or do you know? >> guest: there will be difficult decisions and we need to go through every part of the welfare budget but we believe as we save $20 billion in welfare in this parliament we will be able to find a further

$10 billion in welfare savings. let me give you some more examples. we will cut the welfare caps no family should get more than 26,000 pounds a year in welfare and reduce debt to 23,000. we think that is the right thing to do. when it comes to young people, younger women need schools. they should be either earnings or learning or doing an apprenticeship looking at higher education. they should not be able to go straight home to unemployment benefits and housing benefits. all of these things, changing welfare is not just about saving homes but trying -- trying to -- >> host: you talk about transparency but don't tell us what you are going to do. let me ask you a simple thing about foreign policy. what is your biggest foreign policy disaster? >> guest: other people i am sure will highlight difficult things we had to deal with.

>> host: would you find the biggest reversal? >> guest: some good things we have done work cutting the european budget, first government to achieve that, getting out of the euro, british taxpayers are not giving money to sonecon, we have very challenging situation in libya. it was right. >> host: do you regret going to libya? you use the word promise, the people of britain and france, your democracy, those are your words do you regret saying that? >> guest: i don't regret saying that. i think it was right to stop gaddafi when he was going to butcher his own people in benghazi. if we had not stepped in and if i hadn't ordered those airplanes into the sky we would have seen a massive catastrophe in benghazi with people. >> . it was the right thing to do. i don't accept that we left the libyan people after that.

we put in military training, political assistance. it hasn't been possible to get the different parties -- >> host: not be headed on the beach. >> guest: it hasn't been possible to get a different libyan parts of government together or get them to put down their weapons but we are trying even now to bring that about. it was a difficult situation. >> host: about europe, what would it take for you to vote no in a referendum on continued participation in the european union? >> guest: if i didn't lincoln was in britain's interest to stay in the european union i would not argue for our membership but the situation today is what we need is reform. and a referendum the british people watching at home have the choice in the referendum by the end of 2016. >> host: by implication current

membership is intolerable. >> guest: what i think is we need to improve current membership. this organization works to an extent, we get the trade, important cooperation in europe is not working. that is why we need negotiation, have referendum straightaway, we guard giving the british people a false choice. stay in the reform organization or leave. there is normally one way to get a referendum and that is to make sure the next election, none of my opponents will do the referendum. >> host: you said you won't run for a third term. that means a vote for cameron if you are successful, a vote for cameron as leader of his party and prime minister for two, three, four years after which boris johnson or george osborn

-- if you vote -- >> guest: i said i will serve every day of a second term. what i was doing was giving an honest answer to an honest question because i think people need to know that sort of thing. >> host: you can go on and on, actually do you think i am passionate about turning this country around and having another term, completing this final work but after that ten years, two terms, politicians do have a date by which they need to say it is time for someone else to take over. you are indispensable. >> guest: we are not indispensable. >> host: coming next, questions for mr. cameron from the studio audience. ♪

>> welcome back to cameron and miller band live. the prime minister has been interviewed by jeremy paxton and now it is time for the studio audience to put their questions to him. let's start with matthew. let's have your question. >> what do you think is ed milliband's best office? >> guest: thank you for the question. all of us put ourself foreword to actually believe in serving the public and trying to do the right thing. we disagree with each other sometimes passionately, sometimes noise of the but we all believe in public service and trying to do the right thing for our country. one thing i admire about ed milliband is when we had to take difficult decisions about sending british forces in to help with others to try to

defeat isil in iraq he stepped forward and said yes, this is the right thing to do, let's do that together and vote together in the house of commons. >> host: you called him despicable. >> guest: sometimes in the house of commons we use phrases that are a bit over the top. i remember the same day he called me something else. i.t. took my children yesterday's, 9 and 11 and they said if we were like that at school it wouldn't be so good. i tried to explain -- there's a point to it which is it is the time of weak when the prime minister has to demonstrate the issues so it does make the government accountable to parliament in away that things will change pretty quickly so it doesn't apply, we don't know -- don't behave as well as we should. >> bridget is going to talk to

you. >> prime minister, i will be 79. i am retired professional following a traffic accident i have been left with physical challenges yet i remain proactive in the community. i am passionate about the provision of care for the elderly. i feel let we should be treated with dignity and respect. would you, prime minister, consider it appropriate to appoint a cabinet minister for all the people? one who will show empathy with all the people? >> thank you for your advocacy for these causes because they matter. making sure we treat retired people with dignity and security in their old age after a full working life is one of the most important things we can do as a country and that is why i have been so clear pension benefits like free tv licenses and prescriptions will continue for

everybody. it should be your right and we need to make that clear. i asked this question the other day, dedicated all the persons represented in the cabinet. i will think about it but i am worried about it, i don't want all the people's concerns to be restricted to one person in the cabinet. i want every one of my ministers to be thinking how we treat senior citizens, a once my health minister to be thinking how we treat people in hospitals and in our care high want to make sure education ministry is thinking through life education, something to continue with forever. i want to make sure our defense minister is thinking carefully about veterans and their needs as they grow older. i would be worried about having one person saying they were the only person who fought of all the people. in this end at this meeting the other day if we are not doing right by all the people, blame

me because i lead the government and we need to get this right but tensions have been key to this government, operating pension in line with earnings, prices of 2%, triple loss of pensioners have been protected from difficult decisions. >> let's bring in tom cosgrove. >> your question for the prime minister? >> it is argued we haven't seen anything in terms of cuts to public services the italian tents will these be for those who serve in government? >> we have made difficult decisions. a lot of those decisions i didn't want to have to make but i became prime minister when the economy was close to the brink, when the budget deficit was forecast to be higher than grease's and we had to make higher decisions to make the deficit down. a big deficit means higher taxes, higher mortgage rates, lost jobs, and economy into a

house and i wanted to stop that. will we have done is cut the deficit by half and in the next two years we need basically similar to what we have done so far, we need to find one pound every hundred government spends and say that rather than putting up people's taxes so if you think of department spending changes it is similar to what we had to do in previous years and similar for welfare. it is achievable. i wouldn't stand here and say that if i didn't believe that. i want to do this without putting up taxes on hard working people because you don't tax you wait to growth or jobs. we want to keep the strong economy, make these savings and make sure we put aside money for a rainy days ago when the next crisis hits and crises to come from time to time we don't get pushed over the edge and that would be so irresponsible because in this end we have to make sure we are not just doing right for this generation but for our children and

grandchildren. we don't want that on their heads they won't be able to pay so what we're suggesting is manageable it will require efficiency but we can also make important commitments like saying the and h s is special, that will get extra money every year as long as i am prime minister. >> you would want a specific example where the prime minister will save money. >> a good example is in work benefits like unemployment benefits should be frozen for two years to save 2 billion pounds. that isn't easy decision to make but it is important people can see it is better off, people are better off and we try to keep on creating those jobs as we have done and we find savings including efficiency, we are seeing something like 20 billion pounds by being a bit smarter. we don't have one company that owns all the government buildings and make sure we use them efficiently or things like that. businesses have to do this every

year. they don't get more efficient and aim finished, they think every year how can we save money? how can we provide better service without spending so much money. one example, policeing. >> y -- about policeing let's bring in a police officer, almost as if we plant it. you have been a police officer for 22 years. >> thank you. the conservatives reverse their decision, back to the police service which is more than ever overburdened and walking to a tight rope with a safety net. first of all thank you for your service in the police. i know you put your lives on the line every day to keep us safe and i have huge respect what the police do for us but i was about to say what a brilliant example the police had been over the

last five years. we had to make reductions in spending so police budgets came down by 20% but at the same time the police have done such a good job the crime has come down by 20%. we manage to get officers out from desk jobs on to the streets, but more civilians in to some of those roles, and age for the police did this themselves they combined forces, ordering things together so there is still more efficiency we can get out of that blood in this end, we need to back a british police to do a great job and always have my support. >> the chief constable says it is on the verge of collapse. >> i don't accept that. night understand they are under pressure. in lincolnshier crime has come down because police the doing a

great job and using models technology to make sure crime continues to fall under this government and if we do that we should be saving money as well. >> thank you. >> no comment. >> hello to you what is your question? >> good evening. it is 20 years since the passing of the act in the u.k. for the disabled you are likely to be unemployed is getting harder to get social care. it is heartening. i would like to know what you would do going forward to change that for disabled people. >> i have a simple view of this we should do everything we can to help disabled people status few disadvantages as possible and get genuine equality.

the visibility discrimination act was brought forward by my good friend and colleague william hague 20 years ago and it led to some really good changes that you are right, the job isn't done. one of the things we need to focus on is getting more disabled people in to work. this year has been a good year 140,000 more disabled people, but the gap between the disabled unemployment rate and the an employment rate for the whole country is too big. i want to see that cut in half and i think we can do that but we need a culture change from employers. some employers are absolutely brilliant, who want to recruit disabled people because they know they are missing on the brightest best talent in the country but not all employers are that good and that is what we established disability confidence to try to encourage all employers to take this approach. we have done some good work and have more to do but in the end and all comes back to the bigger

picture of a strong growing economy. if we keep the economy strong. >> let's say -- specific question, is it responsive? >> partially. i still think there is a lot that needs to be done when you mention employment, social care is vital to help people get into unemployment, year on year becoming more difficult. independent living fund was closed. >> it is important local councils have the resources to do this. will establish this new found medicare fund the start on the first of able, 5 billion pounds in it to bring health and social care together more in our country and that could help with the issues. thank you for the question. >> hello, to you good evening.

>> how are you going to convince the british public to not opt out of the e.u.? >> the best way thank you for the question. we ridge just getting into it with jeremy back there. i think britain is at its best when we are out there trading and cooperating and working with others in the world. we are a trading nation, part of the most important networks leather is nato or the european union and need them to work for us but the problem with the european union is it has some good aspects that too many things that drive people mad. is trying to become too much of this the rather than an organization, to take too much power. we need a new deal with europe where we say we want to be in europe for trade, the common market we were promised all those years ago but we don't want to be part of an ever closer union.

maybe those countries need to do that. we will keep our currency at least if i am prime minister. if i can get a new deal for europe and i believe i can. i have sat around that table for the last five years. if i can get the better deal there's a real prospect, you choose, you can stay in on this reform basis, got to be given another choice. >> hi, karen. >> by private countries. >> i longest you. >> would like to see more nhl services by private companies yes or no? >> i am happy if there are charities for independent organizations that can provide a

great service for e as part of the any jess. private health care matters to me. the na chess has an amazing things for my family. i will never forget taking my desperately ill young son ivan to the hospital night after night, getting amazing treatments, everything they gave him. i want to make sure that is always there in our country. that will always be predominately national health service provided by national health service providers, the independent sector a tiny proportion of the total. it has gone from 5% to 6%, tiny increase but if there are organizations like for instance mary curie cancer care that provide brilliant care for loved ones or hospices, reorganization's like that help and our loved ones and they're free and taxes are paying for

them. >> madam? >> to the microphone if you would come and get a little closer, there we are. >> i am on little confused, five years ago, touches about the in a chess, the top down reorganization of the and a chess, that is very different. the closure of closing units. red-eye live in my borough you take the government to court. i feel very letdown with the conservative policy and i am wondering if you don't do what you say what last time -- how can we talk about that next time? >> the biggest promise about the nhl is when we were going to make difficult cuts in public

spending and everyone when i was to it, we said we will not cut the any jazz and we haven't. we increased spending by 12.7 billion pounds over the last five years and because this is already informed, what we did in terms of changing the any chess is covered 20,000 bureaucrats in the nhl is and put that money into 9,000 more doctors and 7,000 nurses and as a result we are treating those patients, things like cancer, seeing 460,000 poor people and looking at their potential counts those that we were five years ago, the biggest promise we made more money, safeguarding that money and treating more patients and if you elect me again as your prime minister with a strong economy because that is the key, will go on investing in the national archives. >> we are almost out of time but we just got time for one more

quick answer and that is she actually lost her voice but is you tonight to ask you a question. if you could do one thing as prime minister what would it be? >> if i could read do one thing what would it be? definitely, the thing as i said i haven't delivered, and promised less noise, that didn't work out. i fully accept that but the most important thing i have had to try to do is turn the economy around, get people into jobs, get the deficit down and get the economy going because we are on the brink and i wish some of the things we had done like for instance the schemes, more people to buy their houses, i wish we had done some of those things quicker end sooner because in the end we have to make a huge choice in 42 days time who runs the country and but i have learned in the last five years is nothing that you

want to do will work without a strong and growing economy. the schools we want for our children, those things. >> wait. >> have i ever -- i have. but that was a long time ago. >> show your appreciation. [applause] >> thank you prime minister thank you. [applause] >> germac, ed milliband will be taking more questions from our studio audience. thank you. ♪

>> welcome back to david cameron and ed milliband. tonight we see david cameron facing questions from jeremy paxton and those in our studio audience, but labor leader david cameron -- ed milliband is in the steel ready to meet our audience. [applause] >> still applauding by the end of this 18 minute section. paul hicks, you are entitled, what is your question? >> my question is this. you sound gloomy most of the time. are things really so bad? >> they could be a lot better. that is the big argument this the election. i think this is a choice. is this as good as it gets for britain and can we do a lot better than this? >> i don't think it is good enough we have 7,000 people. i think we can do something about it.

the prime minister said earlier he couldn't live like this i couldn't even but let's do something about it. let's turn this country into a country where if you work month after month, year after year you don't end up with a zero contract, you have a legal right to a regular contract. that is one of the changes i would make. we can do better reasons this? [applause] >> what is your >> labor makes me feel demonized, how can you make me feel like this? >> i am going -- [applause] >> let me see if i can change your mind. i think that the thing that is happening in britain at the moment is the richest in society, the top 1%, earning over 150,000 pounds a year, doing okay. but i think lots and lots of

people including middle-income are finding life really tough. the question is how we do something about it. i hope you get a different message from me tonight. let me give you an example, tuition fees. some people criticize me for wanting to lower the burden of tuition fees from 9,000 pounds to help middle-class families. i want to help middle-class families but lots of families are saying, leaving university with 44,000 pounds of debt is a good situation, let's do something about it with their change. i want a country where you feel you are now struggling, and that is one of the changes we make. >> that does mean you are anti wealth creation? >> wealth creation democratic socialist, i think wealth creation is incredibly important part of building a prosperous society. the distance with nikkei and this is important for the audience is the way we succeed is not simply those at the top

doing well but all working people succeeding. i say it is working people succeed britain's succeeds. that might sound like a political slogan. it is and villages of reality in the way a country gets on. if hard work is working for everyone -- >> a seven figure bonus. >> you get some security, doing the right thing for the country if you're having and any chance you can rely on that is better for the country. >> let's bring in luke cutter next. what is your question? >> what will the budget deficit be in pounds at the end of five years and how will you achieve it? >> $75 billion we are going to inherit. we want to balance the books by the end of parliament and cut the deficit every year and do it by doing three things.

we will have fair taxes, increase the changes david cameron made cutting taxes for those over $150,000 a year. and funding reductions in areas outside priorities like health and education. we do need to get the deficit down and i make no bones about that. really important, other things we have got to do why does the conservative promise to eliminate the deficit -- >> let's talk about -- [applause] >> i understand that. the reason that hasn't happened is living standards have fallen tax revenues have fallen. the key to getting rid of the deficit is the third element, tax changes we announced, spending reductions but the key third element of raising living standards if you raise living standards we get a tax revenue in and the deficit down. >> let's bring in veronica what

is your question? >> why do you deny the people -- why is labour prepared to deny the people the freedom to choose with his they wished to see their country become a fully fledged member of e.u.? >> as you say it is not my priority to have a referendum on the european union and let me explain why. when i look at our country, to tackle with the crisis, rescue the any chess, build the future of our young people, the e.u. could be a disaster for our country. the trade wheat get from being in the e.u. strategically for britain when you want to tackle terrorism or climate change or range of issues, the and not look organ country. that is my priority. i have said and this is unlikely to happen but i have said it is the transfer of power from britain to the e.u. we have in

our referendum not likely to happen. that is what leadership is about, saying what your priorities. i don't want to leave the e.u.. what the caller referendum in 2017 and plunged the country to two years of the. >> if you win the next election he would not call referendum. >> unlikely to happen. the criteria i have set i make no bones about it. not likely to happen but the transfer of power. >> hello, mr. neal. what is your question? >> over here. do you not think your brother would have done a better job? >> he was better qualified and better positioned. >> my answer is no. let me clean why.

was a difficult contest between me and david. i thought somebody needed to be the labor party in new about labor. i thought that was a time than necessary for the country and necessary for the class and i had strong views about how we need to change the country. the country's too unequal. too the downie quality. we made mistakes like iraq. and immigration. the best person to move the party on and i stood because that is what i felt was right for the country. i think i am the right person for the job. i thought it then and i think it now. >> what regrets street do you have about creating such division your family? >> it was horrible. >> in what way? >> bruising for me and for david. it is field or a feeling i would

say to be frank with you about that. we have assure contests. we didn't talk but it was strange not surprisingly. i care deeply about this country. i believe i am the right person to be prime minister and i thought it when i stood in 2010. i wouldn't have gone through all of that if i didn't have strong convictions. >> she is a pretty hardy. >> hello, what is your question? just in the middle? >> they you think socialism remains an important labor party value? if so why? >> what i call democratic socialism, yes is the answer.

i believe in a fair and equal society. each generation of labour politicians put into practice in there and generation. what does it mean today? what i see in britain, this is something countries all-around world have gotten. this is the question we face. will we be countries that work for the richest and most powerful? president obama as well. will we be a country that does work for the richest and most powerful or will everyone get their fair share? will they play by the same rules, if you do the right thing, be able to build a life for yourself and your family, people are doubting that in britain's of the gentleman who asked if i was too gloomy, sometimes it might sound that way because people are asking this country works for me, i was doing what everyone tells me to do, that is what democratic socialism means for me, making this country work for what you

deeply get. >> they need to be revisited. >> got your hands up in the second row. the quick follow-up question. >> david cameron, sweden things up. or will they give some security and follow your sources? you are going to make a judgment. and tuition fees. in 2011, as parliament work and plagued it? it is the right thing to do. and pay for it. i am doing it because it is the right thing to do in doing it

for another reason. is so important and so important -- i sometimes say i want to be the first politician to wonders of a promise and overdeliver not overpromise and vendors of the litter. i will come back in five years and you tell me if i achieved not. there are promises i know i can keep. >> interesting to think what politicians think about each other. you will remember in the first half of the debate, it is fair to put the same question to you. what do you think of david cameron's best qualities given that you have previously called him a chicken and the bully? >> i will say two things about what david cameron achieved which i admire. the first is his commitment to equal marriage. was hiding his party the right thing to do for the country. [applause] >> and second, this will be universally popular his commitment on overseas development, 1.7% and he took a

risk in the conservative party by saying this is the right thing to do and he kept to that and it is right that he did. >> did you part with it? >> don't know if we have a part. it is looking hard when the bacon sandwich was on. you see them shouting at each other. he said earlier, hard to avoid back and forth. >> outrageous here at the front. >> he made it difficult for your support for people who are undecided. >> what a great start. >> a few gaps recently.

you don't really seem to be fighting for the values your party stands for. the labor council, and closures because of the destination of the budget and austerity him general. >> first of all austerity, austerity is happening, happening because of government positions, difficult for the future and bigger in the next three years but let me go to the other point in your question about gaffes. i won't win the contest about the bacon sandwich. we can all agree about that. >> not happy with your answer, they're shaking heads. >> let me just -- what i stand for and is important is ideas to change the country, principal

when you have powerful opponents like the energy company or banks, reaching out to people who are the most vulnerable in society. >> everyone in this country remembers 13 years and the labor government under blair and brown. talk about austerity but their recent areas austerity is all the money was spent, everything was thrown away, nothing for rainy day and all the years you saying it is a global economy and crisis but the liberalization of thanks and everything came from your party. what i want to know is if people vote labour can you promise that you learned from the mistakes the lead to the mess we are in? [applause] >> let me be specific on that. we were wrong on the regulation of banks. we got it wrong. banks were underregulated. of your people said we should regulate and even less but we were wrong.

along with countries all-around world. i am sorry we got it wrong. i have learned from that in my five years as leader of the opposition. [applause] >> the first question, we have got to make sure banks are properly regulated in the future. banks will work better for our businesses. that goes back decades, his work problems we have got to solve. >> a question for mandy why is labour neck-and-neck with it conservatives in the opinion polls after five years of opposition. 279 seats 278, gaining ahead. why are you not? >> i take an old-fashioned view on this which is the other people decide on the case. we were coming at in 2010, having to be 01 time opposition. i'm interested in the future of

the country and the people and let's see what they decide on this. >> we are out of time. >> already? >> 18 minutes. thank you very much. right-hand robert garrigus and brett applause] >> stay tuned. ♪ >> this is david cameron and ed milliband live. the battle for 1. now a labor leader ed milliband. ed milliband do you think britain is full? >> because of immigration? yes. i wouldn't describe it that way, no. we have high levels of migration.

we do need to try to get those level of migration down because they're too high but i will tell you, i won't make the full promise because david cameron did make that. >> you have four false promises and immigration. >> me personally? we got it wrong. we got it wrong. >> your figures were farcical. >> we were wrong. >> let me say two things about immigration. you asked a question, let me answer it. we benefit from diversity, immigrants over the years made a big contribution to the country but we need proper control. the labor government would people come year, targeting benefits for the first two years and we will do something else. >> let me talk about benefits. i am talking about numbers. the way we got to a figure of $17 million in 10 or 15 years

is that acceptable? >> i won't get into hypotheticals. we can get migration down. i won't saying that. 95 million? 100 million? >> let me say what i am going to do because that is what matters rather than speculating. i want to get low-skilled migration down. the controls we are talking about not just on benefits but undercutting wages, people have been brought into the country to undermine the minimum wage and various other things, they will help to get migration down. with u.s. thing to me is would it be better for the country to withdraw from the european union? >> i haven't mentioned the european union. >> taking the question to yourself. >> i am not. was a big choice at this election. there's a choice at this election. i believe we can bring controlable migration but i won't make promises on solutions either.

>> i asking you if you think any natural limit to the population of this country? i won't get drawn into speculation. >> you don't think there's a natural limit? >> of course there are limits the limits are expressed -- >> you will keep them to yourselves? >> the decisions you take year by year end i will explain those decisions we will make. >> as it seems to you now, there is no figure that you are willing to share with the public? >> i won't figured out the correct level. >> i assume you have thought about it. >> the right thing to do on migration we need controls on migration. >> you have already conceded that when your party was last in government it dropped immigration completely wrong. you were predicting figures between 5,013,000 immigrants a year from the expansion, in 2004 actually something like

400,000 people came in. that is the entire population of malta. what else did the government do wrong when you were last in power? >> that -- two things i would mention in addition to that. there were many things we did the two things i wouldii things i would mention. we will too about inequality, the gatt got bigger and people fell behind. >> did you borrow too much? >> the global financial crisis global financial crisis. >> you borrow. >> the figure was too high. >> the figure was too high. >> there were spending programs that were not as good as they could have been. >> what other clue.

it is important that nobody gets it right. to have some details. >> let me just say the overall point, the financial crisis caught by oversspending the answer is no. >> you are asking the question i haven't asked you. i questioned the you borrow too much? >> you think no you didn't borrow too much, did you spend too much? >> you are asking the question. >> i am trying to summarize your position according to questions you asked yourself. >> what i would say is the dome was not a good example. governments make the same -- governments make mistakes. they are all in efficiencies in government. too many organizations of public services, of course that is right but i am talking about the overall picture. the other thing let's talk about the future.

let's talk about the future. everyone of you forecast the future of the economy during this present government has been wrong. you forecast that unemployment would rise and wages were full. at one point u forecast inflation was not zero which is helpful. >> 1600 pounds a year worse off than when the government came to power. since the 1920s. >> david cameron wants to say. you said the wages would fall and they did get and i was right. they did fall. >> writes on unemployment. >> three things unemployment, wage levels and i mentioned inflation. >> the opposite budget responsibility forecast. it turned out that forecast turned out to be wrong. let's go to the big picture, the

big picture this election, do we think the economy, david cameron says things are good. >> i don't think things are fine. i think we are too much on low wages, work is too in secure. young people burdened down by a lack of opportunity. >> what would you cut? >> let me explain. we said outside areas like education and health, protected areas where there will be reductions in spending and we set out some of those cuts like winter fuel allowance for pension earned, we have talked about the ways in which we will cut money from efficiencies in the police in local government we said for example child benefit to 1%, we said we would refers -- >> what does that come to? >> hundreds of millions more but that is not the point.

let me explain. we are going to have to make these decisions in government but i have got to set out an overall approach. the overall of roche as i said earlier, fair taxes, it is -- a labor leader going into the election saying we are going to reduce spending. tony blair never went into any election saying that. >> what tony bill a did is tony blair's affair. there's a point about my approach. i am not denying the need to. it would fall. >> borrow more? >> there will be reductions in protected department and reducing spending. >> overall spending would not increase. is. decrease. >> likely to fall. i am setting out the direction

of travel. >> i am confused about various fuel policies. let's take in energy policies. you used to believe that raising energy bills was a great way of helping the environment. now you believe in cutting energy bills, now you believe that somehow getting people to have a better deal on oil and gas is better for the environment. >> i never said raising energy bills was the way to solve climate change. >> let me explain. as energy secretary, there will be pressures on bills as a result of the need to transition to a new economy but also said we need to make sure the energy market was fair and you can't use climate change to rip-off the consumer. that is what is happening with energy companies. egos to another big choice in this election. who is going to stand up to the energy companies and say we are

going to freeze bills until 2017 we are going to give the regulators power to cut prices so wholesale price reduction i am sure there are protections on bills in the long run but it is more important to reform the market to make it fair. >> can you help us with another policies? according to your leader in scotland this is a way of taking money out of the southeast of england and giving it to scotland. that is what he said. >> no. there were not enough properties to raise the tax that would fund the scottish -- it was a way of taking money from the southeast of england and spending it in scotland. >> holmes above 2 million pounds, it is true that most of those are in the southeast. is also true that there are

consequential spending. >> consequentials? >> ways that money gets distributed and some will be spent in scotland. it is really important this is part of being the united kingdom. if there are young people who are unemployed the money for a bonus, more london. we help those young people in newcastle. and redistribution. and stays together and looks after each other. >> what other types of blood money that is exempt from england? >> what about for example promise not to commission out of scotland, would you go along with that? >> no.

>> what about starting the high-speed rail line in the french in scotland? >> i won't get into a bargaining game. >> yes you are. >> no i am not. >> don't be so presumptuous, we have six weeks to go. you don't get to decide the election results will for the general election. it is not that important. come on. >> british people -- let me finish the point. >> i use suggesting you can get an overall -- >> absolutely wright. >> in that event you would be a leader of our country. you know what people say about you because you can't be immune to it. a bloke on the tube said to me last week ed milliband goes

into a room with vladimir putin, the doors closed. two minutes later the door is open again and vladimir putin is standing there smiling and ed milliband is all over the floor in peace is the >> was that david cameron e-mailing you? >> no, i don't thank you is the tube that much. but understand what the point is. the point is people think cannot tough enough. >> let me tell you. let me tell you. let me tell you. in the summer of 2015 this government proposed actions in syria. the bombing in syria. i was called into a room by david cameron and make clay, president obama had been on the phone, leader of the free world. i listened to what they stand made up my mind and we said no. standing up to the leader of the free world shows a certain cost this. i am not proud of it.

what i am not going to do is repeat the mistakes of the 2003 iraq war which happens when labor was in power, we rushed to war without knowing what the strategy is and without being clear what the cost of goods would be i am not a pacifist but i supported action in libya. david cameron -- and my tough enough? hell yes i'm tough enough. >> how this impression got out there, how is it that you are less popular than your party? that even your own in thes consider you a liability? how has that happened? >> i don't comment on these things. i desperately don't need them. >> do you read about myself? >> if i can avoid it. >> you make my point for me. to go to the general election the people here and the people at home make up their mind about

me and the country and the country they want. frankly it walks off about the fact. >> i find when i go and stand on the doorstep ed milliband is a liability, you are aware of that? >> the only thing i can do, be yourself. that is who i am. they don't want my principles. i stood up not just to president obama but rupert murdoch and energy companies, the banks, fighting for ordinary people which i believe in when i came into politics, do they want somebody who will think every day out of the working people first? i don't care if the newspapers write about me. what i care about is what happens to the british people. this country can be so much better. that is what i think is important. the bloke on the tube can say what he likes. i don't care because i care

about the british people and what happens to them. [applause] >> they see u.s. and north london geek. >> who cares? it was mentioned your nearby and member of the audience a lot of people when they look at your candidacy for the most powerful job in the land they look at you and think what the shame. >> it is not the way i see it. you need toughness in this job. people from a lot at me over a 4-1/2 years. i am a pretty resilience guy and i would be underestimated at every turn. people said i wouldn't become leader. people said you can't become prime minister, i think i can. i can't win a majority? i think i can. that people underestimate me. what i care about is what is

happening to the british people in their lives and i think i can change it and i am the right man for the job which is why i am sitting here and why i believe that i am the best choice to the prime minister. >> thank you. [applause] for [applause] ♪ [applause] >> it was quite fun. >> ed milliband and david cameron face their third big test of the campaign. david cameron told the audience politicians don't always behave as well as racial ed and ed milliband admits his relationship with his brother still healing. >> earlier the prime minister

told me he could never insist on a zero contract and david cameron, ed milliband conceded the previous labor government got it wrong on immigration. >> there are three more big events in the run-up to polling day. the leaders debate with seven party leaders including those demanding we are here this evening next thursday at 8:00. two weeks later the bbc election debate 2015. that is five main challenges for coalition leaders, at 8:00 on thursday the sixteenth. there is more, questions of david cameron and ed milliband, on bbc 1 thursday the 30th of april. >> thank you to david cameron and ed milliband for taking part of this event. thank you for watching for the studio audience. >> good night.

[applause] ♪ >> you can hear from former prime minister david cameron and labour party leader and the one each week during question time at the british house of commons live wednesday at 7:00 a.m. eastern and c-span2 and the airing sundays at 9:00 p.m. eastern on c-span. >> c-span2 providing live coverage of the u.s. senate floor proceedings and keep public policy events and every weekend booktv, for 15 years

only television network devoted nonfiction books and authors. c-span2 created by the cable-tv industry. .. >> government housing policies caused the 2008 t financial crisis. the threat isis poses to the united states, plus jeffrey sachs on achieving sustainable development goals andrew cochran on drone warfare, and a report on two decades of academic fraud at the university of north