we are not going to fix that in maryland, but the question is what does the government do to be able to manage undocumented immigrants who are in maryland? .. provided the federal government reimburses maryland. a foster care system. we can accommodate the small group of children. let's protect them, return them, answer that the

federal government pays the full freight. ♪ obviously it is a humanitarian crisis. it is a tremendous problem for the nation to have all these undocumented children. you know, my first concern is the health and safety of these children. and we do have to look at that. i wanted to make sure as soon as they came across the border that we took care of their immediate needs, fed, clothed, housed, took care of any medical attention. al think it made a lot of sense for maryland to try to bring more. we have taken ten times more per capita than any other state. i just don't think it's fair to the taxpayers or to the children really to be bused thousands of miles away from their point of origin to be put into maryland. it's just did not make sense. we have a little bit of a disagreement. we want to take care of the kids, and i think it's administration has been too aggressive. >> thank you.

>> moderator: oh, that was our bottle. people watching us right now have a genuine concern about their safety. even though there are some statistics that show there has been a decrease in crime in the state of maryland, and baltimore what is your plan to address what appears to be the continuing crime problem in the state? brown: sure. i understand that no family is immune from that tragedy of crime and even violent crime. six years ago my cousin to my kathy, was killed by her estranged boyfriend with a gun in front of two montgomery county police officers to enter killed him. because of that i supported the firearms safety act of 2013. i led the effort in maryland to give judges greater authority to order domestic abuse is to surrender their farms. because of those measures and others but perhaps more and partly because of the courage of the men and women

in law enforcement in communities around the state if we have driven crime down to levels that we have not seen in four decades. but harbor continues until every mayor of ithaca baca said of their home, on their porch, on the corner of their street and say, this is the kind of never of a want to raise my family, start a business. so we have work to do. that is why we cannot roll back the provisions of the firearms safety act, which i intend to fully enforce and we're already beginning to see a reduction in gun-related crime as a result of that. i also have a proposal to drive out recidivism. we're making a lot of progress in maryland, but some states are doing better. we will make sure that our reentry population does not commit crimes, have the training and support so that they can once again be productive and our communities and rejoin their families driving down recidivism. there are a number of things that we can do, proposals i have offered, but you can rest assured, i will use every tool available,

including gun safety laws, to make sure the you in every barrel of beer are living in a safer neighborhood. >> thank you. >> moderator: your response? hogan: well, we have some of the toughest gun safety laws in the entire country, but that has not stopped us from being one of the most violent states in the nation. in the top-10 in violent crimes, crimes committed with guns and murdered. i am not sure how much progress we have made. i know we have a lot more to do. crime is a serious problem in maryland, and i have been traveling all across the state. i have talked with people in urban areas, rural, suburban areas and i have met with local police departments and shearson states attorneys. i can tell you that the number one problem we have with respect to crime is heroin. we have an epidemic. we have recently been called the heroin capitol of the united states. and it is not just happening in inner-city baltimore and urban areas. this has infiltrated in the small communities all across

the state. i was up and frederick in toward the jail were 60 percent of the people are gang-related and drug-related with heroin. i was in st. mary's county in southern maryland. 60 percent of the problems they're dealing with are as a result of heroin. i was in caroline county, one of the smallest in the eastern shore. the number one problem is heroin. we have the number one problem in the united states every state on the east coast has declared a state of emergency on this problem our administration currently has done nothing and has not taken action even know we're the worst in the country. one thing i will do immediately is get to work and call a state of emergency in january, bring a summit together to bring all the parties to look at this problem of violent crime, drugs, and gains. before mr. brown, a bottle. brown: you know, larry, it is disappointing when you say you don't know how much progress we have made because i think it is

incumbent upon your death inform ourselves on the issues of the week of the church of his art. the facts are we have driven crime down to the los level in four decades, and driven down crime against women and children to levels we have not seen in quite some time. wire we doing it? so i understand we're making progress and i am understand why because we're taking guns off the streets, protecting victims of domestic violence, putting more into drug treatment and addiction counseling in the institutions and in the communities than ever before we have got skills training in the institutions in partnership with nonprofit communities. that is why recidivism is going from 50% to 40%. you have to understand that as governor because perhaps the most support responsibility we have is to reassure the public safety. you have to understand what is working and what is not. sure, we have driven recidivism down. we have more work to do. given cramdown, we have more work to do. you have to understand the

problem. >> moderator: thank you. >> maryland's congressional district is ranked among the most gerrymandered. would you commit to changing the way they draw the legislative and district lies? hogan: absolutely would. my entire campaign is ben about nonpartisanship. three and a half years ago i started a group called change maryland. a hundred and 17,000 people involved, and half of them are democrats and independents. my whole life has been about reaching across the aisle and trying to do what is right in coming up with common sense bipartisan solutions. the partisan redistricting that was done here in maryland was probably the worst in the entire country. it is not something that should ever happen again, and i would definitely take these decisions out of the hands of the monopoly and the politicians in annapolis and put it into an independent body of some time -- some kind. i would absolutely support

removing the redistricting process out of the hands of politicians and putting it into a group that could make honest decisions. >> thank you. >> i support an independent commission as well and have said that over the course of this campaign. i think it is the right thing to do for a number of reasons. i think it gives greater confidence in maryland voters in the way that we every district. but it also, i believe, addresses the dysfunction that we are seeing in our nation's capital. you have members of congress who represent some extreme right and left districts, and that is why you don't have immigration reform, national energy policy, and the number of other important things that ought to be happening in washington are not. so i will certainly create an independent commission. i don't want to get too far out front because that is going to be in the second term of the brown administration and around the census. so it won't be in the immediate future.

i support independent commission, but i also support at least one or two supreme court justices are calling for an amendment to the u.s. constitution because we can fix redistricting in maryland, and still greater confidence among maryland voters, but we need to address the larger, national problem so that in washington the redistricting has resulted in this function, we can get back to the business of doing work in washington which, quite frankly, is it happening today. >> moderator: mr. hogan kafiri thought of. hogan: first of all, think of a fed governor does not want to claim responsibility degrees of we should do something about this terrible redistricting, but it took place during his administration. he and governor malik presided over this. so i do agree with him on the dysfunction in washington. i can tell you, talk to people every day who are just completely fed up with professional politicians and they feel as if our elected leaders are not solving the problem.

they're angry with republicans and democrats. and that is why i have been focused on nonpartisanship. i think that is what most people would like to see. instead of the rapid partisanship in washington and the monopoly that is an apple is that does not have any real honest and open debate or any competition, no checks and balances. as one of the reasons i am running for governor to forge a common, we talked about this a little bit the top of this debate. let's get a little deeper into it. what are your plans to improve the business climate so that more businesses do not leave maryland and take jobs with them? brown: sure. and again at think we agree fundamentally that we need to strengthen marilyn's business climate. there are some aspects of our business climate where we are very strong, quality second to none when making investments in infrastructure. the maryland quality of life there are other areas where we certainly need dramatic improvements but the regulatory environment.

we can streamline regulations in maryland making it more cost-effective for businesses to comply. we can do that without running away from our obligations to protect the environment or consumers and the workforce. we have stated, declared that in a brown omen administration the very first strategic goal that we announce, and every organization needs to declare strategic goals and he developed a matrix and drive the metrics for to go. our for strategical will be to position maryland business climate to be number one in the nation. look, there is a raging debate whether maryland's business climate is hot style the businesses or whether it is business friendly. we're not participating in that debate. our focus is on whether you believe ross tyler not, let's improve the business climate. so that bmw can expand its footprint, more amazons will come, so under armor just announced an expansion. lockheed martin just

announced an expansion of operations in baltimore county. washington county. frito-lay in hartford county. so you've got corporations that see a tremendous amount of strength in our business climate and are expanding and investing. i think all of us can agree, we have to strengthen the business climate. >> moderator: mr. hogan. hogan: my question would be to those in the governor, why haven't you strengthen the business climate? is your policy, your honor is tax policies that have driven 8,000 businesses have the state, cost us to double unemployment and lose 200,000 jobs. this is -- you are now saying you want to make us number one for business, but you killed 8,000 businesses. how is it going to change of the next four years? you have some responsibility here. you're going to create all these jobs, well why did we almost lead the nation in job loss two months ago? why have we lost 200,000 jobs?

where we hired in the national average on the employment? what will be different over the next four years? this is the main reason i got in this race. i started this group 3-years ago. we have been focused on how to make maryland a more competitive. my organization, we held a business of and on improving maryland's economic competitiveness two years in rhode where we brought in 400 business leaders together with economists and think tanks and the representatives of the federal, state, and local government from both parties and talked about this. three fundamentalo ceo magazine we're 41st of the 50 states in business friendliness which will change on c-span2 with me as governor because maryland will be open for business. we will focus on how to bring more business income help existing business growth and create more opportunities and jobs. the regulatory environment they say you want to try to clean up and streamline is the one that you created over the past eight years and is driven business out of the state. talk to people who say they moved to virginia and got things done in 90 days they

could not get done in three years in maryland. we're running around changing the rules all the time. lastly, onerous tax policy, the fourth highest tax state in the nation's causes businesses to flee. >> thank you. >> the entire data in the half that he did not put up a single proposal to strengthen. brown: you and i agree that we can strengthen our business climate by providing tax relief but we disagree on how. he would start with the largest corporations, small group, the wealthiest among many of whom have headquarters at of the state of maryland, and you would give them a $300 million annual tax giveaway. you said in september. he would rollback that tax. in fact, he said in the spring that he would try to completely eliminate the corporate income tax which would put a gaping hole in the next governor's budget. i don't support that. i support tax relief to small and entrepreneurial

businesses that create two of every three middle-class jobs and provide opportunities to working families. that is how we will create a stronger business climate in maryland. >> moderator: each review has served in administration from each party. mr. roman, could you tell me a policy of the administration with which you disagree and, mr. brown, a policy with which you disagree? and defeated one of you happen to agree with something the other party did while in power, we would be delighted to hear it. hogan: that is a tough question. first of all, had the honor of serving for four years as a cabinet secretary. a great with a lot of the things they did. i can tell you one thing that did not agree with, tuitions went up 40%. i was never supportive of it, have never supported 1 penny in tuition increases and the point in my entire life. in fact, have been the leading voice of opposition for 05 years in a row the

lives of a governor and governor have raised tuition as far as something that they have done well, i think they have done a pretty good job of spreading the numbers and confusing people on the facts. as the only thing i can point to. brown: self let me sort of explain the relationship that the governor has with the lieutenant governor. i was asked, are you prepared to be lieutenant governor? probably the best experience i had was when i was an executive officer and a company in the military. it was the company commanders company. i had the privilege of going into closed doors and telling them and sharing with them how we take care soldiers, do the mission to make sure we have the resources. the end of the day the company commander made a decision and we both walked out the door and a supporter the company commander's decision in effectively leading that company. so that's a lot the way that the governor and lieutenant governor works. having said that, there are

few places i disagree. one of them, for example, was reducing deductions on the income tax which is interpreted by some as the mortgage interest deduction. i did not agree with that and was pleased the legislature took that out of the proposal. or able to balance our budget and we did not need that provision. i'm glad it came out to be there was not coming out the door and throwing my governor under the bus. i hope that where the next in the governor is understands that important relationship between governor and lieutenant governor. what do i agree with to the administration? and us did raise tuition by 40 percent. you never stood up and said, look, this isn't the way to go. by understand because you were being a loyal appointments secretary. the chesapeake restoration fund which gives maryland now the resources to invest in operating waste water

plants. >> unfortunately because of time we will move on to the next question. there will be your bottle on this one. there has been a lot of talk on women's issues. kimberly in aberdeen asks, what is your priority? >> my priority is to ensure -- thank you, kimberly. to insure that when we build a better maryland it is for all. there are some things happening very well. the poverty rate for women is the lowest in the nation. we have a higher percentage of women who sit on corporate boards and in senior positions command we have made the greatest rise along with hawaii in reducing the gender wage cap but we have more work to do. that is why i supported raising the minimum wage. why? because the composite, if you will, the average minimum wage earner is at 33 year-old single woman. she was making minimum wage which is less than the

federal poverty level and not able to provide for family. i supported giving her and for under 55,000 others are raised out of poverty. studies show that it boosts our economy and creates jobs. it's good for women, is it for the economy. and that the efforts in reducing domestic violence in maryland on a number of measures to support services, programs and hospitals giving judges the authority to order abusers to surrender firearms and this year, finally kicked the report identified the amex aside the sixth of all of the state the district of columbia in reducing the standard of proof for woman to get a protective order in a domestic violence case. that is tremendous progress for victims of domestic violence, both men and women, but a disproportionate number of victims are women. other were talking about economic issues, educational opportunities, health

opportunities to my will continue to be in the side of maryland's women. >> moderator: thank you. mr. roh in. hogan: first of all, i agree with a lot of what was said in a think he has done a good job with respect to domestic violence initiatives. we talked about that a few days ago when we kicked off domestic violence month and talked about some of the things they have done well. and talking to folks all over the state, and women of the ones that are most concerned about our economy. women are faced with -- most households in maryland are headed by women. in all households just about women make a lot of the financial decisions, and their the ones the suffering as a result of 40 consecutive tax hikes. most of these are regressive taxes that her people at the lower end of the income scale. and the number one issue, the number one women's issue in my opinion is getting our economy back on track, putting women back to work. with respect to the minimum

wage, first of all, i said we're not going to do anything to change the minimum wage legislation. it will help some people at the lower end of the income scale, but there are drawbacks. people estimate we may lose to a thousand jobs. you mention the average minimum wage earner is a 33- year-old single mom. well, it should not be that way. minimum wage was designed for kids to get their first opportunity the join the work force. if we could restore our economy and bring businesses back and create better paying jobs we would not have to deal with this issue. lastly, support unfettered access to birth control for every single woman in maryland contrary to the commercials that my opponent has been running. in fact, we support over the counter birth control paid for by insurance. we will do nothing to rollback women's reproductive rights in spite of the text for my opponent. >> moderator: thank you. gentlemen, we have reached the point where we are to begin are closing statements mr. hogan, you go first. hogan: well, folks, this

election is not really just your typical fight between democrats and republicans. it is more important than that. this is a fight for the future, and it is one worth fighting. the decision that we make in just 28 days will have a lasting impact on the future of our state. it is an important decision. and i believe that the voters of maryland need to just make a simple choice. it really all comes down to this, if you are comfortable with the status quo, happy with the direction that our state is heading and believe that a third term of o'malley brown policies would be good for you, your family, your future, and our state to within you should probably vote for my opponent. if you agree with me that things are way off track, and in the wrong direction and that new leaders are needed, it does not matter what part of the state you live in or what your party affiliation, you need to vote to bring about that change. i am asking, if you want to bring real change to maryland, i am asking for

your vote. thank you. >> moderator: mr. brown. brown: i believe that every veteran of it should be able to pursue the american dream or card complete by the rules, sacrifice when necessary economically purs pursue that achieve your dreams. my parents came to this country six decades ago in pursuing that dream. maryland is to have a choice in november, and the choice is whether to embrace the vision that is shared with countless maryland is across the state where we get up every morning fighting for working families and middle-class values or whether we favor large corporations and the privileged few. will we find pre k or give it three doesn't. we keep our streets safe by ensuring that guns are off the streets or go backwards to the days that nobody wants to return to? i need your vote in four weeks. i need your help in the next

four weeks. more importantly we need you each and every day for the next four years as together we build a better maryland for more marilyn there's. >> moderator: thank you, gentlemen. we would like to thank both of the candidates, of course and the baltimore sun for cosponsoring tonight's debate along with w. jay z tv. we thank you for watching and please remember to cast your vote on election day. good evening. ♪ >> thank you for watching. this has been a presentation from maryland's news station . ♪ >> our campaign 2014 coverage continues with a week full of debates. tonight at 7:00 live coverage of the pennsylvania governor's debate between incumbent governor republican tom corbett and democrat tom wolfe. thursday 7:00 p.m. eastern, live coverage of the eleanor u.s. house debate for the 17th district between u.s. representative to the crenshaw area bestows and

republican bob schilling. and later at 9:00 live coverage of the illinois governor's debate with incumbent governor and republican. and friday night live at 8:00 eastern the wisconsin governors' debate between incumbent governor republican scott walker and democrat mary burke. saturday night on c-span at:00 eastern live coverage of the iowa senate debate with u.s. congressman democrat bruce dailey and republican john d. ernst. sunday, the michigan governor is debate between incumbent governor and democrat mark shower. c-span campaign 2014, more than 100 debate to the control of congress. >> the affordable care act was one of the issues and last night's debate for west virginia's open u.s. senate seats. one issue was a republican congressman voted on the health care a lot. her democratic challenger in the senate race is secretary of state natalie tennant.

here's a look at part of last night's debate. >> moderator: would you vote again today to repeal a see a which would mean 160,000 west virginians would lose their insurance? >> what i feel for is to repeal and replace. i voted for that 50 times, but i also recognize that the aca has some very good things about it. first of all, making sure people don't get cut off their insurance for a pre-existing condition, absolutely for it. was before the president decided to take it in a larger and much more detrimental direction. i believe keeping our students on until they're 26 is a good thing. so there are good things. we need to keep what is good, replace it with global work and get rid of the business mandate to make sure that our businesses are not having a 36% increase in their premiums. 7,000 west virginians have lost their health care plan.

remember, the president who i will remind you of my party supported and supports his policies and his health care politics that if you like your health care plan you can keep. well, that did not work out so well. you know, it was sold as a bill of goods basically. we're hearing people who are losing their physician, deductibles have gone up into the thousands. it is unaffordable. and so ordered things wrong? yes. i wish we'd worked together in a bipartisan way to find a way to keep folks who are on insurance now, the 140,000 to what we want to keep them in short because it is important to us, not just to them but to us as a state. >> moderator: your response? tennant: there she goes again. i wish that -- she says one thing and votes another way. she says she is for all of these things in the aca bid yet she has voted to repeal it. i won't vote to repeal it because i know what it's like to go without health

care. my daughter, delaney, an open heart surgery when she was a week-old. in many folks across west virginia prefer. in those prayers were answered because that surgery saved her life. she is a healthy, happy 12-0 right now. but when my husband and i started our small business we wanted to buy insurance. so he called. i can remember the day i came home when he said, natalie, i talked to the insurance company. and he said, there will cover the india but that will cover delayed because of pre-existing condition. i was devastated because i thought, what a parent takes something that the child can't have? the sow will never go back to the days when insurance companies can deny insurance to someone with a pre-existing condition. for the congressman to sit here and it is used for that, that she voted to take that away.

>> moderator: shelley moore capito was first elected to the u.s. house in 2000. natalie tennant is west virginia's secretary of state. the senate seat is likely republican. and an average of recent polls show republican congresswoman shelley moore capito winning in double digits. you can see their entire debate at c-span.org. >> the candid it's of north carolina's u.s. senate race held their second debate last night. senator kay hagan is seeking reelection against republican challenger, north carolina house speaker thom tillis. george stephanopoulos moderated the debate hosted by the north carolina association of broadcasters educational foundation. before we show the debate, a look at some of the campaign ads running in north carolina. >> i'm kay hagan command you have seen a lot about me lately.

out-of-state special interests are is spending millions destroying my record. dapper of this message because i am tough enough to keep taking the punches and what you deserve to hear what i am really about confiding to create jobs and build an economy that works for everyone troops and veterans and protecting medicare and social security next time you see this falls attack antimasque yourself, whose side are they on? ♪ >> my first job at the paper route. at 15 that was a short order cook. just out of college i went to work, got my degree two decades later. twenty-five years in business, partner and ibm. in america it happens all the time. the train wreck in washington puts all the risk i'm thom tillis. i approve this message. washington has it wrong, but americans can make it right.

>> i'm annette, and i'm from black mountain. education was my way out, but i worry it will be for my kids. some of the of thom tillis that kept the funding. i can't help myself with the software appears think it's clear that thom tillis only lost a certain class of people to have opportunities to become a class mom. his agenda is tax cuts to the wealthy, and that is not working for my family. >> and kay hagan cabana approve this message. >> seen those ads attacking thom tillis, thom tillis, voters paying for those sleazy ads. harry reid trying to fool republican voters, modeling in our primary to get a weak opponent for kay hagan. brought a conservative revolution to raleigh. that is why we need him in washington. don't be fooled by harry reid. >> i'm thom tillis, and i approve this message. >> here is our moderator, george stephanopoulos.

>> moderator: good evening, and thank you for joining us for the second debate by the north carolina association of broadcast as educational foundation broadcasting in the studio of you in cpb. want to get right to introducing the candid it's. senator kay hagan. of course she is currently serving as u.s. senator from north carolina. welcome. hagan: thank you. >> moderator: and thom tillis, currently the speaker of the city's south carolina. welcome to you. thillis: thank you. good evening. >> moderator: you know the rules. who will start with opening statements. the kendis will respond to questions along with input from me and my team. the next part of the debate, the candidates will have an opportunity to ask each other questions directly. finally closing statements. we want you to know that the order of the opening and closing statements in which candidate gets the first question were determined and agree to prior to the debate and senator kay hagan of the

first opening statement in the first question. hagan: george, thank you for being here tonight and viewers all across north carolina, thank you for turning in. north carolinian is needed common-sense voice that will stand up for a middle-class. fight for our military command protect the promises that we have made to our seniors. at a time when we need leaders to unite around our family's best interest, a speaker thom tillis has built to record of dividing a state, is putting the wealthy and big corporations first. he has get it education, killed in the copay built, make college more expensive and said no health care out for 500,000 author of the ins. and, folks, he is campaigning and a promise to take that this truck division of the washington. lisa in north carolina is the state where the weak grow strong and a strong program. thom tillis feels that those who have the most should get the most help. i believe that our

middle-class comes first and that everyone deserves the opportunity to grow up strong and great. >> moderator: speaker thom tillis. thillis: thank you. last week president obama said every one of his policies, every single one of them are on the ballot this november. she has voted with president obama 96% of the time, served as a rubber-stamp for president obama's failed policies of a promised she would go to washington and get things done and has failed promise or broken a promise. we need a senator that knows what it's like to struggle to make ends meet while going to college and raising a family. i have done that, and i realize the american dream. when i was in a legislature i felt my promise to cut spending and taxes and get people back to work. we need to do that in washington. senator kay hagan went to washington, promised she would be different and broker of promise. if you want the same failed promises a vote for kay

hagan. if you think it's time to change the direction of this country i hope you will vote for thom tillis. >> moderator: okay. first question goes to you. as you know, speaker thom tillis has made the fight against isis. and now you have had some differences without president obama has handled this in the past. do you fully support president obama's policy and mission right now and are you confident it will succeed? hagan: you know, george, these individuals are terrorists. they have attacked americans mission should be to eradicate these terrorists. i have been decisive about taking out isis in the course on. that think instead of a two-part strategy, the first is air strikes. we need to take out the weapons stockpile, training grounds, and command-and-control centers. the second part is army and training the moderate syrian rebels. all of this has to be done within a broad coalition of middle eastern partners.

right now we have arab states joining in, saudi arabia, guitar, the uae, bahrain, and jordan. but it has to be a unified front. i think when i see what the speaker has done, he is waffling on these issues, spineless on what he would do to take isis out. i have the full year, the size of the above and i think that we need to hear what the speaker would do. as for anything president, is not doing that you would do? hagan: i think obviously troops on the ground is a big issue that has everyone's concern. think that when i look at what has taken place in the u.s. of the last 12 to 13 years, that we have been at war coming to wars, have many domestic needs at home. we need to let the iraqi and the syrians fight this battle on the ground. i do think that we need to have their reauthorization of the authority for the use about 3/4, and i have called

on the president to bring that before congress. i would go back to washington at a moment's notice to have a full debate in congress on that. >> moderator: speaker thom tillis. thillis: senator, senator kay hagan and president obama, this is a policy that is to be on the ballot. they have failed the american people and made our nation and the world less safe and secure. they're coming up with this strategy, a problem that they largely created. this isn't it, this that cometh to the left and created a vacuum. and the president has continued to fail and show almost a strategy. the stairs they to be wiped off the face of the planet have taken advantage of it really should have a no-fly zone. we should revoke the passports of americans who are fighting with isis and

the middle east. we should take several steps. and the other thing we should not do, and this is a big issue, we should not continue to telegraph to the terrorists want to destroy america and our allies and tell them what we are not going to do. >> moderator: let me follow-up on that. she told me that if other nations don't step toward the united states would have no choice but to put boots on the ground. thom tillis one of the reasons they have failed to step forward is because this president has failed to lead the world. normally the president is considered to be a leader of the free world rallying nations together to put down terrorist threats. but now our allies, friends across the world really don't know where this president stands because the telegraph system -- telegraphs and get straight to the terrors. some credibility.

hagan: he did not as if your question cannot lawfully and all these corporate key told that is proof that he did not know what should seventh theory is as far as your question, i do think it is high time that the moderate syrian rebels get armed, trained as well as the iraqis. i asked the question at the hearing before we have the vote to arm and train the moderate syrian rebels about the process of setting the soldiers in iraq. he says they've been very good at it. half the number of a battalion. ed to look to turkeycess a and what turkey -- whether there will stepup. >> moderator: what is amazing to me is someone who is looking from the outside, senator dagen for the last year has failed to show up to more than half of the foreign affairs committees to get an update the rebel like to see our senator

asking. the third largest military presence of any state in the nation. i think that you move heaven and earth, get rid of the calendar commitments of a conflict the may have and go there and educate us on the options. i would like to know him for example, what perris there were there were greater that cause you to miss more than half of the meetings so that we would have a better understanding of what you're doing and how you're acting care for the questions later and you guys have a chance to question each other then. my second question on the issue of education. this one goes to you. coming core education standards in 48 states to north carolina. the governor recently signed legislation that will result in replacing those standards of new ones. i know you said you oppose the common course standards, but do you support in the national education standards? thillis: of course we have to have standards. we need to know how kids and

matching up. what opse is the bureaucracy, the department of education that was not even created until 1980. 5,000 bureaucrats making on average $102,000 per year stifling what teachers want to do in the classroom. the problem with common core is that teachers are being more worried about having me up to the standards that what they're really want to do, pursuing their passion, educating the kids. come in court, no job left behind, raced to the top all had strings attached. the federal government spends about 15%. the government has been controlling the classroom. of what standards to make absolutely certain that our children are learning math and science and technology to engineering school, but i want to make sure that teachers feel like the erin power to do what they had to do to educate these children. that is the passion. they want government out of the wake. hagan: once again he did not answer your question. , a car was not put together

by the department of education in washington. it was put together by governors and by states setting high expectations for students all across this country so that we could not only compete against one another within our states that we could be more competitive on a global basis. but what speaker thom tillis has done is tax cuts for the wealthy and getting our education system. he has cut $500 million from public education. you know what that means? that means fewer teachers in the classroom, larger class from sizes, and outdated textbooks if there are any textbooks at all. i can imagine the number of teachers that have told me what textbook? was actually in planners recently, a third grader, little girl from third grade told me that she raises her hand every day in the classroom and is no longer called on because there are 32 students in a class. the speaker thom tillis has get our education system.

♪ a lot of times you'll hear make that same claim which has been proven false to. it is simply false. since 2011 s spending a billion dollars more a year in education. this year we provided an average 7 percent pay increase for teachers. we had to catch up to newer teachers because they were getting behind and we were not competitive with neighboring states. next year will give them another seven person race. that is what we're going to turn education around. and the nonsense of the things that have been proven false religious discourse the argument. action is to spend more time in north carolina and understand the good things we're doing. >> moderator: the last word on this issue. hagan: once again finds speaker thom tillis is. we might be spending for education cannot we have so many thousands more students it is being deleted dividend

at 7% raise, i have talked to teachers, senior teachers to been a 20 plus years that a getting a point to 9 percent raise. he took away the longevity pay that is built in. some teachers actually got a tax income cut. we need to do more for education because it is our entire future. >> moderator: next question is on health care and goes to you, senator kay hagan. the one-year anniversary of the affordable care act rollout. change on that law and of? and other legislative changes you would make? hagan: thank you. as you said, it is been a year. i think when we look at the affordable care act there are some common sense fixes that need to be made to this bill. as i talk to people all across north carolina, with their share with me is that they want the politics taken out of this. they don't want to go back to a broken system. they don't want to go back to a time when if you have a

pre-existing condition you were unable to get health insurance. seniors would be paying more for their prescription drugs, and with it would pay more for coverage than they do today. the common sense fixes that think we ought to be looking at, we have taken care of the small-business paperwork, 10909 requirement to be ready to look at the 30 or week. currently in the affordable care act, and the other is to have a copper plan. we need to look at a copper that would be cheaper and primarily targeted toward your people. but speaker thom tillis would repeal this law and take us back to a broken system. thillis: of course the affordable care act, the heart of the program and a speaker mentioned the come as the president made from his policies are on the ballot, every single one of them. do you agree? hagan: you know, speaker thom tillis wants to make this race about the president. this race is about who is going to represent north

carolina in the u.s. senate. nothing north carolinian is what i common-sense voice. >> moderator: speaker thom tillis. thillis: would you vote with the president 60 percent of that time you represent is policies. obamacare is one of the most disastrous regulatory frameworks that has ever been passed in the history of the united states. is destabilizing health care for 250 million americans are satisfied with a plan to try and solve a problem that exists. of course we should address issues continue to be on their parents' health care plans, but center hagen has broken a promise 24 different times. promise the people of north carolina 24 different times if you like your doctor you can keep it. if you like your health care, you can keep it. 472,000 people got cancellation notices last year. oppressing cleverly decided to delay that until next year when the cancellations will come out again.

the last couple of weeks 50,000 retirees and 11 counties in north carolina are getting cancellation notices. and what they're going to get on the 15th of premium increases and eruptions. as a failed policy that needs to be fixed and repealed and then we need to come up with common sense solutions, not broken promises. ♪ let me follow up on that. how are you going to be able to come up with policies that care for the children who are 26 and under? ♪ reach across the aisle. senator in talks about it is time to finally have someone reach across the island get things done. believe that their democratic senators presented that makes sense. adding a trillion dollars to the debt does not make sense robbing medicare of $700 billion over the next ten years by reducing dr. reimbursements in hospital reimbursements does not make sense.

having a child under the age of 26 makes perfect sense the beginning of treatment for pre-existing condition, perfect sense. and believe the american people will embrace it and they would quickly embrace not having the two and a half million equivalent jobs lost through this regulatory overreach. >> i don't think he answered your question again. hagan: let me tell you what he has done to the state of north carolina. no state exchange. what would help the people, but the other big factor is rejecting medicate interstate. 500,000 people in the state are unable to receive care. as people still get sick. they get to the emergency room, which is the most expensive care and not even treatment. that is not right. he could, you know, just like that could have made that happen. the other thing, his company, price waterhouse cooper has actually written a report that stead states that did not expand medicaid

and hospitals are suffering. in north carolina we already had one hospital closed because of the medicaid expansion. thillis: we did not implement an exchange because we predicted would happen. was a failure in know how much it costs? $2 billion. we understood that was coming to try to advance a failed policy that is killing two and a half million equivalent jobs, a policy that is robbing medicare of $700 billion, breaking the promise to seniors, breaking a promise to people were happy with their health plan. i am answering that question. i think you need to answer why you told people 24 times at the like their health truethey can keep it and at and what did you continue to say? >> moderator: the supreme court, and the question is for, speaker thom tillis. as you know, decided not to take up the issue of same-sex marriage. the fourth circuit court of

appeals decision which struck down the bin and virginia will apply here in north carolina. and you said you would fight this. on what grounds and can you went? >> two years ago 60 percent said that they wanted to define the institution as an institution of marriage between a man and woman. i feel it is my responsibility after 60 percent of the people voted that the law to defend all of the state. also think we are in a dangerous time in this country where the president has appointed liberal activist judges and senator hagen has endorsed or confirmed him, literally trying to legislate from the bench. asked attorney general to sue north carolina for the voter i.d. bill. 70 percent of north carolina's think this makes sense to present to 90. said reagan went to washington and ask the federal government to sue us. the federal government is continuing in the judicial

system is continuing to become an activist legislative branch. and it is denying states to do the things that they want to do. what north carolina may want to do is what of carolinian is to decide, not center a in the courts in washington. >> moderator: let me follow-up on that. as they follow through on the supreme court decision in the fourth circuit court of appeals decision and ruled the ban unconstitutional, is that the law of carolina? thillis: we are going to continue to take her case because that has not been decided. there are other circuits that have not decided. ultimately this does get to the supreme court. @booktv thank you, george perry that two families look alike, but all families what to do the best for their children and grandchildren. i do not think anyone, including the government, should tell somebody who they love for who they can marry. speaker thom tillis put amendment one on the ballot in north carolina. he actually said he had to put it on the ballot in a may primary because it would not a past in november.

he is also hiring lawyers, paying for lawyers and a taxpayer dollars to take his suit to court. he has said that they will continue to fight this case in spite of what the supreme court's denial as penn, as far as letting these issues stand. you know, i opposed the amendment won which pared to a marriage in north carolina. and i want to up front that to one of the issues says. he wants to talk about percentages. 100 percent of the time speaker thom tillis policies have hurt north carolina, get education temecula eight copay bill, no medicaid expansion. that is what he says being effective. thillis: 96% of the time said to reagan has voted with president obama. president obama says when you go in the november election that you are voting

for his policies. senator reagan went to washington, left raleigh, turned back on it, went to washington and is loaded with the president 96 percent of the time. she has confirmed liberal activist judges that the nine states the right to govern themselves, ignoring the citizens for north carolina voted 60% for this bill. i would like to have a senator that goes to washington and the only independent she has shown there is independence from north carolinian. i would like to come back, and listen to north carolina is to represent our interests better. hagan: the people of north carolina know that i can on every weekend and all the town hall meeting in 100 counties drought north carolina. once again, he is talking about percentages. folks, 100 percent of the time his policies have failed people in north carolina. and, you know, i have been ranked the most moderate senator in the country by the nonpartisan national journal. they rank senators 1-100. i am smack dab in the

middle. that means i can work across the aisle with the request of republicans. smack dab in the middle is exactly the place north carolina as. >> moderator: next question on immigration gusty. as you know, the images of unaccompanied immigrant children in central america coming across our southern border illegally. almost 1600 been brought to north carolina as their cases work through the courts. should these children be returned home? hagan: you know, the immigration system in our country is broken, and i think in action is not an option. i've talked to people, businesses, farmers thrown off carolina. after listening to the farm bureau, the national chamber of commerce, i support immigration reform. i am one of the senators who voted for the common sense bipartisan immigration reform. along with me john mccain demarco rubio, lindsay gramm have all supported that bill

speaker thom tillis will tell you he does not supported primarily because the border security issues. some of the issues are being brought up right now. as far as these children coming in from central america, i think that we need to help fund the southern command of our military to really get to the root cause of why these children and leaving. some of them, the families are paying the traffickers to send their children up or if. without doing that we are not going to solve this problem. i think these children will go through the court system, but i do think some of them will get asylum. >> moderator: not all of that have to be returned home. thillis: if they go through the system but i think a large number of them will be sent on to their families. thillis: struggled to answer that question. let me be clear, the tragedy these children are going through is truly a tragedy. in need to be reunited with families and the nations that are aiding and abetting human traffickers taking

these children to incredibly horrible circumstances. many to be told if you do that will be consequences. a strong nation needs a strong border. a strong nation needs to know who is coming into this country and what threat they may represent to us. we need to get the ball or secure. we need to implement, and we need to make it clear. incidentally there is another policy on the ballot. president obama said he would wait in to immigration after the election. we all know that he will implement amnesty and that senator hegel's supported. there has been a mistake. this has been a bipartisan failure. republicans and democrats have failed on this issue. we need to get serious about sealing the border, do that first to make clear that people are not going to break in line and then solve the problem here verses the empty words that continued to come out of president obama and senator hank and on immigration. >> moderator: as 30

seconds. hagan: he will not say why he will support immigration reform. a number of senators have passed this comprehensive common-sense built. it does not include amnesty. i don't think speaker thom tillis understands the definition of amnesty, but it is not and gusty. and as far as the executive orders to buy a call on the presiden to execute executive orders. i don't think from immigration standpoint that is the way to go. this is too big. i certainly support the common sense of bipartisan immigration reform bill that we passed, and speaker thom tillis should say what you will not. thillis: she says one thing and does another. she says she has directed the president not to act alone but she voted against a member try to be offered by the senate to do just that. the fact of the matter is the senator has failed t people of north carolina and the nation by now securing our borders. we have an ebola outbreak, bad actors who could come across the border.

we need to seal the border and security, making clear that blanket amnesty is not on the table and then we need to solve for the first time inm we have of immigration in this country. >> moderator: my next question, i want to talk about the ebola outbreak peabody call on president obama to ban travel, liberia, sierra leone, but the speaker for the director of this is a disease control and he told me that this kind of band backfire and be counterproductive. what is your response to back. >> it is clear that the president does not know what to do yet. i know that the cdc is working hard. i don't know that they're working smart. you can see the protocols were not followed and that we have the potential threat of exposure. hopefully that does not happen. we have not had exposure in the country yet and hopefully we can keep it that way. the reason i suggest that the common sense ban on travel was to give the cdc time to figure out how we can make sure when somebody

gets on a commercial jetliner and fly from liberia to brussels to dallas and the dallas that they are not exposing hundreds of people to the virus. we need to protect the safety and security of american people. you do that by limiting and reducing the threat as much as possible. the president has not done that. other nations in western africa have. implemented travel bans to try and make sure that they keep their people safe and secure. and need to do the same thing in a need to send resources to west africa the best that we have because we have the best doctors in the world to try to help solve the problem before senator hank in. hagan: in this issue i think that we need to work with the coalition of international partners on how we can fight this epidemic and ultimately stop it. travel ban could be one part of a broad range of issues on how we can work through this. you know, just -- thillis: are not open to

that. hagan: to a broad range. the problem is, if you isolate those countries you will solve the problem. the problem is, how are we going to stop this virus, containing, and ultimately killed? i think in congress we recently passed close to $100 million of which will help go toward the research and development of therapies into global of programs. i personally have talked to infectious disease physicians here in north carolina and our hospital officials and associations in north carolina. ..

our safety and security is at risk. senator hagan needs to step up and address these problems. hagan: they should be part of a broader range of issues. i am pleased in north carolina one of our own companies has put forth research and development and a trial medication is bng us on the patient dal rit now. i think that shows positive movement in wate've done within our own state think th wn use scare t no anisue lie what you'r serious way.veryctictad i thhe's

>> morermove ontove to th ony anjobs. questionyo what is ou red of theomic ght no given the ct congress and th t gislation, is the ngou b yieve the prident ould be doing on its ow rht now tostreng the economy? hagan:n h carolina we have great places that are hot in the market but we have gh unemployment, particularly in our rural areas. as i said i that italo meeting in every 100 counties. without fail jobs, economic recovery is the number one priority for people in north think that we need to work together. i think we need to have overall tax reform that i think would make a difference. i think we need to look at or advanced manufacturing and bring more events manufacturing back to this country. i've got a bill called the repatriation bill. we have u.s. global companies in north carolina and around the

united states. sitting overseas based on our tax policy. to bring that money and they would pay 35%. mike bell which is cosponsored by john mccain would allow that money to come back in at 8%. they could buy that rate down to five if they hire american workers. we would have $1 trillion coming into this country. we could put together the money, 50, 60, $80 billion into infrastructure fund that we been could leverage and put people back to work rebuilding this country and that would increase thousands and millions of jobs. tillis: senator hagan solution is spending more money. it's very simple. government needs to get out of the way. we need to get our spending under control and we need to reduce regulation. senator hagan when she cast the deciding vote for obamacare voted to kill the equivalent of 2.5 million jobs. senator hagan sounds on epa overreached a silent consent for

regulatory burdens on businesses that will kill hundreds of thousands of jobs. senator hagan's vote on sequestration indiscriminate cuts to the military are going to result in 20, 30,000 jobs being lost down peace. that's not a great jobs. government kills jobs. small businesses, large businesses create jobs. we need to stop putting burdens on them like the burdens senator hagan allow the epa to please on evergreen packaging out in western north carolina to guide to sign a bill to prevent 1000 jobs in the can one of lasted as i decide for we got out of session. the overreached is destroying our opportunities. we have got to get to a point where regulations are responsible and allowing businesses, not government, to create jobs. hagan: let me to about thom tillis is tax policy and jobs policy. east and teachers to texas, film jobs to george and medicaid

dollars to 28 other states. that's his failed economic policy. we need cut taxes for the wealthy, he has gutted education system. he is making college more expensive. he's now put a sales tax on every students meal plan. and he did away with the 529 college savings tax credit so parents could save to send their children to college. i know that a sound education and a strong university universy community college system is what makes for a sound economy. speaker tillis has totally the wrong plan for people in north carolina. tillis: when senator hagan was appropriations chair and the legislature she made a promise to the citizens of north carolina. we were in a rough patch into the template a sales tax. it harms the poor and working families more than anyone else. senator hagan do not so far as to break her promise. she said it would be temporary and pension fund to make part of it permanent. senator hagan has continued to

misrepresent what we're doing. we cut the sales tacti tax. we fulfill the promise snore taken broke. we came back in the first six month we for folder. we cut the sales tax that help support -- the poor and working families but those are the kinds of things we needed in washington. they are the exact opposite of what she voted for with president obama and his policies that will be on the ballot in just about four weeks. >> moderator: talk more about washington. how can you change that if you go -- start by naming at least one big issue where you would disagree and take on your party's leadership. tillis: i think we'll got to do is talk about the things that we can to actually move legislation, like 350 bills that have gone from houston what to harry reid's desk. senator hagan has been quite. she's talking about bipartisan leadership. let's talk about regulatory reform.

let's talk about repealing obamacare. let's talk about putting the epa back in to check instead of destroying jobs. the problem we have with washington is it's broke. the people are not communicating across the aisle. senator hagan over six years has not altered a single bill that's gone to the president's desk. that's the problem. we need people who will bring people together. in areas where we can't agree, don't take the time and move into areas where we can agree. take time to find policies that can create jobs versus kill them like obamacare, 2.5 million jobs equivalent, 600,000 jobs with the epa overreached. let's reduce regulation and create jobs. >> moderator: let me ask the question again. which issue would you take on your party's leadership? tillis: i don't know, this point it's hard to say because in the senate which i'll speak for the senate, not for the house, harry reid house on anything to be passed.

george, you know this better than most people. when you have a house at three and 50 bills in the senate and jolie have a few dozen votes in the house, only a few dozen votes in the senate. it's hard to figure where the differences would be because they are not debating because no such thing as regular order. senator hagan has rubberstamped harry reid's policy i'm sure request by president obama to shut down the senate. save all these tough votes until after the election. you need to understand, delaying the mandate and delaying amnesty are all an election issues that are on the ball and give an opportunity to stop it. if i do want to ask in your question again? >> moderator: hugo ahead. hagan: >> i disagree with the present. i think we need to build a keystone pipeline. trade deals. i voted against trade deals because they sent to me north carolina jobs overseas. i voted against my own parties budget because it had to deep account your military. speaker tillis on the other

hand, would've supported a budget that would turn medicare into a voucher program. he would've supported sequestration. he would've supported a government shutdown and when he would've supported a government shutdown and north carolina when that took place it was the height of our fall lease season at west and our phishing season in the east. that is what speaker tillis would have done. tillis: i'm glad senator hagan brought up the sequestration because i did have numbers in the caucus support that bill. i wouldn't have. senator hagan day. senator hagan voted for sequestration which are indiscriminate cuts that are harming our military and also harming jobs in the military sector, over in eastern north carolina come down east as we called it and north carolina. 30,000 jobs. i would have a post that. i oppose the leadership are doing and the number of other minor examples but the big issue with washington is it's broke.

senator hagan has allowed harry reid to shut down congress and not sent legislation to the president's desk. >> moderator: you all ask each other questions. according to the rules it's been a great senator hagan will receive the first candidate question. speaker tillis, your first question force nor -- senator hagan. tillis: president said all his balls are on about this election if you voted with the present 96% of the time. my question to you is not that you claim to be a moderate, claim to be independent, which of the policies out of the 96% that you supported do you regret? hagan: you know, speaker tillis, as far as policies, presidents policies on the ballot right now, i don't think you understand two things. one, the effectiveness. i don't think you know my record. a miracle works bill passed, tuition assistance to pass. camp lejeune water contamination bill passed.

that can is being effective for the people in north carolina. however, your idea of being effective is tax cuts for the wealthy, gutting public education by $500 billion it and yes, that is a fact. the fact that you make college more expensive doing away with the 529 college plans, a tax of studio plans. doing away with earned income tax credit that affects 64,000 military families in our state. speaker tillis come your idea of effectiveness is hurting the people of north carolina everyday. hagan: i assume by the fact that you haven't mentioned a single vote you regret that you are proud of the fact you voted with the president 96% of the time. that's what i think it's fair to make this election as the president himself said, about his policies. senator hagan voted with the president 96% of the time. president obama's said all of his policies are on the ballot.

policies that are killing jobs, policies that are making our nation less safe and less secure, policies that are failing to match the threat against isis, policies that are not right for america. we need to make america great again. we do it through strong leadership. we do it i making tough decisions like the tough decisions we made in north carolina which is making north carolina perform better than most other states. we came from far behind, fourth highest unemployment rate when i came in. now we are near the national average. we need leadership and people who will stand up to the president but senator hagan told you tonight, the president's policies are on the ballot. she supported them 96% of the time and she doesn't regret a single vote. hagan: speaker tillis, north carolina women are just 82 cents on the dollar compared to their male counterparts. in the general assembly you kill an equal pay bill and you said

you don't support a proposed equal pay bill in congress. why don't you support these bills to ensure that women get equal pay for equal work? tillis: you probably know that there are laws on the books that it's against the law to do something that any employer does, he should pay the consequences. men and women, my mother who worked hard and help us actually make ends meet. my wife, my daughter, and a number of other people have worked, women they serve the same pay as men. let's enforce the laws better on the books, versus some of the campaign gimmicks that are going to put more regulations on businesses and make it even more difficult. women in north carolina are disproportionately out of work since president obama coming to office and senator hagan supported his policies. minorities are disproportionately out of work. let's focus in getting them back to work and getting a thriving and vibrant, a thriving business

in private that will actually increase salaries and make it better for these women. 40% of whom are headed households in this state. we need to focus on policies to give economy back on track, not just another rubberstamp for another regulatory policy that makes it harder for businesses to grow jobs in north carolina. hagan: i think you need to read reports. women in north carolina are earned 82 cents on the dollar. i didn't raise my two daughters to think they are worth 82 cents on the dollar. the first bill that i cosponsor when i got to the senate was the lilly ledbetter fair pay act. we need to build on that law and pass the paycheck fairness act which is the equal pay bill. but speaker tillis, i don't think you understand that the bottom line when women get more money affects not just women that it affects their entire families. husbands want their women to get equal pay. speaker tillis, i've been a woman in the workplace. i know the obstacles that women

face. let's just give women equal pay for equal work. tillis: i absolutely think we should get equal pay to equal work and those employers who don't do it should bear the consequences. based on the laws already on the books. my mother worked hard. my grandmother was a single mom. my grandfather passed away during the depression era where she had to work every single day. i know she was discriminate against and that was wrong. that's what equal pay act was passed. we need to make sure my daughter who will start nursing next year, she better get paid the same amount as a man of the same skill set or there should be consequences for the. what we don't need to do is put another regulation in place like obamacare and all these other regulation t that killing jobs d harming women in disproportionate numbers in the state. >> moderator: 30 more seconds. hagan: speaker tillis and equal pay act was passed. and has not been passed and he opposes that bill.

speaker tillis opposes the minimum wage. he said the minimum wage is a dangerous idea and speaker tillis, mitt romney thinks we should increase the minimum wage. you have said that's a state policy and yet you have done nothing in north carolina to increase the minimum wage in our state. you know, speaker tillis doesn't want hard-working north carolinians to get $10 an hour but he sees nothing wrong with a ceo making $10 million a year who deserves an extra tax break. >> moderator: time for your second question. tillis: senator hagan, last year the threat of isis was clear. back in the early part of this year president obama called isis the jv game. for the last year you have sat on the foreign affairs committee and you must have been meeting. you've also chaired the subcommittee on emerging threats and haven't had a single meeting on the threat of isis. can you explain to me what other

commitments you had that you thought were more important than sitting in the committee, getting advice from our military commanders, and also making sure you are asking questions that north carolinians want to know in these public meetings so that we had a better understanding of what was going on, what the real threat was and what you're going to do to help improve our safety and security? but i am mainly interested in where were you and why were other commitments more important than sitting in the foreign affairs committee? hagan: let me clarify something, george. i'm not on the foreign affairs committee. i served on the armed services committee. speaker tillis . tillis: i stand corrected. were you not present for 50% of those meetings? hagan: george, i'm on the armed service committee. it seems like -- [talking over each other] it seems like what you're saying is i am not great on the issues at hand having to deal in particular with isis. please note that a year ago this

past spring adhering i actually asked about arming and training the moderate sunni rebels at that time. that was actually before we knew with isis was. i really think that if we had taken that step we would not have seen the proliferation of these barbaric terrorists rise to the extent that they have today. please note that i haven't chaired numerous counterterrorism hearings. i have met with the general dempsey, who is chairman of the joint chiefs of staff, secretary hagel, on numerous occasions. recently we had a closed briefing and we had an open meeting with secretary hagel and general dempsey. i asked numerous questions, and that the closed briefing i was probably the last senator to leave after three or four hours of open dialogue about what we need to do as far as isis. so folks, i am well informed on

these issues. i have been decisive on what to do to take of isis and, of course, on. but once again speaker tillis has waffled. he told the news he had no idea what he would do. has not articulated one thing where they would our mentoring the moderates are in redmond, what his plan would be. tillis: i would how much more information i would have if my senator from north carolina who sits on the armed service committee would show up for work. she missed more than half of in these. those meetings are to inform you and me about what's going on and with the threats are and what the military commanders and the people of knowledge on the ground for going to do. senator hagan seems to think it doesn't matter to show up to public meetings. more than half the time should be somewhere. i'd like to know where she was. we have to make sure that people are informed. people are scared. people are worried about our safety and security. i will go to washington and i will show up for the armed services committee meetings. i will make sure the parents that can pleasure and an fort bragg another basis know that i cared i want to know what the stepstatus is.

i want him to be informed. hagan: speaker tillis, you ought to say what you would do with isis. i think the people of north carolina, our trip should understand what you want to do and what your plan would be and you will not say. and, folks, speaker tillis hometown newspaper actually called on him to resign because he missed so many days in the session because he was out fund-raising. >> moderator: senator hagan, now time for your second question to speaker tillis. hagan: thank you, george. many north killings depend on student loans to finance their dream of going to college. speaker tillis, why do you oppose a bill that would let graduates refinance their student loan debt at a lower rate when they would help more than 600,000 north carolinians? they would benefit from this commonsense reform. tillis: it's just another example where senator hagan is out of touch with what we have to do to get our economy healed

and make a safe and secure. we need to create jobs. senator hagan come if we cut the interest rate to zero, many of these students don't have jobs to pay off their loans. senator hagan is trying to find another regulatory solution like obamacare, epa overreached and things that are killing jobs. the students, they should be admired for what they did to get their degree. they are thirsting for the opportunity to work and live their american dream. senator hagan, instead of thinking of things, green job opportunities that will let them pay off the student loan just wants to go into the sort of new mentality where all you're doing is to help people pay off debt versus give them the resources to grow and realize there american dream, to have a job. senator hagan, i would say why don't we stop regulating? why do we stop killing jobs? why don't we start creating jobs? they're more concerned with what people do with their vacation time.

hagan: folks, you heard that speaker tillis does not support allowing students to refinance their student debt. we have graduates today whose debt is crippling them. they cannot buy that first home. they can not starting a business. do you know that this would've 600,000 people in north carolina? interest rates on some of these graduates are up to 13% to you can get a fixed-rate 30 year mortgage today for under 5%. to me this is a commonsense measure that could help thousands of people, 600,000 just in north carolina. he's already made college more expensive. as i said, 529 college savings tax credit done away with. a new tax on a college student attending the university. speaker tillis has already made college more expensive and yet he won't do the simple thing of allowing students to refinance their debt. you can refinance every other thing and yet not a student

loan. do you know that student loan debt now surpasses credit card debt in this country, and speaker tillis says no to a like them to refinance. tillis: i believe that those tunes of graduate degrees and undergraduate degrees would love nothing more than here a senator say this, this is what i'm going to do for you when i am your next u.s. senator. i'm going to greet the opportunity for you to get a job and your student loans will be paid off because i'm going to focus on the promise we should be keeping to the young kids that are coming up today like the kid i was. i went to college, to be 16 years to get my degree. i didn't go to college when i came out of high school. i went into a warehouse. it took me 16 years to get my degree. i never thought i was going to lie on government to get me a job. i wanted to get a job but i wanted to pay off my debt. try for that's all the tom lepper candidate questions. time for closing statements. each candidate gets 90 seconds. tillis: ladies and gentlemen you can see senator hagan and i have

very different visions for america and very different approaches for how i would deal with president obama versus how she would deal with president obama. rubberstamping his policies is not the solution. having an independent voice and going to washington and working for you is the solution. we need a senator that understands government doesn't create jobs. it kills jobs. we need a center that will go to washington and fulfill the promises that they made, not break the promises and make commitments that they don't deliver on. we need a senator that recognizes somebody like me, when i was a kid i got lawns, i was a paperboy, i was a short order cook, i didn't go to college right out of high school. i went to work in a warehouse. took me 16 years to get my degree but by that time i was struggling to make ends meet and i was raising a family but i'm here as a living example of the realization of the american dream. i want every american to have the same opportunity that i did. senator hagan went to washington

and she became a rubberstamp for president obama's failed policies and she bought it within 96% of the time. six years later people are suffering and they are fearful. they're worried about our safety and security. a vote for senator hagan is a vote for president obama's failed policies. i want to go to washington and help make america great again. we can get back to the nation of opportunity that we are the envy of the world. i'm asking for your vote and i will appreciate your support. hagan: you know, speaker tillis, it is not how you grew up to it is how you treat people as they grow. folks, speaker tillis has slammed shut the window of opportunity for somebody people in our state because of his policies that have harmed north carolina. but george, i want to talk about what i can tell people in north carolina. i want to talk about what i've done to help our veterans. jerry is in the rain, he served at camp lejeune. his daughter died of leukemia

because of toxic contaminated water on the base. when i first got to the u.s. senate i worked with jerry to help get answers and to get health care for the victims. because of my bipartisan work with senator burr, we passed the jayme law. so now families who work and live at camp lejeune can get health care. folks, that's what i'm about, helping people, uniting people. as we say in our state those, north carolina is the place where the weak grow strong and the strong grow great. i'm about supporting the middle-class and being sure that everybody in our great state has an opportunity to grow both strong and great. thank you, george. and george, i wanted to thank you tonight for being here. i wanted to ask all the voters in north carolina, i would appreciate your support come november the fourth, and god

bless you and the people of north carolina. >> moderator: i want to thank both you corporatist thing. it was an honor to be with you tonight. this does conclude the second north carolina debate. and this was brought to you by the north carolina association of broadcasters educational foundation. on behalf of all of us thanks for watching. pennsylvania's republican governor appears to be turning against his democratic challenger. according to the latest quinnipiac poll. they're holding their final debate tonight. you can watch live coverage at seven eastern on c-span. and tomorrow it's the illinois governors debate. statewide polls find his edging ahead of his challenge. c-span but live coverage of tomorrow night debate at nine these turn.

>> this week it on the c-span networks, friday night at 9 p.m. eastern on c-span, a memorial service for president reagan's press secretary james brady.

is about an hour. ♪ ♪ >> moderator: good evening and welcome to the your vote of 201o for him for the candidates in arizona's second congressional district. i'mov christopher with arizona public media. we will spend the next hour with democratic incumbent ron barber and republicanat challenger martha's pe weapon. thanks so much for being here.n before we begin here are the ru rulesle for tonight's discussio. each candidate will get a 92nd

opening statement and a 92nd closing statement.ques in between i will ask questions from a list prepared by theti arizona staff not seen by theby candidates.some quesons w some questions were submitted over twitter.tinue sding you can continue sending questions during this evening is life for him using the hash tag candi #cv2question. h each will have a minute toqu ana respond in follow-up. i i will be advising the timelimi. limit. now for opening statements from the first east on a drawing before hand, martha mcsally. mcsally: i'm retired colonel mra martha mcsally.becae the the problems facing our country se and our community are severe. more than ever the failures of w washington, d.c. are hurting us ina southern arizona. middle-class families middle class families are struggling in this economy. unemployment is 9.2% and it wask reported this week that tucson has the highest number of jobost loss in the whole country.

the ly's only funded through on december 11 to 65 more daysptem impacting the national security andd local economy. wer border is not secure. we have border ranchers andakinl residents making difficult decisions to keep their familiesot safe and we have cases and mi islamist extremists around the world that are more powerful anh dangerous than al qaeda before 9/11 because of the failede foreign and defense policy ofcys this administration. every two years we get to decid who we want to represent us ini, congress and fight for us tot f address these issues and this is like a job interview with the voters in for a job interview we bring to them our qualifications from our experience and ourecord record of getting things done.fm and for mr. barber this is an s evaluation. things are getting worse.were n we are in a crisis and a crisiss takes leadership that's going tv do the right thing to have a vision and to be effective. i've been in situations like ke

this before but take resolve and courage. have i've served, fought, bled and hi stood up for what's right and'mo i'm honored to serve you if elected.ening barber: rst ofthat mr. barber's statement. barber: first think you hadblic arizona public media for bringing us together.pportunitye this is an opportunity for the people of southern arizona to see the two candidates side byde ade and make a decision about what they represent, whatarry io policies they will carry into ad office and whether or not theyad can be trusted and whether orot not they know this community.i m i'm very honored and proud to have served now in congress since june of 2012 and i lookedp forward for the voters to say he's done a good job with send onm back. i ent to c when i went to congress i said e was going to be an independent i'm prou voice and i'm proud of the have record that we have had it since

i went to congress. j the national journal one ofo ths most objective magazines in thed country is determined by the fourth most independent member of the house of representatives. i have deep roots. have deep my familyro is here, my wife was born here, i was at the air force base when my dad brought o us here when i was a teenager. a my daughters and my grandchildren are here to read i love this community. this is our home and this isnd s where i intend to be too rvice continued after public service when voters send me back. let me close with this. today is a historic day. the ninth circuit of the u.s. u court de.sclared the marriage ae equa quality is something they wouldn approve. it's about time because anyone that wants someone else ought tg be up toht make the samet imade commitment i made it to to my ife 47 years ago and i'm so arg proud we are going to see thatrr become part ofia our culture our across the country. moderat >> moderator: torhank you to those of both of you. om sure we are going uto coverr number of the topics you hate in your opening had in your opening statement. mr. barber due to the tall youwn

get to answer the first question first. this is a rematch of the 2012 campaign. we were all here two years ago. and what's the difference this time and do you have a minute for that blacks barber: the difference is that voters of southern arizona know that i've been a member ofmost a congress for almost two and ae half years. they elected me twice and i'man veryto proud to serve but they also know my record.ongressayini i went to the congress saying i would be an independent voice for southern arizona that i represented the amount. i stood up to the presidentfo. i've never been a partyline person and i don't intend to be one in the future. people can rely on it to be you to be trustworthy and honest about my positions and not flip-flop. people know who i am and that is a part of this race.

today i have one very part of. it's one of the most important elements that we need to bring to congress and i will work hard to make sure i reach across the aisle and make sure people on both sides of the aisle work together to solve our problem to find a common ground. >> moderator: what is different from 2012 and do you have one? mcsally: without any trouble background -- political background i thought i needed to do my part to make a difference. 205 days as a candidate and mr. barber had won the special election so i was ahead of him and went to the orientation and 11 days later i lost my point a 4%. he didn't have much of a record but now he does and that is the difference. i don't think it is bipartisan when you say you voted against your party only 20% of the time. if that is what is going on in the country, that is what is wrong with washington, d.c.. we've had plenty of opportunities to see how mr. barber when push comes to

shove winds up with nancy pelosi whether it is voted against the porterville or voting against some bipartisan legislation we are going to help simplify the tax code for students and parents trying to get access in a higher education so we have now got a record and people are in a worse situation than they were before. so there is a lot that has happened and people are looking for a fresh face. i have shown independent leadership and that i'm willing to make tough decisions and do what is right regardless of the cost. >> moderator: you are out of time. mcsally: sorry about that. >> moderator: the next question comes to you. voter registration in the district is split nearly evenly 30% each between republicans, democrats and no party or independent voters and political strategists say to win the district without the voter makeup it means you need to be at the center of the issue. first of all, do you agree and second how does that affect the

stand on the issue relative to the respective parties that you both represent? mcsally: this is a diverse district and that's what makes us great. there are things that are dividing for the members of the community on certain issues there are things we can agree upon that unite us. having served in uniform we are always looking for those solutions and what we can agree upon now is people are looking for economic opportunity and national security. those are the two most fundamental issues people are concerned about right now and they want someone that is going to fight to bring good jobs here that's going to provide the leadership we need in order to keep our country safe against the threats that we are facing right now. so i'm always going to be solution oriented and independent-minded and look for the things that unite us instead of the things that divide us. that's what people in the country are looking for and we represent the diversity in our community and i look forward to be able to serve everybody if i get elected, not just my party

but everybody in the community. >> moderator: mr. barber same question, do you agree that you need to be in the center to get elected in the district and how does that affect how you stand on the issues with respect to where your party stands on issues? barber: i have to agree with that. every time i talk to voters be just voters they just say can't you get something done and the only way to get something done in congress is to find common ground created that's why i'm a member of the bipartisan working group. we meet every other week to find common ground and introduced bills that are bipartisan and there've been a number of those but i would like to say for a moment of little bit about what my opponent just said about her ability to divert the party. if you look at what she represents, she wants to proselytize social security and turn medicare into a voucher system and destroy the education system by taking away federal government involvement and make sure that women don't have the right to make their own health care decisions. that is partyline with her party. i would like to know which of those issues she's going to

disagree on. i disagree that -- that's why we'll continue to do. there's no way that you should go to congress and represent a party you should go and represent the people that sent you there and that has been my privilege and my honor and i will continue to do that if i go back next january. >> let's stay on this topic for a moment. you both have said that you want to see bipartisanship in congress. give a specific example if you will of what you would compromise in a piece of your party's legislation on an issue that would allow bipartisanship on a difficult piece of legislation. mr. barber: , you have a minute on that. barber: my record is clear i diverge from the party on many issues. for example the affordable care act there are a lot of benefits but there are a lot of things about it that need fixing. the party that my opponent represents wants to appeal it

and throughout the baby with the bathwater and the people on the other side say it's perfect but it's neither. i voted for amendment after amendment after amendment to fix the parts of the affordable care act that don't work and i will do it when we have an opportunity to go back in january. it's also the case with bipartisanship in the voter security. mccain and title and flake have on the bill forward in the senate that is bipartisan that would fix the border security issue and also take care of the broken immigration system. my opponent says she wouldn't support the bipartisan bill that passed the senate. her leadership and bring it to the floor. there's big differences between us. i would search for common ground. that's what i've done and i will continue to do. >> moderator: a specific piece of legislation that you could work to compromise on and maybe vote against your party and also what you vote against your party more than 20% of the time as the

benchmark that you set on mr. barber? mcsally: exactly is equal pay for equal work. the women that have broken through glass ceilings and adults with all the challenges of being in leadership positions i understand the challenges women in leadership face so i will work to fight for women's or they get access to equal pay for equal work but i can't let the attacks said where they are. those are all misleading and noise. i never said i want to privatize social security or voucher medicare. we only have one person in this election and in this campaign who voted repeatedly to rob medicare to pay for obamacare and that is the current congressman. when he can't talk on his can talk on his wreck or he spends time trying to attack me in the private citizen is trying to stand up and serve. seniors are struggling right now so he's using fear tactics to go on the attack and distort my positions in order to save his job and that's not what we need right now and that is what is wrong with washington. >> moderator: we are going to return to a couple of these

topics as we go through the evening but with me ask you this is mcsally you have accused mr. barber in the past and he alluded to it tonight the lack of leadership on his part. you say that as a quality that you would bring to congress. let's be blunt out as a freshman with no seniority take a leadership role, and any example of someone that has done so? mcsally: absolutely. i served as a legislative cello cello that he could deliver senator john kyle when he was in his first term in the senate and i saw an example where he actually had credibility, he was a workhorse instead of a show horse, he had the bipartisan respect and figured out how to get things done to fight for us. i saw that firsthand. mr. barber hasn't been meeting on many issues. if you look out he talks it is as if he isn't in congress. congress must do this and that. were actually in congress mr. barber. and congress is failing. i think the approval rating is down to family relationships and

a distaff. it's time for us to change. so we have to bring someone that is actually going to lead. leave. one of 435. i've show and i've gotten legislation passed myself as a private citizen. we made it to the rules that their make and the service women in saudi arabia. and i worked hard in order to get that legislation passed. i wrote it and got sponsors and i personally unanimously passed across the finish line. that's the kind of leadership i will show. >> moderator: mr. barber, follow-up on this. how do you defend your record against the criticism from ms. mcsally? barber: first my opponent said at the beginning of her remarks but it's all misunderstood me to lie about her position on medicare social security. we need to go back to 2012 when she took positions to say we should privatize social security by having people invest in the stock market. that is privatization. when she supported the paul ryan budget that would have a voucher

medicare and change the system forever. she also supported the budget that would/programs in the state 23,000 students wouldn't have gotten it will grant under the bill she said she would have voted for and also that raises taxes on middle-class families to give tax breaks to the wealthiest in america. that is her position from 2012 and as we get closer she's wanting to be a moderate and independent. you can't have it both ways. she needs to be truthful to the arizona voters and then we will have a much better competition here because that's kind of slipping and sliding you cannot fool the voters. i've been cosponsoring bills and advancing bills that are independent. the victory for example in the leadership was one i hope we will come back to is an example of leadership in the congress that i took. >> moderator: mr. barber your website says job growth is your top priority and you say one solution is eliminating regulation. give a specific example of

eliminating a regulation that you have sponsored or that you will be sponsoring if elected to the congress and how many jobs that it would create. barber: the one that is in the leadership is a far as this owner for 22 years we know what it's like to be small-business owners. we know what it's like to keep the doors open to make it profit and keep the customers coming back. that is -- you are not successful if you don't know how to make it work that one of the things that we experienced is one i'm working on in congress and that is over regulation by the federal government in small-business and the absolute impossibility of getting access to capital. i'm on the subcommittee of the small business committee that deals with taxes to capital, international trade and i voted for the legislation in that committee that would change the regulation, reduce the regulation on the small businesses and by doing so it

would allow the businesses to grow. we have to cut them loose and get access to capital and grow the economy and get the jobs back across the country. this is what you how you would sponsor the reduction of regulation. >> i have to go back just because you say something over and over again doesn't make it true. i never supported the things he's talking about. i stood up against my party on the paul ryan budget and i'm going to fight to make sure we have a budget that isn't balanced on the backs of the veterans like my opponent actually voted for. i have a small-business roundtable because the national federation of independent business represents the small businesses and came here to endorse me instead of congressman barber because he talks a good game about supporting business but he doesn't actually get things done and help the government off

their backs. we talked about many different regulations but in particular, obamacare committee affordable care act is hurting them. i had a small-business owner that said they used to have 15 employees and now they are down to five. the used to provide healthcare coverage but they can't anymore because the premiums continue to go up. some stopped hiring people because they don't want to get over the limit. this is hurting our economy. small businesses where most jobs come from. >> moderator: let me come back to you for something that you say. is it okay for a politician to be an elected official or someone running for office to change their mind over the two-year period or want to once you say something that that you're stuck with it cracks barber: it's okay to say i've changed my mind because i've learned more and i know more information but that isn't what is happening here. what's happening here is the denial she said in an interview

that she was running for congress that she would support and vote for, the words were voted for the paul ryan budget. turn medicare into a voucher and would make sure it would cut dramatically the power granted. that's what she said. it's perfectly okay. i would be thrilled if she's that i've learned more that that but that isn't what is being said here tonight. they know something is going on when they have a different position and they said i never said those things i am now in this place. the voters won't be fooled. >> the paul ryan budget at the time did you say that you supported that? >> i'm on the record saying that i don't support it.

i would ask a question that is being taken out of context when i was a brand-new candidate of these budgets, which one would you have voted for the progressive budget with budget for the ryan budget and i answered well i guess i would have voted on one but here's the problem i have with it and we have a current member of congress who just last year had five budget proposals, and he voted against all five of them. so i was choosing from three very bad choices and i had been repeatedly on the record as saying that i have problems in the budget and i've actually help form the next budget when we get to congress that would address these things. i don't support programs or raising taxes on the middle class. i am the middle class. i have 3 degrees one at the air force academy and two masters. of course i support higher education. i.e. any problems over just trying to figure out how to get things done. i learned along the way. i'm going to read those before i'd vote for them and not just give you sound bites for

answers. >> since we started this line let's talk about your website firmament. your website is balancing the budget on top of your issues. you said going line by line can't eliminate duplication. give a specific example and how much it would save. >> we had a recent report that said there were $35 billion of missed payments and medicare as one example so we have to make sure that we are consumers of the taxpayers money and that we are not having waste and fraud in programs like that. we have 47 different job training programs and we are still struggling to grow the economy. we have a federal government that isn't working for us. if we look at one agency after another letter to the weather is that the a or many others the government is failing us so we have to provide that oversight and congress isn't doing its job

making sure they provide the oversight by doing a budget and appropriations bills so we have to go line by line and helped the budget in order. >> moderator: the same question to you is there something specific that you would like to see to save money? barber: it's called sequestration and 10% across-the-board cut on every federal program ever to our military and veterans in research and development and all kinds of programs including education. via in favor of is taking an annual study that has has pointed out 90 billion burned about 90 billion programs that could be reduced or somehow

taken out of the budget and that is the study we ought to have. i sponsored a bill in the working group to do. everyone says that is terrible. our bill would require every committee jurisdiction to give an up or down vote on those items and that is what i would do. connect the next question comes from the letter using the hash tag #cv2question and they say both candidates tv advertising is full of claims about the other. at the end of the ads they say that they approve this message. how can voters trust anything either of you say you have the first shot at this. barber: for them to understand the truth first of all any to

find out what was said and done by the candidate. my opponent has been factually based and there were numerous citations so we were not going to put out misinformation. my opponent has given false information she put out an ad for example just this week. that is the misinformation people need to know about so it is important for us to know and not to accept what they say and what they stand for goes back to these words in my opponent's case in 2012 running to the right. how can people believe what they say in the ad?

mcsally: we have an incumbent congressman spending most of his campaign and most of his debate so far and start talking about his record attacking me with misleading facts. everything they are doing is trying to instill women and move them to keep his job based on an emotion of fear. that is what is wrong with politics these days. i'm talking about i bring to the table as someone that is a veteran that has flown in combat and deployed six times to the combat who has shown leadership even when things are difficult to get done and i am offering an option in order to hire somebody knew because washington is broken and wrong barber is a part of the problem. we can change washington by changing who we send to washington and i ask that you look at the ads that the current congressman and his allies that are based on misleading lies and

fear instead of his own right word. >> moderator: let's put lets put on something you just touched on briefly. you mentioned you both have talked about the fights to keep the funding. considering the base is one of the biggest economic drivers in our community is this economics and jobs issues were a national defense issue and you get to answer this one first. mcsally: i want to make sure the voters know that it is only funded for 65 more days until december 11. i warned the community when i heard that it was going to be cut in an editorial in the paper and wrong barber the current congressman is on the record of the first of september last year saying that it leaves no threat. since then he's been doing a lot of activity that he has not been able to find the funding. please come and do your research.

right now it's only funded for 65 more days. i commanded the only squadron that's an operational squadron that they sponsored in combat and i have 325 combat hours in iraq and afghanistan. i know firsthand the national security treasure this is when men and women are on the ground under fire meeting close air support. it is an important economic driver in the community. $1.6 billion we have so many count on it but we need someone in dc that is going to make an argument that is a national security treasure and i know this firsthand. i don't need the staff to rely on to be able to have that credibility. credibility. >> same question but let me put one little follow up on their. did you see that? what but she is accusing you of saying about it? barber: the question that was posed to me was there a long-term life and my answer was yes. in fact they are not going to be

around for a while. they are going to be around and the reason why is that the base that is serving the community for decades. we have a relationship with the fort and i grew up on the basis of i know the value but let me talk specifically now about the 8010. it's only funded for another 65 days. that is accurate if you just assume that we are not going to open up the government after -- >> some of the programs coming up this week on pbs to be flush we are going to have to do that and we are not going home without supporting the military establishment. it is a vital national to keep the asset and economic driver for the committee and i will continue to fight as long as i'm here to make sure that we never lose the a-10 for this committee. >> moderator: we have another

question from one of our viewers. this one is about energy policy. what will each candidate due to shift energy power between the renewable energy and away from fossil fuel? and again this came across to be to us using the hash tag. >> that is a great question from someone who obviously knows the value of renewable energy in this part of the country. if you look at the map of the solar energy capability it is dead set in the center of the most energy available anywhere in the country and we capitalized on that. when i worked for the congresswoman is the issue that we promoted him she promoted and sends she left office i continue that practice. we hold the solar 101 so the people in the community can no more and i have solar on my roof and we have created a lot of jobs in arizona. 10,000 since the effort started a few years ago. we have to have a renewable energy policy but we also have

to have in all of the above policy because they need energy independence and right now he can't move away we can't move away from the energy sources that we have on any other renewable energy. that bridge i believe is being built on the solar energy, wind and geothermal. we will get there. it's going to take a while but have to have other sources as well. >> moderator: mcsally, same question regarding the renewable energy and fossil fuels. .. mcsally: i support aldinger keystone pipeline and getting access to the oil and gas reserves that we have an away that will help us. and i do not support the new apa rules th w