ork part-timerement. contract, maybe it's a full-time job, starting your own business, it is an enormous experimentation going on. is it because we have to? that's part of it. not people going to them to the it's mall and they lose their credit >> i cards, however it is expensive to educate your kids.o sa as it's been difficult for a lot of people to save so yes it doesosing co make a difference but i also think there is a search for meaning and engagement and work diffult for is also a social institution. it's a place where someone has a baby, you celebrate that. and a divorce, we help them through that process. this work in a social institution but it's also because we have all of this skill and knowledge and people don't just want to walk away from that and it's because we have this gift and opportunity and also of longevity that we are living longer so stay engaged, keepn'

bringing upt the income but find d it's b something that you really want to do. >> host: we are talking about the most recent book how baby earn boomers are changing the way we think about work community anddo. life.arrell iour here is the cover.lking people put the phone lines onre changinthe the screen in case you would like to join the conversation. 285-3990. here is the central time zone 585-3891ill pu mountain and pacific time zones. east central how many baby boomers are going tezon toes be retiring the in the next three, five, ten years? >> it is between 1946 to 1964 no and so from now until 2040 year hitting that age of 65 every day so it is a big number. the other thing is beneath it orunt not, it's not all about the

boomers. we are simply engaging even when they pass on we are going to be an older society. abut t the u.s. has a relatively youngimply a population compared to many places elsewhere in theso world so sociy. we have to break down a lot of stereotypes we have about oldertion compare place people and their creativity and knowledge because there is a problem with our economyave treak thinking that they are stuck in their ways and to many young peoplen their people are supporting to many her old peoplkne but that is a different economy and a e different society. al i think we are goingl to learn stuck i that they will continue to work and they will be doing different things.longs if you've been doing somethingsociet y for 30 years t. want to keep doing it no you want to finding something different. th. your household wealth will be high here and a social security do bill will be easier to pay. >> host: is there room in the

economy for the older heal generation? >> we are all shaped by personalsier to pay. experiences and that is a question of your number back ins there ro in th the early '80s that was asked a lot if you had the rise of the professional. college-educated and moving into professions and moving into highly skilled jobs starting to move into management and they have a long way to go still but 2014 is not 1984 and there's been a lot of progress. the fact is more people working will create a lot of wealth. >> host: 5890 for east and central time zones, 585-3891 for mountain and pacific. q. right that the downward mobility in retirement is a looming reality for both middle and higher income workers. >> guest: the genesis of the book and you have seen all of

these long-term economic forecasts about the aging population we are going to be less dynamic. it's not just that people haven't saved enough in the household that the economy is going to be less dynamic. is this really true and what people are more engaged and they continue to work longer that changes the calculation so a lot of the gloom and doom about how little we saved for retirement but it starts to dissipate and people embrace earning the income let's look at it this way if you make $10,000 a year in your retirement that's the equivalent of having a 200000-dollar portfolio that you withdraw 4% and that is kind of the standard how much can you address in the portfolio so that's $10,000. if you make 20000 you can start doing the math. so it does have a powerful impact on the household

finances. >> host: one final question before we go to calls you have a chapter called re- writing the social compact. do we need to adjust how we administer social security do we need to adjust the older age federal programs? >> we have never had a good retirement system. the best system that we have is social security and there is a sort of mythology about the defined pension plan but really only about 11 to 12% of private-sector workers ever worked long enough in one company to take advantage of that so we have never really had a very good retirement except for social security is a part of it is people are going to be working l is people are going to be working longer and you want them to take more risk. i do think we need to stay on top of social security for a low-cost proposal to do that to make it easier for people to save for their retirement we need to shore up social security

and create incentives for people to work longer. there is a strand that says if we make them miserable enough people will work longer. if we create incentives so that people will work longer, here is a quick point the economist from stanford university you work for a year and and as far as social security is concerned, you are paid up. but that is a bump up in your page and you were cheaper to your employer all of a sudden and in fact you quote stephen landsberg at the university of rochester is that economics can be summarized in four words people respond to incentives and commentary. >> guest: that is absolutely true. we have a system and i agree with disability. as people get older s. that we have a disability system that says either you are disabled or you can work but a lot of people are in the gray area and so

reforming these incentives in av people can continue to work and can continue to contribute and to recognize they do have some disabilities. so think about what it would take to encourage more people to work and by the way not everybody can. but people who can. >> on the line from richmond virginia. >> hello, how are you both today i am interested in what you said about older americans searching for meaning and i guess demand relevancy from working. and as a former activist i'm wondering how do you engage older americans who are in retirement to work with young people who are interested in the

progressive social change but don't exactly know how. how do you motivate them to become more concerned and engage in connections with the youth? >> you put on a really important topic and there is a grassroots if there is a grassroots movement going around the country and in organization based out of san francisco and creating on court flows and trying to encourage people to take their skills that they have developed over a lifetime and just what you're saying take it to the social service side of the economy. part of it is people are looking for an income. this isn't the traditional volunteer work. there isn't a big demand for the huge income. understanding what you are doing but that's okay. i'm going to show up at work and do this job and i'm going to try

to draft some of the issues of society and i think that this is an enormous opportunity for the country that we have this educated generation that does want to give back but necessarily giving your money but volunteering your time. but working for the nonprofit organization and social service sector, helping out with government agencies and is so that is one resource that you can go to to find out where might i research this further and where in my neighborhood can i find somebody i can talk to? >> host: steve and virginia. >> caller: i want to congratulate you for your book. i am currently driving a marine corps retirement and also drawing social security and i

have been looking for a job now for a little over two years becausettle over two years because i refuse to give up working in the workforce. i have spent 47 years either serving in or supporting the united states marine corps and so i just want to again congratulate you on your book and tell you that i -- >> are you bored or frustrated do you need the money, what's the situation? >> i have what i like to refer to as a sugar mama. she's very well-paid in her job job and also a retired marine. so i do not have to work but i choose to because for all of the reasons addressed i want to

continue to make a contribution and that's why i continue to pursue a job of some kind supporting the marine corps. >> what we said about wanting to continue to make a contribution and then the previous caller talking about how to get people more addressed in some of the major issues in our society. this is the kind of conversation and it's an experimentation. there isn't a simple answer. here's what you do because we know what retirement looks like we have a common image. we can watch an episode of seinfeld and laugh at it even though we never had an encore family in their retirement community in florida but we understand there is a cultural currency. what you're talking about is contribution and you continue to earn an income and to make a difference that is a different

conversation and a very exciting conversation and it is different than the sort of public discourse. the baby-boom legend to paraphrase here and clothing about aging in america. well, no it's not. those are just the two. >> a quick short interview about retirement and how baby boomers change the way that we think about work the community and the good life. crass marketplace and npr. up next after words in the obama

administration and co-author of getting beyond groupthink to make groups smarter. he shares his thoughts on how the group decision-making can be flawed and offers ways to make better collective decisions. he discusses the book with susan cain author of the bestseller the power of introverts in the world but can't stop talking. >> i love this book. it was fascinating. and it's actually a book that grapples with pretty complex ideas so can we start with just laying out the basic thesis? is the first part is why do groups fail and the second is how can groups do better and on failure there's been about 30 so we might make investment errors we might make errors in our choice of consumer fallout, we might make errors in what we are

scared of what obscure. there's also been a bit of research that hasn't been really pulled together on how the groups either aggravate or reduce the problems of individuals and that actually is a huge improvement over the idea of the groupthink that is in the popular consciousness now. groupthink means groups often suppress the individual ideas and creativity of their members and that is a problem. but to figure out what actually lies behind groupthink what are the specifics that make it happen that is something we have made a lot of progress for the last decade and the book tries to figure out the four ways to groups speak happens in firms and families into governance and religious organizations and labor unions and any kind groups don't do so great and then there's an idea that we've actually learned a lot about

white groups fail and how they can succeed. some of you through simple things that you can kind of institute in a minute and others through more complicated things that required require the use of technology. >> ..