level, if we all collectively were to contribute to the turning around of that fervor in europe to clinch this deal, should we all go to berlin, vienna and paris to do that or should we had to brussels? .. >>

>> so you need to do both but it would be a big mistake not to also go to the biggest capital but commands the most respect. >> i think the capitals are of importance right now i think the commission wants to get this agreement when they get bogged down to solve the problems and that is how it works but being a leader since the very beginning, that is the angela merkel project to have 40 percent of gdp from trade. but the thing i would caution it is very hard for

american institutions to argue in berlin because those arguments that are made are very much american in the nsa with the increase of the migration a rack to dig up of remarks about the iraq war and to we need to be careful of american institutions to go over a and a lobby this is what they said to look to the european companies to take on a major role in the european debate to. but in each of those is a little bit different.

>> that reminds me with the debate of trade promotion and authority as a great - - as activist got together as a hot air balloon and followed ron wyden everywhere telling them not to the the progressive agenda and i think that is where that targeting comes from the most likelihood of success at the highest level of influence. we have time for one more question. >> i note that the program

description talks about the cybersecurity issues is that a particular topic since that is spoken about among various panels? >> can he do anything about cybersecurity? >> this is a different related angle with a certain digital economy. we'll get the idea to have new rules. and a lot of the clashes are in that area. if you look if a company has to have a server localized those are really big issues that have to do with the actions of private actors of those are crucial.

>> if you look to say where would it be important or where could you see that? i don't know the specifics of questions of cybersecurity but there isn't that eagerness so it strikes me as the area of opportunity. >> we have assigned an umbrella agreement of sharing among law enforcement with a judicial passage i would hate to see something than that is mired

in to these arrangements at a critical time and i do agree once we get the initial set we will find more things as cybersecurity comes forward as one of those elements but we're better off to focus on the a other things. >> cybersecurity with financial regulations is to new. is too much going on policy rate -- wise to always have trade negotiators come up

with rules for the future so we could do the letters of. we can wrap up with that question and then i believe we're taking a break so feel free to head out and get refreshments. [applause] [inaudible conversations]

>> web camera images and chat sessions are under

executive order would of our big partners the government communications and headquarters the files reference a program for the offer through web cam is it in bulk during one part to collect visual data from 8 million users it turns out humidity is a problem there -- nudity is a problem there tried to keep agents to look at the photographs they are finding it hard to filter out the new pictures. [laughter] text messages are not immune the nsa collected almost 200 million text messages per day globally for social networks and credit card details. let me be clear this this

collected on individuals who are not suspected of any illegal activity >> in 1830 dread scott was enslaved to dr. emerson during his enlistment he was assigned to duties and he married period robertson and when he died he tried to buy his really is freedom but she refused and he sued. fall the case with our new series landmark cases with our special guest martha jones legal history professor from university of michigan law school that will explore the historic ruling revealing a life and times landmark cases to be

sure to join the conversations and ordered the companion book $8.85 plus shipping.

>> much of the physical and the structure is in the era of economic growth when

natural resources seemed limitless. today that was manifested in the absence of meaningful mass-transit transportation when it is never considered to be scarce and food production systems on factory farms on refrigerated trucks to carry food across the country for research says grow scarcer in that surges upward that philosophy was revealed as faulty. those that are embracing a new philosophy to be hopeful and realistic communities all across the country are beginning to understand the critical need of

infrastructure and the opportunity and practice they know it will not be sufficient for those with three imagining infrastructure that identified infrastructure of the american life as part of the of partnership that showcase projects around the country how we think about infrastructure with grass-roots groups to create an approach to infrastructure with

community engagement and innovation and. you are welcome to go to the orion website. at this point of light to turn the panel over to our experts with the u.s. department of housing and urban development. she has extensive experience on the national level.

as a instructor and a graduate program but ginger stranded the author of three books also read "harper's" end of your times a day in contributing editor with the investor asher with the vermont decision to take control of the power supply. with the eisenhower foundation from

interpretation and new york city. let's begin with you. >> i will talk about to dissertation and i hope to tell you about some of my experiences in the district of colombia to illustrate what chip is talking about in terms of how a infrastructure can help to be more sustainable to bring gauge the community to demonstrate innovation. >> remedied overnight but we need to think about that in a different way so we begin to do that with

transportation were really ready had comparative a vintages so there was transit says say but system we had a great network but that didn't mean we necessarily had the transit riders ship or people walking on the streets but one of the things that became clear to us to have these assets we could do a lot more we begin to see transportation and the choices that we had and what we could bring to this city as a greater source of comparative a vantage we have recent graduates in the audience i heard them talking before the program

began how rough it is to graduate with so much debt we have a dozen colleges its universities so for us that strategy for those that are educated in what can we do to attract more? we thought it was made it expensive that could be a further source of comparative a vantage because that crushing college debt prevents them from making a start of the rest of their lives. we knew that strategy was working in d.c. but they do they have the highest debt

in the country but the second lowest of all right one dash three penalities to grimly diversified economy coming to the district of colombia it was a successful strategy in that sense. but having those trips rotation and choices means the second biggest expense after housing could be much less in fact, if you put those expenses together because we don't have a housing and a transportation in a bank account you could make the expensive city more affordable so that has helped a lot for everybody in the district of colombia so transportation could be a source of resilience remember that the event called the great recession?

we noticed something very odd hundreds of cars began to drop off the department of motor vehicles roll. we asked around and it turns out people were dying down their transportation costs because they could and they were concerned about the economy if they had a cut in we have mortgage defaults with vagrancy in foreclosure in the same jobs and housing market stark differences based on whether or not people could dial down those transportation cost another example is in august 2011 a very rare event people did

know what an earthquake was but 10 minutes later the office of personnel management when every single federal worker go at the same second so we had a massive traffic jam 10 minutes later every bike share bike was gone if you have rated your own work -- by to work you had a normal commute home maybe savor their normal because the cars were not moving at all. if you were in the car you were there to read three hours so those transportation choices meant they could build a new infrastructure to do that

but choices can be a source of help but more than haps - - half for taken by transit so even though we have pay disparities based on income our poorest are still much healthier than the average because they have a way to get daily exercise the more you can get people to walk and pipe literal lead the more eyes on the street it is safer for people to be out with a different sort of traffic with retail and other establishments the lower cost for transportation means more disposable income to spend locally because if your automobile is the main way to get around most of the money leaves the local

economy. but not so if you are walking or biking or taking transit. to his vacation june choices are the enormous source of access to jobs and opportunity imagine if you live in a place that the automobile is that a prerequisite but to access those by transit that is a huge source of mobility but you live in a city like the district of colombia has experienced a lot of innovation think about with

a hand is a car in all the other choices they're taking advantage of something that took the millenials generation to show the rest of us that automobiles are used by percent of the time and that is a national statistics so they were smart enough to realize they did not want to pay for something they were not using they wanted it to all the when they used it and that demand has spurred a lot of innovation in april by i our destructive technologies so a lot of services could be called it is radically reshaping transportation but those

look pretty much the same way in 6,000 years that we change the very form to accommodate that technology. humans like walkable neighborhoods. everything is enhanced to have those transportation choices in cities like washington and san francisco we concede that john ed daily basis. with that i will turn to my colleagues. >> good evening i have a great pleasure to visit the hoover dam headed say

previous generation conception of the infrastructure we may see concerns today about extraordinary works and it is the beautiful thing to see that great example of how infrastructure enables and constrains everything that comes out of bed. and that would be possible if not for the hoover dam or similar projects. with the infrastructure on how that was changing. called the ocean beach master plan as an attempt to create a long-term plan for adaptation for the coast and likely that will worsen as the sea level set said.

would the traditional fixed infrastructure to protect coastal water quality so then facing a certain and dynamic future a story of coming to terms with that to touch those key themes how infrastructure is changing. >> ocean beach is a sandy beach job the open beach it is exposed due very heavy and energy intensive storms a very popular surf break also part of the golden gate area that is part of a larger system of local and regional parks that are very

popular throughout the reason - - stroke the region. and it was built to bring it into compliance that the storm drains go to the same place as the toilets and the sphinx that is the a vintage and/or a disadvantage that the system can become overwhelmed. so that is able to reduce those 70 per year. end even though several actively involved in ocean

beach but unfortunately it was located and the city's response consisted of ad hoc areas that our large piles of boulders which do a good job to protect against erosion but but the quality of the beach with safety of access and with that coastal commission with that long-term strategy. so that is a landscape that we requested by some community led task force from the coastal conservancy

and the national park service. a whole bunch of different agencies but with the sense of either/or. so we initiated to unhappier public planning process to function with that infrastructure system to drive that erosion with the habitat issues so we come up with the master plan and fundamentally is manet

recommendations to close of a stretch of the coastal road so managing bad ever shed problem the way from that either/or road you don't have that luxury and you don't want to live with not having a beach. so with the combination and for navigation purposes with low-profile structural protection that is much less intrusive than the armory to date. since that time we have been working with the agencies to implement the various pieces

in her plan but also to close of stretch of road that makes that possible. so the way we need to design this change the future will not affect the past. so that was not an abstract that it was already taking place. so that management approach with a series of interventions overtime driven by how it changes with a multi a objective approach that either/or idea

to use the a imperative to win out with the tools of the city planning of scientists and engineers and activist. and try to find the optimum solution simultaneously as possible. another way to think about that to talk about the interaction of several different in for structures that are so much more novel in that way but also the road the beach itself in the terms of habitat and recreation than the coastal protection system itself

with a new approach to a less intrusive structures. so think of how these express themselves is of big part of what we we're doing. with the importance of water as fresh and salt, as so many issues relate to water and also of dealing with coastal erosion. i will stop there and look forward to more discussion. >> i am from the commonwealth club the program is we imagining america us infrastructure. with a deputy assistant secretary for the office of community planning and development.

a journalist and environmental writer and historian and an urban design policy director here in sentences go. the next speaker will be ginger. >>. >> i a writer not a planner. at all have the same level of expertise as my panelist collided right to a book about niagara falls that i described as a giant piece of infrastructure described as a natural wonder then i subsequently wrote a book about the interstate highway system that i began to see as a giant natural wonder disguised as a piece of the infrastructure which i suppose that our rights and suggested i write this piece on community power the final piece to be imagined infrastructure the series

has sparked tonight's panel. so i thought i would share the big picture ideas and the things that i learned about community power specifically to focus on burlington vermont walking across the nation the number of things were surprising with the first being a the variety of projects happening so it didn't seem surprising that the green mountain coffee drinking chocolate making town to build a by a plant to start develop and generate their own power and 80 percent of

the town voted to purchase hydroelectric plant when they made a contract then they could source 100 percent of their power renewable a and also locally to be the first major city to do that so that is quite the accomplishment it wasn't surprising to me to hear the story of massachusetts bay built in seoul say turbine it was so successful they built a second one i was surprised to hear the same thing happened in minnesota and towns as far ranging as north carolina and utah were installing community solar

projects and spearfish south dakota reports for this piece that purchased an old mining hydro plant to we have it to generate their own power so the range surprise me with the types of communities that decided to get involved so the question is why do day to that so that his the variety of reason to develop their own power but burlington had rested their utility at the time turned it into a municipal utility a century ago for many. the rates were too high. not surprising still a

reason many try to get in and on community power as a source of revenue and public power consumers pay less on average they and private consumers. boulder colorado recently did not renew the contract because they retired of the company dragging its feet and said we will do what aerosols'. another reason is to get more responsiveness from the company winter guarded needed a series of upgrades the private providers said we would not do as they would not renew the contract they turn to the municipal utility they invested taxpayers' dollars and now they pay less than ever

before another common reason is the typical by local reason that we think of when rethink of the food system. of when it comes to buying power locally it keeps jobs in the community and keeps profits and howard south dakota used it as the economic development to higher tractor mechanics to open a turbine repair facility to use that to drive the entire system for the county. all of these are part of a larger movement toward distributive power and what

we think about it is infrastructure for its gb vertically integrated to be scaled up with big huge areas that i have never heard before but i've loved the 21st century is about reversing that trend. and this is also surprising and makes it more controversial and not less. surprisingly people squawk about windmills but you don't actually see the images that give children asthma or the acid rain that

goes down rand. for when we see it and when we don't. also it was no surprise at all which in the end it became clear with one in the solar panel at a time. says they would have their own but the great value in these communities that develop their own power to rethink the infrastructure because it ages into ways and it is old-fashioned and

hasn't changed much in the way that works. , but that is to be optimized that is optimized for fossil fuels. sova to develop their own power committees are thinking about the new power grid and what it might look like for frequently renewable sources with generation and transmission that virtually or literally. but that doesn't mean the utilities will go away.

there will have to enable of green power and get smarter to interface what is now called the internet of same with electric cars in pounds and appliances to get more sophisticated about pricing or to use that on/off hours and utilities will have to become a partner to develop were green power that means unfortunately we all have to get involved with the saboorian knew the gritty of the regulatory system and pricing system so instead of being rewarded for increasing demand but decrease in usage. i had a lot of fun thinking about electricity as the infrastructure geek but it

ties into a central theme and i think generally it around or write in and we imagining infrastructure that we tend to think of infrastructure as the big vague thing that is simply the way things are is the status quo it is hard to change this big giant ship. at the same time we are aware we need to rethink our critical systems with our infrastructure to function in the hand in the scale toward fossil fuels. to renewable sources of power with and transportation infrastructure and we're interested those that and

then hoover dam and at this time with the federal system of entitlements but the good news is for working on this piece it is not impossible it feels like the way things are and we're always changing it how we have dismantled and incredibly complicated system of real and replace it with in forced automobile in a with an incredibly complicated system of highways that was driven by incentives and stimulus and regulation and

desire with determination and that same level of desire to redesign the current infrastructure how it works. [applause] >> this says the of a commonwealth club of california as a member of the commonwealth club of the number led forum we have come to the point where we have questions from the ideas and first i want to thank the speaker to the office of community planning

and even ginger strand with sinn environmentalist writer and historian with the editor in trite chief of "variety" magazine and executive director of orion society. >> the question is with other forms of transportation how did they shift their resources?

>> you may make the argument is refusing to reauthorize the gasoline tax that basically make states and localities be more or less of their own for transportation and that favors likability and walk ability and transit over a costly highway expansion that they cannot pay to maintain what we have. but in general to do talk about desire in communities across the country to see the transportation choices of the economy and future

with or without the benefit but the federal policies have favored roads over transit and terms of the share the federal government was willing to pay. so the fact there is less money than it is more of a disadvantage for road building and transit. because of a strong links of land-use said sitting on the board in the washington region and 86 percent of all

of the office construction is under way in the entire region is 1/4 mile or less of transit that is on top of transport so if you are not developing a transit bin you are not selling or leasing in the office space. and i don't thank you are getting that from the new road expansion. >> so this is applicable to many communities but what debilities and a bike ability is said the car centric infrastructure choices made years ago. >> it spurs working on quite

a bit in the city of san jose real started to work that city deliberately partially because it is the largest city of population but also because of problems that were largely bill to the postwar period that looks so much more like a the problems of american urbanism. that is the be all i did hothouse of difference from most places. it turns out to be a very difficult problem to achieve the retrofitting of suburbia. if you built up place around a car at was markets and regulations in the whole

factor in shaping the -- environment so it takes a sustained engagement so it shows day picture of what a good walkable neighbor her books like i showed you why did you build it? so well together that is more challenging and more of an uphill battle then you might know. and work that is starting to bear fruits for those accessible neighborhoods that also more livable. and with many different facets. >> i will respectfully

disagree to say in some ways taking back the street with us sidewalk cafes that that roadways that slow traffic is guerrilla activity where organizations like a better box to show people what it is like sometimes doing it overnight with the approval of one or more government officials almost never without explicit approval but to be how wide and narrow it is. so that may be easier to remake that is an example of

the place that was on the cover of books with suburban sprawl that now has light rail and all of the parking lots to be remade with the network of streets as if say purposely have the enormous jobs concentration but using the other amenities that it doesn't happen overnight but in 25 years it will look like a real city. they drop to the corner from the name and aspirations are urban. >> it is completely different rather than the suburban landscape shifting these with the

transportation commissioner dedicated to putting in more bike lanes and a founder and they closed thaa large part of times square that was a highly functional 3 they closed a large part of times square that was a highly functional public space and traffic improved. there are interesting models but tyson's is even more interesting because that was held up as the worst community. >> i want to respond because i agree with your disagreement. of lot of those examples are actually illegal and potentially very in provincial to build a better

block that has pope dash our assumptions how we use public space as the public right-of-way to be incredibly influential that touches on of large set of themes that is tactical and temporary ban also constraints on a temporary basis in most people will tolerate most anything for a short period of time but then to have the opportunity to demonstrate in a different way. >> talk about you have done to increase people's awareness with users of

infrastructure the way the arts can help people understand better to impact their life that is what the arion project has been but also examples to help people think differently. >> the genesis of that question i was involved in city space with interventions of film festivals and exhibitions and things like that. and berndt 10 years ago will be found to wrote conduct that exploration is very engaging this thing to do to

get a large number of people that explorer these questions the much broader movement and also has the set of experience how we react with society and how we live with one another in a public space. that is under the moniker of those interventions to achieve economic development and so forth. . .

needed sustainable infrastructure. i wonder, sure this must've been something you were learning about. what can you tell us about how you were able to afford that will come to partnerships were play their >> i can speak briefly. i think area has a lot more to say about that. certainly with burlington electric district incentives were absolutely essential to their shift into green power

they are able to make their utility profitable by generating renewable power, selling credits,, selling credits, so i renewable power credits and generate more than they need. it gave him a headache essentially because it was so complicated not even getting a usable sense of how complicated the whole structure was. it made me realize, there is a fine balance of working with, developers to develop some of the power resources working with state and federal incentives in order to make the whole thing make financial sense. but i really wanted to defer to harriet. >> harriet. >> what i would say goes back to something mentioned at the beginning, our infrastructure crisis is not

just a question of having aging infrastructure. itit is that we need better infrastructure. we need infrastructure that is place making, like been described, multi- benefit and multipurpose, adaptable, resilient to a changing climate. and that is part of the reason that private investment sits on the sidelines. i think this is a moment when in every major infrastructure category, transportation,category, transportation, water, sewer, energy generation and distribution, telecommunications read a major inflection.-- inflection point. that straight line we used to draw we can't anymore. technology and climate and changing demand, all of

these things are making it impossible for us to forecast. it makes a great -- it makes it risky. we need to do more to future proof and do more immediate engagement, do more scenario planning, think about the risks of severe weather and other climate related impacts command i think that that is part of the reason in the federal government at heart and withhad and with the white house and the national economic council and the treasury and a half a dozen other federal agencies, we have developed an initiative that is designed to get more private investment in our infrastructure and also deliver better infrastructure for those investments, and that means more free development, more planning, and infrastructure that performs in the way

that a lot of the panel is discussed. that is more distributive and adaptable and produces lots of benefits and solves lots of problems. there is a famous quote attributable to winston churchill at the end of world war ii. gentlemen, we are out of money and now we have to think. that is exactly where we are in this country. >> it is sobering to realize how far along other countries are ahead of us and thinking about sustainability and infrastructure and the way that often is encoded into law and mandates that change take place. the question from the audience is a variant on that. how do you see resilient infrastructure, adaptive, international law particularlyparticularly for countries and cities most threatened by climate change? >> i will take a small piece

of that. we have had a fair amount of interaction with the dutch indians that you want coastal management. and certainly in the northeast as well. becausebecause of the dutch, of course, the 800 year history of managing there coast. from a certain traditional, environmental lens there is something very troubling about that, high intervention landscape that is the dutch boulder and the dutch coast. on the other hand, increasingly we can no longer pretend that nature is out there as this pristine wilderness force and our job is to be as small as we can be and letting the wilderness happened. increasingly, we are in a situation where our

footprint on the global scale, a necessity for managing processes has to meet that challenge. and so the traditional, philosophical boundary between the city's polar opposite, and never the twain shall meet is breaking down, and in that sense the dutch have become much more ecologically conscious than they once were, and american environmentalists are becoming increasingly aware and have a list cities in nature have a certain symbiotic connection rather than us sort of trying to keep them -- so definite. >> i would talk about scale. we have a very fragmented system of government in this country and a lot of powers

given specifically to different units of government, and corporation is unnatural. in many other parts of the world it is a little bit easier sometimes because there is this democracy. i am not advocating that, but in many cases the government structures make it much more easy for things to happen at the level of the state, the level of the region, the level of the european union at a much larger scale which is the scale at which a lot of disaster occurs. here we might fix a flooding problem and one community and make it worse for the community that is immediately downstream which happens all the time. i no that is one advantage other places have we need to learn from. >> this is an clark, commonwealth program tonight's reimagining america's infrastructure,

and i want to thank our panel tonight who has been with us and the wonderful information and discussion that we have had. harriet regarding has been principal deputy assistant secretary to the office of committee planning and development at had. ginger strand, a journalist, environmental writer, historian, and benjamin grant is the urban design policy director and has led many of the processes to develop programs and policies for the city. i would like to actually ask the person who has been our moderator tonight, editor in chief of orion magazine and executive director of the orion society, after all of this enormous work at orion has done these issues and the information you have certainly seen and brought to us in terms of the words of the work that orion has done, what stands out for

you and terms of reimagining our infrastructure, america's infrastructure? >> a lot of us, certainly when we began this project began talking about it like so many people we think infrastructure, bridges and roads and potholes you hit on the road on your way to work that morning. thethe words you say when you hit the pothole. andç pretty quickly you begin to realize that the way our lives play out, they are so defined by infrastructure. with better infrastructure is available comeau we use it. when better infrastructure is not available, we are locked into it. people who like so many are trying to understand how to live better for healthier lives, by thinking about infrastructure, it's a concrete way of thinking about things that we can do

that make it easier which is the message that we learned at orion and i hope we are conveying. >> our appreciation tonight to a panel and moderator. our wonderful panel principal deputy assistant secretary for the office of committee planning and development, ginger strand, journalist, environmental writer, and benjamin grant here in san francisco. unfortunately, we have come to the end of our program, program, and i hope you have enjoyed it. we appreciate you and the

audience for coming tonight and especially wish you all well. at this point in our program we are looking at the future of our programs and hope that you will join us once again a big thank you to our moderator and panel. we will adjourn our meeting.

>> he served three years on sale in assault and battery charges. he talked about the training programs at the montgomery county correctional facility. >> just learning how to get a job and speak and explaining my charges before the judge before i get the job. explain the job, how to dress, how to talk, how to do all the information. they helped me out by bringing the employer to the jail. when came here he said stuff about me. now i'm just working.

he got the job in not even one week later, three or four days later that i have the experience one job can take that anger to the next one. the workforce and asked them they are already getting me suggestions if i want to change jobs or do something, finding jobs, even finding areas that can help me with other problems that i may have or anything. >> washington journal is live from the montgomery county correctional facility and will talk with three officials. correction. correction department and kendra yoakam tells us about rehabilitation and job training. and mental health and substance abuse treatment

live tomorrow at 7:30 a.m. eastern on c-span. >> tonight dred scott was enslaved to doctor john anderson. emerson was assigned duties in several free states during which dred scott married harriet robinson. mr. scott tried to buy his family's freedom, but she refused and he sued. follow the case of scott versus sanford and see landmark cases, supreme court decisions with our special guest george washington law professor bracy and martha jones. we willwe will explore this historic supreme court ruling by revealing the life and times of the people or the plaintiffs, lawyers

command justices in these cases. live tonight at 9:00 o'clock 9:00 o'clock eastern. and be sure to jump -- join the conversation. c-span, c-span three, and c-span radio. a copy of landmark cases companion books. >> homeland security secretary j johnson, a pi director james komi, head of the national counterterrorism center testify before congress. message encryption technology, refugees screaming and drug cartels.

>> i want to welcome our distinguished panel here come our witnesses. thank you for your time, testimony, service. when i took over chairmanship of the committee ten months ago the 1st thing i did was reach out to sen. harper and suggested we do something a

little unusual for senate committee, developed emissions. and so we came up with a pretty simple one, to enhance the economic national security of america that accomplish two things. it starts our relationship with the ranking member. it director the activity of our committee. good thing, we established the establish basic priorities. we established five, border security, cyber security, protecting our critical infrastructure, our grid, doing whatever we can to counter violent extremists, islamic terrorists whose threat testimony says is growing and our 5th priority was so directed at the secretary.

doing everythingdoing everything that we can, committing this committee to help you achieve your goal, your mission of keeping this safe. i want to thank you for your service. it is exactly this committee is trying to do. basically it follows what the priorities were.were. the fed to the threat that we face are real. they are not diminishing. they are actually growing. three men of integrity. take your duties and responsibilities very seriously. i want to thank the senators that are here. i am looking for a very informative hearing. >> thank you so much, mr. chairman. i want to start off by calling an audible. we are visited by pope francis up and down the east

coast all over the place, millions of people. the entourage. in new york city, united nations. new york city, the un. i think make touch on this. the word as well. there needs to be a category.a category. i know you believe in that command we do, too. of all the 70 national leaders who came to our country, without a hitch. it's just amazing.

the secret service, most of whom are hard-working. better days. within dhs and the state and local level. when someone does the job well. so the most acute threats came from osama bin laden. largely dismantled. isys in yemen and syria. in the media, the propaganda you can no longer rely on

the threat. you must identify the root causes of why we must meet this evolving challenge which is no easy task. i know we are focused on that. all of the witnesses, i commend the secretary for focusing on countering violent extremism. we remind the world. we have a long history of a moral obligation by taking a reasonable share of syria as he invoked not just the golden rule of medicine 25. rose henry did you feed me, rose naked did you call me.

not to be blind to this really awful situation, millions of syrian refugees, but to realize that there is a smart way, a huge role financially in providing aid , and there is a sort of protection here, how we can be consistent and do that in a way that protects us from extremists who might like to use it as an opportunity to come in and filter. the other thing i want to mention came from meeting with a bunch of folks in the capitol. let me finish my remarks. don't let them come up with a reasonable budget. everything we have seen, cyber security they need to

do a better job. gathering information with the federal government, real-time coming to the dhs portal so that there is no loss of time. is the kind of things, one, two, three. i think you're doing a lot of good things. your department, mr. secretary, building those tools. a weeka week ago, two weeks ago senator johnson and i were invited by you along with tom ridge, former secretary, former governor

and invite me to come to shanksville, pennsylvania. i will never forget. i just want to thank you. remind us of what happened. the strengthen the courage of the 40 people. grateful to the menu. >> i like to thank the secretary for inviting us that describing what those passengers did come almost there final act was quintessentially american. so i would recommend anyone

who has not go to shanksville, go there. there is a powerful panel. you can listen to three amazing voicemail messages from the people on that plane concerned far more about their loved ones they leave behind themselves. again, something quintessentially american. with that,. with that, it is a tradition of this committee to swear witnesses in. verizon raise your right hand. our 1st witnesses secretary j johnson. the 4th secretary of the department of homeland security. he served as general counsel for the department of defense, general counsel for the department of the air

force. secretary. >> thank you, mr. chairman. last month the three of us attempted a sobering ceremony for the 14th anniversary of september 11. today, 14 years later, it is still a dangerous world. the events of that day were the most prominent example of terrorists recruited, trained overseas and exported to our homeland. the hijackers were acting on orders from al qaeda external operations chief who was in turn carrying out the direction of osama bin laden. likewise, the attempted shoe bomber, attempted underwear bomber, attempted times square car bombing, and the attempted package bomb plot in october 2010 were all

efforts to export terrorism to the united states. they all appear to have been directed by a terrorist organization overseas. response to these type of attempted attacks on our homeland was and is to take the fight directly to the terrorist organization and locations overseas. today the global terrorist threat is more decentralized complex, and in many respects harder to detect. the new reality involves the potential for smaller scale attacks by those who are either home-grown or home-based, not exported. inspired by but not necessarily directed by the terrorist organization. today is no longer necessary for terrorist organizations to personally recruit, train, and direct operatives overseas. today with new and skilled a

publicizes its instruction manual and its magazine and publicly urges people to use it. today wetoday we are also concerned about foreign terrorist fighters for answering public calls to leave their home countries in europe and elsewhere to take up the extremist fight. many individuals will seek to return to their home countries with the same extremist amounted. the recent wave of terrorist attacks and attempted attacks here in europe reflects this new reality. the boston marathon bombing in april, 2013, the attack on the war memorial in the parliament building in ottawa october 2014, the attack on the charlie the way headquarters in paris january 2015, attempted

attack in garland city, texas in may 2015, and the attack that killed five us service members in chattanooga tennessee. whatwhat does this recent wave of attacks and attempted attacks have in common? arrow conducted by home-grown or home-based actors and all appear to have been inspired and not directed by al qaeda or isi l. we are concerned about domestic terrorism in the form of the lone wolf which can include various assets of domestic terrorism such as right-wing extremists as well. wewe devote substantial efforts to the study and understanding of these threats and will continue to further our understanding of the underpinnings of terrorist threats of all forms. what we are doing about it i will discuss in further detail. itit is set forth in my prepared remarks, and i will not elaborate that here. i will conclude by saying

basically two points. one, i applaud both the house and senate for the good work that has been done on cyber security legislation. i applaud the fact that it has been bipartisan. i believe that there is an urgent need for help from this congress in the area of cyber security. the need for cyber security legislation has, in my judgment, been aptly demonstrated just over the last 12 months some of the things we have seen. so i hope that the house and senate can come together, pass legislation, and have that legislation come off. the last thing i will say is that homeland security is part of national security, the frontline of national security. our job is much more difficult, to protect the american people if congress

does not repeal sequestration. we simply cannot deliver for the american people all of the homeland security that they need and want if we have to work with a sequestered budget. i urge congress in aa stronger terms possible to consider repealing sequestration. thank you. >> i continue to press to bring cyber security on the floor of the senate. wewe have that commitment and you will see it over the next couple of weeks. the success of that will largely depend on us working together, as we have in the past. it is amazing what you can accomplish if you can concentrate on what you agree on. cyber security is one of those things, and i am quite hopeful with your help and senator carper and everyone on this committee. our next witnesses director james komi, director of the

federal bureau of investigation and has also served as us attorney for the southern district of new york, deputy attorney general for the department of justice and general counsel for organization of the private sector. my friends and colleagues with whom we do so much work. his description of a new reality is that and i simply want to amplify it because it bears stressing a lot of us or something but the terrorism threat to the paradigm. it is important the american people understand how things have changed. isi l has broken the core al qaeda paradigm by using social media to broadcast a twin pronged call.

thousands and thousands of cars around the world. first, comment participate in the final battle between good and evil on the outside and find meaning in your life. if you can't travel, killer you are, anyone, but especially if you could, people in military or law enforcement uniform and video it, that would be best of all and it is a message that it travels everywhere. it is a great way to sell shoes are books or movies, twitter, a great way to close source terrorism. terrorism. started investing in this the middle of 2014 an earlier this year we saw the payoff on the investment in hundreds of investigations in all 50 states of people who are on some path between

consuming this poison and responding to it by traveling or killing where they are. the challenge we face is finding those needles in a nationwide haystack. consuming poison to act and poison is not just a nationwide haystack, but what isil has been doing is when they find a live one, they will move them off of twitter wherewith lost -- lawful process we can seesee the communications and move into an end-to-end mobile messaging app so the needle that we may have found disappears on us. and with the court order, the way we collect the content of your vacations communications in the united states, we get a court order, we cannot see what is being said. this is a big problem.

it's an illustration of the problems we call going dark it's the conflict between two values we all hold dear, safety and security on the internet. i can assure you, we are big fans of strong encryption. protects what matters to us most. the other value in conflict is public safety. we must protect the people of the united states, find those needles. we must find drug dealers. those two values we hold dear are crashing into each other. i don't know the answer and keep telling folks, the fbi is not an alien force. we have belonged to the american people. our tools are those that the people you mr. you. not working so much anymore. we have to talk about that. a lot of conversation, very

productive. does it make sense to continue the conversation? they are working with us to figure out how we could solve the problem. industries, state and local law enforcement, foreign partners because everyone who cares has to be involved in this conversation. there is no clear answer. remove the vitamin understand that we share values and care about protecting people, safety and security on the internet it is a hard thing, but i think america does hard. i think the members of this committee for their engagement, and my partners here at the table command we will continue the conversation with the american people. >> thank you. our next witnesses director nicholas rest mucin,

director of the national counterterrorism center and ctc. previously served as deputy director of and ctc in various functions on the national security council staff and several key positions. >> thank you, thank you, senator. i welcome the opportunity to have a thoughtful conversation with the committee. before getting into the threat picture i want to stress just how well and closely aligned we at nctc are with my colleagues at dhs and fbi. we share information, collaborate in an intense way every day. i will start with the good news. from an analytic perspective the chances of a large-scale attack carried out by overseas terrorist group on

the law -- along the lines of my two colleagues described has been substantially reduced and we have collectively achieve that outcome through aggressive action and also through the creation of a robust homeland security and counterterrorism infrastructure here in the homeland. while we can look with some degree of satisfaction, there is still quite a bit to be concerned about with the threat of landscape which is in some ways more challenging than ever. it has shifted it ways that are proving particularly challenging. today there are more threats originating in more places involving a more diffuse and disparate set of individuals that anytime previously. let me spell out what, i mean, by that. i will start with the islamic state of iraq and the font.

ice -- isil has overtaken al qaeda, and the group views itself as being in conflict with the west which is being played out not just in syria and iraq but a number of other locations around the world. this places include algeria, libya, egypt, yemen, saudi arabia, afghanistan, nigeria , even potentially southeast asia as well, indonesia and the philippines. and that aggressive growth and expansionist agenda has implications for homeland threat picture. and our three especially concerning features have amy reached this conclusion. the 1st is the extensive access to resources which can be measured in terms of manpower, military material, and, of course, money. aterritorial control that they exercise with large portions of iraq in syria as well as the province areas

that i mentioned and 3rd is access to individuals from western countries, those who travel in this remain in their home countries. when we look as intelligence professionals that could threaten our homeland these are the key features we would expect to see which is of concern. in his published testimony sec. johnson alluded to how we are coming to be viewed as a threat from isil. we are seeing the threat as having isil involved in some ways along a spectruma spectrum of activity. at one end we see isolated individuals who draw inspiration from isil prolific and spectacular use of sophisticated social media which is true even if they are not directing or guiding actions. on the otheron the other end of the spectrum, there are

individuals who may receive direct guidance including people who are leaders of the organization. the spectrum is very difficult for us to penetrating understand because of the collection difficulties, but more often than not we see their operating somewhere between the two ends of the spectrum which creates a fluid picture. the under intensive focus on isil what you would expect. and despite the unrelenting media attention that is focused on isil in current days and no respect at all when we downgrade our level of effort and attention on the set of threats we face as a nation. but i am asked often i most often declined to answer and would not want to suggest a focus on isil and the

organizations. the attack capability is being restored. and while the core leaders have been degraded they continue to track and investigate any indications. we know that remains and ambition and stay on it constantly. both are statements for the record the unrelenting focus including the homeland and aviation sector. beyond him and we are also watching al qaeda affiliate networks looking to carry out external operations. efforts have certainly been successful, and some of the

most important figures of concern have been taken off the map. any sign of intelligence will give us a hint. the homegrown violent extremists. go back to 2,009 and to date that number has already doubled. it is difficult for us to put numbers on the precise population, there is no question in my mind. and you can say they have injected new energy and life it can have an impact by motivating individuals. so as i conclude, we

continue to work to detect, defeat, and disrupt the full spectrum focusing heavily on isil. as we face this new reality. but it is extremely important. your testimony. broader, wider, and deeper than any value.

we have a hearing really exploring and highlighting the sophistication with which isil is utilizing social media, and in that hearing we had testimony is said at the time there were covert supporter accounts. they just, you know, basically pop up with another name and handle. you talk about social media, those individuals and noon being moved over. can you give us some sense of the numbers of people you are concerned about that have been engage in social media, and i want to talk about your ability to track, but in terms of the number of people inspired to the social media.

>> probably the best number i can given an open setting is dozens. >> sec. johnson has gone in to the communities to try to engage the communities. i don't think this is classified. the members of the communities themselves think we have a handle on this. we know who among their myths might be being inspired. that is completely false. would you agree that is some sort of assessment? >> i do. jay has been a leader on this. no matter what there background, they don't want their sons or daughters going to the caliphate. here the answer is it is a

huge challenge because good people do wicked people do, write an innocent narrative over troubling facts. i must be misunderstanding or he must be having a bad day. when the hair stands up on the back of your neck, tell us command a police officer committee deputy sheriff. he will check it out in secret. if it is nothing, it is nothing, nothing, but if it is something, you may just saved innocent lives. >> there was a new york times article that described in fbi, really having multiple, hundreds of conversations. in the fbi spent quite a few hundreds of thousands of dollars for that fbi operative.

i am putting myself in the position of the parent whose son, maybe a 20 -year-old kid is being engaged with by the fbi the caliphate and all that type of thing and all of a sudden the fbi swoops in and says, did you ever talk about traveling over syria? they brought up the charges. i think that it is a serious concern about the best way to engage the community. we have not read thought -- we all agree it is important to understand where our folks are going with this as far as consuming enacting. so we will continue that work. knowing that we have to do that work, i hope that

motivates the good parents of the united states, no one wants to children to go die in the nightmare that is this so-called caliphate or get locked up. so it is just another reason why good parents need to talk to us, need to know what their kids are doing. one of the challenges we all face his parents is a sense that you want to know where your child is going physically and you want to know if your kid is going to hang out the mall, but you don't have such a sense of where they are aligned. when you see things that are troubling, help us engaging keep kids from getting to a place that where they have to be locked up. we call them off ramps so that we can intervene early and get that kid the help that they need, sometimes substance abuse, sometimes counseling. that way they don't have to become something that they lockup. that is an ongoing

conversation, and we are making progress. >> you have been a leader, and i applaud you for that. only a couple dozen people who have been inspired. talk to me about your engagement and communities but also about your assessment of the number? >> well, 1st of all, we are concerned about a lot of people who self radicalized essentially by reading things in social media without direct communications doing someone in the homeland and someone overseas. will we no suggests that before someone

in that situation turns to an act of violence there are very few people in a position to know about it. parents, brother, spouse, someone living in that home with the person. by the nature of the problem we do not often have advanced opportunity to interdict, to arrest, prosecute, which is why the cv engagements are so important. encouraging people and communities to help us help you with public safety. and so we have been out there doing this. we have seen a lot of good reaction, some criticism to our efforts but heightening awareness is fundamental given the nature of the current program we have. >> just really quick, you talked about the balance, the very delicate balance

between civil liberties and security. always concerned about that. where are we today in that spectrum, focal.between civil liberties and securities and where do we need to be? >> that is an incredibly complex question, and i question, and i am not sure if there is a particular point that you are. the way we have collected intelligence to get at terrorist adversaries. the kind of insight we used to have into the more complex al qaeda linked plotting is just not available right now. soso naturally in that environment we are going to exhaust every opportunity and avenue we can think of to develop new collection opportunities.

some steady equilibrium along the spectrum, this will be the subject of an ongoing conversation with the private sector and the parts of industry that hold critical modes of communication. unfortunately many of these terrorist actors are exercising their craft on this platform. we have opened the conversation without the federal government dictating solutions or choosing a legislative framework, but we are at the front end of that conversation that must play out over the period ahead. >> i recognize this is complex and did not expect a definitive answer. your answer isyour answer is exactly right.

this is a conversation and discussion we must have but it must be an honest conversation and we must be looking at the new reality of the threats we are facing not on the run we have to discuss this in a serious and honest fashion. >> let me preface my question by emphasizing how much we appreciate your commitment to our country, commitment to defending us in the hard work that you and your teams are doing on our behalf. i would like to talk to my colleagues. a long marriage between people. communicate and compromise, and when i look at the three of you i see the three c's. so keep it up, and thank you for setting a good example. we like to focus not just on addressing symptoms of problems. we don't always look at the underlying cause or root cause. i think sen. peter or in

high will go down with them. a couple of house colleagues we will go to honduras, maybe guatemala. why tens of thousands of people risk their lives going through a terrible situation. we spend trillions of dollars in the last decade or so. we spentwe spent less than 1 peo figure out what the root causes are. i am a big root cause guy. when i look at the cyber attacks, one of them is china. they know what is going on. but they know full well there are entities within that country trying to steal and give economic shortcuts through prosperity and our expense pretty much just over as the cost for them. i just wish to commend

secretary johnson and everyone else who was involved in convincing the chinese that it was time to change their ways, toways, to mend their ways. i am not sure what the prospects are for succeeding i am not going to be able to get that, so i applaud you. there is a mechanism in place that will allow you and the secretary-general to build on what has been agreed to and make sure it is not just that we will say this and do something else to do what we say in the 1st place. >> yes. when the chinese were here, both for the president's visit and about two weeks before we had a very frank conversations about cyber security, about cyber norms that we believe nations should embrace, and there are a lot of good things on

paper. the questionthe question now becomes whether the chinese will do what they agreed to do on paper. and so the way forward will be putting them to the task of having ministerial ever conversations. time will tell about whether or not the chinese will live up to what they agreed to do. i am pleased for his on the paper, but actions will speak louder than words in this context. his focus on the golden rule and matthew 25.

we have this need to make sure those 10,000 syrian refugees come to our country's. i would just like for us to talk about what we can do, not to do, would do to make sure that those threats are anticipated and appropriately addressed. secretary. >> well, just to highlight one thing in particular, given the nature of how the terrorist threat has evolved , i think that it is incumbent upon us at the federal level to share as much intelligence as we camera state and local law enforcement. ..

>> it is something that we have >> the experience we had we are didn't do it as well as we should have in the inert decade with iraqi refugees so we had to redo it. we are more