patient projecting on the screen. the committee reviews actually all the components of the care, looks at the follow-up, looks at when appointments were scheduled and so forth, and then an assessment of did the doctor do the right thing? people are rated on a peer review scale of 1, 2 or 3. 3 is if the case should have been handled differently, 2 if it might have been handled differently, 1 if people felt it was meeting the general standard of care. if the provider has a level 3, they are counseled about that, and if there is more than one level 3, there is an intervention program followed and a program put in place. >> any firings taking place? i can say that there are situations in which you would have. >> thank you very much. dr. sherin when i was deployed i was concerned that those who receive no mail during an entire

year and i always try to encourage people at home to send the soldier something and i wondered what happened to them when they went home. you know, which leads me to i just want your opinion real quick. the idea of when you were getting a guard and reserve go home. active duty go back to a base as opposed to an opportunity for consultation for the guard and reserve of what you doing when you go home? web activity are you engaging in because to me the worst week was the first week home when i did nothing and then i went back and saw patients again. so do you think that would be beneficial? you are not coming home to praise and there's not a lot of jobs. >> i think i may have missed the question but what we try to do in the community is to generate lots of opportunities and one of the key features of opportunities is, involves

kinship, support relationships, community. we look at individuals in terms of their well-being and in order to have well-being yeah in need emotional health. you need physical health. unique intellectual health. you need a community and innate spiritual health. those are the targets that we look at in the volunteers of erica erica and one of the things we are trying to push out is a lot more recreational occupational type activities that bring people together and help them knit that community fabric together for the reasons you point out. >> that answers my question. it was really the question do you see the great body wanat and i appreciated i yield back. >> thank you and mr. o'rourke for five minutes. >> thank you mr. chairman and i would like to thank the panel is for their service and mr. goldstein the american

legion and mr. britain to set up a command center to connect veterans there with health services like those we are talking about today as well's benefits and by every measure most important way in talking directly with veterans it was very successful so i want to thank you and i want to thank dr. mccarthy. she mentioned the mobile vet center and other resources that are being directed to el paso all of which i think should tell us that we have a problem in el paso that we are now belatedly trying to correct into six. during that time when especially access to mental health care was so problematic i had the opportunity to meet a young veteran named nick and his mom bonnie who came to a town hall meeting at mine. nick was having a hard time accessing mental health care services at the el paso va and shared that with me and my team but also with their to hear

veterans who served as far back as korea and vietnam and the gulf war, share their frustration with not being able to get into the va. as you was driving home with his mom, bonnie from our town hall that night in september he said you know i'm having a hard time getting in and i'm a young veteran. some of these guys have been trying for years and can't get in. and for five days later nick killed himself area and i have got to connect the lack of access, the delay in care which turns into denial of care to nick's death. it is because i feel partially responsible and in that time the el paso vha in the national dha were telling me things were under control and as recently as may 9 of this year the director of vha told me there was zero

days way time on average for a veteran seeking mental health care access in el paso and when i take that to mean is no veteran waited more than 14 days to do that. the discrepancies between what we are hearing from people like mr. d'amico and the va were so great that as i have told this committee before we initiated our own survey of meth mouth health weights and on the average was 71 days. like dr. matthews told us earlier this week 40% of veterans stopped trying to seek mental health care because it was too frustrating and fully 36%, one third could not get appointments at all. and so i want to ask you if you had known that the average wait time was 71 days or as your own vha bought it -- audit found 60 days but much longer than 14 days, if you knew as we know now that we have the worst way times in the country for access to mental-health care for veterans,

the worst as of june, what would you have done differently? he said in your opening testimony we are fully committed to providing accessible. you obviously didn't happen in el paso. if you have no miss what would you have done differently? >> congressman or work i had the opportunity to visit el paso. i i had a visit there in june the 16th and 17th. what has happened in el paso is tragic. there were five psychiatrists that left all wants. that left a huge hole in the ability for them to continue to provide mental health care. >> here's what i'm trying to ask you because i have limited time. but the va was telling me and perhaps you and the veterans in el paso was one thing which turned out to be andrew and was very different from what reality was which was that there was terrible, terrible access to care for veterans who could get it in one third could not get

into mental health care at all. so if you had known that in september 2013 what would you have done differently? >> i would have assisted deal with the huge implication of the resources but also telemental health services. i continue to provide care at the va central office by telemedicine and that's the kind of thing we can help for places that are having a hard time recruiting so deploying a system of being able to help. >> you would have expanded capacity. we would have had greater capacity and people like nick could've gotten in to see somebody. so given the fact that we were not told what the real conditions were and certainly the va in el paso in the va in washington d.c. director reported different numbers to mean to the veterans in our community. who is accountable for that? what are the consequences? who is responsible?

>> are not prepared to answer that question. i'm sorry. i will be happy to take the win for the record. >> that is my case in point. you can tell me who's accountable. there are no consequences for veterans dying. nothing is going to change as long as we still have the same entelechy and culture at the va which you simplify today in your testimony. the fact do you cannot tell me who is accountable for this, that there are no consequences that you agree if you had known the truth he would have done something different and people would have supplied -- survived who are now dead and yet there is no consequences. i appreciate the additional providers and your flight to el paso in mid-june but unless we change the culture at va this is going to be a temporary fix that will not last. >> ia. >> thank you very much and mr. jolly were recognized for five minutes. >> why are you pessimistic about the va embracing -- it was your

statement, not mine by the way. >> no, it's a great question that you asked me. i just think on the disks. so sir that we have had in regards to trying to bring it in as an alternative therapy along with these other issues that we are talking about alternative therapies, i believe because i an eternal optimist that the pessimism i have about the va they will be pulled into it because what's happening here and what we are able to be successful with that the department of defense and the military right now because they are clamoring for art therapy because it works particularly in the early stages of special operations command. those warriors are having multiple deployments and going back. they have sought art therapy. it's been very successful. it returns them to the fight for special operators and i believe that whole mechanism within dod

will result in eventually being mainstreamed into the va if we pull all these together alternative therapies. so that's the reason sir. >> dr. mccarthy is there something that stands in the w way? you have a major research university partner ready to collaborate with the peer review alternative therapy. what stands in the way between the va embracing that? generally? i mean is that bureaucracy? is a regulation? is that funding? visit institute to buy his? >> i'm sorry, i don't have an exact answer to that. i would really be happy to review the program and understand it and then understand that the barriers might be in order to make those implementations. i personally don't know. >> and i guess i'm just asking a general question. we hear all about these alternative therapies that are available in these

nonpharmaceutical therapies are available that work. in my previous profession i try to work with the va research department on regenerative medicine proposal that was discovered at a nonva center and i came up against a bias of not wanting to be too tied to extra merrill research and therapies. i'm just asking an assessment at his there at institutional bias against extra merrill research and solutions? >> i would not say that there's an institutional bias. what i can say is va funds in particular inter-merrill research and some of our provider certainly have funded externally but we don't tend to fund external research to fund that is to partner with someone in the va and then it would become intramural and that would be what would allow the funding. >> on nondrug therapies are there any pertinent regulations that control how a va physician

counsels a patient on pharmaceutical therapies versus nonpharmaceutical therapies that is dictated by other medical standards or are their va regulations that address back? >> congressman it's an important question. i think the standard with within mental health care for va treatment is to provide the care that make sense for the veteran at the veterans point in life. we offer their recovery model which would include a range of evidence-based psychotherapies and evidence-based psychopharmacology is supported by complementary and alternative medicine approaches but it's to be an integrative package of care that make sense for the veteran at that particular point in their life. so it doesn't bias against anyone of those are towards any one of those. >> i have a capacity question which is when it does come to

some of the pharmaceuticals the first 30 or 60 days and again i'm not a doctor but i know it's critical when you begin arrangement are the frankly when you switch metis patients because dod or va. is there more precise oversight or care provided to the patient or is there different follow-up with patients in those first 30 days or 60 days that they begin pharmaceutical regiment? >> clearly it's the expectation that people are monitored more carefully as you are making changes either initiating therapy or making increases in doses, yes. >> one last question dr. steele quickly. you have it in his distinguished career working in b.a.. are there areas where dod and va the transition all of this together given your career experience now at the research university one or two things quickly that you would say that the game changers?

>> the first is accountability and acceptance of responsibility are the game changers. the separation from active duty to the va system is such that it needs to have all this cohesiveness to be able to ensure that everything is transferred over all to hit the discussions we have had, it's all transferred over. if we could get legislation that does that and to ensure that there's transparency and openness i think we have a great chance to be able to have a major game change in all this. >> thank you very much. >> thank you. mr. walz you are recognized. >> thank you mr. chairman for holding the hearing and to each of you and i was going to say dr. mccarthy i was going to say it's not personal but i got to thinking enough that's not true there's nothing more personal than this. we had daniel and brian and klay of this is pretty personal stuff. the thing i'm most amazed about is i'm amazed at the lack of

anticipating what's going to be asked of you when you come here and it shows me it's a lack of self-reflection on this. i could've anticipated the question the chairman was going to ask. you probably could anticipate what i'm going to ask because i asked it to everyone who sat here and yet it might be symptomatic that why would we go and look? my answer is to you because we are reflecting what the public is telling us. if this place is working correctly we should be marrying and channeling that so i guess that's the most disillusioned. again i along with umn eternal optimist. nothing matters but results. nothing matters except to get this fixed right. the american public is behind us and getting that right. here's what i caution all of the love, people have sat there and offered of good suggestions and we than kosovars getting things into place of dr. carol at the can answer a few questions now.

here's what the loss of that is required of you in carrying out the comprehensive program best practices in prevention. research to be conducted in a consultation with the heads of the following entities that a person of human services. what have you done with them? >> sir we are in partnership department of health and human services and dod and to the national action alliance on suicide prevention. >> what. >> what has come out that an concrete results and implementation that went forward? >> the education of the suicide prevention coordinators provided at the va medical center provided veteran server in this organization to veterans groups, two veteran providers as well as all va, dha and epa. >> how the measure that because you are are responsible in carrying out the plan the secretary should provide outreach for education of veterans of operation iraqi

freedom and enduring freedom of these veterans. educate to promote medical health -- mental health to promote skills for coping with mental illness identifying signs of encouraging veterans. you just heard a family say that they didn't hear a dam thing for you. >> we have failed his these family sir. there's no question about it. our suicide prevention campaign last year was called stand by them and i was specifically aimed towards veterans and people in the community to stand by veterans and to reach out and to support them and to look for the signs of suicide and to encourage to get them in to care. our suicide prevention coordinators at everest d.a.'s center to five hour reached at events to communities veterans service organizations. >> what does this or support council program look like? are you encouraging people to come in to peer?

>> peer support is one of the most peer support providers over the last year. they are veterans. they are veterans who are in recovery from a situation in their own lives. we are either trained or certified his peer support supervisors. they are deployed across va medical centers. we need more of them. we wanted to be in primary care as well as an mental health programs. they are just formative force an organization. >> so we have some things out there and i bring this up because we are going to have to see how this implements moving forward as we start to do things. i fall into this camp and i think dr. sherin made the case. there are 40,000 non-profits out there to help veterans to dr. sherin what level of confidence do you have that this time will get their because a quick anecdote for me is i have a provider who mostly treats

vietnam vets. in the midst of all this of course he canceled his contract after 30 years from the va on this so now i've got 24 vietnam veterans who are likewise the heck did you cancel this? system is working and now i have to start again so dr. sherin what do you think lex is their chance in what you're advocating that most of us intuitively know is the right way to go? >> i think there is. the va has led the way in the effort that the va is doing this internally so this is happening within the walls of the va and the concepts we are pushing are actually to go beyond the walls. if we want to promote recovery and integration we need veterans working with each other and the committee day. >> some of those things i read out of the act of the va is doing this could be applied the same white? >> absolutely. >> nrd are.

>> that's right. >> thank you members for being here. under the threat of subpoena we finally got from va the 2013 mental health employee survey and if i can i want to read just a few excerpts and ask if you will comment. leadership is disrespectful autocratic and uncaring. they are clear that they are getting bonuses as the top priority if we want to keep our jobs this is leadership from the center director on down that i ever heard of. an excellent poor leadership administrative skills causing more confusion and disorganization in times when my superior does not fully find out all aspects of the issues before issuing a decree in the third one no effective leadership in mental health force like nurses abuse management practice such as controlled self-selecting and choosing staff for performance rules and no transparency. comments?

i mean it took a long time for this committee to get this information. >> i apologize for that delay. i don't know what held it up. >> well i do. continue. >> i have had a chance to review some of the aggregated data. >> you have not had a chance? >> i have and the survey consisted of items that could could be rated as well as the pre-tax comments and what you share were some of the free text, spent there are some aggregated results that are significant from 2012 to 2013 as we hired more individuals. people did focus on a real sense of teamwork and being able to provide for the veterans. i could also add that i would just like to respond to mr. o'rourke that i would like to restate my answer to your question about accountability and who is responsible. i think that we have va are all responsible and that includes me and i apologize for not saying

that before him but when you reframe the question to make it became clear that i answer that question wrong and i am sorry. >> dr. carol u. made this comment a second ago talking about the peer support is one of the greatest things that you did. did the va support back? >> supported financially sir? >> now, the concept. >> yes. >> every step of the way? you fought it every step of the way? this committee and other people said you'd need to bring these folks that experience this in their own lives forward nva fought tooth and nail against it. >> i regret that sir. since i've been part of the central office team since 2007 we have been looking for ways to move this forward. >> i don't believe if you ask any member who has been sitting

here for an extended period of time they will tell you that the va has in fact fought bringing them in because they claimed they didn't have the right credentials and they were not specific to the treatment and in fact you just highlighted it as one of your best successes. >> thank you for your partnership in that. >> with that if there were no further comments or questions we thank everybody and we thank the witnesses for being here today and i would ask unanimous consent that all members would have five legislative days with which to revise and extend any extraneous material. without objection so ordered. once again thanks to the witnesses and thanks to the members. this hearing is adjourned. [inaudible conversations]

[inaudible conversations]

>> thank you senator reid. let me kick off by discussing the hobby lobby decision and our reaction by the caucus to that decision. the supreme court's decision to allow some employers to refuse to cover contraception as part of employees health insurance policies was wrong and misguided. coloradans understand women should never have to ask the process for permission slip to access common forms of birth control or other critical health services. men and women who went to work for hobby lobby signed up to work for a craft store, not a

religious organization trade with up to 90% of american companies considered closely held the hobby lobby decision means millions of working americans access to critical health services may be a threat. minds not your -- to restore a woman's power to make personal health care decisions based what is best for her and her family not according to employers personal beliefs. the bill also will level the income playing field for women. the supreme court's decision burdens hard-working women ignoring the fact that contraception can be crucial to women and the family's economic success. finally contrary to what supporters of the decision were saying this isn't just about contraceptives. the supreme court's hobby lobby decision affects any groups at a

particular types of medications or procedures such as vaccinations. we must take steps now to push back and ensure that women can make their own health care decisions. i'm going to keep fighting to ensure that women have access to affordable birth control and are not forced to pay out-of-pocket for medical services that they have already pay for. america's women have to let us know that women's health care is not your boss's business. senator murray. >> thank you so much for all your work on this senator udall. really appreciate it. as he said last week five male justices gave their blessing to ceos and corporations across america to go ahead and have my legally mandated health care coverage for their employees and when that news broke i was outraged and i was just one of millions of people in this country who are shocked and angry. contraception has always been between a woman, her partner,

her doctor interface. now, by the way at a time when 99% of women in the u.s. have used birth control those five justices decided that a woman's boss also have a say. so today these women are looking to us and they are demanding a change. it is not just women who want congress to act. people across the country understands that if bosses can deny birth-control, they can deny vaccines or hiv treatment or other basic health care services that their employees or their dependents rely on. i think what men in america understand as well as that is just not the female employees who are impacted here. it's their wives and their daughters to wear on their health plan. so just like many of the people all of us heard over the holiday weekend, we have heard from people that are tired of being targeted and are looking to

congress now to right this wrong by the supreme court. as senator udall said our bill, then not my boss's business act, would ensure that no ceo or corporation can come between people and their guaranteed access to health care period end of story. so as we move forward on this i'm hopeful that republicans can put proven science over partisan politics and join us to revoke this court issued license to discriminate and return their right of americans to make their own decisions about their own health care in their own bodies. just as cecile richards from planned parenthood puts eloquently yesterday eloquently yesterday, the bottom line is women use birth control for a host of reasons none of which should require a permission slip from their boss. for women the only controversy about birth control is the fact that it's 2014 and we are still fighting for basic health care in this country.

so i want to thank senator udall and all of our leadership in the members of our caucus for working with us on this common sense my camera legislation. >> senator durbin. >> it's been my opportunity to interrogate, question supreme court judicial nominees. two of them who were party to this decision that was handed down in hobby lobby came before the senate judiciary committee and i asked the same basic question of each of them. it's a question i went back to a moment in american history that most younger people probably don't even believe. there was a moment in american history about 50 years ago when states prohibited the sale of contraceptives. that case was brought before the supreme court griswold versus connecticut and the supreme court said that the right of privacy of individuals and families trumped any statewide

ban on contraceptives. it was a breakthrough. they found privacy at least in principle and is in the constitution and i asked that question repeatedly of justice roberts and justice alito to make sure that they would honor that same tradition of privacy. the hobby lobby decision violates that fundamental premise. the premise that a woman, her family, her doctor interface should be involved in this decision not her employer. i think senator schumer is going to address the religious administration act. we never envisioned the distorted position taken by the court will reconsider that vision years ago. we believe and i think every american believes you are entitled to your own religious beliefs. you are protected in their own religious beliefs under the constitution but you are not entitled to impose your religious beliefs on another person and that is what this

court has sanctioned with the hobby lobby decision. we are talking about religious freedom we are talking about the freedom of every individual and family. that decision violated that basic fame. let me say one last point. for those who are arguing that this is something to do with the issue of abortion, we know that contraception, family planning are critical to avoid unplanned pregnancies. the more unplanned pregnancies there are the greater likelihood of more abortions so those who want to limit the number of abortions should understand family planning and contraception are key to achieving that goal. this hobby lobby decision does not help that. >> thank you in person want to thank senators udall and murray for their great leadership in drafting this critical bill. as the author of the religious freedom restoration act i can say with absolute certainty the

supreme court got a hobby lobby case dead wrong. when we wrote rifra back in 1993 i was a house member in the lead sponsor in senator kennedy was the lead sponsor in the senate. when we wrote rifra in 1993 we did so to protect individuals with strong religious beliefs and give them the presumption they had always enjoyed. they should be able to exercise their religious beliefs without interference from the government. the court took that and applied it, misapplied it to for-profit companies who exist for the purpose of benefiting from the open market working in the marketplace under our laws. now think of the difference. for the reform illusion or adopt a religion you have to obey the precepts of that religion and the government gives you a wide penumbra. we don't have to form a

corporation. he wouldn't tell the owners of hobby lobby to convert to a different religion or disobey their religion but we don't say that they have to open up the company and go sell toys or hobby kits. we don't have any of them in new york i don't think so i don't know what they exactly sell. but the court took the protection and misapplied it. without a doubt the religious freedom restoration act was written to apply only to individuals, not corporations and the supreme court went way beyond the bounds of the law's intent applying this case more broadly to corporations is a perversion of our original intent and only serves to put women's health care choices in the hands of her boss. the supreme court's cavalier decision to grant religious rites to closely held corporations, which operate

under their own volition could curtail the health care freedom of women add as many as 90% of american businesses. because of the court could go so far as to apply this law to corporations, what prevents them from going beyond closely held corporations? that is why we are here today, fighting for this bill to reverse the supreme court's decision, both foolish and dangerous. the bill makes it clear the court heard in the application of rifra and it's illegal for any business to deny their workers health benefits that are required under federal law and it does so while maintaining the protection for churches, different houses of worship, and individuals that object to providing contraception because of their religious beliefs. the bill is a reasonable and measured response to a devastating court decision that

would apply to businesses who operate in the open public market but not private churches who exist to facilitate practice of religion. when they put the bill on the floor next week i hope some of our republican colleagues will support this appropriate response that makes plain the original intent of the law that had overwhelming support from both parties. senator reid. >> on espn every week they have the 10 best plays in the 10 worst place. we don't have to do this every week but let's take it over period of decades. this decision this hobby lobby decision would be at the top. it is a horrible decision, certainly the worst in the last 25 years.

i am so disappointed as i have said before in justice roberts. alito told us who he was. we let it go. roberts didn't. he misdirected us. he has certainly been a disappointment to us. it's wrong for five men to decide what happens to women in america. every woman deserves the same access to medical care. women should be free to make their own health decisions with their families and their doctors. their bosses should be nowhere near these kinds of decisions. when it comes to a woman's personal health, and the decisions he has to make, the

bosses shouldn't be in the same room and they shouldn't be in the same zip code. the murray udall bill, the murray udall bill is so very important. what senator udall and murray have done is exemplary to how we should act to something really bad in the hobby lobby decision is really bad. we are going to take this bill up next week. >> senator reid the crisis that's happening on the border some democrats in the house are saying the 2008 trafficking law has to be reversed and the white house is suggesting it basically reversed. can you stomach a reversal? >> first of all everyone understand this. it is the comprehensive immigration reform bill had

passed which is put together by two people right behind me, we wouldn't have this issue. it would be gone. we would be free of so many different issues including reduction of our debt by a trillion dollars. so senator mikulski is holding a hearing this afternoon. my preference would be to pass the bill in a stand-alone bill. it's emergency spending and there are provisions in it with this money. we can do all kinds of things. we can go after the coyotes. we can go after the drug cartels and we can take care of these children. these children should be treated as humanely as humanly possible and america sets the standard for being able to take care of children in the right way. >> are you attempting to block it? >> no, i'm not attempting to block it. let's see if it comes to to the

poor. to do up my preferences. people are making a lot of excuses as they have done for your to do something productive. it will be productive as it relates to the border problem and give us the administration this money so we can start going after these bad guys. >> senator udall. let me ask you sir if your reaction to the top intelligence in germany and how concerned are you about the ramifications of that and our relationship with them? >> i'm concerned as we all are. i just talked to joe feinstein and we are going to have a classified briefing on the matter. i am concerned that we are sending the wrong message to a key ally which is germany. >> senator durbin. to follow up on jeff's question leader pelosi said earlier that she doesn't want to see that 2008 law amended and passing the

supplemental because it's so important. >> my response would be let's see what the house does and we will see what mikulski does and act accordingly. my main concern are the kids. oh i'm sorry senator durbin. >> served to think justice alito or justice roberts testified legally? >> they are very careful in their answers but they said they both stood by the griswold decision which enshrined the basic right of privacy and having been through many of those hearings i know that they are careful in their language. but that hobby lobby decision was a direct violation of that right of privacy which we all value and i think it was a disappointment. it's the reason i asked conservative nominees like tho those, that specific question because they knew it really went to the heart of many issues relating to women's rights.

>> a number of you spoken about the possibility of -- do any of you have thoughts about the impact for lgbt? >> i'm glad you asked the question because i was standing here when we talked about vaccines and we talked about other issues. i think it speaks volumes when we have the majority of the groups that support these issues that are so important to america today that are saying they are not interested in doing any of it because they believe the supreme court decision is headed in the wrong direction and it's going to make things worse for them rather than better. we have made so much progress in these years. this hobby lobby decision as so many direct adverse -- is hurting so many different people. we can't even see the tip of the iceberg today as to what's going to happen.

it's a terrible decision. >> senator reid? the justice department has just said they are not joining in opening a probe into the allegations of spying on the senate cia or the other side of the coin and senator udall uber on the intelligence committee. do you have any comments? >> my reaction is what went on there i felt we handled it that the appropriate way by turning it over to someone. i think the search at arms to do good job. while we may disagree what i think the cia did to my senators was wrong. i'm going to drop it at that. you are a remnant member of that committee. what you want to say? >> as a leader mentioned the sergeant at arms have been passed with taking an objective look at what happened to it i still believe the cia's entry into our computers was

unacceptable and perhaps unconstitutional and we shouldn't let this drop until we have some fundamental resolution of what happened. this wasn't the first time this occurred and the division of powers in the constitution is at some risk here. it's an unfortunate incident in our history but the heart of this is the need still to be classified in the committee's report on the rendition enhanced interrogation techniques that the cia engaged in in the last decade. we need that. >> senator velasco on the senate floor by kay hagan and this bill calls -- on top of it in the next one is john walsh's bill. how much politics is involved in the choice of what you are voting on the on the senate floor? >> what politics could be involved in that? we had 26 democratic, i'm sorry

26 republican co-sponsors, 26 and all we did, we did this unique thing that's been going on for decades here in the senate. give us a list of amendments. do you know why they did not give us a list of amendments? they can't come up with them because they fight so much amongst themselves. i'm hobby lobby, mark udall has an excellent very record on issues in dealing with women's health. it's part of the issue going on in colorado. it would be political malpractice if we did not react the way we have dealing with this horrible decision made by the supreme court and patty murray as i have said before and i don't intend to embarrass her and a number of meetings we have had lately no one is more helpful to the democratic caucus and patty murray. she is truly one of our leaders so if anybody criticizes these two people were leaving

something that is so entirely appropriate that it's too bad for them. >> i would add one thing. senator udall was the first was the percentage are called me and said let's work on a legislative fix to this. that's why we are jointly cosponsoring this legislation. >> thanks everybody. [inaudible conversations]

presse, has asked congress to revive $2.7 billion the border police and courts can handle the influx of children arriving in the united states from central america without their parents. on "washington journal" we discussed the issue and u.s. immigration policy with texas congressman blake farenthold. this is 40 minutes. >> host: as i noted earlier president obama was in texas yesterday talking about the crisis on the border. we are joined now by texas public and congressman blake farenthold to talk about these issues. the subjects also the front page of many of the papers in texas. here's their front page of the san antonio express news. obama applauds texas gop on border bill. to the texarkana gazette border

crisis officials tell congress the surge is overwhelming is the headline there and then onto the monitor in texas, obama to border critics, this is an theater. this coming from statements the president made in a speech last night. here's a bit of the president talking about calling on congress to pass the supplemental funding bill and also pass a long-term solution to the border crisis. >> last week i sent a letter to congress asking them to increase penalties on smugglers had to give us flexibility to move migrants to the system faster. yesterday i asked congress to fund these efforts. about half of the resources would go to border security enforcement and expedited removal of people who don't qualify for humanitarian claim. about half would go to make sure we are treating children humanely. we would also make investments to further tackle the real problems in central america.

so, right now congress has the capacity to work with us, work with state officials, local officials and faith-based groups and not for profits who are helping to care for these kids. congress has the capacity to work with all parties concerned to directly address this situation. they have said they want to see a solution to the supplemental offers them the capacity to vote immediately to get it done. of course in the long run the best way to truly address this problem is with the house of representatives to pass legislation fixing our broken immigration system which by the way would include funding for an additional thousands of border patrol agents, something that everybody down here that i have talked to indicate is a priority. >> host: congressman farenthold the president they

are saying the ball is in congress escort for for the six cs imposed for this emergency supplemental. what is your take on emergency supplemental? >> guest: listen i think his initial request for $2 million expedited -- billion, i'm sorry expediter repatriation and additional lawyers to prosecute those claims was good. all of a sudden we have gone from two to almost $4 billion including with it a relief for wildfires in california. so we started piling stuff on this and we have gotten away from addressing the problem into something much bigger. >> host: the "associated press" breaks down that funding request that $3.7 billion funding request noting that 1.8 billion of it would be for care for unaccompanied children. 1.1 billion for transportation for detention and removal. $433 million for border agent pay an additional facilities and $64 million for hiring of additional immigration judges.

so what do you see as the track for this funding measure? >> guest: my concern with all thing is that we are trying to address the symptom of the problem and not the problem in the first place. we have got a situation where if you are other than mexican you have a much more, much longer course to go through before we can reunite you with your family and your country of origin so i think the first step needs to be turning off the magnet that draws the central americans here and then dealing with the ones that are here and expedited manner. >> host: what is the magnet because there has been debate over what the magnet is. is it policy dating back to 2008 or under president obama and some of the policies he has implemented? >> guest: no i don't know for its policy is that's what the bleep in central america -- central america guatemala and honduras are. the children have told the

border patrol agents when they get there they believe when they get to the united states they are going to be able to stay. they are running to border patrol agents. we are not having to go find them to arrest them. they are coming in and say where do i sign up to be a citizen? they think it's a misinterpretation, a misunderstanding of what the law is that the president's policies with things like daca has sent a message that if you are a child we are not going to return your home and that's not correct. even under the d.r.e.a.m. act or daca children entering now don't qualify for that but what they do qualify for is a long arduous process when we were having 2000 children crossing the border. we were looking at two to three years before you got immigration and now they their estimates are around 60,000. how long is that going to take? so you come up from central america and your friends see you get to stay. you call and report back, they

don't see asem.com so the message is reinforced that if you get to the united states you get the golden ticket. >> what would be your fix if you were in charge. the leadoff says the gop clamors for border fix in a box at the sensible plan. they noted the peace is called the republican response what it is a tactical decision to letting policies fester for political reasons. >> guest: i am disappointed the border working group has not gone proposals out there. >> host: what is the border working group? >> guest: that is the group that's an informal group of folks that are trying to come up with a solution that you asked what my solution is. my solution was modified to 2008 law to include central america so we can have the expedited repatriation. we need to hire more judges on a temporary basis. these are in article three

judges. these judges. these are macerated law judges to hear the claims of the children. budget them to come in and expedite the proceedings for the children that are to here and it is going to take some money. i forget to set it yesterday but it was a great comment. if somebody leaves a child on their doorstep you take care of them but you do try to get them back to their parents. >> host: said about -- so what would be the long-term pics? the president talked about governor perry requesting national guard troops on the board on the border and the president said he would consider it but that's not a long-term fix. guess of the long-term fixes we do have to secure the border. there are multiple magnet to draw folks here that believe the children get to stay as one and the fact that we don't have strong employer sanctions and full rollout of e-verify to determine folks eligibility for a job. as long as there's an economic

incentive to come here people will continue to come here. we have to crack down on the economic incentive and we do have to secure the border with an adequate number of border patrol agents and increased use of technology. >> host: what about the people who are already here? is there a pathway to citizenship for these folks collect what would you propose? >> here's the problem. my constituents and lots of books that i talked to have lost faith that the government can control the border. we were promised to secure the border when president reagan offered amnesty to illegals in his term so until we can show the border is secure there's not a pathway forward i think the more comprehensive package. now i do think once the american people believe the borders secure we can address those issues and it would be a lot less passion, passion probably set isn't the right word but there would be a lot less pressure to not do anything. >> host: at that point would

you consider a pathway to citizenship? >> guest: i certainly think a pathway to legalization will be easier to do in the house of representatives than a pathway to citizenship but again let's get the border secured and crank down the emotions and book what's best for the united states both economically and on a humanitarian basis. >> host: representative blake farenthold part of your district was on the border. guess the one all the ways down to brownsville texas from corpus christi and now we have sure -- shifted to the outskirts of boston. >> host: here after your questions and take your comments. we'll be talking with him for about the next half hour or so here on "washington journal." republicans 202-58-5381 and democrats 202588 -- in a pencemack (202)585-3882. we will start with james calling from puréed lmi honor whine for democrats. good morning. good morning and in your honor

congressman farenthold. >> caller: good morning. i would like to know why do you guys keep talking about the border isn't secure. it is secure. you keep saying that you need more border patrol. well you got it and as far as these children coming in from other parts -- from other countries, you know that the president gave them the money so why don't they give him the money and let him do what he has to do? >> guest: how can you say the border is secure when we have all these children that are able to make it over? these aren't even big burly guys carrying drugs. these are children escorted in small groups escorted by one person. i don't think the borders secured. this crisis is evidence of it. i have no problem giving the president the money that he needs to address this crisis but we also don't want to throw unnecessary money at it. we want to treat the root cause

and not the symptoms. we have to spend her money smartly. the solution to everything is not just throwing money at it. >> host: jody is in corning iowa on airline for republicans. johnny good morning. >> caller: good morning c-span, good morning representative how are you. i'm sorry, i'm a little nervous. corpus christi is wonderful. it's beautiful. being a truck driver, an ex-truck driver and originally from southern california i know what the border looks like and i know it hasn't been secured since reagan was in office. that's part of our biggest problem. i'm so sorry about the kids and it's not fair for them. it's not fair what's happening to them that our country can do this. you know, we can't. >> guest: johnny it's an incredible dangerous journey for these kids. i don't know if you have seen the pictures riding on top of freight trains in mexico getting

from central america to the united states and they have to go through these coyotes that have deals with the drug cartels and actually they are being used as pawns both by the pro-amnesty zealot and the immigration debate that they are also being used as pawns by the drug cartels. they flood our border patrol agents with a bunch of children. they do the right thing and take care of these kids and three or four miles up the river across comes a load of drugs. >> host: can i ask ask you to expand a little more when you say or country can do this. why is that? >> caller: there is a much needed here. i've been out of work for two years. my husband and i lost our home six months ago are you there is lot of infrastructure here that needs to be done. i don't think we have it in the budget. are we going to have to go borrow this money from china to pay for this another

$4 trillion -- $4 billion. >> guest: we are borrowing for cents on the dollar up everything we spend so we definitely have a financial crisis. i think the president would have had better reception for his supplemental requested pete's say say hey look here so we can cut to do this. by saying we have to spend this $4 billion not cut anything is saying taking care of these children had this problem is the least important thing the government does. it's not something we cannot do to find this money. >> host: what are the things you think we could not do to find $3.7 billion or whatever the amount is? >> guest: we are always looking for assets through efficiency but i do think we actually as the congress and the country need to take a step back and look at everything the federal government is doing and asked the question is this something the federal government should be doing and is it appropriate to send them back to the states or let the people take care of themselves?

>> host: are there few obvious ones are mine? >> guest: oyou go back to last presidential election and rick perry's classic what were the four agencies giving ron paul a lifetime. 20 cents on the dollar we spend in education is lost on bureaucrats in washington d.c.. we could take 20% of our education budget by blog ranting that money to states and they would spend more wisely than we do. all we do is get rid of a few bureaucrats in washington. >> host: shelly is in long beach new york on her lines for democrats. you are on the line with representative blake farenthold. >> caller: good morning. do you think the president should have had the photo op at the border? >> guest: weisman today's in the rio grande valley last week and it was really a moving experience for me. seeing thousands of children

packed into adult detention centers in common cells. imagine a cell the size of your bedroom with concrete floors and benches on either side in the toilet separated by half a wall and then piled 30 plus children in that sleeping on the floor some even without blankets. it's clear that these children are making this dangerous trip and we don't have the facilities to deal with it. one of the things the president wants to do is build more facilities. i take a different tack. let's do with the problem is causing them to come and get them to stop coming. >> host: do you think the president opinion might change if he was on the border and sell used to? >> guest: i don't think we can build their way out of it. if we don't deal with the root cause more and more children become and i think eventually if we don't deal with this they will start coming from all over the world. it's convenient to come from central america because there is elaine ralph but what's stopping folks from other parts of the world from finding transportation over here and

over to mexico or central america and making that track as well. we have got to -- was so here's more from prison of him last night when he was asked a question about why he didn't visit the border on his visit to texas. >> you know jay johnson has now visited at my direction the border five times. he is going for his sixth this week. he then comes back and reports to me extensively on everything that is taking place. so there is nothing that is taking place down there that i am not intimately aware of and briefed on. this isn't theater. this is a problem. i'm not interested in photo ops. i'm interested in solving the problem and those who say i should visit the border when you

ask them what we should be doing they are giving us suggestions that are embodied in legislation that i have already sent to congress so it's not as if they are making suggestions that we are not listening to. in fact, the suggestions of those who work at the border, who visited the border are incorporated in the legislation that we are already prepared to sign the minute it hits my desk. it's a very simple question here that this congress to states to pass the supplemental. there's a larger issue that i recognize the a lot of politics which is why are we passing comprehensive immigration reform which would put an additional 20,000 border patrol agents and give us a lot of additional authorities to do so with these problems and i should have been done a year ago. it should have gotten done two years ago but it's gotten caught. >> host: congressman veron

told the president saying he's not interested in photo ops and he's interested in solving the problem. >> guest: i'm interested in solving the problem into but his not going to the border is equivalent to president bush not going to visit after katrina. look out the window behind you. you have a beautiful view of the united states capitol but ask anybody who has come to washington to walk to the capital. it happens to me almost every week. i see something and i get goosebumps. there's an emotional connection you received when you do something yourself. you see with your own eyes. you are able to touch it and you're able to smell it. the motion of being down there will affect your thinking about it. you are bound to get goosebumps occasionally in the capital to match. it's exact same thing. you don't fully understand until you've seen with your own eyes. >> host: up next-line beach

new york shelly is calling on our line for democrats. shelly, good morning. >> caller: good morning. i know he could connect with the value would have been if he went there but how would that have changed what was already submitted and you know what the breakdown is. you know what that involves. these people are coming because of the president would have gone in there and there would be all the cameras and the security detail that would have been necessary to do that. he would have picked up up the child and that would have gone on to possibly be put on television down there? sending a strong message not to send your kids with the coyotes down there to send their kids

give a bunch of money to smuggle the kids up there to freedom. that's the propaganda coming from there so they have a picture and you know they look at a picture of that. there's the president with all your children. >> guest: here's the situation. they don't allow a lot of pictures out there. most of the pictures we see were actually snuck out of those facilities and that's because it's so bad. so a it would send the message that the conditions you come into art as good as you think but it would also emotionally i think tell the president we have got to stop all of these people from coming. we don't want to put anybody through the dangers associated with the trip up here and the procedures and attention and that is there for sure period of time as we processed these books. >> host: at once, and on

twitter lets take the politics of out of the commentary and discuss what needs to happen to fix the border. stanley in new new york is next led us on our line for republicans. linda good morning. >> caller: good morning mr. farenthold. nice to see you. first off i wouldn't touch any immigration bill that chuck schumer had anything to do with and as far as the movie goes let's take some of the things that obama wants to give his millionaire friends for green energy and lets take some of the money that eric holder strong-arming out of the bank and use that to take care of these people. thank you. let's get the issue is something you looked into and the oversight and government reform committee. >> guest: we spend a ton of money on green energy and bad investment if to be look as the lender and the like.

>> host: donna summer line for independents. good morning. go ahead, don. >> caller: good morning. i have a two-part question. when there's a natural disaster anywhere in united states hurricane flood whatever the governors immediately call out the national guard. why can't they do that now? in my second part of my question is where are all these illegals getting the money to bring themselves to the united states? i thought that they were all poor people down there. i will hang up and listen on line. >> guest: there's a lot that the national guard could do in support of our border patrol and we just need to get the person on board on doing that. with respect to. >> host: do you know what he can do on a somewhat the national guard and in the situation? >> guest: what he is chosen to do is additional department of public safety highway patrol troopers down there. they are backing the border patrol appeared as the border patrol is dealing with the kids we have got the dps set further back and they are dealing with the drugs so we are trying to do

the drug interventions as part of the dps. they could put the national guard and some on the lookout post that they have in these lookout towers that you sometimes see in parking garages that they put on the border. there are a lot of issues here but let's talk a second about the money issue. a lot of these children actually their trip has been paid for by parents or families that are here in the united states. in many cases illegally and what happens with the children as they come in and they surrender to the border patrol. they are in the border patrol system in the border patrol has to process them. the border patrol is required to keep them for 72 hours and turn them over to hhs. the border patrol typically typically finishes and 20 for hours but hhs can't take it for days because they don't have the facilities. hhs find somebody in united states rather than the home country where i think they ought to be looking to reunite these children with. they will put them on airplanes

as unaccompanied minors that they are old enough to do that or send escorts with them. they are find them all over the country and they are being united with ostensibly their parents or a friend of the family who i believe are in most cases the one that paid for the trip. we have the federal governmen government. >> host: are they required to pay back the cost of some of these issues? >> guest: no, we does reunite the kids with their families. hhs is taking the easy way out rather than trying to work with the countries and reunite them and guatemala el salvador and honduras. they look for somebody in the u.s.. we take them with a promise to appear but we, the united states government is the last mile basically in a coyote business. once they get to united states and deliver them their final destination and just that is estimated to be over billion dollars. >> host: mike is up next in

chatsworth california 91 for democrats. mike, good morning. >> caller: good morning. maybe you can help me understand this. border patrol agents at the border where was the mexican government border patrol and shouldn't they be securing their side of the border and also how come they are not really securing their side of the border between central america and mexico? if the mexican government would secure their side of the border between the u.s. and mexico and the border between -- in mexico we wouldn't be having all the migrants coming over. the u.s. should be giving them money to beef up the border patrol? >> guest: lets an interesting comment. as far as mexicans on the northern border, the border with the u.s. they don't care who is leaving. they are more just in his coming in. i do think they could be made in a better effort at their southern border. the question becomes how do we help the mexican government do that. we offer them money to beef up

their troops? then you start having folks the united states saying why are we giving so many to mexico when we need them here in united states? i are a lot of considerations with her special doing map at the border between mexico and the central american countries is much shorter than the border between mexico and the u.s. and would be easier to secure. we are going to have to rely on the mexicans to do that and they are a sovereign nation and they're not going to want our troops or our people down there for anything but an advisory capacity. >> host: we have 15 minutes left with congressman blake farenthold republican of texas here to answer questions and take your comments. cann is in actually georgia on my line for republicans. cannot good morning. >> caller: good morning. thank you representative farenthold. you have really explained the situation very well but i believe that this is a manufactured crisis and it is an

attempt to smear the republicans about the immigration issue in our country and to flex again it makes the news headlines from the irs candles and nsa scandals etc. etc.. shouldn't the border states be able to express their sovereignty? i know cost the state of texas to mexico and arizona a lot of money but mainly texas. they should be paying for the planes to take these children and send the back to the countries in which they came from and deport the fuhrer as well. i think that's a solution. >> guest: i do think we need to change the bush era law that treats mexicans differently than it treats the central american and include central america and the expedited repatriation and reunite those children with whoever they are within central america. remember these children with the word -- were with some adults.

they were not street orphans. they were somebody taking care of them before they came out. there is somebody back there that would continue to take care of him if we reunited them. >> host: did he want to comment on the callers believe that this is a manufactured crisis? >> guest: to listen i think the obama administration is not beyond using anything to the flat attention from the various scandals. i'm not sure this was intentionally dredged up at this time but it is the result of the policies and the ideas being espoused by the obama administration by the vast styles of amnesty and the failure to enforce our existing laws with daca and not the porting children. .. into the country and

you are processed and you are released with a promise to appear and sometimes you are released to parents or relatives present int lawfully the united states and the chances of them appearing are relatively low. if you get these notices to appear and you don't appear, you really do forfeit any right to .ove forward with legal status it's important that they do show up. i don't think a lot of them will. host: caller from florida on our line for independents. caller: good morning. about -- ask you before i get there, this is manufactured. it's not manufactured in the sense of the last color. they do know the loopholes. obama is not stupid. gutierrez inis illinois -- i listen to a lot of

talk radio and even rush limbaugh gets it. obamas this secret that does not want to get out. he does not want to fix this problem. he has already orchestrated this reunification. i see them every single day here in florida. for the past two years, the sheriff's department has orchestrated along with the guatemala consulate in my county, passports to be sent directly to the people in this country illegally. you're supposed to have a passport when you come to the country, not when you have been living here legally. -- illegally. guest: as we have continued to secure the border, there has to be circular unlawful immigration. intoily member would come the united states, work 6-9

months and go back to mexico for a while and then come back. it has gotten so much more difficult to cross the border. family member not lawfully present in the u.s. saves up some money and pays the coyote to bring their wife, children across. causes of our the problem now. host: you talked about the immigration debate and i was playing out in your district. 200 miles from the border. split almost 50-50 between hispanic population and white population. how was the debate playing out there? guest: >> >> happens very much like the rest of the country. the problem the american people have lost faith in government and once we're able to secure the border we

can move forward. you hear consistently from the hispanics and anglos alike that i went through or my parents or grandparents went through the immigration process why should a certain group of people try to shortcut the system actually be allowed to jump in front of the wine? asks, why haven't you impeached this president? a subject that has come up quite a bit in the past week. guest: assuming we could get the vote to impeach the president, he is not going to get convicted in the senate. most people don't realize that the impeachment process starts and then there is a trial in the senate and he will be removed from office unless he is convicted in the senate. won't take up commonsense job bills. the chances they would actually impeach the president are between slim to none.

unless there is enough public theage at the things president has done that there is no choice politically for to not vote to impeach. lena is up next from texas on our line for democrats. good morning. caller: good morning. i keep hearing people saying, why don't they defend the borders. make the borders safe so that they can't come through. what country has borders so refined with personnel that people don't come through the borders? if there is a country out there in the world that has this problem, why don't you follow that format? guest: israel has done a good

job of securing their borders. they are a much smaller country than we are. we are a geographically diverse southern border that goes from metropolitan areas to national parks. wilderness to the deserts. we have a big border that is very difficult to defend. and we have the technology. we are starting to see the rollout of arrow stat surveillance qu equipment. as we roll out technology -- there are roadblocks we have within the government for doing it. valley, it isnde controlled by the federal government and the fish and wildlife folks won't let the border patrol put a dirt road in so they could patrol the area and go pick up people that they see on the aerial surveillance.

they have wildlife concerns on some property there. the border isough going to be necessary and you run up against the fish and wildlife service. host: linda, good morning. republican line. caller: my question is, who is supporting the money for the sses that are picking these people up and transporting them? as far back asit to haveof this year this done? that this the radio

was all land and in the works companies to join to transport these people. who was paying the bills for these buses to be running? guest: you are. you and all the american taxpayers are paying for it. the folks in the health and human services and the border patrol have seen a consistent rise in the number of unaccompanied children crossing the border. they are working with the resources they have to deal with them. the children have to be processed and they have to be housed somewhere until we can find an old -- an adult to reunite them with. we have to change the law so they are treated the same as mexicans and can be reunited with whoever sent them from central america. that they the law is

are able to stay for a complete hearing, which is years down the road. we process them and the border patrol does the initial they turned them over to health and human services to take a couple of weeks to find whoever they decided to release them to hear in the united states whether it's a family member who is here lawfully or not present. in some cases, they are turning them over to a friend that the child identifies through a skype conversation. wet is going to happen when are turning these children over to the wrong people or the wrong sort of people? -- the teenage girls are telling stories about how they are having to deal with being raped during the transport up here. control getting birth

or contraceptives that they wouldn't otherwise use for fear of being raped on the trip. it's incredibly dangerous. my concern is, as more children are passing through these cartel controlled areas, how many of them will be siphoned off and not just delivered as promised but held as human slaves? me theygrandmother tell paid $5,000 for her and two children to cross and they got from central america to the border, they wanted another $5,000 to take them the next step of the way. you are getting folks who come up and more money is being , worse yet,them or women and girls are raped or boys and girls move into the trafficking area and are becoming modern-day slaves. host: a couple minutes left. carol is in new jersey on our

line for independents. caller: good morning. i have a few things to say. i have become incredibly frustrated at the media. both of these political parties that seem to be laying it very dangerous game with the american people. -- playing a very dangerous game with the american people. .f there is a website on january 29, 2014, they published this. biz opsan ad on their website seeking escorts for unaccompanied, illegal alien children. they are seeking 65,000 .pplicants

25% of which of local ground transport. 25% ice charters. is commercial air. escort services include, but are not limited to, assisting with --nsferring physical custody host: i'm to give the congressman a chance to respond. guest: there are two facilities has in my hometown. i first found out about this problem several months ago when i was tipped off by airline employees. who are we flying all over the country every day? they saw thehs -- numbers rising at hhs. that is why they ran this ad.

they are transporting these kids at taxpayer expense from the border up to these two-week holding facilities come identify the parents and then we are flying them are busing them to wherever their relative or friend in the united states will take care of them. host:

because democracy is about a compromise in unsettling you don't get everything you want. baseball is like that. everything that goes to spring training knows they will win 60 games or lose 60 games they have woolsey's sent to figure out the middle you win 11 the have could good chance to play in october. is the sport of the half life as is democracy.

[inaudible conversations] >> if i could get everybody to take their seats please. before we begin i would ask unanimous consent from work colleagues and representative from california and from arizona to sit with us today to participate in the proceedings today. >> without objection so ordered.

we'll come to the full committee oversight hearing in titled service should not lead to suicide as access to medical care -- medical widespread data manipulation and accompanying patient and harm all across the nation this committee has held committee oversight hearings over the last several weeks to evaluate the systematic access and integrity failures that have consumed the health care system perhaps none of these have presented the all too husp' face of the veterans administration's failures as today's hearing will do. the hearing i believe will show the horrible human cost of the dysfunction and v.a. corruption at its heart

access to care is not about numbers but people. recently the committee heard from a veteran that attempted to received mental health care a patient in pennsylvania. he was told repeatedly by the employee that he would be unable to get an appointment for six months but when that employee left another one been in to tell the veteran that if he just told her he was thinking of killing himself, she would be able to get him an appointment much sooner and in just three months instead of six. fortunately that veteran was not considering suicide.

despite sickness begin increases of the mental health than suicide prevention programs and staff in recent years, the suicide rate has been stable since 1989. with approximately 22 veterans committing suicide every single day. however theuñ most recent v.a. data shows rates of suicide have increased by nearly 40 percent among males under 32 use services than 70 percent of male veterans between the ages of 18 and 24 to reduce v.a. health care services. this morning we will hear testimony from three families.

who will tell us about there son's daniel, klay, and brian. three operation enduring freedom and operational iraqi freedom veterans who suffered following combat. each faced barrier after barrier with their struggle to get help. each eventually succumbed to suicide. in a note left behind daniel wrote he felt his government had abandoned him in reference coming home to face a system of dehumanization, neglect, and indifference. v.a. o day daniel and klay and brian more. with that i am yield to the ranking member for his opening statement.

>> think you for holding this very important during. we have had many discussions and debates how to deliver the best health care services and how to ensure accountability within the leadership ranks of the department of veterans affairs. over the course of the hearings and discussions on important issues to access to mental health care and suicide prevention services that is why it is so important to them like to thank all of the panelists for joining us today in particular the family members who have lost a of a loved one i know speaking about of laws are(lñ particularly a child can be an incredibly difficult and exhausting experience but in this case we have to listen to your stories to identify

what went wrong to take action to make sure those failures are not repeated against my want to thank you very much for joining us today to share your stories. 18 through 22 year-old veteran's commit suicide every day those that the system had let down at some capacity and totally unacceptable. when the veteran has experienced depression or other early warning signs that may indicate mental-health issues or suicide that must be treated like the immediate medical crisis. that is what it is they should never be forced to wait months for medical consol because quite frankly that is time they may not have. taking place programs and initiatives aimed early detection and we have increased funding the

department of veterans affairs spending has doubled since 2007 but it is not working as well as we had hoped and we have to figure out why how to correct these problems. the veterans are paying the price for this dysfunction. in 2012 the report found data, whether it's providing timely access to mental health services is totally unreliable and the report that year the only confirmed that finding that but the scheduling policy made it difficult if not impossible to get patients the help they need when they need it. that is why we have to look at the situation. a problem we have seen repeatedly as be dig into the dysfunction of the v.a..

enough's enough veterans andoók families that cover a spectrum of needs for counseling for family members to urgent around the clock response to recent report found alan facility patients waited 432 days, well over one year for care. they're finding their much better than the care they are receiving. to look at it comprehensively and would argue this is the most important area. accord to a productive discussion that will begin today as we look forward to

solve some of the problems with what we see over the last several months and one to thank you for having this important hearing and for panelist coming today. with that i yield back the balance of my time. >> where hobbled and honored to be joined by our first panel of witnesses this morning. family members of the veterans that sadly and tragically lost their lives to suicide and i am sure i speak for each of my colleagues when i say that each have the deepest sympathies for your loss. i am most grateful and at the same time angry you have to be here to share your stories of your sons with each of us.

so if you could approach the witness table and joining us this is the parents of daniel summers, the parents of klay hunt, and the mother of bright and port wine. we are also joined on the of united states army chaired -- sharing his story to seek mental health care. thank you for your service and for being here today. please proceed with your testimony. we are grateful for this opportunity today. and with daniels

representatives and our own california one tuna advance reforms based on experiences of our son. >> as many of you know, my jury started on 2013 when daniel took his own life following a second deployment from iraq. he suffered from ptsd and traumatic brain injury and coal for central man spent six tragic years to try to access the benefit and v.a. health system before finally collapsing under the weight of his own despair. we have attached his story to are just afraid that provides the details of his efforts and we hope you will read it if you have not already done so. it is our objective to begin the process to provide hoping care to the 22

veterans per day or presently ending their lives. >> just over one year ago and four days later feeling fortunate at least we had a letter from him we spent 30 years in the business of health care to sit down with his wife and his mother and together we felt qualified to prepare the 19 page report we and title systemic issues that the v.a. in hampshire debt and also attached to our testaverde. the report is the same as when we wrote it toa.÷ improve access to the health care and make them accountable and to make every v.a. employee and advocate for each veteran. >> daniel was turned away due to the national guard in

active ready reserve status upon accessing the system he was eventually denied there be. he had innumerable problems with staff being uncaring, insensitive and adversarial. no one at the facility advocated for him. administrators cite ted hipaa to not involve family members were to be able to use modern technology. >> v.a. appointment system at dustin is inadequate it lacks basic documentation. the tea levin infrastructure is antiquated and prevents related agencies from sharing critical and permission. a there is a desperate need for compatibility for systems with and the of the h.j. and it dod. continuity of care was not a priority.

>> no procedures in place that at the time daniel was apt the third the knicks see it -- v.a. to be seen for help with this fibril laotian pain. there were policies and procedures the fact since many patients tour stabilized and the revocation must there were inadequate. >> there is nowhere to ascertain the benefits there was no appointment system isç freezing or the procedures.

no communication between determination and vocational rehabilitation. this report is offered in the spirit of a call to action and reflects the experience of daniel beginning in the fall 2007 until his death last june as a and tear our eyes. >> the impediments in deficiencies that daniel encountered with broader issues in the va -- v.a. with the experiences of a much broader population but unfortunately it was true as recent revelations. many reforms outlined require additional funding with the v.a. but that should come greater scrutiny and a demand for better and measurable results cemetery

is an alternative to repair the broken system we believe congress to seriously consider revamping commissioner of the v.a. health care system the new model we envision transitioning into a center of excellence specifically for war related injuries with more routine care provided by the system would be open to private sector and players that would compel the current model to self improve to compete for veterans business and ultimately allow all veterans to seek the best care available while allowing v.a. to focus expertise on the treatment of complex centuries suffered from modern warfare. >> thank you for your time we will be happy to discuss our recommendations. we hope the systemic issues will provide a platform to bring the new v.a.

administration to gather and with professionals and the administrators for a comprehensive review and reform of the entire v.a. process./l or as congress makes the decision to involve other stakeholders we would be honored to be among those chosen. thank you. >> thank you for your testimony. you are now recognized. >> thank you chairman miller and distinguished members of that committee. thank you for the opportunity to speak about mental health care and access, and i inherited day as the mother of marine

corps who at that age of 28 to. the listing in may to telson five and served with the infantry and he'd deployed close to fallujah. surely after writing he was shot through the rest for after he returned to cooperate senate can than later that year diagnosed and into experience during the employment to iraq to use freelance after

discovering that condition prevented him from maintaining a steady job he was met with the bureaucratic barriers including the v.a. losing his files. 18 months and five weeks the appeal file a went through the roof -- exclusively separation he receive care at the va meadow close center prior i place the the

hair but in late 2010 moving briefly to grand junction colorado and then home to houston to be closer to family. the houston v.a. would not refill their prescriptions that he received because he said there were not transferable for from he had delayed to appointments january but after that apartment he called me on his way home and said it cannot go back there is too stressful event i've article

iv it after his death the first midwest bank cash virgin and but i cannot imagine anyone dealing with mental health injuries could successfully access care without exacerbating the symptoms. he was consistently opening one dash open of of having put including]jç participating with whose but then to ease

that transition for fellow veterans to help some of reid from the halls but race and after returning home from more. but one where parents should have to testify before congressional committee to fill its responsibilities to those who have served your sacrifice.

mr. wall end to it very well could have slate -- save his life. we appreciate the opportunity to share his story and our recommendations how to help ensure the va will uphold its responsibility to properly care for americans veterans. thank you. >> thank you for your testimony this evening. you're recognized for five minutes. >>. >> 8% to even the but this time he was 19 years old you

would have -- you received a share his story progress 17 he listed in the army after his training and infantry to deploy to baghdad were cheaper drug -- patrolled the city streets it was extremely daunting. and this was before the judge ever was knocked unconscious then he could not hydraulically lower the ram. the five and soldiers from most often the sec would

give us the first six periods with posttraumatic brain injury another plan and and now he is in the past then the i aig's besides the two incidents that you had if but then to go to walter reed hospital are use reduces that to possibly a some than for a rather deployment? apparently hit this is here

but then it was crossed out and written for him after his first of phlegm and he was dead to be honed his ruined in then and worked memory loss and would have to read everything on his calendar on the refrigerator or his friends would tell him where are we going again? there are few scramble brains to help people keep posted and in 2012 the move his one dash when they asked

him why? or give someone the held thoughts. little did we did no way you immerse stood laden but traveling the same boat to and he had the stigma to say that you just move on. said once a vibrated did not -- headed anxiety in referring to the documents you reseed bridges his medical document that he could not remember the questions from the their

press during the interview. he had extensive back pain and could not sleep, a self profound guilt and as a result he was a risk for suicide. nonetheless he was immediately discharged and told to follow what. how in the road you can ask someone who cannot remember the questions to ask to follow up is beyond me. he deteriorated quickly from december 2010 through may 2011 when he took his life. he could not stand how he would be angry, depressed coming schists and did not know how to cope. it took a toll on his relationships if the dod and v.a. ss brian for suicide risk it was their duty to treat him he applied for disability but was unable to wait.

prions unit lost three othersv2 besides himself to a suicide since the 2008 to work and as you know, suicide her pat surpassed combat fatalities for the first time in history is us slippery slope something that v.a. and should realize. soldiers never hesitated and their mission to protectors' sir sacrifice for our country now is time for that v.a. to prove their commitment to our soldiers i never knew of his ptsd wrist and that if i could survive iraq i could survive anything. i think it is a life-threatening situation like this man should be shared with the family so we're able to help. v.a. needs to work with the service organization including the families.

and the plan for care i requesting this committee to pass 2182. this is the most devastating war in history with suicide in the nation continues to suffer and we continue to lose 22 bright and a day per promised that his funeral i would stop this injustice. . . 2182 and support any legislation that gives our soldiers the timely and loving care that they deserve. thank you. >> thank you, ms. portwine. sergeant wrenchler, you're recognized for your statement. >> chairman miller, ranking member michaud,