the american people didn't find out until june. were you purposely not telling us? would you purposely not revealing this to the american people? spinet my proposal wasn't -- my original thought was to complete the lois lerner e-mail production, complete a review of what other custodians have a problem and produce a paper to you that is laying it all out. >> so why didn't he informed the executive branch agencies, the white house, the administration that kept it secret from the congress who was conducting an investigation? >> it was our public record that was provided in this information. there has been no attempt to keep it a secret. my position has been that when we provide information, we should provide it completely if we provide incomplete information sometimes people are attempting to leap to the wrong conclusion not based on any facts so we thought it would be important to give you the full -- >> but it's okay for the white house and the treasury to lead to a conclusion six weeks before the congress.

that's my question also have there been discussions within the irs about when to reveal this information to congress? >> certainly. >> and these discussions included the treasury? >> no. >> out of the treasury find out about its? spinet of the first tim the firw about it -- >> i will have a lot of questions to write to you and in follow-up. it's completely unacceptable. >> can i follow up? spinet i want to move onto another topic. your letter described the e-mails as being unrecoverable. correct but fails to mention where the damaged hard drive is today. do you know where the hard drive is that crashed? >> after it was determined it was dysfunctional and that experts know e-mails could be retrieved was recycled into the street in the normal process. >> was it physically destroy? >> that's my understanding. >> was it melted down?

>> i have no idea. this was three years ago. >> does the irs have a tracking system for tracking items? >> we don't track every item everybody has that we track some items. >> does someone have a serial number for the hard drive? >> i'm advised as a normal case when a hard drive fails if the e-mail cannot be reconstructed the hard drive is turned over to the recyclers. >> it seems to me that it probably would have been tracked. it seems to me if it was recycled, the government property would have been tracked if you could simply walk away with property from the irs, so i assume there' there is a trackig system for the disposal of the government property. >> my understanding is people's computer continued to be functioning with a new hard drive that fits inside. i'm not aware whether the hard drives have identifiers. >> can we get a serial number in all of the other employees whose

hard drives whose e-mails have been lost? >> if they have serial numbers, you are welcome to. i want the hard drive had crashed during that timeframe. .. a simple yes or no answer. >> you already answered. >> i think -- >> regular order.

>> i think the appointment of a special prosecutor after the six investigations ongoing would be a monumental waste of taxpayer funds. >> is that a yes or a no? >> that is in no. >> thank you. mr. levin is recognized for five minutes. >> that was congressman camp and the irs commissioner from earlier today. we will be showing more tonight at 8:00 eastern time on our companion network c-span. you can share your thoughts on the missing irs e-mails with other viewers, go to c-span facebook page or share your thoughts via twitter using #cspanchat. earlier this week the ceo of general motors testified on capitol hill appearing before a house subcommittee to testify on the company's recall of cars with faulty ignition switches. she said she vows to make changes. you can hear that testimony sunday morning at 10:30 eastern

on c-span. >> the thesis of the book is that there's a whole group of people in america, a big swath of america that is being ignored, left behind, not included in the discussion i think for either party. particularly though i would argue the republican party, and i call them blue-collar conservatives. the folks out there that are working people, most of them don't have college degrees. folks that really still understand the value of work and importance of work and responsibility and people understand the importance of family and faith, belief in freedom and limited government. so you say those are conservative republican voters. in many cases they are not. in fact, a lot of them are not voting at all because it really see either party talking to them about the concerns they have in

trying to create an opportunity for them to live the american dream. >> former pencil instead of president and rick santorum argues that working americans have been abandoned by both political parties and offers conservative answer to the problems saturday night at 10 eastern on "after words," portable tv this weekend on c-span2 pick a spot our online book club we're discussing amity shlaes the forgotten man, a new history of the great depression. join others to discuss the book in our chat room at booktv.org. booktv, television for serious readers. >> and f. on transparency and freedom of information, and i think my colleagues in journalism would get a similar grade whether they're liberal or conservative. the freedom of information process has become a joke but it was already well on its way prior to the obama administration but this administration has perfected the stall, the delay, the redaction, the excuses. and really it's shocking because

i feel very strongly that the information they withhold and protect many times belongs to the public. we own it but there's no sense of that when you asked for it. they covet it as if they're a private corporation defending their trade secrets rather than understanding that withheld this information gathered on our behalf. >> journalist and investigative reporters transeven on the changing face of network news in her career sunday night at eight on c-span's q&a. >> this week tv show host doctor austin finished his promotion of diet products on his show. he appeared before a senate subcommittee that deals with consumer protection and product safety. the associate director of the ftc's advertising practices division also testified at the hearing is about one hour 40 minutes. >> the witnesses can feel free to go ahead and take a seat. we will begin with some opening statements and then move to your testimony.

this hearing will now come to order. we have all heard and seen the ads. promising quick and substantial weight loss is only you take this pill, drink this shake, use this device. all without adjusting guide our increasing physical activity. it seems too good be true and, of course, it is. we have a short clip of some of these ads that have run on television, satellite radio, online and in print that i'm going to play so that it is clear what we are talking about today. and it was finished it's called since it, the amazing a clinically proven sensation that you sprinkle on to take the weight off where the need to lose 10 pounds, 50 pounds or more, now you can. without dieting. simply sprinkle sensa on, eat all the food you love, and watch

the pounds come off. it's that easy. you will lose weight faster and easier than you ever dreamed possible. >> i lost over 120 pounds with sensa. >> you may think magic is made believe that this little being is a magic weight loss cure. when turned into a substance this miracle pill can burn fat fast for anyone who wants to lose weight. very exciting and breaking news. >> millions of you love coffee but now you're going to love it for a hold of the reason. a staggering nearly released study reveals that the coffee bean in its purest raw form may

hold a secret to weight loss that you've been waiting for. the study presented at a meeting of the world's largest scientific society triggered unprecedented excitement for a weight-loss study is showed women and men who took green coffee extract lost an astounding amount of fat and weight, 17 pounds in 22 weeks. by doing floating nothing extra in their day. could this be the magic weight loss being to help melt unweighted pounds you've been waiting for? >> is there a satellite radio and ask okay. we also have a satellite radar at october going to play. there's lots of terrible ads on satellite radio. it's easy to understand why so many consumers are willing to take a chance, ignore the instinct and delete suspicious claims like these according to data from centers for disease control and prevention more than

one-third of adults are obese and 70% are either obese or overweight. this from the start of the obesity epidemic is for the fore colored by surveys by the desire of americans to lose weight i consistently failing to put in the effort to do so. in 2013 a gallup survey showed 51% of adults, wanted to lose weight while just 25% said they were seriously working towards that goal. this mismatch between americans stated desire to shed weight and their lack of series effort can perhaps explain the growth of the u.s. weight-loss industry as well as the proliferation of fat, false and deceptive advertising. with so many americans desperate for anything that might make it easy to lose weight, it's no wonder scam artists and fraudsters have turn the $60 billion weight loss market to make a quick buck.

sadly this is not a new problem. the federal trade commission filed its first weight-loss case in 1927. mike allen's reduce unclaimed in the true romance magazine that quote access that is literally dissolve away leaving the figure slim and properly rounded giving out life of grace to the body every man and woman deserves. since 1927 the ftc has filed more than 250 cases challenging false and unproven weight-loss claims. including just this year four settlements announced in january, and last month the complaint filed in federal court against the sellers of in fact a green coffee dietary supplement. more than one in 10 fraud claims submitted to the ftc are, in fact, for weight-loss products. but the problem is much larger that any enforcement agency could possibly tackle on its own. private stakeholders, companies

that sell weight-loss products, media outlets and other advertising platforms as well as consumer watchdogs must all do their part to help address this problem. media outlets in advertising platforms in particular serve as a critical gatekeeper that are well-positioned to keep false and deceptive advertising from reaching consumers. i appreciate trust in ads.org which represent some of the largest online advertising platforms senior today to discuss the recent report on this issue. the challenges online companies face in addressing false and deceptive advertising and what more they can do. but the problem is a limited to the internet. in preparing for this in my staff reached out to a variety of media companies across all mediums to better understand industry practices in screening and monitoring advertising. i find it troubling that broadcast inside let me do what is who to be today or unwilling to appear. to me this indicates there's either something to hide or they don't have a good story to tell.

either way will not be effective in addressing this problem and to all stakeholders take it is usually. i in virtually any other industry that are good actors and bad actors be we'll hear today from the council for responsible nutrition, a trade association for the dietary supplement industry and the better business bureau advertising self-regulatory council about indices efforts to police itself. we will also hear today from dr. mehmet oz, he offers a unique perspective of being both a medical doctor and a host of the greg piper daytime show that frequently aired segments on weight-loss issues and products, and that is frequently cited in the false and deceptive advertisements used to market questionable weight-loss products. doctor also have some tough questions for yo today about yor role, intentional or not in perpetuating these scams. when you future products on your show it creates what is become known as the oz effected dramatically boosting sales and driving scam artist to pop up overnight using false and

deceptive ads to sell questionable products. while i understand your message is focus on basics like healthy eating and exercise, i'm concerned you are melding medical advice, news and entertainment in ways that harm consumers. this committee has looked at a number of scams effecting consumers. in most other cases, and most otheofthe cases the scams are tn financial losses which can certainly be devastating. but what makes weight-loss scams really stand out is they not only result in financial losses but they can potentially put a consumers health at risk. i hope your suggestions to about how we can better empower consumers with tools and knowledge needed to not fall victim to weight-loss scams and what more stakeholders can and should be doing to keep false and deceptive weight-loss ads from reaching consumers in the first place. i look for during from all over with is to edit thank you all very much for being here. senator heller. >> thank you. thank you, madam chairman for

holding this hearing. regarding the weight-loss industry. i want to thank our witnesses for taking time for being here also. we know that weight management is of interest to many americans. at politicians that. but no surprise the market is quite significant totaling 60.5 billion in 2013 alone in one estimate. i can understand the appeal of these products have for many who are tempting -- and to prove their health and lifestyle. seems to me many and perhaps even most of these products and services are legitimate making responsible substantially representations to health benefits and other claims. but unlike any other market place there are bad actors in this space who make widely erroneous claims about questionable products. there are fraudsters and those who seize upon dieting fads in order to scam vulnerable members of our population. i believe the key to healthy weight loss is a combination of diet and exercise.

i personally would be suspect of a magic weight loss cure or a miracle pill. that being said i can understand how a person may question their own assumption when a person who they believe has credibility on the issue makes a claim about any particular product. that's why and please we're here and joined today by ms. mary engle who is the associate director of the division of advertising practices within the ftc bureau of consumer protection. i applaud the ftc's work to shut down the scam artists and other for children more about the commission's success this year in bringing a series of cases under the agency's existing section five authority against a number of companies engaged in deceptive advertising of weight-loss products. also look for during her thoughts about the commission is applying its reason basis standard for substantiate them health claims, including weight-loss and what it considers to be competent and reliable scientific evidence to back certain claims.

while the standard has traditionally been a flexible one it's no secret the ftc has pursued more stringent requirements in recent decrease. it's an open question as to whom the business of situation requirements are meant to apply. or whether the ftc has followed its own requirements and apply new standards and whether this standard is consistent with constitutional protection of free speech. i'd like to welcome doctor auzere today. "the dr. oz show" debuted in 2009, reaches roughly 3 million viewers every day. i look forward to hearing from dr. oz on what steps he is taken to ensure that the information you shares in conversation he moderates the rights accurate claims. we are informed dr. oz does not endorse particular products and she's been the subject of scruples entities using his image in advertising without his permission. however, much has been been about the so-called dr. oz effect. whereby demand for products and ingredients spike after they are featured on his show.

when a celebrity doctor mentioned many pots for example, sales rose by 12000%. and internet searches for the device rose by 42000%. it is this popularity that may have influenced a florida-based coverage into the market and green coffee bean extract and agree that dr. oz referred to as a magic weight loss cure and the miracle pill that can burn fat fast. this company is now the subject of an enforcement action brought by the ftc that is truly been in federal district court in florida for unfair and deceptive claims with regard to this product. i would also like to welcome our other witnesses, mr. lee peeler for better business bureau, mr. mr. mister, mr. rob harrelson of truthinads.org and mr. fabricant. thank all of you for taking time

to be here today and thank you again, madam chairman for holding this thing. i look forward to the testimony to answer some of our questions. >> great. would you like to say a word? i think that my colleges did a great job of introducing ever so i will do this quickly. ms. mary engel is associate threat of advertising practices, bureau of consumer protection at the federal trade commission in washington. dr. mehmet oz, vice chairman and professor of surgery columbia university college of physicians and surgeons and host of "the dr. oz show." mr. c. lee peeler, president and ceo of advertising self-regulatory council, executive vice president, council of better business bureaus from new york. mr. stevens mr., president and ceo council for responsible nutrition based in washington. mr. robert hatton harralson and executive director, truthinads.org, and dr. daniel

fabricant and executive director and ceo natural products association. and will begin with your testimony. we will have you on a clock which i'm sure you understand the i know you understand, dr. oz about the clock. but we are not strict about that. if you don't need to go over by a few moments will not have a problem. keep in mind entirety of any written testimony would like to submit would be included in the official record. welcome, ms. engle. >> good morning, madam chair and members of the committee, i mary engle, social director for advertising practices at the federal trade commission. i am pleased to have this opportunity to provide information regarding the ftc's efforts to combat fraudulent weight-loss advertising. as you know the united states is facing an obesity epidemic. nearly 70% of u.s. adults are overweight or obese. excess weight and obesity -- bcr major exhibitors to health care costs and present a serious

public health challenge. so it is a surprising there's strong interest in products that claim to vote weight loss. unfortunately, where there is strong consumer interest, fraud often follows. in the ftc's 2011 survey of consumer fraud, we found more consumers were victims of fraudulent weight-loss products than of any of the other specific frauds that we serve it. despite the continuing boom in the weight-loss industry, there exists very little scientific evidence that builds and settlements along can help lose a significant amount of weight. scientists agree that the foundation of successful weight loss is to be a healthful, calorie controlled diet and increased physical activity. products that promote fast and easy weight loss without changes to diet or lifestyle deterred consumers are making these tough but necessary changes. as was mentioned the commission filed its first weight-loss case in 1927 and since then we filed another 250 cases challenging

false and unproven weight-loss claims. in the past 10 years the commission has brought 82 law enforcement actions challenging false or unsubstantiated claims about the effectiveness of a wide variety of weight-loss products and services. services. since 2010 alone the commission has collected nearly $107 million in consumer restitution for deceptive weight-loss claims. our recent cases highly have the agency has focused its enforcement priorities on large national advertising campaigns for a creative range of weight-loss products with unproven benefits. operation failed resolution announced right after the new year targeted the newest weight-loss fads with popular ingredients, food additives, human hormones, skin creams. in one failed resolution case consumers were cautiously urged to shake their sensa and use up to 90 pounds or more without dieting or exercise. in another consumers were urged to rub in creams tout it as

having bodyslamming capabilities that could trim inches in weeks. in a third, consumers with a taste for the rare might try htc drops made from a diluted form of human hormones to lose a pound a day. each of these cases resulted in a summit with the ftc to companies were ordered to pay consumer redress and to back any future weight-loss claims with well conducted human clinical studies. despite his long history of ftc enforcement, weight-loss product versus. this is never consumers are particularly vulnerable to fraud, there's a norms amount of money to be made and people will gravitate toward where the money is. we've noticed some disturbing developments with respect to weight-loss advertising. the reliance on proprietary studies using erroneous or even fabricated data. this was to the case against sensa and an early case involving sketchers challenges.

these practices add a layer of complexity to our weight-loss investigation. a second trend is the appearance of weight-loss fads in mainstream media supported by trusted spokespeople. our pending case against in tv advertising shows how the marketers of the pure green coffee dietary supplement capitalizcapitaliz e on dr. oz having featured green coffee beans extract on his show and calling in magic and a miracle. when consumers see product increase marketed in sophisticated ways on respected media outlets or praised by those they trust it to be difficult for them to listen to the internal voices telling them to beware. that is what would've long sought to partnership of the media to screen deceptive diet ads before they run. are recently issued get check reference guide sent to media outlets throughout the country advises the media on several weight-loss claims that experts i simply cannot be true. and that the media should think twice about it for them. finally, we recognize that consumers are the first line of

defense against weight-loss front of the ftc has developed a full arsenal of consumer education materials ranging from traditional publications that lay out the facts for consumers to online teaser websites and today we launched a new interactive online consumer quiz but i want to thank the committee for focusing attention on weight-loss scams and for giving the ftc an opportunity to describe its role. while we may never eliminate weight-loss fraud, we will continue our efforts to pursue the perpetrators, work with him to tell prevent fraudulent ads from running and educate consumers that trusting the gut instinct can be a strong protective mechanism. thank you and i would be happy to respond to any questions. >> thank you, ms. engle. dr. oz. >> thank you members of the committee for convening this session. this hearing and for allowing me to testify. consumer scams and fraud related to weight-loss products played me since i first are in media long before my talk show launched in 2009.

it's a problem i've spent a magical time, energy, broadcast resources and money trying to combat. i'm chagrined to see the problem has only increased exponentially. i'm encouraged you have decided to prioritizes, enterprise and the conservations of other witnesses will help because we can douse the flames of this uncontrolled wildfire in the interest of protecting the consumer. after i finish my training in 1993, about a decade of training by the way, i began practicing cardio thoracic surgery. as i perform thousand surgeries on patients whose hearts have been ravaged by obesity i realize we need to better educate people how to take part in their own care. i went into the public life in an effort to teach. i started as a guest on the oprah winfrey show in 2004 and had my first experiences with scant advertising at that time but we discussed supplements, nothing special about my description of them but they

come the internet and began springing up using pictures of his, shall impose that we were supporting these products. and selling the. we filed a civil suit against the company's. despite the expense of law enforcement cooperation had very little impact. 10 years later we are back to this phenomena has grown dramatically in sophistication and scale. these ads take money from trusting viewers, many of whom believe i am selling the item to choose to be clarity in case he comes up i've never sold supplements. out of sheer frustration i've taken a number of measures to do with this problem to protect my future recognizing and accept responsibility for this but the passionate language i used to describe supplements was fodder for this unethical advertisement. we have been more stringent and presenting opportunity of include opposing voices on the segments. this to my nose has had noticeable impact. marketers are still able to select a single phrase of

support without surrounding context and continue profiting unabated. the clip you showed and others of similar ones, if you look deeper into the show, i will also always mention something about the fact these are crutches, designed for short terms about and you won't get there without diet and exercise. to go for the i devoted members chose to cover the exact fanatic of how a skin works and what to look for to launch a campaign campaign called it's not need and use partners to amplify the coverage but i devote a portion of every single broadcast, look drug and chemical the last thing i say and tell them and wish him and i don't sell anything. but if you see my nihcm my picture involved an advertisement, do not buy the product. check any show you up and went on and you'll see me say that at the very end. we treated always watch was a way for use report violations and squints. we've collected more than 35,000 completes of artistically hired a private company to open these complaints and police the web and have issued more than 600 cease-and-desist let the after months of investigation paid for by us i confronted an egregious

advertiser on my show in part because we found the part that hurts me, you make of this, not only was using my name, who's also on providing 10% of the active ingredient. so whether it works on not that's a separate issue. by the way last night i went online. i could still purchase this product if i wanted to. it's a fairly shameless series of perpetrators that we're dealing with. i do believe that working together we can achieve a lot more. before offering any suggestions, and i have a few, let me address the criticism that my show may be filling the internet scanning probe. i'm respectful of this criticism. i encourage the nation searching for answers to their health woes. we often address weight loss because as mention it affects about two-thirds of the population. the only message i gave was to eat less and move or which is the most important thing people need to do.

we wouldn't be tackling this challenge because viewers know these tips and they still struggle. we search for tools and crutches for short-term support people can jumpstart their programs. we use solutions used in other countries, other parts of the world. traditional chinese medicine. we future cleanses and new diet programs by promising office. many of these are controversial as are the supplements we researched and provost. i would rather have a conversation of this material on my stage than in back alleys. the conversation will still happen. today is not a referendum on alternative medicine. women to decide if vitamin supplements make sense. the problem we been invited to discuss, internet scam and fraud will begin to recede only when state and federal agencies have jurisdiction over the scammers amplified enforcement and a public-private cooperative effort is undertaken in earnest and put everyone on this panel in front of us, including the ftc legitimate project manufactured, ad hosting services and media outlets like

mine. i need to be a part of this. i feel passionate about doing this and i want applicable. since and i want to play with a sense by time's up i'm not going to cover these suggestions but i would like to offer some thoughts may be in the questions let on about how we can create a quick reference registry, incentivize whistleblowers, maybe a bounty to assist the ftc in this very difficult challenging task. thank you. >> mr. peeler. >> thank you, good morning. i appreciate the opportunity to testify on the ongoing work of the advertising industry self-regulatory system, particularly as it applies to weight loss advertising. this system was created in 1971 by the nations leading advertising trade association in cooperation with the council of better business bureau's. since that time we have pioneered a rigorous form of self-regulation that is impartial, that is it finished by the council of better business bureau's, the discovery has of, it applies to all national advertisers in all

media. it's transparent, all of our decisions are publicly reported. and its effect. companies that do not participate in the process or don't follow the recommendations are publicly referred to the appropriate government agency, usually the ftc. we work on a case-by-case basis actively monitoring national advertising for questionable claims and practices and we apply ftc type standards to those claims. each year we issue almost 200 decisions on a wide variety of advertising issues, including about a dozen last year that addressed advertising of weight-loss claims and required the companies to stop or modify the ads in question. self-regulatory claims from weight-loss products include issues ranging from technical easy to remedy, disclosure questions to questions about the validity of complex underlying studies that support the advertisers claim. for example, one recent nad

decision addressed advertising for a product, including claims data been clinically proven to promote four times more weight-loss than diet and exercise. some of the claims were contained in a special report on how does 28 pounds in one month. with to giving cleanses recommended by dr. oz. other claims resulted, cited results specific studies that support for the weight-loss claims. in this case the advertiser told us that special report that i referred to earlier was posted by an unauthorized third party and the advertiser immediately took steps to take the report off of the internet. the nad determined that the remaining specific product performance claims and ingredients claim should be discontinued in their current form. the advertiser fully cooperated with the review and agree to discontinue the claim, as to about 90% of the companies that participate in the process. we had very similar case with

one of the other ingredients that's popular in this area, bradberry t. down. our casework complements that of the better business bureau system in protecting consumers. bvds handles hundreds of cases locally including claims associated with weight-loss products and services. bbb is also worked to resolve complaints about business practice, practice and are uniquely positioned to identify local and national scams as they emerge and warn consumers about them. we are major outlet for the educational material that the ftc discard because we have 100 over 100 better business bureau located around the country. last year better business bureaus handled thousands of points about weight-loss products and services including a growing number of complex about weight-loss clinics. dvds ossified unsubstantial weight-loss claims are also associated for problematic building practices and

authorship programs, underscoring the adage that ms. with weight-loss clinic frequently lighten only the consumers won't. these these overall results are consistent with those observed in our st. louis bbb that serves eastern missouri and southern illinois. except that the st. louis bbb has not seen the rise in the number of weight-loss clinic ads in that particular jurisdiction. sulfuric odors works only if it has the support of industry and the government. in the area of the weight-loss, keep associations in particular, the electronic retailing association and of the council for responsible nutrition, have stepped forward to provide the types of no strings attached funding that allows us to do our impartial monitoring and decision-making work. although there is no formal relationship between advertising self-regulation process and the government, decades of support by the federal trade commission have been absolutely critical in the success of the process.

so although there have been significant efforts by the federal and state government to control unsubstantiated and exaggerated claims, more can be done obviously. one of the things that think everybody agrees on is a type of state and federal enforcement actions of the ftc has been bringing our critical to controlling this type of advertising. in addition, trade association whose members include representatives of the weight-loss industry need to follow the example set by the electronic retailing association and the council for responsible nutrition, and step up in up and support increased celebrators were marching in the marketplace. it's good for businesses, good for consumers. finally, the ftc renewed effort to enlist consistent support of the media regarding against the most egregious types of weight-loss claims as a key state. network broadcasters have very sophisticated processes for network ads, and similarly in the new media, google has

recently introduced a new approach to ads screening that is tailored to the specific new media. but there are lots of other media outlets, independent channels, cable television, satellite radio and radio that are not doing as much. and, finally, just close with an anecdote. just this weekend i got a standing the. it was for a product called forskolin. exhibit to the product i would never have too died again. when i went on the internet -- never have to diet again. when i use google earth the return address was for a p.o. box. so it was sort of a regulatory trifecta. it was an e-mail for a red flag claim that no one can substantiate with a seller that nobody can find. >> thank you. mr. mister.

>> good morning. my name is steve mr. and under president and ceo of the council for responsible nutrition. see her in his leading trade association representing the manufacturers and marketers of dietary supplements functional foods and nutritional ingredients. we empathize with many americans who are vulnerable to false promises for losing weight fast with everything from rubber bands and bracelets to sprays and greens and exercise gadgets and just dietary supplements. collectively americans spend over $40 billion a year trying to lose weight. the nutrition business journal reports that dietary supplement's annual replacement for lead for weight-loss are a fight with $3 billion a year industry, a small fraction of the total but a significant sum nevertheless. before the committee throws the baby out with the bathwater we want to be clear that there are a number of dietary increase use in weight-loss supplements when combined with moderate exercise programs and sensible eating that have been shown and well

conducted clinical trials to be safe and beneficial weight management. the dietary supplement health and education act requires that also permits must have substantiation for the claims, and that includes weight-loss claims. the regulations for labeling establish detailed approach for what constitutes that adequate substantiation for the structure function claims which requires that the claims be supported by well conducted, human trials with visibly significant benefits. along with the consumers who were duped by these false and misleading claims, the responsible supplement industry complies with the standards also stands to lose when unscrewed was marketers to get finished with misleading and unsupported as. i'm here today to reinforce the commitment of crn's members to protest these scams and frauds in the weight-loss market place. but, unfortunately, the reality of the current weight-loss market is that it is a tale of two industries. legitimate manufacturers who responsibly produce products that work and make claims for

the products that are within the bounds of the law, and then on the other hand, the unscrupulous players who prey on consumer desperation and their insatiable desire to be thin and will say almost anything to make a quick profit -- profit. the ftc has authority to enforce claims made in the advertising of weight-loss products as you've heard today. crn is probably supported and will continue to applaud the numerous enforcement actions brought by the ftc in recent years, and the more than $438 million in restitution and civil penalties assessed by the commission against deceptive advertising with respect to weight-loss products since 2004. enforcement sweeps like the ftc's operation waistline, and more recently failed resolution, and its immediate awareness campaigns like gut check helped remove misleading claims but they also honored the public while sending a message of deterrence through the industry. we applaud them for that.

however, the reality is that in this internet age, along with the proliferation of cable television, talk radio, various online media and the increasing pressures for ad revenue among shrinking print media, both the ftc and the fda have insufficient resources to combat the number of deceptive claims in the market. some media outlets eager to accept advertising dollars will turn a blind eye to advertising copies that clearly violates the law and pcs consumers. so in 2006 see her in begin an industrywide self-regulatory program with the nad, as you heard to self police the the advertising claims of dietary supplement markers. crm has committed over $2 million to underwrite this program which is already invested almost 200 challenges of the claims made by supplement marketers, many of which involve these weight-loss product. i am proud of the track record of this program for providing fair, thoughtful and transparent

decisions, for achieving a high rate of industry participation and for the precedent it set with his decision to deter others in the industry from making similarly fraudulent claims. crn members are committed to manufacturing and marketing high quality, safe, beneficial progress and to assure that our consumers receive truthful, accurate, non-misleading information on supplements and nutritional products. we believe the challenge for legitimate weight-loss products is essentially this. american consumers unrealistically yearned for a magic bullet and unscrewed was marketers will take advantage of these desires was hollow promises to like the solution to this is not easy. significant for steps should include increasing resources and priority for enforcement of the existing legal requirements by both the fcc and the fda. expanding and strengthening self-policing programs among manufacturers and marketers in

the industry icon initiative with the nad, called on media outlets and online retailers to conduct their own advertising clearance before accepting ads with claims that are illegal and the central to good to be true, and finally educating consumers to be realistic about their weight-loss strategies and their expectations. to make them less vulnerable to outrageous and unsupported claims. thank you for the opportunity to share our views with the committee. >> thank you. mr. harralson. >> chairman mccaskill, ranking member heller, and distinguished members of the subcommittee. thank you for the opportunity to testify today about trust in add.org member countries efforts to combat fraudulent online advertising for weight-loss product but my name is robert harralson and on the organization's executive director. in my test but i will highlight how our member countries are incentivized to keep bad ads out of our system. i will also note how they're investing significant resources in this area and have already removed millions of bad ads from

services. trust in add.org include just deleted a well, google, twitter and yahoo!. we found this workstation to work together towards a common goal, protect people from malicious online ads and deceptive practices. with this everywhere bring awareness to consumers about online ad related scams working collaboratively to identify both trends in deceptive ads and best practices, and sharing our knowledge with policy makers and consumers, consumer advocates around the country. trust in add.org offers guidance to consumers on how to avoid scams to the regular release of what we call our bad ads trends alert. these are consumer friendly and easily digestible reports that examine a specific trend or trends we are seeing and device specific samples a bad ads and websites that the compass of removed from the platforms. we highlight the steps of the copies are taken to combat the problem and give consumers useful tips on how to make good choices online.

our website also includes dedicated page where people can go to learn how to easily report a suspicious and on any of our member companies website. our first report released in may detailed ads for phony tax -- tech support service. we released a new report on project that led to weight-loss products and dietary supplement. member comes up allocated significant resources to keep bad ads off the platforms. without question ensuring a positive user express for all users is essential to maintaining a vibrant internet ecosystem. today to set up numerous weight-loss products and dietary supplements to advertising and seen across all mediums, print, broadcast, radio and the web. and while most entity selling these kinds of products provide accurate and truthful information regarding the overall effectiveness, some bad actors in an attempt to entice consumers market products with outrageous claims and promises of dramatic weight loss.

for the bad actors attended these online advertising, these kinds of claims violate both our member companies advertising policies and existing laws and at protecting consumers. we applaud federal agencies for recognizing the weight-loss scam problem and their active efforts to educate consumers about misleading claims. in addition to its active law enforcement against scams, the ftc's consumer information website has an entire section devoted to weight-loss and fitness that outlines many of the advertisements that users could encounter on the internet and other places, and debunks their claims. stopping these ads is critical for online advertising companies as well. collectively our member companies have hundreds of individuals on their respective teams spanning policy, engineering, network security and legal, that are dedicated to identifying and preventing this illegal activity. fortunately, most of these types of ads never reached the user and are immediately rejected

through automated filtering processes as soon as they are submitted. for those that are detected after they're published they are immediately removed and advertiseadvertise account is r. temporary or permanent suspension of the account is then considered depending on the severity of the ads policy violations. user feedback also played an important role in detecting bad ads. our company careful -- quickly takes action when wanted. over the course of the past 18 months aol, google, facebook, twitter and yahoo! have collectively removed or rejected over two and half million ads related to weight-loss and dietary supplement due to numerous ad policy violation. while all stakeholders are working hard to stop these ads, weight-loss scammers, so more incredibly sophisticated work maliciously to find ways to avoid detection by the agencies falling within the guidelines and circumvent our company's automated filters. working together, a wellcome facebook, google and twitter and yahoo! are fully committed to

improving their systems to help protect users across the web. we believe that if we all work together to identify threats and stamp them out we can make the web a safer place for everyone. again, thank you for this opportunity to testify. >> thank you, mr. nelson. dr. fabricant? >> thank you, madam chair, members of the committee. thank you for this opportunity to discuss and participate in the panel discussion. ico and its editor of national products association, the oldest and largest trade association in the natural products industry. we represent thousands of retailers, manufacturers, suppliers and distributors in health foods, by just outlets and natural personal care and the millions to use supplements e.g. some of our member's are household names, most are small business owners, many women owned who got in this business because they want to help people live healthier lives. our first full to customers is always consult with your health care provider and that dietary

supplement are a heart of a ther broader healthier lifestyle that includes diet and exercise. we fully support efforts to combat fraud and rosenberger said the government has to protect consumers. deceptive advertising is illegal and should not be tolerated, carried. we are especially concerned about fraud on the internet. associate with him about brick-and-mortar independent region, not internet only or fly-by-night friends. arbiters of public trust of the customers is one of many reasons that natural products are in such high demand. no one has more of an interest in weeding out fraud and our members because bad actors only tarnished their good integrity. to support ftc, nba has its own entity policing program where members report question will have claims of bad actors can be disciplined to our members are empowered to vote on mnstc-i role as relates to question the ad claims. if you see something, say something. under our truth in advertising program pushing outcomes are reviewed by committee of industry attorneys to determine if there over the line. the first is to me a cease-and-desist letter.

i have attached an example of that in my testimony. the second is to refer cases to ftc and fda for potentially fraudulent advertising or disease claims exist. since the program began in 2010 its result in 446 letters to such firms. of those, 320 acknowledge the issues and make corrections. the remainder were submitted to fda and ftc over that bit of time. we have a strong partnership with the agency but we didn't by federal authorities to provide enforcement action to make his ability. while we see positive action we also see areas for consideration in some areas of concern to refer to the existing enforcement authorities but some are being used for the first time to my former job as director of the dietary supplement programs at 58 were excused -- were used existing tools, injunction and caesars for recidivist firms failing to meet minimal pauli standards in making disease crimes.

npa fully supports those efforts as they demonstrate the current offers. but we are still wrestling with the internet advertising day and a fly-by-night issues so where are we there with those which we believe ftc should consider using existing authorities more on the front end to be more agile and disciplinary the compass without regard to the revenues. more aggressive enforcement of the so-called fly by nights need to be just as important to the fcc as largest sale -- large-scale enforcement. however we don't see much use of these tools. also it appears pursue more sizable appetite did cases perhaps at the expense of more regulatory muscle on the front end against compass of any size or registry but if ftc doesn't act and take a fly-by-night on the front in early in the game, more will be tempted to get into the game.

lastly when we support the fcc's mission we're concerned with the recent development related to ftc consent order to consent orders are case specific and not meant to be applied industrywide. we are seeing some evidence of this which could have negative outcomes for consumers from both the cost perspective but reducing the quality and quantity of information about the products available. it's not beneficial to anyone and particularly to consumers. one example with the ftc's new requirement, that additional studies and research are necessary prior to advertising like a requirement to conduct two double-blind randomized controlled studies to support lawful function statements which is not a current legal or statutory department. this is not only outside the statute but we believ believe id or inefficient use of resources. this is also happening with the cost-benefit on behalf of consumers or the economy but is

that stand are applied generally a from investing in the current record study that is well controlled and meets the competent and reliable scientific standards would be prohibited from sharing the information from consumers. this results in less information being available to consumers, not more, and effectively change the rules in the middle of the game. this is a critical concern to our members. it could constitute a violation or present possible first amendment issues but would like to work with ftc and others to address this concern and help improve the enforcement regime and protect consumers while getting the widest access to information they need. thank you for holding this hearing. >> great, thank you. we will have questions and we have votes that began in a less than an hour, so hopefully we'll have an opportunity, everyone who's here, to have at least two rounds of questions. i can't figure this out, dr. oz. you know, i get that you do a lot of good on your show. i understand that you give a lot

of information that's great information about health, and you do it in way that's easily understandable but you are very talented. you are very bright. you have been trained in science-based medicine. now, here's three statements you made on your show. you may think magic is make-believe but this little being that scientists think they found the magic weight loss cure for every body type of green coffee extract. quote, i've got the number one miracle in a bottle to burn your fat. it's raspberry tea done. quote it may be the simple solution you've been looking for to bust your body fat for good. i don't get why you need to say this stuff because you know it's not true. so why when you this amazing megaphone and his amazing ability to communicate, why would you cheapen your show by saying things like that?

>> well, if i could disagree about whether they work or not, and i'll move on to the issue of the words that are used, and just with a person with a work or not, take the green coffee and extract as an simple. i'm not going to argue that it would pass fda muster it was a pharmaceutical drug seeking approval, but among financial products that are out there this is a product that is several clinical trials, there's one large one, good old windows done the year we talked about this in 2012. listen speaking i want to know about the clinical drug because billy what i know is 60 people in india that was paid for by the company that was, in fact, the point in time initially talked about this being a miracle, the only study that was out there was the one with 16 people in india that was written up by somebody who's been paid by the company tha that was producing it spent this state argued there was no argued there was no one thing for by the five papers plus a series of basic science papers on it as well. but senator mccaskill, we can

spend a lot of time arguing the merits of with a green coffee extract is worth trying or not worth trying. many other things we argue that you do with regard to your diet are likewise criticize about. should you to a low-fat diet, low carb diet. i spent a good part of my group recommend people of a low-fat diet. we've come full circle now no longer recommended that. many of us who practice medicine because we realized it was a working. it is remarkably complex as you know to figure out what works for most people even in a dietary program. in the practice of medicine we evolve by looking at new ideas, challenging orthodoxy and evolving the. so when i hold, these are the five local papers. we could argue about the quality of them, very justifiably. i could pick apart papers that showed no benefit as well. but at the end of the day if i have critical subject, we'll people having undergone trial and in this case i actually gave it to members of my audience but it was an informal talk, just speed which wouldn't pass --

that's how you did with the audience he would not say it would ever pass scientific muster. >> i would never publish the paper but it wasn't done under the appropriate guidance. the purpose was for me to get a thumbnail sketch, was this worth talking to people about are not? i don't think this out to be a referendum on the use of alternative medical therapies because if that's the case, listen, i've been criticized for having folks, much of talking about the power of prayer. again, as a practitioner i can't prove that per helps people survive in those. i know -- >> you don't have to buy prayer spent that's the difference. prayer is free and that's a very good point. thankfully prayer is free. lot i see in the hospital wing folks are feeling discomfort in the life, and a lot of it is emotional, when have people praying for them it likens their burden. my show was about hope. i wanted, and as you very calmly stated we've engaged millions of people in programs include programs we did with the cdc to get folks to realize that there are giveaways they can rethink

their future, that the best years are behind the. there in front of them. they can lose weight. if i can just get across the big message that i actually do personally believe in th in thes that talk of an issue. i passionately study them. i recognize that oftentimes they do have the scientific muster to present as fact. but nevertheless, i would give my audience the vice i get my family all the time and i've given my family these products, specifically the ones you mentioned. i'm comfortable with that part. where i do think i've made it more difficult for the ftc is an in can't engage viewers i use flowery language. i use language that was very passionate, but ended up being not being helpfully but insincere. it provided fodder for unscrew plus advertisers. and so the clip that you played which is over two years old, and i didn't hundreds of segments since then, we have specifically restricted our use of force. i little enough to do things

that i otherwise would talk about. iis a product i'd never talk to the initial that i cover strong about because i know what will happen. i will say something very passionate we did a show, it was a south american route that had a big study published on a. i think a very high quality study where the show not only did it help you lose weight or poorly help to help the government and women are diabetic. and academic center down there. not done by into. ..

i really implore you to look at the -- i would ask you to look at the list of the ftc put out on the check. it is very simple. causes weight loss 2 pounds or more without diet or exercise comes substantial weight loss no matter how you eat, causes permanent weight loss like you said again for busting your body fat for good. if you look at those seven and spend time on your show telling people that this is the seven things you should know, that there isn't magic and a bottle and there isn't a magic pill and there isn't some kind of magic roots were eyesight berry or

raspberry key tone that is going to all of a sudden make it not matter that you're not moving and eating a lot of sugar and carbohydrates. i mean i -- do you disagree? >> senator mccaskill, i know te seven and i see those on my show all the time. >> then why would you say something is a miracle in a bottle? >> my job on the show is to be a cheerleader for the audience and when they don't think they have hope and can make it happen i looked everywhere including an alternative traditions for any evidence that might be supportive to them. so you pick on the green coffee extract with the amount of information i have one that i still in comfortable telling folks you can buy a reputable version and i say this all the time. i don't sell it and these are not for long-term use and by the way the green coffee extract is an example. it's 1 pound a week over the different trials that have been done to happen to be the same amount of weight lost by the 100 or so folks on the show who came on and have been without a

placebo. it's sort of the same thumbnail to get the idea if you should do the things you do already you can't eat kielbasa and expected to work. as user to follow the things we talk about every single day including all those seven items i think it makes sense. >> i'm going to get time to my colleagues now and hopefully we have a chance to visit with the other witnesses in the next round. i will just tell you that i know you feel you are a victim. sometimes conducted by its being a victim and it's being more careful. maybe you wouldn't be victimized frequently. >> the topics that you mentioned are over 2-years-old. i have not been talking about products in that way for two years and it hasn't changed at all what i'm seeing on the internet and frankly it's getting worse by completely

heating your commentary and i realize my colleagues at the ftc that have made their jobs more difficult that's why i came today. today. i.e. in cheerleading for this process. i will do anything i can to help. but taking away those words doesn't change what has already happened to you >> think you. >> you are the popular person i guess on the witness stand. [laughter] and i just had a group of students outside and they all know who you were. so i asked these students who clearly their parents or someone watch your show and pay attention. let me ask -- what's be clear do you believe there is a miracle pill out of their? >> there's not a pill that is going to help you long-term live your best life without diet and exercise. >> do you believe there is a magic weight loss cure of their? >> -- out there? >> if you are arguing it's going to be like magic if you stop

eating carbohydrates that is a truthful statement. you may not agree with the use of the word magic but it's true as people cutting out carbs will lose weight. >> what works for most people? you mentioned to the chair and what works for most people? >> a diet based on real food out of the ground. it's not been processed. with some physical activity. most of weight loss i believe is about food choices you make and keep your weight was it about the physical activity that you engage in. >> and is it true that you do not endorse any products or receive money from any products? >> that is true. >> now you have work to -- you said you have ideas because you work to stop advertisers from abusing your name and likeness. and in your testimony, you address online advertisements. what would you like to see don? spin it if i can get three ideas i'm trying to be constructive. i think the private sector can help by creating a quick registry to legitimately connect products. i don't happen to have any

products i sell but whether it is the services that are being promised and involved by jimmy fallon and rachael ray and a number of celebrities go on. if all of us made a list of what products we actually do work with it would make it easy for the web hosting services to say doctor oz doesn't have any products he sells so how can they run an advertisement saying that he's selling this? second, we have whistleblower systems that are detecting workplace safety. we have been for the financial services. i think the honest employees deserve the compensation and rewards that they help the legal behavior )-right-paren players. i dusted the scam artists in san diego it might have come forward. in third i would argue that we could create private-sector funded county that might help with getting bounty hunters detected on the web and engaged in the people will have time to desire the knowledge to go after some of these folks. a lot of times, you know, people who are victims of these

infringements, myself included and many people on the panel would love to do anything we can to empower private citizens to shut on the scammers and it doesn't hope the ftc. i think it would be the while noyou're looking at a government-funded of the agency initiatives. >> mr. harold i harrelson what r organization doing to stop these parties from placing the ads on the website and perhaps those ads to the list of people? in th the trust in the advertisement database he is making sure that the internet economy into this vibrant advertising the system. our companies have very sophisticated automated

filtering systems that look for this kind of stuff. and when we do find these type of ads they are automatically removed. even from the systems. in most cases long before they are actually served by or seen by the users. but at the same time, as we are notified and we do see the ads that are on the platforms currently are immediately removed and the advertiser account is removed and appropriate action is taken and wanted. unwanted. >> thank you mr. chairman. >> senator klobuchar. >> thank you for holding this hearing and thank you to all of you. yesterday i looked up the top selling weight-loss products on amazon. and even with the ftc's actions against green coffee marketers, green coffee is still a product in the top 20 selling products. the rest of the products are currently garcinia cambodia which i understand was related on your show but it was also

highlighted as a product in thad advertisers used tinadvertisersm consumers by creating a fake website claiming to be women's health magazine. when it was on your show did you talk about the side effects? and i know senator mccaskill has questioned the about link about this and you said this was all two years ago. you are not making these claims anymore. but did you talk about the side effects than and did the deceptive practices in coming out of that change how you conducted your show? >> highbrow transcripts of the different shows and in each case we would each have an expert who spent our entire life dealing with dietary supplements and talandtalk about the different products. they review the pluses and minuses and i just went through a few of these pages. but i look at the scripts and i think i wish they would play another 30 seconds of the clip they used for the advertisements that we see on the left.

so as an example, the garcinia show -- i'm going to see this and i'm not making stuff are selling stuff. i'm not going to mention any brands to you either i don't want you to control. i bring that up and by the way elsewhere in the segment i also talk specifically about the fact if you don't exercise and diet at the same time it's not going to work. you know, folks, is a pill. don't go thinking it's just a pill. it doesn't help you. but together with a normal natural things we tell you to do with the food you eat it will live a healthy lifestyle etc.. so we make those points. you know the biggest disservice i've done for my audience? it isn't the flowery language that senator is criticizing me for. it's that i never told them where to go to buy the products. i wanted to stay above the fray. and i felt in my own mind if i talked about the specific companies selling high-quality products that would seem like i was supporting those companies. and so i never gave them, the audience an idea of where to go

to buy this stuff. so that opened up a huge market for folks to just make the real stuff it doesn't freaking matter and stir to use my name to trick us all. i left my audience hanging thinking i was doing the ethical thing. and i certainly belief if i had gone on and called it a miracle command again, i'm not -- it's not a miracle like it's coming you know, you are going to go to work everyday for the rest of your life that if it is a miracle out of there we don't know about it. if i told them to go by these four companies products because they are reputable, it would have killed us off. >> [inaudible] >> i thought that it was commercial. but if i -- a doctor shouldn't sell products. you wouldn't trust me if you came to me for advice and i said you know, senator, you've got a stub toe. take my version of the screen. it doesn't sound and feel right to me. you know, i feel in the internet age taking a break and mortar approach doesn't work. and i should have been savvy enough to say to myself, and i kick myself and may in future but i usually see here are the

companies i trust. buy their products because they aren't going to scam you or make it legal claims. if i say that it helps you lose a pound a week for eight weeks, which is what a trial says and then someone takes that and changes it to, you know, 40 pounds in three weeks it hurts me and part of the reason i came today this is a huge problem for me. >> someone that has seen these ads they are very seductive when you are looking through things trying to figure out when the diet plan to go on you don't talk about these things are going to be susceptible to these kind of scams. right now isn' it isn't workingd obviously you are not the only celebrity. if you have enough resources to go after this and the idea that you shouldn't just be focused on the fly-by-night or what do we need to do here to get a handle

on this. we do pursue both fly-by-night companies and through our established companies. in the coffee case i mentioned it was pretty much a fly-by-night company. we also pursued 11 different companies that were selling the weight-loss products and some of the other more established. so we do it across the board unfortunately. these cases can be time intensive to investigate and we do look at the studies that are out there very carefully and we hire experts. often the defendants will hire experts. we pay a lot of close attention. we want to be sure where the

science is. do you think there should be more regulation of the supplements will that be helpful beyond the advertising and i know we have had some folks on this and disgusted in congress. they had their hands full in the adult rated products they take a number of actions against weight-loss products that absolutely convey perception drugs in them and they are putting their resources there. >> do you think we are just looking at a celebrity list of advertisements people are falsely relying on the claims that aren't true. >> i think it will be helpful for the approach taken by the.

i think the media could do a better job of screening out these evolved claims and we are hopeful that they will work with us to better disseminate to that and get that message across and help eliminate some of these ads that are running. >> i know you've taken a lot of action against various companies and some of them fly-by-night. but what about the media outlets that run these ads? you all have never gone there talk about that. it's particularly using a lot of fraudulent advertising that appears to be fraudulent on its

face but yet they are not screening them out. why no enforcement action there tax >> the media enjoys amendment protections. if we were certainly to attempt to sue the media company for running the deceptive ad terry at section 12 does give us the authority to pursue any entity that has a misleading ad for a food or drug or device or cosmetic. but we have really thought that it would make more sense to work with the media voluntarily cooperatively to abide by issuing this guide that we issued this year was a reissuance of the guide back in 2003. we had good success at that time particularly with the magazines and getting them to stop running ads containing these seven spatially false claims. and we think it makes more sense for us to try to work voluntarily with the media.

>> i know you've said that some media have done a sophisticated job of screening and some haven't. who is doing a good job here and who's doing a bad job? >> is largely varies by the size of the media. the national broadcast media historically has had very rigorous and screening programs so you wouldn't see the type that you are showing today on the national advertising part of the media. >> about the national -- the interesting thing is the national broadcasting company's own a lot of the cable stations these ads are appearing on. the same ownership. >> and the screening that is done for the affiliates and the cable channels very. and then when you get down to the smaller media and radio is a good example. it's a local media. the advertising staff are pretty

small and that is something like what the ftc has done with the seven claims that even an ad buyer and a very small media could sit and look at the seven claims and say you know, yes for this and know for that. the claim that you are never going to have to dye it again. or you can eat all you want and take this pill. you know, those claims we still see. and they shouldn't be getting on the media at all. >> about satellite radio is not local. and they are all over satellite radio. >> there have been a number of changes in the technology that the industry needs to catch up with you are exactly right. >> you didn't want to see satellite radio. you just waited for me to say it. [laughter] i do think that there is a problem there. >> and just -- there are two

things to look at the media screening. one is the traditional site of screening that the broadcast networks do. second is the program mr. harrelson talked about which is trying to translate that to the new media and look at these claims not only text basis but in almost all of it on basis and that is an area that has a lot of promise for real progress. the talk of little bit about the fly-by-night. i think that the doctors point that it's easier to go after blocks and sensa that have buildings and are actually manufacturing something and putting their label on it than these post office boxes and that is one of our conundrums and consumer protection and the in e subcommittee. so many hearings we have had whether it is the robo calls or other topics that we have had hearings on finding the p.o. box

or finding the ip address and taking action against those that are responsible it's very complicated in this world specially when you are looking at technology in terms of ip addresses that certainly many of them are not cited in this country. tell me about what kind of resources you may need that you don't have two do a better job after the fly-by-night. >> when you see an ad on the internet -- for us the first thing is to figure out who is behind the ad. and it's not actually easy to do. what we are seeing a lot of nowadays is that, you know, some companies will look at the number of affiliate marketers and affiliate networks coming at us if there is a whole host of different companies that are actually placing the little ads and when the consumer clicks on it one little trip to a flat belly or something like that, one trip to lose weight,

something like that. if the consumer clicks on it than that affiliate gets paid but that is in the company selling the product. there is another company behind the product and it requires us to send out multiple rounds of subpoenas to the web posters and to the networks to try to figure out who is behind this and then that is what we get on the ice i.e. -- acia very. >> what about the marketers and the middlemen have you gone after the middleman that is actually just the affiliates that you talk about are actually the ones that are using these ads around the internet and then they are a conduit to the actual product company that is behind the curtain and have you taken action against those folks that are actually placing the one secret to get rid of your belly

fat? >> yes we have gone after affiliates and one of them that as there has gone after the large affiliates that one of them there is we never know how big the company is. >> senator mccaskill can i ask for small fraud committed system was 100 offices around the country gets about a million complaints and provides the service for consumers where you can go and check and see what types of complaints were getting and as i said in my testimony. in the negative option of the shipping policies coming even the st. louis bureau had one of the companies that was building people sort of randomly for the

products. to see what type of complaint history this happens will help. it won't eliminate, but it will help protect them. >> i want to know a little bit more about your recent consent orders that announces that a part of the operation of the part of the failed resolution. the ftc is now barring the defendants from making certain claims unless they have at least two adequate and well controlled clinical studies. is that accurate? >> yes. those cases require the companies under the order to have at least two well controlled studies to support the weight-loss claims going forward. >> it's my understanding that they've also tried to apply that elsewhere. and even thoug though there is e current guidelines in the agency that states determining whether the competent and reliable

scientific evidence exists is a flexible and fact specific inquiry. you have conflicts or i guess the question is are you applying this new standard elsewhere and is there a conflict in some of the regulations your trying to enforce? >> i don't see any conflict. the basic law is companies must have a reasonable basis for the advertising claims they make at the time they make those claims. what constitutes a reasonable basis will depend on the product into the claim. in the case of the products that promise health benefit, the commission requires competent and reliable scientific evidence. and then again, what constitutes the competent and reliable scientific evidence will vary depending upon the claims. so, for example, the claim that a product with present cancer -- products with present cancer than a claim that a product will smooth dry skin. so in the case of weight-loss

products in particular come of it based on the factors that we consider in consultation with experts we have determined that randomized controlled clinical studies are needed in order to substantiated claim that he given product will cause weight loss. the commission has required two of the studies and its orders. now it's not -- i'm not saying that if a company can to us and had one good study on weight-loss we would say that claim is not substantiated but once we have determined that the company has violated the act and has made unsubstantiated weight-loss claims and are under order we've put in a requirement that going forward they should have to studies and these kind of studies for weight-loss do not need to be particularly long-term and not particularly expensive relative to the amount of money that can be made for these products and given the level of fraud we have seen this area is important to have the extra assurance of the second

study to assure that this is a real result and this wasn't due to some fluke or something like that in a study. >> was talk about your dietary supplement for guidelines. we have not revised or repudiated those guidelines even though there is some parts of those guidelines that appear to be inconsistent with the ftc current stance as we just mentioned about the competent and reliable scientific evidence. do you see it that way? >> i don't see a conflict because the guidelines are written broadly to cover the full range of dietary supplements that may be offered and the full range of the claims that may be made for them so the guidance if it were broadly and then again when we are in the context of the specific case and a specific investigation of a product, we know what claims were made for them and what the ingredients are and then we have a record on which to base the order requirements for the substantiation for the claims going forward.

>> is there any intention of modifying those guidelines? >> there has been a discussion in looking at them. they are i think 13-years-old now maybe to see what and if they need to be freshened up. but again i don't think there's a conflict between what they say at all and what we are doing in our orders. >> thank you. >> thank you. and i want to talk to you a little bit about the work that you are doing. and i was just looking at my twitter account and found about four of these ads about these things. how many cups of coffee i can drink in one day. that was pretty good. and various other things. fat melting and other things. and i understand that your member company printed concurrently suspends the severity of the advertising of the policy that is high. what does that mean and how many have been permanently suspended. are there temporary suspensions

and how do you handle this? >> every company that is within trust has different approaches and policies in place. >> if there are multiple violations there are options where the member companies made to make sure that it's in compliance with the ad policies. there's the option tthere is the those ads and the third option certainly for the egregious violations to suspend the advertiser accounts. but interesting enough, some of the sophisticated scammers will immediately try to open up new accounts and push their ads in the filtering systems so it becomes a little bit of a cat and mouse game. >> would you say that it's easy to target the vulnerable population through online advertising into some of the more traditional methods and do

you think more online companies are going to be -- i think it is a personal message to them. these are often just from people. >> i think these types of scams attract the largest constituencies as possible. be it weight loss, hair loss, whatever you name it. and again i think that we are seeing these types of ads across the board. both in print and in print media and online. >> about the protection of the data. more and more we are using the data collection and things like thafit bit. of course people are getting all of their data collected now through this and it's been actually pretty interesting to view the self-motivation and our companies are protecting the consumer data to make sure that it doesn't fall into the hands of scammers and what's going on

in that front? >> well, for example i'm not familiar with the data that is on the device on your wrist. but it's -- i am a little -- can you repeat the question? >> it's about more and more that either that has gone online. people are entering things and just like they are entering another things. has there been an effort in your company to look at how you are going to protect that he got and maybe someone else can better answer that. >> while again, to my knowledge i don't believe that there are member companies that are collecting third-party data to help the related devices and whatever the case may be. >> in a way that some of them are collecting it so you can get the pop-up ads about things related to it.

in the digital advertising alliance that was looking at the question of the collection of data across the science and doing some pretty significant binary work the organization was formed early at the request of the federal trade commission to look at exactly those issues. the specific issue that you're talking about which is a special restrictions on the sensitive data about health. this is one of the things that is still under development. it is a fairly tricky issue to get everybody in the industry on board with that there is an organization that's been formed and working very effectively and working at all of those issues. >> i'm thinking about all of the money that has been spent on these products as people are desperately looking at ways to lose weight. and yes since the 1960s adult obesity has more than doubled, leading to health care challenges for our country as we know.

we know some of these diets are legitimate and are well researched and some of them aren't. but what really bothers me to the core is that while for the first time that we saw the availing out for kids and not really a big reduction but a leveling out of the increasing obesity is in this last year, we are hoping that some are having to do with the work the first lady and the work of some of the school lunch programs, which i don't think that we should be rolling back the standards but that is a whole other topic. what do you think that we should be doing to really get people able to spend their money on what works and what doesn't? we have to admit that we have a major problem when people are spending more and more money and they are gaining more and more weight. >> that is precisely the advertisers that sell car market products and one advertiser that comes to mind .-full-stop this -- on yourself if this equipment it is very clear that you have to have a dedicated regime.

we are going after the fraudulent products and that is where i keep going back to not just the advertising but the fda and trying to get some of them off of the market. >> anand i can do. a big role -- and i think there is a big role that two thirds of the table is talking about and play fo with the resources of te government has. because what we see is a lot of cases where we contact the advertiser and we find it fair fairly. we have a high record of success and that maybe fewer cases the fda or the ftc have to deal wi

with. one thing that makes it difficult is the fact that a lot of these -- isn't it legal to sell the product. it's when you are doing it under false claims that really some of the claims were fraudulent violate the policy that again makes it difficult to substantiate the good advertisers versus the bad advertisers. we are trying to circumstance to get their ads online. >> very good. >> well to me we need more standards and resources and we appreciate your efforts. >> i want to pursue a question that senator klobuchar raised. i understand about.

that's perhaps it's a mistake. so i'm wondering what you consider creating a sort of master list of brands that would be helpful to consumers? because after all you have the events in the voice and the credibility that would be helpful to consumers if you created such a master list of brands that you feel work and are helpful. >> i would love to do that and i have been speaking to people who i trust in the industry about how to go about it. latest estimates and i would offer others probably 80% of the products that are made by 20% of the companies are high quality, reputable products by people who really do their homework. and our audited in many different ways. good manufacturing and the like. and 20% of the products are made by a lot of the companies area they are at the 80%.

they really aren't that good. they are fly-by-night. the quality issues are a major concern into the p.o. box for an example that was given to us is when i busted these folks in san diego i went to their listed address and the p.o. box. so, you could really never find anybody. so, i have been actively looking about. with your suggestion and support i think i'm going to do it and i think that it will do a lot to drain the swamp that we have created around this area. >> i would encourage you to do a draining the swamp which is really important in this area as you know and i think many of us know i was the attorney general of the state for 20 years and i get a lot of work in this area. and if there is any area where consumers are mostly susceptible and vulnerable and misleading and false pitches i think it is this one because there hopes are

so high and their needs are often great. so i think i would b it would ba welcoming development. i would introduce a measure called the dietary supplement labeling act along with senator durbin last august. and this would require dietary supplement manufacturers to register their products with the fda and disclose the known risk of their ingredients on the product label. and i think that this kind of measure is crucial to provide information and consumers regarding the dietary supplement and help the fda to identify potential health concerns. and as you suggested, a master list of celebrity endorsements might be helpful to identify the body of leaders and the bill would create a master list of dietary supplements. it could cause adverse effects to help consumers understand the risk. what are your thoughts?

they are ofte often at alteratie even though they claim that they are not working that way. that has been a proven way of getting weight loss. if you put a type of product in the drug and it worked with weight loss but it is too great for us to tolerate that is a population. >> that meant that weight-loss may actually be unhelpful. >> or it's been proven to be unhelpful which is why they've pulled the products off the market. that's also part of the challenge that we face. we are anytime in our history that we are getting closer to having the fda approved drugs. but we have had very few for many years. succumb as we get better perception products that would be effective, then more medicine would return in a direction. but given the very basic techniques that we have in the bariatric surgery which are underperformed in the country is very effective.

even if you are 100 pounds overweight at age 50 have you the same mortality rate as if you have cancer. so these are desperate situations with desperate people working for solutions and that is a recipe for problems. so, i strongly support the need to look at whether the products are safe or not. not. and the othenot. any other site of depletion is to try to find ways of getting people ideas that they can use to jumpstart their way back. >> let me ask you with the ftc find that kind of a list hopeful? >> while the commission hasn't taken a look on that legislation. i'm speaking for myself. i think it could be helpful. i think it could be helpful to the fda certainly in the law-enforcement efforts and in providing consumers with useful information. >> thank you. thank you all for being here. and thank you all for your great work. i just want to briefly follow up. i don't do with anyone else has a follow-up. i want to make sure -- i appreciate, doctor oz, that we

have covered a lot of ground this morning. and a significant part of it was about some of your language that you have used in association with some of these products on your show. you indicated the products i talked about in my previous questioning that those shows were a couple of years ago. well, three weeks ago i quoted you. they literally flushed fat from your system. what can every time you cheat on your diet i want you to grab one of these tiny pills. this tiny tablets can push a lot of fat out of your belly. people want to believe they can take a little help to push fat out of their body. they want to be me that. it seems to me that if you set everything you cheat on your diet i want you to take a walk that would eliminate the problem that is at the root of the hearing today. that is that your credibility is

being maligned by fraudsters, and frankly being threatened by the notion that anybody can take an itty-bitty pill to flush fat out of their system. in january you called it lightning in a bottle. and a miracle flower to fight fat. that was just in january. so, i really hope -- i know that you know how much power you have. i know that you know that. you are very powerful. and with power comes a great deal of response ability. and i know you take it seriously and i know that you care about your listening audience and your viewing audience and about america's health. and you are he made an example of today because of the power that you have in this space. and we didn't call this hearing to beat up on you. but we did call this hearing to talk about a real crisis and

consumer protection. and you can either be a part of the police here or you can be a part of the problem and we are just hopeful that he will do a better job of being a part of the relief. >> i came here because i want to be part of the solution. you mentioned it is basically a fiber. we know that fiber when taken correctly has been a very effective who weight-loss for the reasons i stated. your comments about the language i use is well heard. and i appreciate it. i hosted a daytime television show where i feel the need to bring passion to people's lives about what they can do. and i'm very respectful of the fact that when it is used -- and it has been used as a way of defrauding people that it is a harmful process and i appreciate your kind words about the power that i have. in a situation where i am second guessing every word i use on the show right now.

fbx is used by my family. i do think it's important and i think that if you cheat that's why i tell people to eat vegetables when they go out for a big deal because it serves that very purpose. succumb i -- so i have things i think work for people and i want him to try them to feel better so they can keep doing other things that we spend every single day on the show talking about. and when i feel as a host of a show that i can't use that words that are excellent exculpatory i got my power is given away to help people. you don't want to be in the pulpit talking about how passionate you are about life and thinking if i use that word it's good to be quoted back to me in just 100 words about it are doing things right, so i'm very respectful i heard the message. i told my colleagues at the ftc i get it. >> i went to see all of the

passion and the beauty of a walk at sunset. [laughter] >> okay. >> and how you feel when you get off of the bike in the morning. no one is telling you not to use passion. the passion in connection with the word miracle pill and weight-loss is a recipe for disaster in this environment in terms of the people who are looking for an easy fix and getting sometimes i think delusional about whether or not an easy fix is going to be there for them. i appreciate everyone being here. does anyone have anything else? >> i was going to say that we all experience the feeling of any word that can be taken out of context. we can kind of relate to this. but at the same time, in addition to being a celebrity come you are a doctor and i believe doctors have a duty as we leave that we have to represent the people that we represent and you have the duty to give them the best evidence and when stuff is being taken out of context like it has or you have admitted making

mistakes and how you described a few things i think you have a duty to correct that record and then be careful going forward because if you use your knowledge and your celebrity status to do good things for the white house seems to me like we are going in the opposite way. >> but senator, just again i don't want to rehash this come about as , thatas a good example show around how the green coffee bean extract and the way that it was described wasn't the right way to do it. in fact i brought audience members and whmembers included h program to sort of see if it worked or not. it has no impact. the things i have said it continued to be used. >> about debunking some of this is helpful and the emphasis on what works best. and you know better than us so we would appreciate if you would keep focusing on that. >> if you ever need anyone to tell him. >> i know who to call. >> we have a few takers. >> thank you senator blumenthal.

[inaudible conversations]

>> via toshiba are to be given as to the american taxpayer, not to the government agency that is abusing its power. i am sitting here listening to this testimony and i just i

don't believe it. that's your problem. nobody beliefs you. the internal revenue service comes to congress a couple years ago and misleads us and says no target is occurring and then they said it was a few rogue agents in cincinnati than they said it was also an progressive. all of those things have been proven on true. this committee sent a criminal referral possible criminal wrongdoing and we've heard nothing. you buried in a 27 page letter to the senate asking for them to conclude the investigation that you've lost lois lerner's e-mails during the time in question because of a hard drive crash. monday hour investigators asked your agency or any other hard drives crashed and we were six other hard drives of the people that were investigating that were involved. you didn't tell us about.

>> we told you on monday. and what did you do? think because we asked you. >> and what did you do with that information? >> you told us because we asked you whether any other hard drives crashed. this is unbelievable. you told us that you were going to give us all of lois lerner's e-mails and you learned in february that it is crashed. >> i didn't learn in february -- >> i'm not asking a question i am making a statement. >> my apologies. >> you were the internal revenue service. you can reach into the lives of hard-working taxpayers in with a phone call or e-mail or letter can turn their lives upside down. you ask taxpayers to hand in seven years of their personal tax information in case they are ever audited and you can't keep six months worth of employees e-mails? and now that we are seeing this investigation, you don't have the e-mails? the hard drives crashed.

you learned about this and we have to ask you on monday? this isn't being forthcoming. this is being misleading again. this is a pattern of abuse. a pattern of behavior that isn't giving us any confidence that this agency is being impartial. i don't believe you. this isn't credible. >> i have a long career and that is the first time anybody has said they don't believe me. >> i don't believe you. >> that's fine. i'm willing to stand on the record and remind you that it wasn't buried and 27 pages. most of the 27 pages of exhibits when asked about the custodians we advise you -- >> being forthcoming -- ian forthcoming as to say -- you know what investigators the congress is investigating -- >> let him answer the question. >> i didn't ask him a question. >> that was some of the hearing from earlier today.

we will show you more tonight at 8:00 eastern time on the companion network c-span. share your thoughts on the missing e-mails with other viewers. you can go to c-span facebook page or over twitter using the hash tag c-span chat. earlier this week the ceo of general motors testified again on capitol hill. she appeared before the house subcommittee to testify on the company's recall of cars with faulty ignition switches and she vowed to make changes. you can hear the testimony from ms. barra and the company hired to conduct an internal investigation. we will have that sunday morning at 10:30 eastern also on c-span. >> the thesis of the book is that there is a whole group of people in america can in fact a big swath of america that is being ignored, left behind, not included in the discussion. i think for either party. particularly though i would

argue the republican party. and i called the him the blue-cr conservatives. you know, the folks that are working people most of whom do not have college degrees and folks that have really still understand the value of work and the importance of work and responsibility and people that understand the importance of family and faith and belief in free limited government. you say those are conservative republican voters and in many cases they are not because they don't really see either party talking to them about concerns they have in trying to create an opportunity for them to live the american dream.

ohio senator rob portman and chris van hollen outflank conflicting budget priorities earlier this week. they disagreed on which federal

programs should be funded that both believe the congress will avoid another government shutdown. senator portman is a member of the budget and finance committees and the congressman van hollen is the ranking member on the budget committee. >> hello everybody. welcome to the national press club where news is made. i and the newsmakers committee events coordinator for today's bipartisan, bicameral news conference by the two national leaders on the federal budget future. the two speakers will address future federal budget priorities and methods to achieve them. they will cover areas the budget should attend to, programs that should or should not be funded and to what extent the usefulness and the future of the shutdowns and sequestration, strategies for by partisan cooperation and action and the projected timeline all in an hour. [laughter] >> we think they will indeed make news by telling us what they think will happen and when

and what they think will not happen. how does this budget process work anyway? maybe they can tell the american people who have seen what to them looks like chaos. and candid and will be improved in the near future? so, that is a lot to cover in an hour. or to expert leaders will speak for ten to 15 minutes followed by questions and the media and club members. now i will introduce the two speakers. congressman chris van hollen is the ranking minority member leading to the democratic leader of the house budget committee. he was elected to the congress in 2002 and beat some very well-known people with big legacies. in addition to the representing of the eighth district in maryland and serving in the house leadership, the congressman van hollen was elected by his colleagues in 2012 to serve as the second term

top democrat on the budget committee. in this position he serves as the key point person on the budget and economic education in the house for the democratic party. the "washington post" describes chris as a bona fide budget expert. and the la times says that he's among the best budget minded. rollcall has noted -- which is here today, that he gets the near universal respect from his colleagues for his intellectual firepower and accommodation of policy and political shots. i think a few years ago we called chris a rising star. now he's just a star. congressman van hollen was recognized by washingtonian magazine as the best natural area members of congress. and as the best local elected official by bethesda magazine. there may be some in congress today who have recently lost elections will tell you just how important that local service recognition can be. chris also played an integral role in the effort has confidence of healthcare reform and fought to ensure that young

adults received expanded access. he continues to lead the fight for the closed act to end secret money and champion bills on the lobbying disclosure reform in whistleblower protections that were enacted. he has a stronger ground in national security policy. they he also worked as an attorney in private practice for ten years. he's a graduate of sophomore college and the john f. kennedy. he lives in kensington maryland with his wife catherine and his three children. rob portman as the united states senator from ohio. he was elected in 2010 running the campaign that focused on the

conservative ideas to create jobs and get the deficit under control he was born and raised in cincinnati where he lives today with his wife and his three children. they started a company where rob and his brother and sister worked while growing up. they built the business from the small dealership with five employees with his mom as the bookkeeper to the one that employed more than 300 people. he became a lawyer had developed his own private practice representing small businesses. in 1993 rob was a partner in a cincinnati law firm when he was elected to congress when he thee represented the diapers seven county to strict in southern ohio. he served for 12 years and off of seven elections he never received less than 70% of the

vote. during his time in congress committee was actively involved in crafting the historic of their reform efforts. and he was an advocate of the balanced budget bill that passed in 1997. he gained the respective vote of the republican colleagues to the successful bipartisan legislative initiatives including measures he offered to increase retirement savings on a reform irs and add over 50 new taxpayer rights, curb unfunded mandates, reduce taxes, and expand druexpanddrug preventiona conservation effort. in the spirit of disclosure for the drug coalition house member when i was the white house drug office or -- drug officer when we had an event together in ohio when we first met and became friends and now the senator represents my alma mater college. in 2005, he left congress when he was asked by president george w. bush to serve as the united states trade representative, the cabinet level official responsible for u.s. trade

policy. .. immensely helpful and also have the kind of bipartisanship we