had come michigan tell me go see dr. xyz and not dr. abc because of her knowledge and skill in what she's been able to put together preceding so many of us, she has that template, those tools in her belt that will send me to the right person. >> you think you would be in worse condition without being at the center? >> i wouldn't be here. this year would be with someone else. the last surgery i had last year there were only four surgeons qualified to do what i needed to get done. >> ms. burnette come i understand you received medical monitoring services throughout sinai center of excellence. can you explain what care you received and what it has meant to you.

>> the care i received has been excellent. they didn't open them biopsy which determine which lung disease i had and how they were able to treat it and which don't as i needed to see. >> could you explain the care you receive at mount cyanide. i assume it is similar to what -- they are treating the whole person. >> of a primary doctor and they sent me two different doctors for the different diseases i have. gerd asthma, sinusitis and one primary care doc aired coordinates all bad. >> was your condition be worse if he didn't have access to the 9/11 health program? >> i believe would be terrible words because i had the world trade center cough. i would not hold a conversation without the program providing me with the medication i needed.

>> dr. udasin what is this cohort of patients in the type of specialized care provided a clinical centers of excellence? >> we have people with rare conditions like david that need specialist health. we have been able to use their best university resources to get people that have seen many abnormalities on things like c.a.t. scans to get patients like the gentleman i mentioned who had the cancer removed. really the number of conditions that we see in the complicated cases that we see so you may have one condition and that influences another condition in mix the third condition worse. so if you have mental health issues and you have reflux and then you get chest pain and

asthma, you end up taking too many medications and then you get the side effects of medications. many of the aspen medications if if you take too many can precipitate heart disease. my feeling early recognition and treatment of other conditions allows for a much better outcomes for people. >> is sounds like with so many possible illnesses misdiagnosis would not be uncommon. >> that is correct. the sheer number of conditions and that is the issue because you treat one condition effectively but you kill the patient while you're doing it because she had some other condition you ignored.

that is what we are able to do as the primary care gatekeeper type person i can make sure all the specialists are talking to each other and making sure the total patient is treated correctly. >> thank you, mr. chairman. i think because of the complications and the exposure to no telling what do you need to have someone who looks at the whole person and actually treats all of them. thank you, mr. chairman. >> the chair recognizes the gentleman from new jersey, mr. land for five minutes per question. >> thank you mr. chairman. dr. udasin, can you explain in a little more detail your center of excellence and what that means and how many there are in the metropolitan region and what

qualifies your organization as being a center of excellence. >> thank you. we are part of the non-fdny responder program. it has a separate center. we are one of the new jersey consortium which included centers have not science i -- mount cyanide, and why you rutgers and stony brook. >> nasa also is on the border over there. we stared at the center of excellence in new jersey. what makes this different, our physicians are board-certified in primary care specialties, internal medicine and

occupational medicine on double board-certified. almost all of the positions have more certifications. as i said rutgers has an environmental centers of excellence in our same building and we do extensive work on exposure and health and that happens besides the rest of the faculty i work with at rutgers. we have a lot of experience with exposure and illness. we have a pulmonary doctor that comes into our practice and sees patients with us. we have mental health people that come into our practice and see patients and across the street from us we have our search and neurologists and other specialists that we needed the rutgers center.

by the way, we changed our name to rutgers. we need to get that on the record. >> that's because our state legislature has permitted the combination of the university of medicine and dentistry and rutgers. >> ray. >> in any event, then i have registered nurses who are they are helping us take care of patients making sure histories are obtained correctly and people know how to use their medication. this is very important that we have people making sure not only medications are used but are used correctly. i mentioned my mental health court and administrative core and that group of people is performing audits to make sure

everybody else is doing everything correctly. we are using our privacy correct way. we are doing the best we can to keep costs down using generic drugs and all of our providers and people writing prescription that everybody is certified appropriate to do this and patients actually get their medications when they get to the pharmacy. that is part of coordination of care and i can assure you we are performing these audits because i want to make sure we have funding to treat our patients. presumably you guys won unanimously confirmed the bill. >> thank you very much. to mr. howley and ms. burnette commit thank you for superb public service.

ms. burnette what position did you play basketball? >> point guard. >> i was five-foot eight so i never played basketball. mr. chairman, i have a letter from 38 members of the new york and new jersey delegation to speaker boehner and leader pelosi requesting early passage of the bill. i would request it be submitted for the record. >> the gentleman seeking unanimous consent to put in the record without objection so ordered. >> i yelled back seven seconds. >> we now recognize the ranking member of the full committee mr. pallone five minutes for questions. >> thank you, mr. chairman. dr. udasin, i wanted to have you explain if you will the importance of not only the rutgers center but all of the signers that are part of the world trade program in terms of

research because there's an extensive research component. i want to emphasize if you can how you are developing diagnosis and treatment of disorders that people might not even be aware of and how that research and the uniqueness of the center makes that possible. could you just kind of describe how the rutgers center is involved in the research into world trade center related condition and how the research is improving our ability to diagnose and treat wtc related health conditions and the benefits of the research. >> answering the rutgers only in nyu research as we have a lot of sleep apnea experts in those two

centers. i am proud to say between our laboratory toxicologists and sleep experts, we have developed certain markers we are seeing in certain patients. one of our sleep experts presented this at the thoracic say the meetings that certain people can be predicted possibly to have sleep apnea. desire inflammatory markers and these people up to 9/11 side were exposed to all kind of toxins that can cause inflammation. so because of that association between environmental exposures and information we have been able to find people sooner get

them treated. and for people who think about sleep apnea and the environment because traditionally sleep apnea was thought of as something you have to be enormously obese to get. we have patients that are not quite playing point guard veteran awfully good shape that have sleep apnea and we are able, as i said because of our occupational expertise, sleep apnea is a very serious condition. there was somebody who died recently, a celebrity on the new jersey turnpike because a bus driver fell asleep. we have a lot of patients who have to drive commercial vehicles, operate planes operate the subway, operate all kinds of heavy equipment. it is really good we are able to treat them safe and away.

that is one thing our research has accomplished which is not only applicable to patients but applicable to other people with environmental exposures. >> i appreciate that. the other thing if you could get across is how we can expect an increase among the population of these 9/11 related conditions. it is my understanding as time goes on we find more cancers more disorders as people get older they maybe didn't exist before that now we find through your research or others in the centers related to 9/11 that we didn't know about before. >> so i want to say certain kinds of malignancies have very short latency. and you would expect to see something like that within just

a couple of years after exposure to toxins. but other toxins like asbestos have much longer late tea. and they might be seen later on at a different time. if i could use a few minutes to answer a question you asked dr. howard earlier about mistakes made by providers outside of the program if i could add we have found in the program people have been undertreated by local providers for various cancers, for very severe lung condition was pulmonary fibrosis. i want to say even though that wasn't the question you asked i want to say we have been able to improve the health care they getting better diagnostic

services to our patients and their able to get from some of the local people. >> thank you very much. thank you, mr. chairman. >> the chair thanks the gentleman. that concludes the questions of the members. they will have follow-up questions in writing. we will submit those to you and ask you to please respond promptly. out of my members they have 10 business days to submit questions for the record and they should submit questions by the close of business on thursday, june 25th. thank you very much for sharing your personal experience and your excellent testimony. the committee will take up the legislation i assure you and act on it and you have performed a public service by being here today. thank you very much. without objection, the subcommittee is adjourned.

>> 97% of the people is to have to settle because they don't have $3 million to defend themselves. 97% who saddled an average of $300,000. when they pay the $300,000 settlement are locked up what is called an nda, nondisclosure agreement which is a contract that says they are never allowed to tell anybody what happened to them. >> we are very excited to have legislation on the topic and will speak to as many congressmen as possible to see but is the best way to let entrepreneurs defend the products and more importantly run their business. and if the demand letters that currently exist.

[inaudible] make it more difficult for them to enforce property rights. -- [inaudible] >> today the foreign policy program at rookies will host the chief of staff to the united nations secretary-general for discussion on how the organization is adapt into new geopolitical trends national and substate challenges.

>> after ted mitchell's remarks, said health and education committee member lamar alexander spoke about the cost of higher education. a national show hosted this event last tuesday and washington d.c. this program is about an hour and 10 minutes. [inaudible] and i would like to welcome all of you here today as well as

watching the live stream. 50 years of the higher education act. this event is made possible with generous support of the bill and melinda gates foundation. at this time i ask to silence her cell phone but please don't put them away. we would love for you to share your comments and questions cannot be social media at #next america. the loss of audience q&a after each portion is standing by at funds throughout the room. if you have a question, lineup and state your name and organization. we also are taking questions via twitter. use the hash tag ask mj. if you haven't already please download the national journal five ab. an opportunity to see information about the program as well as speakers and moderators and underwriters and also have a special feature to connect with

other people in the audience. we will be using now moving forward. 50 years ago president lyndon johnson signed the higher education act with the objective of making college more affordable and more accessible for students. this morning we plan to discuss to what extent we have succeeded in fulfilling the goals of the higher education act of 1965 and will perform in innovation is needed. here's a brief overview of the event which features two keynote speakers. first under secretary of education ted mitchell will take the stage followed by senator lamar alexander. ron brownstein editorial director of the panic media will be moderating both interviews and to close our program a staff correspondent at national journal will moderate the discussion. just a reminder you can years #mj next america during our

program. ♪ >> is welcome to the stage johanna darlega commit senior vice president national journal live in advertising. ♪ please welcome to the stage u.s. department of education undersecretary ted mitchell and ron brownstein, editorial or opinion take media. ♪ >> good morning, everyone. thanks for being here. looks like we've got quite a good crew which is

extraordinary. thanks to the national journal gates foundation for convening us today inviting me to be a part of the program. the next america series is critically important because we need more than ever strategic thinking and strategic action as we adapt to the unprecedented challenges and unprecedented opportunities presented by this era of change. huge technological, social, demographic and structural shifts are redefining what college is who attends college and how much it costs him how much it should frankly cost. it is important to take stock of what happened in the half-century since we passed the higher education act and its companion the elementary and secondary education act. both flaws advanced the idea and made the commitment of equal access to quality education as a moral imperative and civil right in america. when he signed in 1965,

president johnson called it a promise that quote the leadership of our country believes it is the obligation of our nation to provide and permit and assess every child born in these borders to receive all the education he could take, end quote. since then it has been our mission to make the promise real for every student. we've made progress but the task has never been more urgent and our work is far from complete. president obama captured the urgency of higher education for all with the goal he set soon after taking office that america will again have the worlds best educated population and the most competitive workforce measured in part by america's leading the way in the attainment of post secondary degrees and credentials. to achieve the goal we've worked with partners at the national level, state-level local level

and institutional level to strengthen the education pipeline focusing funds on equity opportunity and innovation encouraging rigorous college and career ready standards and assessment, modernizing the teaching profession and making college access college affordability college affordability and completion for all students a top priority. we look forward to deepening the work and the conversations i had in the higher education act reauthorization. today thanks to the hard work of educators students and communities their high school graduation rate is the highest ever with the biggest gains by students of color, low income earners and students with disabilities. persistent achievement gaps have begun to close as we have reached historic milestone of immaturity of the students in our nation's public schools now coming from minority communities. these are important steps towards fulfilling the original

intent by equipping a larger more diverse and better prepared pool of high school graduates for success in college and careers and life. to achieve the basic purpose of pga we must make high-quality postsecondary education available to every student as a civil rights, he said that at any latter to the middle class. today the good news is the college enrollment is growing with the number of black and hispanic students by more than a million since 2008. the administration asserts to try to do our part. we've increased the total aid available to students by $50 billion in 2008 to 2016 and creative tax benefit that they've added another $12 billion to resources available to families to afford college. as a result more students graduate college than ever before. still the map of access finance and completion is complicated especially students of limited means, families move to the

college experience, returning veterans displaced workers. today's learners something we've not seen in the past. this resulted expansion of opportunity and is itself an opportunity for us to think differently about higher education going forward. for the families and others that can be hard to gauge the quality of teaching and learning for receive to secure the funds necessary and to have the information accessible to them so they can navigate the college experience. too often in for too long are most vulnerable students have wound up in the worst place possible with no degree little earning power and debt that can persist for decades. these two has to change. first and foremost this is a matter of principle, deep moral principle. opportunity for everyone is our commitment.

that is the north star. that's what we stand for is the people people and a nation. this is also about the prosperity of our country. never in our history has the ability to complete college matters so much to individual life outcomes and national competitiveness. get the real threat this opportunity will become the exclusive province of the wealthy. college take it to the middle class must not become a luxury good. not unless we are prepared to relinquish the fundamental hope that our children and grandchildren will be better off than we are. there is good news. we've seen a wave of positive reforms on campuses and states and national networks. many islands of excellence we need to scale, bring together and create an overall template of success for the future. overall, one of the best pieces of news is a growing consensus that presidents' day sat started

this here state of the unions beach in the 21st century universal access to publicly supported education must extend down to pre-k and up into college. more states and institutions create strategic plans and set annual targets to increase college completion rates and linking funding to success. we see more dual enrollment early college high school programs and policies that ensure a seamless transfer between two and four-year institutions. several state and institutions. several state and city let us first city let a person city let us first make to your college is free for all students under way inspired the administration's own promise proposal. programs to improve outcomes for vulnerable learners are on the rise along with a range of nonprofit association in coalition effort aimed to help meet the president's northstar goal. innovation at the institution of systems level are harnessing the

knowledge you to broaden and deepen learning and often lower-cost and speed time to degree. all of this suggests this is an exciting and hopeful time for higher education and a wonderful time for the conversation about the reauthorization. managing change at this particular time in a way that benefits all students will take hold by a state institution to creditors, national network nonprofit, administration and congress. it will take unprecedented effort, investment, innovation and compromise. we are innovating at the federal level are working to keep college within reach by improving the process for applying for financial aid along with other resources like to pay as you earn loan repayment policies consumer tools to improve loan servicing and trying to make the path for

college a path towards repaying loans as smooth as possible. using federal funds to feed new approaches come to fuel creativity, build a stronger body of evidence about what works for america's diverse learners and increase the adoption of effect practices nationwide. and we are continuing to hold institutions accountable to improve the value of their programs, to protect the students of abusive practices where they exist and to safeguard the interest of taxpayers. ..

and to make some key changes needed to improve the overall performance of the sector. we hope a renewed concentration -- conversation on higher education provides congress with the momentum to take timely action. through 50 years multiple reauthorization come and trim legislative changes and budget reconciliations, we have embodied a federal commitment to equalizing college opportunity. and the law's scope has broadened to exist students seeking a bright of postsecondary degrees. for the administration come improving the performance of our nation's higher education has

been focusing on the investments needed to ensure that college remains affordable for the middle and low income families. the kinds of reforms that make it possible for all americans to have the opportunity to succeed in college. this is meant supporting innovation and competition designed to lead to breakthroughs on cost and quality that can accommodate 21st century learners. it is required to all we can to build a better and more reliable financial aid system that helps more americans afford college and better manage their student debt. for many years success of congress to focus on the cost of the federal student loan system. the subsidies paid to banks that make student loans and those the terms and conditions. one of president obama's most significant achievements was reforming the federal student loan system to remove things from the equation with colleges instead using loans with capital provided directly from the federal government. this resulted in $60 billion in

savings that we are able to reinvest in aid to students in savings for taxpayers. finally, all of these efforts must be built on a strong shared system of accountability that keeps on bad actors and health all colleges improve. as recent events have made clear we need to ask more from states from institutions and from creditors. we also need to protect the significant accomplishments we've made to reinforce program integrity, including gainful employment regulation, and we need to empower the department with more enforcement tools. this is where we need congress to act with us. we want to work with congress to focus on making college more affordable, financial aid more accessible and loan repayment easier. a key step towards that is to make two years of community college as universal as high school was the century ago. and encouraged states to

reinvest in high-risk. this means strengthening and safeguarding the pell program to ensure the maximum grant keeps pace with college costs. and while we're taken significant steps to semper fi the federal aid application process and form come we want to make fafsa filing simpler easier and early. we want to reform income driven repayment in the president's budget proposal proposed a single, simple better targeted plan. building on the work we have done with tools like a college scorecard, we believe we are putting in the hands of students families and the public tools that will help us all understand how the investment we're making in higher education is paying off for individuals in society. we believe these tools will promote strong student outcomes and help colleges continues to

improve their performance. as we continue to push for stronger accountability through stronger enforcement measures, we want to reward schools for outcome come encourage innovation and help struggling colleges improve. for example, through the pell bonus program and campus paid reform. we can build efforts to promote innovation and competition such as the ministrations first in the world program that allows for come encourages the development of scaling of new evidence-based interventions leading to college success. finally, believe it or not i am interested in starting our conversation, let me close by saying that the department we're looking forward to working with congress, and i know you hear from chairman alexander looking forward to working with senator murray, chairman alexander and all of our stakeholders on these important issues. interest in both time left and

timely as we look to take advantage of the opportunities provided by the vast changes afoot and increasing cases of change. we all benefit. college credentials lead to higher earnings and a better quality of life for individuals and a stronger, safer, more prosperous democracy. but we simply cannot economic and social mobility without educational opportunity. now more than ever our work aims to modernize and expand postsecondary education must ensure that america stays true to our founding values and keeps faith with everyone who dreams of a better life. our work must help foster a more prosperous and inclusive society to preserve a vibrant democracy. and maintain u.s. leadership in the world. thanks so much for listening and i am now in your hands.

[applause] >> thank you. thank you for that terrific score of educational horizon. want to talk about some the specifics on the reauthorization and you think of that. i do want to start with something you touched on and the johanna touched on that we are 50 years since lyndon johnson traveled to his own alma mater southwest texas state college, marfa texas. he signed the bill at a desk you just won't working for the school nutrition to pay his way until rain intervened he was plain to us on the outside of the building that get swept as a janitor wants to do. when he signed the bill he said when we leave here this morning i want you to go back and say to your children and your grandchildren and to those who come after you and all you come to the we've made a promise. tell them the truth issue for them to see until then that would open the road and we

pulled decades down and the way is open and we expect them to travel it. how do you think, if we are assessing 50 years later, if a fundamental of the presently that was to democratize access to education how would you grade is on achieving that speak was i think he would great us at a d+. i think the positive side and it is an enormous positive is that we have opened the gates for more broadly to a diverse population of college goers. and one can look at that in terms of the number of african-americans, the number of latinos, i think you know the pew center just released result in the last month that showed hispanics, 12th graders are more likely for the first time to attend college and are anglo

peers. i think all of that is very good news. students with learning differences coming to college in increasing numbers, and i think fundamentally we have begun to think of college not as an experienced for bright shiny 18 year olds headed off to four years at an ivy-covered institution but thinking of college as a lifelong experience for people who are looking for ways to retrain, we still, upscale, new skill. i think that is made even created a different date than president johnson had my. the fact i'm a hard grader on this is because i think with a long way to go. in particular while college rates are increasing and college completion rates are increasing, college completion rates still lags when we need him to be. >> that is if you look at the data over this stretch big increase in college going

starting across the income ladder come across racial lines by the completion gaps between kids whose families are in the top of the latter is why today than in 1970. i'm wondering your thoughts on why we are seeing the completion gaps persist and even widen even as the college growing differential has narrowed? >> i think back to my own experience as a college president and a state university dean. i think at the same time we are expanding access to low-income families, families or the first kids in the first in the family to go to college. we have been slow to recognize that those groups, namely different kinds of support than a formally typical high school graduate, comes into play. i think much research issue about differentials and cultural

capital that students come to college with. universities and colleges are now working hard to create mechanisms for those students that i think the other thing we need to recognize is the fact that too many students go far too many students are leaving high school with a high school diploma but not the skills to be able to move right into college work. and so this gap we should talk to it as the remediation definitely talk about it as is develop an education is both substantively and psychologically a huge barrier for far too many students. >> you're talking help once they get there, preparation. third leg of this to people talk about is affordability. >> i think affordability certainly is the third leg of the stool. i know that both from institutional point of view and from a national policy perspective the fact that

states have chosen to disinvest so dramatically in higher education since the beginning of the great recession has moved costs either to the federal government and we expanded pell, tax credits, made student loans more accessible, but research is pretty clear that the bulk of the burden has fallen on families at just the time we are expanding access to low income students but that stuff. >> why do you think that something? >> i think there are a couple of reasons. obviously, states really are at the beginning of the great recession. anytime a state legislature and governor have to choose between basic social services and health care benefits and higher education, there's got to be a

discussion and there will be decisions made. i worry more, frankly, about the fact states have not invested coming out of the great recession and i think there is a little bit of a sense that it didn't break, did it? and i think the problem is it's breaking, creaking, cracking as families are underneath that edifice. >> on the affordability front you made a good deal of did yesterday when the department announced the loan forgiveness for students that declared bankruptcy last month which could cause 3.5 billion in all students of the past five years received debt relief. what is the authority under which acting and a broadly does this president -- >> so this is called barbara defense against repayment and it is a part of hea. we have both statute and

regulation, determine the conditions under which students make claims and under which the department is assessing those claims. the decisions that we announced yesterday applies to one portion of the students who are enrolled and those were students enrolled in specific programs where we have established corinthian had falsified placement rates. so for students who depend on those falsified placement rates, they have a claim under in this case california state law to bring a case, but they can also just bring it directly to us. to our decision yesterday sort of took a subset of the population and invited him to apply for forgiveness honor student loans student let's turn to the hea reauthorization.

what are the administration's top of goals? >> we are working, still working through our own blueprint document that we hope to engage the house and the senate with. we're getting good collaboration on that. i think that he mentioned a number of them. i think that we want, we certainly want to be continuing to simplify loan programs. we want to sample five access through fafsa to the federal financial aid system. we want to protect the pell grant program. we want to make sure that pell grant, the purchasing power of the pell grants remains high. >> so they're part to a g. ideas that republicans in particular on the committee and around have discussed. one, the chairman had a white paper commission earlier, this

idea getting colleges and universities skin in the game having a share of risk for loans that go into default. what do you think about it is? >> i think we have always thought about colleges and universities needing to share in accountability for outcomes and so risk-sharing for us is one of the ideas in the overall bucket. we are keenly interested in engaging universities as partners. >> another idea, marco rubio in particular and others talk about basically deregulating the accreditation process, trying to create more pathways to access federal student loans. what do you think that? >> the president in the state of the union, two states of the union ago also address is an address working week we regard as sort of the twin problems in

accreditation. one is about we think that there needs to be more rigor in the accreditation process. on the event we think there needs to be more flexibility. in the accreditation process. so we are working on a set of proposals with the creditors to give of -- >> you had your own advisory commission on that last year. do you think a point you toward your ultimate solution or is that still in -- >> i think we are still working it out. >> you mentioned that two years of free can of the college. that it has received at least when you initially presented a pretty stony reception from the republicans in congress. are you thinking of tweeting it anyway to try to get it off the run with? >> the legislative process is always one of give and take and where in the process now. at the same time we have been i'm talking over my shoulder to

all of you guys, but you can see them any is better looking than i am. we've been really hard by the conversations we've had at the state and local level data from ben of the flavor we don't want to wait. we want to start to tackle this on our own end zone we've had a series of those conversations both in several states which have now begun inviting folks in to talk with us. we have been very encouraged at this point of the idea and would add the core around the notion that in the 21st century, universal publicly supported education needs to start at pre-k and go deep into college, that that's the way we continue to provide access. that's the way we create opportunity, and that's the way we hit the affordability question as well. >> so far in the reauthorization discussion has been focused on civil fining fafsa form, simplifying the income-based

repayment system, and you've talked about that. became and has talked about that. there are those who say that discussion is junior at a time when you're looking at unprecedented levels of debt. you get is a drumbeat in the democratic party that they should be access to decorate public higher education for students, that should be the goal of we should find a way to finance that goal. what does the administration think that discussion? is not a feasible goal a recent local? >> it is serving on the table come in the air and the water and so we are talking about it and thinking about it. we think that affordability doesn't necessarily end up at zero until -- and so we think there's a lot of distance to be made up between where we are in zero come in we should be making sure that we're focused on that. >> you see unintended

consequences? is that what you're suggesting? >> honestly i haven't thought enough about it. >> he mentioned before, we have significantly increased pell grants, spending over the last roughly since 2007, but yet debt continues to rise. the question becomes is there a treadmill? if there is more federal aid that states for the received? >> which is why i think it's important as we thought about the american college promise proposal that one of the key elements is, in fact a maintenance of effort ideas so that states would need to maintain funding levels in higher education so that there isn't that kind of supplant policy going on. and we do think that states need to do more and that the federal government is not going to be in

a position to make of all of that. >> you a link this, on the other hand, the positive side you alluded to it in your remarks. most of doing of the interesting things using data, using a using counseling and anyways to try to improve completion rates. what are some of the experiments after that you find particularly promising? and what can you do to encourage more institutions to follow along those lines speak with you just mentioned a few of them and they are very encouraging. in addition to the work of those individual institutions, university innovation alliance has gathered together large public research universities and is not only working on ways individual institutions can innovate and improve the throughput, but how they could work together. in addition to that at the state level, there have been number of

states experimenting with performance-based funding. this is what i alluded to when i was talking about helping to promote success among institutions come is to be put to provide more resources and institutions that are doing the right thing by low income first generation. >> let me put a question in a few minutes ago to start lining up somebody's i will have a few minutes of questions, two microphones that are there. let me ask you gainful unemployment, a roving in despicable in your favor. i going to go into effect in july? >> were on track to go into effect. there's one more lawsuit pending. we are interested in how that turns out but we are doing our work crunch numbers and institutions of reporting their data to us on july 1. >> chairman alexander has been very critical of these regulation. they expect congress to try to stop you? >> no prediction. spent have they given you any indication, any indication

privately that will be attempting to block this? >> we have not heard that. >> what about the college readiness of? thethe department says it will still be available for students entering the 2015 school year. where are you? >> as most of you know in december we put out a framework document asking for comments. we got a lot from any of the people in the room, and so we have been working off of those comments and we have been running models, looking at her own data, looking at our own tools that we are making available. we feel we are on track spent timetabled? >> we are still on the timetable to provide this for students into the world before the beginning of the 2015 academic year. >> rubio again and widen have

legislation with their own kind of thoughts. one that supersede what you're doing? >> i don't think so. and i think the administration takes the position about this, transparency is very valuable, and more information in the hands of consumers and citizens is a good thing. >> want to let the audience into the want to let the question is but before do. we mentioned arizona state. they have done things recently, this idea of an online freshman year that she would pay only if you pass the final and pursue the credit. the thought of it ultimate that would be but half the cost if you went through a full load of courses, a traditional freshman year. do you do that can i get as a positive experiment or do you were essentially leads to a two-tier education system where the logic of having professors is reserved for more affluent students and those with less things are basically shunted to

a laptop the? >> i think that's a concern. we need to keep our eyes on it. backing up a step i am very excited by the experimentation that's going on, each imitation of delivery models and business models in higher it. -tired and often gets a bad rap for being old and stodgy and i think what we're seeing is a lot of extreme edition. the job for institutions and the job i think for philanthropic partners and for the department is to begin to do the kind of evaluation that we would need to answer the question, is this cheaper but not cheap and? i think that's the goal. >> you would like to see it go ahead? >> i would like to see coherent but i would like to see it rigorously evaluated. this is in the administration's first in the world program, put out $60 million for projects that seek to innovate and delivery systems. we want to be sure we're doing

the evaluation is there to make sure that are not unintended consequences. >> i'm going to reserve one more thing. does anybody want to ask a question? the microphone is open. >> the i'm with "congressional quarterly" and i wanted to ask you about how leadership at the department, it looks like the department assistant secretary for postsecondary education, position has been open and as acting assistant secretary since 2013. president obama just withdrew the nomination that has been pending since 23 -- 2013. i wanted about the position from what you see happening and how important it is in this discussion as you afford with these conversation with congress? >> it's no secret that we have been frustrated by the inability to confirm a number of our key

appointments, and those confirmations have been slow and we would hope that congress would understand the need for us to have a full squad on the field as we move through the next two years. >> let me ask, one other thing that made is a little over the horizon, not message or in the immediate debate. the policy policy center put out a report a few weeks ago arguing if you look at the tax exempt status of the endowment of private universities, the tax subsidies they receive per student significantly exceeds the public appropriation that a lick university in the same states. they calculate if you look at harvard if it translates into a personal subsidy of $40,000 per student hundred and 9900 for umass amherst as a public subsidy.

it turns out the edited harvard received $400 million donation from one donor. documents after receiving a $350 million donation from another. in that report that group and the citizens foundation has talked about it, talked about taxing down with above a certain level but allowing -- excuse me institution to offset the tax by providing more financial aid. have you look at all of the issues of the kind of the way endowment may be exacerbating what you described before post-secondary education becoming only a luxury good? >> what's interesting, we need to keep in mind the broad, broad diversity of american higher education i think if you look at even just the private not-for-profit sector ranging from entirely tuition driven institutions to have endowment support institutions, there is such a range i think we need to

be careful about drawing overall conclusions answer been making a one size fits all policy. that said i think one of the things we have seen is that the institutions with a very large endowment have already on their own taking up the cause of low income first generation students and are creating income level thresholds below which students have either all aid packages for free tuition altogether. and i think one of the problems we have is that that information has not been broadly available. so to understand as a student, if my income ranges 40-$60,000 can once a harvard education going to cost as compared to umass for the university of michigan? that we need to crack that open more and we need, we think someonesomemight will help this problem even when we talk about the

problem. >> on the other hand, if you look at what is the most important sign georgetown center on education and the workforce, what it shows is there's an enormous increase in minority access to education. the vast majority of the students have been channeled into the institution with the least resources, the kennedy college and the open access while the top 460 most selective schools are essentially as white today industry but as they were 20 years ago. those are institutions putting the most resources and getting the best outcomes. ultimately is higher education developing into a two-tier system that has the risk of reinforcing rather than breaking down kind of these divisions of society? >> i do think that is a risk and i think we have to keep our eye on this problem of education becoming a luxury. we have to challenge elite institutions you more, reward them when they do more.

the second piece of social science research shows the under matching research. i think some of these are information problems and we need to really double down on the information problem, and i don't want to dismiss the idea that we should think like broadly about the whole range of subsidies, different institutions get from a variety of different sources. >> you the open and look at the question of whether the public subsidies are in effect supporting the students and institutions with the most to gain? >> i think part of this overall accountability, and what is it that we as a nation are choosing the tools that we have what do we want to reward them for doing more of? we need to look at the whole range of subsidies spill let me ask you one final thing and then we will turn to the next stage of the program. would you think about this tracking we are talking about do you think overweight and who's going to be primarily increasing

resources able to the institutions that are not underresourced like community colleges, or in finding ways as you crack the nut and get more these lower income students -- >> if you look at where the bulk of students of all stripes ago they come to for your comprehensive public institutions and community colleges. i think that we need to invest where the students are and we need to make sure that those institutions are funded, that they are innovating around the new demand the first student body is bringing them and that they are focused laserlike on outcomes for students. >> one final kind of thought. you noted before, two things, that you are surprised and frustrated by the continued strain on public higher education even coming out of the recession at you noted this is the first full year after whether majority partly as

nonwhite. are those two facts related? >> i don't think so. spent all right. we will leave it there. thank you very much. >> thanks, everyone. >> thank you, sir. [applause] ♪ ♪ ♪ >> please welcome to the stage daniel greenstein. >> thank you, welcome. so we are here at the end of the graduation season where this year some 50 million people will receive a college degree or certificate they've been working on a record of seven years. let's congratulate our graduates. their accomplishments are wrote a special when you think that the majority nearly three

quarters were not the traditional college student attending a residential college for four years full-time after high school. the majority juggled life and jobs and family while they were working to get their degrees. nearly a third were first in the films to go to college which means they couldn't go on as usual family support to navigating the complexity of higher education. nearly a quarter attended several colleges along the way and more than two-thirds graduated with a debt. there's more than a trillion dollars of student debt out there today and that's crushing particularly question for those in the 40% back to 10 college don't complete their degree. the so-called nontraditional students don't look a whole lot like a star to represent the majority of america's college students today, and to meet this season especially they are america's heroes. but as they walk across the

stage to accept their diplomas i'm thinking about 800,000 more of their fellow students who began with in college but who will not make it this far. 40% of students who begin don't complete their degree. we have to do better. our economy depends on it. as jamie merisotis noted in his new book, america needs more college educated talent. a lot more. by 2025, two-thirds of all jobs in the united states will require an education beyond high school. at the current rate, our colleges and universities will be producing an estimated shortfall of at least 11 million workers with postsecondary credentials to fill those jobs. 11 million. for the geeks amongst us that's 4.5% compound annual growth rate

in productivity. here who knows that called for university that as far as to confront its a degree production by four or 4.5% a year? but there's another reason to improve college graduation rates. in this country college education is the key to getting a job earning more being healthier, more active than volunteering and voting. success in college is the dividing line between striving and struggling to achieve the american dream. yet today it is an equitably distribute as occurred in the way we produce as privilege get only 25% of college freshmen born into the bottom half of the income this addition will manage to complete the degree by age 24. almost 90% of their peers board into the top quarter will go on to finish their degree by the time the and frankly, these economic development and equity goals are braided together. we can meet our workforce

development needs in a sustainable way without doing much better with students from low income and historically underserved backgrounds. the good news is that we actually know how to improve success for all students get rich and poor black brown and white. over the past decade the innovations that undersecretary mitchell alluded to we've seen amazing results achieved in part two and for your colleges which are increasing their graduation rates sometimes in double digits. improving the way we deliver development of education, logic and keeping students out of structured degree and potential pathways, using technologies to support great faculty and student advisors so students get a personalized education attacking cost and packaging aid in ways ensures higher ed remains affordable. paying attention to quality in ways to cover in diversity in higher education thanks to our lumina colleagues.

so impressive is the body of evidence that is being built under relatively small number of very high impact practices that there'sdoes not excuse left for colleges is graduation rates persist after even slightly above average. there is no excuse for not going as an industry, as a nation after that 4% compound annual growth rate. we know how to improve graduation rates to meet our workforce development needs and clothes they attend again. the question is in a longer how, it's why not thank you. [applause] >> the ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ >> please welcome jamie merisotis, president and ceo of the lumina foundation.

>> good morning. i'm going to keep key off of dan's excellent remarks end of it but i want to begin first with a different point, which is the fact they cannot or even a reflecting on these issues is probably a pretty strong indicator of april active role that private foundation are now playing in this space. we are well aware that not everyone is terribly accustomed to are comfortable with this rule about higher education. franklyn last reauthorization foundations were not all that engaged. but the reason is that we're seeing the same data and information that everyone else is saying and wish you the same objective that our partners in every sector of have expressed. simply put, we need a more affordable, equitable, high quality postsecondary education system that leads to higher attainment rates, educational attainment rates that will significantly improve our economic and social building as a nation.

i like everything that then had to say about equity and cost and afford the entire development. he's right. we appreciate the leadership our colleagues at the gates foundation have offered in several different areas from simplification to data systems to federal financial aid reform. what i would like to do is offer a few more observations. one of the things that data tells us is higher education system needs more capacity. the need for increasing attainment of the demand for talent is growing ever stronger. the problem is that system we have today just isn't able to surf the number of students we need it to. we needed to find better ways to adapt to serve more students and to serve them better. our conversation about regulation is also needed. regulation plays an essential role in protecting the rights and interests of students who really should be at the center of the system. but the goal shouldn't be about

reducing the burdens on the institution. in fact, institutions should not be at the center of the debate. students shared. the regulation conservation, conversation should be about reducing the barriers because those barriers to innovation are one element of what came in the wake of greater student success. to encourage innovation it will be necessary to focus on three broad areas. the first is creating and expanding transparent pathways to high quality degrees and credentials which includes recognizing a wider array of postsecondary education provided, experimenting with new ways for students to earn credentials and directing federal funds to the providers who serve the students best. next is ensuring that colleges affordable. costs need to be predictable

transparent and align with our attainment goals especially for low-income and underserved populations. student aid should be easily accessed, monitored and able to be used at a wide variety of education providers. third, assuring quality by measuring student learning. through the responsible use of metrics, new and existing validaters must be able to assess educational quality based on student learning. rather than seek time. publicly available information about key indicators of possible protect students and taxpayers against waste, fraud, and abuse. the fact is higher education is at a critical juncture. i've been around several higher educational to for a while now and affect mice of his work on ipv6 higher ed act reauthorization and likely to roll to some degree in every reauthorization since then 92, 98, 2008, you get the idea. in my view, none is as

consequential as this next reauthorization. new technology is in delivery mode, and changing student demographics have created major opportunities as well as challenges for higher education. the new legislation must be a savvy, as varied and forward thinking as the student population it seeks to serve. the stakes are high and will have to move quickly. too many of us it feels like the current law is designed for higher education landscape that is rapidly disappearing. went to higher education act was first passed in 1965, america was the unquestioned world leader in postsecondary education. every year authorization since been we felt that same sense of global leadership. but, you know, now we're not so sure. other nations have passed the u.s. bought. innovation is taking place in ways we didn't anticipate. the world has changed.

to be clear the world is not waiting for us to pass this reauthorization. it's moving ahead of us. technology is moving ahead of us. student needs have moved beyond the acts narrow scope. i higher education act to set a tremendous impact when it was first passed in 1965. it's a critical part of what defines our success as a nation in the second half of the 20th century, but here in the 21st century things are different and we must change to reflect the new reality. so thank you all very much for being here. i'm looking forward to the rest of this rich and productive conversation. [applause] ♪ ♪ ♪ >> senator alexander is on his

way up so he would be about one minute to go take a quick break and we will be on in about a minute. thanks so much ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ >> like many of us, first families take vacation time, and the like presidents and first ladies, a good read can be the perfect companion for your summer journeys. what better book than one that hears inside the personal life of every first lady in american history? first ladies presidential stories on the lives of 45 iconic american women inspiring stories of fascinating women who survive the scrutiny of the white house. a great summertime read available from public affairs as a hardcover or an e-book to your favorite bookstore or online bookseller. spent the house returns today at noon eastern with legislative

business set to begin at 2 p.m. on tuesday the house could take a vote on the trade adjustment assistance bill that members rejected friday. ascended back today at 2 p.m. eastern. at 3 p.m. they resume work on legislation concerning defense program. watch the house live on c-span, the senate live on c-span2. >> after ted mitchell's remarks in health and education committee chair lamar alexander also spoke about the cost of higher education. the "national journal" hosted this event last tuesday at the museum in washington, d.c. this portion is about an hour and 10 minutes. ♪ ♪ >> please welcome to the stage united states senator lamar alexander and welcome back ron

brownstein. [applause] >> well, good morning. i looked over the list of attendees to sit higher education people and it reminded me of my days at the university of tennessee when i was president of that institution and i learned humility very rapidly. on my first day there a faculty member walked up to me and said, oh, mr. alexander, he said welcome to the campus. you seem so excited, you remind me of mark kerr. i said that's a very nice compliment. clark kerr was a distinguished president of the university of california. i said how this back when he

arrived and left the same way inspired with enthusiasm. [laughter] so i respect the job that those of you do. according to georgetown university's anthony carnivale there will be about 5 million jobs short by 2020 people who have the proper postsecondary skills. so what do we do about that? and i think the answer is we have done quite a bit there at the end of world war ii of a 5% of americans had a college degree. 1965 when the higher education act passed for the first time about 10% have a college degree. and today it is 35%. so we have made some progress and many would argue with the best system of colleges and universities the world, at least with more people lined up to go to them from other countries. and i believe that has come

because quite by accident with the g.i. bill for veterans in 1944 that began to give money to students and allow them to choose any institution of their choice. we got lots of choice, lots of competition. 6000 institutions, and that is grid the best system of college and university to think of different ideas from the market place we have with k-12. i would like to mention three things that we could do to improve things, and then i'll sit down with ron and talk about and if you would like. one, clear out the jungle of red tape that is regulating higher education. number two is stop telling students that they can't afford college because most of them can. and then three, four more steps to make college more affordable for students less likely to borrow, more than they showed. on the first point, red tape two years ago for those past --

four of us asked to give state specific revision how to reduce divinatory overburden of colleges. they gave us 59 recommendations. among the things they told us was at vanderbilt university hired a boston consulting group to tell vanderbilt how much they cost the university to comply with federal both in the galatians in one year in 2014. and the answer was $150 million. that's $11,000 per student. some of you know about this. this is called the fafsa. 20 million americans fill this out every year online 180 question. testimony before our committee says that two questions would you. the president can think of 30 questions that we don't need. so we can get it closer to do. we could release an army of

people for helping students fill out forms to help them choose among colleges. and the president of the can because in memphis to what he thinks he loses 1500 students a semester because of the complexity of the four. senator bennet and i and others have something we called the fast act that would make a simpler because it would cut it down to two questions is what would like it to do their costumes to take it in their junior year not their senior year. fill it out in their junior year. we would also simplify the student loan repayment form and do some other things. this report that i mentioned that the university people said every work day, every one of our 6000 higher education institutions get a letter or guidance of a new rule or something from u.s. department of education. every day, every work day. the national academy of sciences as a group that has reported twice that 42% of an

investigative -- investigation of research is spent on administered the test. every government knows the reason to wish this up is that federal mandate aid soaks up dollars that would otherwise go to higher education. getting rid of red tape is one thing we're going to try to do. second thing i said, i said the other day in chattanooga, someone said you never hear that which is that politicians should stop telling students they can't afford college because most of the students can afford college. you never hear that. if you don't live with like to suggest that you think of 40% in three different ways. nearly 40% of undergraduates attended public two-year colleges. another nearly 40% attend public four-year colleges. 40% of all those student that i just mentioned are eligible for a federal pell grants that they don't have to pay back up to $5700. as a result, two years of

college in the united states is free or nearly free for every low-income student in the country. nationally community college tuition and fees averaged $3300 a year the average pell grants averages 30-60 to you. intimacy community college is now free for every student. what about public four-year universities with another 40% to? the average tuition is $9000. we% have a pell grants. university of tennessee almost all have been in state state grant called the hope scholarship 3500 annually for freshmen and sophomores, up to 4500 for juniors and seniors. so it is within reach for most students. what about what expensive colleges? the elite so-called schools, private tuition and fees at private universities about $31,000 per i saw a georgetown

university president the other day. he said this is what they do. they figured out how much a family or student cam afford it. to ask the student to bar up to $4500 a year. to ask the student to work 10 to 15 hours a week and the university pays the rest risk of georgetown-based $100 million a year to help pay $60,000 a year at georgetown. so for many students so-called elite universities are a table. despite all this some people still need money and so you can borrow money. we hear a lot about student loan's, taxpayers generous enough is borrowing for can't be good investment for our students borrowing too much works one way to answer this is to compare student loans to automobile loans. when i was 25 bought my first car, and i had to get a loan. i was outraged the bank made my

father cosines alone because i know assets or no credit rating. it took my car as collateral and senate debate the money back in three years. compare that to student loan today. taxpayers will donate up to 6000 a6000of the year, in addition to the pell grants aikido have to pay back. the credit rating doesn't matter. the interest rate is 4.25% for this year. at a fixed rate. you may pay the loan back using no more than 10% of their disposable income, and if it is not payback after 20 years, it is forgiven. is forgiven. issue student loan a better investment than your auto loan? cars depreciate. this dude and education appreciate. is there too much student loan borrowing? according to the federal reserve the average debt per student who graduates with a four year degree this $27,000, about

exactly the average debt for a car loan in the united states. the total amount of outstanding student loans is 1.2 trillion, a lot of money. the total amount of carlos is 950 billion. i don't hear anyone suggesting that that's too many auto loans. what about the $100,000 loan? that's only 4% of all don't and 95% of those are graduate loans borders, businesspeople, others who have elected to do that. but still the costs are up 9% or so of students are in default on their loved. so what can we do to reduce the cost of college and to make it easier for students not to borrow too much? one can we can change the federal laws to discourage colleges from counseling students about borrowing too much. we make it harder for colleges to do that. number two, law students to use the pell grants year for so they can get fruit baskets and this is my.

simplify the application forms and loan repayment. i described a very generous loan repayment program which most students find it too competent to do. i ran into university president who don't he took nine months trying to pay off is about student loan and get the help with his financial aid officer. require colleges to share in the risk of lending to students. and then clear out the jungle of red tape. so these five steps would help reduce the cost of college. it would help discourage students from borrowing more than they could payback. we should get rid of the red tape as much as we can. and ugly politician ought to stop telling students they can't afford to go to college because most students can. if you look at the amount of student loans and the amount of federal aid that is available even if you borrowed $27,000 to help you get a four year degree which is the average amount, you

are student loan is going to be roughly equal to your auto loan, and your degree is a far better investment for you and for our country. thank you. [applause] >> thank you for joining us. i think my biggest problem is i need to members going senator not governor the. >> i've been called much worse last night. >> let's talk about how the idea and the priorities you laid out they get into the reauthorization of the hea. you laid out cutting regulation, cutting red tape, rethinking the whole affordability question, skin in the game for colleges and universities. how do these rank among your priorities for the reauthorization? what are you looking to achieve? >> first, i would be very -- i

will be working for close with patty murray. i am fortunate she is the ranking democrat on the committee. we were able to do a bill to fix no child left behind after two congresses couldn't do it. it was not just my party come it will be yours as well and will try by september to produce or the committee to consider a draft bill. the priorities that i would like to see included are the jungle of red tape, and we've done a lot of work on this. we asked for this and will be introducing legislation that could be, could be part of the simplifying of the student aid, and six others senators, we call it the fast act. that's a good candidate to be included. but there's a lot of interesting duty with the issue of sexual assault on campus but i met with a group of senators the other day. they will be having a hearing on

that. we've got to do with accreditation. i didn't mention that. but that's a difficult one to figure out. and the challenge will as with all this incredible new stuff heading our way technology, how do you allow for that to make its way into the higher education system. so those are some of the problems. .. so if it worked once, we can try it again.

>> now you also mention the legislation that is a good candidate to be in the overall bill. he also legislation on simplified name the income base plan. do you expect that to be part of it as well? what is the goal? >> that is called a fast act and it has six marks to simplify the formula laid out. the easiest thing to do is to allow us events to feel that out in their junior year of high school. right now you have to fill it out and report your tax information before you file your tax return. and you could do it a year earlier which should give you more time to shop around and do things. we want fewer loans in fewer grants. we are exploring colleges having

some sharing in the risk having some skin in the game and they participate in the student loan program. there are nine different ways to pay your loan back. we will say let's go to to you. you can pay it back over 10 years like a mortgage if you get one now. pay it back over 10 years. or you can pay it back with no more than 10% of disposable in town and it is forgiven after 20 years. >> he talked right now about the idea of energy. what are some of the ways that it could be implemented? >> well, we haven't figured that out yet. senator reid, senator jack reid senator war in and senator durbin have a bill. we mentioned in a white paper we put out that we are looking for ideas. basically it would be a broad

incentive for colleges to counsel students carefully about how much they borrow. the federal law makes it hard. it makes it hard for colleges to do. so we have to be careful with it because of the federal government owns more than 100 billion a year we don't want a perverse incentives that would limit access. we have to be careful. there probably is some way and what appeals to me about it is unlikely gain full employment rule which is an impossible maze of rules, hundreds of pages of rules, is to be a broad mandate with an incentive that apply to all colleges and universities and they can figure out their own ways to deal with it or they don't have to participate in the federal student loan program. tennessee has 13 community colleges. and to her drop it now.

why would they do that? why would you loan a student more money to pay back what they might not be able to pay it back and then run the risk of default that might affect their ability to get pell grants. >> you mention mentioned the skin in the game idea. as for responses and comment, one having to do with an accreditation issue and deregulating new mechanisms. responses you get on that and what is your thinking on that? >> my own thinking is less developed. the creditors themselves arguably just give them more flexibility they can do what needs to be done. maybe that is true. i can tell you what we want to do about student aid.

>> the other white paper buster provides stephen with more information. what kind of reaction do you get him out? the problem you all know this. it's been authorized a time since 1965 which means a new group they stack up on top of each other. i voted against the last reauthorization because of reauthorization because it is already installing the new law would double the stack. what we need is someone to take a bunch of stuff and oppress it into languages students can understand. lots of institutions do it well. the university of texas has a

terrific website where you can find out all sorts of things about what college costs are what job placement is likely to be, where you can make if you do this. they are more likely to do it better than we will. the goal is simplify and make it clear so students and parents can understand what they're getting into. senator franken has mentioned colleges use the word award to meet grant or loan and many people are confused by that. they don't know they have to pay one of them back. he has got a point there. not to be clear that pell grant you can keep. i talked to elizabeth warren a few times when she was at the consumer bureau, she said her goal was a one-page mortgage application because a 22 page

mortgage application doesn't do anything for the consumer because you sign the bottom of the page without knowing what it is and a good clear one pager will help. >> ted mitchell who was here in that chair a few minutes ago said the administration is on track with its own data effort to put out system available later this year. said the department attempt will fall on its face. why do you think? >> i don't think they have the capacity to do it. i used to work there. we have 6000 colleges and universities. why do we care what they think about that? there are facts and figures that consumers can find out about all those in detention and make their own judgment about it.

they are likely to be misleading and difficult to do. i'd rather they go to work on something i asked them to do seven years ago. the department needed to do a simple calendar of every rule a college or university was expected to follow from the department so you can take down their catholic college in minneapolis and say january the fourth has got to do this. january the fifth of got to do this. they've been working seven years. >> when you try to anything through legislation? >> yeah, sure. i think there'll be such an outcry and will just follow no-space. >> what are the opportunities available? appropriations? >> they are taking amendments.

>> the higher education act is a good place to do it. >> you've also been critical of one of the core challenges. they say they are on track to go into effect this summer. will you do anything to block those then why do you object those? >> the reason i object if it is tremendously complicated. it is six, seven, 800 pages. but the risksharing idea to take a broad incentive that would encourage institutions to keep costs down from borrowing more than they should. risksharing is a much better tool and allows institutions to adapt their own methods to it. and it applies to everybody. 9% of students go to for-profit institutions. you've got 91 as some other

institutions. >> if they go ahead will you also try to block those? >> if i can, yeah. >> yesterday they announced forgiveness first event at the printing colleges. >> i thought for the students. these are mostly low income people who have had her. i feel for them. my second feeling is there's one more reason why was a bad idea to make the u.s. department of education a day for students and regulator for their colleges. you hear the department in both rules on both rules on what they've done is setting a precedent that says a student may under some circumstances claim he was glad to not have to pay their long back. that is not good news for taxpayers.

usually if your car is a lebanese to the car company not the bank. that is what is odd about this. here you are suing the tax haters who loaned you the money. if you don't pay your loan back that's who is heard. >> was mentioned elizabeth warren more than i expected from the station date. she's one of a group of democratic legislatures is talking about the idea of debt-free public higher education. students should attend a public institution and emerge debt-free. no specifics yet that a lot of that. is it a feasible goal an appropriate goal? >> public universities. >> that is what i was talking about a minute ago, the top could make students think they can't afford college. two years of college for a

low-income student is already free, ordinarily free. the average pell grant is 30 to 60 in the average tuition is $3300. california, texas florida the pell grant is more than the average tuition. so it's already free. i would like to see politicians -- we have 5 million more to post secondary skills. why do we attract them rather than scare them off. the governor noticed the community college already was essentially free for the 40% of students are 50% that are low income. so he found a way to save the community college is free for every high school graduate. that was such a surprise to students to learn that it was free that many more decide to

go. when we have this talk about you can't go to college because you can't afford it, a lot of people stay home. did you know two years is essentially free if you're one of the 40% of students with low incomes and did you know if you go to georgetown will find out what your family campaign work 10 hours a week as much as you would for a car in georgetown. we don't say that to people and every political season politicians run around saying we will solve your student loan program. i would like you to say we made it easier. it's never easy to pay for college but it is easier than most people think and we have politicians make it harder for them. you don't hear many people say what i'm saying right now. >> we have time for one question if we have anybody at either

microphone or i will ask you a final question. move yourself to the microphone quickly. the chairman has to go to the gavel. >> the name is martha sanders and i'm a student at american university. this is a question for you in the undersecretary here earlier. he mentioned how the department of education is the person that most rely on for information. at the same time also people give us and telephones. the u.s. will earn about $107 billion from financing student loans. is there an effort to make sure the money goes back into investing in our education and future or is this too soon to know? >> there's a difference of opinion about that.

i have mentioned elizabeth warren again because she has one viewer might have another. there are two ways the congressional budget office asks what amounts cost. the proper way to do it a have said is fair market value accounting. it takes into account the risk you might not pay back your loan. 90% are in the fall so that the logical thing to do. if you look at the way i described it the taxpayers subsidize the student loan reform we did in 2013. if you look at it with the way the law says it goes the way elizabeth says. the right way to do it is the way i described it may be revenue neutral, that the money students borrowed from the taxpayers be roughly natural as

we can get it based on the fair market value system. sometimes your senators say they loaned money to banks that 1%. why don't they do that for students? the reason is that federal loan is overnight. you want it for more than one day. typically it is 10 years. what we try to do when we were promised in him and we did this in 2013 when the president was effect to pinpoint aside as we asked the congressional budget office, please tell us what our language would do in making it revenue neutral so that taxpayers are subsidizing the student and we try to come as close to that as we could. >> also underplayed pica authorization. when you expect that? >> i hope it is there before the

end of the month or early next month. that is something for senator mcconnell. then they and where i started and give credit to patty murray being able to work with her on secondary education act has been good. congress has failed for seven years to reenact it. which is bipartisan bills which we suggested we work together and we did that and i think we will be successful. the short answer is by the end of the month or sometime in july. the house will be able to pass on to. he knows what we're doing. he doesn't agree with everything we're doing but we are trying to accommodate suggestions he is made as well. it's a good process. >> chairman alexander, thank you for joining us. >> thank you.

[applause] ♪ itl mac cheryl hyman chancellor city college of chicago. [inaudible] aaron smith, senior strategic investor and cofounder at young invincible and moderator -- [inaudible] >> hi, everyone. can you hear me okay?

it's great to be here today. thank you for coming. we had a great conversation so far and i now have a million questions to ask. we don't have a lot of time and we have a lot to talk about so i found they could dive right in. i wanted to talk with you if that is okay because i think we've been talking a lot about the things that federal legislation in the federal government can do to enable innovation at the college level in another city college of chicago you've been looking over a whole lot of innovation over the past few years. from what i've gathered basically in three years you've been able to double the graduation rate. which is tied very community college. they manage to do that by things that seem like pretty common sense.

organizers making it easier for students to transfer to four-year schools, et cetera. do you think that's anything the federal government can do to encourage the innovation at the college level? >> yes, but i will translate a different way. there's a lot the federal government can and do to hold government institutions available for those types of outcomes. what do i mean by that? there should be more performance-based outcomes tied to funding. i think community colleges and higher educational institutions in the federal government should look at how they measure success and they should not be measured by enrollment which has been the traditional way higher educational institutions particularly community colleges have measured themselves. the starting point should be how many students are completing an employed in their area of study

which is different in many institutions that say 90% of students are employed before they came to you. are they employed? i think i heard the senator talk about the accrediting bodies. they should look at how institutions are credited and employers should be a part of the accrediting process. lastly higher educational institutions have been divorced from the real world for too long and they need to be relevant. their programs need to be relevant in the department of education can support and empower them to become more dynamic institutions that respond to the marketplace and city colleges are very data-driven. we have a five-year plan with measurable outcomes that we hold everybody accountable to. i think it should be c focus.

there needs to be a huge cultural shift in higher education. >> i was scared to muriel howard because he been a state college president yourself and work with state college presidents all the time. do you agree with cheryl bears more accountability accountability with employees in the labor market or is that something more unique to community colleges and the role they play? >> at a state institution of public colleges institutions we've been engaged in accountability and a number of different ways at the state level more and more states are engaged in performance funding for they require colleges and universities to report outcomes. the american association and universities have now over a decade of data because we have 200 campuses that voluntarily

participate in something called the voluntary system of accountability were not only do they put the record out specific demographic data that will help inform students help inform political leaders, community leaders, business leaders about the institution but we also look at some learning outcomes and we have enough data now that we are beginning to not just look at a one-size-fits-all to answer the question but colleges and universities are in the process for dissipating in the system of defining outcomes that look more closely at the curriculum. tying curriculum to the outcomes. that is something we very much support have been quite engaged. i would say when you're trying to match student educational degree experiences at the

four-year level does get different in the sense that you're a liberal arts major perhaps heard in a major in english which can take you into a number of professions whether it's teaching our journalism or the corporate company. they are focused around some of the finances. there may not be a quick track. i was a sociology major and they clearly understood i needed to go on to graduate school with a sociology major if i wanted to hone in with a professional degree area. for cheryl's analogy line thread. some of our stand degree of professions whether engineering or whatever. i think we have to be a little

bit open because the four-year level you move into a lattice or at the intent and allow for the very important majors in the arts and my college was huge in the arts and the students do everything for your wedding ring to fixing or picasso. >> we don't have a ton of time and have a lot of questions. you touch on a few points i want to go back to later in the conversation. one is the value of collect data on outcomes and publicizing it in the factors incredible diversity in the college system in the u.s. i do have a couple of questions about the strategy for using senator legg and investment higher education that we discussed earlier today. new and i talked about a couple days ago the idea of risk

sharing. when i hear that it sounds very bad to me. there's a very concrete strategies to push institutions. to take on the risk. could you walk us through the way the federal government could structure some risk sharing program? >> it is important to start by acknowledging the status quo and the incentive that that. cheryl's' discussion on our campuses inspiring and wonderful. we hear this from campuses around the country. they tend to be islands of excellence and innovation part of the reason is the incentives are not there for your average typical college to focus. the current way we hold colleges accountable as a measure of what percentage of your students to fault in the three-year window after they finish school.

he push people over the three-year window. it's also an increasingly less meaningful measure because student sign-up for other protections. one of the ideas i've been writing about of people discuss is the notion you at the colleges on the hook financially for some amount of the risk of default or lack of loan repayments for lack of a better term. the beauty is that sets up an outcomes-based framework. it is not sort of a top-down innovation by a federal directive. here's what we hold you accountable for. the other is to learn more from successful colleges to organize

for student success. it is literally holding colleges financially responsible for a percentage of the women's unpaid by graduates. >> do you have any thoughts on that? they've been very involved in student loan issues because is there any risk sharing i did that seemed promising to you or does the whole approach did not quite where we should be going? >> we should start by acknowledging the big news in the last couple of days around corinne dance. when we talk about risk sharing her accountability more promptly i hear an example where students lead the charge for accountability and we were happy to see the department of education step in and provide relief. obviously we should preserve

protections around gainful employment. as we think more broadly we very much agree that's an important part of any higher education reform thinking about how schools have some skin in the game. one of the things we like that is not based in the cohort default rate that repayment rates because sometimes default rates can be gained. we think students should repay loans at least if not better than if they had just graduated from high school. we should show some advantage from that. keep in mind the risk is being borne by taxpayers and by our country when we have schools that fail to do their jobs as far as giving kids a decent education. we think we are interested in looking at repayment. any kind of a sharing should take into account tuition but the broader cost of going to

school. which we now are very dramatic. finally and a proposal of risk sharing bush would depend on data to better understand will talk more about it. eliminating the record is important. we shouldn't undermine protections we have. gainful employment, the 9010 will are important protections that we can see are already starting to work. we need something that will also apply to our schools. ..