[inaudible conversations] >> this hearing of the subcommittee is called to order.

>> we have a vote scheduled for 3:00 which is troublesome. we'll see how this goes as far south we have a circumstance when it arises. i would like to thank today's witnesses for participating in this important hearing regarding international soccer governance. i'm not one who generally thinks congress should investigate every scandal in the world of professional sports. nor do i believe the topic we are discussing today will lead to legislation that must be enacted. but as chairman of this subcommittee with jurisdiction over professional sports, i do believe this is a critical issue that deserves the public's attention. by shining a light on the corruption bribery and other criminal activity that has been a part of international soccer for far too long, my hope is that the american people current and future sponsors, and media companies that support the game today will better understand the consequences of allowing the organization governing soccer to continue without reform, including the

tragic loss of life. according to some reports, as many 4000 migrant workers will die before the first ball is kicked at the 2022 world cup in qatar. that is appalling and unacceptable. soccer is by far the most popular sport in the world. it is truly a global institution that connects humanity across language culture and continent. soccer is attracting a wider audience by the day right here in the united states. one must look no further than the excitement surrounding the u.s. women's national team winning the 2015 women's world cup last week to see the impact soccer has on our lives. along with this excitement comes billions of dollars in annual revenue from tv contracts sponsorships and endorsements. that's why the revelations of bribery, corruption and mismanagement at fifa and concacaf are so troubling.

i'm even more disturbed by the reports of migrant workers losing their lives in preparation for the world's biggest soccer tournament, the world cup. in fact bribery, corruption and criminal activity within international soccer is so serious that on may 27, 2015 the u.s. department of justice unsealed a 47-count indictment against nine fifa officials and five corporate executives charging the defendants with racketeering bribery, wire fraud and money laundering. four other individuals and two corporate defendants have also pled guilty to various charges. and swiss investigators are now investigating 81 suspicious activities related to money laundering in connection with the 2018 and 2022 world cup bids. this culture of corruption must be addressed. with the announcement that fifa

president blatter plans to step down, we're at a crossroads for the future of soccer. now is the time for the united states and u.s. soccer a federation to engage and determine how we can encourage meaningful reforms as well as elect a leader at fifa who will spearhead long overdue changes within the organization. the goal of this hearing is to have a serious and meaningful conversation about how to address fifa's culture of corruption, the united states' participation in the organization, and the human rights violations stemming from the organization's lapses in integrity. without evidence that reforms are being implemented, we must examine our country's own participation in fifa and how we can restore integrity to the world of soccer. we cannot turn a blind eye to this issue any longer especially when human lives are on the line. i know would like to turn to the ranking member, senator blumenthal, for his opening

statement. senator blumenthal. >> thanks mr. chabot. and i want to thank you for having this hearing and our witnesses being here. i also want to thank the department of justice for its vigorous and propelling significant investigation, and i want to note that soccer is a growing and important sport in the united states. we can all take pride and enjoyment from again, most especially from the wonderful and convincing win last month but our world champion women's team. and i want to congratulate them and saying very bluntly that the corruption uncovered and world soccer is a disservice to the game. it is a disrespect to them. it betrays the trust of

countless men and women, many of them young people, just beginning in this sport who have a right to expect better from the leaders of this sport. the fact of the matter is that what has been revealed so far is a mafia style crime syndicate in charge of this sport. my only hesitation in using that term is that it is almost insulting to the mafia. because the mafia would never have been so blatant, overt and arrogant in its corruption. the simple fact is that this indictment, more than 100 pages long, shows a crime organization, a racketeering conspiracy. it has an organizational chart

that shows how it was run. and the question is who knew about this criminal wrongdoing when did they know it and what did they know why did they not act more quickly? and those are the questions that u.s. soccer federation have to answer today. these are classic questions involving any racketeering conspiracy investigation that's why there is, in fact, an ongoing criminal investigation. we know some of the individuals who were responsible and should be held accountable. at least one other principles has pleaded guilty already and others may be cooperating. but the facts show that there had to be either willful

ignorance or blatant incompetence on the part of many of the members of this organization. and that's true of u.s. soccer as well. they are to have known about it. i'm not sure which is worse. the recent success of our professional women's soccer team should remind us and all of americans, that fifa the international organization responsible for regulating and promoting soccer, has engaged in this willful and prolonged disgracefully disrupt conduct, including wire fraud, money-laundering, and racketeering practices spanning more than two decades. many of these crimes were committed in the united states, which is especially troubling.

i am saddened by the fact that these corrupt practices over many years have deprived american national teams come our youth leagues and million of american soccer fans of the full value and integrity of the game they love. the action of fifa's officials have undermined the very sport this organization was established to serve. and this hearing is an opportunity for us not only to ask these questions about who knew what when and why they did knew anything about, but also to lay the groundwork for reform. just as sports scandals in the past have led to fundamental far-reaching overhauls in the way those sports are organized and conducted. i want to know what reform to the u.s. soccer federation plans to introduce to us to greater

transparency and accountability in the governance osaka in america. not whether, but what and when. because clearly there is an urgent and immediate need for such reform. but also believe that america's national soccer federation has the serious questions to answer. and i think it has ended up not only at this hearing but for its fans around this country. clearly we can do longer indulge the idea of fifa, a multibillion-dollar nonprofit global enterprise being run behind closed doors. that is a recipe for disaster and moral catastrophe. only reforms that installed greater transparency and accountability can should the necessary sunlight required to this impact this corrupt organization.

one proposal is, in fact, to reorganize it as a public corporation or some part of it as a public corporation. i am proud that the united states has led the world in ringing the scandals to light and holding individuals responsible. but that job is far from over. there needs to be additional action, and it should involve not only members of the public and public officials, but also let me emphasize, the private corporation that sponsor these events. corporate organizations that sponsor international soccer like mcdonald's, nike, coca-cola and visa play their part by ensuring that they stand as guardians of good governance. they must do so rather than

silence who benefit from opec governance. and at least one of those corporations is mentioned without naming any indictment. as my colleague, senator moran come has just mentioned, these actions have real-life consequences not only financially but in potential the commission against women in the game and potential physical harm to the workers who may have been involved and may be involved in other countries where major physical construction involved human trafficking and human rights abuse, and worse. the international community must collectively work to ensure that human rights are upheld were ever our athletes compete. the betrayal of trust is no less

winning human trafficking is involved in building the stadium where our athletes compete. it's a betrayal of trust on the part of those organizations that sponsor the game and it implicates the entire sport. we should not tolerate the world's most preeminent sporting competition being staged at the expense of our most vulnerable citizens. today's hearing is a first step, and i want to thank all of you for being here today. i look forward to your testimony and restoring the trust of american fans. trust which has been betrayed but which we certainly deserve. 90 mr. chairman. >> i thank the ranking member. our panel today for this hearing is consists of four witnesses mr. dan flynn, ceo secretary-general of the u.s. soccer federation. that is the united states represented of fifa and concacaf. mr. michael hershman,

mr. hershman is the president and ceo of the fairfax group, member of fifa indiana's conference committee. mr. sunjeev bery advocacy director for the middle east and north africa, amnesty international your cable testified about findings of may 2015 amnesty international report regarding working conditions and finally mr. andrew jennings who it was traveled perhaps the furthest to join us. he is an investigative writer and filmmaker, credited with blowing the cover on the fifa scandal. mr. flynn, please testify. >> thank you senator. our behalf of united states soccer federation i would like to thank senator moran, senator blumenthal, senator blunt, senator mccaskill and other members of this subcommittee for giving your soccer the opportunity to appear today and into question you may have. our behalf of our women's national team would like to also thank president and mrs. obama,

vice president and dr. biden, distinguished members of this subcommittee, justin and house colleagues at the millions of fans and the united states including the largest television audience ever to watch a soccer match in this country who supported and cheered this wonderful group of women to the women's world cup title just 10 days ago. i am daniel flynn and dai bingguo soccer chief executive officer and secretary-general for the last 15 years and i'm ultimately responsible for the day-to-day operations of the federation. we are a nonprofit membership organization recognized by the u.s. olympic committee as a national governing body for soccer invite fifa, the world governing body for sport of soccer as its national association member for the united states. as required by fifa we are also a member of concacaf, the regional confederation which covers north and central america and caribbean nations. for more than one of you just soccer submission -- a

preeminent sporting the united states and to continue the growth and development of his sport at all levels. u.s. soccer directly fields 17 national teams including the women's national team which has won three world cup titles and four olympic gold medals. and the men's national team which is in the process of defending its 2013 concacaf gold cup title. would also the of the national paralympic team. u.s. soccer is made up of various members, organizations including among others our professional leagues, the adult amateur league am soccer organizations for disabled athletes and the youth amateur organizations. u.s. soccer is governed by a 15 person volunteer board of directors elected by its members which include independent directors, athlete representatives, and directors representing different segments of our membership. our annual tax returns

financial statements business plans, by law, board of directors meeting minutes are all publicly available on our website. in fifa we are one of 209 national association members. fifa members must vote in any substantial changes to the organization, and a vote of every member regardless of the size, the number of players on the quality of their national teams counts the same. until two years ago when our president was elected to the fifa executive committee the federation did not have a direct represented on that important policymaking body. although our role and influence in fifa has historically been limited, the federation has been a strong advocate for reforming the organization by among other things improving governance increasing transparency and strengthening ethics rules. u.s. soccer supported fifa decision 2011 to engage experts to conduct its governance

structure and to urge the adoption of reform after the commission report was released. u.s. soccer supported the investigation by the fifa committee for the 2018 and 2022 world cups and publicly advocated for the release of the full investigative report, not just a summary report released by fifa last fall. u.s. soccer was one of the national associations with the dominant -- and publicly supported these challenges are long-standing precedent, in a recent election. we did so not within the political potential political risk including the potential impact on our possible bid to host the 2026 world of men's cup.

in light of his stated intention to resign. the new president to lead this reform we understand that many traditional soccer powers also believe it is time for a change. u.s. soccer will continue to work with like-minded national association and confederations to promote change and to alter the culture at fifa. at concacaf efforts of reform have proceeded more rapidly. in light of the recent events transit support a three-person special committee which includes u.s. soccer's presence to help guide the confederation through this period of turmoil. and over the july 4 weekend concacaf executive committee based on the recommendations of the special committee unanimously approved a series of sweeping reforms to address governance, fraud prevention and compliance and transparency. thank you for your time and i look forward to responding to specific questions you may have on this or other subjects.

>> mr. hershman. >> good afternoon, chairman moran, ranking member blumenthal and members of the subcommittee. thank you for this opportunity to appear before you today alongside such an esteemed colleagues in the field of transparency and integrity in the global world of sports their time honored to speak on an issue that has been a passion and driving force throughout my career, including having served for two years on end and commerce committee of fifa come into scope out of of conspiracy international, the world's leading ngo on issues relating to transparency and accountability. additionally, i am currently spearheading and integrity project as an advisory board member for the international center for sport security. as senator moran have stated before, soccer is by far the most popular sport in the world and it is attracting a wider audience by the date in the

united states. however, the upper echelon of the sport's governing body has been notoriously corrupt for many years. until the laudable recent efforts of the justice department and the fbi many allegations were mostly swept under the rug. now the fifa lack of transparency and accountability has been brought into the global public attention, there's a tremendous opportunity to discuss the inherent autonomy and sporting organizations. sports organizations have long maintained that autonomy is essential to the preservation of the values embedded in sport. this is a difficult concept to argue with. that is until the core values of sport are undermined by a lack of accountability and trust, which we've seen recently in one of the world's largest most profitable sporting bodies fifa. the growing commercial interest have played the protections many government offers large sporting

positions and the rapidly sports gambling industry, both legal and illegal, are all converging to create a situation where self-regulation is increasingly challenging. sports industry must put in place a governance and compliance standards which demonstrates best practices in transparency and accountability. fifa is a big business with revenue of about $5.6 billion every for your world cup cycle. fifa had a chance to be a leader in reform when the scandals first began popping up about 10 years ago. despite multiple chances to change after being presented with reform proposals by transparency international as was her own independent governance committee fifa held to the irresponsible notion that it was autonomous and did not have to adhere to outside oversight or interference.

u.s. public cannot assume that fifa is the only sporting body with endemic structural problems. every single governing body in the sports world, from the international olympic committee to the icc, to the nfl needs to agree to modern standards of transparency and accountability. while many people around the world hold sport as sacred it has become an incredibly profitable industry that needs to be regulated and treated for what it is big business. these recent events are bigger than fifa. they require coordinated global action across all sporting bodies. i believe there is a way we can achieve this with the cooperation and support from governments and sport industry leaders around the world. the international center for sports security which is also a nonprofit organization has borne the idea of the sports industry transparency initiative.

i served on the board of advisors and we have established a set of global standards which would be voluntarily adopted by sports organizations. thisthis collective action agreement will form a governing group that would work with the sports community to promote transparency and accountability while strengthening a higher standard of ethics and values in sports. these standards would finally create a benchmark to evaluate the effectiveness and efficiency of sports governance and compliance programs are that standard would include but not be limited to professioprofessio nalizing boards of directors in sports, managing conflict of interest building a democratic foundation embracing transparency and accountability leveling the playing field for athletes, men and women, motivating ethical behavior for staff and volunteers, engaging with key stakeholders, showcasing sport event

integrity. consider the positive role of sport in society and establishing effective risk controls. this approach will be comprehensive and far-reaching. while every principle does not apply to all sports organizations there is enough common ground to ensure that sports groups understand what is expected of them in terms of integrity and transparency. as attorney general loretta lynch so rightly pointed out in her speech after announcing that fifa charges many of individuals and organizations we will describe today were entrusted with keeping soccer open and accessible to all. they help important responsibilities at every level. from building soccer fields were children in developing countries to organizing the world cup they were expected to uphold the rules that keep soccer honest, and protect the integrity of the game. instead they corrupted the business of worldwide soccer to serve their interests enriched

themselves. mr. chairman, thank you. i look forward to answering your question and those of the committee members. >> mr. bery, welcome and we welcome your testimony. >> chairman moran speed you need to turn on your microphone, please. >> chairman moran ranking member blumenthal senator gardner, senator daines, distinguished guests. on behalf of amnesty international thank you for the opportunity to address the issue of human rights in qatar. the 2022 fifa world cup is brought into global focus the shocking conditions that are routine for migrant workers in qatar. under the sponsorship of system for migrant workers cannot change employers only qatar without permission of the current employer. even if an employer is not being employed, the employer can still block the employee from changing jobs or leaving the country. in 2012 the qatar national research fund funded a survey of some 1000 low income labor migrants.

90% said their employers possessed the passports, violation of poorly enforced qatar law. 20% said their salary was different than the salary they've been promised prior to leaving their home country. 21% said they sometimes rarely or never received their salary on time. as documented by researchers, is the most extreme examples, for migrant workers in qatar have become suicidal as been trapped without paid by them was bigger than forced to depend on charity from others simply to eat. their family members in poor communities in the country of origin can face eviction and other series of challenges is a family member is trapped in qatar and not being paid for work they have done. you are an astounding more than 1.5 billion foreign nationals working in qatar today, well over 90% of the total workforce qatar consists of foreign nationals. these numbers increase at a dramatic rate with qatar's population grew by 43% since the country was awarded the world

cup in december 2010. this is occurring in the context of a massive construction boom in the country to the government is spending spending hundreds of noise about a massive infrastructure development program. this new construction goes well beyond seas to many of these construction projects are not sold for the world cup but remain central to the success of this sporting event and the overlapping effort to make qatar the global destination tourism and commerce. the problems faced by foreign migrant workers government restrictions placed by the system. foreign migrant workers are forbidden from forming or joining trade unions. while qatar doesn't labor laws which should offer some protection for workers comp these are not enforced effectively. to make matters worse, thousands of migrant workers in domestic service roles are excluded from the protections set out under quarterbacks poorly enforced labor law. men and women working in

households are exposed to even greater labor exploitation and abuse, including sexual violence. despite repeated announcements to the contrary the government of qatar has failed to address the problem of of labor exploitation the inmate was working the qatar government promised limited reforms to this exploitation of migrant workers. one year later none of these reforms have been implemented. and 2014 amnesty international identified nine key issues that qatar should address urgently. one year later nothing has changed in four of the most critical areas of abuse. only limited action is been taken in the remaining five areas, which do not address the font of the structural factors that facilitate abuse in qatar. the ultimate responsibility for the rights of workers in qatar remain with the authority. but when fifa awarded the world cup to qatar it assumed responsibility for the human rights impact of the decision. unfortunately, fifa's efforts

have fallen short of the concrete action needed to ensure that the world cup is not based on labor exploitation. in my written testimony i've outlined specific solutions to the problem of labor exploitation previous solution should implemented by the government of qatar, fifa companies in the construction sector and countries that migrant workers are from. united states can help in specific ways. for the government of qatar the solution is to fix its deeply flawed sponsorship system address the other problem i have highlighted today. for fifa it is not enough for the organization's official system except the verbal commitments of the government of qatar. fifa within a strong public message to the authorities and the construction sector that human rights must be respected in all world cup related construction projects. and fifa must put in place effective systems to monitor and report on this. this includes not only stadiums and training facilities but hotels transportation projects and other infrastructure.

if reforms are not put in place urgently the facilities for the 2020 world cup will carry the permanent stain of forced labor and human suffering on behalf of amnesty international and given the opportunity to testify today today. >> mr. jennings, welcome and we welcome your testimony. >> chairman moran, ranking member blumenthal -- >> turn on your microphone. >> i did testify here -- you have come a long way. we want to do. >> i testified in front of john mccain back in 1999. this is all changed since then i would like to join with everybody else in honoring america's soccer players and a gracious way they and the other 23 teams conducted themselves in the women's world cup. this contrasts happened with the massive, massive efficiencies of the u.s. soccer federation. frightened to upset president blatter's crop revival and join

the elite lifestyle that he provides. we are here to discuss how american soccer relates to fifa. kind of the absence of the fifa delicate. that's one crucial question today. where are they? where is he? he is a man who takes american values supposedly to fifa into concacaf and he is not here to talk about it. it rather undermines the whole process i think. anyway, i'm an investigative reporter. i write books, present documentaries to the bbc. i work with us to get 60 minutes and with hbo's real sports are i also reported from war zones in beirut chechnya and central america. i am not a sports reporter. send me to a matter that i might get the score wrong. it's not what i do. i'm very proud of being the only reporter in the world and by mr. blatter because of my disclosures of this corruption over the last 13 years.

before stumbling on the fifa lowlifes i had experienced of organized crime filming nose to nose with the mafia. seizing and holding power masses saving judgment outputting to public authorities and hiding their criminality behind the world's most popular game. after seven years of probing these sleaze bags, i was invited to meet fbi special agents in london. their business card said organized crime. i wasn't alone anymore. berea people had arrived. in august 2011 i gave him financial and other documents about america, that america's place at it from the fans and the public. and by the way, you don't a moment ago about not having

mr. flynn, it represented a fifa. chuck was there since 1990 that you were represented. who represented you. of new york u.s. soccer was have happy to represent american values. i think i hope we can get back to the. chuck had hidden all this financial information from the fans come of the public. my source of income from the archives of concacaf because you are the recent body of 35 football nation including the u.s.a. they were circulated privately toward executive committee members of concacaf including u.s. soccer who also suppressed in the u.s. soccer had to know that blazer and is filed approach jack warner from trinidad, fighting expedition at the moment with the approval of bladder or recruiting football integrating rifle taxes but they looked away. i've got a long list. time to go into the of the phoenix of u.s. soccer with

concacaf and with blackjack. i be happy to present it to any of you and discuss it later. now, if america's soccer leaders have taken action when they should have done, blazer and warner would have been in jail. blackguard seek asylum in some bob litt at the 2022 world cup been posted by the u.s. a. not some graveyard in the gulf. it to the fbi and irs a few weeks to check out the information that i gave them. they arrested chuck blazer. he turned informant and fifa has imploded. fifa is now a smelly shell. that's all. has no credibility. we don't want to know what. nobody wants to know. once upon a time fifa officials walk down the street with a fifa blazer from the local. i am from fifa. i am important. who would do that now? who would dare do that now? none of them, and that's how we

see fifa do. i don't believe this nonsense about his going to what his words -- i put dominated by will pick it up again. his hitmen are working to eliminate rivals. he is hampered ethics committee. i'm overtime. two of the his instruction. his pr operation briefed the wire services that he is innocent, but this international sports leader can only travel to russia in states which would. that's not an international leader. what america can do is engage with clean and decent proper associations around the world create a new organization based on benevolent and invite sponsors and tv networks to go with it. i get see coca-cola, mcdonald's and these are preferring the remnants of blacks organized crime family. there's one other crucial thing the u.s. soccer should do. some of you may remember, when

the u.s. olympic committee was in disarray over the salt lake scandal, 16 years ago, they called it senator george mitchell and others to investigate where they had gone wrong with the i see. and make recommendations to reform. external respected, nonpartisan and respected organizations. this committee set up a similar independent committee to find out what on earth has gone so badly wrong with what's being covered. also used soccer can do what your government does which is put everything online. and then this new we organized organize reinvigorated u.s. soccer could really say to the world from look we are saying we can do. it is full wide open, join with us. next monday the absence of mr. galassi who i think is treating you with contempt

cottage industry u.s. soccer can admit and women from the moms and dads comp the people around the line the whole sport with contempt when he can't come here and defend u.s. soccer activities in concacaf. so he's going to zurich next week for private meeting was left of the lives of -- and urge them to oppose will urge him to today e-mail blazer and say when i get dessert i bought all your pashtun zurich. coordinate everything he pages of the perch, your bonuses your burkeans. i want on the desk that because he is not there. i'm coming home, i'm going to help america kickstart reform. that's what you cut it as a country to get some incredibly back internationally. thank you. >> thank you, mr. jennings. let me start with mr. flynn in asking this question. you heard mr. jennings just said that u.s. soccer had to know.

so the question is what did u.s. soccer know, what should you have known? and in particular with the indictments that alleged racketeering bribery, wire fraud, money laundering what's the reaction of u.s. soccer federation to that the charges at fifa, executives and board members, and also how is what does u.s. soccer federation know about concacaf in similar circumstances? its perceived it is the most corrupt of the very regional associations. what does u.s. soccer federation's no? >> thank you senator. i knew nothing about any corruption -- >> let me interrupt one moment. when you said you knew nothing, you speak just for you personally? >> i will say i or anybody that

i've worked with has not got anything to my attention, cold hard facts regarding corruption within fifa or concacaf. >> that being said there's a couple of things i would like to point out in terms of -- >> mr. blazer has not been involved with u.s. soccer since 1986. he has been a member of concacaf and fifa but not u.s. soccer since 1986. in terms of mr. blatter and mr. warner's activities, i'd like to point out that those were private, individual, secret transactions that, with the full resources of the department of justice and the fbi took four years to bring to light. we are a soccer organization with our greatest focus on developing all aspects of our sport in this country.

so i wanted to point out that those private transactions also were for regional sponsorship and regional broadcast rights. that has nothing to do with u.s. soccer and our rights and our tv and our sponsorship it's i think it's an important point of distinction i'd like to make. >> let me ask a follow-up question been today. so in the is department of justice, u.s. attorney's office announced indictments, you and your colleagues of u.s. soccer federation would be surprised that it would be some activity occurring at fifa or concacaf that would result in indictments indictments? that would be a surprise to you? >> i was not aware of any part of that investigation of the department of justice. >> but the fact that someone was indicted surprises you? >> i just wasn't involved. and my focus and that of my

day-to-day focus is to stay focused on the domestic side of our business. so i just didn't have any knowledge nor did anybody i work with have any knowledge of it. >> let me try something together because may be confused as to why we are having a hearing that involves mr. bery, for example. my question threats to you mr. bery, but others as well we for mr. bery's testimony about the conditions involving the preparation for the 2022 soccer world cup. what's the relationship between the testimony that we are hearing, mr. bery, about corruption, bribery racketeering criminal activity related to fifa, and the findings that your organization has made in regard to what's going on in preparation for the world cup? is our hearing, on these two

contrasting kinds of stories that don't belong together, or the intimately tied to each other? >> take you for the question. at the end of the day when fifa made the decision to grant the bid for the 2022 world cup to occur in qatar it took responsibly for the human rights impact of that decision. >> how can you say that? >> because they fasten international organization with a billion dollars plus in reserves that has the responsibility under u.n. principles to ensure that its operations do not turn a blind eye to or directly involved serious human rights abuses. it's pretty clear at human rights abuses and labor exploitation are rampant in qatar today. not only that but amnesty international's latest report shows the cover of qatar has refused to do anything serious about the basic labor exploitation but the question remains as to why it was that fifa provided, why wasn't that fifa did not go more deeply into

these questions of labor exploitation in the process. fifa has said at this point in time that in 2026 for the 2026 process they going to incorporate human rights concerns. but why has it taken until 2026 process for these questions to be raised? >> mr. jennings, let me ask you come is the relationship between what you describe in your testimony and the testimony and mr. bery has describing conditions leading up to the preparation of 2020? how do they relate speak with take a step back. u.s. soccer has its failings, so do the leaders of english soccer. they should have known better than to ever bid for the world cup because we all know in the business that you have to pay to play. i don't think the u.s. plays ash on should english to pick you don't get a raise or your bride off the plane. let's bear that in mind. it was a dirty decision to put a world cup on a strip of sand that was boiling, people were

dying if it was a summer tournament. fifa new and have to wonder why certain people despite that fifa voted for the world cup to go the. it got worse. what blatter called stakeholders to malmo to get to november, december of the world cup year. if you want to die young come to england and stand outside manchester city manchester united, all the big clubs. say hey we're going to stop yapping football for several weeks because of jack warner took the money. i hope it is a painless death. you can't walk into somebody else's sports culture and just take it away but that's what blatter is doing now. and he was questioning him? i don't see any of the officials from u.s. soccer saying no, no, no. we are friends with english and

the germans and the dutch and all the other western european federations. they will have to stop the game because of the dirty slime bags at fifa. that's the background to it. the money went in from somewhere. i'm not saying what went in as long as the investigation is still going on but it went in on the lowlifes, the executive committees voted come into it with the death of migrant workers. and i would just say one other thing. we have a saying in european football. with officials, administrators can't remember what happened i don't know, i wasn't there, i can remember we say oh yeah when they were younger they must have been hit in head with that football too many times. jack warner's ticket racquets go back to public knowledge back to 2002, getting 2006 getting 2010. richly documented. racketeering was a way of life

for concacaf but apparently that is never reached the chicago offices and u.s. soccer federation which -- >> let me turn to senator blumenthal. >> thank you, mr. chairman. mr. flynn, i appreciate you being here today. i do think it's your testimony that you have no knowledge about this corruption before may of this year when the department of justice issued its indictment is that correct? you had no knowledge speak with that is correct. >> did you have suspicions? >> there were moments i would describe if i had a level of discomfort, i would not participate and i would just get myself out of any situation that offered any level of discomfort to me. >> so there was evidence that cause you to remove yourself from discussions or meetings speakers i wouldn't say evidence. i think it was the comfort level

level. >> whenwinter that lack of comfort level begin? >> -- when did it -- i couldn't pin point any particular time. >> years before the indictment, correct? >> i wouldn't necessarily say years but it would be hard to pin point the time. >> months? >> i think would be fair to say greater than months, but once again to be hard to pin point the exact time frames. >> you make any effort to investigate? >> there is if there were colfax i would bother to the attention to the appropriate people. there was nothing in the way of any facts that i could take to anybody else and obviously would consult for outside counsel, but that's as far as i would take because it was something that as i said it was a discomfort level. >> but you made the effort to investigate, and your outside

counsel did not tell you to investigate? >> no, i just passed along my level of discomfort. >> would you agree in retrospect that u.s. soccer acted inadequately to investigate or prevent or stop ongoing blatant criminal wrongdoing at fifa? >> i wouldn't describe i wouldn't say that we would do it differently. what our focus has been is trying, we really have two choices. we are one of 209 national associations, and we have really at the end of the day find a way to participate. one of the ways to do that is starting in 2013 when somebody on that fifa that was with u.s. soccer. that was a star in terms of

getting a louder voice at a seat at the table. >> let me interrupt because i think what you are stating is fairly well-known history. and want to ask about what officials at the u.s. soccer came to learn and very bluntly why those officials did so little until the department of justice indicted chuck blazer and others who have long-standing ties to u.s. soccer, and particularly in light of the lack of comfort level that you had. in retrospect what is the explanation? >> i didn't, well -- [inaudible

conversations] i was aware of some of discomfort but it was all i think in general, a general feeling. so had no hard evidence come and we want to continue to participate and try to influence the organization of one of 209 members. the second choice we have is to opt out and to pull out. and with that comes a series of ramifications. we no longer have a seat at the table. we no longer are involved in the competitions, olympics, world cups, any competition for our youth teams our paralympic teams. and it has far ranging ramifications for u.s. soccer and soccer. the business model of soccer in our country which we have

through ownership of our professional ranks in all three divisions invested hundreds of millions of dollars, if not billions of dollars, building the sport over the last 20 years so we can continue to build and we can compete on the field in such a manner that would just accomplish on the women's side. >> i understand those two options but wasn't very third which is to begin asking questions, begin an inquiry began shining a light, began blowing the whistle, began essentially holding accountable visuals who might be guilty come and we now know they are wire fraud, conspiracy, money laundering, bribery, that directly impacted the quality and integrity of the sport that you are responsible for upholding? >> we did support the 2011

ethics committee as i mentioned in my opening remarks. we push for full disclosure of the full report. as i said we front and center were 16 nations that nominated prince ali to run against long-standing mr. blatter. great peril for the chance of hosting 2006 and having a seat we continued to give but that is a proper course of action to reform fifa. >> i want to make clear, mr. flynn, that my comments are directed against the collective you, not you personally executive officers, the board members, the organization u.s. soccer federation and i want to ask you as a matter of fact why

he declined the invitation to be here today? >> when the notice came appearing, we anticipated rather broad and specific questions potentially, it was determined with outside counsel that i would appear before the senate subcommittee hearing. >> what's the reason that mr. july they didn't? >> i think it was a comfort level that i had more knowledge of the day-to-day operations and events, questions related to that. >> don't you think he has an obligation to answer the questions that we've been directing to you? >> i would answer if you're not comfortable with my answer can we be more than happy to respond in writing to step anything directly related speed will you commit that mr. gulati will answer these questions because i will certainly give my best to do that yes, sir.

>> just a couple more questions. what is mr. blatter's continued rule in fifa? >> to the best of my understanding, there is a special meeting the 20th and 21st next monday and tuesday from that they had to do a four-month notice to move forward and to be a new election for a president. speed will u.s. soccer take the position that he will be in effect excluded from fifa? >> opposition i think was pretty clear when we in the last election dominate and supported prince ali. i don't know who the candidates are. i don't think anybody does yet rest assured we will look at all of the candidates and the platform from human rights to corruption to reform before we make our decision. >> one last question. don't you believe now that u.s. soccer has a responsibility to

do more if silence in my view have been deafening and in respect to expose the wrongdoing and condemn it? >> i'd like to address common answer your question. i think everyone prime example of what we have done is the recent reform of concacaf. those with sweeping reforms from independent directors to greater transparency. we think that is a footprint that would like to bring forward to fifa. recognizing that we are one of 25, an executive committee and one of 209 nation's within the fifa organization itself. we pride ourselves in our leadership. we also understand at times and limited capacity that we have for reform. spent my time is long expired and i'm hopeful we have another

round. >> how many years have you served as either ceo or secretary-general of u.s. soccer? >> roughly 15 years. >> i understand mr. blazer, indictments, mr. blazer and 14 others, is that correct? >> i couldn't be the exact number. number. >> more than 10. you mentioned the cold hard facts, not having cold hard facts at a time having discomfort the in your 15 year career, we will get to the happy part about what happened to women's soccer, congratulations by the way. tremendous accomplishment. >> thank you. >> but regarding the discomfort that you felt at times i would

like to step back because perhaps there was a line crossed. if you look at what indictments read, bribery, racketeering and so forth. >> the discomfort was in generalities there i will tell you in terms of home mr. warner, 141 nations converted by clinicians in concacaf, how he ran a meeting. ..

>> generally speaking, and falls into the two surest equation framework. trying to participate, one of the key things we do as an old base hosts the qualifying rounds. we have to at times balance that with the potential of the opt-out and with mr. blaser i felt we had other things to do that could help older sport as well and there was some concern if i brought it to his attention and may feel some level of discomfort in a different way.

>> did you see other peers six discomfort in other ways when you try to confront mr. blaser? >> it would be hard to characterize it that way. if we've reached out and when we reached out to talk to other national association, other federation, once again where one of 35 voting members and there really wasn't anybody else that had the same feeling that i did on a personal level or that we did as an organization. we operate as best we could within the framework. we are by virtue of being a member of fifa. we have to find a way to participate, work our way through and fortunate enough 18