he gave speeches but continues. we paid in $2,000. now he is 20, $25,000 a speech. >> you mentioned that your view on the different trends in journalism, the funding is drying out. i wonder, are you familiar with the work of james o'keefe, the more entrepreneurial, lesser known young journalists? >> the question i get a lot, to say that he is the only investigative journalist in america is a disservice. all sorts of names being tossed around as i said, i am optimistic about journalism,

optimistic that there will continue to be new ways of people as indignant and is angry as seymour hersh. whether anyone can persist for as many years and have as many scoops in stories says seymour hersh, that i am doubtful of, certainly not that there will be tremendous investigative journalists. it is also a new world. the internet has given us all sorts of new possibilities. what is we is snowden releases his material. he would have leaked that material to a journalist. the nature of traditional journalism has been turned upside-down.

[inaudible question] >> maybe i am misremembering. them the least talented he predicts that the u.s. would be invading iran and make a really strong stand on that which did not pan out obviously. >> zero number of times that the bush of lustration had very specific and was making very specific plans for an invasion. that never happened and people got it wrong. what i say in the book and a number of people told me is that when his articles kept coming out and the new yorker it was not possible for them to do an invasion. what he was really writing about was the possible invasion. he never said they're going to

invade. he says, my sources are telling me the plans, and here is with that look like they're people out there in the someone to go to deal to get out the story. in some ways he was getting out the story did. he prevented such an invasion. [inaudible question] >> it is a good question, and i do not know the answer right now about a month ago he wrote an article in the london review of books. the first thing he had in writing, and he wrote about the fact that when syria had a sarin gas attack that killed 2500 people, the obama administration

immediately blame syria. his sources are telling him that there was other evidence indicating that it was not the syrian government. there were other people in and around syria it could have been irresponsible that cherry pick intelligence and chose to ignore that. he also turned that argument down, which was shocking while wonderful article. and so has his relationship ended? i mean, like every other he has ever had to my feet to three-quarters of the editors of the world and threw them off of a bridge -- he never gets along with anders which was certainly the case, but a very interesting kind up channel four's and a very controlling force. we will see soon enough. >> any other questions?

all right. >> thank you all for being here. thank you. [applause] >> tomorrow night white house press secretary jay carney and the intersection of media and politics. he spoke to students at george washington university. you can watch it at 8:00 p.m. eastern on c-span. >> i remember on saturday the first conversation i had with the people at that table. it was not about where you are

from or what your school was like but ukraine, politics, a belief on education and religion . after that moment i was like, this is going to be intense. it has been cool to see the evolution of our friendships from just talking up politics, experiences, what we have learned to know we have bad. this is an experience i will never forget ..

>> that our generation we are able to separate us very easily. we can just turn work with this and i think that that conversation allows us to talk a lot. there's conversation with osha media. >> i think this whole week has been about learning. i come from a small town words politically homogenic. and there's not always chance for people who think the same to get their opinions out without being ridiculed. as well as being here with the other delegates, it has given me an opportunity to learn other viewpoints and how we will think differently. >> high school students from around the country discuss their participation in the u.s. senate youth program. a week long government and leadership education programs held annually in washington.

sunday on c-span "q&a". >> coming up, a house marketplace consulting firm. we spoke with the american enterprise institute about the of problems with the affordable care act and offers recommendations. the remarks are just over an hour. >> we will continue on with our program we are very thankful that bob has agreed to come.>> a bob is a consultant to the policy community as well as thee marketplace community including hreat expertise in the insuranc

industry and this includes the pundit of the year. which is actually a pretty finer distinction. and we are very grateful. so we thank bob for coming today >> i appreciate it very much ane

i'm going to give you myd give perspective today i work in thea marketplace and i have learnedo long ago that my job is to sais omgure out how to satisfyst customers. i have a number of clients out there and what they expect me tw do is to figure out what ising going on in the marketplace anda what is going on in federalnd policy. to help them navigate their business through that change. so if t t they won the conservae perspective they will go to foxx news. otherwise they will go to the.i as business people they need toe know what is goingy to happen d how it is going to impact them.y i will try to bring ad wash perspective here to us today. i've been working in washington one way or another either as an executive is someone running hi own business for more than 25ar. years. an in as an insurance industrysu executive it occurred to me a long time ago that the insurance industry could not sustain

co itself if it's business mission is to figure out who is on thepo cover. if inyo order for them to surviveo. economically and politically, they have to figure out how to cover everyone. quickly igured out pretty quickly that as an industry wedn cannot do that ourselves.t as a chief operating officer itn must havdie a long line of peope up td up to sign up for my coverage and i would then beerae broke and he quickly. so i realized that this is a role for government in this whole process. jay carney said a few months agd that i had been an opponent ofo0 obamacare for 20 years.guess mas oppoess that makes me the first opponent of obamacare since it's only about five years old. seemy i sedon't see myself as an opponent of obamacare. of heal surance y not one of health insurance reform one of health care reform as most of you in the room know.different thin i am a critic of obamacare and s think that it needs a lot of changes and i guess everyone

ys tha says that. so does that make me unique.g ty first i will tell you what i'mso going to tell you and i will do my best to tell you. the affordable care act has not cleared the tower.d.c. is to borrow a headline from the media outlet.it pa needs fixing. particularlyrt in its health pln offerings. it was clear that the supremeenf my mind s never had any doubt that this law will be enacted.to i don't think it's going to look that much like it does today or even five years from now. but it's also clear to me that'e we are not going backwards in this country. we are only goinhigs forward. so it does need a lot of fixing. one of the things that concerns mece about this 8 million enrollment is that it might convince the ardent supporters oft obamacare but it doesn't ned help. but there is a differenceeen ofp

between operating the health insurance and the small group ht individual health insurance market and actually creatinglly something that people like andpe want to be a part of areaerencei there's a big difference andst g distinction.here w i think that is the most important thing for them to decide where we car are. so i will tell you where i think we need to go and where we need to be short-term and long-term.k i've also i will also tell you that i don't think there's any chance that we will have thishas before 2017. eec so doesn't really matter whather happens in the election in 2014h whether the republicans capturee the done it or not. kind ofnot going to have the environment or the votes for any kind of substantial change to the affordable care act. probably not going to have thesh political attributes for this kind of change. ian think this just limped along for a number of reasons.ng a actuarially or financially and alsoct lyrically. end so i will also tell you thah while the supporters of obamacare are pretty cocky these

are, i think republicans easily overconfident as well. i actually think the democrats could take this issue back invep november if the republicans are so careful.ry so there are two very differentr thterpretations. the first is that the enrollmend has radically exceeded expectations when we have hardly made a dent in the number of people who are available. or the enrollment surge proves the program is working and it'se on its three-year projectedsn'te track and doesn't need any majos fixes or the program is still ao regulatory nightmare that needs to be repealed in the first place. i expect. most people are in one other on this. and i would also suggest that there's more commonality to that when you think about it. oft you see one of the surveys as to whether obamacare is succeeding orsu not.rve first this data was fairlye in

early. th poiat pointed out is that ntmost of the people who are signing up for previously insured. that we weren't really gram.cting the uninsured into the program.s have these numbers have almost certainly changed in the last two months. but i will suggest it as itic ps ironic problem that this prograg has, which is attracting people who are not insured b efore. fundamentally because the way the product the way that it are works in my context and background, they are not all that attractive. the corporation came up with arv survey that went into mid-march, came up with some of the same conclusions that we were getting more of the people moving overmo from thevi insured market than e becae why di up on insurance. this is a fundamentally important question. because why did we turn the insurance market upside down ine the individual and small group market if we are not going to be successful in getting the people we want to get in the firstr place. this is in the heart of whether

wi can be confident that we are on the right track or not.u that i will also tell you that when you look at these pollse majory carefully, this particular pollo says the majority of people who were getting insurance virginia and the employer market area anm you heard thear recorddn't representative said there doesn't seem to be a lot of h indications that that iswas wi happening. so i was with one of the largest self-insured insurance companies in the united states yesterday, insuring millions of people in the self-insured market and imai went to their head of marketing and i said are you seeing any ey increase in the employer market and the number of people signing up and he saidth no. to hear and that is what i continue to hear all over the marketplace. the survey indicates we are m spending so much in the employe. market. i'm not saying that myying information is better thanyou

vemething that the other corporation with about, but i will tell you that we must beok careful when we look at these polls. we need hard data. the most recent poll came from gallup reflecting this. the seac the bottom line is that the gallup poll has found thatobably probably about one in four people who are uninsured have unin him insurance either in medicaid or otherwise you're so thato me makes some sense to me. when i look at the enrollmentioe numbers and the 8 million people coming through the exchanges, so you can make some comparisonso and the 8 million needs to be reduced by the people.ying? how many? 70% is a pretty good number. i go around talking to people ao recently as yesterday and this includes hundreds of thousandspr of people.thousa it isnd more than 20%. it is not as bad as only 15% and

it's not 20% either. it is in the middle. so to adjust that by about 17%is when it's all said and done, then you adjust for the fact that 83% of the people are subsidy eligible, you get a number that you can compare toir the type of foundation estimate of 17.2 million and what you17.l get?io somewhere between 25 and 30% of the subsidy eligible have signed up. so if you are inclined to beli believe in the numbers we are going to get over the next three years, you can say that we are on track. for someone who has been pecurred marketing as i have ado cew look at the open enrollmente that lasted through march into i april and 30% of the eligible sign up and 70% didn't, thath tells me that you have a problem with the customers. but you need to worry about.lso,

so what's also interesting is that doctor insurance agents were signing people up. and they are a big part of getting people signed up. when i talk to people who run tll centers and insurancelkingo companies were talking to those on the other end of theth line.f they are hearing a lot of complaints about the product anr the offering. at the heart of the problems exrts and care has, as economists and health policy experts have said, you can have your opinions on these things and the microeconomics.on i did a post on my blog not lont ago about a marketing story fro thed 80. the stuff the company gotthe mae involved the in the manufacturing people got involved. they win out and got us from all over the country and they new ted this new dog food and

they went out and sold the dogdo food. nobody bought the dogor food. so they had this meeting andat they had a whole team and thehe consultants.untr of they were trying to figure out s why no one was buying the dog food.ur bac finally someone raises her handd and says, mr. president, it could be that the dogs don'tt like the dog food.he and i think there's a problem here when you have 30% of the 30ople walking away and 70% signing up walking way. per member something important about obamacare.hing i obamacare is a monopoly. there's not another place to buy health insurance.if you a if you are a responsible persont want to have health insuhrance for your family, you could haven afforded it anyway. b there's only one place to buy if it. perso view a person with pre-existing conditions and you can finally buy health insurance, there'sadt inly one place to buyh it.bu so there's only one place to geg this product. in addition to that the government will pay a big portion of your cost area to

have a product here that is a i monopoly where someone says a good share if not all of the cost for you to buy it is part of this. so you put out a product whereyt you don't have to pay most ofo the cost and it's the only place you can buy at and it thend it' responsible thing to do to buy. 70% passed on buying it. there's a customer issue here.an the fundamental problem is that people are still aftert thethe subsidy and they are expected te pay about 10% of their after-t x income for plans with high deductibles. the average deductible is $2600n thenbronze plan is $4500. we don't understand this and th there are a number of issuesathe there.w take a look at the way the

california individual health insurance market has rearrangedd the. where the insurance carriers carr taken disproportionatere ad marketshare. clearly clearly people inpe californiats voted to narrow the networks.erd so if you watch the covered california situation, you will had know that they had a heckuva wih time with the providerhange directory. he went on the exchange to buy a plan, you have an impossible time figuring out who your was heard butughtarrow their own networks will producea a price .5% cheaper. that is why. if they don't do it, which direction to move?n and that is also something thate is interesting from another perspective.covers orge an employee benefits market, we have been working with narrow ns high-performance networks. w ore

this includes large employer with the highest quality and very often they are the lowest cost providers. this includes your procedures and so on and so forth. so your steer people towardsper these network. not because they're cheaper but thatuse they are lower cost anrd herer. but what we have here of these exchanges is the insurance company mailing out a contract. so i'll adopt yours and hospitals in town with medicaidr reimbursement rates with the doct sssurance that they will get the exclusive business are not insurance company and then see. the sign-ups and send it back. that is the selection process. so this whole business of the narrow networks is really going to have to play itself out. and you really have to wonder ao

from a customer satisfaction cnts wereve where we are on this. comments made this morning thate maybe we will evolve toward a medicare stylem. program. it's basically a medicaid risk t contract and there is a risk that that can happen.text and if it happens, it's not so bad as what some say. but the people entering the system or knew didn't haveer health insurance before. somewhere between 10 andidual mr 12 million and they tend to bedo higher income people, self-employed people.people, intelligent and well educateduni people. they could afford to buy the b health insurance. they thought that it wasnsuranas important to have assets to prot protect. but these people can only buy now from the affordable care aca insurance monopoly. are they going to be happy in these networks?ybody

more than that, anyone who thinks that this is about theale individual market better take another rta look.ly the se a small group market is regulated at exactly the same way the individual market is.wae they have to comply with all ofp the same things that are are undergoing changes for the individual market. that includes 35 million people in the small market, and we are in the process of moving something approaching 50 million people in this country into the obama regulated monopoly. mo and if that starts sliding toward medicaid and medicaid style programs, is itsustainabla sustainable in a political thing do do? so again, i think the core of this decision, it has a lot to a do with the kind of program that we have really created here. so the big question of what will healhealth plan do, they either

go in saltmanth or go back out f the market and it's not going tn happen. but the first thing to i s talking s there is little to no data and i was talking to individuals yesterday with firstes. and so the first indication is that if you're only getting 20 to 30% that is not stable, and if you believe in the ceo 0% projections, take the weekendifa off. if you are concerned about thes sign-ups, this thing has to get to about 7% marketstinab sustainability.le and the comment was made earlies today that we have a lot of high risk tools anyway. but if you try to bring people into the marketplace, you can't really rationalize that in an efficient way.omewhere

so you have to have a subsidy and that's why this was created because it's a transition all. s so if you get a good spread, yo' don't need to bring the sick people into the pool. and an employer with 1000 employees and no mandate has anf efficient cost structure. you don't need -- what you need show up onrance because they are going to show up on day one and bu if you can attract people into the pool you'll rationalize the cost. so every employer out there that stand on their own with nof invidualal mandate proves that. whatthey also prove you don't need an individual mandate. what you need to do is draft enough people. peop

what obamacare tries to do is coerce people. with lousy products. and that is the fundamental it has.e having said all that, the rate increase of the insurance companies are going to be fairly moderate.5%? and you get scrutinized for thee auto government. and they don't have any data and they just don't know.any but i can tell you that health care trends in this market arebi probably in the double-digit range,n the 70% range because he sought only 30% that showed up. these deductibles are so darnhit high thatua it actually boosts e

trend rate. so theoretically they probablyso have these increases. but since they don't have the data to prove it an d they don'n want to make this any worse thae it is right now and they have the protections for three yearse i expect you will see moderate increases. so you wilsel see some big and little increases. had in some people came in way too high until anyone will find it andlef anyone who wants the insurance company coming in will find it. so what you have here stays for the next three years as people the insuut what they've got. it's a lot of people say why are areinsurance companies in this market. why are they getting out.are well, obamacare, the affordable care act, it's a monopoly. if you're going to participate

in the small group andoupn individual market, if you're going to participate in the small group market, asre going o 50 million person market, there is not an alternative. there is not planned it. t they generally believe thisy wi thing is going to ellvolve and they will be protected by theby. reinsurance pool and that theyi. have time in one way or another this will all work its way out and i believe that as well. in but that doesn't mean that wee' will figreatre shape. that means we need a way toof manage ourselves out of this. obamacare doesn't even move the needle at times for publicly traded companies. and the other thing to remembers is health insurance plans aret.

getting used to the government.i this is a picture of what thenc health insurance industry looks like. one i grew up in this and thisie we i was in the group healthmagn insurance. i can't even imagine now. thothers only half of what they do.naged the other half is managed m medicaid and medicare. the federal employee health benefits program will probablybe be bigger than obamacare for the medigap, m or four years. medigap, medicare supplement, all of thesese products.is so what obamacare finally gets to come it will probably be the smallest. but it is a monopoly in that part of the market.th so what will employers do?a lotf yesterday i did a board of directors meeting at blue cross. ynd a third of the people were employers. so there is a movement towardsri health care, no question about that. these are all product terms tha

comes in different colors and varieties. one observation i will make about the marketplace over the last 12 months that i think is important is that obamacareare really has changed things are today used to be that your 8020 standard options plans was yourv standard health care plan in america. everyone had something like that and that is what we considered to be good health insurance. that was the standard.appe but what is starting to happen now is they are starting to move towards the affordable care act unless towards the exchanges. today the player has been saying do i need the 80-20 option or do thjust need to do better with 6uarihigher deductibles. tracy pointed out that mostthe plans are 70% the employerne market and thew new standard in employee benefits is as you can

see this reference point out i'm e. and people are definitely worried about the cadillac tax. most employers will not do thisc because they are changing their planlas now. so when you change -- and the changes you have to make him you can't just shift the costs. gregates w aggregates the employer cost in u.s. livesot te caught the benefits.amace si obamacare actually gives us permission to do that.hat obamar anyone who says that they arepac having a direct impact on theerr market hasn't spent any time in thekeoyer market. the fees and expenses, are they no more than 2%? you bet. but don't presume them from having an impact on thep markete ask your friends who areour employed what happened to their benefits last couple of yearsppd and what is happening next yeart

because there is an entirely different perspective there.e. and as the economy is starting to grow between employers who have to completen their skilleh workers, if i have a bunch of staurant workers, i don't need to worry about dividing the benefits anymore. it used to be not that long ago that the guy who swept the floor at in the room had exactly the same assurance of a guy who he worked at the desk or that that. has changed very quickly. part of it would've happened anyway.vemen i'm not here to blame the affordable care act all thathist stuff for it but if anyone doesn't think this, they are dead wrong. medicaid expansion is one of my favorite topics. be i may be one of the biggest critics of obamacare, but i'mhe mightthe biggest of critics for those that don't expand up medicaid. my view is put uup or shut up. for years i have been hearingsae

republicans they give me flexibility and let me out of my way. the medicaid program is both in. we need to try them market based ways in the supreme court is a w, some pportunity. some of them have taken advantage of that and controversial ways. but they got is the ability to put people in private plans. but they haven't gotten thatan s yet. but they have flexibility in in moving into managed care and that is not in a significantyoui concession. you're now going to have managed care managing people rather than the government and that is an insignificant concession and not enough or not and then there's t mike cooper plan on the table that change is not only how it is livered, but how the incentives that consumers will

have worked. i don't know if the administration will accept that. i really hope they do because i would love to see a competition between blue state governors ana red state governors about who system work and i don't know why republicans are so afraid ofic this. compet they tell me because it's not a' perfect plan. well, i'm sure that in 2017 whet theyh have 70 vote in the united states senate and they doubled double their majority in the house and ronald reagan is back in the white h ouse.s [laughter] they can get their perfectuntilh thing. until then, grow up. repuathe challenge and do it. [laughter] republicans and obamacare. oppoy i am an equal opportunity critic.repuican i w pill not get into a lot of detail because i don't have ail lot of time.n go to og you can go to my blog a and are

assoation n association health care plans and you can see theh i spent a londy fair. i spent a lot of time with insurance people. when i talk to them about selling insurance across state lines, their reaction with those puzzles is that they laugh. i'm not kidding, they laugh. it is ironic that conservativesm believe in using the market to make the system more efficient.h but the people who are actually the most successful to date and making the market efficient, they say the proposals are silly. the second thing i hear from a them is why don't they ever ask us. [laughter] >> i'm not lying to you here.i' next time you're faced with an insurance executive, asked him about that.

why is it that conservativeselie don't consult the marketplace that they believe in. of criticm i have a lot of criticism for the way the democrat handle work obamacare and the anonymity ande what it reflects insurance market. this has been on the conservative side. now, we have a lot of common sense ideas and there are a lote of really good ideas. i will suggest them fundamental problem as it takes us back to 2013. but i don't think that's realistic. we are not going backwards. we are going forward. so there's a republican reaction to obamacare that makes itfix i. impossible in some ways.ich and that includes whichepubl republican wants to go to the primary in north carolina saying that he wants to fix obamacare.a but that is where wet, are heada we are not going backwards

anymore.pens u and so i think that opens up a giant opportunity for democratn for the party that claims that it wants to fixx obamacare. so we have a lot of conclusions thbottom but the bottom line is if you y ore a republican you better tell people you want to repeal andhas replace this because that is. if you loo what's popular. but if you look at where the independent voter is and whereoo the voters are overall when you go to the generalu election, ty fi don't want toxe go backwards anx there's a fox poll that says that people overwhelmingly vote for the candidate that want to repealher obamacare rather thant defend it. they forgot to ask third what question, what if they wanted to fix d it.repos in and he saw a report in "the new york times" and the same conclusion occurred.red. people don't like obamacareand m primarily because the healthth a

care plans are so lousy. but they don't want to go back to to the states we had before.a w and they figure out a wayp to position not women that will be the winner. so where do we go from here? obamacar obamacare wins in 2016 and the real rates will need to bethis ' towards the end of this come about is a few years down the. road.he 2016th neither side in 2016 elections, and 2017 a new president will be tired of the obamacare wars and hopefully ready to move on. ioppo conduct first opportunitye a m will have to get a measure course correction here.g but i clearly don't see that

before happening before 2017 and that happens afterwards. ir do think that the obama administration is really getting the soundtrack and a number ofo. ways. many says the this can be your idea and maybe can help you can help them out here. all they really have r to do and tim is really on the right know, p track.e, healteople we provide a lot so healthy people can see value. 27-year-old kids don't care peoptilize, they are well. we need benefits that people are actually going to utilize the value read go ask the people o what they want. a family of fourf making $59,000 thrg year, they have to pay $500 in premiums.d, $59,000 per year.count touy th

it's a piece of paper for $5000u so of course they are not buying it.nobody but nobody asks them. you know, and there is lots of opportunity here. pre government is probably paying $600 a month in premiums. probably willing to pay more in premiums and i now have this to give them something. so i would use the existingth forests so you don't get a jump health insurance plan and let the insurance companies come up with plans that are more flexible. it's this section of the affordable care act that mandates the benefit, there is nothing in the statute that

mandates the kinds of benefits at the obama administration has mandated to regulation. if they back off on theregulas e regulationt , there are a number of moving parts, there's thes is premium, the deductible, the co-pay, the networks and theitsn benefits. but these are not one of thet vu variables under obamacare. so what you have left? premiums, deductibles, and their putting them back on the table and doing it in a transparent way. inhe int this includes having anctuarialo actuarial cloisonné have to givr you a piece of paper or a chart yat shows you what you areat buying is different than thean e standard silver plan and then presume that the gods are smarts enough to figure this out for themselves. if the obama administration cana do that, they could put this

thing back on track.ult so i hope you wrote this down. because they won't listen to mei i was told to exit.e whitese f bmitted ew rates have to be theyttted between may 27 and june 27. ab so they have about a month tothg get this thing back on track an. once i think there's a more fundamental thing for all of fay this and i suggest there is remarkable agreement betweenble reblicans nd republican and health care reform. insurance exchanges, using the market to manage this. even jan jerry brown of using this in california. there's an agreement under this.

thing.crats are democrats are right when they say that obamacare was told on n republican chassis. and republicans are right when they say that the democrat overregulated the heck out of ie and it created lousy products. so they are both right.hat we c so maybe we should back off andx see what we agree on what we cao fix and most importantly listen customhe customer. stop arguing with each other ana go listen to the family of four. they will tell you to do this. they know how to do this read so net a solid safety net for democratr in the place that people can compromise on things. m di's the same thing that i just talkeddn about.just giving the carrier's flexibilito so that we get rid of the junke. politics. ar there weree nowhere near as manr junk policies are the liberals would like to think that theregi

are. the increase narrowed my net networks.out so yes, there is junk out there but not that much.s consu can s better value by offering more choices and consumers can stretch their tax credits further.ing the government would be payingie the vast majority of we have f thatl flexibility. and we don't need an individual mandate. i've underwritten hundred if nos thousands of employer plans and not a single one had a mandate. when you were?d to people wanted to buy it. the pel enough people wanted to buy it . because the dog food tasted good and it is a good product and that's why they bother. give them the ability to do that. duri go with no mandate and you don't sign up during the openng enrollment in the pre-existing b condition is banned for twoegtie years. so don't dwell on the negative.e

you have to emphasize the positive here, if you givey people plans with a value andino can afford and that they not appreciate, you are going to wil have people not buying. because then they will buy. the plans had value. val the only people you're going to catch them this provision dve because you are giving people ay herbal healthou insurance. so make the tax code equitable. i believe the deductibility and the tax exemption employees doig exactly the same thing. that's the subsidy people are eligible for what the standard silver plan and we have to create a standare plan for the tax credits areteve

tied to so whatever we are peop willing to give people there, the maxi that is something we reallythe should use for the tax cut.at'sa beca will make the system more efficient and it is a solid safety net. because then they can say we ari subsidizing this fellow over here. so why should wezir be felt thai did not fellow over there. that is equitable.t more this includes tort reform. use so use the additional money to deductibil strengthenit medicare. cuts an includes medicare cuts ande obamacare, it's not a terrible problem for medicare today. but go ask the medicare actuarye that runs this long-term and we have to fix that.the medica so implement the medicarets docket. it may have been a weaker bill in terms of changing the amer

affordable healthcare act.ea because it creates the incentive for us to move on for the common nation of cost or quality. codified in the law so states don't have to say is this a democratic or republican health secretary.ervices as long as the state wants to expand 100% and take the 100% and money, okay, they have an progm approval. they want to go 108%, give themt 138%. but they have to prove they can get those people together. if they can do it, let them do it. give them the ability let's putd competition between them. that stop arguing about it. why is everyonwhe so afraid?i ts

i think it's a fantastic idea.el and h so medicare will have to e a reform down the road.i thin but i think we need to bring bck this back and i think someday we will. platform this includes guaranteedlan, but medicare benefits, access to the old plan and what creates a much more robust market that giveseoe people choices and makes thei've market more efficient. i think that we will get to tha someday. the best hope i have is presuming the ways and means and the drinking number and the chairman of the ways and means, and this is where really exciting things cans happen. the progressive movement began in with thompson and it's about people with new and fresh ideas whether conservative oressive

republican. paul ryan is a progressive conservative and ron wyden is a progressive democrat. so there's a place were some really interesting things get done. so the affordable care act is nr fixing red the surge in a moment we'll have people saying we don't need to fix that. it's sort of like watching ang thotball game. theall is are on the field and someone fumbles and the ball is bouncing down the field., of cos of course what you do in a gamet like that if you thary to jump a the ball as fast as you can. there are important things about her.n the and it's bouncing down the field. the democrats are standing thero we'vehey are saying that we don't have to jump on the ball. it's not a fumble.stang t and the republicans are standinc there watching the ball bouncing down the field and in that we don'tine have to jump on the bal

because we're so far had were going to win anyway. but if you look at this poll. i think the electorate is waiting for someone to jump on the ball and take it to the nex. step and that's where the political opportunity is. way it because this is not going to. work the way it's working right now. but i also think the f first rel chance for reform and change is the next generation on thistowa journey for health insurance reform and health care reform probably doesn't come beforeinke 2017. i think the republicans could yet see the issue. i was watching mary landrieu the othero day read more morean democrats think to a better payr attention because this election is notel over. jim will moderate an a now be ae happy to answer any questions you may have. thank you.

[applause]'s start >> we are generating a lot of questions. let's start over here. >> good job. what a great talk. you advise health insurance executives and there's a lot of ominous stuff there.ps on th inc the politicalre rate increases d what you talk about. how we are re-accelerating and that there is a good likelihood that 30% of the people that ate thepe dog food are going to be sick or.tat tw how is it that two of these the eaings guiraded plants raised their earnings for 2014. how do you reconcile those earnings with the ominoush forecast?foreca? >> the affordable care act is a' move the needle. first of all, it's a tiny

percentage of what they do. it's more revenue than obamacare will be in the next three yearst and then you have the reinsurance provision.ompanies n the insurance doesn't mean the insurance companies won't lose money but they will only lose a couple of nights on premiums. so that couple points on premiums on the small sliver ofl business is not a material thpact on the bottom line. they are much moreey worried abt a bicaid and the big issue here that isg a perfect opportunity r medicaid expansion and so medicare advantage is a big part of their profits right now and that's one of the reasons that they handle it in october and november. so someone said the other daydat that weti try to get back into e business. working. do wha well, i can tell you what those guys were thinking, i'm not

sure.t i' but i will just llleave you j t. if i was running a health old insurance plan in the good old days, i might just wait and let people sign up at the other guyn and people are earning what thei other guy. [inaudible question] >> hello. in the mid-80s to early '90s i had kaiser in california. my hope for obamacare was what you had offered were talked was about. lerdab the healthy option that was very easy or affordable. i did not have a high deductible.du you evers a plan like that and also could you please comment on single payer's? a health >> sure.sura i was running a health insuranct

business in los angeles in the mid-80s. i have enormous respect forare inpensive. >> this includes benefits that are by the way relatively expensive.oat, it't to b so it has to be co-pays andot gn people not waiting the extra day or going to the nurse.s so you have to have incentiveseo for people to think about hoinw they are going to utilize this. but there are ways to createcrea valuable things.ctual because there is no individual mandate in parta d. s probably 70 or 80% sign up. but why did they sign a? and by the way it is part of the fr bitrophic health insurance

plan.g it's a few benefits of fun. icbig donut hole pluscatastroph catastrophic insurance and the people love it. th that was a product that had the mark by mike these products.par >> there are some that are really mad about those thatn manaerate withco obamacare. but when you talk to insurancett executives, they really do want obamacare to work. and so many have gotten slapped around quite a bit by theby federal government. so why do they want to make it work? well, they're small groups, individuals come in, not such a good reason. the other reason is that they don't have a lot of confidenceeu

in republicans when it comes toe health care policy.if obamaca so if obamacare blows up and fails and it looks like the newr york or new jersey individual insurance pool, it's just a mes terrible mass, will republicanss grab it by the horns?? they haven't had a history of ss that.ur but they do not get terribly serious and this includes health insurance reform. so what happens the next time the pendulum swings than obamacare is a disaster? just go direct to single-payer? >> that is what is going to happen. so we make obamacare work in the

market. >> you're going to live a long life. >> we will see this cycle move together. >> the tea party argument is because it is a benefit requirement, plans are having to been more to add features that people don't want. but i'm wondering in particular what benefits are adding the cost and is there enough money o to go and allow for networks ans some of these challenges as well. >> go back to the section that has this. you have to have a doctor benefit, lab w benefit. for eau can have a prescription drug benefit with a specialave e

deductible or one that pays 70% of the first 30 days and 100% of the next time. it's not that you're going to take any benefits away. it's that you're going to do different things with what canoy be delivered on those benefits.s and they do it with much lower cost. so there are number that varies y the way you package theway benefits and you take something away when you do that.you take so i think the difference is healthy people want differente s things and other people want.ine

but they want different things on the up front and there areth enormous numbers. the part d drug benefits are a good example. cms runs a computer program thau you can find which plan is bests and it's a very efficient plan.t we can manage that. there's alwaysio a mess selecti. >> hello, thank you. you mentioned about how only 30% of the dogs that like the food. prev >> it was just a monopoly andur. it. may not like >> exactly.

>> intouch tibet on the point that we see turn in the medicaid market in the individual market as well. so my question is the 70% of b people, some of them are tomorrow's uninsured. tomorro so does that mean that the numbers are that scary because perhaps we are mitigating future bu uninsurance by making sure that some of them still have insurance? there's no reason to believere s that 30% while afternoon won't buy it. so you want to do the kaiser poll, gallup will come you just did a poll of 29 million people eligible for the exchanges and 30% showed up. that's a pretty good predictor. >> the gentleman in the back.

t hello, i'm with the heritageh foundation. h i wanted to ask about the backend. b we were assureacd everything was going to be fine about obamacare and the curtain lifted and there was a lot of disaster there. than there is this mysterious backend. what are you hearing from and. insurance companies about those systems working and will we have some shoes off? >> the big problem with thisisss transaction came from the feds to the insurance companies onge4 enrollment and they are generally working. we are still getting what wemenr would call unacceptability for l performance. but it's in the low single digits now. it's something that the carriers are going to keep their heads above water on.

it's not what it should be, but it is workable.ater bill is the rest of the backend is like the ability of the feds to pay the insurance company their premiums. and the ability to do reconciliation and compare the list between insurance companies and the fed. so there is a meeting next weeks between them and a number ofnexe insurance companies that they are focusing on to talk about some of the issues of what the c backend should lookom like.look. so it's not close to being able to be tested yet. if we are lucky i am hearing that we will have this bym hearf september. that would be one year later. it should've been tested in that december of last year. but don't discount this. when you talk about what insurance companies can do with the rates, they don't know what their premiums are going to be. we know what their claims are. . but they haven't been able to do a reconciliation.

so one ceo told me that the affordable care act and there is the fourth or fifth month with no backup and no reconciliation. so let me assure you that they are good for it. with but we have the mother of allgot reconciliation.ghter] this is one of the problems wit. the 8 million. and i wouldn't be pushing that stuff too hard. >> we are running up against our we'rline here. thee insurance companies are getting paid to go out and use the benefit, but then who is on

the hook? >> the provider ends up being on the hook. not the insuranc te company. the insurance company can take them off the system for two more months.mes so we have three months with one months payment. if the person goes to the doctor and the consumer doesn't pay the premium in the second or third month, they insurance company can suspend the payment. end result we are not sure if it will be covered in on.or particularly for specialists in

this includes a 2000-dollar deductible. so they have catastrophic insurance, especially if they are certain that he or she could get paid. so there's a lot of time out there. and these are the complicated moving parts. but it's one of the things that arearly has to be different ande can be somewhat of a mess. the fact that we don't have a de reconciliation had some provider more than the insurance company. because they will get their money.necessily. >> okay, we have so time for a couple of more questions. >> hello, state medicaid expansion, given the likelihood

that the obama administrationxp will not hold to that 90% match rate, would itik not be from a physical standpoint 90 per irresponsible for governors [inaudible] >> here'ts the question for my conservative friends. coervati the federal government is paying 100% on the medicaid expansion when it drops 90% and they are just the teaser years and theydi are really going to be onca the hook for 96%. >> so you are telling me that you don't know how to make how t market-based reforms were fishing? you're telling me that you don't have 10% of his system? rd

put up or shut up.i haopin >> some of us has to believe in the market. even people who claim to believb his, some of us actually spent her life in the market and this includes most of my peers as well.coul sumac in the long-term, what does risk adjustment look like in the long-term? especially if you loosen up the system? because it seems to be a big problem. >> what does it look like in 2017? >> and beyond. >> it is the old market. going way in three years.>>

>> two to three years. am c >> risk adjustment say then that means that if you are a health plan, itself a just and that is fair enough. and but the training wheels of the subsidies go away.ls t so that is what turns companies are used to now. what and their biggest customer is the federal government. >> clearly the risk adjustment formula, and that's why you heap them say that they are cherry mh

pickers. it is a zero-sum game. you can bring all this together leopit's not going to do you any good. and they are getting an adequate part of this with the affordable care act. the that is what changes the law.rdable c you could be the best cherryare picker in the world and i was a pretty good one in 1984, but it's not going to do you a bit of good today. >> please answer my question, which is we are very adamant about this going backwards.backd but is it possible to enact something like this with theenaa transition? two yes, i think it's a semantic thing the republicans have a really big problem with. and i think republicans have tol figure out how to get around

this repeal end some of the but problems occur and i have ahas e great deal of respect for parts ofrw that bill and i wish that a had proposed it in 2009 and we are going to eliminate thet to n medicaid expansion.dpass iill so 30 states will expand it the0 next year. >> they replaced the medicaid expansion with the uniform it wt credit that everyone would have insurance under the system. >> so we propose this in 2009.is >> what we are talking about is going forward.ing

>> sometimes to go forward you have to do a lobotomy. [laughter] >> i think one of the problems they have is that we have to get hung with the notion that they want to go backwards. and that is going to be the wrong political move to make from november. it may win some primaries, but that is going to m akbe a terriy thing for them to have to do ina november because the vast majority of american people wane this fixed. they don't care about all the criticisms and there's no cricisms reconciliation. that is what they have to do. there's a lot of really good ideas what that. of >> thank you gfor joining us.

[inaudible conversations] [inaudible conversations] >> next on booktv. an interview with gabriel sherman, author of the loudest voice in the room about the creation of fox news. then wayne smith talks about anti-christian violence in the news media. in the biography of seymour hersh. >> c-span2 provide live coverage of the u.s. than it or proceedings and key public policy event. every weekend, booktv.

for 15 years the only television network devoted to nonfiction books and authors. created by the cable tv industria brought to you by your local satellite provider. watch us, like us on facebook, and follows on twitter. gabriel sherman is the author of the loudest voice in the room about the creation of doctors. he discussed the book with jane hall on "after words." this is one hour. >> congratulations on your new book. it's generating a lot of interest. so i would like to ask you about writing this book. >> that's a great question. i have covered media for a decade now and i have been fascinated by politics covered

by "the new york times", and msnbc. i wanted to do a book about the history because it was the most dominant network with ratings that were double that of cnn and nbc. so very early i realized that fox has a complete expression of his worldview and the network is shaped from this image. in this includes fox news or the combination of everything he had worked towards in politics and television. >> you said that fox news is a political operation. can you tell me what you mean by that? do not of course. it goes back to roger, he's a political person. he got start in television as a

republican strategist and a campaign manager this includes ronald reagan and most famously richard nixon and he really thrived in the culture, driving ferocious competitiveness in all and all the things that we associate with fox news is tied to history or background. so when he started the network for rupert murdoch, he brought all of that culture with how he structured it like a political campaign. a group of executives, some of the senior most individuals who call themselves the g-8, who was a group of campaign advisers who worked for george bush in 1988. so we had a lot of these little

things that occur at fox. but more than that, the way it operates his own the meeting and everyone marches in lockstep. there is a lot of the attributes that come out of the local world. >> how do you consider the republican agenda reign. >> what you see is how it so much better in terms of television media. and taking talent that speaks up and the way it manifests itself is that fox drives these

narratives in 2008 but the rise of barack obama. ecb storylines in his presidency. this idea that the administration included policy advisers and had extra constitutional authority. the health care debate was a huge story. i write about how to is a health care pun that i could go on camera and make the point of this bill gave an on-air talking head a banner she could wave on screen to make a pointer to see that narrative methods or comes out of the political world. >> fox can get criticized. we've had many on here. what is your response to that? and how does it work?

>> the notion that it is a republican network does not mean that they cannot have a liberal voice on fox. and it is a testament to the talent so that there is a mix of voices so that you have liberals eating red meat. it's never a fair fight. no one would necessarily consider them an equal exchange. when in fact sean hannity was the de facto producer of the show and included that topics that would go to allan collins and save what do you think.

but the whole show and the structure was a part of this. so what they have done is allowed himself to have liberals on there to give him this talking point on both sides. >> what did you make of the fact that they had been a part of the washington bureau. not everyone understands the storyline that you had set out their. >> it kind of goes back to being a political messenger. helping people understand why fox can talk about these liberals and reporters on the payroll. so let's talk about the young television adviser to richard nixon. he had been the executive

producer. ..

that are hostile out potential it to his message, and it is in that tension, that exchange of ideas that confers the level of credibility the same way that makes and was able to defer credibility of his campaign by having panelists that would of -- ask tough questions. panelists thought that the best panel, the best town hall aided was where he had to sweat and face tough questions pier it is the same thing. the audience wants to see republicans fight for their side and then ultimately when they're when it is that much more effective. >> it is interesting because of -- they hit that pretty hard. public-relations. they have said that you did not check the facts. you have a lot of anonymous

sources in the book. most of the incendiary comments are attributed to sources close to the investigation how these stand on that? >> led a team of two professional fact checkers with more than 2,000 hours. so just going back, i reached out to him more than a dozen times in person and in writing, travel to different states to see him in person. i wrote to his attorneys, public relations advisers. i would sit down and discuss every single factor in the book, and he declined every single requests to participate. >> how did you ascertain the truth? >> we checked with the secondary

sources, document, records, and ultimately i feel confident and it is important to point out that the book has been out at all of the revelations have been out. >> there are couple of the challenge. allegedly and the will of steel and saw that. >> the specific effort -- episode you are referring to is based on a documentary record from nbc from an internal investigation that nbc human-resources commissions to investigate robber ales, and the lawyer, the outside counsel to the secret investigation in the documentary record that he produced on behalf of nbc. as a reporter i reflect their the niles, but i rely on the

historical record. in 1995 this episode was discussed. the man in question said at the time that this event took place. the fact that he is denying it years later, he said he is a personal friend, lot of other factors. as a reporter i rely on the historical record. >> host: let me ask you something. your encounter rain very true. and years ago -- i mean, he said -- you said in the book that he said, i want to elect the next president. he says, kids are all wrong. they're is a certain kind of pugilism to that. he says you're a good reporter come but that is all wrong. obviously there are a lot of political people that joke that

this is a place where future and past political candid it's might be. at the same time he did not elect the president which seems to be a contradiction. he tried to get chris christie to run. so you also say that he is disdainful of mitt romney. have the square his saying he wanted to elect the next president with what he was actually able to do. >> that it still one of the things that makes him a fascinating character. he has these competing interests he is a man in a certain way you is that wall with them so. does two things can be in conflict with each other. what i find fascinating -- what my book shows is in the year 2012 in this campaign we saw the limits of his ability to shape

the political landscape through the medium of television. for much of his career television was the all-powerful tool it propelled candid it's, shaped the way the public perceived candid it's, but fox is became so powerful that it shaped the brand of the republican party and ultimately eroded his efforts to get a republican into the white house because the branch of the image that fox presents to the american public, while compelling, while it was a phenomenally successful television product was not a winning political message. he confronted the limits of his power to amend my book ends of the step that it is a story of decline. they are not this all-powerful tool to get someone to the white house. >> talk about his race.

it is severely, older, white, often the audience. often very attractive. i guess my question is, who is he is appealing to? there seems to be in a greek appeal. he has fashioned himself in the past. just capturing the liberal bias of the mainstream media. at the key might even consider myself a bigger than the republican party. he the think he is appealing to? >> the same people from more than four decades, the same people who richard nixon appealed tutti elected in 1968. this is the silent majority coalition that they assembled for the '68 campaign that had been there are liable republican

coalition for over 80 years. he took tell michael dukakis as soft on crime, we got for policy. you know, all that notion of patriotism, the middle class, populist to white voters, often times from the heartland. he grew up a factory to have the of the voters who felt that the american that they knew from the 1950's and early 60's is slipping away which is why fox is so successful was making these cultural appeals, the idea that american traditions are under siege. we are getting older. it is important to point out the median age of fox continues to go. the voters that our appeal to are getting older every year, and this coalition that he has

been speaking to for decades. >> t think that he believes it? >> said think it is both. he is a conservative, a true believer. cynical television, pure business, or real. the politics are real. foreign policy, government spending, a committed conservative. and that is fine. those are his beliefs. it is interesting why he has not wanted to voice those beliefs in the best. he wants to keep people off balance but never truly knowing what he says. a fox news producer could never really talk about roger ailes. when people want to communicate this said the second floor wants or the second floor says. that reference is to the

executive suite on the second floor of rupert murdoch's headquarters in midtown manhattan. it is interesting that he wants to be the man behind the curve. that is a separate point. that said, he is a believer, but is willing to use show business techniques. the war on christmas is an issue where he does believe that if this is a tradition under attack that said carinas it is a successful program in its energy. in an interview him he lifted the demographics of seven as majority with celebrate christmas. fox should be the network the should be a pro christmas now or at think that's a great that shows how he is willing to use

his show business acumen. >> you are talking about wage issues pretty much. let's talk a little bit about the impact of this excess of the company on the other networks. what is the impact? >> one of the lasting legacies of ailes is one of the reasons i argue in the book that he divided the country because it divided the media. this notion of a mineral media which is been a conservative belief going back to the town of nixon, he brought that to the server -- to the surface. they finally force the media to choose sides. i go in to direct you have great detail in my book about how cnn and nbc responded to the success of fox, especially in the years after 9/11. fox past cnn in ratings in 2002

and never turned back. in my book that describes how the executives in the run-up to the rock war at nbc were really concerned and apoplectic at this idea that stocks were continuing to run away. they said, maybe we should trust these were conservatives, breed brand ourselves. it was called america's news channel. they put american flags all over the scene, actually tried to and out fox fox. what i think is interesting is that the one thing it did not work. the big two, after that failed in mess nbc found success with the over the. and then it is said to go all lead in brand themselves as a liberal progressive cable news network. so you see how ailes was so successful that it forced other

networks to change the programming strategy. he is no way changed fox, but other channels. every media is forced to explain to viewers if their conservative, liberal, or down the middle. but the fact that we're having this conversation is a testament to the talent of ailes to make others define themselves. >> that drum beat, particularly after 9/11 was very effective. baena sure you can a treated totally. people were being asked to use -- where flag pins of the air and accused of being anti patriotic. >> i introduced -- interviewed one crews to tell me after 9/11 they're running to times square to buy flag pins to put on everyone in the office. it was a fervor, almost like a

spiritual movement that had ripple effects throughout the culture. >> it put pressure on the other networks. some of the executives were saying, let's be sure to point out even during some of the worst abuses while fox certainly pointed out that there were abuses on the other side. that drumbeat has been very successful. whether it is attributable to fox were posed 9/11, there is always pressure going to war. let me ask you one of the question about president obama specifically. you write that he is bad for the country and is basically as close to a socialist as you can be. some have used -- obama have complained about the way and yet he is upset quite gone on the

air. so what is it about the depiction of a obama that uc as driving some anti obama agenda? >> what is so interesting -- >> give me some specifics. >> well i going back to before he is the president in 2007 fox news ran with a report that he was educated in madrasah, skirting close to the lineup was in this idea the is a muslim and hiding his beliefs. it is this idea of taking in and outside of the american mainstream. ailes said that obama hate's capitalism. clean energy, they hammered the solyndra bankruptcy which is a

legitimate scandal, but it is emblematic of the nba that obama wants to get control of the economy. the health care debate, death panels, it was not just relegated to the conservative base. the idea that whether the health care bill had did panels and it was a rigid. of the health candidate because fox was pushing that aggressively. what is interesting is that obama's candidacy and election changed the mission of box news. i interviewed someone very close to a ailes said that prior to his candidacy there were competing. fox is that counterbalance in the american media. with obama's rise ailes saw something different, the american that he knew as a child and adult, changing to confront

this white house, and it greeted became his personal mission where ailes was standing at to the president which is why out of the book with an exchange that took place of the white house. and ailes took his sons of the white house, is going to greet the president. barack of what turns to ailes in makes a joke and says, eyes to the most powerful men in the world this year. and he says, don't believe those rumors, mr. president. i made about myself. you see so much revealed, the president to win the year 2011 facing a tough reelection really while he was making a big, i joke, really there is some truth to it. fox release seems like it was possible to change the political

landscape. and this joke about making up these rumors to refuse to use humor, so the application. he is hilarious. this charm offensive has been a big part of his coroner, and it was such a way to open the book to bring these two men to it to show a bias level of politics there were adversaries and it was a way to get into the book. you learn a lot. >> you said his america was changing. are you implying it was a racial attack? coriente as saying that obama had a deep-seated hatred of white people. what you find that as changed? >> a lot of it has to do with race. the reason that have a civil rights movement.

people who are in the meeting. he grew up at a time when white christian men were the dominant force in our national politics or born in 1940, lived through civil rights bill of the women's movement. we have on all of these competing voices into the american congress session. fox is a channel better seeking to that. at the a protector of that america. it just supply bills that a ticket or you don't have any evidence that this racially motivated check? >> i think the politics of race very much a part of it. >> an appeal, the fewer of they're losing.

>> immigration, his views on environmental regulation, becoming a more multicultural country, one that has stricter environmental laws. a much higher taxes on gasoline, energy, the eddy and that america would go down these other forms of policy jewesses' the was seeing america has a different country. speaking to those americans who feel that america should not be open to other ways of turning itself. the race is one part of it. the a the of the -- were never passed and justice to replace that has been done away with, affirmative-action, civil rights, but it is not limited arrest. >> again, he may regard him as a

socialist. his views on race. >> the notion that he said that the obama's residency means that we don't have to have this assurance of a. this is not an issue of black verses white. it is about the politics around race and won it yet as a century should have the political sensitivity of the leaves your racial history which is what the is getting at. in a to cover up. this is the @booktv idea that the above will white house would not punish the group's. >> that is going tab to be the

last thing for a minute. i want to ask you what you learned that makes you see in philly. >> great. >> on the next washington journal foreign policy initiative on as the lead in tensions between russia and ukraine. followed by the keystone excel pipeline. the american petroleum institute joins us. plus some of the day's news and your calls, tweet, and facebook comments live starting at 7:00 a.m. eastern on c-span. >> no more discussion on fox news with gabriel sherman, author of the book "the loudest voice in the room".

>> you would back to his home town that talked about his brother. i don't thing most of you would know much about this. what was his child of light? well was he doing, what connection, if any, do you make? >> welcome way it is important to point out, he built fox news from his life experience was resonated with me, and i wanted to understand what it was light. i went back to a factory town in northeastern ohio. a factory town in that area. it is central to understanding who he is. born in 1940. he in his parents went to

college. the blue-collar job. the bins. his brother -- mother was an ambitious woman. it is interesting to note that at that time this is a woman member of this possibility for blue-collar america. gm, general motors, deploying thousands of thousands of people health care, benefits, it was like a city and to itself. it was really a community, and there was a social cohesion in blue-collar towns of the other

thing was a struggle with hemophilia. so roger ailes suffered from this debilitating condition. it was a serious medical condition. it is that sense of fatalism and will to overcome the difficulty five is a part of his childhood, very resentful that of -- his fund other ticket of the children until they.

and he himself had spoken, violent and -- the father as a violent man. a very dark child did. out of that uc a lot of successful people all of the country who would succeed in the the one thing that defined his childhood was television. a hemophiliac. this was of the 1940's and 50's. he grew up on these classic american, the division between good and they will lend an aura of the television that captivated and compelled him on his career. you see the seeds of that of --

>> that it is a popular zoom to the populism as of there. >> the way ailes talked about it and lead your life, he is filled with these efforts isms. soviet recommend to any reader. you of the message.

>> the world is disappearing. >> it is well but he is able to appeal to people of a different needs. don't talk and a television for second. he winds up the entire university, a pioneer in broadcasts in the partner. he was kind of lost. you wanted to get to the military. the stumble the broadcasting. he would be the last want to

leave. what felt like interviewing the friend and hearing him talk about it, he found it in a radio and television. >> let me ask you about to carve a lot of people don't know that he was very successful. a very successful producer of the start -- >> the selling of the president ripped was the first idea of a packaging. one of the things that it is interesting is that he got very good press because he so often is quotable in a very combative way. yet journalists seem to like it. >> his charm and charisma has

been one of the things that has propelled him to wear ribbons to various. is of ruinous to sit down of me is connected to that. >> tell me about that. >> controlling the images of republicans in the news media. he think about it of a number one story the the as controlled as bad as though. a year in television advertiser to richard nixon. here comes of philadelphia enquirer columnist who will write a book about the campaign. and through his term, profanity, charisma, he talked themselves into being a star of the book. when it came no roger ailes wallace of became a never read celebrity. sought out by republicans. even though it was trash talking nixon's these republicans wanted him to use some thing.

he became the svengali of his generation of his ability. and he has massaged and embellished his own life meritor to amass power. >> citizen kane a little bit. >> and what was so interesting for me as a reporter is to look at the hundreds of live not thousands of quotes that are given and compare it to the historical record. consulting archives and his son is a broadway producer. and to match of his version with the historic record in oftentimes see a discrepancy, but this was not a case of guyana. what i was trying to do was he wearing his live in the size his story to betray himself in a way

that would advance his career. in this great tradition of american actors and storytellers , larger-than-life characters who have been pressed themselves of the american consciousness by massaging stories. he is a great storyteller which is a testament to his talent, not an nra a critique. >> something and even covered that i didn't know what about. the directions of tbn cabal that impacts what is on the air. as of journalist covering this and the media critic, it is difficult where and how someone mayor ray not be doing something of the air. talk to me about what you

learned but that operation. >> this is an offense that inland part of american history that i hope my book illuminates. it is one of the most interesting parts of the project . the bin is a director, a fledgling news service that was in business from the agents to report to the 1476. it was financed by engines of course, the cause of magnet financing right wing groups. so begins there as the news director. and what they're trying to do with package news stories to sell to local black influence, political, international news and it way that would balance out the big three. he had abc, nbc cover in cbs.

conservatives : back in trying to find a way to cut through the of of greuel by s. i consulted a man named robert pauley it teamed with joseph coor's to start this network. fascinating documents, memos where they're room literally spend jazzing have a good package the news to appeal to conservatives. one airport where there would live to release of their lineup to a conservative watchdog which was a pioneering watch dog through. media matters of law. this idea that they would send there line of to a conservative activist groups would showing me how exclusively there are trying to dictate the news.

there were focusing on techniques. there was a memo where the consultant figured out that they could develop their own riping post. cover the environmental protection agency. naturally they were kind of deconstruction the news to iran's the political agenda, and i saw the blueprint of fox news, and it is a fascinating story. he was working there and win in a soaking of the techniques that 20 years later he applied. >> what about recognition. see that as a key? >> yes, that is one of the principal techniques.

you know, the health care debate of a classic story lead toward back in time, the round out to the iraqi war. >> they developed it into simple plot lines, adversaries. the case of the iraqi war, of the hall freed of the cab hammering else's air with a television network as cost file, anti-american. but the war. it about these characters of the opposing side of the build up the characters of the pro side, the jurors to view bush has the hero. then developed story lines and repeated them to be going through the news hour and continued as prime time to be you see that going back.

this is the repetition of stories which could be a powerful propaganda. >> if you watch in as nbc and fox. >> parallel universes. story telling has been about a chord or solyndra. where reviews said is the difference between him as nbc -- to they have similar operations or the different? boxed for peace. interesting marketing strategies to read or to point of the bat was a business decision. yet, as we talked about ominous nbc was more than happy to try to read a conservative

right-wing network of the vote was about the lobbying strategy. they started fox for political reasons. or of business marketing issue, but what is interesting is the evidence of bees use them as good as what. as pure television and programming is not as compelling they don't have a unique talent, his ability to foster conflict, but talent. if you look of the talent that has been packed, they're oftentimes faded personalities. bill reilly was out of work. sean hennessey had never hosted a national television show. he sees personalities your authentic. and with interested b.c. there to carve up of the ideologically

pure rather than understanding that television is about the drama and the spectacle. >> well, particularly evans nbc would disagree saying that there purely an ideological. the year crude demographic. and they have been coded asking. you know, i think it would disagree about how the program comes across. but back to the talent of what to eat a one roger ailes view of bill o'reilly yesterday? he has met with huge success. what is their relationship? >> it is interesting to one that particularly close, but they both need each other. o'reilly is really the one talents who can do almost what it wants.

prexy canossa disagree for what have heard. >> which is a testament to to carry. television genius. but o'reilly really made the show him in a row as a testament to his skill as a performer. usoc and 6:00 p.m. show that was going nowhere. the new term to 8:00 p.m. during them on the kolinsky and built with the scandal. he connected with this audience who was outraged. the drama of the story, his ability to get guests to engage carry his fiery interview airing style. i describe him as an irish street. a thing that is the test of. he has the highest rated show on fox, the linchpin of their

entire prime-time lineup. he jokes that normally uses his show to sell his books have proved himself to what it really is because he has this respect that our riley is a self-made man. >> it is interesting because o'reilly has come out in ways that do not fit the scenario you are describing. because he is powerful he does not have to -- >> you can do what he wants. he speaks -- of raleigh really is an interesting -- he is essentially the one talent with some exceptions he can do what you want. sean handy is very much unlocks the with roger ailes. bills five was cut off for years pressure on hand is to write producer. it is the where he can get

what he wants on there. >> and we will come back to a couple of things. they're is a famous moment where karl rove who had been on fox for many years and raise a lot of monday against a wall or an doing commentary about obama this believed. tell us a little bit about that. that was bill with reagan kelly, basically somebody said let's go check. is it looked pretty awful. again her it does not fit the scenario. what happened in the bill would where she question that some of let's go look of the return they haven't news reading of the talk about how there will cover the but.

head there was frustration that chris christie had given a low of the flow. the fox polling analyst says, our polls don't show that the herd will be. everyone in that room felt that he did not believe the polls. the polling was skewed and robbery in a chance. the constant party insider was fighting. it was this bill with that of capsulate and then the. talking heads proclaim the a round the landslide. >> he thought he was going to. >> the reason why that would visit with the culture is that it's show the world that it

really was a self-contained universe. people thought that romney was going to lead even though the data sheriff ron refacing an uphill battle. rory to challenge you of this. this is will they to a genius. call room is that i their reality. where everyone has to talk about it. they broke the tie. and the work of it which was a fitting end. >> is it possible that it proves that they need kelly was in the raising jordan this? >> it think it's both. she has conservative views but

is willing to challenge people's assumptions. >> okay. let me ask you this. but to use the as the future of fox news? seventy-three years old. >> service 74 it may. the future is dependent upon larger animals. he has so far declined. he says he has a lot but has not disclosed to it is. it will be rupert murdoch's decision. so it's a reflection of the personnel of the. andrew of lakes to and take there cue.

the future of fox is is an open question. >> steve the key in mission will would happen? >> i don't think rupert murdoch had ever have imagined the success. fox news is nervous sigell was profitable division of his media empire. i think ideologically he is a conservative about pragmatist, foremost the business person and has the research and ability. famously he cozied up the tony blair and reached up to hillary clinton and the state's. but that said his profits give him the independents to program.

on issues like immigration, education, climate change, they are of the same page. he allows him to do it. >> said it will live in such a different world. peerless lotze of bestead there put money behind it the kind of whether apparatus. that is the title of your but. looking back -- i guess i have klum tea how to questions. the long term impact of our political discourse? >> as think roger ailes has

brought us back to an earlier time. partisan ba going back to vh. >> it was the balance of it to the. it was a post or anomaly. arson the is here to stay. the inventors flowered with the billion different voices. the are now part of the country. that think the lasting legacy has been to belies the scorched earth zero some position of politics, a testament to his success but democrats have copied his success. bill clinton can of the moment

it to about the democrats talked about how they ran a campaign. barack obama grand -- >> that was before. >> with that went back to the top of the political consultant and currently using scorched-earth tactics, always being an offense with the school politics. defining that rugby as the project with the tycoon who likes to fire people, the famous 47% video. those were the tax. his lazy will be that politics that no is considered a zero sum game.

politics is about trying to get all of your issues across the. >> did you think this is different from some how congress operates a one a burgers ago? >> i don't think he has brought us back it time. he has brought us back to this style of politics. he has made in the should of consensus that dirty word. >> the other factors, people fund-raisers. now you have to regret not that often going a fox. struggling to find its way. >> as a reporter who really believes in the of fact angeles and then the idea you could go out and ask questions.

i think unfortunately one of the legacies is that journalism is now seen as a way to advance. that the help perhaps the book will open people's eyes to that and encourage people to want to have more of a central clearinghouse review rules can report the facts. >> the key very rare.

>> it was love about where you are farm without the ukraine, politics, relief of education and religion. this money is cooling to the mid tenth and what it has been cool to see the evolution, from just talking about politics, experiences, we of willard, we get that it is an experience i'll never forget. >> and always thought i could never go that far and politics. such as caustic and where the. kind of chip away at that that did it in local in my community

because like president obama said, though it gets a nickel. then is that lloyd to help us with these the problems of we have. >> love of the thing is is our social media. they are able to express our opinion easily. i think the sense conversations. their conversation. >> and think this whole week is that about one. i come from a small town of um. is the bunch chance led the era of the of the delegates is. chance to learn other viewpoints

>> wayne cole smith with co author argues that the news media is biased against christians. he talked about the book at the heritage foundation. this is 50 minutes. today we will be talking about prodigal press, confronting the bias of the american news media. this book was originally written 25 years ago and has been widely

used in college classrooms. much has happened in the past would, here's. the 247 news cycle it john referred to is a course facilitated the least in part by the internet. the internet was doing the ag believe that al gore's i. since then the engine that is driving what happens in this year's cycle. we felt like it was teefor an update. it was just published in september. delighted by the reception so far. what i will do today's share with the soviet use of this book and taco the low world bins grew to give you an idea of who we are. also, want to be clear that my purpose is not to-the mainstream

media. i do not consider the mainstream bdm as the in in the. i do believe that we aren't the midst of a pathological be a culture. stow unity is a los charity today, i hope will pathologies and ultimately, perhaps, to find a way out of the pathology and provide hope for the future. first, a few words. largest christian news organization in the country. about 400,000 readers. we'll also have a robust presence of the answer that.

beginning about two years ago lucerne renew program. it to our weekend program. to those of you are used to listening to things of christian radio police will discover that it is nothing like what is on christian radio the two co-host's of the program. study of the first of the year when most of the 30 minutes into the program and i will host. what again, it is not patterned after anything of christian radio will decide targeted toward young people of the whole range of ages pacific children publications widely used in the

christian school and home school community. no of like to begin by sharing what for many in the will be obvious to the best media is done with it and has a profound debate of whether we think. the average sharon personals bid above 54,000 hours was so full of best media before they reach their 17th pay. compare and contrast that to the imminent time an average your impression merits but did church , and use of less than 1,000 hours. that does not mean the one in seven lines of were the bat and the of it is just a matter of how much time you spend with them. but it that these numbers put into sharp relief of is the blow

of time will respond with these various and of little disingenuous to : with the balance of about of time has no impact. as a battle of but the wars of injured show some movement, a democrat and later it independence in your said what the decades of research have been a powerful influence of the and trees while news and bad behavior's of america's children which is grown on larger as the has grown greater. that is one of the ideas that would begin to explore and how it wanted of the media shapes the way with an element media

shapes the way we think. let's take a lk it can't. i would like to begin about the content to know what to share with you a story of a christian newspaper from the new york times. if you read the new york times don't think of is the question is the button was to come by henry re the. in the teens and teens of the bins are investigative reporters went a bit of and the abortion ban been posted. -that has been taffetas and of social media. in