careful, that you have placed too much in technology and described too much -- ascribed to much magic. >> "igods" is the name of the book. craig detweiler of pepperdine is the author. >> you are watching booktv on c-span2, 48 hours of nonfiction authors and books every weekend. booktv, television for serious readers. >> and "valor," mark lee greenblatt shares stories of soldiers who demonstrated extremely courage while serving in iraq and afghanistan. during this event, he discusses his book with pete hegseth, ceo of concerned veterans for america.

>> good afternoon, welcome to the heritage foundation and our lewis letterman auditorium. we, of course, welcome those for joining us on c-span. we would ask a going here in house if you'll be so kind to check that cell phones are turned off as we prepare to begin. and, of course, the program will be hosted on the heritage homepage following today's presentation for your future reference as well, and our internet yours are always welcome to send questions or comments simply e-mailing speaker@heritage.org. hosting our discussion today on behalf of heritage is diem nguyen salmon, our senior policy

analyst for defense budgeting. she is in or douglas and sarah allison center for aren't a national steve ells riches my with both u.s. defense platforms, government contracting practices, and brings her expertise to matters of defense hardware investment. before joining heritage she worked at the washington, d.c. headquarters, and later became the manager of analytics, global defense spending data subscription business. from 2007-2009 she served in the allison said here at heritage both in heritage on nationals could issues. she earned her bachelor's degree in political science from university of california-irvine, and a masters in international relations from the school of advanced international studies at johns hopkins. please join me in welcoming diem. [applause]

>> good afternoon, and thank you all so much for joining the heritage foundation and concerned veterans for america today for what we hope will be a great conversation with mark greenblatt about his most recent book, "valor: unsung heroes from iraq, afghanistan, and the home front." if you all haven't had a chance to read the book, i would highly recommend it. it's a good short read and really highlights individual stories of truly inspiring stories from our soldiers and very telling of the quality of our troops. interviewing mr. greenblatt today is captain pete hegseth who is the ceo of concerned veterans for america. prior to joining concerned veterans for america he was the executive director for vets for freedom where he successfully grew the organization over 95,000 members. he has been deployed three times. his last tour was afghanistan where he served as the senior counterinsurgency instructor at

the counterinsurgency training center in kabul. he holds two bronze stars for his time served in iraq and afghanistan, a regular contributor fox news channel and a senior fellow at the center of the american experiment on foreign relations. he has graduate from princeton university and holds a masters from harvard university kennedy school of government. please join me in welcoming captain pete hegseth. [applause] >> well, thank you very much, and first i want to thank heritage for personal partnering with us on this because this is truly a heritage effort, and for what heritage does to highlight efforts of veterans but also folks like mark who have done incredible work to try to highlight the stories of this generation. i think this institution more than most in this town has fought to ensure that the stories continue to be told and

that we highlight folks doing great work like what mark is doing. so i'm honored to be your. i appreciate this. i think the viewers will enjoy it. and i can so you having had the opportunity to engage with "valor" you want to pick it up if you haven't already, i don't get paid for this promotion, perhaps i should, but it is a phenomenal read and i know members of our staff have engaged with it as well, and it provides an accessible and, we will get into this in discussion, but an accessible account of exceptional stories of what men do on the battlefield or it's the type of raid of some of his engage with these types of, well, not on the level of these stories, but situations, it is accessible to a reader who has been in the military, but it has the new wants, subtlety and depth of someone who has and who has, and i think that's what makes it such a powerful, of literature.

let me introduce mark briefly. it won't do it justice but i think we will give access to mature to any. mark is an attorney based in the washington, d.c. area who specialize in criminal an ethics investigation. he is involved in several community service activities. he received his undergraduate degree from duke university and his law degree from columbia university. he was also a senior managers in government fell at kennedy school of government at harvard university. he is a black belt in tae kwon do so he can what some ass when he needs to, and was a drummer in the -- which he claims to popular as the beatles but i'll leave that up to. he lives in bethesda, maryland. ladies and gentlemen, welcome mark lee greenblatt. [applause]

>> mark o'meara said this before. he wrote to someone who hasn't served as a that of a wand to honor -- what made you undertake this endeavor, and how long they take in what is the process been like? >> into the seventh in 2008 i went to an awards banquet where they honored military veterans. folks serving in military. they would tell the story and bring them up on stage in front of this huge audience of people and was not a dry eye in the house. these were unbelievable stories. i would go year after year, and they kept saying, how come no one knows this guy? how come no one knows this woman? they're going to go back to they will be bagging groceries if you like enough to find a job, where as in years past, in generations past they would have take a tape parades in the honor. they would be hometown heroes and we just didn't have that. so year after your i said, how come no one knows these folks quick finally i said, why don't i write about them? that literally was the start of

it. i just started securing stories. i do investigations, as you mention i do investigation for a in so this is something during my day job i could get this conduct and this was a nice juxtaposition where i was looking for positive, inspirational stories, what went right. that's what drove me. it took a long time but it took five years. >> how did you find them? would you read a news report and say i want to get in touch with this guy? was a word of mouth works how did you find such exceptional stories? >> a variety of different ways. veterans organizations were helpful. disabled american veterans and veterans first helped me find stories that others, also just hunting stories down, calling context and say you know someone who might be in this world? and just moving forward and getting closer and closer. that's one good thing about living in washington is you can

get, pretty much to everybody. a special inability. that was something i just hunted them down, looking for stories. eventually i found a good roster of the stories and one had an appreciable number i thought this is ready. >> we're going to get into a couple of those stories eventually because they are worth talking to your to get a sense of what you occasion with a material that you mention tickertape raids in the past. in the book you talk about sergeant york or audie murphy from world war ii, names we know our understand of history over exemplary of those complex. you didn't think these things but i well, except when folks think iraq and afghanistan today, what are the names you engage with? you engage with jessica lynch or lindy england or bowe bergdahl. those of the names that people know from this conflict. i know audie murphy? to get to the question, i understand why you wrote it, why

know audie murphy, why no sergeant york, why suc such a le attention on the individual heroics of? >> i think a lot of it arises from the political turmoil surrounding wars at the time. i think there was an affect, a culture of not romanticizing what men and women were doing over there. was seen as cheerleading in the media. i think that was frowned upon. so i think that really was what eroded those types of stories getting out in sort of a big fashion. and that i think had a big detrimental impact. it was a counterweight to the negative stories that would come out. that's really what was driving me, that imbalance, that there was a lack of balance between some of the negative stories, maybe i'll the grob -- abu ghraib. that's what i find a fix, sure

that void on the other side of the scale. >> it's a very important point. win a war is being fought on political terms, it becomes difficult to sort of highlight. and as you said may be glorified in the eyes of some. but as you outlined so well in the book these warriors of course separate themselves from that. they're doing a job. >> unintentionally we talked about this briefly. the wards of the men in his book, distinguished service cross, several silver stars, multiple bronze star medals, all incredible awards but no medal of honor recipients. i think that's where things are intentional and excellent about this book is feeling like i said received the highest award the nation can bestow, but yet when you read what they've done you kind of wonder what then does it take to receive a medal of honor if these guys aren't getting? that was when the first things i responded to when you tell these

stories. then it into the medal of honor itself. if you look at what you of it, that a certain one way. you've got only 16 of this generation and only four in iraq, all posthumous. why so few medals of honor, and the thing that also has to do with the political aspect of? >> i think it does. the pentagon as we were talked about earlier, the pentagon has certain technical requirements and some of the difficult in the conflict we're in right now in terms of where their ieds and men and women doing incredible things in the face of ideas that may not quite qualify the technical requirements you need to have, combat fire and that sort of thing. i also think it was concerned about again surely think of looking like a record fine in order to drive or. so that made folks shy about bestow in the medal of honor.

so we have a huge gap, a huge divergents between years past and current generation. it's something like one out of 30,000 troops received the medal of honor in years past. and have something like one out of 130,000. it's wildly different. the men and women are still doing incredible things over there, not just the 9:00 about in trenton, but thousands of others. it's unimaginable to think that they are not doing the same great things at the same rate as previous generations which just doesn't add up. >> it doesn't at up at all. i got personal friends, incredible, silver star, should be a medal of honor. it does resonate because when a medal of honor is on round the neck of someone from my generation, most recently, kyle carpenter, i am proud that. i don't want it. i didn't do what i didn't do heeded. he did so incredible that he deserves it.

but i way that we can sing that guy represents my generation. i'm proud of what he did. i do think when you pull that back, you are sending the signal to troops of the generation that what they did wasn't quite worth what they thought was. >> and let's not forget even the medal of honor is no louder psycho sing. look at guys like dakota mayor. there was major effort to undermine his story. it's very controversial these days. we've gotten to the point where even that is not sacrosanct, and it's a real tragedy. >> this book hits home for me. i did a painting of paul smith manning the church of his humvee, actually over the changing table of my son's bedroom. a little odd, right? but i want my son to know he was. not care who britney spears is. i think that's what the really, really powerful example of this book is. it is unsung heroes of iraq,

afghanistan and the home front, which is clearly intentional. talk about the deeper side of this. tell me more about what was revealing to you about the deeper side, not just the combat side? >> i set out right essentially combat stories. i wanted to do with these guys were doing that i found amazing. as i started interviewing them and getting to know them and e-mailing with him and talking with their families, i said there's more than just combat. it's more than the linear plot line of bang bang shoot them up stuff. that's exciting but when you made that up with his other half of the guy that i know it became incredibly compelling. that was something i had to incorporate. i get example, one of the guys is a marine named james hassell, and james was an 18 year old kid, enlisted in the marines, felt it was his calling, his destiny. but his mother was furious.

she was patriotic and wanted to defend the country but she did want her son to do. and so james indicated moment that i describe in the book, he finally said to her, he promises her that he's going to come back from iraq in one piece. that promise was really driving or. and as james -- fast-forward a year or so, he's in iraq in this awful, awful firefight. a buddy of his its injured badly, and they have to evacuate them out to an awaiting medevac. about 100 yards down and out outside of his house there in, the problem is that there is insurgent fire going directly into that holy. there is no way james and his buddies can get ryan, the injured guy, outcome without going through the fire. what does james duplex puts up his hands and says throw him on my back. james is the biggest guy in the unit at the time, and he knew,

he said, i'm the guy. i can't leave writing here to die. he said i may die on the way out but i know ryan will die if i give die if i begin here. die if i give him your. swiftlets ride on his back, all the guys that ride on his back, and he is ready to leave, enter into the alley where there's live insurgent fire with a 200-pound man and his own gun, is a weapon, his own sack, everything. james thinks about the promise he made to his mother and thinks he's about to break that promise. think about that moment. now, when you're talk about writing by the deeper side of these, how do i not talk about that? that was why i had to get into their background, their family. there are other sites, three-dimensional individuals and so that's one that just stuck with me. and i tried to convey that, that moment just sitting there

looking, anything sense of, i'm about to die. quite a moment, quite a powerful moment. >> and throughout multiple moments where the families are the driving force or a person these is the driving force behind why they do with to do. i know for me it was the quiet part of my mother all time that i would think about on a rate for something and saying i don't know where this going to go. but your head goes there. speaking of why they do what they do, you did an assessment of identify what are the attributes, what is our? how does someone do something so exceptional? on the road quite a bit about it and there are some common threads throughout. why do these guys do what they do? >> the one thing that was overwhelming was the sense of brotherhood, teamwork, self-sacrifice. it has different guises but that's a central concept is they will do anything for each other. it was overwhelming to talk to these guys. these are individuals who jumped

into the snipers fire to save a buddy. think about the concept. there's a life of sniper fire and they jump into it to help a guy who'd just gotten shot right in that spot. pretty amazing. so that was driving you. what you're thinking in the moment. that's something i don't know that we as civilians can appreciate. you can speak to. that training, that builds within them that sense of brotherhood, and it's really just compelling and inspiring. we don't have an equivalent to that in the civilian world. there's just nothing like it. it is just incredibly inspiring. >> you hit on all of the unit under brotherhood, the selfless service aspect of your i think the one that oftentimes turn two, and he did emphasize, is the impact of training. just really how significant that

is on influencing natural human instinct. i'm going to -- well, if we could jump into it right now, a particular story that wrapped me up when i was reading the book for perfectly selfish reasons and it was interesting with one of michael waltz, special forces captain in afghanistan who was basically embedded trainer and special forces operator in remote villages in afghanistan. i will ask you to tell a story because you can do better than me, and a little bit about the relationship he had with the afghans and we continue to do which is just an amazing an amazing story. but in the middle of the firefight, in the middle of the ambush, not to sort of lead with the most juicy aspects of it, instead of dodging for fire, he stands up. and why? >> well, he's the guy in the middle of what's called a riverbed, a dried up river bed in a remote village in afghanistan to he's leading a patrol, and it was an american

unit paired with an afghan unit their training and try to get them acclimated to some of these apartments so they can stand up in the years to come. as they're walking they are ambushed. they receive live fire, and as pete said, your natural instincts if there are bullets coming at you is to get out of the way. but mike told me that he was trained that your armor is more secure in the front and so he actually turned toward the rifle, the machine guns that were firing at them and stood up and started shooting back because otherwise he was sideways, you are vulnerable here and if you slip in behind -- >> it's counter to the because you think you're a thinner profile. >> that's exactly right. that's what he was explaining. the incredible thing, and our multiple incredible things, mike

is very involved in the policy behind our efforts in afghanistan. so you wanted to ensure that he would engage with the population and he didn't want to look like a storm trooper where he had a helmet and all the night vision gear and all the stuff soviet no helmet and he went with what he called a light load. so here he is with a light load, no helmet, no grenade. he was firing his rifle facing full on to machine guns and then his rifle jammed. think about that moment. now at that moment i definitely have gotten out of the way. but not mike. might through his rifle down but i remember him showing me. he had a fluid motion to keep through the rifle down and picked up his pistol and he was fighting back against to you is maybe three machine guns with a pistol. by the way, that's remember he had no helmet. pretty incredible moment. eventually he decided to duck behind a small stone wall was

five feet away, and he describes his job as not terribly graceful. but he did actually do that, he did jumping on the stumble and he continued firing. is an incredible story about how the training kicking at that moment to turn so he was full on with his armor there despite the fact he had no helmet. >> it is overcoming what is hardwired into nature to flight. it is the ability to then buy. i remember the first time i was shot at, i ducked and then said -- it was training but is also the shame of i've got buddies and i'm not going to be the guy who ducks longer than anyone else. there's a lot of human dynamics involved in this situation but a guy like that, a special operate. when he jumping on the wall and they were regrouping, the afghans, there was a man down that he knew was down, but adds incredible depth to destroy. he routed the troops. tell the story.

>> let's back up just a little bit. i said they were paired. mike's unit was paired with an afghan you know, and on the patrols in the days before hand he had grown to develop a relationship with his sergeant major tomorrow whose leading up to senior noncommissioned officer of the afghan unit. he really respected sumar. he was a hardcharging guy. he worked hard cut to the men under him respected him and he was a categorically different from what mike had seen in other armies both in afghanistan, but in elsewhere in the developing world. and he said that's the kind of guy we need. and that is what will help afghanistan succeed. clone back at 10,000 times and you'll be fine. he developed this admiration, this respect, this really healthy relationship with this guy. the incredible thing is this is all done through an interpreter. neither one of them spoke each other's link which and he said

he was really remarkable how sumar could still engage with you, even through an interpret interpreter, a very unique man. and on this particular ambushed, i mean, on this particular patrol, sumar was at the very, very from the mic was a couple folks back, and when the shots ring out, mike saw that sumar was hit pretty bad. mike then fought back, as were just describing, full on fighting with his pistol. then he jumps behind a stone wall but he knows sumar is down. and so mike, think about this concept, runs back into the kill zone. that's where the shots are firing. runs back into the kill zone running toward what machine gunners are to grab sumar, and he carries him back. he describes a not terribly elegant because he's trying high jump out of the 50 does no, we should is going to start again.

he does not the machine guns are watching, sitting right there. he doesn't what's going to happen. he just knows he has to get sumar out of there now. as he's coming back to the growth of trees where the rest of the men were, he is pulling sumar, and he feels sumar died. he was literally in his arms when sumar breathes his last breath. and it was very emotional, and you know, they're still in the middle of a combat zone, and this guy just died in front of a. one of the first afghans to die. they later took up a contribution to help his family. they knew he had a large number of kids, and they took up a collection and send it back with an interpreter who was from his city the guy comes back -- i should mention that sumar and

mike had taught him one of the things my kids asked him is why on earth are you army? is a life-threatening decision, not just combat but also there's taliban were seeking to kill you in your villages. and he said, you know, that he wanted his kids to have a better life. he said he needed to earn enough money so his kids would not become radicalized. they gave the family a collection to support them after sumar passed away. but then mike heard from the interpreter months later that the widow had run out of money and was forced to send the kids to the madrassa's. does everything sumar was fighting against, everything mike was fighting against the it was happening. it was unfolding in front of his eyes. and so mike, this is on his own accord develop a way to wire money from america to this

widow. mike had never met her. he never met anyone in the family of the sumar ideas sinking this money, thousands and thousands of dollars of his own dollars in order to support that family. and what ultimate happen, he learned that when he came back for another deployment is that because of the money he is sending over, those kids, the widow could pull those kids out of the madrassas. that's just, so when the tide by telling the deeper side of these guys, how do i not tell that story? what he did was pretty incredible but then funding the family, that is unworldly. >> they don't know who it is. a friend american, money shows up and she mentioned that there to point he won in 2009, the kids had actually been at madrassas for couple of months because she didn't have the

money and she's able to pull them back. obviously, we can engage in each store but i will take you tell one more story to give everyone a flavor. but michael waltz, he would ought to be a policy adviser at the white house on afghan policy. i think he's a unique example of someone who has existed in the deepest darkest most difficult days in a technical sense but understands the strategic connection which is oftentimes what's amiss. i know this book is not political at all, but i'm going to ask a quasi-political nonpolitical question. we are at heritage, in washington, d.c., in the middle of a political bubble. how would washington look different if michael waltz was sitting in the halls of congress as opposed to we have today, or men and women like him? >> i think it's a tragedy when you have veterans serving in -- i don't understand how that has unfolded over the years.

it is where we are editing the very different. i think the va scandal would have a different tone. i do if it ever would've happened. i think a different category of oversight. and also i think just the discussion of the wars. when you see, like moments i've seen testimony went individual, you know, very senior officers are testifying in congress. i heard about one incident where the officer was responding to a question fo from a senator, ande said, ma'am, and he kept saying them, because that's how he is trained. the senator took offense to that. that just illustrated to me, she took offense to that and instructed that he not call her that. that seem so odd that someone of such stature would not have that type of understanding of how the culture is. and it struck me that was such

an illustrious moment that was a real tragedy. but i think the discussions surrounding the war, things like the veterans backlog which is an absolute tragedy, travesty, i think those and would be very different. i think we need to have more folks serving, you know, more veterans serving. >> that is an extension which are talking about. i want to mention wil what wouli do work for an advocate for at concerned veterans for america's. they be it's because i'm the captain, and agitated, i don't know, but i would rush the opportunity and relish watching some young veterans, republican, democrat would've been elected to congress who sit there in the oversight function after able to talk to a general and say, general, i respectfully disagree and here's why. and sometimes maybe not so respectfully. that's why i like being a captain. but you're right. that function, the ability to tell the hard truth based on

earned knowledge is so much of what's lacking here, and interest in their something greater than yourself. so tell us if you want one or two, the best, they will get the best when he read the whole thing. another plug, seriously there's so much in here, you could tell any story in a chapter but tell us what acute nuggets or stories you think are worth sharing today that give us more flavor. >> sure. when the stores is not an army grunt, steve stanford, steve was in an awful firefight in iraq and they were taking a guy shows and they were evacuating out large number of folks from this white house. stick with providing fire in house as others were if i couldn't the guy. they're finishing up. they've got all the guys out, and steve was manning the door and he saw a friend of his walking out towards the humvees, and a shot rang out and hit his

buddy, i guy named chris, in the neck. chris dropped, and steve, who is in a position of relative safety, he was not in the snipers are. the sniper could not have gotten. steep rent out to workers such as gunshot right in the snipers fire, 20 feet away from the sniper, and he started performing cpr on chris. think about the concept. he's performing cpr on chris as the sniper is plugging away at steve, plugging away over and over and a over again. he was crying when he told me this. he said i had more important things to do than worry about little pieces of metal sticking

out of my best. think about that moment. he is literally trying to save his buddies like as the sniper is pinging away. finally, the cyber shot that wasn't in his armor. it was in his leg, and it hurt. he understood, okay, i've got to pay attention to that guy. steve whipped around his rifle with one hand because he was so close, he shot and villages shooting at each other relatively close. as close as i am to some of you in the audience. they're shooting away and finally one of steve's shots killed the sniper. that was about a minute before steve blackout and, you know, he was later evacuated to the hospital. he apparently had cardiac arrest three times during surgery that night. so he simply died three times and he brought them back three times that night. he is now, i'm happy to report,

he's doing very well. he's a police officer in michigan, and he's a good guy. >> that's a great segue. the narrative often times in the media is you've got broken men and women coming home, damaged goods, ticking time bombs. based on these nine stories, how are these guys today? what i contribute in? what sort of the epilogue? >> sure. i do touch on some of the stories, i given epilogue, but now we are a little removed from even those apple locks. i'm very happy to report that by and large they are doing very, very well. these are good guys. they are smart and they're active, engaged but they did struggle but some of them did struggle, especially the ones who had close buddies die to them like steve with his buddy

chris who ultimately did pass away. some of them struggle and have bush to report they are doing pretty well. two of them unfortunately have passed away, and it's an amazing thing that neither of them were in combat situations but they were both home and purchase tragic situations when it passed. >> one of them doing the duty of attending to a fellow veteran. >> that's right. chris kyle is a former navy seal and he had some notoriety in a way, possibly. had written a book and he's one of the stories in "valor" andy seth a large charity effort when he came home to help veterans that are suffering from post-traumatic stress but one of those that he was helping connie offered you take into a range and shoot because that's, you know, just relax and hang out. this one particular marine lost it and flipped out and thought that chris is going to get him,

and he shot chris and killed him right there on the spot. it's an awful story. but of the seven who are with us today, they are really doing well. you know, and digesting, go to school or working and doing good things. >> as you said, chris kyle had reached a certain level of notoriety for what he written and what it done as a sniper. how much of the of the guys had been approached at any point before you approach them? them? how many its own comeuppance at tommy your story or help me to your story? >> none. that's what's called unsung heroes. by the way, chris was not approached. i would first want to approach him and he later wrote his book as we got out of service. so even chris at the time was no one. knowing anything about chris. if i could add a little piece about chris, a pretty amazing thing. one of the themes of the book, the sense of humility that these guys don't talk about what they did.

they don't focused a spotlight on themselves ever. chris, for those of you don't know, was a navy seal sniper, and he was the most lethal sniper in th american military history. think about the concept. he was incredibly effective. he was called, the insurgents in iraq called him the devil of ramadi. again, think about that. they put a bounty on his head, $80,000, on his personal head. he was awarded multiple superstars, multiple bronze stars. i told one story of one of his bronze star medals in "valor," and the amazing thing about chris, i interviewed him for eight hours while he was in baghdad. eight hours, a lot of question. a lot of answers. countless e-mails after that. never, not once, not one time

dimension did he mention any of those things. now, i don't know about you but if i did anyone of those things, i would've tattooed him afford it. i would've put it out on facebook like you wouldn't believe, right? not these guys. not chris cannot the rest of these guys. they just don't do that. it's so inspiring from especially this area where we are -- were claiming credit is what we do. that's what capitalism is based on. these guys just don't do that. the contras is so remarkable. talking that getting those folks to serve and guards, that's what would be so great is that sort of thing we do not going to shine the light on themselves. they are not going to say i did this come even though they may have played some small role. that's something that would be so refreshing, so helpful. >> we're going to open it up to questions year. we have a great group.

we have microphones without question raise your hand and will get a microphone to you. before we do that as we get set up, i will probably do it again at the end, but kerry how grateful i am. i can't speak on behalf of anybody, but i know for our generation so much of what guys want is just for the stories to be told, the stories that are meant to be told. if you know sean, you know it's not about him. he just saw what he wants every american to see through the pages of the book he wrote. that's exactly what you did with the book "valor." i as one veteran myself want to thank you for putting in the blood, sweat and tears that go with telling these stories because i know how viable it is to them. but ultimately to all of us that they be told, so thank you very much. >> thank you. i just wrote the words.

you did it. so that things should be going the other direction but i appreciate it. >> questions, please. >> hi. i'm barbara ledeen. i have two sons who served, and daughter who serve in a civilian capacity. there seems to be a divide between them and the other people of the generation who stayed here and attended college, for the most part. they are let's say the only generation, and to think they know something about the war and about what we were doing. there's a pretty profound divide actually. my kids talk about leadership going forward and the fact that their generation, you guys, your generation will be, the

leadership will be composed of those people who served. what do you think of that? >> i would hope so. for the very reasons were just talking about. it's essential. went to get those folks involved in the political process. because that type of selflessness, that type of leadership is sorely lacking i think. so yes, absolutely. and i would agree, i think there's a chasm, a massive chasm between the folks that serve and don't. and i think there's some not just a divide, but that divide leads to a lack of understanding. that's a problem. you to forget about the va backlog. they forget about the men and women serving overseas when it's not their neighbor, when it's not someone in the family. i think that chasm is problematic absolutely.

>> the questions are for mark but i will hold back my chiming in but it's a fantastic question. i think this book serves the purpose of educating a public that has no idea what went on since 9/11. your sons can what they've contributed, much of them has contributed, this is part of educating and highlighting what that -- i also think, unfortunately, the onus also rest very much so on veterans to ensure that that chasm doesn't turn into animosity, which it quickly can when you say i've seen all this, i've done all this, is underappreciated. this guy read it in a book or learned at harvard, and, therefore, he wants to tell me about national security policies are what it's like to work in afghanistan. that can quickly turn into animosity. so the extent to which veterans can assist other veterans, there's a network, not just a support network but a connective network or hopefully, small groups of people that may change individual ultimate be those who

have seen the real deal, understand how to connect a tactical and strategic working together to effect change in a nation where the country is complacent or so i agree with you. we will go right here. >> my name is kristi mccormick. i wanted to know, outside of the training in the military did you see anything or do anything in the backgrounds and childhoods of these guys that would lead them to be this kind of soldier or servicemember and do these kinds of acts of our? >> that's a good question. the one thing was that many of them have friends and relatives that had served. that was something that was sort of in the back of their mind. a couple of them were just out of nowhere, like james hassell whose family members hadn't served. it came as a thunderclap to his

mother. and there's another guy, dan foster, there's no one really, his grandfather served honorably but that was before dad was alive. i think it generally there were folks there've money with which are but there are a couple that just sought out that structure, the brotherhood. they liked the concept of belonging. james actually did research into what the marines were all about, and he just became enamored with them. and he said i have to be a part of it. i cannot be a part of it. it was pretty compelling that this was just out of nowhere for him. there was no, you know, it's just something that developed within him, and it was pretty inspirational. >> one of the attribute to piggyback on the question, you talked about his humility a lot in the book. we think of selfless service you think of what honor and think

you're trained are taught in the military. she military is sort of residual piece of it, but did you find that these are humble guys who join the military, or their service humble them and, therefore, i mean, the cart before the horse will? >> i think it varies a little bit but all of them through the training became humble. some of them, james described himself as a brash kid. he said when his plane football he walked out in his first game and he pretended, he acted like he was tom brady. so he was this brash kid and it was all about him and he was strutting around. he was this kind of charming rogue. but he describes, i go to great pains in the story to tell about his evolution. into this team player, this guy that was not about himself. it was really remarkable, this evolution that occurred in a

sharper to time and it al was ao the military, all through that training. eventually adopted this credo that you have to be part of the solution, not part of the problem. that was something that drove them. he told me all about that. he said that was all from his training. so i think they were in some measure, some of them were humble going in and fit right in. some of them came in, maybe a little brash, like a peacock but quickly morphed into that humble teen first player. [inaudible] >> tom with heritage foundation. basic want to ask about the cheerleading that the media didn't do. i was wondering what your thoughts were on why the media wasn't cheerleading. >> i think some of it is residual from the vietnam era sentiment, but i think it was

grounded in the politics and just the media environment of time that i think they among their peers if they wrote stories like this, they would be perceived to be cheerleading. i think it was frowned upon. that wasn't news but it wasn't news to talk about the good stories. it wasn't news to talk about abu ghraib. that's tragic. i think that's a real problem but i think that was the ethic of the time, the judicial something that was unvarnished positive, you were cheerleading. and i hope that that is changed to some degree innocents them we are seeing some of the medal of honor recipients getting some unvarnished good press, although you have moments like dakota meyer were folks are trying to undermine that sort as well. i think that's what was. given the swirl of the turmoil of the politics at the time, you receive to be cheerleading and that was just frowned upon.

that was my sense. >> and i would say the stain is you want, it's a longer cool to be for the home team. especially when it comes to the press in wartime in world war ii there were things that were told because they need to be told. i think he got vietnam incredibly, obviously effected me but now you have a media obsessed with sort of every level of independence ensuring that without a star with balance that includes all the wrong things that america started on the battlefield as opposed to emphasizing the good. >> not only that, there's a picture of a journalist who was taking a picture of an insurgent sniper shooting at americans. i don't know that in world war ii an american journalist would have been taking pictures of a german sniper shooting at americans. i just -- maybe i'm wrong. i just think the ethic has changed where it's this

detachment is overwhelming. and any sort of positive story is viewed as cheerleading. you can't root for the home team. i'm hoping that is eroding over time. i think there's maybe a course correction there lately, i hope. >> it also can be disingenuous to cheer for the -- .in this case. this book is highlighting story but for the media to say now it's time future of the for the home team, after the game is over. that's something that veterans feel. that's not what this book is. this is a book to correct and say what they have done. yes, sir. >> can you hear me without the microphone? blake lewis, i'm in into your flesh i'm an intern here at heritage. nutty buddy is going to write a book like you did explain these stories and giving that publicity out there, so what can the general public do, what can

the younger generation do to help this movement, to help get those stories out there and to do some justice because telling the stories, forwarding them. facebook and things like that can be incredibly effective, just broadcasting these stories, keeping them in the front of people's mind so that when something happens on keeping up with the kardashians, we also have the balance with what really matters. so even on a low level in terms of things like facebook that can help, just telling the stories. that's something i'm doing now is beyond the ninth of written in the book. i'm posting on my website, on facebook, i'm trying to do other stories of incredible incidents that are just inspirational. i literally get choked up when i'm writing them t. that only a page and a half or so. they are not lying but those, sure those types of stories. they are not hard to find. fences were think i think even on sort of in the ground game it can be very easy to do that, you

know, share with friends. one thing you can do by the way, on my website i have ways you can e-mail the seven that are remaining and the families of the two guys who passed away, and you can ask them what can we do to broadcast this more. that's the kind of thing, you can engage with these guys and they're great guys and i'm sure they would love to hear from people but that's what you can do, engage them, what can we do to get you out and come to our community, give a talk about this or that. i think they would love to do it spent what is that website? >> mark lee greenblatt.com. and on if there's an e-mail, he would have and you can pick all of them, one of them, whatever you want. some of them resonate with others. as you mentioned mike walls can hit home for you whatever it is, reach out to the skies and ensure they will talk with folks

and me with an organization that sort of thing. spin that's cool but i didn't know that aspect, the ability to engage with not characters but you can kind of use that phrase, the folks that you highlight. i would also answer your question by saying look to your own community. i am from a small town in minnesota, dozens and dozens of guys and gals from that town have gone on and do incredible things. find a way to audit in a small ceremony in their hometown where they never get honor. whatever it is, i think that our small subtle ways that we miss. this is a big way to do, which hopefully is the inspiration for small ways so you can highlight families and veterans. >> i'm david and i'm also here at heritage. i've read a few books like lone survivor and hard in the fifth and things like that ended up in

a talk about their efforts coming back here at home. we hear the news a lot about how we do have broken people coming back, and it's a tragedy, and with suicide imagery being one of the highest issues, et cetera, et cetera. you said that these people have been doing well, and what has allowed them to do well and were things we can do in the future and allow our veterans to come back and integrate in society better, as those us as a 2 22 be able to support him a? >> i'm boiling it down to basically one word. jobs. i think it really helps. that's just my sense, my sample of the world. but it does sell. it helps them peace back in, gives them a sense of purpose, a sense of mission and a couple of my guys, one of my guys, james who i mentioned, he was homeless for a little while after he came back. and about the concept. he had just gone and served and he was homeless because the va

was screwing up his benefits. same thing with the dan foster, you know, who serve admirably and earned a silver star, holding off an ambush in remote outpost in afghanistan. he came back into the thought he was in north carolina that he was in california so we didn't get, he didn't get his benefits. he had a job. i think jobs help reassimilate, get them back going. but not only that, just this sense, to talk about having civilians having, that country understand their stories. that's a huge deal but one of the guys, again resorted, now a master sergeant, buck doyle. i said what do you want to come out of this? and buck told me, he said i want you, i want people to understand the that's the phrasing pdus. just to understand, it's not sympathy, it's not pity. absolutely not what they want

but you some sense of understanding of what they are doing and what they're suffering through. what their families are suffering through. reaching the very divide that barbara was talking about earlier. i think that would help. i think jobs, jobs, jobs. if it's not my fingers and change the world and anyone way in terms of what the questioner as, that would be the big one. >> peer-to-peer, the extent to which veteran are working with other veterans is incredibly effective. we are working hard to work on the va peace but so a small private community or positions are better and lead or physicians are doing incredible wealth because veterans can relate in a way other veterans cannot. what's hard to recapture when you come home is that feeling you had when you are with those men in the remote afghan village doing something that life-and-death consequences. and you come back you and your like, to a watch o'reilly or hannity tonight? everything feels mundane. and so i think the jobs peace or

a sense of purpose is so critical, they don't want hand. they don't want to see -- they don't want to be seen as a victim. i do think will be part of a long part, if america is to be restored, i think it's going to be led by guys and cows who understand and that in these types of things. >> absolutely, absolutely. >> thank you. [applause] >> well, before we close i just want to again thank heritage for hosting, fantastic forum for taking the opportunity to highlight this. it is mark lee greenblatt.com, and the book is "valor." so for everyone watching on tv, "valor," you can get on sure anywhere there is the inter- web. but it's a fantastic read. it will change the way you see the ordinary heroes that aren't so ordinary who wouldn't

otherwise have told their stories told. so pick one up, tell other people about it, and thank you, everybody, for being here. [applause] >> booktv is on twitter and facebook ever want to hear from you. tweet us, twitter.com/booktv or post a comment on our facebook page. facebook.com/booktv. >> are some of the latest news about the publishing industry.

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beaches. he discussed his book at politics & prose bookstore in washington, d.c. it's about one hour. .. so