>> the heads of the washington met met metropoliton authority were having a meeting and taking questions on plans to accelerate maintenance and projects over the next year. >> welcome, everybody. today we will discuss how the washington metro system is going to address the safety and reliability issues. the issue is important to all members because when we have people coming in we want to make sure when they come to see the

nation's capitol they should be able to move around the region safely and efficiently. the federal government has invested billions in the metro but it is not safe or reliable. the committee is going to be watching to make sure the talk turns into actions. the fta is playing an important role at metro's temporary oversight entity. the fta is here to share what they will to promote safety and

liability. wmata has to be held accountable to the federal, state and local taxpayers that are funding them. i look forward to a frank discussion. i am yield to congress woman comstock. >> thank you, mr. chairman. i offer extended consent to offer my opening statement into the record. but first of all, last friday, when paul weidefeld terminated 20 managers, seven of whom were considered senior. i think we hope this is the beginning of a new era of accountability and transparency at metro and i know our delegation voice support for you in these actions. we need to find new ways to run the rail.

i can pleased to be board members are focused on having transportation and management experience. on cost issues, metro's cost run 120 percent to 150 percent higher than compareable transit systems. that is why i appreciate mr. weidefelt said he is not asking for more money but is focused on addressing issues on restructuring metro and addressing the labor issues and how we can find ways to do better. it is said, quote, authorities

must not sustain employees and does this prohibit the realization of the savings of the contract work and having the best people. i have talked with the new general manager and the agencies. i have agencies who can do this at lower cost than the current cost and the current cost seem to run ahead of davis bacon's cost. i want to see how we can use technology that can document the track work and save money and increase safety and transparency and being used around the country. i hope we can explore that more. we are going to be looking into having hearings on that and anywhere we can assist you on that, we want to find the best most cost efficient programs.

finally i want to address the news about a rape that occurred on metro in broad daylight. 10 o'clock in the morning. i have had people approaching me having safety issues and this is unacceptable and a concern that this wasn't immediately made known when this report was made and how are we doing this. we talk about a new era of transparency and the culture of safety we all need and finding better ways to save money i think this troubling incident is why we need more peal on the frontline protecting our people. i thank the chairman for this

mornt important hearing and i look forward to hearing from our witnesses. >> i turn to ranking member norton for her opening statement. >> thank you very much, mr. chairman. i have to begin by saying how much i appreciate this hearing. i think the fact we are having this hearing points out how important wmata is and we are locked in together to working on the problems and unwinding them together. i stress, wmata's uniqueness. no other metro system across the united states has to respond to three different jurisdictions. that is a built-in structural

problem tat neither wmata or for those of us in the federal government have been able to help wmata to get over. it is there. it is one of the reasons for its complexities and those complexiutilities play in the changes that are needed. for example, just this morning, secretary fox announced he was appointing a high level official from his office to help hasten to work of the three jurisdictions in setting up their own safety oversight mechanisms. the new chairman, mr. weidefelt has taken steps that are acknowledged to be bold and necessary to be sure inconvenienceing the public. but here we have a dual -- we

have issues that collide. we want the public to be safe and the public to be able to ride and to get where they are going quickly. how wmata solves that during this process when they are overha overhauling the system is one of the hues we want to face today. -- issues. the basic challenge wmata will meet after this single year of essentially rebuilding much of the system is how to keep it that way. i will want to hear more this morning about that. the word safety culture is thrown around. what does that mean? it is a really scary word because it means mng -- something is embedded in how the wmata operates that has to be

dugout and the culture notion has not been defined. congress of course, passed map 21 giving federal transit administration oversight over public transportation in the united states. we reinforce that in the fast act. there are issues that pile on to fta that it would like to offload and i think the safe track plan of the general manager will help to do that. some of metro's funds are being held up and on top of the other issues it had a final crisis in how it dealt with applying for federal grants.

it looks like the wmata has taken the proper action but the federal transit authority hasn't rerespond. wmata does something right and we expect the federal agency to respond in time. mr. chairman, i think anxious to hear the testimony and very much appreciate the witnesses have prepared thoughtful testimony today. i thank the members for coming and i yield back. >> i now turn to chairman of the full committee bill shuster. >> thank the witnesses with the panel and three members we have the entire house delegation that represents the area which you can tell this is an important to them and to all of us. millions of people come to

washington, d.c. every year from around our fellow citizens to people from around the world. this transit system ought to be the crown jewel of the systems throughout the country. they get more money than any other system in the country but they spend more than any other system in the country. we need to bring alignment. safety has to be paramount. this is really important to the entire nation that we get this right. in addition to the monies that the federal government gives to the metro system also 40 percent of the metro rush hour riders are provided a federal employees are provided a subsidy to ride that system.

new ceo is doing just that. what the federal transit administration has temporarily taken ever that authority and the administrator is here today to talk about that. that oversight needed to be done because that metro hasn't been able to do it appropriately. secretary fox has given one year to virginia and maryland and washington, d.c. to step up to the plate and do what is necessary on the oversight. and we passed the fast act in congress last year and strengthened fta's oversight authority and provided

washington, d.c. with five years of increased funding. more dollars the citizens of america are contributing to the system. this should be the crown jewel of the system and it is

-- cities like chicago could

have spent tens of thousands of more dollars on projecks waiting to happen that are critical for the safety and security of their riders and the efficiency of the system. we cannot ignore the thousand pound gorilla in the room. we are not putting up the money we need to be a good partner. we only partner 50 percent. this is happening in cities that want to give their city transit

options and have to chose to run a bus with a million miles on it and that is breaking down and maybe the brakes don't work and giving people other options. the united states of america can afford to partner and help them rebuild and build out new options but it will take a new attitude in congress. we were not allowed to vote on one amendment when we did the fast act. many were bipartisan that dealt with funding. we pretended. in fact, we took money from the t.s.a. to help pay for the bill and now people are standing in line at the airport. wow. we will keep shuffling things around until nothing works in this country. thank you very much and i look forward to hearing.

>> we have the jerry connolly who is representing the 11th district of virginia and john delaney who is representing the sixth district of maryland. i would ask unanimous consent the witness' full statement be added to the record. it is so order and with that we start with chairman hoyer. >> i want to associate myself with the remarks from the gentlemen from pennsylvania, mr. shuster. clearly this was the crown jewel and nobody would be calling it that today and clearly it must be the crown jewel for all of the the reasons the chairman said. millions of people in this room use this system. i appreciate being allowed to share my input on the need for

robust investment and high safety standards. the safety and reliability of the metro is critical imimportantly to washington, d.c. and susurrounding communities. it is important for the smooth functioning of the government and our national security. my district is home to 62,000 federal employees and many serve in military jobs located here and many depend on metro to get to work to serve the american people. metro is a crucial tool for the millions of americans and foreign visitors that come to the nation's capital this year. i had a meeting with paul

weidefeld, metro's general manager who you have spoken and i think that is proposed. to discuss wmata's new plan that addresses to improve safety. we spoke on a more broad bases than simply the fast track or the safe track program. the recent incident on fire and day-long shutdown for daying diagnostic inspection has brought to light a number of important safety things that must be done to insure safety. these problems are the result of past failures to address adequately in long-term maintenance and up grades. as the new 7,000 series cars are brought into the fleet, we need to make sure that the tracks and

tunnels these new modern cars run on are up to date. metro safety and reliability is a critical concern for residents of maryland, which is home to communities served by all of metro's lines. i am disappointed, as i know many are, that metro needs to implement the safe track plan in the first place. but it is necessary. we should not be in a situation, however, where entire lines may be shutdown for maintenance and where the predictability and reliability of train schedules has been undermined. i am impressed with mr. weidefelt's leadership and determination to take the steps necessary to put metro back on course to be a system that all, in our region and in our country, can be proud of. we have a ways to go before we can get to that point, but it is encouraging that wmata's leadership is fully committed to

putting passenger safety first and acting to improve safety in the near and long term. mr. chairman, i hope the subcommittee and the full committee will support investments in metro safety and service so safe track plan will be as successful as possible, as quickly as possible. congress has a responsibility to make sure that the metro system, which we call america's subway, can well serve those and serve american citizens as well. i want to thank ranking member norton for her tiring advocacy for the metro and all those that ride it. i want to insure you, mr. shuster, defazio, and newton

that the the washington delegation is united to make sure working with you america's subway system is a system second to none. thank you very much. >> thank you, congressman hoyer. next is congressman connolly. >> chairman, ranking member norton and defazio, thank you for having me and i am delighted to join mr. hoyer and mr. delaney. i serve on the government oversight committee which held their own hearings in the wake of the palazzo tragedy. the challenges facing metro are significant and i welcome collaboration between the two communitys to make sure robust oversight of metro's dollars and safety. i spent the last 22 years working in met roef. first as a member of the fairfax

chairman and approved local operating subsidies. for the past eight years, i worked with you and colleagues to insure the annual commitment for metro safety improvements which is matched dollar per dollar by washington, d.c., maryland and virginia. no one is more disappointed than me at the state of the affairs of metro. i want to create a comprehensive framework of safety standards for metro and all the nation's transit systems. metro current oversight committee is nothing more than a paper tiger without the proper resources or tools to provide oversight. our partners are working to stand-up to a new safety

commission that will meet and enforce the new federal standards. secretary fox has appointed the fta has the interim oversight agencies. i disagreed with that action deferring to the fra's more robust safety standards i share the ultimate goal for addressing the shocking lack of safety culture within metro. to that end, i welcome an opportunity to explore further the fta's authority to match the oversight and enforcement authorities to address the urgent safety recommendations. metro's new general managers has indicated he is voluntarily directing his team to explore what fra standards they can apply on their own regardless of what style of transit community

they are using they deserve to know they are being protected by effective and enforceable federal standards. what we are witnesses today it metro is the result of a decades long march of dysfunction. riders are not confronted with daily service, including today, mr. chairman, or safety delays and incidents with smoke in the tunnels have become all too frequent and are scaring riders away. recent issues led the general manager to take the step of shutting the entire capitol system for 24 hours in march. earlier this month the two stations serving capitol hill were closed down during rush hour.

three years worth of maintenance is trying to be deferred into one year. this will present significant and sustained challenges to riders and the federal government. federal employees account for 40% of all metro riders. we have called to push teller work, flexible work schedules during this time. of course metro cannot focus only on track and repairs. a complete system wide change culture is necessary. safety and personal accidents already taken by weidefelt should serve as a shout across the bow that in' difference to customer service will not be tolerated. these are not problems that can be fixed overnight. metro faces a monumental task and the federal government must be a funding partner. i welcome you to explore option

to expanding the federal commitment including subsidies. the federal government is the only com pact member that doesn't pay any share of operating subsidies. we must incentivize the community to support the metro as well. metro has been our single greatest achievement and in many ways our single biggest disappointment. working together we can restore america's subway to a place of prominence it once held and setting a standard and giving riders the world-class system they so deserve. >> thank you, mr. connolly. next is representative john delaney. >> thank you. i want to thank the chair and my colleagues for giving me the opportunity to discuss metro

with you. it is very important to my c constentuents and it is important to all of the visitors of the nations capitol. metro is in crisis with deficiency around safety, reliability, customer service, and financial management. if you diagnose the problems with metro you realize there are several causes. the first is that metro reports to four governing jurisdictions and this four-headed monster makes it difficult to metro to get the funding and oversight that is optimal to an organization of its scale. secondly, metro has been under funded and it is a reliable source of unfunding and created uncertainty and made the unfunded situation more

pronounced. finally, it has been mismanaged for several decades. whether it is strategic or tactally they can both be made. i would like to leave the current ceo off that list. and there is another issue and this gets to chairman shusters's comments about culture. metro has a deficient culture as it relates to priorities and i think that raises a governance question and what is happening with the board, board of directors in the governance of the board. i think governance really matters because a good board sets the correct mission, sets the correct strategic goals, and most important responsibility is

recruiting management, to hold them accountable, and secure the funding the entprise needs. -- enterprise. they do that by making sure people think they are running the process right. currently, there are no standards for who members can be with metro. the chairman said you cannot legislature certain things and you cannot legislature good governance but you can do things to make sure we have the best people possible sitting around the table making these decisions instead of maybe elected officials or people who were given a board spot because they raised a lot of money for the relevant elected officer. what i have tried to do is put forth, and representative comstock has been supportive of this with me, but forth

framework where jurisdictions are required to certify the members they are appointing are experts in either finance, management in transit or in safety. i think this will put people with more qualifications and experience around the board table at metro and i think it will encourage, maybe, longer term thinking because my sense is these people will probably have more experience in board governance matters and won't think about their own unique interest but spend more time thinking about the good of the whole enterprise which is what a real fiduciary should do. in addition to more funding, supporting the management changes, i think there are important things we can do around governance and i applaud secretary fox who is taking a step in the direction and

changed all of the federal appointees to the board and put up four people that have expertise in safety. we would like to see people with finance, management and transit experience. we get them creating the right mission, the right management team in place and hold them accountable and i think every time that can change the culture of metro. appreciate the opportunity to be here with you. >> thank you very much all three of you. with that i will dismiss the first panel and we will bring up the second panel. thank you very much. >> while the second panel is coming up, i would like to ask the statement of representative chris van holland, a member who represents a jurisdiction in his region be admitted to the

record. and i would like to ask unanimous consent to correct the record and have a chart that shows federal funding for wmata as opposed to other agencies wmata receives 19% of its budget from federal contribution and 17% is the industry average on fares. wmata fairs coverage 42% of the budget where the industry average is 23.2% and i ask this chart be entered into the record as well. >> without objection so ordered. >> now i would like to take this opportunity to welcome the second panel. we have paul weidefeld who is the general manager of the

washington metropolitan transit. carolyn flowers and tim lovain from the washington counsel of governments. i would ask unanimous consent for the witnesses full statement to be included in the record and without objection so ordered. i would ask you to limit your comments to five minutes and with that, mr. weidefelt we start with you. >> good morning, chairman and ranking member and members of the subcommittee, i am paul weidefeld thank you for allowing me to testimony today. i thought i would summarize quickly what my priorities have been and talk about what we are up against and what i am trying to do about it and wrap up with concluding remarks. in terms of what my priorities are is safety, social

reliability and fiscal management. what we are up against. i think it is important to step back and think about the physical nature of what we are up against before we get into the management issues. we have to recognize this is a two-track railroad system which presents a lot of challenges for maintenance because you cannot maintain the system without impacting the customers. you add on top of that decades of delayed maintenance and under funding and that created the issues we are dealing with and on top of that an aging fleet. i think it is important to recognize metro is more than rail it is very major bus system, almost 600,000 people on the bus alone, we have a much better fleet there but basic infrastructure services that need to be fixed particularly in garages. in terms of the agency, what i found is what i have heard echoed here. a lack of safety and service

culture in the organization and that is perminating throughout the entire organization with forgotline employees and management. there has been a lack of accountability on the management and lack of strong management systems in place. a lack of sustainable and predicted funding sources over the decades. we are facing ridership decline and part of that is self-inflicted by the performances levels we have provided and the change in demographics in the region also and the way we travel. power transit is increasing and it is one of the most expensive services and we need to think about how we provide that as well. crime as mentioned is a concern for all transit agencies. we have had terrible and visible incidents on our system recently with our passengers and with employees. always in the front of my mind is terrorism and we have to make sure we are doing everything on

our part to be prepared for anything that may occur there. in march, i released a customer accountability report with 60 action items we outlined to what we are doing to increase the overall performance and customer service portion of wut what we do. i releaseded the rail maintenance plan called safe track. the current approach is not working and we need a wholholes plan. we have 134 in prop and 137 in service and 748 ordered and as soon as we get to the point where i am comfortable we are delivering what we pay for we will increase the delivery of those cars. the bus fleet is maintained well and we will continue in that area. on the metro access we are

looking at brokering outside third party vendors to provide better service there. in terms of safety and service culture that starts with me driving home that is the most important thing we do. recently i came out with a number of things to reinforce that. safety trumps all. we have our track inspectors and people that have the ability to understand the system can shutdown the system at any time if they see something they want to get out and look at which wasn't the case in the past. we have a new chief safety officer who i brought in earlier this month. we are looking at the police -- the police are doing a metro stat and monitoring the system every day minute by minute to apply resources and adding new resources there and of course working with the joint terrorism task force. the good news is that the system over the years has driven

economic development and culture here. the business community is behind it, elected officials are behind it and the riders are behind it. my job is to get it performing better and we will deal with other issues but my priorities are on the safety and fiscal management and that will continue to be my focus in the near term and we will deal with the large issues as we go forward. with that i will be glad to answer any questions. >> thank you very much. ms. flowers. >> thank you chairman graves, ranking member norton, chairman shuster and members of the subcommittee, thank you for inviting me to speak to you. together safety and reliability comprise the minimum we should expect from public transportation. wmata has fallen short. delay and disruption and injuries and fatalities have

been happening in the recent years. we want to restore safety and reliability for riders and employees. we are conducting on the ground inspections, leading accident vections, and directing safety improvements that wmata must make. we are exercising the authority congress provided our agency. congress authorized fta to oversee public safety transportation systems under map 21 and the fast act strengthened our ability to set and enforce national standards. over the course of the past four years we have worked with transit industry stakeholders to develop adaptable and enforceable regulations. state safety oversight doesn't exist or fail and congress gave us the statutory authority to step in and that is where we are in the d.c. metro area. as secretary fox has made clear,

fta's direct oversight of wmata is temporary. virginia, maryland, and the district of columbia must set-up a safety oversight agency that is fully functioning and compliant with federal requirements and capable of providing effective oversight. none the less, since the fta assumed oversight we have been able to work with wmata to get results. wmata has made steady progress in addressing the findings of our initial safety management inspection last year and they have responded to troubling deficiencies discovered at the rail operation control center. our investigation of this incident -- sorry. as a result of the fiengds from fta's safety blintz in april that looked at three areas, red signal overruns, track integrity

and vehicle impairment some tracks were taken out and defects were fixed. in addition to identifying and ordering the correction of safety problems we conducted a review of wmata's grant application to insure federal funds are being used to meet the recommendations. most troubling is the fact wmata has failed to create a culture of safety and although this problem goes further back i mind like to talk about a recent example. on may 5th, a third wheel insulator exploded at the federal center southwest station. our investigation of this incident is ongoing, our preliminary investigation showed wmata's response was slow and inadequate. operational convenience was prioritized above safety. they failed to notice us into

timely manner but they waited hours for track access after a curseary investigation was made and service was resumed. it was only later in the day when a fire occurred in the same area the track was taken out of service and the problem was addressed. such errors of misjudgment are not acceptable. safety must come first before service. as a result we issued a safety directive requiring wmata to take immediate action to prioritize safety before operations to mitigate fire and smoke rivering -- risks and improve safety response and conduct a stand down. we have verified wmata has taken action to address these requests and to his credit paul weidefeld has been listening to our concerns. but the agency has a difficult

task ahead. everyone of their employees must make a personal commitment to safety. we are working with wmata and our colleagues from metro d.c. to restore the safety and reliabilities. >> next we will hear from mr. levine. >> mr. chairman and members of the subcommittee, i am tim lovain, from the planning board at the national council of governmen governments. the transportation funding board is a metro politan planning area that includes 22 jurisdictions and over 5 million residents. i would like to thank chairman graves and ranking member norton to share my thoughts today.

i will focus on three things: first how critical metro is to the regions mobility and prosperity, and the importance to the federal government, and finally the efforts underway to help metro improve its safety and service reliability and be the worldclass system the nation's capitol deserves. 710,000 rail trips were made last year and two million jobs are located within a half mile radius of metro bus stops and train stops. 77 of the stations are in region priority locations for growth. 86% of this regions new office construction is occurring within one quarter miles of metro rail stations. metro ties our multi state region together and will help the region accommodate an additional 1.5 million people and 1.1 million jobs over the

next 30 years. 1-5 metro railriders come from zero car households already. metro provides 1.1 million rail trips on inauguration day in 2009. metro especially helps the federal government do business. as it has been noted the federal workforce represents 43% of the morning commuters and 40% of the workforce here use the rail system. 15 million offices are within one half mile of metro rail stations and it is policy to locate future office space near the metro. the federal government recognizes the importance to the system. it is very important this federal funding program be retained as it is critical to undertaking and completing

needed safety and state of good repair work. metro's importance is highlighted by 19 million visitors coming from around the country and the world and their impression of the nation as a whole is shaped by the metro system in part. when metro opened 40 years ago, it gained the reputation as a world class system and we need to restore that. we acknowledge metro is facing significant challenges to ensure safety and reliability that characterize a world class system. improving the safety is the number one priority. this issue has the full commitment at the state and local and federal government and we are pleased the transit is an active partner. this is being tackled on the oversight safety fund and on the

management front we are pleased with paul weidefeld and his short tenure has taken bold action to retore the trust of the riders. there is more work to be done and our region has to come together to work on it. one additional and important resource to address the challenges is the need for funding reform. i believe metro is the only major rail transit system in the country that doesn't have a dedicated source of funding. i believe that lack of dedicated funding has contributed to metro's maintenance shortfalls. that is why regional leaders are exploring how to work together at the state and local level to provide long-term, predictable and sustanlable funding support to meet metro's needs. we look forward to continued and hopefully increased funding from the federal government. i am confidant this region and

the federal government can continue our partnership and rise up together to the challenges. we can make metro a world class system for decades to come. >> we will move into questions. my first question is for mr. weidefelt. ntsb investigations have had similar fiengds. -- findings. why didn't metro, two questions here, why didn't metro provide better training and staffing for emergency preparedness and the second question is what have you changed at the rail operation control center to make sure, you know, this doesn't repeat itself? >> i cannot speak to the history of what training they did.

i know what we are doing. one of the things i have done is replace the head of the reoperation center in april. we have added additional staff and have a more robust training program that came from incidents in the past. we have staffed up. we have a fire liason now 24/7. when i got here it was 16 hours of the day but a lot of instances between emergency personal and someone in the reoperation center, fta is monitoring the activities daily at the rail operation centers to make sure the proper procedures are being followed. we are doing spot testing of our controllers to make sure they are part of all exercises and in effect we throw curve balls at them during the exercises.

>> i have a question for ms. flowers, too. the committee is concerned about wmata safety and the reliability for sure. but we are concerned about the need for all transit agencies to their eficiency. my question is what is the fta doing to ensure transit agencies recipients are most efficiently using the limited resources they are receiving? are you considering contracting out work through competitive bids whenever that is appropriate, ms. flowers? >> chairman graves, we have

program management oversight as well as grant management oversight of our grantees. we do contract out some of that work so that we can, on a national bases, be able to monitor our over 800 grantees. >> how about the -- you contract out the work to monitor them? >> yes. and perform triannual audits and enhanced audits on areas like f procurement and financial management. >> how about maintenance work and other things for competitive bid? do you encourage that? >> at the grantee level they make decisions on the procurement but we do ask them to be effective in the use of our funds.

i know that ms. comstock mentioned the option of contracting out is something she would encourage. that our, you know, agencies that do contract out to try to ensure they effectively use our funds. >> thank you. i have some more questions but i will turn to ms. norton for her opening questions. >> ms. flowers, i want to thank you all at the fta for the financial discipline you are importing in the metro. quite as it is kept, metro, or wmata's financial record keeping mirrors, or has mirrored the much more widely understood and known issues of safety

particularly financially accountable, a system that was in disarray. that directly effects safety because most of the money wmata is getting is for safety. if you look behind the criticism wmata has received we are told 783 million dollars in federal transit funding for wmata is going unspent. everyone assumes that wmata is sitting on money and that wmata is really ineffective by not spending money it already has so how could it want more money. but if you look behind the numbers, you find, ms. flowers, 390 million is obligated for safety projects and new cars and the remaining amount is waiting

reimbursement through fta. now according to the information we have been given from fta in order to bring itself into the compliance it needed, and again i thank you for the discipline that apparently is working, wmata has complied with all 45 recommendations of fta, submitted the required 65 corrected action plans, is working with fta on a testing and validation plan, has closed five of the required testing and validation items, and submitted 11 and fta has to review with the later four being submitted

at a latter date and on time. ms. flowers, an inspector general report of fta criticized the fta for not having consistent policies when it in fact undertakes a very serious matter which is withholding federal funds which in this case means the three jurisdictions get to pay. this report was entitled fta monitored grantees corrective action but lacks policy and guidance to oversee grantees with restricted access to federal funds. it found for example with respect to wmata and here i am quoting that wmata was required to mail hard copies of the invoice packages to a contractor in north carolina to review

which is more time and resource intensive than other processes. my question given the need for every penny wmata can get my question to you is can you specifically identify at what point wmata will be able to return to normal restrictions? ... normal restrictions and procedures for accessing federal funds that the congress has appropriated rather than drawing down funds by hand which can take anywhere from ten days to two weeks for the money to get to wmata for safety and other matters.

>> we are on site at wmata, and we were there yesterday to work on a plan we call aa snapshot plan to try to expedite the issues that you were talking about. we have also put into our regional office additional employees to ensure that we can address the issues and trying to expedite, the drawdowns of wmata. i understand that -- >> if they complied in this way what is left to be done so that we can understand? >> we are in the final steps of the verification process. so -- >> do you expect within a few months, by the end of the year? when do you expect wmata will be able to access funds in the normal fashion?

>> in this last step, if we see that the documentation is verified we should be able to, i think, have a targeted lifting of restricted drawdown in certain areas. there is older stuff that i believe will still be there, but we can work with them in terms of addressing targeted and focused areas to lift that drawdown. >> but you don't have a timeframe. the burden is not on you. you.you. i have done what you asked them to do. the reason i am pressing you, the burden shifts. the fda, but when do you think wmata will be accountable enough so that the drawdowns will no longer -- these will no longer be necessary.

>> we are verifying documentation, and i expect in the next few weeks we will have completed this step. >> thank you very much. >> thank you, and i now recognize the chairman for five minutes. >> thank you very much. i appreciate the witnesses being here to testify. i also think congressman delaney's testimony was spot on. ii think that one of the things he said is absolutely paramount in all of this, attract the dollars to an organization you have to 1st demonstrate that you to play those dollars efficiently to get things done. we're going to give more money. i don't think is been done over the last several years or decades that they deployed those in the most efficient way which requires a cultural change at the agency which i think the new ceo has really set the

standard. he saidstandard. he said some tough things and needs to take some tough action. to managing the employees, and if you're going to shakeup a culture at an organization -- and i spent 20i spent 20 years of my life and business and had the unfortunate circumstance of having to terminate people comeau what i thought about this question about me back to one of the 1st hearings i had in this room 15 years ago that the epa associate administrator for hr, the previous congress passed a law that said federal employees must follow the guidelines congress sets in legislation. my question was, how many people in the last year out of 17,000 at the time did you fire? it took him a couple of whispers back and forth to tell me that they fired one person. terminating and firing people is unpleasant, but

there are times when people that don't do the job, doing stuff that is unsafe, negligent, illegal, they must be terminated. my question, do you have the tools necessary -- and i new york coming up to a contract negotiations in, do you have the tools necessary and if a mechanic was negligent are illegal are unsafe, try to work with them but eventually sometimes unfortunately you have to terminate, do you have those tools available that you are able to say to people who are doing the job comeau we have to let you go, or other locked in a protected? 17,000 people, they terminated one person. that does not make sense. >> if isense. >> if i could, i will come at it from two levels. in terms of the management,

three weeks ago i sent a letter out to roughly 650 at will managers, not necessarily managers, not necessarily people sitting behind desks the frontline supervisors and superintendents. i sent out a letter explaining my priorities in management style, but more importantly, i had importantly, i had them sign a piece of paper recognizing that they were at will. shortly after that held a meeting with all 650 of them the 1st time and i understand the history of the agency where that was done. explain what we are doing that accountability is the most important thing besides safety and customer service. and then shortly after that i did terminate a number of managers and have currently a review of the entire organization in terms of where there are redundancies were just over time positions have not been dealt with. i will continue to manage that. that is the overall management side by have a little clear capability.

on the front lines side i have the ability to let people go. we have processes for that. it depends upon the type of discretion. if the patient manager is in the right uniform they get a certain thing. basically all the way up to any major incident where i can terminate immediately. we go through the process that is set up in the contract. and that eventually can get to an arbiter and then it will go through the process while, which is the normal process, but i do have the ability to do that, and we do do it on a regular basis. >> thank you. i appreciate hearing that from you. weyou. we have got to make sure the safety is paramount. people that ride this whether they are from the area or other parts of the us deserve to have a safe

system. if someone is working for the metro that is not, then we need to make sure that safety is paramount. i appreciate it and wish you well. i have been impressed with your management style. >> and i now recognize ranking member defazio for five minutes. >> thank you, madam chair. administrator, i realize your briefly on the job, but in map 21 we gave new regulatory authority to fta over transit safety, and yet some critical aspects of the role are still lingering somewhere. i don't know whether they are down at the trolls at omb or where they are, but what is your expected timeline? >> are you asking about

fastback. >> there are things left over. still pending roles to fully implement that. >> we just issue this day safety oversight role on march 16 command we have several others that are in the process right now, the public safety program will is going to to the process of review now and so expect that to be final rule by midsummer. the national public transportation safety plan this comment period ended on april 5 command the fda expects to issue it in early fall. we have the public safety transportation agency safety plan, and that is also going to be out early fall. and we also have the safety certification training plan

which we expect to come out in midsummer. >> thank you. if you can stay on top of those and make certain that they continue through the process, you know, you mentioned the same thing i did my opening statement or one of the things about the backlog and deferred maintenance. obviously a lot of it lies with the larger legacy systems. this is a legacy system at this point. and as i point out, it is not an adequate amount of funds. so you know, you had a chance and began to look, and there is focus on them, but do you believe that this problem could be more widespread given that efficiency and funding and the accumulated backlog? >> yes, sir. you mentioned and

$84 billion backlog on a national level. ourour estimate is about 86 billion growing at two and a half billion a year command as you indicated, wmata is one of those systems, a legacysystems, a legacy system that probably makes up about 40 percent of the backlog, and so although the administration is asked for additional funding for infrastructure we have been seeing that funding is come, and it creates an issue, and it makes a challenge for all transit agencies to look at their priorities, and you see that challenge your in dc with wmata where they have to make a decision about what they can do with available funding. >> so, when you -- when you're inspector workforce, you are just ending up your

1st, and the focus right now is wmata, when do you expect to you will have adequate staffing to begin to go out and look at other legacy systems? >> we have focus right now on wmata and have 13 ft use that are basically focused on that area. we have done technical assistance and other areas where we have found problems , but we have been given additional authority but not the funding to basically address that. >> thirteen total. >> thirteen. there's probably only five inspectors and to investigators. >> five inspectors and to investigators for the federal transit administration to oversee all of the transit agencies in the united states of america? is that correct? >> that's correct.

>> that is interesting. i wonder how long it would take if they spent ten minutes at each one,one, how many years that would be, let alone an in-depth look. i hope that congress will soon allocate additional funds for the obligations we put on your agency. >> now recognize mr. michael for five minutes. >> ii can tell you where to look for some of those dollars. they pass legislation that was supposed to consolidate or eliminate 50 to 60 programs only question and oversight, how many people have left, there are plenty of people and resources. i suggest to my toes secretary to find some to go into important oversight responsibilities of the transit system. now, with some fanfare the

sec. has announced -- what is the name of the position that will be created? >> senior advisor. >> a senior advisor just for wmata. >> that's correct. >> i don't want this to be windowdressing. it isit is probably a good idea. probably need some technical people to know what is going on, but in order to make that effective i want you to report to the committee quarterly.quarterly. i will ask the staff for quarterly report. and actually get it back to us because of going to take some action in the next congress. but we need accountability out of view all, too.

60 percent of capital funds come from the federal government. it is one of the highest in the nation. the closest is the chairman's operations sector gets 39 percent of its money >> is pretty high. in our march 18 hearing and just prior to that i checked to see. we have to have money. we have to have money. $783 million a week before and federal funds sitting at wmata, checked it. and then the year before 485 million in 2015 sitting there not used. so that money does have constrained side.

his or anything that needs to be changed so that money can be used to make the improvements for safety that are necessary? i need to know now because we are doing appropriations. >> yes. >> we have the flexibility. >> but the money was there. the money was there. okay. testified on the 18th. >> what percentage? >> we have made progress. >> what is left, 20 percent? >> 10 percent. >> we have insulators. >> i know. i have been out there. that was where we are having

problems right now. that is being done in-house and contracted. >> with the safe drug plan basically we are using contractors. >> contractors. most of your repairs you probably get done by contract rather than in-house. >> a combination of both. >> okay. again, we have to address the media problems. are there any other major safety issues? i heard you are doing ties. what would you say are the next safety issues? >> a combination of fasteners, ties, power cables, running rail. >> submit to the committee a list of prioritization and what percentage you think you can do in an outhouse.

>> sometimes i havei have a tough demeanor. you need to fire people. part of my italian background. sir, you fire people, about 20, i heard. i'm going to create a new award. you are going to get the 1st one. for me to you if we can get more people and other agencies, tsa to take the action we would have much better government. thank you for stepping up to the plate and doing your job responsibly.

i'll have aa privatization build the turn this over to private management systems and work. we are in fairly good hands. >> staff, make sure the delegates a certificate. >> this is unprecedented. >> thank you. >> thank you. i got to washington. i am from new jersey. one big transportation hub. i got to washington ten years ago. i was all excited. ever since i got here the reputation and efficiency has just gotten worse and worse and worse.

and really it is a shame because this is the nations capitol. and at aa time in america when people are moving into the cities, at a time when you look at washington to government going to give you certificate. people are moving into the city. and yet we have the system that is a gem now we have less ridership them before. so the city, it impacts everything around the city, the economy, the people coming to work. i think this really has to be turned around on the city

is going to standstill. the only people that will be able to move around of the people cutting you off at the bicycles. >> frankly, people deserve better. people deserve a safe system. and i said, look, mr. butterfield, i don't want america to get the wrong impression. but i see that you have action items. can you tell me what is good but the system that we could work with? this is a system we can fix. we need to get people back in the system. also if it's good?

>> is no doubt about it and he is back to the two track system. but that system does perform well, and when you look at other systems they all have issues. i went to school in new jersey, working for a number of years minus some of the issues they have. san francisco is facing significant issues. it is a large infrastructure investment. day-to-day the system works well. >> also, the concern is people in america are moving back into the cities. if we don't have a system that is safe i think we are headed for trouble, and i know we have a responsibility to make sure there is enough funding for the infrastructure, the

safetyinfrastructure, the safety part of it, and i just want america to know what you can still companies the system. we are going to fix it. >> you can cows with a couple in from colorado. theythey got to talking about the metro and had a great experience. i think it is more common than we think. >> thank you for being here and talking about the system. >> thank you, and i recognize mr. webster for five minutes. >> thank you, madam chair. i read the metro every day for five and a half years from pentagon city to the font to capital south. and you know, i think there are two things here. talking about more money, hiring, firing, all of that, but all i know is that every day that i ridehere is no escalator broken.

so i started watching three escalators. there are bunch of them. this is three. and i would say that over the past few years that these three that i have watched have been rebuilt four times. i'm talking about all new everything. all the treads, and it just seems to me like there would be a more efficient way to do that. i would tell you,you, you ought to look. i don't know if there are reports about that, but i can tell you that i know because i have seen it. on the other hand, there is one escalator that is privately done and in the five and a half years i have been writing on that same system where you getwe get dropped off and this one is done by the people around

the building, it has been broken wants in five and a half years. so i think there is probably -- ii don't know what you do as far as efficiency in this bars rechecking the people that do your maintenance and so forth, but if the other maintenance -- never been in a rack or anything like that, so i don't know anything about the cars. i cars. i see them. you may have extra ones. what i do know is, the escalators are fixed,fixed, they're, and you must have them repaired time and time again. and it seems to me -- and i don't knowi don't know if it is done by contractor, your employees. it is the vendor that provides the actual treads and so forth on the escalator, but i would tell you, i believe there are lots of savings to be found.

different vendors are different employees were different persons that actually perform the work. so that is my two cents. thatcents. that is only from my experience on it. i don't live here. i have one rail system in my district. it is owned by disney world, and i have never seen a broken in the 30 some years they have been there. we have a lot of people that ride that, too. 66 million every year, and they go one place, walt disney world and see world and universal studios. but the one rail system seems to be much more maintained, so i would suggest maybe just talking to those who own or operate a rail system, maybe there are savings there, too. with that i yield back. >> and i now recognize for

five minutes. >> you probably sitting there thinking my do a better job of criticizing than fixing. there's obviously the stories in the newspapers and on tv that have been scary to me. and my 1st question has it been the ridership and does that affect your budget and the other question is there have been very high publicized criminal incidences. there was a young man that was stabbed multiple times, a woman that was recently sexually assaulted, and i do not mean

to insinuate that that was the fault of metro. my question would be, is there anything that you can do to make it safer? >> the ridership levels, yes, it is a combination of the quality of the service, but it is also just the change in demographics, telecommuting, the growth of the uber, all kinds of things. and we are not unique in that regard either. major properties. in terms of criminal activity, it is an extremely safe system from that perspective numerically. very safe. that means nothing because obviously that does not mean

much for the perception. we have applied a number of of things in terms of policing. we put more police out there , moving people out from behind desks, moving people. we have contracted it out so that we have armed officers, a major recruitment underway to beef up that area. today we are meeting with counsel governments to have an agreement with all the jurisdictions where we can bring in moonlighting officers to beef up the presence on the system. the reality is, if you do something we get you literally within hours if not days. we are getting these people. these things happen in a matter of seconds. it was a vast, open system is extremely difficult.

we are working with local school systems, follow social media and we apply the resources accordingly. >> what are you doing about training so that you do not have to fire? >> i get no pleasure. it is not -- that is the last thing i want to do, let someone go. so that is the key, to train, to bring people long, and it is not just management but front-line employees. part of the change of the culture.

you have to use it when you need to. >> whatto. >> what are you doing up the training? >> a number of things. there focusing on the safety training, just basic, even how we idea our people. >> are you holding glasses? >> a series of classes from outside vendors coming in, creating programs, we literally have to do it on an annual basis. we have letting it slip. it isit is recruiting people that come in that way, combination of all. >> required, employees are required to go through the training. >> yes. every new employee spends four days and training.

>> what about continuing. >> exactly. some of them literally to have their id badge they have to have the training. >> thank you very much. i yield back. >> thank you. i recognize mr. meadows for five minutes. >> thank you, madam chairman. let me come back to you. obviously we have had our dealings before, and i guess my concern yesterday we heard talk about funding, and the focus is about funding and get i understand that perhaps this is not a funding issue as much as it is a management issue and truly a maintenance issue. >> i think there is an issue with the funding in terms of dedicated and sustainable funding. that means we don't go through an annual budgeting

process. >> are you aware that at no time that we can find that the borders come to this committee or the oversight committee to suggest that maintenance was not getting done because they did not have funding? we can't find it. >> am not aware of that. >> if you are not aware than this committee's not aware and the oversight committee is not aware, how can we be focusing our attention on funding when you're bored has never let us know that they are not doing repairs because of funding? >> i just don't know the history. >> are you aware that there is an average of four times a week of a fire actually occurring on the metro system, there's a greater probability of someone seeing a fire on the metro in washington dc over the last five months and there

was in the great smoky national park that i represent, do you find that alarming? >> i do. ii do. i think it is, again, why the safe track plan, it's why put it out there. >> if we are looking at this board and i understand from a board member that the buck stops with you, you are going to have complete authority to make this system safe, reliable,, and the service standard that we can all applaud. >> if that does not happen will you let this committee and the oversight committee know you are being thwarted by the board. >> again -- >> i guess what i am saying is, i am making a request. if there is aninterference

by the board on any of the service related activity will you report back? >> sir, ifsir, if i may, again, i took this job to tackle these issues. if i am thwarted in any way it is not the job for me. >> i ran into a gentleman in the hall a week or two ago and said earlier the board should have someone who start travels the metro each and every day as a citizen advocates of the speak that is on the board. do you agree? >> i know ai know a number of the board members use the system every day. >> but someone who speaks -- that does not have any political ties and actually speaks for the populace? >> i have that through writers unions and a number of resources. >> what if we took every one

of the board members. required them to experience what all the commuters get to experience. didn't have the same appreciation. >> making that a requirement do you think it is wise to continue to add additional capitol improvement and extend the metro in doing

that do you think it is more prudent to have the maintenance. >> whatever the number, 86 million. increase the system for economic reasons, safety reasons. there is a time for that. i focus is on the maintenance we can't back away from ongoing maintenance. >> i will yield back. >> and now recognize

mr. lipinski five minutes. >> i want to make sure i get out there. started a few years ago. the 1st congressional transit caucus. we support public transit across the country, not just my hometown of chicago, but i am also a metro rider when i am out here. the 1st thing i wanted to mention, that wmata recent cancellation of a new electronic payment program designed to make customer experience better reportedly would've saved up to 60 million a year. there is much invested, and we certainly have a few challenges occurring.

i will be asking questions for the record on that them what has happened. but i want to move on. i just want to ask questions. a recent assault on a dc metro bus driver became deadly when the bus was hijacked and killed a pedestrian. driver assaults our national issue. noticed proposed rulemaking and driver salt which is a growing issue. when will fda issue this rulemaking? >> the 1st thing we have done is that our transit advisory committee on safety has done a study on operators salt and given us best practices and recommendations on preventing and mitigating transit worker assault, so that will be the basis of putting together a proposed rulemaking. they're currently gathering information and input as well as unions to inform

this rulemaking. we are in the process right now working on that. >> thank you. i will come back to you later after the hearing. this morning i am a red line writer. single tracking a report of an arcing incident. i said i'm getting on my bike to ride the 17 miles down to castle hill because i don't know when i will get in. i think metro in so many ways is unfortunately an embarrassment. it needs to work. i'm not here to just tear things down. the region is to come up

with a dedicated funding source for metro. we can do anything here. we need definitely i talked about changing colonnade to change the way people act within the system, the whole culture which is difficult to do. i thank you for what you have done so far. i want to ask, the march 16 shutdown causes significant inconvenience. commuters, two months after the fda released a series of safety directives to metro. among them were things that appear to be routine maintenance including removing debris. so i am concerned about metro's efficiency conducting inspection and repair, especially given the safe track plan and i want

to be assured that of metro will cause a series disruption in people's daily lives the you'll be using the time to accomplish all the required maintenance. first, where fda findings in may a result of the march 16 shutdown or the result of previous what? what were the may fda findings? >> i think they reflected the lack of ongoing maintenance and the ability to get out there and do that which is why the safe track as the impact that it has because typically to get out there and do a level of work we need to do because it is not just one thing. >> but did you know, the main findings, of those, others things that were found on the march 16 shutdown? >> no. we were looking at the power cable issue because that was -- >> are focused on that one thing. >> focused on that.

>> measure is completed, will it be in compliance with all federal safety order recommendations? >> it will be. that is the plan. not only to meet it but we have to go beyond it and maintain it. we don't keep doing that will be right back to where we were. >> very quickly, take the red line, here it going by all the time. where i sleep when i am out here, i heard for months the quick clack of every time a wheelset when over a track for months. a broken rail and i saidi said i could've told you a long time ago is a problem there. it seems like there is

somehow something wrong. there is something wrong here. part of trying to make the system run well which is something that needs to change. we need to make the system work. >> thank you, and i now recognize myself for five minutes. i want to highlight an issue for my opening statement that i talked about, the average costs are higher. operating expenses are 124 percent of average up to 151 percent.

and that works out. that is compared to prevailing rates which leads to my question, outside contractors provide the same service at a lower cost. >> we can. if we have -- and that is what we are doing in effect.

>> but are they getting paid this contract rate, or can they were brought in and get these $30 rates trying to save money, get things back online. >> we have met with people. see if we can expedite. but on the technology front, a sees my language, have you seen the metro blog called on fark metro?

how are we using technology? i look at that this morning comeau one of the major questions is about this incident, the crime, so like you to address that, but i wanted to address why don't we and to enable your writers to assist, how can we plug in the system i've spoken with your technology companies are doing this. this technology enables us to look at the new safety pictures. get a picture, at the timestamp.

a lot of accountability. hundreds of unmet safety issues. these new ones go online and in the interest of transparency can you commit to providing that as well as using the technology? >> i do. that is with the care reporters about comeau we opted things. but will also be frank, i want to work with outside vendors and the community in general that have that knowledge. it is hard to create. it is also something that is

not -- we have a lot of smart people in the region. and you are seeing it evolved. that is something that i've made very clear. i want to bring those people to the table. just open it up. >> we talked about this, goes into the system and it can be timestamp. if somebody is seen thathits seen that fire that day, take a picture and send it in, are your folks tracking that and saying this is a picture that just came in, timestamp, lines up you have to send anyone out to verify.

i can give it to you as well as someone who is paying $50 an hour. the time lapses should not be occurring given we have the technology. when you look, most of what we know about it occurred from people using their cell phones and giving us that information. and let's make sure we are using that to maximal effect >> i totally agree. i want our staff to do things before it gets to that point. an example i gave in front of the cabinet, we had

parked render had parked a large piecea large piece of construction equipment in front of it. i should not happen. so that is the culture change that we have to get to. >> canto. >> can we go back to that rape incident under part? >> pursuing that person. >> to have those kind of statistics on the website by station order way. we all know, the criminal use, the smart card. >> our tv cameras. >> while that was resolved quickly, the public at large

did not know about it. that is something everyone is concerned about. can we take those crime statistics whether somebody at will smell, i understand cell phones being stolen how one of the most common things that happen because people are looking at them. can we have those kind of incidents per station reported so that people know and can look and see what is going on in real time and just having although statistics, and what will help you in that way, all of our transportation resources, universities, you will give them a vast amount of research data to help you to work that you have to pay for. >> i think we have to put it in context. they are just part of the community. i think you know just as

likely to happen outside is inside. >> the information is power. people are becoming more for use it. in addition to our costs being hire, are you confident you can bring the cost down? we made a commitment to do that at the table. wetable. we are focusing on wage, pension, health benefits, workrooms. it does go. given our costs are 120 to 150 percent higher it is incredibly distressing that our performance is 70 percent on time when your average transit system is up

in the high '90s. that is the disconnect and concern. i now recognize as este for five minutes. >> thank you. thank you all for joining us. as someone who is a high school student in those metros when they were being built i have a particular interest in the legacy around how we maintain them. a couple of questions. who are you looking at what organizations are what institutions do you think we should be looking at to inculcate the kind of safety culture that needs to be instinct? >> okay. i spent ten years, and i think that's a great example it is just part of who you are, and trying to instill

that same philosophy. it is who you are. >> i would agree. it is baked in the absolutely every decision you make, and then to empower workers to see that as their responsibility to get there 1st following up on what the subcommittee chair said, you look at something like click it fix it to empower people who are users of the system not as adversaries but as advocates for making sure that the highest priority situations are dealt with 1st. having recently been in silicon valley there are a lot of entrepreneurs who are eager to try to help democracy work well. we need to find some way to tap into their energy and intellectual in a way that

helps us launch in the 21st century and not be tried up in trying to update our computer systems. a number of us would be eager to try to help make the connections. we have an ongoing issue not unique to transit. the excitement about developing aa big new system whether it's a bridge or road or airport. whenever put enough money aside for maintenance, for these heavily used transit systems. given was happened do you have suggestions for how we insist that it is actually being spent as we go and they cannot be postponed because we know that is the political imperative, you would rather go on and do something new, maintenance is never exciting, sexy, but it is a disaster when the

worst happens. do you have suggestions? >> one of the criteria that we look at the financial plans for new capital projects is to ensure that in the financial forecast maintenance is included and i think that is going to be critical. when you are constructing a new system you must ensure that there is a way to sustain the system over a long period of time. assets are built for 50 to 100 years, and so it is, you know, just critical that you look at the way to sustain the system in the future. so that is part of the plans that we look at and addressing the state of good repair as part of our

program is also going to be critical and having funding to ensure that these systems have enough funds for maintenance and that the maintenance is not deferred. >> i think wei think we need to be working together to ensure we see the progress. this is the priority project and then you have to come back to the board and say comeau we are not far enough. it is dangerous. we need to see the progress that we need the judgment of that comeau on the ground was now a critical piece that needs to be addressed. finally, can you talk about the reliability and performance measures comeau what they should expect?

not where we would want to be and obviously taking things off-line to exacerbated. what figures are you using, and how will they be communicated? >> sure. you can go online and monitor what we do. one of the things we changed , we used to put on our on time performance on rail cars based on how we manage it. we movedit. we moved to a mechanism whereas you tap into the time you out from a customer perspective is the real delay. that is what we are starting to put out there. >> thank you. i see my time has expired. >> i recognize mr. norton for five minutes. >> i think the chairwoman for taking me out of order.

mr. wieder felt, we all recognize that there are no new ready sources of revenue the usual mythical sources, of course, are, are mentioned from time to time. .. i do know that in the last fast act that we just did there was a 25% increase on older systems. that was something, that as the ranking member i thought hard for. there really is a difference between the systems and the newer ones.

yet, what cannot be ignored is that metros have a 5% loss over the last five years. they're probably going to have more with safe track. i noted in something you said a few months ago that ramada was trying to help itself, is looking for something that business health often does, incentives to re- attract riders. you can tell me, things like if you went into a station and it was crowded and you had to leave, you could reenter at a later point, some sort of new path. could you outline if you are still considering incentives particularly after your going to lose some of your riders anyway. can you afford to put some of these incentives in place? if so, what kind what kind of incentives are you looking at now to help riders be reattract it to metro?

>> a a few things we have done. one is the ability, to tap in, tap out what we call. if you get into a station and there something going on, we would charge you to get back out even though you did not use the system. we change that so basically you have 15 minutes to make up your mind, if something does not play out the way you want you can get back out and do not have to pay. i think that is good customer service product that we should have. we worked with university system for instance where university pass. we are working with american university where they and older students will have unlimited use of the system for flat fee that they are charged at the beginning of the year as part of their tuition or fees i guess. the rationale that is basically that is a lot of non- peak usage. it also introduces other people that we want to educate about the system use the system. it's another way to attract people like that. again, we're trying to do things from a customer and it side to

give real-time information. as i just mentioned so people can make educated decisions. it is continuing to do things like that. i have to balance that clearly with the impact and the revenue of that, on the other hand we have to make sure we are reflecting the times of today and not doing the same stuff we did in 1980 or 19 it 90. >> so notwithstanding fast tracked you're still going to put those incentives out there, perhaps because a fast track you need those incentives out there. >> yes, we will. >> thank you madame chair. >> i now. >> i now recognize myself another five minutes also. going back to some of the labor costs, can you tell us what it does for track inspector position. what do those paid? >> i do not know the track inspectors, know the operations side, i can get i can get you that but i don't have it right now.

>> okay. i know know you are new so i am not blaming you, we have had some other questions and i have not been able to get the answers on some of the labor costs and what we are paying people per our. again, as we are talking about how we right size this and how we get the expenses under control i think it is very helpful to have that transparent and to know what these jobs pay in comparison to -- >> i can tell you at the operations i because most of our employees are bus operators, train operators, the bust operator*just above $19 per hour. the highest rate hour. the highest rate gets to be about $31 per hour. that is about to visit the country compared to other properties, on the heavy rail side and we are basically about fifth or sixth on the bus side compared to major properties. >> on the 20 people who were fired, assumed assumed there some longevity there so there are people who are so still

getting pensions and getting paid, we have legacy costs there. that was one of the questions i had asked him in terms of because currently the policy right now is the overtime goes towards their pension so when you have over time in the systems we were trying to find out what level of overtime there was throughout the system. i understand i understand that while we are doing the accelerated repair that there is inevitably going to be some over time, again that would be why we would hope to look at contracting out. we're not able only be able to avoid the overtime but avoid the long-term cost that overtime would present as well is to be able to contract out at a lower cost. again, i would reemphasize -- >> i will get you to fax him at. >> going forward into the labor negotiation, what are we the public and congress able to see?

we had talked about this a little bit about what we are we able to see the transparency and labor process and what is being negotiated? because you are going to have to negotiate this but since we are partners in this and the entire region is, i think it is important that virginia, maryland, d.c., congress, all know what the negotiations are terms and how we compare to other systems for the country. what kind of information can we get on that? >> we will be presenting that to the board. we'll present all that information to the poor. again, we have an agreement on both sides to do these negotiations. they are negotiations, we do not want to do them in public, so that is what we are doing. we will take it to the board and that is where public process. >> but when it is presented to the park and it also be presented to us in congress question. >> yes. >> okay, and maybe also to the public because again feeding off of the ability for the public

and there's a lot of expertise out there and a lot of people would like to compete in the space to give us a better product, more technologically accurate. when they are able to see in a transparent a transparent way how we operate, think that will give us and more people coming for to talk to us, to talk to you, so we can open up that process and just have an open platform in whatever way we need to, to get that information at whether it be the maintenance, what we are paid various contracts, paratransit, you have highlighted press looking looking at other ways we can save as well as the technology. >> again, again, we have to do that within the context of it negotiations that are in law. >> okay, ms. forrest you have anything to add on that front and how we might be able to help you? >> how to do your job and how you're trying to approach this question.

>> well, we thank you for the support that you have provided to us through the fast act as well as map 21 and expanding our authority. we have the challenges of the additional authority and like everyone else here at the table, you know, funding for that authority is one of the challenges that we have. so, we look for forward to the support through the appropriation process to provide us with the necessary resources that are needed do our job. >> finally, i'm running out of time here, i guess somebody else am imposing upon except the witnesses. i wanted to ask about the rock. we have been up to visit and i think think you and your staff for bringing us there and continuing to update us on what is going on there. i understand right now, is it correct that we have 46 positions are allocated for the

controllers there, but there are currently 19 vacancies. is that still accurate? >> no. i believe the vacancies are down to three. there are people in training now but they're not certified yet to be on the floor. >> okay so we are getting online. i appreciate that because informal reports and things as i said before, that washingtonian magazine kind of gave the customer account but also the worker account of that and it was seen as sort of a source of a lot of the problems. what kind of actions are you able to take so far and do you see taking forward to correct a lot of the problems that were there? >> as i mentioned in april i have a new head of the rock who have some experience there and also other parts of the agency so bring some different skill base to that.

it is a focus of a safety officer to go in there and think of other ways that they should be particularly on drilling and things like that. fda has been supportive of that as well. again, it is all of the above, it is not just one thing, but clearly management is a big part of it. >> okay. i appreciate all of your time and your attention to this important matter. i think you have heard from all of our colleagues in the regional area as well as the chairman here and members have been involved in these issues for years. there is a large measure of goodwill and appreciation for what you are doing and the difficulty of the task ahead. i think it is important that as long as we're able to stay united on this and work with you on fixing this, we we know will have problems and disagreements down the road, but i think as much as we can keep it together and where you can come to us and tell us to is that you do not

have. if you run into blockages where you can say well you know we could do this stuff and i could keep my deadline or even shorten the year deadline if i could have this authority from congress or we could change this law, there are legislative fixes that we need or things that you are not able to do under current rules, please let the fda know, please let us know. if you are not getting the kind of support from where ever, we need to know. i would also invite the listening public to those who go on blogs of whatever name that you let us know your experience, take those features. i can tell you when i was on the transportation committee, people would send me their pictures of road problems, things, i would be able to send them, when i had a picture and the location it always got handled much faster. we have people on these trains every day for dealing with things. take those pictures, send it up,

put them on blogs, give that attention because then whether it is a supervisor anybody else, there's no one to run to. it is there, we know it, we are working through these problems in a systematic way. i would ask all of us to be partners in helping you do your job. thank you. i ask unanimous consent that the record of today's hearing remain open until such time as our witnesses are provided answers to any questions that may be submitted to them in writing and unanimous consent that the record remain open for 15 days for additional comments and information submitted by members or witnesses to be included in the record of today's hearing. without objection, it is so ordered. if no other members, have anything to add the subcommittee stands adjourned. [inaudible]

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[inaudible] [inaudible] [inaudible] [inaudible] >> tomorrow morning on capitol hill, psa administrator lays out his plan to cut wait time at airport check times across the country. we will take take it to the house homeland security meeting live at 10:00 a.m. eastern on c-span three and online at c-span.org. >> this sunday night on q&a, u.s. senate historian, betty talks about various events in senate history and the work her office does. >> i came in june 1998 as a newly minted senate historian.

my colleagues dickie said to me it's going to be nice and quiet, we have no election coming up you'll have lots of time settled in and reading get comfortable in your job. within a few weeks the house had decided to impeach bill clinton and we got very busy, very quickly. we had to do a good deal of research on impeachment trials, we had not have an impeachment since 1860. the 60. the senate leaders at that time trenton tom daschle really wanted to follow historical precedent as much as they could. >> sunday night night at 8:00 p.m. eastern is pacific on c-span's q&a. >> doctor anthony director of the national institute of allergy and infectious diseases talks about the risk posed by the zika virus in the u.s. in the high mosquito season as it approaches. from the wilson center in washington d.c., this is just over an hour.

>> good morning. welcome to the wilson center, we we are impressed that you have managed the metro another issuei getting into this building. we are delighted to host, or maybe terrified to host a national conversation on zika in the us, can we we manage the risk. i am jane harman president and ceo of the wilson center, recovering politician, and i think that this subject could not be more important. over the weekends in in the washington post there is an op-ed by ron m complain many of us know from various roles in government including as president obama's evil azar. he has a message for this town "zika is not coming te the united states, it is alread. here".

puerto rico is already facing a crisis. when mosquito season picks up which could be any minute, the, the rest of the country will too. zika is an urgent threat to american public health but you would not know it from the attitude of my former employer, susan from the united states covers. for too many members this is just another occasion for the blame game.re with failures like flint, michigan on everybody's mind i would have thought there would have been a rush to get ahead of the next preventable bowl tragedy. when these public health crises blowup, politicians who drag their heels get embarrassed. but much more important, people become ill and some die. to their credit, the individuals on today's panel have been out there on the airwaves getting the word out from a range of angles and i am delighted that they are taking our stage todayd susan, as i i mentioned was one

of my colleagues in the house. >> a reforming also. >> a reforming politician also. she, like i has escaped the toxic partisanship. she now has a public policy at google which is dedicated funds, data, data, and engineers to mapping the transition of the zika virus. thank you google. like me, i'm sure she is frustrated that her former colleagues are not moving faster to address such an urgent health crisis.s. >> absolutely. >> and shook it, principal deputy director at the cdc has been combating disease for decades. i remember dealing with you when i was in congress. diseases like h1n1, sars, ebola, and now zika. for those who missed the memo, she recently, she recently suggested that we could see hundreds of thousands of seagate cases in puerto rico and hundreds of cases of

microcephaly. let's just focus on that for one moment. my six grandchild, very healthy, very healthy boy was born three weeks ago.boy wa as a grandmother, and as a parent i cannot imagine what it must it be like to have a child when with microcephaly. we really have to do more to get ahead of this.s. when and says zika is scarier than we thought she's beaks from deep medical background and a long record of service. the same goes for my friend dirc doctor anthony. the longtime director of the national institute of allergy and infectious disease at nih. tony is a giant in the field.se i cannot tell you how nervous ii was to hear him say ", we cannot pretend to know everything we need to know about zika " we are grateful again for jason, npr's global correspondent for moderating such an importantntcd conversation. we hope it can be a wake-up call for this town, especially for

those folks a 1 mile away on capitol hill. the senate and house have passed a different zika funding packages. they actually have done something. but now they have to hold a conference to bridge the gap between the two measures.riority i really cannot imagine that congress is so busy that it cannot find time for this priority. i do not know when they will conference, but tonight would not be soon enough. in the meantime, please joining in welcoming our distinguished panel. [applause]. >> thank you all for coming today. i hope this is going to be conversation among all of us, we will get to q&a at the end. if you have questions about it, will pass the microphone around, and try to get some of thehe questions you have. susan, i'm going to start with you. just on the amount of interest, you guys arse to some degree gauging that by what you're seen

in terms of traffic, the number of people searching about zika in the u.s., and i look at some of the data that you are pulling together and what are you seeing? it seems like you are seen a lot of concern out there. >> that is for sure. personal i want to thank the wilson center and my dear friend jane for bringing me together with all of you to discuss this issue. anytime you get an opportunity to even be in the orbit of --ge ice feel blessed. google, if if i could just backtrack a little bit, i want to put this in context, they decided decided a little over aa year ago to get their arms ramsey get. this initially started not in the united states because so much of the attention when we began this partnership with the cdc and nih was focused on other parts of the world particularly

in some parts of the world where we have very large and play bass like brazil for example. what google did at this point it was we have three main components of our global, very quickly product integration and research awareness campaign. what we do and that is working with groups like unicef we try to predict, and we do this for over 900 health conditions, people go directly on search and we are trying to provide more information in over 70 languages on what zika is, how it is detected, symptoms, how to deal with it, how to prevent it, and overview of the virus, and public health alert that we keep updating from the world health organization. we do that on search. on youtube we partnered with greeters across latin america including sesame street and the brazilian physician to try to get the word out there to raise awareness via all of their channels and subscribers to provide information on prevention, message and controlling the mosquitoes in

both spanish and portuguese. the last thing we have done for long time with cdc and nih as we have mapped the global interest on the zika virus. starting octobee timeline for when zika became a global a global epidemic. with all of that we have given over $1 million and we could talk about that. i can get deeper into what wefo are doing on the day today. but to answer question and, knowing that is the kind of information that we look to compile because that is what google does. we does.look t we tried to order the world's information. so the concern around zika now is it really clear and we have t seen as of march, since november a 3000% increase in searches. so a lot of time google searches are very predictive of what is going to happen. peopl i think both my partners on stage will tell you that we work with them on flu trends. when people start to search and i used to make, or well, i guess i would be allergy trends. and how to cure it sore throat,

how to deal with a high fever, we can sort of help the government figure out when flu trends are coming. our guys will tell you that we can start to see the beginning of a housing crisis because people started to see this amazing birth on the scene the people tried to figure out how to get second mortgages, how to deal with bankruptcies. so now we have started to see this amazing growth, 3000% justd from november until march in terms of people searching. that is really a dramatic increase. i daresay, although i would love to see it is out of pure curiosity, i daresay that most of it comes from real intense concern. >> i think that is what the big issue is people. people are concerned.. i can send it over to you, how prepared is the u.s. to deal with this. were going into the summer season when the mosquitoes are both hard to manage, the disease itself and that concern that people have.

>> i would say that we are not starting at a good place. we used to have a lot stronger mosquito control and mosquito awareness. really the surveillance of where the mosquitoes are in the resistance patterns that they have, so we really have a patchwork nation around mosquitoi st capacity. the state health department, the local governments are really concerned and are working on this. we absolutely need resources to get ahead of it. this is the season when mosquitoes are coming. t tit we really have worked out plans of how to be ready and what to do at each step of the way. we really need to build that up. we have prepared the labs across the country, cdc developed a new lab test and ship them out to states and cities and the number number of countries around the world. those are new lab test that do not work as well as we would like. we also need to get better at diagnostic test developed that will answer more questions. >> at the beginning of this there was not really a definitive test for zika, was their? everything was being sent all all the way tonifo your lap in

atlanta, is that correct question or. >> that is right. the cdc develops a develops lab testst based on 2007 outbreak of zika before it was related to birth defects. the virus itself can cause no symptoms in four out of five people. one person will have symptoms that are relatively mild, fever, joint pain, red eyes, really a rash that is itchy but not very specific. you do need a lab test to know whether it is zika or something else.in times. that the lab test do not really give your perfect answer every time because they have to be collected at certain times. that said, we are doing thousands and thousands of test every week to get information to family so that they can plan.d >> we are talking before coming out here and i was asking how many pregnant women are there on an annual basis, i have three children, a lot of people have gone through pregnancies, it, it is a very nerve-racking time for people. when he think about the number of women were going to get bitten by mosquitoes this summer and are going to be concerned,

in the healthcare system in the capacity there to manage that concern. >> every day about 10000 babies are born. with zika, if you come back from with an area where the virus is spreading and you're pregnant, we are recommending these your healthcare provider, that you get a test in the first trimester and again potentially later. but you actually understand whether you are exposed and got infected or not. do not yet know whether babies that are born looking healthy following the zika infection are going to be developing normally. so we really need to be able to follow these babies longer term. last week we announced a new tracking system of pregnancy registry here in the u.s., along with a special in puerto rico. withtem se registries we hope to be following women and their babies longer term so that we can understand and give good information to families about

what to expect. as you are saying, what we know about this virus is pretty concerning. microcephaly concern, these babies may never walk, talk, be able to be themselves, care for themselves, their families are affected for life, their siblings, their communities, we really want to prevent that kind of problem for families.care for we need to know more in order ti prevent it well. w >> doctor, where do things stanv in terms of a vaccine that would put this crisis behind us. it seems like if we could get people vaccinated -- >> certainly a vaccine would be important in the long-term solution of how we address zika, particularly if you have a low level of infection in the nation like brazil.av let's say you have do is zika what we have done with rubella. some some people may remember that in the 1960s there is ael

considerable risk, about 20,000 rubella about 20,000 rubella babies, congenital rubella syndrome were born in the united states. the rubella vaccine which we all take us children, all take as children, it is one of the mandatory vaccines it was originally directed to women of childbearing age.isry the women way you get women of childbearing age is that you vaccinate everybody as children because they to be protected. with zika there is some good news and realistic sobering news. the.e the good news is that we have made successful vaccines against other viruses, zika is this type of a virus other viruses you may be familiar with our yellow fever, gain key, and west nile. dengue. so conceptually we do not see any scientific roadblock toworke developing a vaccine for zika.on in that regard, as soon as the

cdc and nih realize that we are going to put a full-court press on this we started working on a zika vaccine.e. we have done it with the kinds of technology that we have seen with other vaccines. the way the timetable is now we have a listw of about 45 vaccines at different levels of a when we can move them from preclinical into what we call phase one study to see first if they are say. the big thing about vaccine that people need to realize an even know everybody wants a vaccine, the most and printing a safety. you are giving it to hundreds of thousands of normal people.sariy so we have several candidates, the first one in the queue may not necessarily be ultimately the best one. but the first one in the queue is going to go intl a phase i clinical trial for safety and if it induces theto kind of response you would predict to be protected. that is almost going to happen

by september 2016. there'll be about 80 people, because it is a small number people because of safety we'll do it here in the united states at multiple sites, including at at multiple sites, including at the nih clinical center in bethesda. we should know by the end of 2016, beginning of 2017 whether it 2017 whether it is safe andsi induces an appropriate response. if that is the case, which i've no reason to assume it won't be, then we'll start with that theht phase two to that logic multithousand patient child to be determined if this works. the thing that confuses people about timetables, because it we get asked the timetable, we know when it is going to start, we know when we'll get the early data. how soon you get advocacy dating that depends on two factors. one, how inherently effective it is, the more effective the vaccine, the quicker you know it works. the second important factor is how many infections there are in the community at any given time. if there still is many infections in the first quarter of 2017 is we're seeing now in brazil, colombia, puerto rico, colombia, puerto rico, we could know if the vaccine works by the

end of 2017, the beginner 2018. if the infections go down which is good news for the public health, it good news for the public health, it may take a couple of years longer. that's what happened with us with ebola. we had a pre-good vaccine good vaccine and as the cdc and nah they did it in sierra leone and we did it in liberia, soon as we got the vaccine going all of the infections disappeared. we kind of feel it's a good vaccine but we haven't definitively proved it yet. i >> what the concern is if you look at the island outbreak in south polynesian outbreak, they they even think that outbreak peaked at the moment. it is quite possible that we will not have a vaccine until after we have had a peak in the u.s..s. if history -- >> be careful when you say peak in the united states, because we do not fully expect, we are going to be prepared for everything but we have travel related cases in the continental

united states over 500. we have 800 plus more in puerto rico and in the territories. we must really are going to see local transmitted so we need to get ready for what the public and press response to that is going to be. the local transmitted will be when someone never leaves the continental united states and gets infected. we we know fairly certain was it because we sought with a dinghy in florida and in texas, and we saw with others id florida. the critical issue is how totota prevent that from becoming sustained and disseminated.do t. i believe if we do the kinds of things that and was talking about regarding public health the mosquito control we can prevent this from being a real disseminated outbreak. but we need to be action oriented to be able to do that. with regard to the vaccine that the population would use, i think it would likely be used in those countries in which you have a degree of and the midcity of zika that it does not just comment is. dengue has been in the south

american and the caribbean for a few yearscoee beed now. it has not disappeared. dag is is still a problem at his chicken good and --ir thi >> we had a story about people collecting skittles in houston and looking at some of the control programs there.is t is there all across the u.s. of places where people are collecting miskito scope or is it very patchy? can you tell us little bit about what it is like in terms of the monitoring for zika virus out there, especially cross a southern gulf state. >> much of the mosquito control efforts are local. so they can be across the board in texas from one county to another, with a capacity is. we are intensively doing surveillance in puerto rico right now. we're really trying to understand where the population and hotspots are the mosquitoes resistant to certainhat is h

insecticides and what works ins terms of reducing the amounts and the density of mosquitoes. across the southern states its variable. we had a summit in atlanta on april first, 30 state leadership teams came to atlanta to talk about mosquito control. what were they doing, what could they do, could they learn from the best practices and some of the other jurisdictions. we know there's a lot of room for improvement. excellent program across the street, it may not be as strong as where you are, course the mosquitoes are not following the district lines of where the control programs are strong. ces the 80s egypt time mosquito is the principal one that spreads this zika virus. it's difficult to control. it's hearty, it can overwinter, and very little water is needed to maintain it,

it flights during the day and night. it's not the type of mosquito that you notice is biting you. it can be very subtle. it could be can be very subtle. it could be inside and outside the house. puerto rico are some of the southern states were people leave the windows open to get that nice breeze they can have mosquitoes inside and outside that are quite difficult to quid control. so this is an intense part of our work right now. really evaluating a lot of different efforts to understand what would be the best strategy. >> to also have a strategy if you start getting local g transmission?al also just to deal with public reaction to that. if you start start having to announce people have not been traveling all the sudden are up with zika at one particular place, how do you deal with that? >> the implication of local transmission is quite large, it is not just concerned with part of the public particularly with pregnant woman but just the blood supply. in puerto rico we ship blood there for about six weeks until we could get

adequate screening test to beal able to screen the blood. so this is one of the areas for the state and local governments are really intensively trying to prepare and again where the resources are sorely needed. what. what we really want people to do right now is when you have a travel associated case, work that out. go. go and see if there mosquitoes home because it isle actually through travelers that our mosquitoes could get infected. we recommend if you're coming back from the caribbean, puerto rico that you should actually use mosquito repellent for three weeks because you may the virusd up silently and if you get bit by mosquito and euro area, that mosquito could pick up the virus.ly it is not really intuitive once your home to be pouring on thepe mosquito repellent. that is a message that we know people have heard but we do recommend that.. in the atlanta they airport they have a loop that reminds you to do that. we do think that one case the health apartment should be out there looking at the mosquitoes in the area and of course if there is more than one case we want to understand is at

the same household, they nearby, so these are drills really thatw the states and locals need to do now is the weather gets warmer so they can react properly. we need to search the lab testing, we need to get communication out there, we need to make sure doctors know how to do evaluations come a lot of work to do. >> to have any sense of how likely it is if someone goes too brazil or puerto rico, or somewhere where it is clear that there's local transmission, how likely is it that someone has gotten infected, but got bit, does it not? it not? >> well we know that over 500 people have traveled back from zika affected areas to the 50 states and develop zika infections. we probably have many more than that because those are peoplele that are going to see someone getting tested and going through the detection efforts. so we probably probably have hadre thousands and thousands of travelers, we know of over 500. i think there's issues a probability. it would be be great to know what the chanceshb

are. i think the reality is, one bite and if you are pregnant your baby could be harmed, that is just a phenomenal problem to be working on. that really motivates us. the cdc has us. the cdc has over 1000 people who are part of our response are ready, they are actually 11 different centers of the cdc are involved because of birth the facts, miskito experts, infectious disease folks, the probability only gets you so far. >> the other issue that anne was saying that is counterintuitive, you come back from brazil or puerto rico say wow i made a so why should i put on mosquiton repellent. the other interesting thing is that is complicated and competitive that it it is sexually transmitted also. so men who return, it's actually

transmitted from men to women but not from women to men because we been able to demonstrate not only the presence of the virus in the semen, after a person seems to have recovered but also the documented case of sexually transmission from a man to a woman and a man-to-man. but is but as always the man is a transmitter. when you come back from a region you should really take a look and is very well delineated and on the cdc website, if if you come back from a region and you have a pregnant wife, clearly you should be if you have been affected, or highly's suspected of being affected to use a condom for the duration of the pregnancy. if you do not have unknown pregnant sexual partner, the same thing, if you have been infected, you have a documented infection or high suspicion of infection, you, you should either refrain from sex or have safe sex with a condom for six months. if you're down there don't have any symptoms and you figure maybe i was, may be in one of the 80% of that don't have symptoms, you should use safe

sex either abstinence from sex are consistent and correct use of condom for eight weeks. that is something that is a difficult message to get across tousus people. you can just see that. i go on vacation i have to comem home and -- it's an easily acceptable recommendation. but it is a compounding issue when you think in terms of how it can be spread. it cannot only be spread by someone coming back, being affected be a bit by mosquito which then by someone locally which is a local transmission, but it could be a sexual transmission. >> are we getting more information about exactly what people are at risk? is it possible that if you are affected just before you are pregnant or at the very end of the third trimester, we getting getting information?th >> there are larger cohort stories and case-control studies. the cdc is doing well, were doing one with the national institute of child health and development of 10,000 pregnant women in the study that is called the zika in infancy and pregnancy study. were trying to.

were trying to answer some of the questions. called like any virally transmitted disease that results in congenital abnormality, the first first trimester is always most vulnerable with regard to a fax on the fetus.s but we have some concerning evidence that there has beenen transmission at a time beyond that the first trimester, well into the second trimester andes beyond in which there have been harmful effects. it is not just the first trimester. >> i was just going to say, think this is one of the most critical questions people want to know.a we know now that this virus can cause microcephaly and some other birth affects her problems. but we do not know how often that happens. if you have a zika infection what are the chances. these studies that an agency dc, and collaboratives around the world are doing, they're so important to get that information. the other kind of study that is ongoing which we want answers to is about what this virus does in the body. as tony was saying, this persistent

virus and semen is why we have to have these really complex guidance on sexualalsot s a tr. you may remember from ebola that that could persist, we have been seen survivors of ebola able to start a flareup through sexual transmission. a a bullet has been document it up to 18 months that it could be still a virus in the survivor. we don't know what it's when to be in zika. what what if it was the second pregnancy you had to worry about. i think these are really tkn important research questions that we need answers to. the beginning of an emerging infection threat like this is when there's so much uncertainty. the uncertainty causes concern, the more knowledge and the hard information we can get the more we can plan and understand what we need to do. >> i'm wondering if i google your seen people drilling downfe in terms of what they'ree searching for about zika? a'm getting getting something beyond people who are just freaking out and are worried about or you see that people are looking for specific information spit.

>> were seen a trend where they're looking for more specific information. why i am here and why google is so committed to this, and i'm sure tad that add that we spentg way over $1 million with unicef and have given our engineers to try to help track this because what we're seeing when people start to look, they're looking deeper, they're asking more questions and it is mirroring the epidemic. that is 11 thing that we do know, significant portion of time for google searches is that when thosefor questions after when you take it past the first click they do start to see it follows the trends, usually precedes the trip. that is why were now at the point where were starting to shift those engineers to the united states and we can continue to work with the world health organization and with cd

, and unicef to try to get a handle and get as much information out to people in the united states where think it is been late in coming in terms of our concern, our knowledge. now very recently you'll see that we put up knowledge panelst and directed people to places they can go. definitely the intensity and the click through's have grown, particularly here we see it in the united states. >> the fact that it is mosquito borne, do you think that adds to people's concern about it? >> well, i think it adds to thee concern because it's very frustrating and how you control mosquitoes. when you have a mosquito species that is particularly -- to the things that we do. i would woul think that as a dimension of frustration because there is not a lot we can do. you can try your best with larisa, sec tsai, cleaning up the environment butt even with that history has told

us that this is a real difficult mosquito to deal with. it's a different kind of public health measure then when you're trying to prevent transmission from person-to-person like with the respiratory illness. it's a whole new venue of transmission. it is quite difficult to contain. >> are the insecticides working against it? i getting some resistance there to? >> this is going to be variable. in puerto rico when we have the best data there is one insecticide that we know works from our island testing. in some areas there's more than one, but there's one that works data, the throughout. one of the issues is having to delivery. what are are the best ways, inside, outside, adult larvae, there are some innovative traps that have beenl developed that are being usedd a that word the mosquitoes are attracted by a little bit of a sweet substance and they end up essentially killing theal mosquito. i think there is a lot of different approaches.to people are naturally questioning

is it okay, as this can kill a mosquito what's it going to do to me or my child, so their procedures to make sure that the products that are being used in and around homes are going to bo ones that they're safe and the benefit to risk ratio is reallyt going to be on the benefits i. it is an area where understanding the full range of options and investing in some of the innovation is very important. you probably probably heard about some of the innovative strategies for mosquito control, the genetically modified mosquitoes, the bacteria, i think it's exciting to have several new avenues been evaluated. in the meantime, before they're really ready for massive scale up we have to use the tools that have been out there. we really have to assess whether they are working in real-time. >> giving that so many of the cases were dealing with in the u.s. are travel related, i have to ask the travel question, everyone wants to know if i'm going to go somewhere, can i protect myself?

is it possible for me to say the olympics in brazil and protect myself and come back and be fine? >> of course you can. f nothing is 100%, and those are the recommendations you make. first of all to reconfirm what we have been saved. if you're pregnant, might be pregnant, going to be pregnant, don't go to an area in which there is local outbreak. there's local outbreak. that is for sure. if you do go, you can do thingsc to protect yourself to the best. for example, wearing close that cover considerable part of your body. there seems to be in some situations a reluctance to useat insect repellent. the approved insect repellent that contained a 30% deed are safe. they they are safe to use. you should not hesitate to use insect repellent. honestly obviously when you're in ait country that does not have particularly you mention some places that you not have a lot of screens, not a lot of air-conditioning, sometimes it is difficult to protect yourself

in that regard. it is easier here in the continental united states because we do have that. we have air conditioning, air-conditioning, we have screens. proper dressing, keeping in a place that is not mosquito friendly. mosquitoes don't like air-conditioned rooms.n using insect repellent is also another way that you can helps.g protect yourself. >> i left open it up to questions for the room. if anyone has a question, i will start with you in the back, wait to get the microphone, tell us who you are, and white until you get the might. >> thank you so much for your expertise. i'm a scholar with the wilson center within the scientific innovation program. we been looking at this issue for some time now. the way the problem seems to be really about management and knowledge from expertise. i wanted to ask you if the u.s. would consider to strategies that have been used in other

regions in europe and latin america. one is the use of genetically modified mosquitoes that they've been using in brazil and in other places, and then could we harness the power of citizens? could we teach them, them, could we harness their power to better improve the monitoring of mosquito populations. if so would there be diagnostic test?> we think about going further using citizens and really the power of citizens thatrstand understand better what it is about to actually innovate? >> maybe i can start. i think that the issue with the genetically modified mosquitoes, there are some evaluations being considered.ut so the fda has okayed a pilot

assessments with community input. so communities are considering whether they want to go that route or not. in terms of the citizen engagement, it's incrediblyyo in important. this is an area where everybody has a role to play, i do not know that i would say from diagnostic test distribution, i think at least in the u.s. weno have a good distribution system, but in terms of source control, in terms of making sure that you cleaned up the neighborhood, foh cleaned up the backyard, got rid of the standing water on the tires and so forth, and cleaned up the garbage areas, but also in terms of the information. so that issue pregnant woman making sure they know what they need to do to protect themselves or couples know what they need n to do, i do think that that question of mosquito monitoring there's probably some innovative ways that they could tap into that.rtainly is they're certainly a sides to figuring out what kind of mosquito it is and is it resistant or not. i think there's more power of communities that could be used. that that is part of what is being developed in puerto rico. i think in the southern states that is good as well.d

>> is there some way to get people to move beyond just searching and i don't know whether there some way to take that interest a general people to take action the way she was asking? >> when i was thinking about that, as think about a proposal while particularly for you in the united states. i think one thing we have done successfully in latin america is using our youtube channels and partners right because then you really have an ability to deal with their subscribers and it's not just a once shot messaging. you reaching different b populations that we work with unicef and the world health organization in terms of how to get that message out there. the knowledge panels are written particularly in the uniteded states with the help of our health partners because that's not what we do. so whenever we get the opportunity to get a message from these amazing individuals or we will put it on our health panels. as we're here i think about the

memo that i was going to send. it's not what i say, it's what i do after i leave, to talks to talks about more proactive things that people can do in the united states and in particular may be involving some more less traditional media outlets to get some of this conversation going. >> just had, one of the things that would help in areas where there is a lot of circulation like puerto rico is installing screens. all the schools are clinics that need these screens, we start to do that math and figure out what that's going to take its humongous effort. community volunteer and engagement may help. there are some private-sectorhu companies sort of helping think through their product availability. there is involvement of governments but i do think there is some community efforts if yoe want to clean up apart one day maybe can also help with screen

or nets availability at some of the public setting. >> i want to get a few more questions, although in the back. the back corner over there.ll tell us your name as well. >> [inaudible question] >> go ahead and stand up. we're not quite hearing you. >> i'm a student of anthropology. my question have to do with the weekend and give the cultural factors are in central america. with continuing the idea people's behavior and prevention, i wonder if there is social science research in your agencies that deals with different cultural, structural conditions that would frame the way that people would react to make decisions of the preventioe of the disease?

>> i can say there is been some involvement of that in some of our fieldwork, and particularly focusing on planning for the communication or outreach efforts. we have done focus groups are informant interviews and a lot going on with pregnant women in puerto rico to understand what it their concerns, what are their practices, what are theyey interested in. but there's probably a lot more that could be done. i'm not not sure about nih's work. >> so we are not doing thisor ourselves and funding that butdu our interactions with their colleagues in purcell, like you said about social determinants very important. but what we're finding is that t the ability of people in a particular region to have any even control over what their risk is very difficult. like it many diseases property is a bad thing. if you live in an areany

where you have a still water that you can't get rid of, if you haven't fire mental -- environmental neglect it makes a very difficult. people at least in the beginning of the epidemic suffered the most for people who lived in the poor northeastern section of brazil. that was really the epicenter early on and we are seeing a more diffuse now. it did not have anything to do a social and behavioral issues it had to do with the unfortunate poverty circumstances they were in. >> will take one down here. >> the mic is coming. >> i have a quick question. most of the news stories have been directed towards microcephaly and the effects on pregnant women. i am wondering if it affects and

another demographic, neurological diseases that might affect other parts of the population? >> you're talking about gilliam bray, and with no doubt were not seeing and we don't know the exact about gilliam bray but that's not necessarily the attacker number. we need we need to do more these cohort studies that we follow perspective. the relationship between dion jillian beret and zika is a very significant. we have to be careful because we see this in many viral diseases like a case of myelitis and a 17-year-old woman, case of encephalitis in an 81-year-old man, a case with encephalomyelitis, one can't say

for sure that there is a significant part, but there doet not seem to be anything significant above and beyond trans -- it's an underappreciated fact that we do look microcephaly as one particular morphological problem that's the thing that's associated with infection. it it goes way beyond that because if you look at these babies, microcephaly may be one reflection of both developmental abnormality due to the virus or from neurologically developing tissue. these babies as you follow them have a variety of other issues. fred no i problems, deafness problems, a variety of other things. i.ti i think when we do finally get the full scope, we we're going to see that microcephaly may bet

just the most obvious gross manifestation of the effects, there's a lot of other things that will be seen that would be detrimental to be developing fetus.y >> in terms of the guillaiin-barre neurological complications in a nonpregnant setting, we have made recommendations for avoiding travel if you're pregnant because the risk is high enough in terms of this concern about the birth defects. we do not know factors that make it more like glee that someone'c going to get guillaiin-barree li following the zika virus. following what we we know now we don't have to say that the risk is so high that nobody should go to these places. >> ..

i do think that further study of the full spectrum of zika infection from the mildest no symptoms to what are these rare but potentially serious complications will help us understand whether there are some predictors that would help give some warnings to people. >> i wonder if the goods showing us some weaknesses. is it the potential that another virus that is also mosquito borne could be creating trip three and potential that another virus kitcould created a much higher rate than 24, 400,000, is it showing us that there is the potential in terms of the way the diseases spread, something that could be even far worse than zika has access, may not necessarily be happening now: but the possibility of other infectious diseases that will keep coming at the t end of 2015 hours giving talks, as wastalks, as was an end tom at the end of the ebola epidemic that you can be absolutely certain.

so we are going to see continual emerging and reemerging effects, that is just the nature of the interaction. sometimes you get something that is explosively transforming like hiv-aids and then there are over 70 million people, .-ellipsis that are curiosities, things that come and then get public health measures suppress them. very intensive public health measures, and then you get something that isthat ist devastating to a region and something that is causing concern in the americas but beyond the americas because ii can tell you, the europeans and people in africa are quite worried. >>guess you are right.

>> between the way that we live in the way microbes evolve, and this is more concerning. but we know there are more.ry dp there are some circumstances that let us know this is happening.ra a dense population, a good system of surveillance. and then clinicians recognizing, i have never even seen it, and now i have several in my clinic and raise the alarm, but we need every country to have a strong frontline public health system where they can detect problems, react quickly copper -- prevent catastrophe. if we had a strong public health systemea we would not have had 28,000 people suffer from a disease, even in the us, we were not as ready as we needed to be.

between human behavior and the mosquito concern and then these pathogens that just really adapt and evolve and spread, we know we have to be ready for multiple outbreaks. >> i'm going to go to this guy right here. i tell us your name. >> gavin from medical college. recently come back from a number of countries in south america doing risk assessment for zika.an now doing the same thingng here in the us. what is really evident is that they have had -- zika has become a gender nightmare. we are actually deciding when and how they can have sex while they are not empowered to do that. we have seen a lot of worry phyn

where they are turning out to the physician and the hospitals going on pregnant, do i have zika. talking to physicians and nurses about the counseling n and mental health needs, and that but the analogy to other programs from malaria, national campaigns, is it time for a us national zika campaign so that we mobilize the community and address the needs and take that burden off of just the most? but we have to remember, the list is different. so right now we're launching

a communication campaign to make it whole community issue, billboards partly funded through the foundation. but i think the issue of this is not any one individual problem. it is all of our problem. is the other thing to say is that in puerto rico.more cla >> we have to be concerned. >> picking about this issue, it is not much of a threat in minnesota. clarity on the transmissibility because the

way that those two, it's very different. all of the eastern seaboard >>eds to be worried. >> it is. it can be transmitted, but it is clearly the dominant factor.es get dis focuses on one species. others get distracted.hese we diluted out, but there is one objective. >> all right.

recognizing i am speaking to public health professionalssan and business representativesth k curious if you can reflect on the media landscape?ion to and how does increased attention to publicicats he confidence help or hurt domestic and international response for raising the political profile. >> we have the concert at google at least of people have to come seek us. i think probably what we are

talking about here is not causing panic in areas where there need not be panic. i was pregnant twice. and so to make sure that we are people with knowledge. that is one of the things where google is helpful of because people who do have concerns were brought to a series of levels.. so those people who are concerned and maybe at risk are going to be getting t information.ive, s at the sameat the same time working with these individuals so that only start to see that means that we have to be more aggressive. we can see those trends. >> the media has been pretty

good about not being overly hysterical about this. i have been pleased with it. there are always exceptions, but for the most part thereof not been stories are headlines that have been egregiously misleading about threats that are in there. isolated during the outbreak. a paper that came out that said ebola is a virus that is mutating.hat, i t now all of a sudden it will be respiratory born. i did not like that.about i wouldn't blame that on the media.

>> that is the challenge. and >> i do agree. this virus is scared enough on its own. another problem that we just get fatigued. working fatigued. working on something for years but the public moved on years ago. we cannot fix this overnight it is going to take time and work.a, the the media are social media, the potential can't fade, and we need and not hype this but find a way to haved fou persistent attention and focus.get we are activated and looking intensely.

how we get public support without alarming people, that's a question. >> a few more questions. >> ob/gyn at the george washington university. it is going to be a long summer with us.ter] [laughter] >> zero, boy. >> thank you so much. i i know you are alwaysec counseling figures people want to take care of themselves and want healthy babies. i think we hope to have better and better information. right now we have no local transmissions.

puerto rico, us virgin islands. the focus is on travel riskel as and having the health department come out and assess the travel associated circumstances.>> what that could like this summer. >> women, the 1st message you get to your patience is that if there is no local outbreak there is little chance the mosquito bite is going to give them see. if we do have local outbreak will reasonably good chance, then it will not be unreasonable for someone to come and your clinic and

cerro city a lot backyard and got bit by a mosquito. that's can be a problem.hey're g they will be demanding to have a test for zika. there are two types of testsect , ally infected now and then there's one that if you got infected three weeks ago the question is was ition infected, and that is the test we are working on to get a great deal of specificity to make sure you don't confuse it with something else. if you happen to live in the southern part of the region. that will be a challenge.at working on getting diagnostic that is highly specific.

amanda weeks pregnant now. >> when you look at the idea , we were talking earlier.nt. >> one of the things comeau we have a couple of tests. the quite important. they see this as a commitment. >> and i don't mean to play out, but you know now that i

needed be concerned a lot of this withwould -- some of that were not ramp up. >> we are faced this with other perceptions of risk, the anthrax letters coffee for asking me whether i picked, so the issue of relative risk, risk may be a new risk, that may be far

less than the risks that they accept every day of their lives, but there are risks that they are used to. new risks, even though it's much less risky than gettingha on the beltway, there is the extra twist with this. when the risk is to your developing baby, that trumps everything. that is really the thing that will transform people's perceptions of risk because the brings it into a whole new category. >> one more question. >> well, what a superbfi panel. exceptional people who know how to tell it straight and not scare us to death, although as a grandmother now i am scared for the yet unborn new grandchildren my children will have.

my question is about congress. i started there. do we need these bills that are -- have been passed by both houses, do we need congress to step in? what do we need from congress, and out of we make that happen in this toxic partisan down?ugh this >> my initial reaction would be even though this time is extremely partisan, one would hope that an issue like this would not be partisan. you know, we are talking about the difference in thatat which really is that emotional and societal difference of takingon responsibility for something in making decisions commit something i don't know that we experienced with regard

to the level of concern generations after. and so it is saddening that this is one area. what i have heard you say is this is a significant matter of resources. >> the president asked for 1.9 because we need 1.9.on. we need it. with the cdc is doing, what we are doing is using money we would otherwise be using for other things. you can only do that for t certain period of time.ot go you have to start paying it back and then you will stop doing things arethat are also important. we need congress to act quickly. taking moneyro from ebola is not the solution. we are still seeing outbreaks, the cdc is doing

how many a week? we can stop doing that. short answer, we need the money the president asked for. >> it seems like it would be a safe political vote. >> i think that is fairly good. >> thank you all for coming. thank you all. [applause][i [inaudible conversations]

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[inaudible conversations] [inaudible conversations] [inaudible conversations] >> madam secretary comeau we give 72 of our delegate votes to the next president of the united states. [applause] [inaudible conversations]

>> the libertarian party is holding its national convention this weekend. live coverage saturday at 8:00 p.m. when the candidates will face one another in a debate. then on sunday we will watch as the party chooses its presidential and vice presidential nominees. as of right now they are the only third-party that will appear on the ballot in all 50 states this november. the libertarian party convention live on c-span, c-span.org, and c-span radio. >> the house is taking up a bill to restructure puerto rico debt crisis. the chair of the house natural resources committee. thankthank you very much for being with us. >> it is my pleasure.

>> the next up will be the mark of tomorrow on capitol hill. what can we expect? >> well, i hope everyone will be happy and we will leave with a strong product. i expect the bill that be passed out of committee and start its way on the floor. there will be a few amendments offered, but i'm comfortable with that. >> out of puerto rico end up with a $70 billion debt? >> actually, it is more than that. 70 million is bonded debt. they are also 44,000,004,000,000 behind in arrears to the pension funds. and it comes over several decades of poor decision-making processes compounded by some bad economic situations the developed, the depression,

the downturn, the recession, and bad decisions on where they simply tried to spend their way and prosperity. jobs with government, that simply does not work as a pathway to financial prosperity. >> how do you make sure the house is not in the same position trying to help puerto rico, how does the island begin to change his financial course? >> that is exactly the crux of the question. if you simply do a bailout and suggest that you solve the problems of the past so what we will do is once again going back to lessons of history, how the district was able to say it got its financial house in order and get security and various other cities have done it

separately. there is historical precedent, but we will create an oversight committee that will go down there to demand financial audits be done call work with the government to come up with a plan of how all the bonds will be paid as well as how you get security for those. that board will then have the power to enforce the plan, and also the power to go and try to find other efficiencies within the system. what puerto rico itself cannot be solved simply by making cuts in the budget. there has to be growth opportunities which is one of the other things that the bill does, given the opportunity to expand the financial base, especially in the area of energy cross which is one of the reason why jobs i've been driven on the island, energy is so expensive. we will have a vehicle, some efforts to try and increase

their ability to make their energy down so that they can remain more competitive in creating jobs, manufacturing especially. >> fiscal control board, two questions. who will appoint members. will they be able to supersede puerto rico officials? >> the appointed members, it will be a seven-member board they will all be appointed by the president from a list that will be given him. two members will be given a list from the speaker, two from the majority leader in the senate comeau one from each minority leader plan the president will appoint someone of his own. >> joining us on capitol hill, andhill, and this is being viewed as a win-win for democrats and republicans. how are you in the speaker able to bring along a house

on house democratic leader and the white house to reach this agreement? i know there were sticking point's along the way. >> there always will be. everyone tries to be a wordsmith personified. the issue is puerto rico is in such a significantly dangerous situation that every thing kind of roles out of perspective, total collapse, that would be a humanitarian crisis. i think both sides to the white house, treasury department, members of congress realize there is a responsibility here of congressional control and responsibility of the territories to do something, and this is an issue that crosses party lines. both republicans and democrats realize we must do something to secure finances and given growth opportunities in the future which is really what drove the ability of coming up with a consensus here.

such a significant issue. >> as you know, the next deadline is july 1st one at $2 billion payment is due. will congress have acted? >> my hope is that they will have or if not that it is so obvious that this will be the effect. the community, the investment community will realize there is still a future here and will not react negatively to level obviously be another default on their payment.payment. if we can have the saudi committee, through the house , through the senate, or close to it, people will realize there is apostate future, way forward. if not that i am considering in the future. >> bottom line then you are satisfied with this agreement?

>> i think this is the only agreement that can pass, the best agreement going forward it has the basic principles that are based upon historical precedent, and i think it will be positive. he did ask me earlier, and i forgot to respond on if this allows the board to supersede the government of puerto rico. the answer is yes and no. the plan of action will be worked out in conjunction so that will be there. the power of the board is to make sure the plan is adhered and goes forward and will be implemented. >> utah's 1st congressional district, chair of the house resources committee involved in these negotiations, on capitol hill. thank you for being with us. >> thank you for talking to me. ..

senator discussed the importance of finding a balance between privacy and security in the digital age. add an event for strategic and international studies. he also briefly touched on the campaign saying he hopes nobody chooses him as a vp candidate. this comes as he was rumored to be on a short list of democrats for vice president. this panel is about one and a half hours. >> we should go ahead and get started. it's lie. live -- live. >> art would take almost an

entire period to go through his whole bias i will hit some highlights. he has been a missionary, and civil rights lawyer, a teacher and elected official including a governor governor of virginia for those of us who live there. he serves on the armed services budget for relations and aging committee. he is a ranking member of the readiness subcommittee for armed services and foreign relations subcommittee on state department management which must be a trial in itself. [laughter] he has worked in armed services focuses on marked defense strategy, reduction of unemployment among veterans and has done a lot to keep the navy which some think is important. he is focused on the middle east and latin america and he is a leading voice in expanding the role of congress on

foreign-policy and the way congress consults. we seem to have a pension for how early legislation he writes. he co-authored the rot nuclear agreement, i'm not going to do it all because it's just too much. he has done so many things. one more thing, founder and cochair from career technical location caucus which is really important, it's an exceptionally distinguished career. were grateful that he took time out of his busy schedule. [applause]. >> is good to be back, i want to to thank jim for his kind words

and it's an amazing day. i knew i was going to be here, is, is going to be a great panel to follow that will really dig into these issues. you have a a speech later in the day, they're talking to about press freedom in the americas which is an issue of deepest important and i am passionate about. give a speech later today about higher education in russia and sends higher education is the bellwether for predictions about the future of the economy, that is an incredible topic. if i didn't have the pesky votes and committee hearings i would just sit here all day long. i'm anxious to come and get this started and talk about cyber, the title of the discussion that the panel will address his cyber security after information sharing. i will not talk that much about congressional information sharing bill i will talk about other issues, issues that, issues that remain for us to grapple with. we cannot just assume that the information sharing bill it will be implemented, there's a lot of implementation issues and you will hear some of those from the

panel as well. it it is good to be back. the last time i was here at sea sis i was here to talk about the role of the president and congress and especially around more power issues. i'm happy to be talking about cyber security. i'm a good virginian and when i was here talking about war powers i talked about medicine. medicine. let me talk about jefferson. two great quotes of jefferson that i love, one that was in his notes on the state of virginia, this wonderful book he wrote that was really the first work of true american literature that has stood the test of time and this is a quote which was incorporated into the virginia constitution. congress and government and all else depends on the broadest possible diffusion of knowledge among the general population. now jefferson could not imagine a digital where all knowledge was digitized.

where the internet and search engines and servers could be at your fingertips to have that broadest possible diffusion of knowledge among the general population. he could not have imagined it but he was still talking about the world that we live in. the notion that diffusion of knowledge to all, would be great for the individual but would also be great for society and would be a guardian against tyranny in an era where if information was available to all rather than just to some. he also said the light and liberty go together. openness and freedom go together. because secrecy and tierney go together. those are two interesting thoughts as we contemplate this a cyber challenge. challenge. the express of a bias toward that does fusion, that digital world that is both good for individuals and society, there is also a bias toward transparency rather than secrecy. as we as we grapple with some of the cyber questions

privacy versus national security, jefferson jefferson had a strong bias towards transparency rather than secrecy. but secrecy is different than personal privacy. jefferson was also a strong believer in individual rights and that the individual should have some fear that would be secure against any intrusion of government. that is also a jeffersonian principal. so, as we tackle these hard questions, some of those are just original wisdom of the greatest of virginia and i think most of us would feel that about jefferson, and in terms of conceptualizing the future that we live in and beyond, it is very farsighted. i would offer three observations about cyber after the

information sharing bill, about congress and cyber policy but first let me do a quick it commercial for virginia since i started with the jefferson to tell you why this is important to me and many of you are virginians in the world. were at the epicenter of a changing digital landscape. so many of the key federal agencies that work on cyber policy have significant presence in virginia as to their employees, we have a private sector in the private space that is second to none, it is a great hub for it and cyber innovation. virginia second in the nation and the preventative workforce and technology jobs. it's an interesting step because our biggest industry sector in virginia is still egg and four street. to have megan foresee the biggest by the gdp but second in the nation with those that work and technology jobs shows you something about the evolution of an old economy to a new one. frankly now that technology jobs too. but the workforce that we have is a workforce that is very connected with these cyber questions. we have strong colleges and universities, institutions and training that

workforce, and this is huge for virginia. were at the the hub of internet traffic in the world. 70% of the internet traffic passes through loudoun county which has the highest concentration of data centers in the world. that started really and attained great critical mass with aol and even though we are now many chapters beyond aol and the digital space, that really helped defense contractors and other federal agencies. it really helped to ground that industry heavily in virginia. lastly and sadly, we have a lot of cyber attack victims. the opm breach that took all of that data from these employees both government employees like me but

also contractors that were doing work with the government has affected virginia very dramatically. i know probably everybody in congress and the senate has had to deal with the aftermath and questions and people are mad about it. in virginia we have a lot more people who are mad about it than other states. the three issues that i want to spend my time on today and they are the issues that i am grappling within my own committee assignments are basically these, cyber doctrine, the debate over the security and privacy balance and third, cyber security investment. let me, cyber security investment. let me just tackle three. cyber doctrine. i remember in foreign relations and having an opportunity in those committees, i'm not in those but they have an opportunity to do a lot of cyber related hearings. let me just give you some snapshots of hearings that i have attended in my time in the senate. in armed services hearing a couple of years ago they had a cyber command which was testifying in talking about cyber and used the phrase, and in some instances a cyber attack could lead to war. so it came time for me to ask questions i sent a cyber attack is by definition not work? it's something short of warlike and electronic vandalism or graffiti but it's not war itself? i could hypothesize it's where a

cyber attack would do as much damage our nation brothers as a war would do. and the witnesses were to said well it wasn't exactly sure that is what it meant but at least in the description of the key decision-maker cyber attack was somehow short of war. recently, we had an hearing with armed services again and we had a margin and this is the way that hearing was set up. the testimony was heavily about all of the cyber attacks that we had been subject to. the targets, the targets, the opm's and the sony's, the big ones were discussed at length. there's also statistics even about the number cyber attacks subject to every day. i'm still relatively junior and the committee so i am late am late in asking questions. everybody asked questions before i do. the testimony with all the text render so i decided i would play

a trick on my witness and when the question got me a set okay you told us all about the cyber attacks that we are subject to, the numbers and particulars, give me a great example of an instance where the u.s. has effectively responded to a cyber attack. and he said and i knew he would say that what will have to do that in classified session. and i said really? so you have been very willing to talk about all the particular of attacks were subject to, many of which are in the news and many of the numbers of attack someone we have other hearings about the committee and the war against iso will talk to the number about how many bombing runs we conducted, how many troops are deployed, how many dollars we have spent? so we will talk about what we are doing in other areas still talk about the attacks we are subject to but you will not share one example

publicly of how the u.s. has responded to something in cyber? no we will have to do that in the classified setting. can you imagine that the american public at their only hearing publicly of the attacks were subject to rather than what were doing that they would feel pretty anxious about this, they might feel like their government really isn't doing anything, that they're not really responding, course we are but if you're not sharing it, what confidence are you given your citizens that your are on top of it area we have had other disk sessions including in this one where senator king has been issued if you're not willing to talk publicly about what you're going to do do you have a deterrence doctrine? is there such a thing as a deterrence doctrine that you keep secret? if you keep it secret is it deterrence? we had a deterrence doctrine and have one with respect to nuclear and other military doctrines, but if it is all on the down low with respect to cyber then how are we deterring attacks? we have had extensive areas where we challenge the administration over deterrence, then when we have the commander

of you calm in and we talk about nato here's another question we have asked, when is a cyber attack, when would it trigger the article five collective vents in nato? so if a black vladimir putin goes into an area that's restricted but what if there is a well-documented and clear effort to destabilize the power source in the communication network. there are many has been efforts to do that, when does that rise to the level of an attack that would trigger a u.s. defense obligation. when we asked that question we are basically told well we are starting to have those discussions but we do not really have an answer to them. so i think the real issue and sometimes it's funny, because my

cemetery talked about doctrine. the real question and in that instance the dr. and i was talking about is the war powers doctrine, we are doing things, we are taking steps, were reacting but the doctrine that tries to rationalize what were doing is sorely lacking. i i would say the same in cyberspace. what is the proportional response for a cyber attack? how do we may claim that we are under attack it either in the cyber domain or another to me? what is the right role for the government to undertake steps, including proportional responses when the cyber attack is not on the government but on a private-sector actor like sony? i think these are big questions. i think our. i think our technologies have raced ahead of our effort to try to provide efforts to these questions and make them public so that our citizens know we have a doctrine and can have some comfort there. hopefully feel deterred. i do think in this first area that chairman mccain and the other's staff members are really trying to focus on this. as i have had discussions with

folks at dod and the intel agencies i think they're running to catch up on the questions, there there are discussions going on in nato about these collective defense obligations but more work in the area is absolutely critical. technical technical solutions and tactical decisions should ultimately advance and overall doctrine rather than one by one or one-off case-by-case reactions. so, i think the first issue i want to put on the table and hope the panel will lead a discussion is the need for nor more doctrine and the status for those. the second thing i would talk about is the balance between privacy and security that is raised by the appliqués but there are many other cases that raise it as well. i to offer you an observation about this. i guess my punchline is the congress is ultimately responsible for legislative activity in this area, we are uniquely unqualified to make

these decisions. uniquely on qualify, no need to do is explain why. there's two principal approaches right now been discussed on the privacy and security balance in congress. senators feinstein number have per proposal that require a company to provide law enforcement with information or technical assistance on a specific court order, it would be a defined proposal to try to avoid using the all writs act which is more generic and not necessarily tailored to this information. that is a proposal that is within intel, on the senate side right now that is being banded about. another proposal that is different is a proposal from senator warner and chairman mccall to propose a 16 member digital security commission to assess the broad issue of digital security, not just the encryption that would be part of it but the broad issue of digital security. and. and then make recommendations to congress, hopefully in a

relatively urgent time horizon. this is modeled after the 911 commission and would include technology experts and privacy experts, and folks from the business sector who understand that we make changes how we might affect both u.s. companies in technology and would chase people to other technologies. obviously national security leaders. leaders. the idea would be that the commission that could grapple with this and make recommendation. i know there is a reaction to come home and another commission, just what we need. i actually think it would be a good idea to do that commission that could then board material to congress. i'm going to tell you i like that. i prefer to do that rather than jump right into feinstein and bird. went to give your reason that you may have not thought of it but as soon as i explain it you will get it. the question of privacy versus security is about a careful balancing of really important

interests. as i said, while members of congress should have the ultimate responsibility for voting on legislation to try to strike that balance we are uniquely qualified to do it for this reason, there is no area where a member of congress is more different than the american public. then in a recent expectation of privacy. members of congress are different than the american public in a number of ways. i would argue that there is no area that we are fundamentally more different and that we have long ago surrendered any expectation of privacy, we have forgotten what it is to have an expectation of privacy. you know, i started in politics in 1994 and it was pre-youtube and was pre-youtube and essentially pre-internet and its current, so at that point at as

a city councilmember still had some expectation of privacy but i have none now nor do anybody else my line of work. so, if you give us the task of striking the balance between privacy and security, first we will over even out youth over a valued security and of course we should. that should be the top priority of everybody in congress is to protect national security. so we will be extremely diligent about that. and we should. but we will undervalue privacy because we have forgotten what it's like to have any privacy. so, if trying trying to strike that balance is something for congress we're going to strike it in a way that i don't think will fairly take into account the legitimate privacy interest of american citizens. now, that question that question what is a legitimate privacy of the citizen question untran? that's that's a complex question, it's not easy. there has to be some to strike the right balance of what is a reasonable expectation of privacy. most citizens knowingly

or unknowingly surrender that privacy every day in the commercial sphere, there's an issue of how relevant is that repeated surrender to the question of how much privacy needs to be governed each individual would be entitled to. there are many challenges as you get to try to decide this issue of the scope of a legitimate privacy, but congress is not the right body to do that. we would really be benefited by a commission of people that included those who could remember what it's like to have a private spear. and he would then would also respect the national security of trying to set that balance. so rather than trying to rush into a solution where we have not really looked at the scope of that individual privacy interest, i would say that we should get that done and hopefully get it done because i think those recommendations back to us would really help us grapple with it. that is my second thought. my third thought is in the cyber security investment area.

we have to invest more in cyber capacity and i think this is an area of government that has been most affected by budgetary uncertainty. if you you look at sequester shutdown, furloughs, continued resolutions instead of budgets, it has had an effect on everything that we do but i would argue that it may have had as much or more of effect on cyber than anything else. first, it is coincided with the time where the need and acknowledgment for increased cyber investments has been ramping up. just as that is been happening we ran into march 1, 2013 going into full on sequester to figure it out. the cyber workforce is incredibly into mandrake now.

so some of the budgetary austerity or or uncertainty that people are looking at career paths that are going to look at one with a government that seems uncertain and they're going to look at other opportunities, i would worry that her budgetary uncertainty is basically chasing talent in another direction. on the budget committee i came into office with two goals in mind on that committee. the first, a very state centric governor -type goal, i really like to your budgeting. every state does to budgeting. every state does to your budgets. at the federal level we do one year budgets when we do budgets. but states due to your budgets because it is good for predictability. predictability is wonderful is wonderful for our own people, it's wonderful for the private sector so that everybody can understand the parameters of what were dealing with and adjust accordingly. we have now done to, to your budgets and a roll, it was ugly

getting there. the restaurant only happened after shutdown of government and the second only happened after the speaker decided i'll re-sign into a two-year budget deal. i do not think we can count on a catechism every two years to get us to a budget deal, at a budget deal, at least we're moving towards some level of predictability. but i will tell you, when i go go out and talk about budgetary issues to virginians and i try to make the case of why sequester an bca strategy voted on in august of 2011 and caps that were in place, when i try to tell him why it is back, i always use cyber as my example. i. i say the dca caps basically sequester hold harmless the war fighting expenses those are held, but everything else is nondiscretionary and defense other than fighting is all affected by sequester so it's kinda like artificially were going to everything down. then i say, and people say well that's great we should save money, and i say well how many of you think we're doing too much of cyber right now? nobody raise their

hand, how many think we should do more in cyber? everyone raises their hands. so why should cyber get affected like everything else? the notion of across-the-board anything is foolish from a management standpoint especially areas where there's wide recognition that were doing too little, not to let much. the first thing that we need to do on the investment side is hopefully get this to bca in sequester behind us. for the third year in a row on the senate side i have gotten included anti- sequester language calling for and entered dramatic litigation on the defense and nondefense accounts. a lot of work we do on cyber obviously is done in dhs, that is the nondefense account. to the extent that they hit the dhs cyber gets affected. so will be taken up on the floor later this week and after memorial day of the senate really going to try to do again what we were doing last few years which is not eliminate at least lift or mitigate the effect of cyber cuts.

if we do that, then we have to make the right investments in the right investments are at least two fold and i'll be glad to open up and take some questions. the first one is workforce, when jim introduced me he talked a little bit little bit about work that i do, virginia is a center for technology workforce, not the only center, there's other states that have a huge expertise in it too. even as a even as a center of a technology workforce, second in the nation, there's huge gaps, state economic partnership says there's only one candidate for every three cyber security positions that are open in virginia. this is in is in a state with the technology workforce. so we have a dramatic need to get more people into this field. this is one of the reason among others that when i came into the senate i did not get put on the health committee, health education labor was a committee i wanted to be on but i realize you don't have to be on the committee you just have to pick an issue that nobody in the community is champing. then i picked manufacturing.

i ran a bulk occasional school 35 years ago, the u.s. systematically downgraded the importance of career technical information over the course of a few generations. now there's a renaissance and it's coming back. cyber is one of those areas where trained technical talent does not necessarily have to have a college degree. there's other ways to get this gills validated to be a player in this area. so this is one of the things that we are working on that we put in important career technical advances in the no child left behind, were were working on the perkins act reauthorization. reauthorization will also work on cte advances that will include cyber. in virginia the administration and i have to mention it because my wife is his secretary of education. they're also doing major work in

this workforce area to expand the cyber workforce. the redesign of high school curriculum to include more cte and cyber courses. the effort to designate community colleges around the state is national centers of academic excellence and the just became the third virginia community college to receive that designation. we have to have both the federal and private sector workforce necessary to meet the challenge. some of that is it going to be tied up with our work on perkins and higher ed. in addition to the workforce we have to shore up our investment and technology platforms. i visited fire ice, one of the cosponsors of today and they are a wonderful, powerful leader in this field in virginia. i visited their office and we

had an extensive discussion about to the problematic alliance of many federal agencies in nonsecure systems that are legacy systems but their own secure because has not been the dollars available to purchase the upgrades. either to make upgrades that can be made or to find new systems that can be more secure. largely this is is been because of budgetary uncertainty sequestered budgetary caps. so if we can pump find a path out of dca of sequester, and i'm not talking about just, i'm a budget hawk, i do believe in the management of debt and deficit but i just don't believe it's through across-the-board gaps. i think that's foolish. i think you have to manage that the targeted strategies that look at both sides and look at expenditures. but across-the-board reductions that hit accounts that are so important in the cyber world are very foolish given the needs that we have. so i'll just just conclude and maybe take a couple of questions. the information sharing bill that we did was in law we call it necessary but not sufficient.

it was very important that we did that. it was good to have some discussion with folks working on the issue of implementation, companies are starting to get used to the notion of sharing, they're getting used to the notion that if they do share them they get helpful tips back about things they should prepare for a watchword. there's more to do and we need to talk about ramping up. i do think these areas of further development of doctrine, grappling in the correct way with the privacy security balance and then getting over some of these at budgetary malpractices so that we can make the investments we need to people and systems are the next beyond information sharing that government should tackle. with that i'm i'm glad to take a few questions before i head up, we have a committee hearing in born relationship to prep for the