dr. ben carson since down with jackpot of nbc news to spell out his plans to reverse what he argues is america's current decline. our prime time programming concludes at 11:00 p.m. as soviet dukes morris recounts the life of the late conservative commentator and congress will not clear boothe luce. that all happens next on it c-span2 book tv. >> up next ucla georgia lee talked to book tv about her book jumped in, a study of los angeles gangs and gang violence. this 20 minute interview was recorded at ucla and is part of book tv college series. >> host: jumped in was the name of the book. professor georgia lee of ucla is the author.

the subtitle what keynes taught me about violence, drugs, love, and redemption. professor leap from what did cain teach you and tell? >> guest: it depends on which of those you want to begin with, but what they taught me was out there is little difference between all of us. i know that sounds almost like a cliche, but what i derived and continue to learn is that they are not that different. somewhere along the way they took a different turn. >> host: how long have you been working with gangs? >> guest: well, the second question is interesting and leads me into the first. it depends upon who you were talking to. if eager to the lapd or law-enforcement have a very strict definition of what a gang is, three or more people covered getting at a corner or in public playing

with some type of criminal activity. you can get a very, very specific even down to the number definition. >> three or more people. remember, it is not just three people. they're making a plan to do something that does not fall merely into the left, but you take a broader look. gangs come in all shapes and sizes. i have had gang members say that law enforcement is the biggest gang of fall. people belong to a story or fraternity might be perceived as being part of a gang. they have rituals, symbols, all kinds of things. so it depends how long have i been involved? , chilly since i began my professional life has of

very social worker ants of less los angeles in 1978. the real answer is for a long time. >> when you talk about gangs have you? >> i ask the members, i asked him how they see it. the definition does not come for me. i'm more interested in how people identify themselves? if they identify themselves as part of the neighborhood or a part of a gang because never heard, i listened to them. i'm more interested in how they talk to themselves than i am a labor. >> host: help organize our these neighborhoods, these gains? >> guest: i love what father greg boyle said. it is religious organized crime. they are populated mainly by adolescence and young adults if anybody tapped memories back to their own adolescence or teenagers are your and adults, they know

how disorganized, how sort of live for the moment individuals are. now, that is not to discredit the kind of things that we hear about, the drug cartels to our corporate organizations who are very carefully organized a round trip distribution and product. this is not a wino. instead what i have lived with our the different permutations of when -- men and women in los angeles to have come together and identify themselves. >> to they have to five we think of the bloods, the christmas spirit is that where tart brought to the? >> guest: it is fascinating. we did think about the bloods and crips. that is certainly who is in the media and hip-hop and film and things like that. the vast majority of gang members and los angeles in

the county and the city are browned, mexican american and central american or latino. so yes we're talking about african american gangs like the bloods and crips and off their sets and clinics, but we are also talking about latino and mexican gangs like white van switches into the fifth generation, anything from ms 13 which is a central american game, 18th street, some of these very well established gangs. and it people will always say what about the aryan brotherhood, what about asian-pacific gangs, some own gangs. by and large los angeles we're talking about latino and african-american. >> host: does your ethnicity determine which can you may or may not belong to? >> guest: it is becoming more elastic. it used to, but gains by four different members and want to become bigger. i know now that mexican

gangs and central american games will take black members. african american games will. so the real answer to your question is it it depends. also, there are now taking female members. that did not used to be the case a couple of generations ago. >> host: house central to the lives of adolescence and young people in south-central l.a. are these gangs? >> guest: that is a great question. it depends. they are still there. they still -- not to the extent i have seen in the past. does it is still there, still part of the history, still part of the generation , but with the young people i see coming of they are beginning to perceive of alternatives. is a slow, slow process. nothing changes overnight, but i have seen some real

change. the other thing is, will be honest with you, a lot of the geisha south and east los angeles to have migrated. then along her are just in los angeles. they've gone to san bernardino, as far away as las vegas. but i think we need to understand, there are still games, but they're relocated jeff. >> host: what are some of those alternatives that you spoke of that they can see alternatives? >> guest: welcome to the city of los angeles under took a very, very aggressive prevention program a little over five years ago during the tenure of mayor antonio vieira us up. and that was city sponsored prevention. that has had an impact. there are also many, many nonprofit agencies that have labored very long and hard it in south los angeles and these los angeles, and they are finally seeing some

fruits of their labor communities and schools, the community center incentive will. they have worked with one or two generations of gang members. those gang members are now having children or have had children, and they're trying to get them. hermosa involved with a program that it is reaping some benefit called project father heard which is sponsored by children's institute ink. it is a program that helps fathers who were formally incarcerates or former gang members really learn how to father their children. so when you say, let's change that, it is not any one thing but a number of different programs and force is coming together. >> host: what is only industries? >> guest: there is the official meeting. it is the largest gang intervention program in the united states of america and certainly in the city of los

angeles. it sees more gang involvement and women. it is, of course, seem more than any other organization in the country. what it is is that dream of father greg boyle who was a jazz with priest to begin working with gang members three decades ago. and was started in that tiny little shoebox office grew into what is now a huge enterprise trains gang members for jobs, provides therapies and have a series of businesses or social enterprises were the gang members are employed. for example, the home they -- on what date reword remembers when the distress baking, also the home rock cafe where father greg has waitresses with attitude and learn to serve and learn about the food services. are really do feel like i

have arrived because avatar car named after there. they have touched a removal. they have millions of services, everything from a unit of the project father heard that is there talking about helping these gang members i have a parent of children. they have education of glasses, to bring to my gang members get their cds, high-school diplomas. it is quite extraordinary. >> host: is there a percentage of the crime committed in south-central or in l.a. that you can attribute to a gang activity ? >> guest: it depends on who you talk to. and it really is the majority of violent crime in the past was gang-related. it but it is a difficult thing to define because here's the deal i take your wallet. i am a gang member. is that a gang crime or my

just checking your wallet? rice let's say i1 of the plaza de or one of the crips and our desire because you're one of the crips and going to beat you up. should those two crimes be classified the exact same way? one is clearly gang-related. the other is a petty theft. so it is tricky. that is the answer to your question. violent crime in los angeles tennis to be gang-related. certainly in the past the majority of homicides in los angeles were in gang territories and believed to be gang-related. >> host: i just saw on the news they triple murder in van nuys. i did not see any details. could that be a gang activity? >> first of all, talked about in the media, i sure have learned to listen with the third year. they will sell the media, we

are trying to rule whether or not it is being related. there are also signs that suggest it may be gang-related. number one, if it is in a gang territory where gangs are known to function and possibly to work, that is number one. number two, if it does involve young men will it continue to be the greatest perpetrators but the greatest target in violent crime perry of the elderly. so i tend to look at to it and falls, someone who is middle aged or someone who is 21. this is somebody, is there some sign of violence? and also, might there be a sign that it is black on black, black and brown, brown and black. involved in some way. i want to stress to you, i

the one he to watch tv and think bang go. there has been an involvement here. there are things to suggest that when you hear it on the news. sometimes i will hear someone drove by in a car in south l.a. and certain cross sections. i will turn to my husband and so it sounds like one of the neighborhoods is involved. >> host: do you have an idea of how many gang members there are in los angeles? a little number? >> the official story is that -- the official statistics are that in the city of los angeles there somewhere between 40 to 60,000 gang members sibila 40 is 63 the city population of 3 billion. the metro area speech to the county, what you're talking about the estimates are 80 to 100,000.

we have to be reasonable about that. some people have been identified as gang members in years ago. no longer active but still counted. another thing is coming gang members are now popping up saying, i want my card costs. so the numbers are -- >> host: what do you teach your? >> guest: how to save the world and then wakes. i teach a class. i teach undergraduates and graduates. and with undergraduates, a course called intervention to social welfare, westin and -- was often referred to as the jury how to change the world class. i bring in gang members. i bring in people and the child welfare system, the elderly, and the students engage with individuals and. at the graduate level i am

privileged to teach both research and also in the research methods class prices got an interview gang members their religion have to take history and find out what the trajectory of these individuals and of with. >> host: could a middle-aged white guy and a woman in a red dress go anywhere they wanted in south central and pacific? >> guest: no, absolutely not. first of all, yeah, if we went down in the morning for nearly we would be relatively safe. now, everybody there would know we were there. in fact, i have a little cracked and make in my book. the unitas is given had a communications system of games and usher 9/11 would have happened. sort of a bad joke but is to

say that their surveillance in its territory is excellent. if you and i went into selfless and angeles there will be people taxing the to millie's laypeople who looked out of place where got here. now, if we went down its and collected by we will be taking more of a chance. however, if we went the company by someone who was president of navy who was in a gain or just a resident, then it would be a complete response. we would still be seen as outsiders who be seen as somebody navigating a passage into the area. >> host: is there a game president, would of directors, erica? >> guest: there is a hierarchy, with they would never see a president or board of directors. there is. people refer to a shot

collars, lieutenants, no particular levels. leaders of leaders and then there are soldiers. and that is the knowledge of it is used. hierarchy of sorts. it's disorganized crime. so it rains and are rewarded raw or how i started out, i learned it is not that different. and what i learned is very, very smart people, to kill the people and give planners are rewarded in gang life just the way they would be. >> host: have you felt threatened while working, setting? >> guest: no. that may be partially denial also, what i did, i was very, very careful to align myself with people with

leaders as well as former gang members -- i don't want to say they were my body guards, would have tended me, took care of me, vouch for me. also a couple of at it factors. because i have worked as a social worker, believe it or not there were people in the housing development is unremembered me. and they were no grandparents. so they remembered me from three generations back. part of the community. the other thing is no. when i said these folks are smart they have great cross sectors. and they know who is there to do them harm. they know who is there to understand the work with them and read and i think they felt through my motives no, i may be naive and there may have been dangerous did not perceive the letter did

not feel it. on the other hand, i was cautious. it nudges show up and say, hey, i'm interested in learning about a gang members. you can't do that. you will be granted any axis . >> host: professor at ucla, author of this book decompress is the publisher. if you want to learn how the bloods and crips and ms 13 were formed here in los angeles. >> guest: of alameda and for no street. down next to downtown los angeles in chinatown. >> host: thank you for being with us. >> guest: thank you so much. >> every weekend book tv authors programming focused on nonfiction authors and books.

keep watching for more here on c-span2. and watch any of our past programs online at booktv.org. >> host: walter isaacson to my new book coming out this fall. what is it about? >> guest: innovative spirit we talk a lot about innovation these days. the word is almost becomes of the void of meeting through overuse. i wanted to look at how real people into the computer and internet adelle innovation really happened in the digital age. was something that came out of working with steve jobs and before that bill gates to say who made that type of person, how did they end up being successful? so the book is not just about singular people but about teams, but collaboration. one of the things that i discovered in doing this book is that real innovation comes from great teams, not just for a great leaders. >> host: would it surprise you? >> guest: the importance