hard for the country to get back to its senses and the establishment clearly is not going to leave that. .. for the veterans but people in service -- i have been running this for years and i have to admit that none of my left-wing readers picked up on it -- the military actually has qualities that are distinctive in this society. they are a model for what we could work on to restore our patriotic solidarity. commitment in uniform up and down. they say we take orders and we do what the system says we got a do whether we like it or not. but the system owes us.

we are seeing this play out now. the politicians have made some choices reticulated republicans supporting the iraq war and the democrats. they made cheap commitments and now they have thousands of kids with their legs blown off. or their mind screwed up by war. we have to take care of them. >> we have to leave it there thank you. >> more live programming coming our way. later today, a discussion on how the media covers asian-american issues. the focus on the asian journalist association. it is live on c-span 3. we are at a bullying prevention summit hosted by federal partners in bullying prevention.

and a look at the primetime programming tonight. at 8 eastern it is our american history tour. we travelled looking for civil war stories. and booktv tonight. books on hilary clinton, obama, and the snowden links. and american history tv. sports and history is the theme. >> here are some of the highlights for this weekend. a history tour looking at the civil war. this weekend the communicators visits a technology fair on capital hill. sunday on q and a pat buchanan is here. books on hilary clinton, obama and snowden tonight. the weekly standards on afterwards and we tour the

littery sites of casper, wyoming. and the negro league and the depiction of slavery in movies. and an interview with herbert hoover. call us and let us know what you think. or e-mail us. join the c-span conversation. like us on facebook and follow us on twitter. >> we will wrap up today's edition of washington journal with a round table discussion on census bureau studies. this segment is just over half an hour. " continues. host: >> host: it is our america by the numbers segment that we do on friday's on washington journal. we are taking a look at the aging nation and the future of baby boomers.

jennifer ortman is here with the united states census bureau. and richard johnson from the urban institute and retirement policy director. welcome both of you. >> thank you very much. >> host: one thing we found is the older population is projected to double from 43 million to 84 million by 2050. tell us about why that is happening and what it means for the united states. >> we are projecting the older population is going to double between 2012 and 2050. if we look at the period from 2012-2030 as we see the baby boomers turning 65 and such, baby boome we will see it from 14% to 20% by 2030. 1-5 americans by 2030 will be 65 and older.

>> as far as how we prepare for it as a nation, what does that mean? >> there are policy implications and i think richard could elaborate. >> host: are we ready for that? >> it isn't the crisis people are saying it is but it a challenge. we will see changes in the workplace. more people working. the workforce is going to be older in 2030 than today. it will have impact on government outlays. more on social security and medicare and medicare for older people. we will see changes in community. it will be more important that communities have features in place that allow people to age. for example, more transportation and more accessible. changes to housing. housing modifications so people can stay in their homes and not go into nursing homes if they become frail. we will see changes not only in

government outlays but in government revenues so as more people retire we have more people out of the workforce and we will have lower income tax revenue and payroll taxes. so it a lot of impacts. >> host: and one thing is the growth population is getting older and the make-up as well. the population over 65 is expected to be 30% minority and that is up 21%. what does that mean? sgr >> the nation as a whole is getting more diverse. we are projecting the total population will be majority minority by 2033. no race will have more than 50% share of the population. if we look at the percent minorities some are grouped other. we are seeing increase in the porportion of the minority

population. -- porportion -- and for the older population they are not as diverse but we are seeing an increase for the older population. 39% of the older population is projected to be a minority by 2050. that is compared to 21% of the older population being a minority in 2012. >> host: what about men and women? >> in terms of the older population it is a trend there are more women than men. women tend to outnumber men in the older population. but we are seeing in the projections that life expectancy will continue to be longer than watt we see. as we see the gains from birth and at age 65 we see the share of the population in the older ages that male is projected to shift up a little bit so that in terms of women outnumbering men it will not be as much the case

in the future. >> host: richard johnson when you look at factors like how many men and woman are part of the older society are there special consideration for the united states to figure in? >> the narrowing of the life expectancy gap and men are catching up is good news for wom women. wy are projecting the number of widows will decline over the next 20-30 years and that is good. when women become widows their economic shrinks. they have high rates of poverty so that is a good change. and the older population is going to be better educated than they are today.

so that will help their financial well-being and their health status. >> if you have questions about the aging population we have divided the line. 18-24 and 35-49 and 50-64 and those 65 and over 202-585-3883. this tells us ultimately people are living longer. isn't that correct? >> that is what a lot that is driving this. the large number of births between 1964 and 1965 is causing the shift but it is driving by the fact people are living longer. what some people call the aging crisis is good news we are living longer. >> host: combanything to add?

>> the composition of the older population is expected to shift. i have a graphic looking at the distribution of the older population by age and we are seeing 56% is between 65-74. out in the future the portion of the youngest population is going down. 56% in 2012 to 45% in 2050. and in the oldest old categories are shifting. so aging and people living longer we will see older old people living in the population. >> host: you look at the numbers that way and question quality of life as they get older to be considered as well. >> that is the fact. and the fact the older population is growing rapidly is creating challenging. 65-74 and we say maybe we can

mitigate the problems created by the aging population. people could work longer and that helps a lot in terms of people's well-being and retireme retirement. it is unrealistic to think that people are going to be continue working and what we see at those ages -- that is when the long-term care needs and that is when people start moving into nursing homes. the good news is residences are much less common but people are getting more in-home services and that is expensive and family helpers and the burdens that an aging parent creates on families is real. >> host: mr. johnson and jennifer ortman joining us. peter from sterling heighters mission for 65 and older. >> caller: good morning.

thank you for taking my call. my question is directly related to the census bureau, ms. ortman. a couple years ago i received a survey from the census bureau that had a cover letter attached and they were trying to determine the future infrastructure needs of my area. i found it to be highly objectionable, intrusive and the bureau followed up because of my refusal to answer it with people coming to my door and i refused to talk to them and countless phone calls. what gives the government the right to go after us like this? it is worse than telemarketing situati situations. i expect an answer. >> any survey conducted to collect data and provide statistics about demographic

characteristics and social characteristics of the nation and it is used by policymakers and others to understand the current population and considering what the future population might look like and also in terms of allocating resources across the country. so if you have concerns or questions i encourage you to contact the bureau directly. there are offices for the regional offices or head quarters. we welcome your calls and are interested in your concerns. >> host: carolyn from rockville, maryland. >> caller: i have a question for the census bureau. >> host: go ahead. >> caller: when i first tuned into the program the branch chief broke down the demographics for the aging population but she said something interesting.

she said that the majority minority and there is an emphasis on racial classification. this is an important topic about aging populations and what it will look like because i am 32. i am trying to figure out why does the census bureau care about racial classifications of the aging population? i kind of feel like that takes away from the overall point and the things we need to talk about

that. >> looking at race is important because we see differences in economic outcomes by race and health status and differences in terms of long-term care needs. so if we think concern groups are going to have different levels of needs it is important to see how the composition of the population is changing. it isn't just the fact the population is growing but it is how is it changing. those characteristics are important to make the right decisions. >> host: i am looking at a chart showing the population of those 65 and older sarting in 2012 and

ending in 2050. what is this chart telling us and what is important to know? >> the chart is summing up about what the reports have been saying. you see the bars showing and you can see the change here with 43 million up to 73 million americans age 65 and older. and that shift between 2012-2030 is being driven by there baby boomers. by 2030, all of the baby boomers are 65 and older. 14% of the population is 60 and over. >> host: and percentages are about to stay the same? 21%. anything to add? >> we are really going to see

this dramatic change over the next 15-20 years. staying at that level for a while and that is what we are seeing over the next 15 years is the movement into the baby boomer years. >> host: 7,000 a day turning 65 and older every day. >> i think it might be 12,000. >> host: brian from vermon, new york. 65 and older. >> caller: congrats to c-span. they create important programs. i am over 65 and i listen to the news and all of that. i find that the problem is the greed in america. these rich corporations don't pay their share fair of taxes. they have loopholes that would

add to social security if they were paying their fair share so we would not have a deficit projected into the future. do you understand? >> caller: ronald, before you go, how prepared are you? do you have savings? >> caller: i have social security. >> caller: any retirement savings? >> caller: no, my pension from a union isn't much, but if it wasn't for social security i would be in the shelters. >> host: ronald has pension and social security but no savings. is that common? >> about half of them rely on social security for half or more of their income. 24% of them rely on social security for 90% of their income so it is really important. other sources of income are

predominantly pensions. very few people save outside of the pension system and their employer sponsored plan. housing is important and housing wealth can help in terms of security. what we see is many people don't tap into their savings and stay in their homes and don't take out reverse mortgages. >> host: any statistical information you want to add as far as the savings or what they depend on? >> i would like to mention we have additional statistics on income occupation available on census.gov and released a report with additional information about education and those characteristics. >> host: here is nick,

enterprise, alabama. go ahead. >> caller: my question is regarding the changing population. so the question is the media is showing millennial employment and unemployment. how is the growing longevity going to affect because people grow older and retire and are out of the workforce. but baby boomers are staying in the workforce causing higher unemployment with the lower age brackets. so how is the younger replacing those who are older and retired? >> that is a big concern. a lot of attention is devoted to this issue of the fact that retireess are not retiring and

taking jobs from young people. data doesn't bear that out. when there is a deeper session like we just came out of -- recession -- when the labor market is week there could be displacement going on. longer term there is not. i think there are two issues here. one is what about people who have been hit hard by the recession. younger people and there is concern that if they were unemployed it is going to take years to get back to a solid job and they will never make up the earnings they lost. they might be permanently on a lower trajectory and their wages might always be lower and that is a concern. but we are seeing slow growth in the size of the traditional working age and i think the employment prospects are going to improve.

we have a short-term problem but longer-term the fact that older people are working longer is going to be good for the economy and make everyone wealthier. >> host: population here shown. what are we looking at? >> we are showing the blue line is the size of the population under 18 and the red line is the size of the population 65 and older. it is interesting to compare the projections of the youngest and oldest segment of the population. 2010, 40.5 million 65 and over while the population under 18 was 74 million. looking to the future there is a small amount of growth for the population under 18 growing to over 89 million in 2016 and contrast we can see again due to the growth of the older population drivenby the baby

boomers the older population is projected to double by 2050 and projected to become larger than the population under 18 in 2056. >> host: which means? >> that is the question and i think rich might want to speak to that. >> you know, i think what is really interesting here is the ratio of older people to workers. that old age dependency ratio. when we have too many retirees and too many workers that is when we get into economic problems. that is what is driving social security problems. fewer workers and more retirees. so each worker has to support more retirees. and it is scheduled to run out of money 15 years away. >> host: what is happening to

generation xy and so on? their future's are questionable? >> yes. they probably will have better retirement outcomes than the generations that come behind them. i say that because for people born in 1960 and later, some of them are baby boomers but they are facing the retirement age of 67 versus 65-66 and retirees today. so less social security benefits for them. we had a long period of wage stagnation. the median wage in the country has been flat since 1980 for men at least. women have seen some gains and that is a good sign. but men have slow growth in wages and people are not able to save. the baby boomers have pensions which is rare for younger folks. so the real challenge is and

they can be addressed it isn't a crises but is for people after the baby boomers. >> host: santa cruz, california, beverly. >> caller: i would like to speak with mr. johnson. i am wondering if you can address the issue that payment isn't made into social security past $110,000 on income and what i have read is that if these people did pay into the social security system over $110,000 like everyone paid and continued to pay no matter what their income is the system would be solved. i am wondering why is that not happening. >> host: thanks for your question. >> beverly raises an important

point. social security is facing financial problems. more money is being paid out of social security than is coming in in taxes and by 2033 the trust fund that has been built up is going to be depleted. when that happens, social security is only going to be able to pay 75% of the benefits it has promised. one of the solutions as beverly said would be the raise the payroll tax. we raise the cap on the payroll tax. it is now $117,000. if you make more than that your benefits are not subject to taxes but also not benefits either. so the argument has been well if we were to raise that tax, beverly is right, a lot of social securities and problems would disappear. that is if we don't give benefits on additional taxes.

if we don't give benefits on additional taxes it means that high income people don't get a good deal from the system. and you might say maybe that is not so bad. the risk you run is social security becoming a welfare system. it has broad support because everyone is getting something out of it and it is good deal for almost everyone. we need to think long and hard to the extent we change the system and if it will erode support among quarters. i want to point that this proposal beverly mentioned gets a lot of attention and part of that is because the wages are more unequal over time social security used to cover 90% of all earnings and now it is 83-84

percent so if we could get back to the 90% and that would raise it up to the upwards of $200,000. it is serious question. >> host: bill from north carolina. hello. >> caller: good morning. how are you? >> host: fine. thank you, go ahead. >> caller: i am a retired auto maker who retired at 59. i have a pension and took social security at 62 actually. i still work part-time jobs because i need something to do. and i don't have complaints. but i often wonder when they first instituted social security what makes me wonder is was the government really concerned about older people and their having some kind of income? or did they figure people don't live that long and we will have a butt load of money to do

whatever we want with? >> bill, i think the reason for social security in 1935 was to eliminate poverty at older age. it was a problem back then. it is much less a problem today but without social security it would be a much more serious problem. bill is right in that people didn't live that long in 1935 and so not many people were living nearly as long as today and not collecting as much. on the other hand the payroll taxes were a lot lower so expected benefits were lower but you were paying less into it. you know, social security continues to be, and at the time it is longevity insurance that will protect you if you live to 80 or 90 so you will not run out of money before you die. that is what it is for and continues to do that and that is why it is important we continue

to protect it. >> host: your organization compared aging population for the united states and other countries and provided a chart for us. what are we looking at and why is it important to see the comparisons. >> aging isn't just a united states issue. it is happening around the world. if we look at this graphic we are showing on the left the percent of the world and selected countries and the percentage of their population 65 and older in 2012 and on the right the projected percentage for 2050. the world is projected to grow older. 8% of the population is 65 and over and that is projected to increase by 17% by 2050. looking on the next session, this is developed countries. the united states is one of the youngest with about 14% of the population 65 and older.

we are along with russia, canada and ukraine. japan, italy have 25% of the population 65 and over. we look over to 2050 and there is a big shift but the united states is the youngest developed country. with japan, germany, italy, spain and these are countries where more than a third of their populations are projected to to be 65 and older. the united states is aging we will still remain one of the youngest developed countries in the world. >> as far as how the other countries handle their aging population can you talk about how they address the issue? >> so it is a growing problem in europe as the numbers indicate that many of the countries are older than the united states. so they are starting to have to now many european countries are

shifting the way they provide retirement benefits. what they are doing is we are seeing in germany in particular is an increase in the retirement age so you cannot get the equivalent of social security in till 67. so they are forcing people to work longer. >> host: from new york. this is dan. >> caller: jennifer ortman, what is my legal responsibility to answer the census and how far will the law go to enforce the response? and real quick because last census i could not answer it and i had an agent show up at my house 3-4 times in the evening, during the day, wanting 20

minutes or half hour of my time. and after i told them i don't have time for this i am self-employ ided. >> census forms are mandatory and everyone is required to send them back and the community forms are mandatory as well. the surveys provide us with important information provides to the public and policy makers in terms of planning, allocating resources and make informed decisions based on the composition and characteristics of the population. >> host: what the next as far as your analysis of this snapshot?

is there another survey to look at the issue? >> we produce projections every two years and will have a series in december. we will continue to update the projections to provide the most up-to-date information we can in terms of what the population might look like in the future. i will say the aging of the population is something we will continue to see. because you look at this on a regular bases, anything in the report that startled you? >> we did focus on the youngest and oldest segment in this report. aging is a population we have seen for a long time so it wasn't surprising. but seeing the shift where the younger ager is projected to be lower than the older population was interesting. >> jennifer ortman with the

census bureau and richard johnson with the urban instenste thank you both. >> tomorrow, we will talk about the u.s. air campaign in iraq and later we look at the upcoming mid-term elections and we will wrap it up with kathy synder who focuses on the mil r militarization of the country's police force. >> here is what is coming up on c-span two. next a look at unauthorized charges to wireless phone bills. a practice known as cramming. and later a conversation with christopher hitchens. he talks about his terminal

illness before he dies. >> i have your memoir in my hands and the first seven pages are all about death. did you have any premonition? >> no, but it is weird. i had a free gift from the portrait gallery in london about an upcoming exhibition and a paragraph that included me and one of the people featured to day while the catalog was going to press. they put next to my name so for the first time in my life i saw the words in print and it does focus on the nine. i think they thought i was going to sue and they said we will withdraw and maybe a few got out. and i said no, no, send me as many as you have gotten because

it makes a wonderful mini introduction to my memo which i nearly finished. so it is called a prologue of premonition. a meditation on death. >> senator blumenthaul cheered this hearing.

>> this hearing is open and as you know i am the senator from connecticut and i am hear regret regretfully in place of chairman rockefeller who as an intelligence matter and can't be with us at the opening but i don't think he is going to join us. his absence is no way a sign of a lack of interest in this subject. i know he would be here if he could be. i want to welcome all of our panel here and all of the folks attending this subject is one very, very close to my heart as a former attorney general for a couple decades in connecticut i

had first-hand experience with cramming both wireless and landline. as many of you know, more than two decades the telephone industry started to get into the payment processing business and the idea was that consumers could charge purchases to their phone bill rather than a credit card and banking account. at the end of the billing period, consumers pay for the telephone services plus the purchases from the third-party vendors. using a telephone bill to purcha purchase goods and services made sense and attracted