around to law firms and talk to lawyers. >> guest: bar association's. >> host: bar associations about this type of situation would a lawyer should do. suppose you were teaching in college or high school and you taught a class on watergate and you wanted to tell the students and some grand synthesized way what this was and what is the lesson citizens and students should take away from this extraordinary scandal. >> guest: we had 20 lawyers who got on the wrong side of the law during watergate. that's the best count i can make. 20 got on the wrong side of the wall and many other god on this site without seeing it. many that worked at the nixon white house knew the difference

between what right and wrong. you have a great leader in a test of things. everything that i thought was wrong and later pulled out the law books was wrong. to me the lesson is when it feels wrong it probably is wrong. doublecheck. we also have an interesting situation. >> host: if you are in your 30s only and you are the white house knocked the door down and reach her hand. maybe even go out. it would take an extraordinary amount of courage for somebody to actually do that. >> guest: i blew up one break-in which was the brookings bern the brookings never thanked me for saving that building. >> host: i doubt if they are going to. >> guest: i think you are right but anyway that's one lesson. >> host: is this writer is this wrong? >> guest: exactly and for lawyers as a result of watergate

that came out a set of rules that had never existed before largely because my testimony. that's why it's interesting to do these continuing education programs because they develop real-world ethics rules. if you are in my situation you you have are reporting up requirement and you have to report to the top person. >> host: who is the client? >> guest: there were fascinating conversation about that and the white house counsel if the president is not his client the office of the council is quiet. he's the entity and he has to protect the entity and not the occupant of the entity. this is true with other entities, corporations would have you. the general counsel represents the organization. >> host: common sense should prevail. >> guest: but you have to go in and say mr. president for the

office of the president by march 21 talk would have been much different. i would have said if you don't hear my warning and don't believe this is a problem i have depending on how the rules were put in at that time if there were anything like they are now i have a duty to report no. i have to go to the congress and tell them. that's a lot of leverage. >> host: so who was nixon? >> guest: who was nixon? one very fascinating character very complex individual. he's a different person with different people. something about a million. he's intelligent but at the same time he's remarkably stupid. to make some of the mistakes he makes shows the level of incompetence i didn't think existed. >> host: don't you think he thought he had immunity? >> guest: he does. >> host: i don't mean legally. he was in this bubble.

he's the president. no one is going to challenge him so it starts in a sense what the tapes. the arrogance of the tapes that he thinks he can do this. this wasn't done just a yuan john dean and the aids. it was done to anyone who went into the oval office and he was just kind of saying the confidence that people should expect when they come into the president, we are not going to care about that. it's in my interest to do this taping in them when it was disclosed the idea that no one is ever going to get those tapes. >> guest: he was troubled by those facts and in a couple of conversations he tells haldeman u. know i don't feel comfortable doing this. he knows it's wrong but he does not pull the plug. >> host: and what is amazing about this book is in a sense

it's kind of seals the conclusion about nixon. what you have done this you brought the microscope as close to this presidency is anyone could and for that it's a public service and at the same time it's a really great book and all of the detailed and for somebody who wants to relive and relive in technicolor for many many hours, this will tell the story. >> guest: i found bob dalit's review interesting as a presidential scholar. he said it's not an easy read because it's a painful read because it reminds us of those periods. you are not my audience in my mind. bob dallek was not.

it was people who really don't know what her gate well who have a smattering of knowledge about it. not at the level of dallek or woodward could do. those are the people and the reason i didn't do transcripts is because i find transcripts tedious to read. i know frank gannon also said why didn't he publishes transcripts? i have 23 volumes of three-inch notebooks. that's almost 4 billion words. i mean this is huge. >> host: so 39 years after we first saw you on the national stage on television you have returned and i'm sure in the minds of many people with applause and in the minds of some others the ghost of john dean. thanks so much. >> guest: thank you, bob.

>> up next on booktv "after words" with guest host chuck todd of nbc news. this week ben carson and his latest book "one nation" what we can all do to save america's future. and at the prominent former neurosurgeon and presidential critic proposes a road out of what he calls u.s. decline. he contends his solutions appeal to every american's decency and common sense. this program is about an hour. >> host: dr. carson, i think the best way to start before we delve into your book is to delve into you. tell me, you you have a very inspirational story. tell me where you grew up. >> guest: i grew up in detroit and a couple of years in boston also. my motherame from a large rural family and got married when she was 13 from rural

tennessee. she and my father moved to detroit. he was a factory worker in some years later she discovered he was a bigamist. she had the responsibility at that point with only a third-grade education and trying to races. >> host: how many were there? >> guest: myself and my brothers. i was the dummy. >> host: you were the dummy? that's what i wanted to go to. how do you go from a dummy to a neurosurgeon? >> guest: my mother and i think any success i have had i contribute to god and my mother. she was always seeking wisdom and came up with the idea of opening the eyes and looking around you. she noticed the home she cleaned people didn't watch a lot of tv

and they read a lot of books. she looks at where we lived then she looked at where they lived and somehow it clicked in her mind if i can get my boys to stop looking at tv all day long and start reading and she impose that on this. >> host: did you ever favorite tv show back then? >> guest: i loved everything. we didn't need a "tv guide." i could tell you what was on every station but she basically restricted us to two or three tv programs per week. with all that spare time we had to read two books a piece from the detroit public library. we didn't know she couldn't read. >> host: when did you find out your mom couldn't read? >> guest: later on in high school. and that she got her ged that same year i graduated from high school. anyway by making us read, which i hated something happen happened.

i used to admire the smart kids in the class. i was always saying how can they do that? the teacher asked the question and i knew the answer and it got me excited and i got to the point where i was reading a book. i went from being the dummy to the top of the class in your nap. >> host: tell me the first book you read? my dad made me read profiles in courage in the eighth grade and that was what sparked me in politics. >> guest: was in fifth grade, chipped the dam builder. it was about a but he was a cool. i went on from there and read about every animal book in the detroit library. i started reading about plants and rocks. there were all these rocks and i would get boxes of rocks and pretty soon i could identify in iraq.

>> host: you were a scientist and didn't realize. that may be sparked your interest in science. >> guest: one day the science teacher held up a big black shiny rock and so does anyone know what this is? i never raise my hand that nobody raised their hand so i raise my hand and everybody turned around and couldn't believe it. this is going to be hilarious. >> host: were you known as a jokester? >> guest: they knew i couldn't possibly know the answer so would be something really. i said it's subservient -- adds obsidian. then i explain how obsidian was born. at that moment i wasn't stupid and the teacher invited me to come. >> host: what great is this? >> guest: fifth grade. the teacher brought in to the lab i wanted to start a rock collection for me. i started taking care of the animals and looking through the

microscope does there've -- discovering the whole world of pro-kazakh. >> host: who was your teacher? >> guest: mr. jake. >> host: you never forget that. how long ago was this? >> guest: that was more than 50 years ago. the adjusting thing as i went back to that school and this was several years ago with good morning america. they wanted to trace my roots and mr. jake was still there, balding and potbelly but still. i wanted him to show them the animals because he had a red squirrel at crayfish on all these things. he said we had to get rid of these things. >> host: do you have a relationship with your father? >> guest: not a strong relationship. we would see him periodically. the last time i saw him was when i got married 39 years ago.

>> host: the second family he had do you have a relationship with those have brothers and half-sisters? do you ever forgive him? >> guest: absolutely but i look at the big picture. my mother tried to make up for all that and my father was involved with drugs and alcohol, women. nothing wrong with women but you can't have more than one, that's the problem. that probably would not have been the best influence on me. in retrospect even though i was devastated as a kid and always prayed that he would come back now i realize that would have been the best thing for me. >> host: detroit today, what would you do? >> guest: the same thing that i would be doing -- bring back fiscal common sense. a lot of people blame the unions for what happened to detroit. i don't blame the unions.

unions do what unions do. they would gladly strangle the golden goose for the golden egg. the executives they have a one-year, five-year, 10 year, 15 year plan. they note they kept conceding cap conceding to the union that eventually there would be a problem but they kept doing it anyway because they knew they would have to golden parachute and be long gone. >> host: would be somebody else's problem so you blame us much the executives. >> guest: is the same thing i see around the country. we keep letting it be somebody else's problem. >> host: you know you have gotten a spark of enthusiasm of reason. have you been surprised that it's come from conservatives and do you consume you are a conservative when you did this

because i get the impression you weren't always a conservative. >> guest: obviously like most young people growing up in a place like detroit when i went off to college i was radical. >> host: where did you go to school? >> guest: i went to yale. >> host: what is a radical at yale? various degrees. if you told me radical at berkeley but you know. >> guest: they had their share. there was the black panther rally and all this kind of stu stuff. but it's just the way it was at that time during our history. radicalism was very much accepted at that point. i consider myself really more of a logical person than i am a conservative or liberal or anything. i'm not all that fond of labels that i would say most of our problems are easily solvable if

we could just throw away the labels. i indicated in the book i would love a situation where party designation is not on the ballot but you have to know where that person is. >> host: a lot of cities, the mayor's races is the case and guess who's getting stuff done these days? mayors. they don't have the baggage of the political parties right now. so you go to yale and when you decide i'm going to be a doctor matt? >> guest: i had decided when i was eight years old. i used to love the stories in church. it seemed like they were the most noble people on the face of the earth. great personal sacrifice bringing mental physical and spiritual healing to people and i said that's what i'm going to do before night turned 13 growing up in dire property and decided i'd rather be rich so at that point i wanted to be a psychiatrist.

>> host: so you decided a psychiatrist made better money than a doctor matt? >> guest: on television they have these plush offices in these big mansions. >> host: who were the psychiatrist's? >> guest: most of these programs you would see the psychiatrist. i started reading psychology today and everyone was bringing their problems. >> host: like lucy hanging a sign out there, 5 cents. >> guest: i had luminary professors like on a freud and it was really pretty exciting. when i got to medical school i said everybody has special gifts and talents. i started thinking about my life then i realized i had a tremendous amount of eye and ordination. >> host: with the surgeon. >> guest: is key. it's essential for a narrow surgeon because you dealing with a nebulous mass.

>> host: or pediatric which is even smaller. >> guest: you have to keep in mind world attacks or even know you can't see them. >> host: how did you know you have that skill? >> guest: from some of the jobs that i had done and really performed extremely well. i worked in a steel factory. >> host: what did you do? >> guest: crane operator. >> host: when was this? >> guest: right after i finish college. you would drive these enormous beams of steel through enormous areas and drop them onto the bed of the truck. that they would let me do that after one day. >> host: that's a little scary. >> guest: these guys see something in me that i don't see. >> host: did they really see something or was it like he's the next guy of? >> guest: a lot of guys that i work there a while didn't get to do that. as i thought about it, and a lot

of people thought that was strange because at that time there have been eight black neurosurgeons in the history of the world. to me i didn't think about that. i said this is where my talents are. >> host: i hear an in surgery that basically in some ways the rotation, the one rotation where people identified the plastic surgeon rotation in some ways. you have to know their precise and artistic. now breathe -- but is there choose to do? >> guest: i think there probably isn't a lot of my career was developed on craniofacial surgery with plastic surgeon which is why i have a passion plastic surgery. >> host: you are practicing right now? >> guest: i miss the way it used to be. >> host: what does that mean?

>> guest: there were a lot of things in the process and most people when they chose medicine they chose it because you had a great deal of autonomy. you could sort of figure out wow i can solve this problem and in the early days they would be a kid from bolivia or someplace that have this incredible problem and didn't have resources. >> host: you've figured it out. >> guest: nobody said boo because the hospitals had a big enough war chest that was okay. once the insurance companies got to the point where they could dictate how much they were going to pay and hospitals no longer had a margin and you want to do what for free? are you kidding me? is changing so much in their so much bureaucracy. one of my goals in life is to

try to make medicine fun again. i want doctors to get up in the morning and get excited. >> host: 's should doctors be getting rich? >> guest: dr. should be well compensated. i know a lot of doctors who are not rich. >> host: who should be paid more in our society doctors or teachers? >> guest: i would say it's an irrelevant question. >> host: okay. >> guest: i think people should be paid for what they do. recognize that doctors spent a very long time training to be doctors. they go to college. they go to medical school for four years internship residency. >> host: you argue arguably say it's 12 years of postgraduate work to be a practicing doctor.

>> guest: takes a long time and there's a lot of sacrifice involved and once you do you are working extraordinary hours and then you have the tort issue. with neurosurgeons is particularly bad because everybody thinks they are supposed to be perfect and they are dealing with higher risk. that was one of the reasons that i had a real problem with so-called health reform that doesn't include tort reform. >> host: let me ask you, your christianity is throughout the book. science and faith sometimes collide. you are this highly scientific deeply religious person. some people say that doesn't compute. that doesn't always compute. >> guest: first of all i would

say i'm not deeply religious but i have a very strong relationship with god. there is a difference. >> host: let me pause you there. what's the difference? >> guest: the differences religion tends to be more form and faith tends to be more substance. in the name of religion a lot of really silly stuff has been -- however people who have a deep relationship with god i think have a tendency to do things in a different way. >> host: now go to the science versus faith. >> guest: i actually believe that science and faith can be quite compatible. i've had some interesting discussions with nobel laureates who say how can a person of your intelligence believed that god

created heaven and earth and all the staff? i say how can a person of your intelligence believed that something came from nothing to quite explain to me exactly how that works. so i will give you that there is something. just, there's something. now you are going to tell me it explodes and we have a perfectly organized solar system to the point that we can predict 70 years have been a common is coming and earth rotating on its axis. so that just happened, right? they say well you know if you have enough explosions over long enough period of time that eventually one of them will be the perfect explosion and that is what will happen. so if i blow a hurricane. junkyard over billions of years billions of times eventually there will be a perfectly formed 747 ready to fly, right?

.. >> >> the only one that survived are the beaks that could break through to extract nutrition.

so what i actually believe happening is the creator has given to his creatures the ability to adapt to their environment. >> natural selection? >> absolutely. i'm a nap -- may not call that darwinism but creatures are able to adapt to their environment. >> host: is it 6,000 or 6 billion? >> guest: i don't know the answer to that. the bible says in the beginning god created the earth. >> host: some people say one day could have spent 1 billion years and people that have defended that but it is that something? >> guest: nothing tells us how old the earth is. it could be billions but

also i believe the recent colitis is guy he does stuff that we cannot do it the wanted to create something that already had age he could do that. that is why he is a guide. >> host: senior scientific education you feel does not conflict? >> i have never had an instance where my belief in god is conflicted by my ability. >> absence of malice a surgeon with a god complex that is a stereotype is that unfair hollywood of most surgeons it? eighty-one no doubt some surgeons have very large egos.

you don't get people. [laughter] and no incredibly base surgeons and carrying. >> host: i get why they might have a guide complex they're the only one that can solve the problem in their head and that is where this comes from. >> guest: in this unfortunate. >> host: how did you. >> i personally remember and i also recognized a lot of things depend on the situation.

he was involved is virtually everything that he has done. there always people involved in not that there is the thing wrong with that but i would not have realized some of those complex operations. but i had to consult with a cardio thoracic surgeon to understand though polls -- the whole concept in work with the plastic surgeons? how will we get this covered ? a lot of people besides ms. so far involved.

>> and let's get to one more question so much treasure scientific background to tell you? >> it tells me if you look get the ear that any given point in time and as you may remember you may be too young in the seven days time or "newsweek" had a big glacier the space stage is coming. now it is global warming. it depends on what period. this is what i say whether we get colder or warmer we have a responsibility to take care of our environment. that is a bottom-line greed of have to argue for your harder coulter but had we intelligently take care of

our planet things are always changing. a kidney york city or new jersey you have to make public policy decisions based on rethink that is the importance to figure this out. >> guest: is also important to not get overly involved with paranoia about it as far as i am concerned we should be keeping junction with the research facilities how can we best utilize our resources? and not developing best i don't think that is a wise use. >> but the whole concern is

the focus what the problem was basically the entire aerosol industry changed this is the case were a problem was identified coming solution was identified industry fought it hard but then blow and behold we moved on and industry adopted. >> i am not saying that. >> absolutely but what i say is we need to take a balanced approach as you saw from reading the book i say that about everything. said order for an eagle to fly high and straight it needs to wing's rights and laughed everything in a lopsided way my way or the highway you will crash. >> host: your this highly intellectual person you go to the best school and taught at the best school

the were concerned about elitism? >>. >> guest: because there are a class of people the you see at the university's right now who believed that they are the beacon of light for everything and if somebody does not agree with them if they'd want anybody to hear them if they have a business they want to shut it down if they have a reputation they want to destroy it that you have to be the cat's meow. >> when did you say i am following this and the highly acclaimed searching?

at all know if there was the dramatic moment. i have been talking about these issues you'll see a whole health reform laid out i am not johnny come lately but what change me and the perception was the national prayer breakfast because i spoke my mind why was concerned about it. >> kevin interesting challenge in chapter six of your book this is a concern

how people will get too much of one side they follow conservatives on twitter one channel here or there. but pretend you're a member of a different political party to make a rational defense so a rational defense, put seeing you on the spot to. >> everybody should have health insurance we need to find a way to make that possible. and since we have a lot of bright people we could probably figure out better than the private sector to those that are benign.

>> but what part of the president's plan you would keep? >> certainly lifetime limits >> you do extensive surgery you understand that a young family having a pediatric neurosurgery could bankrupt them. >> excluding people those are horrible things and in fact, talk to a high administration official before this was passed. i think everybody would agree so why not take those things to make them the foundation of health care reform? it could be bipartisan. health care is something we all need.

is to have unanimous a disagreement. why would you do that? that is the problem to take these issues where we keep polarizing. >> why do we have to keep doing this? why the white called the book. >> "one nation"? because the the american people you would have made the first goal is the next

step then is where the collision happened spinach not that we have not been adequate resources the had the you design it? >> they have control of what they put their money on. >> so with the health care savings account? >> with the variety of different ways the same money that we spent you

don't lose it if you don't use that there is no limits. there is a number of ways and also give people the ability. >> but those that he and you money would you put some government money into this? babies start out $5,000? >> if we take all the people in this country we will fall short of where we are now. this is the key thing here

made to have something done. looking up the food stamps program because people would be irresponsible. then they go out. >> but you don't have to put limits on. >> people learn by themselves. they learn how to stretch it out to make it work. that brings the whole freedom economics. >> so hospitals are as much of the problem because they will charge a ridiculous amount by father died with long diseases she would go through the bill but they

are charging crazy amounts of money. >> guest: it is because of the cost is only $2,000 but if they post when dash they put that down they get 300 itself with a 20,000 then they will okay 3,000. is all a game. friday bring reform? >> host: it sounds like that was tough but the end of working with the insurance company and not the hospital. >> guest: if you are in charge through that hasa you do not go through that you go to the other one. that is the way the free market works. >> so the only way to reform the system is out of the

insurance business? to make you cannot have all these artificial is. >> host: so you say no insurance? >> no. what i say is for all routine health earhart 80% can be paid through a gsa but people do have major and catastrophic issues that is what insurance is for. that is what always should have ben for. >> host: everything is catastrophic like cancer policies for 80 year olds don't exist anymore that is what you get those for the big diseases and take the other stuff -- the other stuff off completely. >> if you spray your ankle and you need an x-ray that comes out of your age to say a physical?

agents say birth control? hsh. not hobby lobby do not impinge on your major medical what happens to the cost? >> it comes down dramatically. >> host: now we have insurance lobbyists and companies and hospitals health care is among the fastest-growing sectors so had to enact the plan? >> keep in mind insurance is insurance. so homeowners insurance if you have a high deductible guess what happens to the price? it plummets if you want everything taking care of what happens? same thing. exactly the same. >> host: chapter seven, as

some of your language that you use you talk about the politically correct belief the words do matter. so why not curtail some of your language? >> i think it depends upon your point of view. maybe there are all sorts of ways people get offended. >> guest: when i talk about political correctness but not being able to express how you actually feel. >> host: so some african-americans would say slavery was awful to compare the national debt to slavery >> guest: in what i say is the hypersensitivity. lot of things don't bother

people but then they say did you hear what he said? you should be offended. this is the same stuff that used to go on the third grade playground. did you hear what he said about your mama? come on. we don't have to deal with that. we have major problems to deal with. i talk about is leaving a young people because our level of debt most people cannot comprehensive plan dash 18 trillion did you try to pay back $18 trillion at $10 billion a day you would take 5,000 years. that is absurd because it your dollar is the reserve currency of the world what if it were not? that is a designation that generally goes to the

largest economy of the world but we will lose that soon. china is growing 67% how much are we growing? so they will pass us however i don't believe they will become the force and get their banking system. however here is the issue they're already talking about creating a basket currency. so instead of the dollar being the basis it is a hodgepodge but that it will rob us or deplete us. what happens when you can not print money with the debt that we have? stopping and think about that. >> talk about political correctness, i looked at the

last 30 years at a more honest discussion than we do today we are afraid is somebody attacks the president to say we will have a real conversation and we don't. there is some theory there. to believe it is some people is not but the color of their skin? >> guest: when you say some people. i do think people are very much influenced by their perception so if somebody told you and then you met me you would interpret

everything they he is a nice guy and lowe's everybody. somebody is always looking for racism. the matter what you say to them. >> host: have you experienced its? >> guest: somewhere along the line but has not been a big factor for me my mother told me something important. she said if you walk into an auditorium full of racist bigot you don't have a problem they do. because they will all cringe and wonder if you will sit next to the mid you can sit wherever you want. [laughter] if somebody has a problem problem, in georgia. i of more important things to do. >> host: has a race benefited you? >> i don't think it has hurt me i think it is a wash.

to chile in the profession as a neurosurgeon i fully recognized early on in my career i would come into the room and the eyebrows would go up. >> host: you did feel that a little bet? >> guest: the by the time i got to talking to them here is how we will handle it that would melt away. >> host: to enter of field that is so result oriented that you enter the perfect place that the numbers don't lie that will trump everything else. >> guest: without question and the wonderful thing about medicine. there is the procedure i started advocating which was

very, very controversial. people were complaining because the president in the dean in the ama. but by that time i was able to reveal the members to demonstrate not one single person had died. that ended the controversy. >> host: people have their own set of facts and it is half-truths' in the ready is grounded just enough for their position. going for economic issue you advocate for the flat tax. >> guest: i did not say 10 percent but it needs to be proportional. i use 10 percent because it is easy to do the math. [laughter] >> host: fair enough. >> guest: but enough to

support government but it needs to be proportional. recognized by having this very skewed system with the deductibles, of lot of people make enormous amounts of money to pay very little in taxes. 1% would be a lot to them. i think that is craziness. on the other hand, i believe it is insulting for people who make small amounts of money, a day if they really stopped and thought about it, even though not contributing a lot still carried their weight. >> host: let me propose a counter argument on these that don't pay any federal income tax. if they buy lottery tickets

are go to the casino all of this gaming that preys on the pork, they spend more money from detroit. they are putting tax dollars into their pockets. so there are ways although they're not writing and check to the federal government, they're contributing more money in a gaming situation. >> guest: however gave mean, that is what we're doing is giving the system with this complex tax system. if we have something simple and easy to figure out, first of all, we will have a predictable amount of money to bring in and we will know what we need to run the government. now the other thing you might have noticed, i am not a big proponent.

in 2010 if you took the income of 5.1 trillion worth 3.5 trillion, a 60% of everything the middle-class makes? that does not make sense. so we needed to reduce that and i propose that thousands of government employees may tire every year. don't replace them. shift them around but don't replace it you do that for years it kids manageable. ended people are down to the manageable size then they can concentrate. >> host: then something happens.

and then to find out there were not enough people? >> if all these people make. >> the way the town works works, we have to fix it and we have to throw the money. >> but a lot of people don't understand the fundamentals. wonderful people coming doctors, nurses their best best, wonderful patience. honestly there are some things the veterans' hospitals do very well liked post traumatic stress but everybody else should go.

>> host: i want to end a little more political. you used the c word that is the compromise word there is a difference between compromise and common ground which is the tiny 10% the you both agree. why it is better? to obviously advocate for compromise. >> i am talking about is not the use of our principles? >> so when i look at democrats or republicans and

to go into the group of hyper partisan. >> host: where does it come from? >> i can assure you the numbers of liberals and conservatives that liberals were wrote describing awful names. the other side thinks they don't love america and a good leader is someone who can take a variety of individuals to create a vision and have never been a day working together to accomplish that. a bad leader says to this group that group is against you they are the bad ones.

that is bad leadership. another aspect is multitasking. during the current administration we had a situation with the previous administration there is enough multitasking but focused on the war to make sure the mayor ted did not get attacked again but we have to multitask. so we have had a pretty long drought without leadership that says america remember who we are. >> host: what leaders have done it the right way? >> kennedy. which get the stuff that was going on. the cuban missile crisis the

civil rights movement the economy was horrible and unemployment but they accused of bully pulpit in 10 years report the man on the moon to galvanize everyone academic. he put his brother bobby in charge of civil rights. he got his ear to the ground and was very smart. defaced down the russians in the midst of world war iii. in a blank. -- blink. and said just the opposite did you go over taxes and it had a tremendous ameliorate the effect. ronald reagan will get the

leadership he provided that actually is resulted in the dissolution of the soviet union. and winning the cold war without firing a shot. bravery, the statesmanship statesmanship, working across the aisle is able to work. and kennedy was able to work >> host: do see any of leadership right now with either party? >> a think there is potential. one of the reasons i intend to keep speaking about is what people will sides to understand. everybody has potential. >> host: what about the clinton presidency? >> guest: i was in a different place they could work to get the budget under control in and you know, the whole history of that.

[laughter] >> there is the argument that maybe is impossible. >> that was good. and as you probably have noticed dido's spent a lot of time talking dash about people. how to resolve the problems? we are smart people we are innovative, but we have to create the environment the honors hard work and innovation. >> host: you bring up your speech after the national prayer breakfast what about ben carson? i asked you why would you consider it? >> guest: the reason first of all, certainly is not my