in their book, the roosevelt, a companion book to the seven part pbs series. they also took phone calls and e-mails and tweets on "washington journal." just program is about 45 minutes. >> filmmaker ken burns joins us wrer jeffr tow with geoffrey ward. nourteen hour documentary, morea yrs 100 years of history. did you think there wouldn't be enough material? >> it is the most extraordinaryi story of an incredible family and an amazingin country.ay than

>> i think that they raise issues that we have today. .. in the tension between idealism and pragmatism. the important thing is that traditionally weak cover these guys independently. we assume that because the it or was republican and franklin was a democrat that you can segment them and they contribute to different silos of american history when in fact they intertwined and integrated families, with the last name roosevelt is of much more interest. exponentially more interesting when you see how related they aren't that there is no franklin or eleanor without theodore. that there is no "new deal," without the not only theatre roosevelts nearly two terms as president but his attempt to run as president as an independent progressive third party. so you have a great deal of americans 20 century commanded by one or more piece of

roosevelt and interconnected command it is. and then you have got the rest of the 20th century and the 21st century that is still in the wake of their accomplishments. >> host: working on your first project with mr. burns but also your first project on the roosevelts and fdr. what drew you to roosevelt? >> guest: in particular john to him because fdr is such a fascinating and opaque person but you really can't have eleanor if you don't have theodore and that's a link that we wanted to show both in the show and in the book. they are to me in exhaustively interesting people and it was a great privilege and joy to do that but. >> host: we can show you "the roosevelts" an intimate history a companion piece with a 14 hour documentary airing this week on pbs. mr. burns i pretty describe this as an inside-out history.

can you explain that? >> guest: we talk about this and geoffrey and i have talked about this in the 32 years we have collaborated on at least that many shows that american history is usually top down. that's the story of presidents and wars in general and that has a kind of lennearness and a convert and familiarity that is what passes for most people for american history. we have also understood that there have been trends and an interest in the bottom-up history talking about so-called ordinary people about labor, women and minorities a way to make a much more inclusive history and they fully joined and participated in that many things but in this case we discussed it in an intimate history. we are seeing we want to know a little bit about these three extraordinary leaders but we want to understand the language character forms leadership and more importantly the way adversity and all three of them have it in in their lives, the way adversity helps to shape that character. so it's inside-out and that is

not a psychological psychobabble going on here but we want to know who these people are, all of them as jeff says deeply wounded people. we want to understand how they negotiated and escape the specific gravity of these wins to become the kind of people that they are the way things are interesting to every american because they decided having people that could have easily frittered their life away in idleness, they gave away what they understood about that. that's part of our democratic compact that they integrate -- reintegrated in a way that i can't think of any two leaders and you add eleanor and she is there, have ever done. so this just livens up page after page of history. you can imagine and the book that jeff and i i have been particularly chuffed we wanted it to be a stand-alone. we wanted them to the companion books as if it somehow attached to the film. we always make a book and this is our proudest example that if

the series didn't exist it would be a good book. >> guest: that's the idea. >> host: we want to bring interferes to the segment as we are talking to ken burns and geoffrey ward about the roosevelts. if on line democrats (202)585-3880 and republicans (202)585-3881 and a pitts (202)585-3882 and outside the u.s. (202)585-3883. they will be here for the next 45 minutes as we discuss the 14 hour documentary and the book here as well "the roosevelts" an intimate history. mr. ward i want you to pick up on that theme of overcoming adversity and why were they able to do it on so many them including members of their own family were not able to overcome adversity in their lives? >> guest: each of them these extraordinary things to battle with. theodore roosevelt was terribly

asthmatic as a child and was -- her doctors tell his parents that he wouldn't live and he dealt with the awful death of his wife and his mother on the same day, and somehow pulled himself up and decided he was going to look what he called the strenuous life ended and became unbelievably strenuous and taught the country to do that. eleanor roosevelt, his niece, was the daughter of his younger brother who was an alcoholic and delusional and was orphaned as a child and was betrayed by her husband. somehow overcame all of that and franklin roosevelt suffered from polio which the story of his battle against that is i think for me the proudest part of the film and the book too. i had polio as a kid and i think that's one of the reasons i was

so interested in him all of my life. >> host: mr. burns did it take about these men and one of the things i was surprised about was how young they were when they died. here's a picture of franklin roosevelt just before he died and that was at age 63. >> guest: i just don't think we can appreciate that these two men essentially gave their lives and their sacred hunter to this country. they sacrificed everything and if you look at the pictures of roosevelt he looks about 85. he died at age 60 and when you look at franklin roosevelt -- says like a cadaver and it looks like he is 95 or 100. he died at age 63 and that's an incredible thing. they did everything they could to the service of this republic. >> host: we will get to her questions from twitter and your questions on the phone. our phone lines are open but a question from twitter. mr. burns and mr. ward how did you start working together?

>> guest: well i had an association with american heritage magazine and geoff have been the editor at american heritage. i was working on my second film on the history of the shakers and i felt that i had learned to roadblock in how we were structuring a pretty friend of mine, a mutual friend of geoff as well, geoff came up to her little new hampshire editing room and check it out. he ratified what we were doing but i was in the beginning moments of doing a film on the demagogue huey long. i signed geoff up to write the huey long script and the rest is literally american history. >> host: how many films for both of you as well? >> guest: i've never counted them that we had done one on -- and just did one on the congress and of course he wrote the civil war and baseball, and they did

biographies on thomas jefferson and cady stanton and susan b. anthony, marc twain, the history of jazz, a biography of geoff johnson the first heavyweight champion the history of world war ii called the war biography, history on prohibition and the roosevelts. i'm probably missing two or three. >> host: they were talking about the roosevelts in the history appearing on pbs all this week. we'll get to your calls. paul is our first caller from north carolina on our line for democrats. paula, good morning. >> caller: good morning. i would like to ask them both. [inaudible] can you tell us how she was related and one more quick question mr. burns. i love your shows. i watch them all especially the one on lewis and clark.

>> guest: thank you so much. we love that one too. it's a really good story and every time it plays, pbs place is pretty frequently. i check local listings is the best thing to do. this is a very complicated family drama. those eleanor and theodore r. cousins of franklin. i'm a seventh cousin of theodore and eleanor so you can say his cousin is really far away. but eleanor is the niece of theodore. that means that theodore's brother elliott is eleanor's father and theodore is of course the great president and his brother elliott died of alcoholism and of mental illness and orphaned eleanor by the time she was age 10. that is how they are related in theodore always felt a special

kinship with eleanor. she was his favorite niece and that's the relationship there. >> host: franklin new hampshire line for independents. you are on with mr. burns and mr. ward. >> caller: good morning gentlemen. first off putting a face to the team and seeing mr. burns all the time. you gentlemen have done fantastic work over the years. i'm not a big reader but i sit around the boob tube all day long. you have given me more information and stuff over the years than i can count. please continue to do so and no matter what your format is i will continue to watch you in any way i can. thank you. >> guest: thank you very much. >> host: mr. ward he talked about putting a face to the work. how many of the films -- >> guest: i've been on the screen a couple of times.

>> guest: can i address that collects this is the first time that we -- this is the first time that we sort of moved geoff around. he has been my principle collaborator for the last 32 years that as he mentioned geoff had polio, contracted polio as a boy. of course he is written to extraordinary books about franklin roosevelt's early life and we felt that we were going to give to something that jumped over and people acknowledged he had polio and they moved all the presidents ability to ignore what was going on the secret service. we wanted people to have a visceral first-hand experience of what it was like to have polio. he is struggling in constant

pain and trying to overcome a thing that he cannot overcome and geoff understands that struggle. it seemed important or put jump in front of the camera. >> guest: my generation was brave -- are raised not to talk about it. fdr used to call it sob stuff. i'm older now and i was absolutely prepared to do this without a moments emotion. a master interviewer got me on the second question. >> host: what was the question? >> guest: i had avoided asking him about it. i think he was pent-up not to respond and not to have an emotional reaction. we don't have to point neon signs and the way in which the

story of the roosevelts resonate with the questions of the day and we don't have to put signs up today that geoffrey ward polio victim and in fact that's the wrong word. what we wanted to do was clearly communicate that he was someone who knew what was going on that had a first-hand understanding and could help us understand just in the wail of the roosevelts took what they learned about life in the diversities they had overcome and helped everyone else overcome. i think geoff becomes a kind of guide to what it must have been like for franklin roosevelt. >> guest: i hope we have done that. i think we have so that once you understand that the last three shows when you watch him, you realize as you haven't before what he's going through just to make a public appearance, to make a speech. i think it adds a lot to this story. >> host: geoffrey ward and ken burns are here with us for the next half-hour as we talk about the documentary and the book.

barbara is up next from playroom nebraska on our line for independents. good morning. >> caller: good good morning. i just wanted to say we mark their calendar to watch this and i just think it's brilliant. we will purchase this and i'm so excited. my husband just finished reading the trilogy about teddy roosevelt. i can't recall the author. >> guest: edmund morris. wonderful books. >> caller: i kept asking him as we were watching it he said oh yes. i remember reading sections out of the book and we thought he had adhd. if you were alive today he would be on medicine. >> guest: one of our historians patricia in the first episode as you know blair is really just a table setting. it's a 19th century where we are introducing it to all three characters eleanor and franklin

in a minor way but this is mainly the trajectory from theodore roosevelt's birth to his election as president of the united states. nagl episode to which is tonight everything gets started. you know rebutting that happening in all but the nymex and it's an ever tightening dramatic stuff each night. it's really important to understand he's an add kind of unstable -- and at one point he will see and you must remember that the president is six years old. he has wonderful energy but he also has a cause for that as well. thank you blair so much. >> host: diane in arkansas on our line for republicans. diane, good morning. >> caller: good morning everybody. for you to know where i'm coming from, i will be 80 years old next month so i can remember the roosevelt administration and of

course my folks talk about it. i am concerned about the tone, the narrations and all on the whole program. you have an adoring tone to you. it seems to me that you could have been a little less biased in this comes out strong. another thing, when i was watching it, it seems that teddy roosevelt was in montana was it, for two or three years and come to find out he wasn't there that long. he came back and he married his old girlfriend. it's just all thrown over like it's okay come it's okay but it's almost scandalous. plus the and you can say all you

want to but it's the roosevelt family. >> guest: these are all really important things and i think you bring up some really good points. first of all this is not hero worship. we are very critical of all free people and in fact we have done more to think that anybody else to expose the flaws of each one of these characters to knowledge their greatness and also the wounds. a fifth cousin is pretty far away. the law permits you not to marry your first cousin in most states but it doesn't say anything about fifth cousins and basically i'm a fourth cousin of abraham lincoln. that's about as remote as you could possibly be. i think what we do say is we are very clear that he spent a specific amount of time and a number of months that he did often nonand it is quite scandalous when he does go back and mary within a couple of

years after the death of his wife his old sweetheart. there is of course "the new york times" notice which his sister she asked them to print a retraction even though the engagement was true. the tone is very critical at times and also very celebratory at times when it deserves that. i think it's an even-handed peace. >> host: mr. ward did you want to dress the caller? >> guest: he gave the perfect answer. >> host: demetrius is with us on the republican line. thanks for being with us on "washington journal." >> caller: it looks to me like theodore roosevelt was hyperactive. was this due to possibly oxygen shortage due to his asthma? is there any sign of meningitis and pneumonia? >> guest: i don't think so. i think it had to do with, he

was many things in one of them was a depressive. in order to keep from the darkness from ascending on him he was almost excessively acti active. part of the reason he got so much done was he couldn't bear not to do things. demetrius you watched last night and you know there was this amazing phrase and he said black care which is a way of saying you can -- outrun your demons and because the family is so susceptible to things like alcoholism and mental him is that he was a depressive. he had these physical limitations and he had the expectations of his father to get going. i think this set them in motion but remember that when patricia was saying and all the photographs his fists were

clenched and that's the kind of way he went through life. i think it's important to understand how much we are beneficiaries and how much we are, have to be very careful and see them clear eyes with the deficits are of that kind of behavior in human beings. >> host: in fact chapter 1 of the book titled get action about teddy roosevelt from 1858 to 1901. the finger is pointing forward. >> guest: think about his life. if you hear is a child that you are not expected to live out a childhood and the story is called get action you can realize the kind attention that his life is under and i think that's what he burned out so quickly. >> host: what age was he when he died? >> guest: 60 and he looks at 85. it's really stunning. by the time he was 50 years old he was an old man trade after

his adventure in the amazon or the vice president of the united states it is suffering from malaria and aggravating an old leg length. he suffered a lethal dose of morphine that he always carried with him on such trips so he could kill himself as to not be a burden to the expedition. the president of the united states out of office not barely four years and he's about to take a lethal dose. he says wait a second if i die my son will have to carry my body out so maybe i will live and maybe be president again. he's absolutely certain that all would be forgiven and this is the eternal child an optimist. >> host: garden city michigan on our lines for republicans. you were on with ken burns and geoffrey ward. >> caller: i was just wondering if there are any future plans for henry ford in

the automotive business. >> guest: thank you well am. i'm a michigan boy and i grew up in ann arbor and it's great to hear her calling from michigan. the leader not we are -- so we know what we are doing between now and the rest of the decade. we have the biography of jackie robertson and geoff and i are working on an 18.5 hour history of the vietnam war and the history of country music and a biography of hemingway. for punishment weighed are planning talking about american innovation and technology and of course you would have to include the 19th century. we are thinking about it. if we had 1000 years to live we wouldn't run out of topics in american history but that's a very good one. >> host: can you take a moment to talk about the voices that bring these characters to life in a documentary? >> guest: i have felt since the beginning of my professional life at that third person

narrative is all alone and kind of someone that's telling you what you should know. the last time i checked that was called homework. we like to break her films up with first-person voices that read actual letters and journals and memoirs in newspaper reports and telegrams. we were fortunate in an intimate history -- "the roosevelts" to have an amazing cast. our dear friend daisy stickley and dave harris and adam arkin and the late ui wallace. we were able to get ed herman to do fdr and the little known actor named meryl streep to do allen are. i want to say i really think just pay attention to that name. streep, meryl streep. she's fantastic. >> host: sean is up next in german texas on our line for independents.

gene good morning. >> caller: good morning. i was in this series and you guys had a reference to the proposed takeover by an industrialist who wanted butler to lead the army in the potomac and if you could comment on that briefly? >> guest: we didn't do that because it never came to anything. was it absolutely fascinating background story and it would make a fascinating film. he couldn't fit into this one. thank you. >> host: do you want to talk about the highlights of the? >> guest: he was a fascinating fellow. i am not an expert on this but it is alleged. butler was a fascinating character. he was in the art -- american occupation of haiti who turned against all of that. he's a fascinating man and he

deserves a good book and doesn't have one. >> host: javier is up next from bradenton florida on our line for independents. good morning. >> caller: i just want to say that this is what we need, both of them especially from 1901 to 1905 and in 1909. because he was middle class and for the poor people. he was not for corporations. he was for mostly working people. >> guest: javier i think you nailed it. that's exactly the story of the roosevelts. and what's so remarkable i think to us is that you have all three people all of whom are rich, all of whom are born to privilege

and get they are going to dedicate their lives to deepening the playing field to say look this government doesn't work unless it works for everybody and it just can't work for the people with money and influence. has to work for everyone. you have to have a viable democrat and a viable middle class. you need a strong economy but also means trying to lift those people out of poverty and into that middle class. if you look at the hole into the 20th century not only theater but particularly franklin are able to do that. in essence saved the republic from itself at a really critical -- critical time. he was very clear about that. he says rich and poor alike so this is not class warfare. it's just that he has to have a level playing field. everybody should have the same opportunity to rise and i think both people and eleanor particularly and let's not

forget she's hugely influential because she understands all the issues of poverty and race and minority of immigration and health in children. all of these things and she's able to add a conscience to her husband. one of the reasons we are drawn to the story is that when thomas jefferson articulates universal truths as he thinks as we all think in the declaration of independence that all men are created equal and endowed by their creator with certain inalienable rights simply among these are life and the pursuit of happiness they work of united states saudis tried to make sure it applies to everybody. when jefferson wrote he meant white men free of poverty and free of death. we don't mean that anymore in one of the reasons we don't mean that anymore is because of theodore franklin and eleanor. >> host: so many people in their socioeconomic status may not have taken the same route.

>> guest: board feet -- both theodore roosevelt's father in franklin roosevelt's father really believe that there come for demanded of them helping the less fortunate and in their time it was a little more patronizing than it was in the time of their sons. i think their sons basically saw it as their duty. public service was a serious thing for them and theodore roosevelt was the first to say when it's acting correctly it's off. that's not a popular view these days but that's the basis from which all three of them worked. >> guest: is probably a healthy basis because if you think about it and we like to look at that dome and blame our problems and look at the white house and blame our problems but that's us.

if you feel an ownership stake in that than you can understand that we are responsible, each one of us either because we voted or because we didn't vote for whatever unhappiness you feel. as long as you make the government either you can't do anything about it and they won't actually use your service. >> host: patties up. >> host: patties up next in north branford connecticut on our line for independents. good morning. >> caller: hi. i like to follow-up on something that mr. ward said yesterday on tv. he made a comment that they would be laughing at franklin for having polio. i thought that was an awful comment. i feel -- >> guest: i truly truly didn't say that. my mother lives in north branford so i'm particularly interested to hear from you. no no i would never have said that. what i meant was that in

roosevelt's day people did not automatically report his handicap. there was a sort of gentleman's agreement not to do so. in today's world tragically i think tv crews would follow him around trying to find him looking helpless. i think that's a loathsome aspect of today's world. >> guest: it's not just fox commends "msnbc" and cnbc. or tmz looking for that moment when the braces were unlocked and they were going to find him and you can see the sweat and the obvious pain of it. this is by no means bias i promise you. >> host: hamilton ohio on our line for republicans. nancy, good morning. >> caller: good morning to you all.

from what i have read and heard franklin roosevelt, his policies instead of cutting short the depression prolonged the depression. i don't know everything about it and i would like for you to expand on that in regard to what policies he put forward that prolonged the depression. my second thing is why did he give away a lot of territory at the end of world war ii to the soviet union? thank you very much. >> guest: these are phenomenal phenomenal questions. let me try to take the first one out and let geoff handled the other one is these are central questions. part of the mythology and misinformation about franklin roosevelt, let's be very clear. you can argue or debate over

what is the correct role of government and how much government and a little government we want to have but it's very very clear that without the bold and decisive action that franklin roosevelt said in the early days of the depression we might not have a united states of america. he was able to use the moral persuasion of his office to help people put their money back in banks and save the banking system. he instituted a number of programs that not only helps begin to pull americans out of the depression but when he himself will believe it or not was a fiscal conservative actors extraordinary mandate and 36 to balance the budget and/the stimulus programs, the united states went back into a very serious recession. it's also true maam and you are absolutely right at the end of world war ii the arsenal of democracy was the final program that brought us out of the

depression and into the war. it's franklin roosevelt himself who redesigned the american economy that by september 2, 1945 when the japanese surrendered more than 50% of all the manufacturing in the entire world took place in the united states and it's largely because franklin roosevelt having worked through his depression to lift up ordinary people turned around and made sure they made -- industrial made enormous profits. you can say world war ii is on the backs of american technological expertise and productivity. >> guest: let me just add to that. roosevelt of the whole point of the deal was to save capitalism. the charge that he somehow allowed the russians to take over eastern europe is based on

a misunderstanding. when the conference for which things were divided the russians occupied most of eastern europe. we have been at war for a very long time and we were certainly not going to turn around and attack our allies. >> guest: the biggest army on earth, the russian army. >> guest: exactly so they roosevelt's new, he said he did the best he could and his hope was that he could work things out after the war and then he died. he may have been naïve about that hope. eastern european said not fall because of anything roosevelt did. >> host: joe on twitter did eleanor enjoy being being the first lady and how was their marriage viewed by the public? >> guest: that's a big one.

when she initially came to the white house she was not happy. she was afraid she would be imprisoned there and be endlessly serving teas and she served a lot of tea over 12 years but she soon realized there was power in that artificial position that she could use. she was a relentless advocate of the important causes of all kinds from the war to women's rights to economic health for the poor. refugees and so on. she was a sort of -- she was her husband's conscience and she made of that job something altogether new. just as every president is measured against franklin roosevelt everybody's first 100

days are measured against his. every first lady finds herself confronted with the memory of mrs. roosevelt. >> host: peter is up next and louisiana for -- on our line for independents and peter you are up next with ken -- ken burns and geoffrey ward. >> caller: can you tell us how much influence he has on harvard and teddy roosevelt and fdr? thank you. >> guest: i'm not sure about that. i know a little bit about hagel in that his favorite student reportedly was a man to who travel to the united states and would eventually build design and not let his son complete the brooklyn bridge. hagel is a hugely influential philosopher and a german academic model who basically took over the american academic model at the end of the 19th century. i don't think you can draw very

straight lines between the philosophy between hagel and theodore and certainly not drink in roosevelt. >> guest: i agree. >> host: jerry is on our line for democrats. good morning. >> caller: good morning and thank you for taking my call. mr. burns i have just got to thank you and give you kudos for your time. i thoroughly thoroughly enjoyed the civil war but your depiction of the dust bowl during that time brought me to my knees because it really showed what true poverty could be again in this country. mr. ward i want to thank you for your book. i haven't read it but now i see

the great moviemaking subject that burns has come from. >> guest: thank you. we live in the media age in which we are drowning in information. we have got lots of it but very little understanding. it's great to have c-span and pbs that takes the time to represent all of those places. that is what we try to do. we have superficial ideas about the dust bowl or the roosevelt and the conventional wisdom. there must have been one bad storm and they didn't know that it was man-made and that lasted a decade. these are important things that we tried to tease out in the films we have done. in the case of roosevelt as i said at the beginning the program we tend to segregate them because theodore was a republican.

he was a progressive democrat and they were much more alike than different. there was its intricate family drama that we told that helps you understand the important parts of american history that allows you to gain the conventional wisdom that i think we are all burdened with today. we think we know everything that we actually know very little. not all of the stuff is true. we come with certain baggage and assumptions and conspiracies and things like that and it's our jobs as storytellers to tell you what we know the facts are and we employed people from the left, the right in the center and most importantly people who knew the stories. i think we are very confident that we told the balanced and accurate portrait of the skull for people. >> host: of all the stories

you told together to have a favorite? >> guest: they are like your children but we are as proud of this is anything we have done. it's really tough to do and intertwined narrative of three people. a lot of reviewers have likened it to a russian novel and that is what it is. there are lots of secondary and tertiary characters and you also have to have the united states and that which is covering 100 years, 104 years from 1858 when theodore was born until 1962 when eleanor died. that's a hugely important. now. we have the greatest cataclysm in human history that took place, world war ii and the greatest economic cataclysm in history and that was the depression and you have world war i and the gilded age and you have the cold war and the "roaring 20's" and yet at the age of the great trust monopoly. this is hold on, fasten your seatbelt. this is a pretty bumpy ride and it's been our great pleasure and joy over the past several years.

>> host: the book is called "the roosevelts" an intimate history. >> guest: we wanted to tell it from a different point of view to help understand. you will understand these events that may seem familiar to you in a deeper and richer way. >> host: huntsville alabama honor going for democrats. virginia good morning. >> caller: good morning. i'm enjoying c-span as they do every day that i would just like to congratulate you guys for the great job you did. my father's name is -- roosevelt of course he has passed now. he talked to me about the roosevelt and he taught me about theodore and franklin and how progressive they were. this is something i would like you to expound on. president obama is considered a progressive. he is always trying to bring the middle class up and the poor class up. why is it that during this age

they are not receiving the message that our country -- a middle-class people. >> guest: virginie you are absolutely right that i think you are beginning to the conversation. we have been locked for several years in gridlock and political partisanship but i think you're beginning to see the language of the very rich understanding that they have done really well by the way. 2009 until. i think they'll understood that the salaries remain flat and earnings remain flat for the so-called middle class. it's declining and the wages are declining. you can't have a healthy economy going forward without that. all americans, does it matter where they were democrats, republicans are independent of all americans ascribe to a level playing field. i think we are seeing that rhetoric and i hope that our film ads for small voice to the

notion that what's the nature of leadership and how to do they get things done in a very complicated country that as partisan as we are now the roosevelt both of them are despised by a number of people in society. i think they were still able to get things done and just to go back to president obama, the one thing theodore and franklin roosevelt couldn't get done with the affordable care at. they couldn't get it done. if theodore were to appear in our studios today he would save what? it took 80 years to get help claire? what kind of country are we? i think maybe it's a big political football now but seeing the progress of the united states you can look at the affordable care act as the last act of theodore roosevelt administration. >> host: a question from twitter for you.

[inaudible] >> guest: wow that's a big one. a thing theodore roosevelt would not be surprised today because he battled the very conservative views that are now prevalent really all of this life. he was republican and terribly popular but he was not popular with the right-wing of his party and eventually broke with them. franklin roosevelt built a great democratic machine which has largely broken up. labor is much weaker than it was before and he had always be -- has been gone for years so it is very different. i think they both be surprised at what has happened to their party. >> guest: i think franklin would recognize the democratic party a little bit more.

he is more at home in his constituent parts in minority and city and progressives in all of that. i think theodore would recognize that the tension in the republican party was there. to get rid of these monumental hypocrisies in the founding the toleration of slavery when all men are created equal and they went about doing that with their second candidate abraham lincoln. the other was to level the playing field. they had interests that had begun to take over and there was big business and rich people who were work for government and they thought the farmers and independent shopkeepers in the republican party became a place for that. the progressive wing that theodore represented thought the republican party had lost a little bit by returning and the

democrats were under the sway of the so-called interests of bosses. both the democrats, franklin roosevelt's father and republican theodore's father in theater himself were interested in leveling the playing field. i think he would wake up and say i'm dead. the republican party wants its way can you attain the need to bring back the main street guy, not the wall street guy, to bring back the family farm or not the agribusiness and bring back you know the principles of the republican party as it was founded. i think the history of the republican party has been this alternating current weather's been in a progressive mode anymore conservative mode. so i think both men finally said oh i get it. they raided in two seconds and set about trying to make compromising get things done. they were about rolling up their sleeves and that is why i think we admire them.

it may not be because we agree with them all the time, we certainly don't and we find great flaws but they knew how to get things done. >> host: the book in the documentary "the roosevelts" an intimate history all this week on pbs today want to thank ken burns and geoffrey ward for joining us this morning. >> guest: thank you. >> guest: thank you very much. next on booktv in a collection of essays david horowitz accounts his transition from an opponent of the political left as one of the critics. this is about an hour. >> thank you everybody. a democratic strategists once