connecting with what's happening today with what has happened over a long period of time and you are traveling back and forth constantly between narratives of what we see around us and what you see around us and links to the recent past. from your study of history you say there are lots of reasons and a lot of it is hopeless but do you see areas where we have managed to escape or recover? >> obviously 50 years ago we could not have had an african-american president. i think what that means is we are prepared to have a society where african-americans with hard work talent and a lot of luck achieve great things i think we are okay with that right now. that is our progress. we obviously don't have enslavement anymore. that's gone. but this goes back to your

earlier question. when you think about how do we get there, i see people getting killed. even whatever progress there was great violence. and what does that mean about her fate and what does it mean about society in general? what does that mean about human societies period? i don't know. >> thank you for these. i would go to the audience questions. the first one is a good one. do you think between the world has had a -- "between the world and me" has had a bigger impact on the world or your son and do you wish it were the other way were the other way around? luft. >> it hasn't had much of an impact on my son. the book is written as a letter to him but nothing is actually new to him. everything in here is pretty much stuff that i have said to him so it's had no impact on

him. he has read the book several times. okay, daddy rights. [laughter] he likes the book and says it's a good book. what about that comic book though? [applause] i can't judge what impact it's had on the world. >> you did a little bit of this at the top. do you have any advice for students and young people who want to do what you do? >> yes, yes, yes, read, read, write, write, read and repeat. that's really the job. i think you shouldn't think too much about getting published. if you get published that's great and it's a lot easier now. make a lot about getting better. avoid any trappings of lammers.

avoid any ambition towards glamour. get adjusted to the loneliness and misery and the horribleness of sitting by yourself and facing a blank page. you can adjust yourself to that there are also beautiful things about, out of long time after. [laughter] but they will come. they will come. but i think you really have to adjust yourself to this sort of almost spartan existence of being a writer. i'm probably not the best friend i could be largely because of where my commitments are. you'll find yourself having to sacrifice that i think. don't drink too much. i mean this is real.

it's not moral advice. this is because writing is the job and it's a thing that has to get done. if you are out until 2:00 in the morning and you are not getting up until 2:00 in the afternoon you have lost time for practicing aircraft. don't go on drugs. avoid drugs probably. again it's not a moral argument. but the sanctity and the space if your mind is very important when you're writing. if you want to do a bunch of drugs and drink, go do something else. that's fine but if you're going to be a writer you're minding your clarity and your vision is so important. for me, i actually found and again this sounds overly moral but i actually found monogamy of having a child to be crucial. it's rooted me and disciplined me and put me in a place. i could not go out and do some things that people my age did. my son was born when i was 24 and i couldn't do a lot of a lot

of things to some of my friends in her 20s were doing but it actually meant that i had more time to write. .. >> >> this is one of the books

to help clarify things for me. americans generally believed the of problem in terms of racism that since you have several groups that do not get along. does one have more power than the other? if we could just get the group's to be a long it will be okay. it is the theory of race. it is in our vocabulary as racial relations. then everything is okay. racial discrimination if we can just stop doing those without a specific race that everything will be okay. racism comes after the race exist you we're doing something but that exist

already it is obvious. that is built on the notion that the blacks are a race of people that cannot of africa and agents americans cannot of asia and laypeople lough kim bravura. and increasingly has been taken latinas originated in the past 50 years or so. i don't know. [laughter] it just happened. they became another race. if they could get along then that is the problem it is the notion that race is that parents because they cannot get along.

but that is not how history works. there is no coherent definition of race whether white or black that you can man tate -- maintain. i am considered as a black person. if i were in louisiana in 1750 i would not be considered that. if i was in brazil i may check another blocked in south africa i may check colored we do when irish people came to this country or released they were viewed as very degrees of white. rigo there was a political process with these groups of people that became white but

it was a bad it was okay with their rival. even different races by which i read some have darker skin hailing from sub-saharan africa because interaction of their skin but throughout history that always is of the relationship it is right now. to read the 14th or 15th century that primary threat of europeans, the of the turks or muslims? that is part of being an christiandom. so if fewer eighth member you did not consider yourself black. this is a modern invention s

buick and for folks to be carried across oceans and there was the needed to you justify the labor. you could see the first coming in and then ends -- mixing with the intelligence service. in to relieve there are no laws against this all of that decade later. but then of what i am trying

to get you to see if it was ted doesn't think. is not the word of god for. this is evade decision policymakers him how he. >> the leatherleaf at stake

held with this book be different if you had a daughter? [laughter] >> that is my a river -- reflection of my senator have a daughter i cannot help that. >> now you're living in paris. are you going to read about blacks there? >> the sometimes it is a harder definition of a minority. [laughter] unless it is suppressive.

but in general to love them because there is no racism in new york and? [laughter] i love them all. but it is not escape in in the first thing that nisi is a up the american. at least over my skin color

by the way it is set for chitter action not i spent

my time studying specific things. and the african-american experience in this country is multiple layered and it

is very hard to have any general expertise. you can have that knowledge in specific areas. talking about the diaspora, it becomes that much hurt so what do we need that have senator curve -- and now they have plans african-americans can go there to get citizenship can we generalize that in a not broadway? >> not to insult the question at all. but i do think it is one that requires steady -- steady in more than i know right now.

they were made and how low do you respond to gentrification? >> repeated the. over andover. [applause] if. >> is it that black people spend less wealth. but the black people don't have the self to a nation if they want to leave. very soon you dote. we have a huge white gap for every nickel of the family

has a dollar per character and nature times the of wealth? version should win is that. >> but before you get to that huge wealth gap problem not the result of policy or reject not the results about social engineering in insists when we made this case we're made decisions in the social engineering. to say i am bader middle-class.

en to settle the 80% but the black people would move would not be a part of that. what would they look if we had not done that? will with the city looks like if african-americans have the same access with those great reforms in the '40's is the 30's. what is the difference? if we had made a decision to only offer unionized labor to certain people. what is the percentage of the fire department right now. he was so depressingly low with a number. on this route dash -- discrimination that that adds up. so when you start to say

what the hell's going on how come they cannot hold onto anything? if you were too late to. it is the fourth quarter with two of minutes left you are trying to win the game. you are saying why am i on my own to yard line with two minutes left? because there was a game that happened you start with the analysis right there you have missed it. if we get to the point to talk about gentrification he was struck for their back did not start here but that thinking some would show up and decide they want to live here and black can have that

power in the policy it made the most since. e-but to limit the ability of black people. >> the b share is a tougher question and that there were not human to you. do you still feel that way? >> no. no. a book but the summer of

2000 and he wasn't fired nothing happened. he was mistaken for another suspected criminal and charges are not even brought he wallace's goff to colleges served in the navy navy, has done everything in america to include yourself from her insurer in the.

>> all that great pageantry. they could be frank with you. put of course, he looks at george. they are victims of terrorism but my friend is as old as this has treated for him. that is how i felt then. one of the thing students is stick you can explain your

paid nor. but it is hard to choke about the decisions of said day. but that he thinks this scare right here with a wife and but i did in the charity doesn't matter how other

pepo commemorate believe with instruction. it is to use separate things. but i feel we can ask one more than we have to bring it to a close this and. hiring which comes first? political intention nor of his neck.

>> o is case for and have but we will be that there. [applause] ha hopper. [inaudible conversations]

[inaudible conversations] >> the first and primary reason for prison is the anti-social behavior iran to remove that threat keeps us safe whether they

rehabilitate the prisoner or deter future crime is a secondary concern. the of primary purpose is for people. >> so those that they have to engage with the community

to discuss issues that our important to them. >> it is an expense for people to have to stay and surprise and as an experience i'll look forward to the pub warren being or a

>> now that with greater different kind of entities by votes this afternoon, would it be convenient for the house to consider issuing different passes to the different types of mps so that would be easier for them to be recognized? >> now, examples of unparliamentary language have been ruled out of order over the years. but what about robot?

he tested a debate when refused to take an intervention. >> i was just explaining the terrible message -- mess they're making with the poor children are being left behind. know, if you wouldn't mind. you see, i would have been happy to take every single one of you robots getting your -- i would be happy, but the thing is, deputy speaker, is the proposal of your motion refused point blank to take me so i'm not taking any single one of you. >> point of order. i was just turning over in my mind whether the description robot for a member of this house would be considered to be derogatory. and i have come to the conclusion that in some circumstances it might, and in some it might not.

[laughter] and for the moment, for the moment, i am concluding for my own piece of mind that the honorable gentleman was thinking of a high functioning, intelligent robot. [laughter] and, therefore, for the moment i will not call them to order for the use of the word. but i'm sure the house will be warned that we should be very careful in our use of language. >> i'm joined once again by allegra stratton. plenty of sound and fury by the scottish nationalists that the english vote for english law. just a procedural adjustment, one consideration for english mps. was this a justified outburst? >> hypertalk of the i did when there's a particular english vote that will require any english or perhaps a welsh mps that the scottish mps in particular, they would come into the division lobbies and squat there and make the sound of fury.

because really there some principle involved but essentially this is a moment for them to megaphone home to people in scotland that westminster doesn't work for you and this is one of the other reasons why we should split apart. >> it's been an interesting meeting featuring the scottish person and the prime minister david cameron. conservatives and mps usually not much in common. you think the two leaders get on well? >> are told it's a pretty good relationship and that the to meet each other. to have slightly different imperatives. but david cameron needs to not let sturgeon have too many pops at him because he needs to create the sense that the uk is working very well together. sturgeon is a slightly different calculation. she needs to happen in the run up so she looks lectures to got them on the run and proving he does not have her people's best interest at heart. and more generally if the mp can

continue make the case but david cameron isn't really on your side we should put them away at the epson. behind the scenes they get on pretty well. remember her predecessor alex salmond, it was a much more contemptuous relationship and he was much more prone to orchestrate after the meeting with the conservative prime minister, or any prime minister and have some fun with it. that's not her style. >> the european union, we can't not mention it. the eu referenda. the bill has cleared parliament. the legislation is going alone. david cameron has had none a tremendously successful few months. it's not looking good for him, isn't? >> on quite surprised how they have handled this. it is looking good for them and that there's a view inside downing street they want to do this quickly. if you can do a june referendum

you can avoid the prospect of another migrant crisis, the images of people television trying to flee syria. council a tiny, tiny spike in support for the camp. the downing street is let's get this done quickly and see the referendum becomes law quite soon, allows that to be possible but the thorny issues that nobody yet knows where they will end up with is on his fourth issue of immigration and in particular tax credits. i'm surprised how they handle the. at the moment they are looking on the back foot. we are not getting what we want. imagining david cameron, not getting what he wants on tax credits. there's a series of compromises which are probably too complicated for your but if they can't is the league camp, if that can't can get up and running on immigration which is

what the prime minister wants in the first place, that could harm him spent 2016 to will jeremy corbyn spring a few surprises himself speak what i think that jeremy corbyn, i think he's around for a very long time. and i think that the key test for him will be the made elections. the question will be, if you have patchy results for labour. so it looks like they don't do well in scotland, maybe the touristy thing for second place by the digital london mayoralty, which is possible it could be jeremy corbyn has another fireball to protect himself. so after that point there' thera possibility in september that people close to him change the leadership roles or at least make it more clear so it's easier for him not to be challenged. essentially those who oppose him

have a window between may and september and i'm not sure they will be up to move against them. >> allegra stratton, thanks so much for joining us on the westminster review. >> total pleasure. >> we will see if the predictions in 2016 come true. true. parliament not only debates the big issues like syria and welfare cuts. they can also debate the issues slightly lower down their priority scale. in november can have our debate on these fellows. should the humble hedgehog becomes a national symbol of britain into for the nation with a springbok does for south africa and the kangaroo for australia? a conservative mp was concerned about the dwindling numbers of the british hedgehog. >> in a bbc wildlife bold, hedgehogs were chosen as the best national emblem for the british nation, beating the charismatic badger and the sturdy oak. the victory for the ultimate

underdog came about with 42%, more than 9000 votes being cast for the hedgehog. >> aristotle points out that the hedgehog carries apples on his spine into his nest your saville argues the hedgehog travels with a great -- grapes embedded on his spine. but i would like to challenge the honorable member that the hedgehog should become our national symbol. i ask you, madam deputy speaker, i ask both sides of the south because this is not a question that concerns only one party, but all of us, do we want to have as our national symbol and animal which when confronted with danger rolls over into a ball and puts it spikes up? do we want to have as our national symbol and animal that sleeps for six months of the year? or would we rather returned to

the animal that is already our national symbol, i prefer of course to the lion. majestic, courageous, proud. >> stewart showing some unique knowledge there about hedgehogs. a new year beckons. there will be no shortage of events happen each day in the comments and the lord so we will be here with our daily round of 11 p.m. each evening. for now, goodbye. ♪ >> has 2015 wraps up, c-span presents congress and year end review, a look back at all the newsmaking issues, debates and hearings that took center stage on capitol hill this year. join us thursday at 8 p.m.

eastern as we revisit mitch mcconnell taking his position as senate majority leader. pope francis historic address to a joint session of congress, the resignation of house speaker john boehner and the election of paul ryan. debate over the nuclear deal with iran, and reaction from congress on mass shootings here and abroad, gun control, terrorism and the rise of isis. congress year in review on c-span thursday at 8 p.m. eastern. >> three days of featured programming this new year's weekend on c-span. spent the first and i think primary reason we have prisons is to punish people for antisocial behavior and to remove that threat from society. prisons keep us safe. whether they are going to rehabilitate the prisoner or

deter future crimes i think those are really secondary concerns. great if it happens but the primary purpose of the prison system is are people who are not interest is to keep society safe from the threat posed by those folks. >> a little after eight race relations town hall meeting with elected officials and law enforcement from areas experiencing racial tensions with police. >> that's wha where it begins because they get the job saying, and do their job saying, on protecting the public. they are id of the public are those who gave them their marching orders and that's us. that's us who need to look at all the more we talk about transparency. we need to look at those rules that they have and start using to engage themselves with our community spirit sunday at 6:30 p.m. a discussion on media coverage of muslims and how american muslims can join the

national conversations. at nine young people from across the united kingdom gather in the house of commons to discuss issues important to them. >> this issue so much more than buses, trains and expense. it leaves people feeling disillusioned. as a child i could way to experience a bus or train journey. i look forward to the children chattering. however, when we grow up we see trains lose this one face up to forget the haunting forward word whether we can afford the bus or school tomorrow. >> for our complete schedule go to c-span.org. >> now, t-bird activist and journalist look at poverty, gang violence and drug addiction and low income communities in what's being done to address them. the center for neighborhood enterprise and the news platform opportunity lives cohosted this event. it's three hours.

>> good morning, to thank everybody for coming. we want to start our conference put on bob woodson, founding president the center for neighborhood enterprise, organization founded 34 years ago on the premise that people who are experiencing poverty are the experts on how to solve poverty. and so for the past 34 years we have been like a geiger counter that is going around the nation in some of those crime ridden a drug infested neighborhoods. and unlike at poverty industry, we go in looking for strengths. the traditional approaches to addressing poverty, they go into low income high crime neighborhoods and want to know how many people are raising children that are dropping out of school come in jail, on drugs.

when this demographic profile the good government, apply for grants that the government funds these professional organizations who then parachute programs into low income neighborhoods with the expectation that poverty will be alleviated. 70 cents of every dollar spent on the pork goes not to the poor but those that serve poor people. to ask about which problems are solvable but which ones are fundable doe this you. so as a consequence we've created a commodity out of serving poor people and we wonder why we have failed. and so i think, and also the experts at solving poverty are the professional social scientists. i've been in washington, d.c. for over 40 years, and whenever a conference like this is convened, each you will see academics, people who started the problem, and then they provide scientific evidence about remedies. but when these are applied we

end up with a failed remedy. i think so what we've done at the center is that we have brought the practitioners, the poverty warriors, the people that share the same cultural and geographic as it goes, those experiencing the problem. i feel like that we've had in the last 50 years with 20 trillion-dollar spent on the pork it's been like a team that is lost every game every year. and we never think about changing the coach, the players or even the playbook. and also i feel like i'm a fan that watches my team with all the best players on the bench, try to win. and so this conference is intended to change that, the dialogue. but in order to do so i think it's important to understand why we have failed to address poverty in the proper way. because you cannot generalize about poor people.

i believe there are four categories of poor people. there are those who are just broke. they don't have any money. a significant breadwinner has died our factory has moved away or the company went bankrupt and they're out of work. they use the welfare system the way it was intended, as a temporary bridge over troubled times. they use it as an ambulance service, not an entire transportation system. and then you have those that are poor and are in need, character iintact, but you look at the disincentives for working for marrying him to conclude that i'm going to lose more benefits if i am productive and, therefore, i'll just acquiesce and stay on welfare. the third category, those who are physically and mentally disabled, we must find a way to care for them. but the fourth category that concerns most of us are those

who are poor because of the chances that they take and the choices that they make a. they have character flaws, and so what the center for neighborhood enterprise does and the groups that you see here, we specialize in category four. our groups run the people everyone else runs away from. we operate within the zip code of those experiencing. they are what i call community at the bodies the most effective way of treating the human body in strengthening its own immune system. you don't start with a transplant. so we believe that is poverty warriors that are indigenous to low income communities represent a new source of knowledge, a new source, a resource that is properly resourced can really begin to bring about dramatic declines in poverty if we can only recognize them. as my friend bill seidman years

ago, the qualities that make them effective also render them invisible. they are not whining and complaining, they are not a part of the victims lead. they're not whining, not protesting anything. they are just busy doing to work. they are not looking for you. you have to go and find it. so we are just delighted to welcome you. after which were put have a panel of thought leaders that are in the audience that will come up from the second half of this and begin to respond to what our practitioners have said and done. and i've asked of them to share not just what they do, but why they do it. what is the magic sauce? what is it that some of people to response -- responsibility when prisons can change them, psychiatrists couldn't changes in, but somehow you inspired

them to want redemption in their lives and then you provided them with the means of achieving retention. and we want you to share with us what it is that you do that promotes of that kind of transformation in people the result in the restoration of entire communities. i'm going to ask my co-moderator, pastor buster if he would offer some opening remarks and then we will start, we want to dialogue, a conversation. >> now i kno i know why i am heo be co-moderator. i've been waiting to find out who i am and why i am here. thank you, bob. they think the board and the staff of the center for neighborhood enterprise for the work they do. they are some of the people i read about who were assigned the task of making brick without straw. that the group left the country.

but bob and his staff have persisted in this arduous task that is almost impossible. i do want to commend you for what you do. but let me just as co-moderator describe the assumptions that we are here to counter, that the presence of these panelists and those in the audience have consensus around. number one is that problems can be solved if enough money is spent. that's assumption number one. if the problem is poverty it is in the culture now a consensus that the more money government spends, the more commitment government has to solving the problems of poverty. these men, and women were invited but they are not here yet, so just know that those who

are concerned, these men are here to describe work that they do that really offers an alternative view, that the changes that happen in people's lives that give them the capacity to overcome poverty and other personal challenges is not dependent upon levels of spending of government programs. that's assumption number one. assumption number two that has seemingly gripped a great part of our culture is that race is the undeniable predictor of all outcomes, particularly when it comes to black people, african-americans, whatever term you use. and until the race issue is resolved, then neither poverty nor education nor any of the

social pathologies that we are concerned about can be successfully addressed, and that racism has a systemic evil is such a strong undercurrent, that until racism is eradicated, then we can reasonably predict that a disproportionate amount of black people will be stuck in poverty and in negative outcomes. these men will counter that assumption. the third assumption that we have is that the government ultimately is the preferred provider of services to solve problems. that government can do more effectively, that government can do it more efficiently. and what's going to happen today is that we are going to describe strategies that have tangible outcomes that were not, in fact,

performed by government. although there's a role for government, none of these presenters today will assume that the government could have done what they did better than they did it. further, there are times when the work has been inhibited by government. by government programs, government regulations. and the reason our presence urgent it is important, therefore, is because unless voices like these are heard, that we will continue to focus on assumptions, which lead us to historical, political, economic dividends. the war on poverty has led us to a very expensive dead-end. and after 50 years of fighting poverty with the government spending, we now see higher rates of poverty and we see even deeper wounds created by the presence of poverty. and so as we continue doing the same thing the same way, we will

certainly get the same results. so our hope that it is that you who are here and those who will tune in later as we record this will be able to glean from these experts, strategies that have measurable, irrefutable outcomes that will inform both public policy and neighborhood practices. >> good. i'd like to just start by introducing someone i've known for a number of years, and as i introduce you i will ask you to make remarks and then apple introduces the next person. but when this young man, omar jahwar was 23, working as a full-time paid employee of the texas prison system inside gainsville prison, and he was paid to do gain mediation inside between black and brown gangs, between black and black gangs,

and i was impressed with the fact that as a full-time employee he was also trusted by all of the inmate factions, and he roamed freely in that environment solving complex. and i knew that this was a very special person. so i said to him, if you can do this inside the prison you can do that inside the community. and so we summoned him out and help start vision of regeneration in south dallas. and i'd like omar to talk about how, what have you been able to do in terms of reaching gang members, reaching people that everybody else said are useless to even try speak with first, bob, thank you for allowing us to come and appreciate the opportunity to ship and as bob said on omar joe barr from dallas, texas. whawhen i was much younger and h smaller, i was a prison worker.

and i think the thing, i tell people all the time, to ask me how do they do that and i said you've got to be young and unintelligent. [laughter] but you've got to be a little bit offkilter would you can go in a prison into some of the i was doing. it's funny, i'll start with is stored in a to point. one of the men who was in prison, the way i met bob was a prisoner. he was leaving the prison and is going to, come to d.c. he was kicked out of texas. he did not return to texas. that's about his behavior was in the state banned him from being released to texas. so we found his aunt in d.c. until he came to d.c. but he was too motivated by what was taught him in cyprus and a brother called me and said, omar, i found his brother talks just like you, who asked just like you to go differences, he's old.

[laughter] i said, really? he said yeah, man. and so me being very, you know, i had a lot of federal, i was series about this so i called bob on the phone and i said to bob, if you are really that committed, brother, come to the prison. i was in my heyday and i was challenging him to come to the prison and do what you do in prison. he said i'll be there in a month. he brought his holding to the prison and did a book signing and give books away to all of the inmates and said, and then he said those words that he just said to you. he said those to me. if you can do this in the prison, but may help you do it in the community. so what we have done is we've asked that, in my opinion, the most effective tool to turn violence and gangs into soldiers were committed and who are not afraid, but usually the most underutilized because people are

afraid to talk to the soldiers. so if you don't know, you don't know how order to reach, you normally become a beauty, under siege by what you see. you can misdiagnose them as all useless, but they are the most useful tool you can ever have come is a person is committed and is not afraid. they are not afraid of the environment. they control the environment and they are committed. here's the second thing i want you to know, is that poverty and pain does not mean a person is not motivated. they may be miscalculated but it don't mean that they are lethargic. most people assume that those who are in poverty think that that's a permanent condition, but in their mind they are coming out some way. it just depends on if you're able to help them reach their goal of resuscitation, revival, whatever they're trying to do. you have to have someone who is saying your motivation is not

wrong. your tactics are. i used to tell young men in prison, i said, your character is flawed, but your characteristics have a market advantage. if i can help shift your character, would you let me use your characteristics as a leader? and they would say yes. because i'd never forget, i did a blood and crips peace treaty, and when we did our peace treaty, major gain in that area, and asked all of those brothers. i said i needed do an anecdotal diagnosis of you. this is that sociology. decisions by anecdotal diagnosis. i said how many of you on baby mama trouble? all raised their hands but how many have money trouble, how many are running from the law? i suggest some anecdotal diagnosis, what you are doing and working. [laughter] do you want me to help you? yeah. i said all right. we can start from there.

so i would dialogue and then i would come from their being victims or are they victimized. it was the condition is not permanent. can i help you change it? and so they've been will lead to the position of being a hero rather than being a villain. so when you transform someone found themselves it's easy for them to translate to others. so they started at themselves as a different person. and then when i would lead them to forums like this, this is what they were surprised with. they were surprised there were more people for them than against them. when they saw that they were needed they became more necessary. so it was harder for them to just erase their personhood. if i can objectify person i can erase them from being imported. but once you see that you have

value, it's easier for you to straighten up and do the right thing. i have some more advice. >> curtis watkins from washington, d.c., and we go back a ways, and, from the national homecoming. what is your response to omar saying that it takes people that perhaps have lived the experience, who are witnesses to others, that transformation is possible and that their condition is possible to change? what has been your experience? and tell us something about your background. >> thank you, bob, for creating these forums because they are so important because we learn from each other and we learn that our society is more like indifferent. my experience they somewhat omar said is that there's a human to touch but that lives a lot of

providers don't know how to reach people. they reach people through their programs, through a structure. and i'm not downing structure, but people want to be humanly touched. so the individuals we work with and work for, and i like to phrase, we work for. these people, we have relationships with. we build trust and build this respect that things get done. and then there's a higher expectation that is put on them as it relates to in order to be the person you want to be, you want to do the things that give you credibility in the community. that transformation takes place in a way that this individual, like in our case, we make sure kids get safely to school. that within itself at one point some of people to work with us were the people who were terrorizing the community. so now they are in a position where they're making sure people get safely to school to and from, the little kids.

data boosts their self-esteem and gives them credibility in the community were as people start valuing them and they start valuing themselves. this is so important. a lot of the people we work with, and myself included, were broken people. and this gives them develop to move from point a to point b. so the human touch is so important. a lot of people don't know how to get to people, human standpoint. but we offer that, i call it that entry that allows people to know that we care about them beyond nine to five. they can call us at any time and we are going to be there for them. and i want to say this one thing. recently in this community in d.c., which was jamie gray's first resident management pioneer community, i found a couple in that community who basically was doing something

different. their kids are extremely successful in the midst of living in a public housing environment with a lot of chaos going on, but the kids getting scholarships to college. they are successful on a roll, all of that. but she sure did something with a one day. and what she shared was that one of her kids went away from house and they did know where the kid was a and the community got in kind of like an uproar about because they thought someone snatched her kid. and took him to find a the kid was next door. and everybody in that community was waiting for her come once they found was a kid was, to go off on her kid and say something very colorful things to the kid and beat the kid. but what she told her daughter that day, she said, i care so much about you. i'm just, i just love that you are safe now. and everybody was looking after, almost like she was on a stage

and everybody was waiting for her to act out like what normally happens. what she did, she created a different trend in that community and she set the standards were she is a positive force. i learned from situations like that. i get the opportunity to see that on a daily basis so i feel honored and blessed in a very huge way that i get to learn from people who said that they are not teachable people, people cannot teach you anything because they are living in a certain condition. that's not the case with us spent and pastor webster, emanuel missionary baptist church in indianapolis, indiana, you live in one of the highest crime zip code in the city of indianapolis. and you chose to your churches that are instead of in the suburbs. and tell us about the very unique way that you have, i

visited your church many times, and iac hundreds of men pouring into your church that 5:30 a.m. >> i'm not one of them. [laughter] >> tell us about that and how you use your ministry to reach people as these gentlemen were saying, through your witness. not your advocacy. >> i think at first have to be crazy. but i want to say thanks first of all to buster for introducing a cheaper cuts first of all. and what you both represent. secondly, i want to say also we talk about poverty. i think poverty is multifaceted. i think it's not only deals with social and economic poverty, but from my perspective it's also spiritual, emotional and intellectual.

and i do with a whole lot of people in the neighborhood who only makes from zero to $20,000 a year. nine-mile radius, probably 20-30,000 people live in that area. it has been ranked as the worst zip code in the city of indianapolis. more people come from the penal system back into my zip code, and we could have moved out. you are exactly right. but somebody has to care. somebody has to stay there to save us. so we decided to build our new church in that zip code. the reason i started to camp, bob, is because they were so many shootings and killings in that neighborhood, i want to do something to help fathers and families. when we came at 5:30 a.m., i figured become a 5:45, you want

to know. we don't serve coffee, doughnuts. we don't give away food. i think if you make a way to meet people's needs, because all of us have unresolved issues on the inside, if someone begins to find out how to reach them and speaking to them, the guys will keep coming. i started with about 50, and 10 years later we probably served over 1000 guys right in that neighborhood. this year alone i've done a marriage boot camp, a father and since boot camp leading to father stated when i started it it was with inner-city people. now folk from the suburbs are driving in. which tells me all of us have some unresolved issues that nobody has dealt with. >> tell us what happens at, how many days to the commit to coming? walk us through a typical book camp, and what does that mean speak with boot camp stand for

because of others testimony christ has answered my prayer. all of us have a story. over his great sharing life stories on sunday, just type of stories. we do the same thing can we just not on tv. when they come in the morning we do aerobics. we have a principle of the day. one of the principles of the is like a law of diminishing intent. another principle which are within the work of life is not a dress rehearsal but it's the real thing. you only get one trip through to deliver. then we have groups, 20 liters with about 15 to 10 guys, along with a group of young boys between the ages, listen to this, six and 13. when i start to get more i didn't start of her kids.

but because of a single print households and the fatherless problem in america, robert putnam says in his book if we get five back and hope that they can solve america's problems. but my thing is trying to do that and how to do that has been very tough. but the boot camp now has a great success rate and not only getting fathers back into the home, we teach lessons but we also now offer life skills, number one because if i give him a job, if they don't have life skills they won't get their own show. or advocate them a job, they're liable to have some type of tension between their employees and and. so now we teach life skills and we've got the private sector coming alongside of us saying we will hire your guys. for instance, after we get through teaching we hold them accountable. everyday they get a text. everyday somebody contacts of them. everyday they have when they start the morning out with also a phone conference line you can

call in monday through friday of 6:30 to 645 time it. we give them those principles. we say to them you have a responsibility to give back to your society. 21 days straight, yesterday 21 days straight at 5:45 a.m. i have done that for over seven years. well, within the last three years i changed it from 21 days straight. id3 minicamps to you. i do come back with a camper indeed you can wander around father's day, 14 days in the fall. once a month we have and accountability meeting whereby we bring all these guys together and their sons and we talked abouabout the issues have to doh as a father, a husband, a man, a boy. we are nurturing single. boys who does have fathers in the home, and several now are enrolled in college. to have a mentor to follow them all the way through high school and college.

you get me rolling on this. this is my passion, but i think it's a phenomenon. i never meant for it to happen this way but when god gets behind something he introduces you to people like bob and buster and a coupon to get going and those positive things. >> that's good, thank you. we are going to discuss that, but i just want to remind everybody that the reason that we were able to get people together because congressman paul ryan, two years ago, asked me would i, and assembl assembla group of people, grassroots leaders in ohio? so he can learn. it was a month before the campaign was over, and so i asked bishop mitchell. we have leaders in every state. so i called marvin mitchell and i said marvin, i need within four days the names of 20 grassroots lived in ohio to meet congressman paul ryan.

so called them up and because she had the trust of them, i had the trust of them. that's how our network works. something that end it was interesting. we met in cleveland, cleveland state university in an auditorium. and paul ryan was a vice presidential candidate so he has security. i had to give them the names and events. i gave him the names and connor and steve called me and said bobby, three of these people with criminal records. i said i thought all of them did. [laughter] what's the problem? he said, i would get back to you. so they went to paul ryan. policy th baba trust them, i trust them. we came in and we shared with

paul, and pastor paul grodell was the principal. paul said to me, bob, do you think that we can lay our hands on paul and pray for them at the end of the meeting? i said, i'm not sure that works with catholics. but let's try. [laughter] so after that meeting was over, and you could see secret, when he came in, seeing this guy with somebody else, i got all uptight and i'm telling you they were in tears midway through. and when pollock up and put his hands, we all gathered rental and printed i look at the secret service guys and they were just in tears. paul says it had a profound impact on his life, so that's a good segue into -- >> and i want to thank you because you to come and rescue me because i was the last one in line to go back there and the secret service got in front of

me and said you can't go back there. and i said i'm within. they go, no your not. [laughter] i said i really am. for whatever reasons they didn't believe me. [laughter] you had to come back and rescue me. >> i came back but i said no, he came on his harley with his wife of 30 years behind and i said yeah, he's one of those. can't you tell? [laughter] >> so thank you, thank you. it's been a blessing to just meet you and hang out the privilege to be part of the family. >> talk some about you spend we passed a church, my wife and i pastor a church in ohio and it's actually in a place where it's 54% poverty rate. and the lord led us there. it's not a normal place where you would think about starting a church, but the lord called us

better. 21 years ago i was one of those attics that was running the streets shooting heroin, and this was before the heroin epidemic that started this country. but 21 years ago i was that guy. i was hopeless. i did know where to turn to. and somebody reached me with the gospel, changed my life. and since then always been in my heart you never forget where you came from. and so we started that church with a principal. and so i ended up meeting greg hu, that was part of the comeback series. and i remember meeting greg and going to his mom's house, and he had struggled and fallen a lot of times but i was just there as a witness to show them, anything is possible. so what the amazing thing, so now what we do as a church is we reached the people that would

normally not come into a church. so we go out on the streets and we need people right where they are at. because we are them. i mean, i think that's a misconception that people have about other people is that you know what, we all struggle with something. so we have a staff of about 15, 16 people on staff at church, 90% of the people on our staff are former alcoholics and addicts. and so it's a domino effect it takes a person that's been there to bring hope into somebody's life that's currently there right now. and so that's the basis of our ministry, and we are currently right now working on opening up at home for attics. and that's why meeting and you will was such a blessing because what he is doing down there and san antonio is exactly what we want to be doing th but we are doing that now only on a smaller

scale, but as you told me, we need to hang out with people where we want to be. but again, it's just, we are meeting people where they're at and working with people to get them off drugs, alcohol, and to show them hope, what it's about. >> we are joined by pastor shirley holloway, again, another place where paul ryan visited, visited bishop holloway twice. here and in d.c. i've met or maybe 18 years ago when this executive with the post office of pastor comes from a family of pastors living in the suburbs and went to speak at a homeless shelter with all her playing on as she said,