solved or far enough. >> we last saw had a reputation to send people to wall street with complex financial vehicles with various kinds of cdo's. our young people less likely to do that now? >> there is still interest at princeton and elsewhere but statistics show the best and brightest are not necessarily headed tool street like in the '90s early 2000's. >> host: like they come to ohio to manufacture it what that would be for society not but what they don't join austria is not important but

may be a different balance. >> at number it is far enough but there is a shift of for the college graduates are going. >> host: we talked about my frustrations.

but the governments job is to provide the foundation for something and it's been really hard lately as i'm sure you appreciate to get bipartisan support for sensible programs and there is a lot that could be done to help the productivity gains in the last few years and the wages had grown as much as we would like so there's a lot of things that could be done to make our economy more vibrant the shore. >> the two or three things we could do one of the most important things we could do

about well and equality in their representation that may be the bias that in light of the union we have seen the wealth and the quality and the issues of globalization in the joint workforce training. >> i want to caution this is a very long-term trend. federal reserve is accused of exacerbating i just don't buy it. these are associated with a globalization technical change, whole variety of things and it's not going to be easy to reverse that. i guess the two main tools we have our facts and transfer policy to make the calls about that and neither is the skills the other is the skills and training to make sure everybody has access to succeed and we haven't succeeded at doing that. i think any quality in the

outcome is in many ways parallel to the quality and the wealth distribution. >> what you mean in the reference tax policy? >> this is the congress decision will. one tool that you have asked the legislature to address inequality is tax rates, income while, corporate taxes there's a lot of improvements that can be made in the tax systems. i'm not advocating a particular tax rate but it is a tool you can consider and think about also the trade-off of doing that but it's one tool congress has to look at. >> the distinguished economist speaks with a louder voice than almost any other distinguished economist and i know you're not going to let me pin you down on

the tax rate should be the thoughts generally i would like to hear your assessment of what you're doing right and we are doing right and wrong from the earned income tax credit to a state tax to a corporate tax to the personal income tax. >> i think the earned income tax credit and other credits work and reward education that those are constructed and avoid some of the trade-offs that you worry about as you create a tax on benefits by taking away benefits as you go to eager to work for example, corporate tax it seems that is an area there is a lot of bipartisan agreement addressing the territorial issues those are things that i think we should be able to get done. >> host: i'm working with the

the senator and speaker ryan and we are coming to an agreement on tap debate contacts so we can give incentives for the overseas voters back home in a tax rate of ten or 11% and that money goes to long-term infrastructure and at the same time so that doesn't incentivize companies to go overseas which they do with repatriations. one of the things you love about baseball you can sort of compare across but obviously not all of them and you are lucky enough to see what was the perfect game with two outs in the ninth inning and i represent ohio as

you know in the southern part of the state i'm not asking for your opinion because of betting on games in the northern part of the state shows jackson who paid for cleveland before he was traded to the chicago white sox so understanding the blemishes of the two of them on their career there was a rookie player for "the new york times" into this story came up again recently because they were playing the cubs and the cubs it was the last year they won the world series in 1907 and if they had actually won the world series this year which they were close to doing, my team would be the longest existing team to not have won a world series to 1948. but how fair was it that the first baseman for the new york giants was a young star made one mistake and was called boneheads

merkle for the rest of his life. how fair is major major league baseball with labels him for the rest of his world series appearance 15 years in the major league's? >> i rather like it was yesterday. he didn't run the ball to second base. this is interesting. if you know they have the so-called neighborhood play when you are doing a double play and there is a runner sliding you don't have to touch second base to be in the neighborhood and adobe have an instant replay and that sort of eliminates the play because you come back and say they didn't catch second base, so the question is the standards change and that the time that in 1907 the convention was that you didn't have to go to second base and so i think it was a little unfair for fred merkel he related it to the question.

>> i think it was a little unfair but was the standard practice was reverse in a crucial play at the end of the world series. >> thank you. the book has been bernanke in the current stack. good conversation thank you for the service to the country. >> that was "after words," booktv signature program in which authors of the latest books are interviewed. watch past programs online at booktv.org. now on booktv we want to introduce you to the diversity wisconsin professor diamond. what do you do here at the

university? >> i'm a professor in educational leadership at the school of education. >> and what exactly do you teach? >> i teach courses on race and inequality and research methods. and also leaders that will go elsewhere and how to think about organizations. how did you get interested in education in the first place? >> my mother started as a first grade teacher and i really became interested in trying to understand e. qualities in education. understanding that equal the schools and place for inequality is sort of manifested itself where we hope we can challenge but it's also a place that sort of gets reproduced and so i wanted to understand the dynamics of the process. >> that leads us into your book despite the best intentions help

racial inequality thrives in good schools. you and amanda lewis. >> amanda is a coffee taster did working with at the university of illinois chicago and they are the co-authors of this book. professor diamond, you say that it started with a phone call. >> it all started with a phone call. i have been engaged working with schools trying to address racial achievement that achievement of black and latino counterparts and the principle of the school caught up and said i'm having a struggle i've been working in the school for a long time to understand why these persist and can you come talk to some of the students in the school to try to understand what's going on with this achievement gap that we see in the school. why is it that a the black in the patina kids are achieving at these levels? >> you talk about riverview high school and the principle of

grace rather and the natural midwest. how much of that is made up and can you tell us is this a real school plaques to the co? >> it is predominantly middle-class, racially diverse in a place that is known for its progressive, liberal ethos and context. >> so made up much room at west. is it in the midwest? >> those are synonyms for their real names and real places, yes. >> what is it about the school that attracted you to write about? >> it is a fascinating place because it's been stably integrated for probably 30 years, 40 years. what you find is not the sort of standard that is asperity between middle-class including black latino families as well as white families and again a gala terry and ethos, the belief in diversity. many of them moved to the

community because it is a diverse place and so the idea. they believed in racial equality that's been stably integrated for some time and resources are abundant and we wanted to understand what's going on here that they are racial inequalities that still persist in a place like this. >> what are some of the inequalities when you talk about statistical inequalities when you look at the stats? >> what we were finding is that for example, when we looked at black students and latino students had lower grades on average. they were not doing as well on the tests, so the tests they were taking they were not doing as well as their white counterparts. we looked at things like graduation rates where most were graduating and going off to college which was a positive thing but for the black and latino students were going to be two-year colleges as opposed to four-year colleges so there were all these inequalities and

differences that manifest themselves in the school and they sort of made us wonder what was actually going on inside of the school context and so we wanted to understand grace and with the dynamics were as well as the social class dynamics that might be leading to these inequalities and so we thought mr. weber's invitation was a great opportunity to look at what was going on more generally to be started with the black students and we actually wound up in producing interviewing about 171 people in the community including students, parents, community members, teachers, administrative to get a complete picture of what was happening in the context. >> we wanted to understand what was racial of these inequalities. there's research that talks about race and what it means to understand it and one of the things we wanted to understand is this idea of oppositional culture. there is an idea that black and latino students are not invested in schools or invest in

education and their peers criticized them for behaving in ways that would lead to academic success for the sort of hypothesis that you may have heard from everyone from president obama talking about education and what we found is that really wasn't an explanation that carries much weight. what we found for example is that there was no war negative peer pressure and that black students were more pro- schools in the counterparts and we found this through interviewing and through the survey that we conducted in riverview and what we found was the counterparts of what we really wanted to do in that piece of work is debunked the idea that we found the evidence released to support the idea that this is that isn't what's going on in the context of the school in riverview and that there were other things that were manifest. >> one of the things we have a

lot of discourse and discussions about the achievement gap that's what winds up happening is people don't really engage in the idea of race itself. what does race actually mean? the >> they will talk about race as a variable but they do not impact the social meaning of race and so if you think about race you have have to book historically what race has been used for. it emerges at a time when you have things happening around the world, slavery, all these qualities of the genocide and what race found up being found that being is a construct that allows people to justify this kind of expectations. and one of the things that continues to exist is this idea that black and latino students are essentially not as intelligent and that they are likely to be violent or misbehave is one of the things that manifests itself based on this historical context is the

idea of the criminalization of black bodies and latino bodies and the act of intelligent people perceive. and these things were apparent when you talk to people in the school context and like i said before we interviewed black, white, latino to understand what was happening and there was a pretty consistent story that people perceived that black students and latino students were not as intelligent, were not going to achieve as well and were not going to behave as well as their white counterparts to be >> so was there a perception or reality? >> there was definitely a perception. what we think about with regards to the reality to reality is a self-fulfilling prophecy. once you've decided somebody is going to misbehave, you are going to scrutinize them a lot more. so we found for example in the hallways at school students were supposed to have a pass when they are not in a class when they are moving through the hallway during class. oh. what he found his white students would say i never need a whole

pass i walk through freely and white students would say that i know my black friends can never do that. and the likelihood of being in violation of the code is much higher if you are stopped them if you are not. it's like racial profiling and policing so that was one of the examples of how it played itself out and the students were trying to make sense of it and said it's not fair it's something that happens all the time but the administrators were trying to make sense of it when talking about having students in the office and when they would ask if they needed it has to get back to class they would say i never get stopped. they would always ask for the past. pass. so not only were black students talking about this, white students and others in the community were talking about how disciplined wasn't needed fairly or equally among students and we had similar patterns we saw in classrooms with regards to how students were disciplined and referred to discipline and how they were expected to achieve.

>> what does that have to do with test scores or academic achievements? >> when students come to school they are looking for a number of things particularly adolescents because we are talking about a high school. they want to belong. they want their peers to accept them but also navigate the context and feel like they belong in that context. when they are being hyper surveilled or questioned about if they belong and they are being scrutinized and punished for things to peers or not since strong message about who is valued and who is not. when you layer on top of that there is a perception that students who were close that were associated with african-american culture were more likely to be scrutinized and students who didn't wear this kind of clothing if they were for example a button up shirt and a pair of cat they were often assumed to have the best intentions to be good kids and if kids into the workload is associated with african-american culture, hip-hop culture they

felt like they were often more scrutinized and again this is something that was echoed among the tv for many people in the context if you have to deny a part of yourself to navigate the context that may lead you to feel like you are not necessarily a part. >> host: us your test scores are lower, your academic achievement is lower. >> i think what happens is if you feel scrutinized and feel less likely to be embraced as part of the environment that can happen but the other part of performance expectation is what teachers expect in the classroom so what we found is that black students talked about the fact that the teachers didn't expect much of them. administrators talked about low expectations that they experience for black and latino students as they navigated the school. parents talked about the expectations and those things also become a self fulfilling prophecy. they provide more or less access to the teacher's time and attention, they provide more or less access to rigorous