not worried if it will start crumbling in idaho or upstate new york. i worry about the integrity of the state. this is the decision that just came down3ñq. >> thank you. [applause] >> this is a fascinating look at jimmy carter. you will want to get a copy of redeemer. thinking about more time. [applause]

and then join us in the lobby. unintentionally. its program is about an hour. >> host: "plassop lp >> host: "please stop helping us" how liberals make it harder for blacks to succeed" author jason riley if i were to tell you i would take this book around with me around town and in

political circles it has raised eyebrows just the title of loan and starts conversation what would you say about that? >> publishers would be glad to hear that. i had a similar reaction when i went to get the jacket photo taken and the photographer is black and said what is the title? the immediate conversation starters. >> you touched the third rail to go from president obama as a black president with friday even at the conclusion and that talksutj about the acquittal. so talk to me about coming up with these thoughts that

typically is not fond of the way you have written in the black community. >> guest: a lot are to those who have dedicated the book to black conservatives and academics who have done a lot of research and written about this for many years. and i am familiar with their work and a younger generation of blacks saying the things they are saying for a new generation of readers. independent starting off chapter number one with the white house talk about barack obama. >> guest: i think obama presidency was the culmination that would push

political power as a means to raise blacks in america. said games are made with the civil-rights act of 64 but black liberals have made power by electing more black officials and the obama presidency is a culmination of that issue and and i wanted to say we got that now. but what do they have touche show for it? they push political power in the economic power. >> host: talking about those civil rights leaders that would march with you and tell me about that.

>> what you have on of left individuals that is searching for all of us those big bottles have been fought and won. the trouble they have today is to convince four people the problems they call attention to are the true problems. and a parody of what they used to be under a chief that the naacp's said time scouring the nation for confederate flags or use of that edward. there you go.i] nothing has changed more for their social economic situation or someone to waive a confederate flag and that is a search for relevance at all think that is racism in general what is

primarily holding blacks back today and sent the for some time. >> they can be fought and won. >> what do you say that african-americans still to this day have the highest unemployment rate in this nation and? has been this way since the inception disparity in educational with predatory lending grew they are targeted in there are so many other issues with the criminal justice system as well why president obama mccabe out for after the verdict because there is a thought and a feeling that african americans are added

disproportionate level to give higher sentences for cocaine also is in jail for different things. versus the white person so tell me about the battle. >> guest: i take issue unemployment rates that they had to invalidate. >> been that way since we have been here. know they haven't but you will see black participation rates higher than white labor participation. if you go back to the census coming i'm a slavery through

the 1940's you will see the two-parent households are higher among blacks than whites. so you have to look at the trend that was already in place for the major celebration -- and civil-rights legislation passed in 1944 and 1960 the 40-point drop in america. and that trend continues but at a much slower pace. >> with lbj we began the war on poverty talk about the census with slavery and the '50s and '60s but what kind of jobs?

now in midget positions of president with those agriculture agrarian housekeeping. >> host. >> guest: i am not talking about that but blacks are joining the skilled professions prior to the affirmative action policies that after those policies have been put in place. at the higher rate it affirmative-action to increase the number of black college graduates and in fact, has the opposite effect to look at regarding affirmative action policies.

at the university of california the racial preferences has been banned in 1896 with a voter referendum the black college graduation rates at university of california rose more than 50% in say also had the most difficult discipline of math and science and engineering. the policy intended to increase the ranks of the black middle class to have more black college graduates than we would have had. >> talk about affirmative action and the philosophy with that. >> again, i a fake clarence

thomas or anyone else they will say looking at the track record in what is working and what isn't looking at affirmative action and it shows it is mismatching kids with schools it takes smart kid to might do well to funnel them into a more selective school then they are more likely to drop out altogether and then a steady done seven years ago in rolled at m.i.t. they scored in the top 10% of math sats scores of all kids in the country regardless of color. but they read in the bottom 10% at m.i.t. said take a hitting it at a -- out of

the park but at m.i.t. struggling as a result but m.i.t. does not care about that but how the freshman class looked if there is enough diversity or the college catalog has the right look or if those kids are graduating as a secondary concern at m.i.t. but someone who is concerned about the number of black graduates in the country i would like to see more of them graduate. and to show that the absence of affirmative action for graduate than when they are in place. >> host: "please stop helping us" en how liberals make it harder for blacks to succeed" the author is with us today jason riley this is a very hot topic it i am thrilled to be sitting here today talking with you because it is interesting what you have to say. you go by fax and as a reporter i get a different

set of facts but it is from the listener and "the reader" and the viewer and i appreciate what you have to say. >> guest: there are lots of footnotes in the index to back up but i am saying. so people campbell conduct themselves. >> host: let's go back to the affirmative action situation to the university of michigan and talking about preference talked about the bush years with the university of michigan but talk about the examples of the m.i.t. but what about harvard that really go out and recruit americans to come in and give them scholarships? and they have been battling back and forth from those i

believe schools in general. >> many of those are black immigrants by the way not those that grew up in the black subculture that i talk aboutv in this book. there have been a number of studies which blacks are graduating and many are immigrants then look at education across the country particularly in big cities you have selected types of schools and those black kids that manage to get into an end to the immigrants but the issue of affirmative action is are we helping the intent degree -- the group? would lower the standard of the commission may help you're hurting their chances to graduate?

>> but in this society i hate to say this but you don't make anything. >> but why are we assuming it is yale or nothing. >> talking about m i t it is a wonderful school but the other ivy league schools have made appeals but harvard has been prominent. >> guest: i have no problem with harvard the recruiting kids but the problem is when they recruit kids who cannot handle the work to make the freshman class more diverse that is what i have a problem with. >> where did go to school? >> for they can handle the work where they can graduate just like the rest of kids in america did you see a

higher graduation rate of a person enters says of freshman that is where kids graduate. >> host: interesting conversation. talking about another topic going back to the title of the book "please stop helping us" how liberals make it harder for blacks to succeed" voter it is the big issue especially since the been talking to check to a with this black president to read a piece from your book that says it's just so happens the turnout for the first time on record even while implementing the voter id laws 66-point to percent

voted in the 2012 presidential election higher than that 64 percent of non-hispanic whites who do so according to the census bureau. so do we need voter id? >> guest: i address this in the book because it is shameful the way the attorney-general eric holder the essentially goes around the country to scare blacks by saying that these laws are passed to disenfranchise us say of that evidence does not support that. as i said black voter turnout in 2012 exceeded whites and that negate some of obama of presidency it as if it is just a phenomenon but that dates back to the clinton years, and the black

voter turnout was increasing the other point to make is not only most democrats and republican vin and women and conservatives and liberals support voter id so do most black americans. the president is out there telling people to support voter id in the majority of the number of polls have shown this tell them the republicans are not interested in integrity but suppressing their boat in my point is given the turnout trends that republicans are trying..ip dividend that voter turnout also went up that is some of

the strictest brodeur id laws in the country. >> host: with voter id they say it promotes the racial issues of the past. >> guest: is false. you need an identification to get cough medicine. >> host: certain cough medicine. >> guest: to get a library card. the idea that it is too much to ask people to produce identification to vote is insulting to blacks. and most blacks agree with me because the majority have told pollsters that they support voter id. it is wide and deep you would not know that due to the white house rhetoric it is wide and deep and has been for a long time. >> host: i am sitting with

jason riley the author of "please stop helping us" how liberals make it harder for blacks to succeed". a very, very hot topic and before we go further people say who is this guy and you may have supporters then you have your detractors but let's find out who you are. we understand you were odd though "wall street journal" editorial board and also a contributor on fox news as an independent. correct? where did you get your it is or how did you start out this way or did someone help to shape your ideas? >> guest: it happened and gradually starting in my way to teens. i was not politically aware

as the kid to we did not live in a political household to discuss but in schools through various social studies soar course it is you were required to do so but but in college to start to read the of authors what they said made a lot ofxd sense the fact that they brought a data to the discussion speaking from experience with people like shelby steele a resonated. that was it for me. with the individual to take

me to show me the way or point me in one direction. tea when i graduated from buffalo and born and raised there as well. >> host: talk about your dad that is a household. talk to me about that as it relates to president obama. >> i grew up not only in a home with my father who had a lot of influence although did not live with us but visitation rights for days a week was very much a presence coaching little league baseball but having an extended family strong

and intact my church for my extended family i saw black men all around me with proper english did not swear or drink to excess i had too many role models to account but my father was a part of that.-ac and to appreciate that aspect he was around. >> host: since you have something that obama did not have what is the issue when it comes to talking about black bothers or are you on board? >> up with love to hear that.

i wish you would do it more often. the point i was making is the flak he catches from the of left he is accused of talking down, a condescending, and what comes best to mind. >> it is about a dirty laundry to make the same arguments conservatives make about blacks but to talk about culture as the culprit on what ails the black underclass to day is taboo among blacks. . .,xj racism

and 70% of the community or double-digit unemployment rates in the community. given that in previous times they faced many obstacles in the country we had better outcomes in both of the categories. >> host: please stop helping us how liberals because harder for blacks to succeed. jason riley, when you are on fox news or writing the columns for "the wall street journal" do you include this kind of conversation or dialogue that is in your book? >> guest: i do commentary on television on all types of

topics. most of them not having to do with race that when it comes up, sure. i see these types of thing thind recommeni'vewritten in this boon fact, that's where i said vendors either in the pages of "the wall street journal" or the publications over the years order on television. i have been doing television commentary for about a dozen years now. so there've been many opportunities to speak about these issues and i try to take advantage of them. >> host: what has been your response from the civil rights leaders to sum up this? have touched these anyway and backing and yo you're backing it up wih your fact so what is the response? >> guest: there is a lot of name calling and that sort of fighting childish -- what you don't get is a lot of engagement of the idea. you have seen this happen with clarence thomas.

justice leah is wrong thomas isn't wrong. he's got psychological problems and you get a lot of that. that is a reaction when we engage in the business of pending tree or journalism or politics i get a quite different reaction. that's just common sense. so there is a disconnect between the naacp and the rank-and-file and i think they are wide

differences and it is unfortunate to me that many in the media continue to run to the jesse jackson and al sharpton speech went over the past decade the interest of the jesse jackson and al sharpton i think they verge widely from what the black underclass and particular needs in terms of all of the policies. >> when we go to the break and come back we will talk about these third world issues that you dare to touch in this book. but does it bother you you are a black man, does it bother you when you hear the black community rise up against you? >> guest: that would be melodramatic. >> host: you said they called you names. >> guest: no one likes back, but i think these things need to be said. i don't think liberals and the policies they've put forth have

helped the underclass. i think in many cases and we were talking about affirmative action earlier committee are doing more harm than good. and i think someone needs to point that out. and that is what motivates me. yes there will be name calling but if you are saying what you believe needs to be said and there is a positive contribution to the debate and it is important some name-calling is something you can put up with. >> host: jason riley please stop helping us how liberals make it harder for blacks to be. we will be back in a moment. >> "after words" is available via podcast through itunes and xml. visit booktv.org and click

podcast on the upper right side of the page and subject which you would like to download and listen while you travel. >> host: how liberals make it harder for blacks to succeed. we talk about the third rail and it comes to president obama's address to the nation and any announcement or the speech to the nation about almost a week later after the george zimmerman verdict. a week later almost president obama came to the briefing room to the press corps and he knew

about racial profiling and things of that nature. who is following you with the dispatcher told them what to do or not do. what i took to task is the various debates we wanted to drag into the discussion whether it was gun-control or racial profiling or the perception of the young black men in this country.

we cannot divorce that conversation is from black behavior. i don't think we can talk about racial profiling without talking about black criminality there's a book i write about of the new jim crow. to bring up the black crime statistics she complained that length about the black incarceration rates that leads to those higher black incarceration rates and as i pointed out earlier the black incarceration rates into the gap in 1960 was narrow an dam it is

today. it's whiter now, and obviously. if you think that there was or is a racist criminal justice system out there response responding or responsible it have to be much more racist back in 1960 dan is today when eric holder who reports to another one, president obama. >> host: tour talking about george zimmerman and the acquittal and talking about racial profiling. at the end of the day there's a young man that his dad more a hoodie. was he racially profiled? >> guest: yes i believe he was because of the color of his skin and the way that he was dressed. i don't have any doubt about that really.

>> host: if i have a martha's vineyard hoodie and i choose to wear my hoodie and have my hair pulled back and no makeup, you don't know if i am a man or a woman. >> guest: if we have a problem with black man being perceived as more likely to commit crimes, we need to do something about the crime rate behind those. >> host: the federal government, state government coming universal, what should be done to prevent these kind of things from happening. >> guest: the title of the book is about what we should stop doing.

it's to go easier on criminals. he wants to reduce sentences. in the lower rate than they currently are because there is a disparity between the rate of the black suspensions and white suspensions. let's go back to the powder versus crack cocaine. it may not be about the disparity. it was a 100-1 disparity where those who had used crack cocaine got a much larger sentence and those who did powder cocaine. they are the groups that are

thought to do so the disparity has been whittled down to the obama administration and there is a racial element to their. >> guest: you know who put that in place clicks >> host: bill clinton had a chance to put it down. they wanted the law-enforcement to crack down on this and that is what happened. it was racially based there was a racism behind it. it's not accurate. >> host: they had to start from a basis and i remember i

was around at that time. so what we had to negotiate with its 100-1. when they were working with bill clinton and they kept moving it down. it's to increase the sentencing. you don't have to reduce the sentencing. second, no one is asking why the administration sympathies are with the drug dealers and not victims of their crimes. how does it help the communities to have them returning back to the neighborhood sooner rather than later. how does that help the law-abiding individuals of the community's? and of course the majority of

people are law-abiding and they have to live through this nonsense because of the thugs that make life a living hell for them. similarly, in the schools. how does it help the kids that go to school to learn if he forced the schools not to suspend the rat rates they othee would have for the federal government. my sympathies are with the law-abiding residents of the ghetto i want to see them achieve and get out ahead but it's more difficult for them to do that. >> host: you talk about the issues that include the minimum wage and immigration hot button issues right now and we are talking about the book thi but t

conversation. the author please stop helping us how liberals make it harder for blacks to succeed. cut about your feelings on immigration reform and what you say and d in the book of the immigration reform. >> guest: this book i don't gebut i don't getmuch into the m when we see the higher levels immigration we should see the lower levels of black employment and vice versa but that isn't what the data shows and as you know it's been doubled the white rate in the decades and it's been irrespective of the immigration trends in the country, so i don't think that hispanics should be scapegoating

in the black high unemployment rate. on the minimum wage and other policy that is intended to help blacks were but it is a very poor black and high poverty tool. most people already make more than the minimum wage. most people who make the minimum wage are not poor. poor households are in that circumstance typically because no one is working in the house. not because there are people working at jobs that don't pay enough. so, what they need is a job more than a raise and to lift themselves out of poverty. and so, to the extent that minimum wage has young or lesser experience out of the labor market to the extent that they result in a reduction of jobs overall in the economy they do not help dress poverty even though the left continues to solve minimum wage hikes as

anti-poverty tools. >> host: as we talk about minimum wage and you write in the book about the minimum wage and we talk about other issues that are in this book how liberals make it harder for blacks to succeed what is your personal commitment that you feel has a black man to the black community or maybe you think it is saying stop being in charge of the cdc. >> it's important not to be put in the groupthink and it's not to say the right thing for fear that he will be called names. and i think it's amazing how young they can take hold of a black person. i remember going to visit my older sister at home many years

ago shortly after i started at "the wall street journal." i was in a conversation with my niece, her daughter and asking her how school was going and she stopped me in the middle of a sentence and said why do you talk white and she turned to her little friend sitting there and said that since my uncle soundbites? why are you trying to sound so smart? and i laughed but is stuck with mit stuck withme but she said. here was an 8-year-old, 9-year-old leading the race to intelligence and knowing sophisticated enough to avoid a certain speech patterns herself and mock them in others. i had forgotten how young this stuff starts. >> host: yet you have experienced that, michelle obama has experienced about.

so many african-americans have experienced that when you are not necessarily trying to have a street lingo to work in the business world. >> guest: there are limits. >> host: so you are talking self responsibility. >> guest: and getting the indice culture and order. i think those are the things that need to take place. blacks develop the kind of attitudes and habits and behaviors that other groups in america had to develop for them to rise into the exten and to ta government policy however well-intentioned gets in the way of that self-development, it is more harm than good. >> host: when does the political structure get anyway

because right now washington is in gridlock. we have a republican here and they are not coming together and the question is you have groups of people who are in need and there is fighting not looking at the groups of people that yes -- >> guest: i don't know there's a political solution to what i'm talking about other than encouraging the government to get out of the way and stop doing some of the things it is doing. raising the minimum wage is on the labor force, stop doing it. when you block school choice block them from attending a private school or better public school. you are not helping them and that is what democrats and many liberals continue to do. push policies that side with the teachers union and the adults in the education system and the need of the kids, particularly poor kids who often times are black. >> host: it's interesting that the republican party particularly since george bush's first term, they were trying to get more of the black vote and

then katrina happened and they knew that it wasn't going to happen. >> guest: you have republicans here and there who are trying and paul ryan comes to mind, chris christie in the election in new jersey and you have stephen goldsmith in indianapolis, but those are all exceptions to the rule. i think that republicans still believe that they can win without the black vote. i don't believe the racial animus is driving it. it's pragmatic politics with one group of time and you are likely to go where you are going to get a better return on your investment in time. right now, for instance, republicans are starting to think they need more latino

voters. and you see this big debate going on in the gop over how to do that outrage. there is no such debate going on among the republican party with the black outreach and i don't think that there will be until the republicans decide they need black voters to win the elections and then i think that you will see the concerted effort to get that vote. >> host: do you find that a problem they are now realizing that there was a problem? they are gender specific and race specific white males. anything else falls along the wayside and they are trying to play catch up. do you find that that is a pandering move to certain to say you are part of this country we have to do this or do you think they need to broaden their umbrella because this is one country not necessarily just one

country that one group. >> guest: i don't like pandering but i think that the left -- i associate it more with the left than i guess what you would call identity. appealing, not appealing to them as americans. so i think that there is hammering that goes on and i hope republicans don't go that route. i think it is a very unifying message, that at times both parties have been guilty. >> host: should they open up for more inclination? >> guest: i think they will have no choice going forward given the changing demographics of the country. the question is how they go about doing that and we will see. but right now at least with respect to the black voters i

don't think that they are making a serious outreach. the speech to the convention every four years isn't in the black outreach. standing up and saying i support school choice is not a black outreach. i think they need to go to the neighborhoods and to the churches and introduce themselves, the people and not let the democratic opponent define them and when they have done that, when those few republicans have done that i would like to see more of that. >> guest: >> host: talk about the independent party and its outreach and its effort if it is one or if it is not one. >> host: those people that are lumped into that group, those that are undecided i call them a party onto themselves. >> guest: i think the polls will tell you they can tell you

how the independent is going to vote if they get one or two more follow-up questions answered. people like to call themselves independent. >> host: it can swing an election so they are an important group. a lot of them are coming down. both sides probably want a bigger tent i should say. but you're right in particular i think it is something on their mind right now but i would say more so with respect to latinos at this point. >> host: please stop helping us. that alone just makes you worry. please stop helping us how liberals make it harder for blacks to succeed. he has been giving his thoughts, very informed thoughts that have

footnotes and all facts and figures that he is basing his information on. but as we look through this book i want to go back to the black unemployment rate and talking about -- you are talkin were tat how people don't work in the household. >> guest: most of them there are no workers. >> host: where do they get their money? >> guest: the government and that's the problem. what they need is a job. the best anti-poverty program is a child not an increase in the minimum wage. so people already make more than the minimum wage. >> host: so these people that are not working and rely on the government sometimes are people that fall through the cracks and they need to have training programs and things of that nature to bring them up out of where they are to get into society again.

>> guest: i don't think a majority of them are. i think you were talking about the culture of dependency generation after generation the stigma is gone in many cases. what these people need is a work ethic and i don't think open-ended welfare programs develop a work ethic which is ultimately going to be the ticket out of poverty. >> host: what is the guy is going to change the dependence on the liberal party in your opinion? >> guest: we have to stop making excuses for the defect in the black culture. certain attitudes that are counterproductive for instance. that is something that needs to be denounced and not explained away or swept under the rug. we have to realize that they are

scoring worse on the standardized tests and graduation rate outcomes and so forth not because the test or the teachers are using the methods of instruction -- postcode wheedling on the liberals or the family structure? >> guest: it's because blacks are reading twice as much as the white kids into the asian kids and we need to come to terms with that. there are cultural problems. they are not necessarily political problems. we have to help in this regard, and i think that what the government can do beyond what it's done in terms of passing the civil rights act and the voting rights act, giving legal recourse when they do feel they have been discriminated against, beyond that there is not much the government can do and we get in trouble when we start doing what johnson called for almost

50 years ago at the start of the great society program. he said he wanted equality as a result. he wanted equal outcomes. you're not going to get equal outcomes based on the human history not only in the u.s. or anywhere else. you are not going to get the perfectly racially proportionate outcomes of the type that left is pushing for. it's an unrealistic goal. .. that and that is something that black leaders of old used to understand. if you go back to frederick douglass or go back to the perky washington this is what they were saying. they were optimists. they said i think we are going to have them one day. but the more important job is to read the people and to be able to take advantage of those opportunities once we have been. and that has been the failure of liberalism in my mind.