they had social media what they have done is take their recruitment rather than handing it out a flier each week they can reach into the internet cafe or to reach young people around the world so that is a powerful difference. so if they have done a good job to use that technology then we have then slow to catch up and down thankfully you see those efforts trying to confront a new theater of warfare. >> water your thoughts?

>> it really isn't that a new. they always used the tail at the time. you very river in the old old-- half better truck that looked like kiev office to put out the media in an oddball dash london. it is the broadcast media that was the figure in the vat babies. there is the propaganda is of the state isn't the isis way is revolutionary compared to that of other groups. a lot is given a loss tibet

that the seoul '88 but it your testimony you say to talk about the good guys that are heavily outnumbered >> yes. look as they condemn the islamic state. most newspapers or television stations or public leaders muslim or non muslim so if you look at the world war production of media, no doubt there are more of us they of them. people are searching for this type of stuff with a subculture with that niche day radically outnumber everyone else.

>> memory is an organization founded s.a. a pie in the year from the middle east to the voice is the use of words of the region such as terrorism and reform in the up muslim world and to present the tools that is key information what exactly is being said in their own words? people say one thing in their back but we try to present that reality is accurately as possible. >> we need to recognize just

like extremists have in the oven government quarters of the world from northern mali they have taken the vantage of most of the of mcgovern to space existed and social media. >> it is a good thing. em that defaults the position. some of those are poisonous. to take advantage of service so or technical meador technical space to use that as of what bin of radicalized people. >> has isis been effective in their use of social

media? and today have a responsibility in your view? >> use the event of a collision choking in the past some people think there is a right in the constitution but obviously there is a right to to free-speech to talk about those parameters are fundamental to our society. we regulate speech and have concluded certain types should be prohibitive god forbid if they were with child pornography that would be prosecuted and would come

down. but they are asserting there is this sacred rite of social media that we have a right of speech and we have to have that debate - - debate with terrorism. in those to finally acknowledge the tremendous platform but they should not be appropriated to do their bidding whether recruited or fund-raising you ask if they have been successful then it you would see them reach end and the reason in as deal is

successful terror group in history is between money and oil the way they reach the foreign fighters of is the recruitment effort around the world recruited men to their shores. but alberto made a valid point to understand where they come from. we have to deny them the ability to take down as many of these accounts as the key and but to take down a social media account and if they do come back even if they are less effective and

tries to identify and craft messages so we advocate messages to joey in the jihad. >> do you agree that there is a responsibility of the service providers? >> at the very least there needs to be a conversation that is a common-sense first step in "forbes" magazine to say is an abused even the terms of service and at the very least so yes i agree with that. >> park wallace, you say

this sad truth is extremist have spent more aggressive with their social media platform bad government and the private sector has been to track that. >> historically i believe is absolutely true. thank and alberto has been on the frontlines and underfunded. now you see a lot and this discussion reflects the interest of that area. and a lot of people coming at this from different places to minimize their reach and by messaging to send a message is nine at an

idea of a or a path if a foldable person did you half to divert them there you will see much more attention than the scene of these terror tactics young people recruited many are dying in their family is devastated. where we start to see the footprint of other locals that have radicalized or those borders and then commit homegrown terrorists of an western countries so it is important to see that grow regroup to deal with of

well-positioned -- what is a shed. >> ambassador? >> they are big steps but basic steps and the use of isis propaganda is uh that working that day half. but with real power is there a deaf it is the story the end of the world and a rigid and lifestyle and rand coated hecatombs structure. we need to do those technical steps weedy to get in their face and answer them. there is a lot of discussion

and some of those are silly but they are some basic idea is that our proven to be somewhat effective over time >> butted york testimony you say isis messaging is presented in a wide range that many approaches are not full of violence. >> most are not most are state building or somebody paid the a pothole or give dignity to where we go. -- or a widow but the second type of category is something is combat camera.

a or battle footage it should state in the air against the bad guys that it is made for us. the grotesque violence. most of the message of what they want to recruit it is not though period and crazy but we're used to. >> but the push back. you have the countered meredith with the social media and i also believe that countered narrative chase is the year accord at the end of the rigo. we have to do it be smart about it but we are fooling ourselves to suggest the

state would not find a halt to do resonate that is why it has to be a combination is a poor analogy the of the ball then subject to telemarketers and an overhaul. with the stock broker sherry a penny-stock. that kind of wonder who would answer? but obviously it works. and in some ways not to minimize that, it is one isis is doing.

and they will always find people at will resonate in. i don't believe the counter narrative in isolation but prevent them while convincing egg some bond -- some blood they are wrong. >> call to of ted the war herb cup of cocoa and a blanket but what i read is the phase that will cut them down to size. the number one encounter narrative is military victory. to crush them on the ground to show with them as losers. the state building and the combat video to lead to victory if you can show them losing territory or elements

of weakness that is the most powerful narrative we use that is of the real world. so that most powerful narrative and with that prophesied that everyone says. there are some people from the bitter dead end but if people see that as the loser said they are. we have a challenge of the physical state to end is

under military pressure and but dash virtual state that is very aggressive fox so that reality catches up to that engaged of the of propaganda. >> candy b are like-minded but by using another comparison the war on drugs became a proxy battle and saddam advocate that it was all about poverty i think he would attend did the panel put out a wonderful

comprehensive report but it is across the board they count from different backgrounds because of the deal logical perspective to cut into play people want to superimpose the last second to be countered meredith. -- narrative. >> that is off the wall they examine those 44 affairs roped same-sex marriage was the way to combat isis. >> ambassador fernandez how does your group monitor terrorist organizations. >> we are a the pioneers we

don't wanna turd terrorist we monitor everything. of development of political and social field and a large part of which whether isis or hezbollah or a crazed cleric who says cut the heads off of the jews because that is what we want to do. reproduce rapidly and to provide analysis of the political and intellectual trends. >> physically how you do that? >> all school. 24/7 across the world

peopled and washington, the middle east his you know, the language cheaply and our native speakers who are looking on line, but twitter, television, and people that are steeped in what you see in into put it into context. >> ambassador? >> they have the resources for all of us but we try to understand the narrative because operationally we have a team of people fox -- in brussels and london and berlin that we try to

monitor social be via of those recruiters. he describes these as networks. agent in fact, even though the bibbers rage the 30 or 40,000 accounts, the network of those is not nearly as fast. we try to monitor to understand where they are. so ours are very targeted with social media with much of that trade has been laid out. and did terms of recruitment twitter was then gave way

and typically they would go to another platform or have the of 101 dash one-on-one conversation and and then proceed to a secure message she to have a secure conversations with their own potential recruitment with played tickets and a border crossing. >> if you call it secure but somebody had that company knows that conversation is happening? >> it depends i hate to give such an answer but what they should note but the

phenomenon of social media and what bin as there are other areas that our troublesome to secure messaging of your phone is cahow where people feel they have a right to have a secure discussion but those ads have access the of different types of platforms to what we have heard from general copper and others to suggest that secure messaging is a bayonet of the security services of a potential terrorist. to say privacy and secure

communications and i think that sounds serious with eddie executives to take a hard look to provide a great service to people but a banner of appropriate due process six that they tell promote terrorist attacks. >> alberto fernandez this brings up the issue of some of the tech companies are against. >> we all realize our role of social media but we do have a problem there is a telegram there was a report of church read -- german service and russian and and

things got more difficult for isis relatively speaking they would move the telegram. the number of my language was arabic. it was not love letters it was terrorism. but it wasn't that telegram replaced twitter but that is our they are exposed telegram has a clear message ge cap -- applications that refers to a secured communications and we have to shut that down and not allow communications but it is a change feet of twitter as a final baking go to race

secure messaging app but that chain of communication telegram was the key and we are hoping we took some statements out of a telegram that they to do better. >> what would you like to see the u.s. government and others do to mitigate the use of social media? >> a starting point that our current law relates to lou terrace for support that could read a lot of different names. that you would give them a weapon but a hunting knife except in their hands of the

killer you could have a robust discussion and that they are on notice the platforms are abused. those of which we have proposed that tonight the abilities if we don't we have to have a robust discussion they become material support there is a lot under consideration regarding this. >> you cannot gestured a blind guy to say we have a right that is serious than they need to be part to have a robust discussion and we're not there yet hopefully we'll get there with discussions like this.

>> i agree with that. the biggest up we can't take to reduce this threat is to be more serious and more intense that is the best propaganda you can make yes that ideology that is poisoned and rampant but with this problem taken from them and reduce them from where they were when they were still killing people doing terrible things that they did have a state that is what they presented as. >> president of the bill eased research is a to former u.s. ambassador and an saddam came into the

united states as a refugee from cuba. mark wallace seal of counter extremas of project former ambassador to the united nations serving as general counsel and senior adviser and can paid better true georgia w. bush to thousand four. . .

>> ray fines and steven spielberg's shinder's list.