the federal bureau of investigation provided the same check-in i was one party's vetting process. some campaigns wouldn't be comp

triple being given a choice that was offered to them so you have a process to do a completely new and you don't know whether the course of the process issues will develop. i can think of an example a number of years ago where a medical issue arose. it required an adjustment in the process and so this is a responsibility and it cannot be rushed. we basically look at the possibility that the parties might find one or the other and that could happen for at least one the parties this year that the nomination procedure the nomination would be in doubt all the way to the convention and a they hurried last-minute process for selection of the nominee is a disaster given the recommendations we have made for components of the well-structured process.

>> charlie do you want to weigh in on this too, the core process? the other thing out there of course this year might be an unusual year, we don't know so our recommendation certainly are that all the campaigns need to get owing on this. maybe there needs to be someone that meant depending on the circumstances of there being several candidates. nonetheless i think we all thought it's ideal to start now and to get something going now. >> that's right and i've recommended to the media and today through this presentation in both parties to start right now with the creation of a process on selecting a running mate and begin the process now. what you really have to do like in our party where we have a real tough three-way race for the nomination which is likely

to go to a contested convention on multiple ballots they have got to pick people they can set aside for campaign activities to work full-time on this and the candidate has to devote some time to it because the candidate has to have a long list in mind and they have to bring it down to a small list. we will talk about betting next time so i won't get into too much detail about that. they have gotten permission from people to set so yes i hope everybody will start now and go ahead and do it the right way so it's fine if we nominate somebody at the last minute on wednesday night and hit the running mate on thursday morning if they been vetted properly and you have them show up at the convention i guess. >> a couple of other recommendations relate to the

sense and the nature of the information you are getting from these candidates, asking the most personal questions and that information is floating around in the campaign. we have thought about how to deal with that and also thinking about what rules out the vice presidency so maybe i can start with matt on the sensitive nature of the information out there. candidates have to think about who gets to see it and how it's held in what to do with the information afterwards. do you want to answer that? >> the prisoner ran her vice presidential selection process did a great job. it's a balance. you need to have people with a political background to go through these materials and best certainly has that but there is sensitive information is included and for example the campaign manager i recuse myself from looking at that information and i relied on bath and

governor to identify any flags that existed that would disqualify somebody during the vet. it was really easy to do and the reason i did it at the time i was 38 years old and i thought there was a chance and there probably isn't any more that i would do another presidential campaign and i didn't think it was proper that we would one day run for president ourselves and it turns out many of the people on our list have and will in the future. in fact it's important striking that balance. i did it and i don't think it impacted my ability to provide any recommendation as mitt wanted at the end of the day. like charlie says it's a very personal choice. it's about the person at the top

>> you can speak to that if you would like and i want to focus on our last set of recommendations which is thinking about the vice president's announcement as the beginning of the rollout of the fall campaign and how it relates to the convention and how you do it and what pitfalls to avoid if you are announcing the vice presidential selection. >> thank you john. in reports we described the election and it is the first decision of the presidency so it's an incredibly important decision. the governing decision as much, much more so than a political campaign position in the tozzi something about what kind of president that nominee is going to be like who they pick the process by which they have chosen the person in the rollout, the announcement of the choices. is the opportunity for the nominee to really communicate with the american people.

what were the important things he or she looks for, so what is important to me when i think about this from a governing perspective and what was the process that they used to give people a sense of how they are going to approach important decisions of their presidency so this is the first presidential level position and it needs to be communicated with the public and that contacts. there has been a lot of years that have changed how presidential and vice presidential rollouts but it has to serve a dual purpose of communicating something important about the nominee and also introducing the vice presidential nominee and a very different light if they are well-known or not very well-known. as the opportunity to introduce them to the american public. even if they are extraordinarily experienced elected official and even if they were running for

president in that cycle and have the opportunity to participate in debates against the eventual nominee they don't know that nominee's position and they are going to be the principal speaking about their records, what i believe what i have done and what i voted for to be a hit in effect a spokesperson for the nominee. it takes a little time to get up to speed so traditional you don't want that person to have to be out there answering a billion questions right away simply because they need to have a little time to actually learn the nominee's positions and get used to the idea that they are no longer just speaking about their record and their beliefs and what they have done but they are speaking on behalf of the ticket so they become in effect high level people which is a different goal that most elected officials are accused of playing >> that's another reason why it's so important. the partnership begins immediately and you have to have two individuals that are familiar with each other, have

had time to think about each other's ideas which paul certainly did on campaign buses throughout wisconsin and everywhere else in the country and it matters. i do think the element of surprise is important and i think we were able to pull that off in 2012. i know, scott couldn't be here but for senator abdul senator dull loves to practice and he was able to pull it off. this is a guy that knew everybody and is involved in politics that he could essentially pull that off and have a surprise there because he had built-in chemistry. at times it was not his. >> i would like to add to that that in fact dull and kemp knew each other very well. they run out the sides opposite sides of issues like taxes and they didn't particularly like each other, but it was a series

of meetings that scott was able to manage to have dull sit down and meet and talk at length for hours without it getting out to the press. jack was able to say look i know who's in charge of the get elected and i will be loyal to your agenda. i hope we will be open-minded and consider some of my ideas. dull rejected the gold standard meeting by the way. just kidding but they not only developed a way to work together and jack was it terminus acts that -- asset and it turned out the economy being so good i'm pocan -- build being such a good candidate but jack was a positive addition to the ticket and most people that you ask in either party would be the head of the party had he begun to be president.

the other interesting thing is they probably have never gotten together, kemp and dull would have gotten together before jack was on the ticket after the election all the way up until the time of jack's death they got together as friends very briefly. >> i would add one thing and we will go into the show that in which everyone here knows it's critically important that in addition to the vetting process which is you know the extreme personal information that a campaign manager didn't want to see and political consultants should not see because they may end up against these people at some point and they should know these negative things. but the public vetting process or public research process that goes in a parallel track that the campaign can do and do research and giving occasions offices will undertake which as you go through that public record. in the case of joe biden that

was a public record that began when he was elected to the senate in the early 70s. that's a lot of votes and to go through that record and to start looking at those different issue positions start thinking about how the campaign is going to answer those questions and identify common themes so a public research process that goes on at the same time as in tents and -- intensive private vetting process. >> i'm going to give a warning to the microphone and ran. we are going to open up question surely but i want to give a chance for one last -- and then open up for questions the way you please identify yourself. >> other than the part about my ranting about the governing decisions that i cannot stress enough than one of the other points to be made about the

partnerships between the present and the vice president that had governing consequences is the message that was sent to the staff. that is to say it reduces the likelihood that you are going to have friction within the west wing and the old executive office building vying for stability or control or access to policy because the principles that made it very clear what the role of the vice president is and the president and the vice president are unified. i think it's extraordinarily important and i would also underscore finally a lot of the attention that's being paid understandably because of the political process and we all understand that a lot of that a lot of the tension would be paid to the political significance of the pic. this is an extraordinarily tribe ties behind closed doors choice that has massive governmental consequences and that many respects a process by which those consequences are prepared

for and addressed have been outpaced by an evolution store hope would be to help constructively think about how it could be done that is equal to that. >> the last point i would emphasize john is a privacy point about the information that is gained in the vetting. it's critically important but also the more privacy. so you embarrass good people when they don't get it. everybody will have to develop a short list. it's the only way to make a decision but the more private you can be and if you were embarrassments for people who don't get it the better. >> i know we have a mic here and we are going to call on you in the audience and you should identify yourself so why don't we start right here. don wolfensberger with bpc. i think you'll agree it doesn't

really matter that much much which state the vice president shall candidate is from in terms of making a difference with voters but what about other factors like religion and socioeconomic that ground, things that maybe will resonate more with voters? does that make any difference in the selection? >> to open us up to the panel it's not a choice about the political convention. about what they candidate thinks is politically important so for example in mondale's choice of geraldine for a about what kind of the candidate wants the political decision made and that's an example where questions were raised about how the entire bidding process worked and whether it yielded the best possible result.

anyone suggesting there is in some political elements of the communication, to the choice and you put your finger on a few. >> i wouldn't put -- on the ticket. [laughter] i'm against putting one on at the fact is there are a lot of appeal to the people like joe biden and his blue-collar background and the fact that he has never been a person who became wealthy. it does allow him to relate very well do a lot of average americans and i think it's been an asset to the presidency. you take that into consideration but it's a total sum of the man or woman and the chemistry that matters the most. >> i would just add that of course it's important. i think their religion piece

again if you are trying to make a statement but what is important at the end of the day is what are you saying to people with this joint ticket? for instance in 1992 bill clinton took a very oncoming sean joyce and al gore. they were from the same region of the country for example. they were both pretty much from the same part of the party. a more centrist part of the democratic party but it was a very generational message. two of them together in their chemistry was quite good and gore was obviously qualified to run before which i regard as a huge asset for anybody entering the process. you know when john mccain. sarah palin in 2008 she had a reputation certainly an alaska of a reformer and mavericks similar to mccain's profile and they think that from a messaging perspective part of

that consideration when she was someone who stood up to special interests and that taken on some really tough issues in her state you think about what are you communicating i think that is as much a part of it, what are we going to say about this ticket. it's a political process too. >> that's right there's a political dimension to every choice you make on the campaign but recent history shows the candidates that qualifications listed individuals that were the most successful vice presidential running mates. >> wide-awake go back here in a blue striped tie. >> hi i am a first-year law student to look -- interested in election law and my questions rather than talking about the individual and pac that the person on the process maybe he

could talk a little bit about how technology could play a role for the process of electing a vice president today knowing the 2008 election cycle the idea was to announce the vp candidate i text messaged him may be looking at a way of maximizing the interest like three different process might have an impact on the election. >> i will start, and 2008 the obama campaign announced they were going to let supporters here who the vice presidential nominee was rather than giving it to the press first which was consistent with an approach we have in the campaign of communicating with supporters and building a basic community of grassroots supporters out there. it didn't quite work because a network raised on a faulty hairline report reported that the part of this organizational and we wanted to get peoples

cell phones of the good communicate with them on an ongoing basis in the campaign. i think clearly there are to the campaign slogans -- continue continues to dennis sanders campaign has done an extraordinary job of the someone is to build a strong community using a technology to allow them to communicate directly with the voters in a way that used to be done by political parties at the grassroots level and specifically with local leaders communicating things. i think technology will continue to play that role. i also think technology can be used certainly in congress to bring pressure on nominees in a huge on line effort to take this person on line pressure so in 1984 the public pressure from the women's group that the democratic already needed to have a woman as her vice

presidential nominee to signify that women had arrived in the political process. in a very powerful way so i think it plays a huge role. >> you want to say a little bit about the fed and social media and the new thing that we have to look at. >> you talk about technology is certainly going to impact the effect and right now there are some young man or woman that is leaving for social media footprint as we speak that 20 or 30 years from now they are probably going to regret. >> we have a front running candidate for the social media footprint. >> there will definitely be regrets and people have to be cognizant of that. i will play in the vetting and how the world what is perceived

with the footprint that is left behind. >> i think the children of potential candidates that the vetting process has to include them in a way in a much more cooperative like simply because anybody who is under the age of 30 has been living in a social media world that their parents didn't grow up in orin happened and has a big footprint that you don't necessarily want coming out or at least you want to know about under the nominee having to answer for everything ever done on social media. >> to question the back here with a the bow tie. the mic is right there. >> following up on this line of question and answer given the eagleton event what features are in place now to avoid having that type of event occurred?

>> and four younger audience members --. >> i won't be able to give you the timeline he was a senator from missouri. that's a very good point. highly articulate and very well received and well-liked in the senate and then it turned out that postelection it was discovered he had undergone shock treatment and therapy for depression and we are in a different world now arguably whereas then that was a trigger for an immediate outcry that he couldn't be a suitable candidate for the vice presidency and certainly couldn't be one heartbeat away from the presidency and eventually he would have to resign. he was replaced by sergeant shriver, a cousin by marriage of

president john kennedy selected by the democratic national committee as a recommendation for the nominee choice for governor. what it currently happened was he had been asked a all-inclusive is there anything else you want to tell us question and he chose not to disclose this. so you have to get everybody's medical records. and i mentioned earlier if there are questions have to be run down. right now as they pointed out there are probably a lot of people that don't remember this episode terribly well but it was built into the process and dived into the fabric of the vetting process right now that you would never say to a candidate -- candidates will always be asked beyond of those questions are the open-ended questions or anything you want to tell us that we haven't thought to ask you but to the extent that there is a path that the campaign can travel to trust and verify and

explore the areas where like radical history and their own initiative with their own due diligence that is what they are compelled to do. >> the 1972 convention at which senator eagleton was nominated for vice president actually helps the chaotic convention and it was one with the nominee of our party didn't get to make his own acceptance speech until 2:00 in the morning. this is probably one of the examples one could use as why you don't want to rush these things. it's a contested nomination all the way into the convention and probably not as much time spent on this in retrospect as they would have wished. >> we can hear joel waldstein on the second panel. we will hear from him but this really is the timeframe where the vetting becomes much more serious starting in 1976 but the

other point you passed over a little bit of an very there be cases where the party has to come back and pick someone else. they didn't reconvene the convention of the party leadership. >> once again the candidate, they look to mcgovern the second timer brown saying who would you like to run with and by the way you can imagine the number of people who are raising their hands have diminished significantly. >> that's right and the importance of the decision cannot be overstressed. this reflected very badly on the governor's leader. he wasn't going to win that election anyhow but he didn't need this distraction. you want to pick a good vice presidential nominee and then you don't want distractions. i used to say and i still say two days after the rollout of the vp if you see the vice

president a candidate on national news is bad news. >> okay, why do we go here? >> i am kay a department laborer employed. you think the electorate would be ready for an all-female ticket? >> it depends on who it is. i absolutely don't think there are very many voters who would vote based on the gender of the ticket but if you put somebody on there that is otherwise not popular or does not vet well and becomes a distraction it would be a problem. but in the end these voters, 98% of them vote for the top of the ticket and the vp doesn't make that much difference. if they become a distraction or a negative that makes a difference.

>> i think any challenges secretary clinton is having in our primary art because she is a woman, it's because people find her dishonest and untrustworthy. that's a whole other problem but it won't impact who she takes as a vpn that won't disqualify anybody. i think on the shortlist i think there will be quite a few women pretty think senator elizabeth warren on secretary clinton shortlist as she gets pulled more and more to the left and i think the other people including senator jeanne shaheen up in new hampshire. >> i would say it is actually just a woman's perspective. a great electioneering in which the one candidate to who in both parties is seen as the most qualified and experienced candidate the one most prepared to actually, who has the best credentials to be president as the woman.

i think in public polling it's been very clear about this in focus groups as well -- who is qualified and who has got the right experience, it's a woman this time so it suggests again that it would depend if people thought it was a choice it was because it was a qualified person ready to be president than i think people would be happy to accept that choice. if it's seen as a political play people would be skeptical like anybody else. >> i think we have time for one more question over here. >> ms. dunn you brought up if a vice presidential nominee is not well-known that it's on the campaign to really debate the groundwork to introducing this person to the nation and i am young. i have only had six elections. in my life the person the

marquee example is sarah palin. how much do you think media played a role in introducing sarah palin to the country and i asked that because i feel that a lot of people's first impression of sarah palin was tina fey on saturday night live and they looked at sarah palin the rest of the election has more of a comical unfit or unintelligent person as was played by tina fey to people's perceptions of the ticket and mccain as a whole. how much do you think video plays a role in shaping the vice president? >> they play a huge role which is one of the reasons you want to get these correct. you can go back and look at public polling. this was a very well received nomination initially and if you look at the coverage for the two weeks after the republican convention the race was never

closer than during that period and i can only tell you the obama communications director was getting all these questions he is going to lose the women's vote in your trouble that polls are so close which we didn't think because underlying it was a choice. tina fey didn't present those problems, okay? [laughter] and her interviews and public appearances she said things that gave tenet a the material to create an extraordinary impression of her. that came right out of her mouth. it's a gotcha question. the media doesn't invest in these things. it's why this public use in

addition to the private setting the public these is critically important. you don't want to put someone out there who is not prepared. in 1988 and the report touches on dan quayle. he had very little time to get prepared and he was united states senator. and pretty well-liked as colleagues. he had been around for a while but was totally unprepared for the different level of attention that you get get when you are suddenly a candidate for national office. the. >> this leadtime where suggesting if you give people on the shortlist to spend time not just for the candidate that the staff to drill them and debate them and make sure they are willing to take advice. in governor palin's defense she was picked and probably had two hours of that kind of breathing before she rolled out. later in the election she had a very good debate with joe biden which is not easy to do.

joe biden is a great debater but that is because the staff spent a week with her practicing drilling in training. but it was too late to recover from the tina fey stuff but any that is right on sunday night september 14 to mccain's campaigns tractor -- tracking poll had us three points ahead the lehman brothers went under and the great financial crisis started in two weeks later we were 12 points down. it was the luck of the job. >> we are going to wrap up this panel and we will make a quick change of the people on stage and moved to the next i want to thank all of you here and all of task force people. thank you. [applause]

[inaudible conversations] >> won't come back. and the director for the to box a -- democracy. this is the second panel of our day selecting a vice president advice for eyes presidential candidates. i have announced the members the working group in the beginning. we had some on the first panel and we have some more here today we are also joined by one of the countries leading experts on the vice presidency if professor of law at st. louis university and several books and articles on the vice presidency but the author of a book that has just come out, the most recent off

the presses the white house vice president say the path to significant mondale divided. i recommend this book to all of you. it's for sale outside. there are many virtues of about the book, the history and it might be the only book about the vice presidency that does not tension john garner's famous characterization of the vice presidency which i will not repeat here but i guess we could say the book is a book full of warm thoughts about the vice presidency, deep and warm thoughts. what i would like to do in this panel is to talk about the vice presidency. we have joel here and maybe i can begin with joe. we have two big questions here. one is the role of the vice presidents significantly over time and your book is the most

important time in the vice presidency beginning with walter mondale. could you give us a quick overview of how the world of vice presidency is changed within the ministry should? >> painting with a broadbrush for most of our history the vice presidency was an elected officer and that was true-up to the vice presidency of alvin barkley by and large who is president german's vice president. beginning with the nixon vice president in 1953 the vice presidency moved into the executive branch so the vice president spent more time in the executive branch doing political things for the president then presiding over the senate. i think that was, the focus of the office doing that period was on presidential succession. it was having somebody who is plausibly prepared to be a presidential successor and

generally vice president for doing things in the executive branch but for referral to the center of the executive branch which was the carter mondale administration that the vice presidency moves into the white house physically but also becomes part of the center of the presidency. i think do the last 40 years the six administration since then the vice president in each case has been a senior presidential visor and troubleshooter who has taken on different roles in different administrations but has taken on significant roles in each of the six administrations. so i will come back about the history of the selection process. i want to jump into some of our work. maria you have a long experience with the convention and he ran republican convention in 2008. we talk in a report about recommendations on the rollout of the vp but the conventions

have, they are always looking the background when you make a choice. there'll smiley face the body that is going to approve the choice or make the choice of the vice president. joel can talk about the history and how that was much more the case long-ago history but talk a little bit about the consideration when nominees are picking their vice presidents of choices and how the convention typically rolls out and a usual year what is the role of the convention and the vp selection process? >> while to very interesting question. a sleepy convention played a significant role although i'm not sure anyone realizes the significance. once the convention nominates a vice president at present the most important thing we can do is that thursday night the nominee who has just been nominated has to sign all the paperwork to get on every

ballot. people don't know what goes into the making of a president. i think. ben: and i and many patients are that a little sweat from our brow to see how we'll get somebody from new york to l.a. and make sure that they are filing the correct paperwork. there's a lot of technical stuff that goes into it. the next thing with regards to the vice presidential nominee is where we are today on the republican side. i know you want to talk about it in general but right now we have moved the convention 67 weeks up so it has moved out. in addition to the fact that republicans, it's likely that we may not have an actual nominee and the traditionally what happens after the primaries sometimes before the primaries are over you have a presumptive nominee and that person plays a significant role or have staff

that will play a significant role with everything from for example the layout, the design of the convention. they want their stamp on that. they have a say in the speakers in the program, the order of the convention but the stage is going to look like because that's part of their persona. what's interesting on the republican side now is there may not be a person from a presidential campaign that will actually have a stamp. there may be two or three potential nominees but even thinks this simplest hotel space there is a lot of stuff that goes into putting the whole thing together. this whole thing will extremely extremely -- the extremely interesting. which i'm happy to say it's not me. >> we talked about it earlier. when is the timeframe for the typical speech after having been

nominated for the convention and what might we have to think about if we don't have a typical convention? >> probably potential nominees are fighting everything from states in the convention hall to hotels and transportation. the interesting thing for the republican side and i believe on i believe on the democrat side also is traditionally the vice president is nominated on wednesday night and the president then this nominate it on thursday. it would be extremely interesting if we don't have a candidate by wednesday how the process will change. as least as long as i can remember and ben's memory may be better but as long as i can remember that sea org or we have always used so this could change the whole outcome. >> you have had experience in the stu. talk about the reflection of the

role of the committee in general and how this might -- this year might be a little different. >> the convention is obviously something where you want a great feeling of unification and camaraderie to emerge and part of the way, and good television ratings i might add an part of the way that the conventions of dell but the television ratings part is the recognition that world calls are an audience killer. a couple of things happen. the presidential roll call has become a rolling roll call since 2000 so we do a third of the states on monday, at the third on tuesday, a third on wednesday , a joyous celebration when a candidate goes over the top on wednesday. rolls right into the vice presidential pick at that point. there has been a rule since i

think 88 or 92 there's only one candidate. the convention can pass them by acclamation. there is a contest for the vice president that provides you with another roll call on wednesday night that throws off the timing that maria talked about. the whole process in selecting the candidate is usually done so there is not a surprise factor in aiming at the vice president of candidate should it turn out to be a contested convention and you are campaign do you want to name your vice presidential candidate well in advance to be able to coalesce your support board you want to state the naming of a person for the convention to be able to amass a coalition under stress conditions? >> the convention can play real world this time.

>> one of the things we discussed in our deliberations in ways of thinking about picking of the vp is the private sector might or people who are thinking about building important jobs in other realms would be. you want to say something about the role that could play for candidates or what kind of criteria would one consider? >> let me start off by saying i appreciate the opportunity to be a part of this. i've had the opportunity to watch bob bauer's career from a distance and the ark of his public service and legal career. do we have a chance to be part of this which is really special and i appreciate the bipartisan policy center doing this. i think you really truly is an extraordinary public service. i was probably eight the only person on the panel who has never been on the inside of the vice presidential selection

process. as john has mentioned outside of the corporate border charitable boards part of the process of executive improvement and development. the think the first thing that really struck me about this in listening to the wonderful stories by the way. i am repeating them, was how complex this really was. the political and social media elements in the heading and confidentiality elements of all of these things broader level of complexity to this that far exceeds almost any other selection process that i'm aware of. i guess the analogy for me was that somebody says a jet engine is something that has 10,000 moving pieces and everyone of them has to work every time. this is i think a process that

has 10,000 moving pieces and if something goes wrong they can have an awful lot of unfortunate impacts. in that regard i guess two things that struck me. first of all i think that there may be a role for some input for people who do have experience in executive recruitment process etc. and other things particularly when things are in a hurry as they are right now. because they do have experience in bringing things and asking questions and even in personality charts of how people are likely to fit together and work with others so i think all of those things are useful. they have checklists. when people are in a hurry whether or not burning room or cockpit i think having a checklist is occasionally useful so one of the things that i would take about on it is either

within the team having somebody with that experience as you are it or assigning somebody on your internal team to go and talk with the executive or critters, the headhunters. you are going to have to put up with their view that they could pick a better person than the electorate does. but beyond that they may have useful input and particularly looking at this time i am reminded, and at least the central lesson for me out of this exercise is i was with my granddaughter on wednesday and i was trying to explain to her what we would be doing today. she said i get it we learned in school, she says failure to plan is planning to fail. [laughter] i said i think that kind of hits what it is. whatever tools you can get them planning is a useful thing. >> but me ask you to sketch out

the longer ark of history at the vice presidential -- especially talked about the convention now and it obviously hasn't then the primaries and then we moved into a new era where the candidate is the primary person. can you sketch out for us how is the vice president in pickton house of change related to the change of the importance of the role of vice president office? >> for most of our history the convention played a major role in selecting the vice presidential candidate and it was really the party leaders who would oftentimes get together and they would try to placate the party that has lost the presidential nomination. they would try and engage in geographical balancing, ideological balancing so oftentimes you would end up with

tickets where they presidential and vice presidential candidates didn't agree on major issues. they did know each other. the vice president for candidates was emboldened to the presidential candidate because he was the person that selected them. that really started to change in 1940 when fdr basic leg brand for the third term and made it a condition of running for a third term that the delegates would except henry wallace. there was tremendous opposition to wallace prevail in our roosevelt went to the convention to try to put him over ultimately the delegates agreed to wallace has a the price of getting fdr but wallace was not able to speak to the convention because there was so much animosity toward him. the in 1940 on through 1972 the process was pretty much at the convention was the presidential nomination was resolved people would celebrate.

they would be tired and they would be hung over and somebody would say we better pick a vice president rate we have to announce it tomorrow morning and that's when they would get together in 1976 he really changed in part driven by the macovin -- mcgovern rules in the party ruled that the president's nominees were now being chosen by convention and primaries and caucuses which tend to accelerate the resolution of the decision for presidential nominations. at least from the democratic side that year jimmy carter clinched the nomination and he had this time to engage in this sort of deliberate process that is sketched out in this report. president ward's nomination went to the convention but he has also started in 76 doing vetting while he was still competing with governor reagan. and so that was the process that began in 76 of doing this vetting that took place once the

nomination was secured. i think the other significant change related place on the democratic side in 1984, the republican side in 1996 and that was announcing the vice presidential selection before the convention and it really was a change for the convention -- where the convention stopping a place where you would wonder who would be the vice presidential nominee and there would be contest about who that might be until the decision was announced instead the choice was announced before the convention. the rollout to face and the convention and then became a celebration rally at the ticket pensively the leader of the ticket and a chance to attack the other side. >> let me focus in. there are great things in this book and i recommend it to you. we are recommending a process that takes us into a banana time and to do it seriously. jimmy carter actually did

something very different. maybe so extensive it has continued to pick up but having these big public announcements of interviews and rest conferences with potential people afterwards. do you want to say something more about that? >> when governor carter ended number of people in the first panel made a point about this being the first presidential decision that everybody other than gerald gerald ford was their first presidential decision and he was cognizant of that so he invited three of the candidates down to plains georgia. he would meet with them privately and then have a press conference or the other four he met with at the democratic convention they would have a press conference and was all very transparent. this is an immediate post-watergate period. in 1984 vice president mondale really tried to imitate the carter process and it really got

negative reviews. there was a feeling that it was embarrassing for people who were selected and so since then it's all been done much more privately and much more quietly. sometimes lists of people who are being considered or to pick we become known or at least many of the people who are being considered become known so there is some discussion in the media and some public media vetting and so forth but the tendency, the practice has come away from the public aspect of the carter and the mondale process. >> so let's turn a little bit to the vetting. we have a recommendation that even the core vetting process for shortlisted people takes eight weeks if you do it right. can you just give us a little sense of what that process

involves? he described a number of stages and what you go through on a campaign to put people through that vetting process. >> it's a five step russ is basic take and i think the recommendations reflect that all of us who have been through it or leave it should be a very small discrete group of people, probably not people with regular campaign duties. like matt i never saw the personal reports from the candidates. the structure of the process is step number one you need to see what the universe is. you need to come up with a very broad list of people to consider who might be compatible candidates. the second is to do a public records research on them with the advent of social media that becomes much more voluminous than it might have been. you need to be sure that the statements from the different

candidates are compatible with who your candidate is. then the results of that can be presented to the candidate for the narrowing of the list, and manageable number of which i would say a starkly has been fine but some campaigns will go a little more or a little less. then comes the part that will be particularly challenging for the republican candidates to do this time which is the personal fed, it truly intrusive document designed to get at any possible foibles and weaknesses that you can of your vice president just to prepare for the inevitability of what might come that the folks on the first panel discussed. and after there is a thorough review of that personal information, financial personal everything you can think of than

the candidate himself or herself has to make the decision on who that person would be and there is somewhere in there a one-on-one conversation with someone representing the campaign and the potential vice presidential candidates that includes the well is there anything else we should know conversation. ..

>> >> some ways it is easier to bring somebody in with that cycle before to put

themselves out there. statewide that might be helpful but that doesn't exempt a person as they are abetted by the public but they're not getting the same scrutiny. very tough? >> stuff to happen for years number two you're running as the different candidates and backup capability issue is on policy positions or the country clubs that they belong to. so just wondering a different spot light. >> by dick somebody who

wasn't a typical republican somebody who was in the position to affect that candidate? how often are they looking ahead to a convention since. >> there is a lot of thought process and that will help you get through to the convention.

the hon but there was any sample was elected official head notoriety was a lever. then to spiral out of control but they will except

whatever the nominee puts forth. >> to say something more from the party role or the candidate there was a strong party role and secondary is how that has evolved with selection today. the party leaders already drove the selection. so it was the of party bosses who will get together. we need indianas votes to put thomas marshall on the

ticket down the line. so that type of arrangement. after 1940 after the candidate started to take a major role is still had the leading party official end with the democratic process and the candidate's decision but as this moves away for mechanician -- convention on the presidential candidate and they still go to capitol hill to talk to those figures thank governors can the circle of people in the room with the decision made

and a few people who were close to them. >> and i will throw out a couple more questions. we refer and made recommendations that all candidates should start doing things now. it takes time. to take the time to do a good process. that being said there may be some amendments how much they can get going. what are some of the considerations out there we don't have as normal a situation in? how do we get going with that process so they are

left with a last-minute process at the end? what can we tell them to get the most out of the recommendations? >> with up five step process you can get the list for the public record research nearly down internally to those who were on the short list. i figured it is challenging for a candidate now to not know that this person is the nominee to be asking for the personal information and did a couple of cases could be a rifle down the road. so bad is the most difficult part of the process for at

need some unique solutions but i have not heard that. >> another unique situation worse several of the nominees have actual delegates in to make ahead of time how far i don't know but something that i have not experienced before in that could be interesting. several nominees or potential nominees come with delegates. >> we had a lot of contested conventions. perhaps the most contested convention is the largest

number of ballots at one headed 13. with 113. there was the 98 year-old physics professor who used to tell me how he would listen to "the reader" the first one ever it was great political entertainment but i don't know how the vice president was picked so it could be very contested anything we can learn to think about it today? if we're not going to pick the nominee indians call will that like? >> i think we are in uncharted waters because the whole process is so different. of long periods of presidential selection and

you have a media world but one of the important aspects of that pre-convention process and with that political reality and in maya interested to be vice president? and compressing it into a few hours. if there isn't any precedent that i can recall right now so we will turn to the audience.

>> "u.s. news and world report". talking how the vice presidential pick saugh could affect the boaters but could that influence the choice of the presidential nominee? depending on whose trump decides he will pick as a package will that become more important than the presidential candidate? >> we have not talked about the possibility somebody is picked indians before they are the nominee. there has been some historical examples. >> end not the wood

necessarily know that vice-presidential choice but i do think the campaign faced a strategic choice of your nominee who they are well met indians or wait until the convention or at the start of the second ballot? that you decide the way you get that majority whip your vice-presidential candidate.

it was time when governor reagan was out of moves to make to secure the nomination and is hopeful with the pennsylvania delegation but the other thing he tried to do was a mint the rules -- amend the rules to require every presidential candidate indicate who the nominee would be for vice president. that is the strategy and to alienate the heather 10 people. so to run the risk of designating one person to adversely affect your chances to affect somebody

else sit by and hearing all these different options is a special episode of "the apprentice"? [laughter] >> i have got a question that occurred to me in the discussion could you comment:the colts of personality with presidential candidates and how that affects the vetting process for the candidacy? >> civic any candidate in mind? [laughter] >> the same as the

compatibility that is important matter which of the five cases you want to look at the all want somebody they feel comfortable with such a matter where they fall on the personality scale is still what somebody who is compatible. >> ice understand that nixon chose agnew. is that correct? if most of the candidates would try to keep their

options open with the need a limited number of votes to put them over the top abb willing whether they vetted much or not. >> nixon chose agnew not because he turned over votes but it with those southern delegates and in effect nixon was looking for somebody to veto people of the right leg governor reagan on the left. and he viewed governor agnew

as more centrist he could start off as a rockefeller republican. >> to repeat that? as somebody denigrating the vice president to denigrate the office nixing grew pretty quickly and the end to start off a he would complain they he was to have these meetings with me and that is not however works. you don't meet with vice president and he should go out to give these speeches. but when they were reelected

is 72 agnews saw himself as the leader in the polls to see themselves as the candidates. and why don't you read it chair of the bicentennial celebration in? and that is what he had in mind. but that transformation between 73 when agnew was marginalized and 77 when mondale could walk into the oval office anytime he wanted it is remarkable. >> into think it and with

the nomination of the delegates to put the candidates in a situation and may be a different situation than a general election? >> i have a question for the panel specifically with the political lines if they are devising both candidates of both sides. and there was a question earlier regarding women how

to revise the candidates and even some private sector experience? >> to get as specific or general that you want. >> so what you want to project there are people out there to send a message about being president. and end to deliver the state

of delaware. and i do hope there she is a nominee that secretary clinton and on the republican side there are those people. the group was unanimous somebody could step into the role. with those political considerations. and to take a shot to shake up the race.

and what they're experiencing candidates. if that balance is you if that person has experience that's great if you are just looking edison and going for someone. so for all candidates and their situations. >> nobody is listening to me but you anyway. and the senator would be outstanding. to be a mayor or governor. with the democratic national committee as a sensational

for secretary clinton. first and foremost, would get someone who is presidential so that people could perceive him or her in the oval office. not simply because of succession but even more with you don't have a vice president who could do this sort of thing it is a huge governing asset. but that focus to choose a running mate has political significance. and to make decisions or what you value or what type of decision maker you are. the other thing it is important are they vice

presidential? for that panel for somebody as a role of subordinates. imagine somebody like joe biden with his own boss chairman of two major committees now he is the number two person and passed to live up to that role. he has to be able to be a leader also follow and be comfortable in their role and is an extremely difficult position for presidential candidate also a vice president. >> one last question. >> am trying to put myself

into the shoes on the short list of vague campaign. what is the fate in campaigns and a losing pretty early on? the discussion of 1972 earlier. tarascan number of people to be the running mate in and then turned it down. for a variety of reasons they didn't want to be on the ticket would he think about vice presidential candidates but

representative o'brien is now speaker of the house so you had able people to have opportunities but a calculation of how likely the ticket to be successful working with the person at the top of the ticket is a personal relationship. they have been able to achieve very good person relationships but did that go south for leon it will not be a fun four years so the people have to work added as well and take that into account if you want to

put your name for word. >> with that we will wrap it up but we want to thank the members of our working group his advice as wallace's thank you and we closed the session here. [applause] [inaudible conversations]

>>guest: glad to be here. >>host: give us a sense of what it the republicans are now doing. >> there is a vetting process underrated is unusual typically a something happens with the presidential nominee presumptive that means the candidates need to get ready so they have begun vetting the vice presidential prospects researching backgrounds although they have not reached that most significant stage where they interview the candidates themselves but they are preparing to announce the ticket as early as june or wait for the convention is in cleveland. >> there are complications if you wait until the last minute so they could cause

harm for the candidate? >> esp remember john mccain with his last-minute hail mary to select sarah palin unfortunately she did go to the longer term process that we were accustomed to him there were some surprises there that ended up hurting the campaign. so they are trying to avoid that circumstance but there are new calculations. they don't know who the presidential nominee will be so there are some political calculations that need to be made with an open convention. do you cut a deal with someone who could bring over a delegation or certain segments in cleveland to get the whole ticket nominated? >> it appears as if senator cruz or governor kasich are a little further ahead on

this publicly than donald trump? >> that's right. interviewed trump about this last week at his office and he said he is giving his running mate of lot of thought but has not begun any formal process and doesn't have the system place. he is focused on winning the nomination first and foremost,. we sat down earlier with the aid that was just tired who has taken over the campaign and told us we are focused on the contest coming up we will get to a when we get to it we want to make sure he becomes the nominee before we are ahead of ourselves. >> what names are you hearing and any surprises? >> the names that you hear is mostly speculative but rubio, scott walker is

looked at by john kasich. certainly rubio would be an attractive running mate for any of the three candidates. i don't know where trump will go necessarily. that depends if he can wrap up the nomination in june if he goes to open the convention he may need to use that as the means to bring a party together. nine or even to try to convince john kasich but of course, people change their mind. >> you have been on the ground for the rnc a lot of the campaigns have met with delegates in officials.

what was your take away? >> there is a lot of activity. the rnc is preparing for the open convention but his other new h shaver share they held private meetings with rnc members and to save the hostility that you hear from donald trump about the party leadership and the rules process is enact. that is the role he plays to motivate his supporters borelli's he will start acting more presidential he will include more partners and a general election and to make them feel and was to become the presumptive nominee to do that he will need to appease a lot of the of party leaders.

and with the series of policy speeches asking about your story ronald reagan selected his running mate before the convention hopes when didn't work out too well for him? >> this was a bold move coming in to that convention to the lump sum against ford to get the nomination he really needed to win over delegates city picks the moderates senator. of course, he arrives in kansas city with the loss of the nomination. then went on to represent the republican party. and then for the lost the election. >> it could complicate the

choices for the republican and running mates. in joining us from hollywood florida thank you for the time. >> madam secretary 72 of the delegate votes. ♪

>> date yet he said there was reading your book a vacation. then he started to tell me that hamilton's life is a classic hip-hop narrative and i thought what is he talking about?

that he had of world-class ignoramus in the first question was is that a vehicle to tell this type of large and complex story then he started 2.0 you can pack more information than any other form in talking about the fact that has internal rhymes and endings of these different devices that are very important

>> real chairman of your organization. >> is the election reform group over 25 years advocating reforms by proportional representation in reforming the electoral college. it is like a runoff election we vote in a primary the top to voters. >> louisiana does this. >> yes you can do that instead of having to you can have one to allow the voters chavis' second or third

choice but there is no majority the city asking all the voters to come back for second round you just take the ballot you count the second and third choice also instead of runoff it is instant runoff. like a local election. >>host: but what is the point wise and necessary? >> it makes elections even shorter you don't have to have a primary california has a primary in june or again in may. so that is one of the benefits with a shorter reelection season and more choices so the first choice he may be more pragmatic to foster stability to use that

system the study showed there is more civility in elections because to appeal to more voters. if so i will be nice to you so there is more stability. >> is that doable when a national scale? dealing national election rehab is for president. right now we're promoting the national popular vote plan with the interstate compact so my state of washington is says california and a few other states so that idea with the

national election if the state agrees whoever wins the national popular vote gives those electors. because right now we have a situation, because they are and competitive so the campaign in iowa and florida and a handful of other states and california or texas those are called flyover states they elecampane in those states so we would have truly a national election for president. >>host: talking about electoral reform with our guests chairman of a group called a fair vote.org.

is a non-partisan organization? >> if i would call them right now it is under all others because i am independent we are a nonpartisan group and democrats and independents like myself that is the key to our success if we have the election reform like proportional representation or fair voting that is good in places for never get elected it would be good for democrats and also creates

space for independent and third-party is. more important than campaign finance nine of 10 elections are uncompetitive. it doesn't matter how much money they've raised the issue of partisanship and gerrymandering. so for the independent like me, i vote by the person and not the kennedy. so a lot more choices but i am concerned about partisanship with gridlock with the legislature in the state legislature and congress. so if i have more herb republicans are rolled the bearcats in a fair vote my

group was founded who had a unique candidate stephen given a strong third also serving 20 years in the house of representatives. 94 years old if you are watching. he is one of my political mentors. but that is the vanishing breed of republican. like to general four-door rockefeller. >>host: what are the three questions that you are proposing? >> it is a different effort to. the questions is i am

working with former representative. >> and was a so we saved three questions. what are you going to do about climate change? the data and political this connection? what is your policy proposal >> get the same time to see interest in those questions. >>. >> it is the it said so it

is a revenue neutral but instead will a big getting the money and it goes back some thad means the we have had that system over six years and sent but there is the esteemed and infant. however but then the money goes back to citizens it is like ron but what will

happen in the future with the young people of america? when you have to pay all the dead take care of these people on social security and medicare which we need to do? we owe them it is good for the local economy. there is a check that there weren't and we need to preserve social security but

if we do that with an $18 trillion debt? to grow the economy is. >> let's not ignore that. is an incentive or said we should spend some money bettis and even on the radar. but two left case with true election reform. the partisan primaries are to liberal and -- terrible. but then combine those with gerrymandering then they are a minority.

is a beginning to the political extremist. >> north carolina on a bed different credit line. go-ahead. turn down the volume on your television. the republican line the good morning. go ahead. >> caller: good morning the last thing our nation needs is more democracy. more democracies is nine serve the purpose the framers had a democracy and that is where she remains

that prophesies to but somehow there are people other than that in the area that democracy equals freedom. no it doesn't. that is security when you kick in sanders or politician with computer technology is and to partisan data because it stays of the legislature but deciding on who wins or loses but it's not eire had a fair shot but they live

under the rules in the month of the elections. but it's hemisphere but by the way with an irish this is all for the house of u.s. representatives no constitutional amendment is needed. , chris can do it today and we have more democracy.

>> how is everyone? but i want to state the issue is the fact but a lot of people operating but they're not aware dash there will make ted deal in 1961 so we're spinning our wheels in the circus of deterrence where of lot of people are not aware of the actual congress betted improperly used because it isn't in the jurisdiction but what people

are counting on now is when you start researching and looking back we are guaranteed a republican form of government and they're only than bill of rights and seven articles that has been ratified. >>guest: in response. >>host: i do want to say referring to united states of america corporation. ♪ >>guest: things are out of balance. so line of the terms is the corporation and those are out of balance for go before we do that allotted deserve

to be criticized but there are a lot out there that are hard-working americans. and i started a corporation in 1992 with kurt cobain we were not a big baggie full cooperation bevy were making music. [laughter] but we were making things happen. things are way out of balance his congress has built a wall and they do that with the gerrymandering of the cold in this surplus

boater come within a democratic one with 84 percent turnout per processor plus votes that mean but the democratic one, '01 42% and we have read districting their means and a former congressional elections this they are getting that.

>> to you have other versions? >> first thru third choice then the top three vote getters would win. what does that look like? in massachusetts where there are nine seats for the u.s. house doubleday made it they were elected governors. but for those independents or the third-party when you flip the mover but they have

not thought of the half a in an increasingly they have a support the of the rights act. in the bed is out of each district. were to take it away and in one never presents list he.

this enriches the republican the people's house should be open. it is not another open house is closed. remember break down the wall? tear down this wall but their politicians. >> hello? we're visiting. >> caller: my question is to talk about democracy and

but if you are voting to urge you going against the we do another reminder% of the people to the june rise end i explain live there and privilege so how does a representative in congress or the senate but i have defended how do they get there legitimacy? through the election for galway's. we have multi seeped and

until you have the ballot people pass out of balance so to have the acceleration the history of floating and next question? >> that our behind all things that are not fair.