>> continuing on this christmas day, craig shirley, the author of last act, final years in emerging legacy of ronald reagan, good morning and merry christmas. .. when manchester wrote death of a president, so various presidents over time have had books written about their passing or their presidencies. midnight at monticello, but no

one has written eight book about reagan's post- presidency, so it seemed appropriate in the idea came when one of my sons, mitchell, was sitting in the kitchen highlighting these big binders of material i got from the reagan library in every time reagan's name is here he would highlight it for me and he said to me one night, has ended-- has anyone ever done a book about reagan after his presidency and that was the beginning of "last act". >> host: what do you focus on specifically as far as post- presidency? >> guest: i use the funeral is kind of the baseline and then i do flashbacks and flashforwards, so it's really the seven days each chapter represents pretty much one day although, there are other chapters as well of the funeral, but i do a lot of flashbacks over the last several years of his presidency, his retirement and obviously that

alzheimer. >> host: if there is a main message you want the folks to get as far as his post- presidency and his legacy what would you wanted to be? >> guest: i don't know if it's the beginning of the dichotomy of american society or a continuation. i suspect it's probably both anyway. for the entire week of his passing, the elites were very rough on ronald reagan both personally and professionally in terms of his legacy. paul krugman, for the "new york times" wrote there was no economic recovery when in fact new jobs were created and the washington post openly criticized the state of reagan-- and nancy reagan's marriage how he had proposed whether women in the point is the elite media and elite academia were very rough on reagan, but the american people that otherwise.

there was to menace outpouring that rivaled john kennedys and president roosevelt outpouring when they passed away both here in washington and in simi valley first when he late-- not stay, but he laid in the library, the presidential library and over 100,000 people in less than two days came to pay their respects and then here over a day and then again, well over 100,000 people came to pay their respects and back at simi valley as the plane lands appointment do and makes its way ironically on ronald reagan highway, 101, back to reagan library, is that hundreds of thousands of people turned out just, and every day people turned out along the highway and they had to shut it down because there was just tremendous outpouring. >> host: to your points a and a clear was emerging after reagan's in the national media were schedule and on the other

hand those who got reagan work nearly all complementary. he was a good president and president-- [inaudible] c2 that was representative of literally thousands of people who either showed up, wrote the newspapers, called up the networks. every time the networks veered off into being harsh on reagan some switchboards would light up at cbs or abc or nbc of the people call it as saying knock it off. >> host: ronald reagan biographer, craig shirley, joining us to talk about his book, "last act" that takes place in the post- presidency and if you want to ask questions headed reagan approach this idea of shaking his-- shaping his legacy. >> guest: he very much resisted -- he once told lou

cannon who is probably the official reagan biography and he was-- you know, buchanan asked reagan about his legacy and he just resisted and said the american people will decide that. i did my job. i'm proud of my job. as far as legacy, not to say that he wasn't interested in how people thought of him because he did write his autobiography and his post- presidency because i think like churchill-- churchill once said history will be good to me for i intend to write and i think reagan wanted to frame how history judged him as well because he wrote his own biography. >> host: you write a lot about nancy reagan. how much of a role did she have been shaping his legacy? >> guest: you cannot be married for over 50 years and someone once described nancy reagan as a -- she used to say-- she would

set up her, you know, our zone and munching on apple and he would be sleeping soundly and that was because she was worried about him and he how people perceive him and his decisions as president and going back to his time with the president screen actor guild. she took off-- active interest in not just the life, but also the times of ronald reagan. >> host: not just his image, but policy decisions as well. >> guest: no, she did not get involved in policy decisions. she had her office on the east wing and he had his office on the west wing and there is a mop-- a lot of mythology put out there recently that she was the palace guard and she approved a people that entered his office, which is absolutely not true. she said she could. she slept next to the president of the united states and she could offer it, but she didn't get involved in policy, so they

had a happy marriage in that they each new what the other was responsible for. >> host: and so you write in the book as far as him weaving off and dealing with alzheimer's and before we go to calls, a bit about alzheimer's, what was the initial reaction of the reagan family and the president himself when he found out he was diagnosed with a? >> guest: the family was devastated. he had mrs. reagan had been going to the mayo clinic every year like clockwork-- clockwork for years to be tested both psychologically and physiologically and he passed every with flying colors and alzheimer's as i understand it it's memorization, series of colors, series of numbers and things like that. it was only until 1994, the spring of 94 when he was already six years out of office that he showed was considered more than age-appropriate forgetfulness and it was later diagnosed as alzheimer's.

he was told later that fall, november, the first weekend in november. mrs. reagan already knew and of course, she was devastated because it's a death sentence being told you're going to die. we all get up in the morning and part of our ability to go forward is the unknowing of when we will pass, so the getty-- up each day knowing today we will do this or that whatever, but when you are told you have alzheimer's you know you have a finite amount of time left, but so obviously mrs. reagan was devastated. he was told by the doctors. took it in, understood it completely and then he went and he sat down and started writing a letter and his chief of staff at the time, brad ryan, said mr. president, what are you doing and he said well, i guess

i better tell the american people and the so that was the letter that was released in november of 1994 announcing his alzheimer's. did it with bravery in connection and humility and with very much his christian spirit throughout the letter. >> host: some of the lines he wrote, and open our heights we hope this will provide greater awareness and will encourage clear understanding of the individuals and families affected by it and now begins the journey that will lead me to the sunset of my life and i know or america there will always be a bright dawn ahead. >> guest: your reagan and he's think about other people, not think about himself. he's talking about the future of america, which is bright and he also expresses a lot of concern about, you know what the affliction does to families and his own family including nancy about the slow descent into alzheimer's.

>> host: first call comes from providence rhode island this morning and this is jack for biographer craig shirley, the author of "last act" looking at the final years of president reagan. jack, you are on. >> caller: good morning to you, pedro and a merry christmas to everyone there. that the reason why i'm calling-- i am a fan, okay. you know, people to realize, yeah, the media detested ronald reagan. they were, you know, supporters of okay republican establishment what bothered me too was george hw bush during the primary season took ronald reagan writing and before he pretty much quit and ronald reagan was beating him decisively in that bothers me a lot. of people don't talk about that. secondly, here's the key question i want to ask, bill o'reilly, i call him a highly

intelligent hedge fund or. i will tell you why. because his book, okay, about killing reagan, he really doesn't really emphasize his greatness as presidents when confronting the soviet union and actually defeating them by going on on offense of posture, the only ministration to do that because he really is a fan and he tried to hide this but-- >> guest: as far as george bush, he is referred to the 1998 contest. reagan, we don't live in a system of where you inherent the presidency. you have two complete-- compete port and george bush thought he had every right to compete for the nomination and i'm sure reagan would have agreed. he fought tenaciously for it, but i think it speaks well, both

to ronald reagan and george bush that ronald reagan selected george bush as his running mate. he served loyally for eight years and reagan gave him a lot more responsibility than most other vice president scott. he had an office in the west wing, which was a new phenomenon in american politics, american government and he was selected by ronald and nancy reagan to give the eulogy at the national cathedral. so, what started out as a political rivalry, and in fact sometimes it was very very toughly fought between gorge bush and ronald reagan ended up being not only very good friends, but very very respectful of each other and george bush said in his usually-- eulogy, he said i learned more from ronald reagan than any other man in public life for national politics. >> did he write that they never even had dinner together in the west wing of the white house.

>> guest: that is true. that is probably another issue, you know, that i can't explain. the reagan had their own privacy in the bushes had their own privacy, so they did not actually dined together, although reagan and bush had lunch together every thursday without fail. reagan, you know, wrote a number of nodes when he was leaving office to incumbent president bush and they made reference to all miss my thursday lunch, so in some ways they are probably closer personally than any other president and vice president in american history. >> host: republican line, dave up next. hello. >> caller: good morning and merry christmas. you know, there is a widely held promise, that i think the media has helped promulgate that president obama inherited the worst recession since the great depression, but i'm kind of in economics buff and i remember

early in reagan's first term in office, the unemployment rate actually reached 10.8%, which was four tenths of a percentage point higher than the highest unemployment rate under the obama administration. but, the economic recovery under reagan was twice as strong as it's been under president obama. the gross to messick product grew at about 4% compared to 2%. there were nearly twice as many jobs created and i can only think of one reason for this and that is that reagan's economic policies were the exact opposite not only in his predecessor jimmy carter, but of our current president. now, i know that sometimes people like to ignore the facts or reinvent the facts for political or ideological reasons

, but facts are stubborn things and in this case i think the facts speak for themselves quite quick-- clearly. >> host: that's david in california. >> guest: the color has a good point, reagan inherited an economy that was a negative growth. unemployment was already at 7.5% and climbing. jobs were actually being eliminated from the economy because it was actually contracting. then, on top of that he also had , which economic textbooks and economists say is possible was a shrinking economy and inflation. usually when the economy contracts you go into a deflationary cycle, but we had rising prices and falling jobs, which economists would say is impossible and on top of that possibly high interest rates which were 18, 19, 21%, so you had double digit inflation, double digit interest rate and unemployment rising rapidly.

reagan was in many ways confronted with the worst economic calamity since the great depression, but the collar is right. he brought inflation down from 12, 14, 16% down to less than 5% and he brought in just rates down from 18% down to seven and a half, 8%, very-- much more tolerable levels. he created 19 million new jobs and when he was-- what he left office the deficit was falling the last two years of his presidency. so, supply-side, tax cuts type monitor of policy and back to work created probably the greatest economic expansion in american history because 19 million jobs created over a series of short years, actually. in fact, it didn't stop until the third year of george bush's administration. >> host: democrats lied, eureka, california. hello. >> caller: good morning.

especially on this special day of the year. people never talk about the one thing that i want to say. i am neither for nor against reagan, but everyone talks about how great reagan was. movie actor, governor of california, great smile, great person, but one thing he did that really burns my whatever is that he broke the air traffic controllers union and no one wants to talk about that. have your guest to talk about that. have a nice christmas. >> host: also talk about why this still resonates. >> guest: because it was such a momentous decision and by the way, merry christmas, color. i have an old friend that lived in eureka for many years that worked in the reagan administration. peter hannaford was a paid greater-- two reagan and

speechwriter. this was the height of the cold war and we needed a safe and secure in her transportation system, both commercially and otherwise. ironically they had endorsed reagan and they broke the law because they had a signed contract. they had to report to work and they broke the law when they went on strike and reagan was not going to tolerate it, so he gave them a certain amount of time to report back to work and if they didn't, so he quite justifiably fired them replacing them with new air traffic controllers in the air transport system remained safe and on time. there is a mythology that the soviets were somehow, you know, it's probably true they were paying attention to what reagan did with the unions and i don't know if it got into deep analysis, but george scholz who

is reagan secretary of state said that clearly this was unintimidating factor to the soviets, reagan's toughness in dealing with the air traffic controllers. >> host: how do you think that either the immediate or those in washington reactors raza reagan legacy to his ending the cold war? >> guest: i don't think reagan has ever gotten the credit. i wouldn't say he ended the cold war. i would say he won the cold war and there is a concepting cold war history of that soviets gained ground from the end of world war i they gained ground against every american president up until 1981. no soviet leader ever willingly gave up power. the soviet union basically surrendered because reagan, you know, the mythology as he spend-- sent them into oblivion which is only partially true. he used all the powers of the presidency. he used the bully pulpit to break the soviets and he used

the cia to help the covert operations in nicaragua, and to help the solidarity in poland. he formed a vital pack with pope john paul the second and margaret thatcher in presenting a united front to the soviet threat. he used many many powers at his disposal, not just the power to increase defense spending. he used all that to break the soviet union and, in fact, he did. when the berlin wall was coming down and he's already a couple years out of office. he went on nightline and later told buchanan he always thought it would happen. he just didn't think it would happen so soon. >> host: from little rock arkansas, independent line, you are on, go head. >> caller: i wanted to ask this question, i used to be

administrator myself under the bush's-- bush should ministration and i'm not really educated on reagan administration, but i do know a little bit about him. i just wanted to say why, he under reagan did he put money where it belongs or whatever like that? i said put money where belongs and redistribute wealth. >> host: okay, call or. we will let our guest responded. >> guest: reagan believed he used to say the best welfare check with a paycheck every two weeks and he believed a growing economy was the best way to lift people out of poverty in a matter fact, he did all of this in the 1980s and shipped it

showed the night-- party shrunk and wealth grew larger and he also included block grants, instead of the federal government determining how to spend money they would simply give it back to the states to let them decide how best to spend it, so he was very much believed in the federalism, which was that in power of the states and less power in washington and he put it into practice. >> host: because of his background and previous history as a democrat, did he ever show populist tendencies? >> guest: very much so. he comes out of the populist midwest, which was a hotbed of anti- concentration of power and he was always suspicious of big corporations and big banks and when he announced for presidents when he would take on gerald ford in 1976, he specifically

mentioned the corporations as part of the problem of washington, big labor, big government, big corporations because he believed in all concentrations of power were inherently dangerous. he was very much a-- infused with a populace anti- washington, anti- concentration power world view. >> host: how did that jive that with those republicans in congress. of gingrich was coming and playing everything else. how did that relate to republicans generally? >> guest: most of the new republicans that came in and newt gingrich is a great example because he came in as a reagan republican and as a matter of fact, bob michael was less enthusiastic-- he was a good guy, but minority leader, but, you know, he played colquitt tip

o'neill in this and that, so in many ways gingrich and jack kemp and bob walker in a couple other young firebrand members did heavy lifting on capitol hill and got it lined up for reagan's policy initiatives. reagan in a way creates new publican-- a public and party because the republicans rising up in the late 70s and early '80s and even today have a different worldview and saying the republicans new deal era. >> host: pat from pennsylvania, democrats line. thank you for holding on. you are on. >> caller: i'm really surprised to hear all of this supply side economics reaganomics, trickle-down theory, voodoo economics as it was called by opponent simon wasn't that begin-- maybe there was a boom afterwards, but it seems to me that was the beginning of the state we have now with the tremendous imbalance of, you know, money in the bank with 1% and billionaire class has

benefited from all of these capital gains tax reductions and didn't it start there and i would like like the tax when reagan took office with the capital gains was and has it slowed it down over time to where it's really no-- low now and i just think that's what started-- was the beginning of this total imbalance now and that's really, you know, killing the middle-- middle class and really bad thing he did was take the solar panels of the white house i mean what kind of, you know, forward thinking was that? >> host: thanks, color. >> guest: he took the solar panels off the white house because they were not working and because they cost more money to maintain them what they saved in terms of electricity, plus a statically they are really really ugly and when people look

at the white house they want to see something that's treasured and memorable and important and they should have a certain amount of pride when they look at the white house as the official residence of the united states and carter put the solar panels on, which did not work and were also on top and quite ugly, so reagan quite naturally took them down. as far as-- it's interesting that call or mention capital gains and honestly the middle class grew during the right-- reagan presidency, but the 86 tax bill is that while the institute's three top marginal rates, lowers the top marginal rate from 90 to make any 5% lowers it to 20%, but he also increases slightly capital gains tax. that was part of the compromise with the chairman of the house

ways and means committee who reagan negotiated historic tax bill, which was actually the last time we have had to-- significant tax or form in this country, but i think also is that this was the populace reagan. he viewed earned wealth as more important than inherited wealth and about-- so he allowed the marginal rate of capital gains to go up while the trade-off was that the top marginal rate lowered dramatically. >> host: from tennessee, arthur, democrats line. good morning. >> caller: yeah, i think reagan will go down in history as one of the worst presidents we have had because the union i think was set up so these big companies could union bust all of these people down through the years. he was nothing but a union buster. >> guest: reagan was the president of the screen actors guild and was the first act--

president to be in union. he was a card carrying member and when he's became president he still had active membership in the screen actors union and he said in his 66 autobiography that he was a rabid pro- union man and he was prounion. he questioned collective-bargaining whether or not that was appropriate and he also believed in the rule of law is that they had signed a contract with the united states and part of the contract included not to going out on strike. they went out on strike and broke the law. >> host: our guest is craig shirley, his latest book, "last act: the final years and emerging legacy of ronald reagan". did reagan ever feel anxiety in

the sense of not being in power are not having political office when he left? >> guest: not at all. it's interesting, because he wrote in his diaries the next to last day and he kept diaries all eight years and he's one of the few presidents to keep an active diary all eight years he was president. although, they were secret and no one really knew about them at the time. he wrote that tomorrow i stop being president and then home to california and the start of a new life. he is 77 years old and he is looking forward to a new life. i think that's remarkable about his personal sunny optimism is that it was always a new day. there were always new opportunities and new optimism. don't forget had he just not been present he had been governor of california and president of the screen actors guild award, successful actor, successful broadcaster, so he

had a lot of successes, not to say he didn't have a lot of failures, because he did. he had a lot of successes and obviously the presidency. he was proud of his presidency and he said so in his farewell address to the nation in january of 1989. but, he was ready to move on. >> host: you right in the story bill clinton's renomination and president reagan looking at that thinking he could get involved a. >> guest: he was at the ranch watching one night with dennis leblanc who is a very close friend of the family and they were watching the chicago convention 96, and reagan grew visibly agitated and frustrated that clinton was being renominated. dennis said he did not elaborate -- dennis did not elaborate, but reagan was a republican. he was a loyal republican. >> host: to the idea he never really wanted rick to reenter some form of politics to the office.

>> guest: no, but he gave a lot of good speeches. he spoke at the houston convention 92. he gave a lot of political speeches in southern california. he met with gorbachev twice. he went to the office every day. he was quite active in the post- presidency and gave a lot of political speeches. >> host: tell the story about him after he leaves office, he set up his california office already. people are calling him to see him and he's the one picking up the phone a. >> guest: he and mrs. reagan had gone back to california. the plan was they would-- they had a new house in bel air, and they would go there basically relax because he had been president for eight years. they were tired. so, they were setting up an office and in century city because they picked up office building where the movie diehard had been filled and secret

service wasn't really happy about that because they picked on office that had been just been blown apart in a movie by terrorists, but they moved in. i think it was on the top floor of century city. so, staff is opening up a boxes, hanging up pictures, filing and everything to set up an office. reagan calls in a couple of weeks after being home and says i'm coming in and they thought they had a couple months to get ready, so they were scrambling around in putting together a makeshift office for him and they were all in taj will dress and reagan comes in, greets his staff goes into his office and just the door. a couple hours later he comes out with a piece of paper and he has a two credit line is as i went meet with these people and fred scans the list and does not recognize any names. he said you could meet with these people, but who are they and reagan says they have been calling. as it turned out when they install the switchboard the lines had been crossed so

instead of phones going to the switchboard of the receptionist answering office of ronald reagan or president reagan they were going directly to reagan's office and so while she was sitting in there twiddling her thumbs not answering the phone, these people are calling and ronald reagan answers the phone and says i went to talk to ronald reagan and, hey, you're talking to him, so i went to come meet you. he said okay. anyway, this long list and fred goes ahead and schedules a time for each of these people to come in, meet ronald reagan and get their photo taken with reagan and one guy calls to set up the meeting and says-- says this is great i will bring my neighbor and fred ryan says look, buddy, lightning struck your wants it will not happen a second time. but, everyone-- everyone who called and reagan answered the

phone, they all came in and got to meet the president of the united states and have their photo taken. >> host: let's hear from lynchburg virginia, democrat line. >> caller: this is my second time calling. c-span for many years, the subject of ronald reagan, but let's be truthful about a few things about ronald reagan. and the one, iran contra, which oliver north took the blame for him. number two, this is the beginning of the middle class dumbing down during the reagan administration. overall, we have not had a republican president balance the budget since they write the eye has-- dwight d eisenhower, so i don't know why a lot of people save reagan's success, you had to enter 41 marines died in the

middle east being bombed overnight and nothing was done about that. i can go on and on with pilfering from social security, he took money from social security to help pay for tax cuts for the well-to-do and this has been a situation go back as far as reagan presidency that the middle class has been really suffering under every republican president. >> host: okay. we will let our guest response the two i am writing as fast as i can. no one said the reagan presidency was perfect. they were human beings involved and sometimes human beings have the best attention and iran-contra remains a blemish on the reagan record. reagan had nothing to do with it

and he said so in his diaries, but he took the responsible before it and went on national television took the responsibility for it. what oliver north had started covertly in the ronald reagan white house. reagan never would have approved plans that went against the federal law and it went against the federal law. it prohibited the use of american funds with the nicaragua and contract, so no one said it would be perfect, but i think-- well, actually the color is wrong. the last president to balance the budget was not dwight eisenhower, it was bill clinton and bill clinton together with new gingrich bowed the budget for several years in a row because essentially clinton had embraced reaganomics, which was less government, more tax cuts, on federal spending and spending of the private economy. >> host: craig shirley joining us. i know you won't have the

current day politics, but i went to read something that michael reagan, ronald son, wrote about donald trump because we are talking about donald trump and the nature of the gop. he said trump is nothing like my father. my father united people and that's why he won election. is in the process of killing what's left of my father's gop any spends most of the time during people off of the republican press-- bus. is that a fair statement? >> guest: it's open to interpretation and i agree with michael generally, specifically is that there are two things about trump that i see that are not reagan, but like reagan and what is that he challenges the status quo. reagan always challenged the status quo. the second thing is that he talks about the future, a brighter future, which again is like ronald reagan. going out of his way to insult women or minorities or hispanics

or whatever, no, that was not reagan at all. in that regard i agree with michael. >> host: as far as the children are concerned, what was the relationship with reagan and his older children and you saw this play out especially during funeral in the event there in california with nancy. >> guest: i suspect it's like most presidential families. they had the high points and they're not so high points. you know, most families have their problems, but not under the glare of the national spotlight. john adams had his problems with his son. james madison had a stepson who was a compulsive gambler who lost so much that dolly had to sell montpelier to sell of his debts and fdr children said they never knew their parents and bill clinton had his problems with his half brother roger.

so, by comparison, the reagan's children problems were pretty tame. he loved his children. he grew very close to them-- i mean, they were always close, but they always had differences and sometimes they played out the national media, but after his presidency and during the alzheimer's, they grew especially he and patty-- he and maureen had always been close at hand michael had always been close and ron came much closer to his father in that post presidency, so in a way his passing brought them altogether. >> host: from our independent line, john, chapel hill, north carolina. go ahead, please, you are on. >> caller: good morning, pedro and craig, and merry christmas to everyone. a couple of comments about my thoughts about what i recall about president reagan.

i am 73 years old. ronald reagan, if i remember went to philadelphia mississippi to dog whistle his way into the white house. i also recall his stand on south africa. he and margaret thatcher but like crazy to support the regimes and i remember-- i believe that he referred to nelson mandela as a terrorist. that is the ronald reagan i remember. i also remember that he was a bit against big government, but yet the lodges-- largest building in washington dc has his name on it. that the ronald reagan that-- and there are many other things i can say. i appreciate the gentleman that spoke earlier about the marines. i am a former marine.

but, i don't see the ronald reagan that you see, craig. i can't forgive him for that because i lived through it, so those are my comments and merry christmas. >> guest: well, let me take the last thing, the easiest thing first. he didn't choose to have a building named after him. that was an act of congress. as far as he didn't go to philadelphia, mississippi, he went to the county fair in mississippi and the campaign or in 1980, but it was the same county fair that michael dukakis addressed and jimmy carter addressed and so this idea that, you know, reagan once refused to join a country club in los angeles when he found out they had a policy that did not allow jews. he refused to join, so this was probably them-- one of the most nonjudgmental men have ever elected president of the united

states. regard to south africa, i mean obviously he a poured apartheid, but he was also fighting the communists, so he had to figure how to thread this meal where he institutes a policy to desegregate south africa while still keeping south africa in the anti-communist hole because it was strategically important. it was important terms of the soviets, so he engages and announces and then puts into place a policy of construction of engagement. now, apartheid had been in existence in south africa since the time of maybe george washington. yet, fdr never did anything about it, john kennedy never do anything about it, harry truman never did anything about it and jimmy carter never did anything about it. reagan is the first president to institute policy to bring about desegregation, so it was a tricky political maneuver. it actually worked, but the idea

that reagan was a racist is nonsense, there is no basis on it whatsoever. >> host: lets here on a republican line, mike, hello. >> caller: good morning. first of all, we are really picking apart these people. jesus said that he without sin cast the first stone. you know, until jesus runs on the ticket, we are always going to be voting for the lesser of two evils. you know, isaiah 700 years before the birth and number three celebrate today, he prophesied. he said to us a child is born to us and government will be on his shoulders and he will be called wonderful, almighty god, prince of peace. do you know one thing i want to point out, there is a common thread among our presidents, the one to our successful, let's look at lincoln. lincoln embraced the same scripture that ronald reagan

embraced. that is found in second chronicles:'s seven 14. it reads if my people are called by my name and seek my face and turn from their wicked ways then will i hear from heaven and will forgive their sin and we will hear-- heal their land. reagan wasn't a perfect guy. when he was in office i was a card-carrying member of the united autoworkers and i disagreed with a lot of things, but now it that i look back i have to agree with what he did. the firing of air traffic controllers, they broke the law. they broke the contract. they were wrong. ronald reagan was not great. he made a lot of mistakes, but he listened and gave your too many counselors and he listened to the greatest counselor and i believe he listened also to the mighty counselor of whose birth we celebrate today. >> host: thank you very much.

we will let our guest response be to i think america has been unbelievably fortunate because virtually almost all of the presidents we have had have been men of good intention and men of good faith and that goes from george washington to president obama. i don't question president obama's faith at all. some republicans would question policies. none should ever question his faith. abraham lincoln sometimes said that the only way he could find the answers was on his knees. george washington and franklin roosevelt when he was here on december 8, 1941, his final words to congress, we shall gain triumph so help us god. all presidents, i think, have been men of good faith and we shouldn't question it. may be the policies, but not the faith. >> host: maybe the mistakes that

ronald reagan ever expressed a major regret. >> guest: he had deep regret about they root. he was angry about iran contra and he expressed that in his diaries and expressed outrage of oliver north. >> host: he did not get invited to his funeral if i read it correctly in his book. >> guest: yes. >> host: because of that? >> guest: yes, because the administration major embarrassment and there was talk of impeachment, not that it was serious talk or it would have gone anywhere, but there was talk of impeachment because washington was in a firestorm during iran-contra and 87. yes, he had some regrets. he regretted that tempered deal in 1982 with tip o'neill because the deal was that there were supposed be $3 in spending cuts

for every 1 dollar and tax increases and the tax increases came and the spending cuts never came and he never did really another deal then with tip o'neill after that. >> host: augusta, georgia, democrats lied. tommy, hello, go ahead. >> caller: good morning and thanks for taking my call and merry christmas. >> host: cohead. >> caller: number one that trickle-down economics, we still paying for that now. number two, the around contra thing, i believe they let the drugs coming through here to. number three, beirut, over 900 marines were killed and look how they drugged hillary clinton out over benghazi. number four,-- novel. >> caller: that's all i had to say. >> guest: there was debate early in the most-- of ministration of 1980 about federal assistance

for school lunch program and some bureaucrat tried to float the idea about labeling catch up it's all lost in the sands of time now, mythology has taken hold a 900 marines did not die in beirut. obviously, 247 men died and he regretted it and regretted going into a. as a matter of fact, he wrote in his diaries that he later came up with five points for conducting military warfare including having it-- a very defined mission and beirut did not have a defined mission. they were simply there, but he learned. he wasn't static like most men. he learned and adapted to change. >> host: because you use the funeral as a theme for the book, talk something about how the planning for the funeral when you refer to something called the book. can you tell that-- that viewers

what that is. >> guest: early in an administration, early in a presidency they could every modern president and basically says, mr. president, do you want a public or private funeral and if they say a private funeral then they say thank you for your time and they go on their way. if a president says i want a public funeral then they begin the planning, military district of washington begins planning with white house and later staff in retirement whatever it is, library or whatever else, how to comport themselves and how long does it lie in state in the rotunda. is there a motorcade? what type of flowers? who selects the speakers? who is selected as pallbearers? every imaginable detail that you can imagine including, you know, his interment service-- ceremony at sunset on the cliffs of simi valley at the library of

california as the sun is going down, bagpiper playing amazing grace and reagan participated in the plane. he met with them once a year or whatever and they would select pallbearers or speakers and then in retirement, so it is constantly evolving document, which fred ryan tommy at one point if you keep changing speakers and pallbearers because reagan kept outliving everyone, but they finally got it set as to planning, motorcade, millet-- military, flag lowering of the flag, there were events at every military base in the world. there were 21 gun salutes at every military base in the world. can inspire, all of this, the bell was told for you times for the 40th president, all of this goes into the planning, which by the time of the reagan funeral is literally a

play-by-play composition of everything that is supposed to happen, who is supposed to do what, where, why and how. >> host: from maryland, independent line. here is robert. >> caller: how're you doing this morning? >> host: good, go ahead. >> caller: i wanted-- one of the things to disprove about mr. reagan as well as nixon and george hw bush as well as donald trump, they all played-- nixon talked about the silent majority, which everyone understood was a plate to racism. mr. reagan went to philadelphia, mississippi, bush went to willie heart thing and come is doing the same thing playing on the prejudices of people, but really bothers me as during the nixon administration, they imported--

during the reagan administration oliver north and john poindexter , the largest distributors of cocaine throughout the minority community and yet they were on television saying lets, you know, say no to drugs, man. it has caused a tremendous amount of harm and minority communities and this is just some off-base. and another thing about mr. reagan, one of the things that i disagree that seemed like all of the time he was in the cabinet meetings he was always sleeping and he was surrounded by people like-- mrs. reagan forced mr. reagan to fire and these corporate people just literally took over and destroyed our country, man. right now that economics is

having a tremendous negative affect on our government, our country. >> host: robber, thank you for the call. >> guest: i don't know where to attack this. reagan left office in january of 1989, with a 40% approval among african-americans, which is astronomical for a republican when backed eisenhower's. when he left california, one of the things he noted was that he had appointed more african-americans to high-level positions in his government in california than any previous governor in california history not included pat brown, local democrat who was predecessor, rural warren, liberal who was predecessor, so this idea that reagan again, he did not cut of philadelphia. he did not go to philadelphia. >> host: the falling asleep story. >> guest: it's just not true. there was a picture of him

working at a cabinet meeting and he later assigned it to his chief of staff, jim baker, and he signed it dear jim, ci do other things besides falling asleep in cabinet meetings. i don't know if he did, maybe he did, but in his defense were probably pretty boring affair. >> host: for our last call this more, this is georgia, ken, on our republican line. >> caller: good morning. thank you for taking my call. i would take issue with a lot of the callers who dispute ronald reagan's trickle-down economics and it's with great dismay, even these many years later that people think of their entitlement of that which comes from the government and remember that government cannot give you anything. at first as to take something from you and ronald reagan's

policies were great policies during his president to put this company-- country on its right track and i would maintain that many of the policies and i watch this program and i wish i could remember where i saw and who was documenting it. it was like a public broadcasting station one night, that many of the conservative republican policies that reagan instituted were largely dismantled by the succeeding presidency of george herbert walker w bush and i believe today with the increased deficit and think about trickle-down economics, trickle-down economics with ronald reagan was that my money being spent by my choice would help grow the economy and that rising tide would lift our ships. >> host: we are running short on time.

>> guest: this is a theme running through about trickle-down economics. a created a 2 million new jobs. it eliminated inflation as a threat, which is a threat to the american republican countries have been destroyed in the past by inflationary spirals. trickle down economics led to a dramatic lowering of interest rates. trickle down economics led to a turnaround in the american faith in their government and the future, which in 1980, and a lot of told pollsters that their children's future would be worse by 1989. in every measurable way whether you call it reaganomics or trickle-down economics or conservative economics or whatever else, it worked. it worked. i don't know how many times i can say it. >> host: other themes are laid out in the book, "last act: the final years and emerging legacy of ronald reagan" written by biographer craig shirley. thanks for your time this

morning and merry christmas. >> this week and on the tv on afterwards, fox news correspondent james rosen looks at the life and political career of james-- dick cheney. former alaska governor sarah palin on family, faith and community. william jones recalls the march on washington, plus the additional effect of the american workforce, the federal rivalry between our exam to and -- for complete television schedule, visit book tv.org. book tv, 48 hours of nonfiction books and authors. television for serious readers. >> well, they told stories about their labor and they told stories about the ways they were hired, about the kinds of treatment that they got from their employers. and they told stories about

history. one woman who i write about is named geraldine miller, who lived in the bronx. she was an organizer and domestic worker here in new york city and worked-- lived in the bronx. she told stories about something called the bronx slave markets and these were street corners during the great depression where african-american women stood while they were waiting to be hired as day workers. miller told a story about women who were waiting on the street corners and employers would come up and look for the women with the most scarred knees and she told the story because women would look for the most scarred knees because those were the women who scrubbed floors down on their hands and knees and miller told the story is a way to, i think, highlights the exploitation and occupation, but it also became a platform for report-- reform, so i she told the story, she told the women,

we are never ever again going to scrub floors down on all fours. >> fascinating story because of course, we associate what sounds like a shape up. we call it a slave market when it has to do with women, but the shape up was a common way of hiring unskilled men to do manual labor and now you have uncovered a moment where women go through exactly the same ordeal, so what looked like a gender difference for a lot of years turns out not to be one. >> absolutely. ended the term a slave that market was actually given to those street corners by ella baber-- ella baker and marble cook which were to african-american organizers here in new york city who wrote an exposé about the treatment of domestic workers during the great depression and it's interesting because that name stuck and it stuck for women organizers in the 1960s who probably had never read anything

about the slave markets of the 30s, but had certainly heard those stories and those stories became part of their organizing tool box. >> you can watch this and other programs online at book tv.org. .. how columnists and cartoonist and the one is an award winning rapid novelist and author of nonfiction books about