he said i'm sorry. that is contrary to my religious beliefs. but there's another florist down the street i can do a good job for you. you would think that would develop into respecting develop into respecting a person develop into respect and the person would say i understand her conviction. i will go down there. thank you very much and can do need to patronize the forest. a civil complaint was filed and they try to bankrupt or personally and financially with her business as well. this is a zero-sum game. the reason we cannot comply is because we know this will collide with religious freedom and there are certain names we cannot, therefore will not render to the state when they collide directly and unequivocally with what god requires of each and every one of us. ..

>> founder of common good foundation and come to alliance. and a catholic clergyman. i'm also on the path towards ph.d in my own church. it's my honor to stand with all of you ended in order to be part of this putsch piggybacked pastor rick, i don't drop it was intentional but it is certainly good optics because i'm standing with the thousands in fact standing with millions and i'm standing in a 2000 year history of the christian church reaching beyond that to mount sinai go

all the way back to the beginning of creation itself. and defending marriage is what it is. between one man and one woman, intended for life open to life and formative of family. and family is the first society. it's the first school, the first church the first government come the first economy, the first mediating association. the entire social order is built on the family. and i stand fully within the tradition of my church and the fact that classical christian tradition in saying it is not just a religious position i am espousing but written in a natural moral law so eloquently pointed out, a lot of the non-the human heart and to be known for the exercise of reason we all know it cross culturally and across civilizations.

yet we do stand at a point in our history where nine black robed justices may decide that the natural moral law no one has any standing in the jurisprudence of the united states. once again as matt pointed out that have been wrong before and it would be wrong now if they did. i would only add dred scott, the instance to instance decision of roe v. wade. cost is 60 million of our youngest neighbors now not with us. so i'm honored to be a part of this pledge come pakistan with other christians other jews of people of faith in and people of goodwill in making it very clear we will stand for marriage. and we will do all we can to ensure that marriage continues as what it is. i would only add one thing to what's been said so far. there is, in fact, a 2000 year

christian history. so i not only stand for these things but on the shoulders of giants. and this is not the first time in its history that we've entered into a culture that has rejected a natural moral law. turned against god. what do we do as christians? we do what christians do. we try to infuse once again like levin and a loaf that truth that elevates all humanity no matter what the religious belief. so should the court make the wrong decision, not only will it be an unjust law, and that is absolutely correct, it will be one which we cannot obey just as the early apostles could not stop preaching. what will that mean? i don't know this. i don't know but i do know this. god will triumph. the truth will triumph. and, finally in gratitude to my evangelical protestant friends,

my other catholic friends and orthodox christian friends and jewish friends for having the courage to stand together. this is so relying -- this is a silver lining in this cloud, this dark cloud. we are bring brought together. this is not about protecting ourselves but we love this nation. not only am i a member of the clergy a mixture i will have been married for 40 years. i have five grown children and i just had the privilege of baptizing my seventh grandchildren won't be american experiment to continue. it was rooted by our founders and is very christian tradition of recognition that rights come from the creator, they are endowed and they cannot be taken away by a civil government the judicial, legislative branch or even in the executive. thank you very much. >> hello everyone.

my name is janet. i have a ministry that assist in helping men and women lead the life of homosexual. i'm based out of minneapolis and i live in texas. i also enjoy helping churches have a better understanding how we work with those that are in our churches struggle. i believe in compassion without compromise. we will have passion but we will not compromise the gospel. i think far better than anyone who has lived the life of homosexuality have an understanding why the gay community do not want someone like myself around. because we have the opportunity to debunk everything they are saying. why don't you see me on cnn or today or msnbc or good morning america? because they have all the gays and lesbians on their show. that if i come on the show i

will tell down their belief system to advance my goal is to debunk everything that they are saying, to be true what i know is july. we have tragically watched our nation caved in to homosexuality propaganda. more and more people are falling for the lie that homosexuals are born that way. well, we know that's a lie anyway. homosexuals have successfully made inroads into hollywood, television, our children's public schools, universities our government, the president of the united states, and now our churches. homosexual marriage is growing in america. reality which is currently being litigated in our nation's supreme court as a potential federal civil rights. but we know this is not a civil rights issue. becomethe color of my skin is an immutable unchangeable characteristic. i can't change from black to

white, but i did live a homosexual life for 14 years come and i've been out 17 so we know that change is possible through the power of jesus christ. if same-sex marriage becomes the law of the land no one can even imagine or predict the ramifications that this decision will have. i know from personal experience that homosexuality is a false identity that is rooted in sexual or emotional brokenness. same-sex marriage is a rejection, reality of god's design for how to raise our children. mean we reject reality, we harm our children. see, i grew up in a family of seven kids with four different fathers. i understand what it's like not having a dad because of all those who are fathers, none of them was around. every child deserves and wants a father and a mother. this is critically important to

their sexual development. in the 14 years that i lived as a lesbian i saw firsthand that there is no substitution for the role of a father and mother that they put in a child's life. each. offers a unique contribution to the health and well being of our children. i know this to be true because what i was in homosexual life with a woman who had two children i tried to fulfill the role of a daddy. at the time i realized i wasn't equipped or capable of being a father to these girls. more and more children family members and friends, those who were never predisposed to the homosexual before are now experimenting sexually, trying out homosexuality and becoming hooked. those who seek help to lead -- to lead the life of homosexual

and they soon discover that there is no longer any help out there. homosexual activists and their homosexual attorneys are pushing to ban any type of ministry such as janet boynes ministries. their goal is to indoctrinate our kids. their goal is to silence us. their greatest fear is men and women like myself who have walked away from that life. soon it may become illegal to even have this kind of ministry. who knows how much longer we will have to do what we are doing today? unless we act now. we must be bold and allow ourselves. we must be bold and not allow ourselves to be forced out. we cannot lay down our religious freedom. i thought about what president obama's said in his inaugural speech. he said you might not have voted

for me but i will be your president. really, mr. president? you have allowed gays and lesbians into the white house. you sat down with them. you have had dinner with them. you heard their voices, but not once have you allowed those of us who walked out of the life of homosexuality to come into the oval office come to come into the white house and hear our stories. i challenge you today to allow us to come and you listen to what we have to say. i pray that our courts will uphold traditional marriage so that god will continue to bless this great nation, the united states of america. thank you. >> first of all i am honored to be here and thank you for the opportunity to take a stand with you, dr. scarborough, and with all of you, a stand for marriage as we point god ordained it.

i stand here brokenhearted frankly, because i never thought i would see the day when in my beloved country the united states of america, merely holding to a biblical worldview would subject you to ridicule, to fines, the punishment and yet that's where we have. and so we are here not only to reaffirm our commitment to marriage as a union between one man and one woman we are also here to defend the religious liberty of christians and others all over this country who are simply trying to stand up for what we believe in. it's important to remember, christians didn't invent marriage as a response to the gay rights movement. this is what we've believed for the last 2000 years. i believe this long before there's any such thing i'd ever heard of any such thing as a gay-rights movement. so the idea that this is something that is motivated by bigotry, by hatred, or who we --

who were we haiti before we believed marriage being between one man and one woman long before there was any such thing as a gay-rights movement? so it breaks my heart that our country is going in the direction it's going. it also breaks my heart that no matter how loving we try to be no matter how reasonable we try to be no matter how much we expressed, as one woman did when a gay customer came in and demanded that she provide i think a floor arrangement for a gay wedding and she put her hands on his hands and said, i love you. you've been coming here for years, but i can't do that. she was still his friend. she still loved him, but he was asking her to break her commitment to our lord and savior jesus christ. people have to remember christians have died for our faith in you. we have died for our commitment for the work of god. so the idea that those of us who believe are simply going to roll over because their social pressure, when we know we follow

a long line of heroes of the faith, who surrendered everything, including the 158 children who just died not too long ago in kenya. kids really who would not renounce their faith in jesus christ under threat of beheading, under threat of murder. we are so not going to back off because people are upset with us. but we are not upset within. we love them. we prefer that we will continue to fight the good fight. two with a quick points i want to make. one is i frankly, i am frustrated i this. this idea that homosexuality is like and at analogized to the black civil rights movement. look, first of all i can look around this room, some of you i know but i don't know other than those i know personally, i do note who in here is gay and who's not. you know who is black in here. [laughter] and when somebody walks up to a

hotel and says, i need an overnight stay, if you look at the person because of the color of their skin to think no. when somebody goes out to get a drink of water and says you can't drink the water fountain, you are the wrong color, that is very different than a person sang the want to come in my store and do this is? come on in. i don't have the whether you're a homosexual or heterosexual, you want to buy dinner, you want me to make up for a razor, you'll need to take a kid you will need to take photographs at a graduation, the family reunion? no problem, but don't ask you to do something that violates my faith. that's very different than what black people faced during the era of slavery and segregation. and this not like into interracial marriage. because there is no biblical basis for denying two people of the same race the right to marry or the right to be together. that was concocted to justify the subjugation of people on the

basis of the color of the skin to try to kick them into place. but you won't find advocates pointed out to you a 2000 year history of prohibition against people of the same race getting the, different races getting marriage. but the analogy is sufficient and it's an insult to the illustrious history of the black civil rights movement to continue to use that analogy. but it's been very emotionally effective because people said i don't want to be like that i don't want to be a discriminator. but these are two very different situations. the last thing i would suggest this. i think we are facing an undermining of the very foundation of this country because it's founded in truth. the founding fathers that we hold these truths to be self-evident. you know when jesus thank pontius pilate and punches as well your kingdom jesus said i have come to bear witness to the truth, all who are of the truth hear my voice. pilot said, what is the truth?

and i think that's the same question that has been asked now, what is the truth? so who says marriage is a union between one man and one woman? i think that we are so -- so deceived or internal destruction because if we are not a nation based upon truth, if there are no overriding moral truths and everything is up for grabs the only thing that determines determines what's right individual is forced. but that's not the kind of nation we need to quickly we answer to a higher authority. we believed there were truths that nobody could change. we believe marriage is one of those truths that can't be change. people can talk about redefining it but i will always believe that this one definition of marriage and no matter what they labellevel any other convenient it will never be a marriage. made in the minds of those who do it will be but it will never be a valid this because marriage was ordained by god, and can only be one thing, a union between one man and one woman.

truth forever on the scaffold, wrong forever on the throne yet that scaffold sways the future. can't stand within the shadows keep watch over us so do i do with what happened to us with a standard where taking but i think i can say for every one of us, we will give our lives standing for the truth. we will do it in love and do it in compassion, but we will be courageous about it and we will never back down. spent if we are going to bring the people back up here that spoke, janet and rick and keith come if you come back up. if there's any questions. go ahead and -- >> e. w. jackson -- >> bishop e. w. jackson. >> my name for those watching his rick scarborough come on the front of vision america which we found vision america.org.

>> if there's any questions, just two things i wanted to just point out because it's a question that comes up but the first thing is not as much pleasure that comes up but as a policy matter, as a policy matter, same-sex marriage says that the highest level of government sends a message that children don't need moms and dads, the two women and two men are just announced of the equivalent of a mom and a day. it forever deprives children of ever having the opportunity of a mother and a father. had the recently wrote and i think the article was in federalist.org, that she was raised in a home with two moms. she's now married to a man come has children, and she says her heart aches when she was in the home with her moms come and she loved her moms not speaking evil against her moms, but she said she was deprived of her father and she was never able to have that opportunity. another she is married and she sees her own husband interacting interact

with the children she realizes exactly what she missed, and that's what janet was talking about. the second thing is what does this resistance look like? that's a common question. what does this line we will not cross me? and i think it will be manifested in multiple giveaways just like the civil rights movement was. and maybe a rosa parks refused to get off a bus or so this is unaccounted that a segregated or drinks after water fountain that is a white only water from the it manifests itself in different ways but let me give you an example. in 2000 same-sex marriage came to massachusetts to catholic charities that event and administered for many decades, they were told you can no longer do that coming up to put children in homes with same-sex couples. when they said that violates our christian beliefs and doctrines of the church, they were said they're told you then need to cstc-a their credit they would not compromise. acs. i say then and now that number one, they should continue to pursue their call which is to

place children in homes with moms and dads. whether the adoption or the force or the photographer or whoever it might be. number two they should not voluntarily cease but they need to stand their ground. if a state chooses to use the police power of the state to come after them, then the state chooses but we will not voluntarily cease and we will not voluntarily compromise our calling and our commitment. that's what it means. this is a line that cannot and will not cross. so if there's any questions. >> state your name please. >> isn't working? sarah jones. i have a bunch of questions. i will stick to one. name it, i keep hearing not just today that it's been increasingly popular talking point that a same-sex marriage is indeed legalized in june that pastors will be forced to

associate same-sex marriages that there will be forbidden from preaching certain topics and the intervention of the however, not a single civil rights workstation has ever advocated this as a policy position. so where does this come from? what basis do you have for a? >> i can address the. i think we of the same-sex marriage to a protected civil rights act which accounted illegal with respect to race you were able to do legally with respect to same-sex unions. so let me extrapolate about. catholic churches that are catholics and baptist churches in our baptist but they can hire white only baptist or white only catholics. the church might have a restroom but it cannot say that this is a white only restaurant. i'm sorry, this is a white only drinking fountain. the one for people for colors down the road. the universe had a policy failure of abandoned by the time it was a -- they no longer a

democrat and abandoning a policy. that banned interracial dating or just a lot of banned interracial dating that college campuses could not have such such a policy. this is the worst act of 19 safety for the banned discrimination on the basis of race. the irs came to bob jones university and so change a policy. no, it's based on a biblical beliefs. and wicked excited supreme court and the lost that case and therefore, they lost their tax-exempt status. a facility in new jersey, a methodist association lost its property tax exemption over this. this will have a wide reaching ramifications. whether and when it will reach the point of what a pastor can say, i don't know. we do know however that the bellwether of marriage for all of the world is the netherlands norway, denmark and sweden. what happens from and that is that his family welcome break from europe and into united states. same sections for the game worldwide in the netherlands in 1988, 1989. first time in the world history.

we do know that a pastor in the netherlands was jailed specifically for preaching on this issue. we know that pastors in europe have been fine and also targeted solely for preaching on the bible with respect to this issue. we know that for example in canada you can't broadcast certain things that are critical of homosexuality. we are not to that point, but it's not a wild hypothetical that this is in fact where we're going because we're denmark was and norway and sweden, we now are. we are europe was in terms of the issues of targeting people that are faith-based, we now are. it's just a matter of time. >> i would like to add to that not only as a constitutional or but even more as a catholic clergyman. the osama tape her case has protected somewhat some of the challenges we face of it in terms of hiring and firing in

the catholic church. we sorted this commit against no one and would recognize that every single human person has fundamental human rights, including those who are so professed as gay or lesbian. but there's going to be no changing what we have stood for for 2000 years concerning marriage. right now we are do with struggles based on employing people who are in a purported marriage, men with men, women with women. and we cannot hire them because they are, in fact violating the fundamental teaching of the catholic church. so far the president that come from that have given us some protection but there is no question that that is correct. the police power of the state will follow any rulings that says that we must give them the treatment legally to homosexual

couples, or to lesbian couples as we do to make. and if we do not do so we will suffer the punitive implications. now, that is not a scare tactic. we are already witnessing it. right now comfortable and encouragement so i would his weddings in the catholic church. i do so as a civil authority registered in virginia but also as a cleric. in australia and in some other states, nations, the church is beginning to look twice, will they be able to do that any longer? we may not be able to do that any longer. we face a genuine specter of the state and dating the church and telling us what we can and cannot preach and what our sacraments are about. that is a threat to the fundamental religious freedom. >> we are about to live by c-span audience. i would encourage everyone who's watching this broadcast first place to thank you c-span. but never number two, go to defend marriage.org and let us know what you think about this pledge.

>> let me just come down to me avert some of the legal analysis. let me give some of the practical implications. when you make this a federal law, then the implications are profound churches don't only preach. at bookstores, day care programs, they do a whole series of other things. now, if you start applying the law to these things that they do that you might not consider to be worshiped or strictly religious, then you intend on that churches ability to do what it does. and if the standard is, well you're a discriminator, then why wouldn't that be an application? maybe you should stop preaching that. maybe should start out by these things that are discriminatory, that are upsetting people. and a moment there is some sort of course order the court case in which an order is given, that certain kinds of even cannot engage in because it's

discriminatory, when the past decide on upholding a court order that requires me to do this or that because that's a violation of my religious liberty and my christian convictions, what happens when you violate a court order? content and ultimately imprisonment. so there's practical implications to this that don't require we go to a point where there's a lot of says a pastor may not preach this particular truth. ..

that is a logical shake. the reality is that is not the agenda of this particular movement. the agenda is not just to make me silent and have my own particular viewpoint and disgust among people of my community. the agenda is to make me participate, affirm and promote it. for example why was there such a big backlash against the founder of chick-fil-a. now what they want to do is force his business out. why was the ceo that founded this large software company that was forced to resign as chairman of the board because he gave about a $1000 contribution or so to the proposition at a campaign years before this.

this agenda is a very intolerant agenda that is not content with the silence of those who object. this agenda is an agenda that one secret to participate in affirm. this agenda doesn't say i understand the conviction that i've been a patron of yours for nine years and we are good friends then you have known that i am gay and i understand your heart. the agenda is that what you not the forest down here who can do a better job because that is where the heart is but i want you to participate in my ceremony. i want you to participate in my rally even though you don't discriminate against white people. they want you to participate in a public affirmation of it. that is the critical difference that crossing this line is different than bro versus wade in the sense you can now grow versus wade as horrible as it is to have genocide about massive

nature. until now you have a then forced to participate and be a part of it in affirm. this is not a decision where we stand on the sidelines and criticize, complain about it. once it crosses the line it fundamentally changes the landscape and the culture and there is a coercive component of the state that targets anyone who objects and in answer to the previous question, there was an ordinance passed in diet though arkansas that went back and people gathered enough signatures at the end of 2014. is the first ordinance that had criminal penalties against churches that refused to affirm gender identity in same-sex sexual orientation with people as secular positions that if you

didn't resolve that within 30 days it went to criminal prosecution. shocking. this is not hypothetical. this is a force participation in something we cannot affirm. >> on the last point, that is the issue. by the way there is a distinction between recognizing equal rights and human rights for gay person and then he moved on to train as marriage. that is the issue here to a classical issue protestant evangelical or catholic. that is an oxymoron. there is no such thing. there can be life on choices between gay couples to live together but marriage is what it is and it cannot be changed. i will add one last thing. i am the guy appear with a collar on. i will say is a catholic areas of theology to a sacrament.

for the sacrament of marriage there needs to be a man and a woman who pledged their consent for life and are open to life. if in fact we are moving towards the redefinition of marriage and we put the police power of the state behind a will there be compulsion for priests or deacons in the catholic church to preside over the services. our colleague from america united says there won't eat. we know from the trans and history the police power follows the federal decisions. so, it is incredibly important that we recognize the implications and make a difference. in my church, we have a wonderful document from the 1990s on the pastoral care of

homosexuals. it is respectful. but we will not and cannot recognize any such thing as marriage between anyone besides a man and a woman. if the state tries to compel us to do so we must and we will resist. >> look. i don't think anyone at this podium wants to see people denied the right to wear the right to live, to have housing. we respect the dignity of every human being. we don't hate anybody. but we believe what is really at work here is something far worse then the coercion to do something, but to really end your heart, comment the line if you want to be acceptable. if you don't want to be a big hit. if you don't want to be a hater. when you say gay writes it sounds great, but my understanding is every american has writes. i am not sure what gay writes

means. we don't want to see a late beat up harass, her. he never fought and trained many calling a person i know to be gay and name. but we can't challenge our names about the nature of the behavior. that is what we are really being asked to do. the whole culture has been asked about today's and say this is right and good and appropriate and it's not. writes for human beans, absolutely we support them for all of us. the concept of gay writes is pregnant with all kinds of political and social implications which we simply can't agree with. >> i want a tug on the hearts of those cpu who disagree with us for a moment. i like to consider myself and i are both pastors. the vast majority of homosexuals

want to live in answer to their choices and that is what i want to do. the step of the court is the first that these two lawyers have articulated how that works. we are here to defend the rights of unfettered truth. we are here to defend the rights of all biblical preachers to speak to the issue of sin but more importantly offered the vehicle of salvation. it is a hard matter for us driven by the fact they showed. you may reject god's word. it is quite all right. i don't deny me my first amendment right to propagate the gospel and don't force us to cut off fully believe to be the answer that can change the young lady whose whole life has been tormented and offer them the solution we believe is jesus christ. that is the foundation that

underpins why i'm here today and why i will die if i have to. for what i believe. >> it is real funny that we stand here and talk about the gay community and marriage. as many support marriage, there are many that don't support gay marriage. i have many that you mail me privately to tell me to continue to make a stand. they don't support it but if they do voice their opinion, they will be blackballed. many in hollywood do not believe in marriage. what is the guy's name? the designers. they shut that down. ellen came after then and everybody came after them and said we are never going to buy your clothes.

that is what we are facing. we are going to make a stand. we are not going back to slavery. that was many years ago. we have a voice today will uphold what we believe is what the lord has said that marriage is between a man and a woman. i received death threats from the gay community. i received nasty e-mails. you can google my name. you won't find one bad thing i've said about the gay community. why do they come after me? they know change is possible. they know they were warned gay but i believe in the last days christ is going to return. i am not surprised by what is happening out here. as a matter of fact i'm excited because we will see jesus. we will continue our walk with christ and continue to make a stand and i am blessed we have all of these folks behind me

standing but that's because i am an example that people can change. i lived the trans diet for 17 years. the day i get married i will shout from the not tops. i am so excited. for now the lord has a single. before i die, i will be married and i will show people you can have a nice marriage successful marriage. change is possible. >> we will close the formal part of our press conference. if you have a question, we are glad to entertain. i kid you not call for taking time out of your busy schedules to cover this information. god bless you all.

[inaudible conversations] [inaudible conversations]

>> i was in jail because i refused to reveal the identity of a source of my thigh did not want his identity revealed. in our business, as you know protect sources is the lifeblood of independent journalism and i really felt the people i routinely spoke to who have classified information although they could trust me to protect them, my sources would dry up and eventually i would just be riding with the government wanted you to write. so i felt this was a question of prince paul that i didn't have much choice. the >> both the house and senate are not in session today, but lawmakers will return next week for a busy week of debate.

>> coming up next, the senate homeland security committee holds a year in the northern border threat to security. we will hear testimony from u.s. border patrol chief, michael fisher and customs and border protection deputy commissioner john wagner. this is about two and a half hours. [inaudible conversations]

>> this hearing will come to order. senator carper is on his way and his staff and earned me we could get under way here. i would like to come without objection, offer my opening comments into the record. peering objection, so ordered. as i was talking to witnesses before the hearing, this is our fit in a series of four hearings on border security and what we are trying to do is lay out the reality and i think senator booker would agree with me it is not a pleasant reality. it's an enormously difficult problem and in terms of illegal immigration in terms of drug trafficking, the biggest problem is no doubt about it the

southern border. as the ranking member says repeatedly and i completely agree from a manufacturing background, way to analyze the root cause of the problem. we had an extremely good meeting with general kelley, head of the southern command yesterday, just discussing the problems in central america and the problems of border security and drug trafficking and looking for the root cause. it is really america's demand for drugs. how that demand has created the drug cartels that is really corroded been so harmful to society is in central america. we bear some responsibility for that. these are not going to be easy problems to solve but we have to make incremental improvements. i come from a manufacturing background. nothing is ever perfect. you have to continuously improve. the purpose of this hearing and

every hearing is to get people watching people of the dais here admitting would have a problem to lay out the reality properly. i see that my ranking member is joining us here. i would like to turn it over for him to discuss comments. >> i would love to. not too long. thank you, mr. chairman. thank you for pulling this together. important hearing and we appreciate those numbers including the senator from new jersey. in the last couple of months with an a fair amount of time on this committee is some of you know because you have been here to focus on trying to better understand the security challenges in our southern border with mexico. as large and challenging as our border is it comes with a unique opportunity and risk. our candidate is the largest in the world this is 4000 miles and

when you add in alaska alaska's borders goes up to 5500 miles. also an economic powerhouse to one estimate. some 300,000 people in $1.5 billion in trade every day every day. we celebrate even has to pay close attention to addressing potential border threats. and congress had the pleasure of visiting with senator levin and senator heitkamp. memorable visit with carl levin. we sat in the parking lot and listen to the opening game in minnesota. the tigers beat the twins. i won't forget that. great day. great day. the northern borders include north and south down flows of drugs. other trends national committee and potential exploitation by terrorists. since 9/11 with increased border staffing technology.

for instance, 2000 border patrol agents today and that is compared to 340 in 2001. that is a sevenfold increase. the northern ports of entry have increased a third over the last 10 years. we now have several cbp drums on the northern border as well. however we can no more close our southern border of mexico. having said that we need a better understanding of the risks associated in may to implement the most strategy. we need to do this while sustaining the robust trade. not unlike our southern border, such as areas, mainland mobile towers will increase our ability to respond to threats.

good intelligence and strong information can also help make best use of resources. fortunately, our relationship with the candidate, perhaps the best force multiplier working closer and closer together to enhance our shared prosperity. we look forward to hearing how the relationship is working under the 2011 beyond the border of framework and many others still needed. i hope witnesses will address whether they're successful practices either for increasing security or expediting trade or both to replicate a new sars on the southern border with mexico. finally, i continue to hope the border security will be a larger conversation on how immigration reform.

>> thank you senator carper. this committee is well populated from senators from both sides. i'm from wisconsin. senator tester in montana senator heitkamp for north dakota, senator said three from new hampshire. this is a pretty relevant hearing. if you are welcome as well. it is all part of the same problem. we are glad to see you mr. chairman. i do want to welcome the witnesses for the very thoughtful testimony. it is the tradition of the committee to swear in witnesses. if you all rise and raise your right hand. do you swear the testimony you will get before the committee will be the truth the whole truth and nothing but the truth so help you god? thank you. by the way we do have votes starting at 10:45.

i asked the witnesses to keep your opening statements to the six minute timeframe. we affected attendance here by our committee. i first witnesses michael jay fisher, chief of the u.s. border patrol. she featured showing you asked in 1987 and has served since then including field operations in el paso, jay p. chief of the detroit sector assistant chief troll agent in the tucson dirt and chief patrol agent of the san diego sector. mr. fisher. >> thank you mr. chairman. ranking member carper and members of the committee, it is indeed a privilege to appear today on behalf of the united states border patrol to discuss our strategy to secure the northern border between the ports of entry. our approach along the northern border supports u.s. customs and border protection overarching strategic themes in collaboration integration and innovation. collaboration at all levels including information sharing

among u.s. and canadian law enforcement is critical to the shared security of the border. advanced information and intelligent is that we'll be the key to minimizing risk along our borders. for instance, the operational integration center located at the air national guard base in michigan is a demonstrating project to enhance the situational awareness of cbp in ashen partners including u.s. coast guard immigration and custom enforcement, state and local bomb forstmann as well as the royal canadian border services agency. the oic consolidates a wide range of information including radar and camera feeds database queries not available to cbp can remote sensor inputs, remote video surveillance and mobile surveillance fees and video from

various ports of entry. additional information such as local traffic cameras will be added in the future. in terms of innovation, join efforts to improve surveillance technologies that overcome northern border terrain and environmental challenges, the department of homeland security is collaborating with canada along with us in a sensor sharing pilot to demonstrate the capability and operational utility of their surveillance picture between cbp using a combination of u.s. and canadian information. our situational awareness on the northern order is enhanced by technological capability including camera systems, mobile surveillance system and remote via surveillance systems. cbp is opposite bear moran has 41 fixed wing and rotary aircraft equipped with sensors stationed along the border including two unmanned systems out of the air force is for north dakota.

you may ask flights improve our situational awareness and border security in areas difficult to reach. in addition, we are expanding the coherent change detection technology as this committee is aware, the same methodology that allows us to cover approximately 900 miles along the southwest border without having to deploy technology are border patrol agents. finally come our integration efforts continue as well. for instance each month the bp produces the northern border briefing with a cross component multiagency intelligence report for identifying, monitoring and addressing emerging trends in threats along the northern border. the report is produced in direct collaboration with canadian partners as well as other federal, state and local partners. the northern border has provided a broader ave. for information sharing greater intelligence with the next that the longer northern order.

the border patrol is an active participant in several targeted joint operations called the integrated border enforcement. they are comprised of u.s. canadian law enforcement personnel encompassing 15 region. the information teams designed to increase information and capabilities among the appropriate authorities. by incorporating mobile response capabilities in the air, land and marine environments, would provide participating law enforcement agencies with the force multiplier that not to make this effort. chairman johnson, ranking member carper thank you for the opportunity to appear today. i look forward to your questions. >> thank you chief pitcher. i want to know the deputy assistant commissioner, john wagner is also your written

statement introduce you as well. you've been assigned the bp had orders since 1989. mr. wagner began his career in 1991. mr. wagner has worked in new york, new jersey seaport and laredo texas. appreciate you joining us. our next witness will be james sparrow in the buffalo new york area. mr. spero served as a national crime for the benefit fraud unit at i.c.e. and special agent in charge for hsi. did i say that right among mr. spero? spero, okay. >> chairman johnson, ranking member carper, distinguished members, thank you for the opportunity to assess the efforts to improve security along the border.

as dhs principal investigative homeland security investigation is positioned to leverage its broad statutory authority to support order enforcement. hsi works in close coordination with dhs components and u.s. interagency partners as well as counterparts in canadian law enforcement to target transnational criminal organizations travel, trade and finance. hsi applies a full range of innovative investigative techniques, including leading and participating in u.s. canadian task force says, undercover operations controlled deliveries, asset identification and an removal confidential informant and title iii electronic intercepts to identify and disrupt criminal operations. with nearly 1300 special agents

and 100 research specialists operating along the border. in fiscal year 2014, hsi seven special offices covering the northern border often enjoyed or cooperative investigations with federal state local tribal and canadian law enforcement sees more than $237 million in cash and monetary instruments. nearly 26,000 pounds of marijuana. 2000 pounds cocaine, 719-pound of. 949 pounds of methamphetamine. nearly 1400 firearms. over 55,000 rounds of ammunition and about 8400 weapons.

hsi special agents made over 5700 criminal arrests resulting in nearly 3800 indictments and approximately 3500 convictions. the statistics reflect the impact of our coordinated law enforcement investment and investigations along the northern border. additionally, hsi maintains the largest footprint of any u.s. law enforcement agents in canada. hsi attaché offices located in ottawa, vancouver, toronto and montréal. further enhance national security by the isis liaison to counterparts in local government and law enforcement. our partnerships are essential to joint operations and information sharing along the northern border and beyond. one example is how hsi participate in the joint

terrorism task force. hsi brings its unique authority to the task force to collect threats of national security. hsi border enforcement security task force were at best created in 2005 at the mechanism to address the threat of cross-border crime. in 2007, i.c.e. began to employ along the northern border to provide a proven and platform from which they investigate criminal organization that attempt to exploit perceived vulnerabilities that our nation's borders. they differ from other task force says due to the proximity of the border and the programs focus on cross-border criminal activity. currently there are four units operating along the northern border. but a significant advantage of the best task force model as the

participation and integration of foreign law-enforcement personnel with the ability to conduct cross-border investigations with hsi and our federal state, local and tribal partners to address criminal act committee on both sides of the border. one successful collaboration with our international law enforcement is an hsi investigation that targeted a cocaine smuggling organization involved in the illicit cocaine cash in united states and mexico. investigators estimate the organization was responsible for the smuggling of approximately 1600 kilograms of cocaine into canada with a value of over $60 million. through successful collaboration with canadian law enforced meant, and high-level target was

sent in may of 2014 to 81 months of incarceration. this individual was arrested in september 2010 when attempting to export 97 kilograms of cocaine across the bridge from new york into canada. 97 kilograms of cocaine seizure is the largest seizure in the history of buffalo. in conclusion, cocaine remains dedicated and committed to the nation and we look forward to continuing to work with the committee on this effort. thank you again for the opportunity to testify today and i'd be pleased to answer any questions. >> thank you, mr. spero. i was in for mr. wagner has an opening statement. >> i thought i was off the hook. >> i will give it now. >> chairman johnson, ranking

member carper and members of the thank you for the opportunity to appear and discuss our efforts and ports of entry along the northern border. the earth international boundary delineates to friendly nations with a long history of cultural economic ties contributed to a high volume of cross-border trade and travel amounting to $2 billion today. cbp and ensures the operations protect and secure commerce or trade and travel between our two countries. the u.s. and canada connected by more than 120 lan ports of entry, 755 to aircraft and recreational vessels across the maritime border. with the flow of activity, cbp has more than 600 officers and agriculture specialist stationed on the border ensuring contraband of individuals are intercepted and cargo are expedited. many ports of entry to deploy

technology. this is along with the two best nine implementation of the western hemisphere travel initiative requires a passport to enter the united states and allow cbp against law-enforcement terrorist screening databases. we continue to deploy license plate readers, large-scale and small-scale technology as well as a variety of handheld technologies including monitors. dhs and canadian agencies are collaborating news technologies to enhance cross-border operations. as part of the effort we've made significant investments in infrastructure since february 2000 u.s. government has invested $400 million to rebuild and improve 30 ports of entry along the northern border. our northern ports of entry have high trade and travel. features 72 million travelers with canada for us to resound to

visit family and friends. many initiatives facilitate travel at the northern border simultaneously increase security. cbp develops efficient security operations designed to contribute not barriers. security measure is vitally protected tourism from the damaging effects of terrorists and other security incidents. identifying travelers from those who may require additional script is the key element in our efforts to facilitate secure international travel. the volume of trade is equally a significant period in 24 team that combined two-way trade and investment between the u.s. and canada totaled $759 billion. the u.s. and canada are the largest export market with 16% of all u.s. exports and canada. cbp is committed to working with federal private sector canadian partners to facilitate the flow

of trade and travel and promote economic growth along the northern border. in 2011 the u.s. and canada signed beyond the border initiative as a primary of the ms significant interest and participation in others. i'd like to highlight a few schmidt today. we have completed the first two phases which involved an exchange of entry records of travelers at ports of entry along the u.s. canadian border in such a matter they will serve as the ask the record from another. we've launched a pilot to test the feasibility of primary cargo processing and canada to reduce wait times and congestions. the pilot was completed in washington and british columbia, face to between buffalo recently concluded. our 16 coming dhs concluded negotiations of the pre-claire made for a marine and air modes

of travel. we've also expanded the trust is a perforation with 1.1 an increase of approximately 80% since 2011. canada and united states are striving to provide a secure and trusted supply chain for a safe timely, economically prosperous movement into and between the countries. through the integrated cargo security strategy which seeks to address risk at the earliest opportunity we cannot pilot in montréal testing at dan's data and adopt common standards for security screening and and ongoing cargo at the first point of arrival in north america. the united states continues to align and harmonize the trusted trade appropriations of canada and in the u.s. customs trade partnership against terrorism program. we expect to launch a fully automated harmonization process allowing joint application of the cross-border highway carriers in the pip programs by fall of this year and this will

allow companies interested in both programs to submit a single application and managed only one partnership account instead of two. there've also engaged with entities and authorities to increase security to public or the partnerships. for example, cbp and dhs detection office have partnered with buffalo and the bridge authority to place 18 radiation monitors at the cbp inspection lanes in northern new york. this agreement was reached in november 2014 and recently completed. enhancements increase security and efficiency be supporting new calibration with radiation alarm rates by over 50%. chairman johnson, ranking member carper, thank you for the opportunity to testify today and i am happy to answer any questions. >> thankthank you deputy commissioner. next is david rodriguez. david rodriguez began in 1970. from 1973 tunic 1997

mr. rodriguez were at the dea. he was selected as director for the northwest highway drug trafficking area program in seattle, washington. in 2010 -- you get used acronyms in this business received national awards on the u.s. canada border. >> chairman johnson distinguished members of the committee. the record may and do joint operations with more than 115 international, federal, local and state agencies throughout the northwest. we help these agencies identify threats as well as strategies to address them. the transnational criminal organizations operating on both sides of the u.s. canada border from illegal drugs sold in the u.s. and canada as well as

drugs weapons and bulk cash. these organizations include caucasian groups ethnic east indians come at organized crime groups and members of the hells angels motorcycle club. also the prominence of the mexican national drug trafficking organizations particularly consolidated organization targeted we have gained a strong foothold of the pacific northwest. these include but are not limited to this than a little cartel and the organizations. washington topography information rendered the drug smuggling production with the washington sector at the u.s. border approximately 430 minus one. 13 ports of entry. a significant portion of the international borders are secluded and demoed expanse of public land is susceptible to

many creative activity and large-scale cannabis cultivation. public lands adjacent also serve a drug and currency smuggling. most of the area is sparsely populated were crossing the border can be accomplished without detection. other threats at the northern border illegal entry human trafficking, money laundering and threats relating to terrorist dvds. the corridor is the main transportation route into the pacific northwest and into british columbia and canada. multiagency investigation showed ptos continue along the washington border often throwing duffel bags or hockey

bags containing drugs directly across the border. we separate the u.s. and the canadian parts of the territories. gto then transports the criminal organizations in the state to take advantage of the remote areas of the border with the lack of cross-border detection equipment such as radar in the critical powers to increase the use. narcotics are often concealed above track compartments in trailers. they used to smuggle cocaine and marijuana along the border have declined in 2014. there is demonstrated frequency

mdma or ecstasy will continue in north america. mdma in tablet form remains the standard however recent investigations of the northwest indicate powder form. it has been on the decline with 100 kilograms seized in the northern border in the state of washington compared to over 800 kilograms received in 2008 and 2009. shipments are also expected directly from areas outside.

all-caps seizures in 2013 total 3.1 million the year before in 2014 it was approximately a fluctuation in seizures year to year. our efforts are guided by the 2012 northern border counternarcotics strategy updated in 2014, which articulates the u.s. framework for the ongoing effort to reduce the threats on both sides of the border. the strategy addresses joint efforts in the areas of intelligence collection, information sharing, interdiction between ports of entry as well as the maritime domain. investigations or prosecutions disrupting and dismantling drug trafficking organizations. we participate fully in the northern border programs and will continue to foster cooperation among federal state and local tribal international agencies. along the washington border.

we participate in an important role in intel sharing and the enforcement initiatives training interdiction and analytical support to conclude i would like to thank you for the opportunity to testify here today. >> thank you, mr. rodriguez. next is richard harts indiana for -- hartunian. mr. hartunian sits on the attorney general battery committee where he is the cochair of the subcommittee in which he leaves the northern border group. prior to this he served as the assistant u.s. attorney in the northern district or can't achieve a organized crime drug enforcement task force coordinator. mr. hartunian. [inaudible] >> -- sorry. thank you.

u.s. attorneys for the 16 federal judicial districts along the northern border know well the border security is a critical component of our national security and work with federal, state, local and tribal law-enforcement agencies and canadian counterparts to combat the trend national crime that threatens it. before distressed with the largest volume a significant border related activity or western washington, eastern michigan, western new york in my district. the northern district of new york shares a 310-mile border with canada and includes eight of new york's 11 ports of entry. each volume of people and goods pass through the northern district of the major population centers of eastern canada by road, rail, forest, field and waterway. a territory straddles the border with portions of new york, ontario and québec. smugglers exploit circumstances

in the way and a large rural areas to cross the border surreptitiously. all along the line they try to take advantage along with the nations of the border with the binational to accelerate the legitimate flow in jurisdictional divisions. the prevention of terrorism remains of course our number one priority. a family and i have personally felt the impact of terrorism having lost my 21-year-old lynn over lockerbie in 1988 pan am 103. the terrorist threat is current and real astronomically illustrated by the canadian convictions last month of two men at conspiracy for the benefit of a terrorist group. they plotted to derail a train traveling between new york and toronto, but were thwarted by a joint investigation that included undercover work by an fbi agent. u.s. attorneys offices were closed with a tall joint terrorism task forces operating on them beyond the border and their canadian counterparts to

spot terrorism understanding our vigorous enforcement of the federal criminal code prosecuting human traffickers and those who smuggle drugs guns, illegal immigrants in cash reduce the threat of another attack. our national effort to combat trained national crime includes initiatives with coordination and collaboration such as indicated border enforcement teams. and the task forces on land by dea task force says. each of the districts after establishing regular operations on the maritime borders in washington and michigan. drug organizations include helicopters and vehicle compartment to cross the border with cargo, ecstasy or high potency marijuana moving south

in cocaine, firearms and cash moving north. for example, in northern new york we recently dismantled a ring to transported hockey bags filled with 100 to 250 pounds of canadian marijuana across the sea lay through distribution in the northeast and seized 16 handguns headed for canada. another group we dismantle with ecstasy with 50,000 pills in new york and boston returning with cash and several kilos of. in the fight against human trafficking a joint investigation by rcmp and hci through the u.s. to montréal prostitution recently resulted in charges in canada and the u.s. we combat the child exploitation like the case for a defendant was charged in canada when he tried to bring in child but did not show up for trial. so we took the case in the

defendant was convicted and sentenced to imprisonment for 225 months for transporting nearly 4000 images and over 100 videos of graphic child pornography. as cases illustrate the enforcement teams and task forces for significant success is that the structure composition and mandate have left them short of true integration. yana border declaration in 2011 included the commitment to build on existing bilateral law enforcement programs to develop the next generation of integrated cross-border law enforcement operations. with their canadian counterparts, we addressed the issues associated with integrated enforcement. meanwhile, the vital work of the border security goes on and now includes the border operations leadership team which brings together operational leaders from one horsemen of prosecution agencies with border missions for their insight and action on measures to enhance our efforts to eradicate cross-border line. we are confident our bilateral

commitment to border security, and mutual respect for sovereignty and our shared tradition are protecting public safety and individual rights will strengthen efforts to achieve integrated cross-border. the full range of tools and mouse available to us. the northern border of u.s. attorneys and federal law enforcement agencies are poised to capitalize on the historic opportunity to forge bonds with their canadian counterparts that increase effectiveness. thank you for the opportunity to describe challenges we're facing in the northern border. on the over to answering your question. >> thank you mr. hartunian. certainly one of the purposes of the hearing is to try and get some and for where our main problems occur. we have southern borders, maritime borders the northern borders. i'd like to go to you, chief

fisher and talk about the basic extent of the problems. since i haven't found the southwest border we have 480,000 applications of people crossing the country illegally. and the northern border over 3000. obviously a much larger border. the bigger problem in terms of illegal immigration is coming through the southern border. in testimony, we've had contradictory testimony on this. the apprehension according to the customs border patrols of 75% is what we believe we are apprehending. we have had cdp agents. i realize it is very difficult to get the number. do we have some sense of what the ratings on the northern border? >> mr. chairman, the effectiveness rate is used on the southern border because years ago we defined the thread among other things as flows of

people. that is not necessarily the case. using an effectiveness rate doesn't make a lot of sense to us. we take a look at our strategy and where to deploy our finite resources. if you take a look at approximately at the canadian population. and the population areas it is very concentrated in this area is. our resourcing try to match those. >> again, is your sense we apprehend against the northern border southern border. ask anyone else who wants to chime in. >> my sense would be as bad or

higher in the southern border primarily because the flow rate is so low. >> what about in terms of drug trafficking? do we have any statistics in the total number of times from the southern border versus the drugs being trafficked through the northern border. 10% 5%? >> i don't have the percentage but i will tell you it is considerably less than the smuggling that occurs on the northern border than what we see on the southern border. >> we have had testimony from general mccaffrey on the southern border. estimates between 5% and 10% of all drugs are interdicted which means 90%, 95% are getting through. would we have a similar type of interdiction raid on the northern border? anybody want to answer that they might have some sense of that? or do we simply not know? >> i'm not familiar with the methodology on that.

generally we look at seizure rates among the northern border versus the southern border. we don't measure that in terms of the comparison to differentiate threat. >> in terms of the drugs flowing through, we've had contradictory testimony on the southern border, when witnessing they flow through the actual ports of entry. other witnesses go around the ports of entry. do we have any sense on the northern border were the primary drug trafficking is occurring? do they smuggled to the ports of entry or are they coming through the vast unmonitored parts of the border? anybody want to answer that one? mr. spero. >> one of the things i would say about the northern border if it is certainly bidirectional. coming in from canada, and other drugs being exported from the

u.s. and going from the u.s. into canada. as far as the difference between whether or not we're making investigation interdict did either at the port of entry per between the ports, we are seeing in some cases different drugs. the case that i spoke about during the oral statement is a case where the tractor-trailer being used a drug smuggling organization to get cocaine from the ontario california were the drugs are being stored at the warehouse is actually being transported across the u.s. and through the port of buffalo and are supposed to be delivered to canada. that particular method was a trap or a concealed compartment. it was actually under the

floorboards of the tractor-trailer that had that particular delivery been successful, that would've been a case of drug smuggling going into canada through the ports of entry. likewise we still see smuggling i believe it was mr. hartunian and mr. rodriguez who were talking about the hot bat coming in between the poor whether those are hockey bags of marijuana or some other drug. we get referrals from the border patrol to make those interdictions between pours as well as from the office of field operations making those interdictions at the port. ..

and in particular with canada, what we have found over the years, the information-sharing is really good. it gets better. i had the opportunity to have three border patrol agents embedded with rcmp in canada with a fourth shortly this year. having a border patrol agent in canned today working with the rcmp only bolsters our ability to understand the evolving threats and helping us secure the border on both sides. >> that type of model we have with canada, if we could implement something similar with mexico would make a tremendous difference? >> yes, mr.