown-up. but still i sort of meditate. so i think everyday i meditate. it's embedded in whole day, whole week. so getting older no hope, that i don't think. [laughter] whole life, solo, human being.

i think we can develop further, further, further. what do you think? >> so there's no question, your holiness that plasticity is present throughout life. that's the great news. so it persists until we die. and there's good scientific research to show that. so that although there are these sensitive periods, there still is plasticity. but, your holiness, i know on many occasions you've talked about the importance for you of the affection that you receive from your mother very early on in your life. and that may have set the conditions which didn't allow you to study and to do the analytic meditation and contemplation once you were older. so that early sense of love and security may be important. >> right. absolutely right.

>> your holiness, the curriculum developing has three notes of care and the very first is, we all of us have received care in the early childhood to remember the care that we have received and to honor and to appreciate that more fully as a way of deepening the appreciation, and then the transformation so that we can not only give ourselves but also ultimately care for others. so these three notes of care, receiving care, self-care, and extending care to others becomes the curriculum and ed koch me back in become effective within even at the early ages -- pedagogy me. i would like to introduce our second presenter, diana chapman walsh of course is that you as well and diana, i would like to invite you to speak. >> thank you so much, arthur. i am very happy to be here in this happy fast with your

holiness and your company again, what a great pleasure it is as always to be with you. and this group of intelligent and undoubtedly happy people, by the clarifying insights that have emerged from the mountains of evidence that our friend, arthur brooks, has amassed, and mastered and is spreading across the land. arthur, your joy and exuberance over the past two days i love. they are really infectious, so thank you very much for having us here. [applause] >> i also need to say that one of the things i've learned from studying arthur brooks his writings, including his op-ed piece in "the new york times" is that women are happier than men. [laughter] so i am very glad to be here on this stage as the lone representative of the happiest sex. [laughter]

[applause] >> i have come in the spirit of warmhearted inquiry, warmhearted is the word is holiness uses often, and lives. i come in the spirit of warmhearted inventory. i so admire in your holiness, and have so relished in my encounters with you. since joining the mind and life board just two years ago. it's been an enormous privilege. those encounters have demonstrated the power of a particular form of dialogue. and i think we're beginning to nibble at its edges here, a dialogue in which all are invited to come, prepared to learn, potentially to be changed by respectful engagement with the other, and perhaps to emerge with ideas that are surprisingly new. that kind of discourse requires

artfully designed containers with ground rules and touchstones and intentions that welcome honesty and vulnerability, based on reciprocity and earn the trust. this is a meeting of a less intimate sort, and so i bring questions for now, as you'll see, but perhaps we might hope in time to meet again, for the deeper dialogue that moves minds and hearts. i hope so. i want to learn more about how glenn hubbard would mend the social safety net. more from dan loeb about how we can build on the success of the success academy. and reintroduce the rule of law into our casino markets. i would like to learn more from

john height -- john hate about is encouraging third story and ask him how deeply are we willing to dig beneath the symptoms into fundamental causes. and really, really study the need for profound systems change rather than simply focusing on the symptoms. so thanks to all three of you for your extremely thought-provoking presentations. so my questions, i have many, but i'll just mention to for starters. first, what price do we pay in happiness when we focus to sharply on ourselves? his holiness hasn't told us that it starts with the self, with

the individual, but it doesn't end there. we in the west are so preoccupied with working on ourselves, that it becomes almost an end in itself. could that be a distortion of thought, a psychological grasping, and into materialism again to the overheated outward materialism that surrounds us at every turn? what's of the fundamental error is to seek happiness through accumulation of any kind, material or psychological? in october, i had the pleasure of participating in one of those mind and life institute dialogues that arthur described to you in the home of his holiness. and we were there with an interdisciplinary group of experts on the topic of craving, desire and addiction.

and underlying problem we learned from the buddhist scholars who were with us is that our human tendency to fill and uncomfortable emptiness by clinging to thoughts, feelings, things that are inevitably impermanent, as are our lives, is part of our problem. the struggle to come to terms with our mortality is the vulnerability that makes us human. if we seek happiness through acquisition of gadgets, prestige, advantage, then aren't we looking for completion outside of ourselves, seeking a permanent or a perfection that is never ours to attain? can we learn to be more present to others, including those we most love? without possessing them.

can we love them for who they are, not for who we want them to be? my second question is related to the first. how much of this interest in individual happiness is a sophisticated diversion, a distracting overlay of a simplistic model of social action onto a complex world, as we deflect our days from frightening signs of instability and danger. i can hardly bear to allow myself to imagine how our children and bears, my sweet five year old grandson, sean, we'll look back years from now and make any sense of this moment in history when we had

compelling evidence that we were doing irreparable harm to the earth's life support systems, and yet, failed to mobilize to protect their inheritance. the head of mit's anthropology department, a friend, susan komen explained the error when you look at individual agency choice and personality as a causal factors in the world that is far more accurately explained by social context, organizational forms and design, culturally structured opportunities and motives. and over focus on individual cases, she writes, obscures the patterns among them, and protects the grand narrative, a story we tell ourselves that our

institutions are functioning well enough to meet our needs. from this perspective as one example, instead of asking how the individuals experience of earned success at work induces to personal happiness, we would widen the aperture and ask how the birth lottery, the economy, the educational and social structures support or undermine the individuals opportunities to experience earned success. and the panelists just before us alluded to those considerations. think unemployment, for example, in 30 years of wage stagnation as the weakening of unions has denied workers the opportunity to bargain for decent working conditions and their fair share of the profits of rising productivity. we could argue even, i would assert in this place, that it's

the unions, not the free enterprise system, that offer the freedom. freedom from wage slavery. now i know i won't get an applause for that. [applause] many scholars working to shape what they call a need economy, many of them, and they are quite brilliant and there on the margins, they are not in the center of our academic bastions where i have spent most of my life, they would place my questions squarely at the feet of the american free enterprise system, avi is here to uphold. they are asking -- aei. they're asking with a canadian economist, quote, why does the capitalist process and system of economics, accounting and politics continue to defend or

ignore its many forms of social injury and ecological destruction? that's john's story, number three. i have a list here, a quick list of some of those injuries or externalities. john spent having to read it to you. he gave it to you himself, but i think we could say, and maybe he would agree, that adam smith might not recognize where we are right now, as his version of the system he viewed as moral. if we are going to address these problems, these intertwined problems that we heard described this morning, we will need a new kind of leadership, that's the second half of what i want to talk about this morning to a different kind of leadership in every sector of society. next-generation leaders who were equal to today's challenges in all their complexity, who are skillful at leading themselves with compassion and equanimity,

with love. with love understood as connection in the way paul to let to find it, the unifying impulse, the recognition of our interweaving with all living beings. the primary message we have been hearing from his holiness yesterday and today, so very clearly, the transformative power of holistic and analytical minds that are informed by warm and inclusive hearts. love. we will call it love. arthur zajonc mentioned the academy for ethical leadership at the mind and life institute is beginning to design with strong encouragement from you, your holiness. thank you for that. we have our first planning meeting just to mix ago and we see the way ahead for a safer and saner future, in a

leadership it's grounded in connection in love. we want to explore how to sculpt leaders who are gifted in the ways of community and connection. can we grow up leaders who lead from within, as parker palmer has written, who understand that they have a special responsibility to manage their own in the shadows, lest they cast more shadow than light on those around them. the rejoinder comes. these are times for muscular leadership. we were told to be afraid, be very afraid, and to place our fate in a row of figures offering simple comforts. but surely these nervous times call for einstein's new levels of thinking. the more urgently if we believe that we are entering a period of profound change, what kinds of

people do we want leading our vital institutions through historic transformations? how do we want them to lead? what should we expect of leaders we can trust? we will need leaders who can bridge and balance tensions without collapsing them, can hold contradictions creatively so that they open our minds and our hearts to wider syntheses, rather than shutting us down. we will need leaders who can hold contradictions between power and love. power without love is reckless and abusive. said martin luther king in the last weeks of his life. and love without power is sentimental and anemic. the collision of a moral power with powerless morality

constitutes the major crisis of our time. i learned while leaving wellesley college for 14 years that my power, the power of the presidency, existed for the essential purpose of enabling others to find their purpose, their authority, their self authorship. and i learned that to achieve that i would have to remain open to others in a way that is the essence of love, as the drive, the sustained unity, and maintained connection. i would have to respect the other person's reality, the other person's yearning, the other person's path of growth. to be open to influence back from others, and their different realities, and this in turn taught me the value of diversity as a resource for learning. i learned to hold another tension there, too. this one was even harder.

to honor my inner life in the face of all that was swirling around me. it took time and concerted effort to hone the skills, to manage external realities, and yet maintain a quality of attention in the present that could enfold, past and future, embrace complexity, and help me try to meet each moment with equanimity. i didn't always succeed at this, far from it, but i learned to find my way back when i was lost. and to know this quality of mindful presence, as the capacity, i wanted for myself and for my leadership team, because i wanted it for our students. it's been said that this new generation skp into social media as their world spins out of control is being raised on information without context,

butter without bread, craving without longing. and yet we have good evidence, as solid as richie's evidence combat today's youth are longing for more nourishing fare. the disciplines they will need in the years ahead are the ones we will all need, and they are a license work, never fully mastered, always requiring conscious cultivation. we will need the strength to stare down our demons of fear and despair so that we can engage the world with curiosity, opening our minds and freeing ourselves of regret, recrimination, and the defeat of shame and blame. we will need to hear tolerate the diversity within our cells to recognize our own enter voices -- within ourselves. our own invoices and attendees

and moods to notice how fluid and ephemeral they are so that we can see and appreciate differences in others, and use the practice of self discovery to move beyond ourselves. we will need to move beyond dualities, beyond either/or and even beyond the simple corrective of both and, move to true multiplicities of seating and of knowing. multiple lenses that acknowledge how competing language games and inequalities of power create lived realities that never even intersect, unless we stretch ourselves to try to bring them together. and as we stretch, perhaps finally, we may find our path to happiness in our immense capacity as humans under the right conditions, the ones of

which his holiness has spoken for his whole life. our immense capacity as humans to find and awaken the best in ourselves, and in one another, radiating outward in widening circles of compassion and care to the 7 billion human beings you hold in your heart, your holiness, and all the living beings with whom we share this planet. thank you. [applause] >> your holiness, diana chapman walsh has spoken about a new kind of leadership, leadership that really is directed towards our future, a future which on the one hand is filled with possibilities and positive possibilities. on the other hand, also filled with dangers in jeopardy. you yourself have been a leader of the people, your country.

you've been a spiritual leader for your community, you become a kind of leader for the world community as a whole. is there some way you could speak out of your experience of a leader whose combined these three elements in a way that might be of some value as we go forward? >> new leadership. >> new leadership, thank you. [laughter] spink i know you're a simple monk. >> actually most of my life in exile as a refugee. so anyway, simpler.

>> really? >> second home, three to five years. the cover of indian, very, very helpful, very supportive. so then my own case -- >> things that i need to do. >> of course, yesterday they appear in early -- sometimes people have demoralized. encouragement now. so i usually say self-confiden self-confidence, something very, very important. i offer to anyone my story, one time in south africa, town, i

met local black family. one young african, a black african, joined that family, conversation. he introduced himself as a teacher. i always, love talking to africans. i mentioned now, you ought to get free democracy. equal. the constitution gives you that. now you mentally, emotionally

should develop, we are the same. where is the white people, reach the blood people, reach some kind of self-confidence and hard work. very important. i just mentioned that. and he responded, difficult. we black people, our brain is inferior so we cannot compete. and i feel, i felt very sad. if that is the attitude, they never can be equal. so self-confidence is so important. then, then i explained him, no. if you ask scientist, brain

specialist, any differences, brain, because of differences of color, nobody say our brain, 100% the same. and then i also mention own case. we have opportunity, say, we can be equal, anyone. and then paths of talk, explained. then finally -- a sigh of relief. then he say, now he convinced we are the same. so that moment i really feel tremendous sense of relief. at least i helped to change one

person's mind and develop inner self-confidence. so self-confidence is very, very important. quite often, poor people come up early, of course big differenc differences, the rich family or the community and poor. but if you look inward, same potential. so i say self-confidence and hard work. in india, africa, i talk with people. you all have the same potential. work hard.

so early period, i simply give some kind of encouragement. and then, then, of course, maybe -- [inaudible] rightful beginning, you see? many tibetans refugee. they're expecting, within two years can return. then i am telling them no, we should not keep it that way. i usually am telling, hope for the best, prepare for the worst. it's something very important. so we carried that way. then, now, 35 years past, new

development refugee emerge, second generation, third generations. so we have sort of separate tibetan settlements and separate for school, always -- so now refugee community is quite well-established. so then, meantime, right at the beginning i fully committed the promotion of democracy, since my childhood. old system, something wrong. and outdated. so we must change that. not just a decision to change, will not work. step-by-step. work for