years because the people are impatient right now. >> i want jennifer to come in on this. >> i totally get the deficit issue but what he proposed according to objective evealators like the tax foundation would increase deficit by 5.3 trillion because of the tax cuts to the rich he is proposing. do your point about doing something about oxycotin or investment in schools, the paul absent about education is -- policy -- cut 75% of funds from public schools. 30% from the department of education. put it all into vouchers which help the private institutions but the public institutions are left wanting. you put at risk the 22 million students as a result. so my point in saying this is i totally understand what you are saying and understand from a

republican point of view why you would say that and those are the intellectual arguments you are making. but the problem is the policies he is proposing don't address the issues you are raising. [applause] >> not only do they not address the policies you are raising but actually they take us in the opposite direction. jennifer mentioned the independent tax foundation which did an analysis and they found that donald trump's tax plan would boost the after tax incomes of the top 1% you would get an additional 1400 on your taxes because they would be reduced.

this is going to happen every time -- this is why that could work and good for the american. >> in the late '70s, we had a change in effort and it it collapsed. this is a simple model of saying are you better off than you were four years ago? he won the largest electorate college victory. it was a very bold approach that said if you cut regulations and taxes you stimulate the american economy and get dramatic growth.

the truth is we came out of a deep recession fast and had a tremendance amount of economic growth: i have been through phase one. in 1994, i campaigned to produce four consecutive budgets. i believe you can save $140 billion a year in federal budget. literally. i believe if you open up america for national resource development you probably generate seven trillion over 10-12 year. i believe if you went through all the properties owned by hud and got rid of the empty houses sitting and blighting cities you go through the cycles. having done it once, it took four years and we thought it would take seven.

i think within 5-7 years a very aggressive entrepreneur who walks in every morning and says what do we have to get done? not what is our theory? what my next speech? what are the seven answers for the press conference but what do we need to get done. one pieces would be business transfer tax, eliminate the corporate income tax, rebate the tax on leaving the country and charge it for imports coming in. that differential alone would create a tremendous number of jobs eventually. [applause] >> if you can answer in the context, we are hearing an appetite for blowing it up. the status quo hasn't worked. median incomes of americans have been frozen since the late '90s. it is time for radical change. but the question is radical

change of what sort? everybody wants change. i want change. i agree with newt gingrich entirely that we should not pay crooks. bipartisan agreement. but the real issue is exactly what you do. and we can debate supplies economics until we are both board to tea-- bored to tears. i know when the budget was balanced and what happened with the george w. bush administration in terms of creating a $5 trillion debt and barack obama worked out of it. then we had deregulation under george w. bush that created and contributed to one of the worst meltdowns in wall street and the economy we have had. the central issue is donald trump and his experience, his

credibility, you say he is a great business man, well i know he alleged in 1976 that he had a networth of $200 million. that is he said. he now he has a net worth of $8 billion. in 1976 if he had taken the 200 million and put it into an index film and reinvested the dividend and did something he would have $12 million now. not what i call a great business man. >> i think of it this way. sometimes when you think of bill clinton and hillary clinton when president clinton left office and hillary clinton decided she would run for senate. they famously said they left the white house broke which of

course wasn't true. but essentially broke. in a relatively short period of time, hillary and bill clinton made close to $150 million. that is great. i am for all people making as much as they can. that is awesome. what did they do for $150 million, though? to whom did they speak? what type of action did they get to the leverage of power in washington, d.c.? what type of regime paid them to speak? and how is it that bill clinton's speaking fees, i believe, tripled when hillary clinton decided to run for the presidency? i wonder why that is that he -- suddenly all these countries wanted to hear from bill clinton and pay him three times the going rate. that might seem like a small point but i would say it this way: donald trump didn't bat a thousand in business in.

i don't know many who have. so he has had some things that are not been all that successful. however he has employed and created economic opportunity for at least 14,000 workers across the globe. those are real human beings with real families and children and kids to send to college and dreams and hopes and that is something. and to create a job and to make a payroll and i have maybe 50 employe employees and that is small. it is not easy. i am just a small business person. to employ thousands of people and to start a company and to keep it going with the government and all of the competing interest of the competitors, i love how people blow that off. there is nothing there. how many people have the clinton's ever employed in the

private sector? zero. [applause] >> it is true that donald trump has created a global business and i think it is trip terrific to talk about people employed around the globe with compassion. 500 businesses are under the trump umbrella and news week did a story talking about the kinds of businesses and in what country he invests. he has investments in shores in russia and in the united arab emrites, in india, all over the globe. the question is because he says i won't be running my company when i am president, i will give it over to the kids to run. any ethic expert tells you that

is not a blind trust. that doesn't remove the conflict of interest your immediate family is running this global operation. when he makes a foreign policy decision, if he did as president, that happened to benefit one of his companies, wouldn't everybody be wondering did he make that decision because he was going to line his children or his own pockets in the future? would our foreign policy as a country be for sale? that is another element of the dangerousness of donald trump. i want to parrot with this idea of him being a compassionate business owner. here is a guy who, you know, at his resort in florida, always has international workers coming. he said he can't hire people locally.

in trump modeling, he recruited a bunch of international models to come work in the united states and his organization coached them on how to lie to the immigration officials. this is a guy who is a steadfast put up a wall send them out guy and yet his personal life and existence has completely gone in the other direction. so to this resolution we are debating, can donald trump make america again, it is difficult to imagine a guy making america great again when everything in his personal life wreaked of hypocrisy based on what he is saying today. i completely understand -- [applause] >> yup. i am sorry but we are conscious of time. we will wind it up by having an explanation of why the personal isn't a reflection of professional. quick last statement and then

going to closing statements. >> i think a clinton supporter worrying about conflict of interest is so -- [applause] >> -- it is so infuriating breat breath taking. under hillary clinton, the u.s. state department lobbied the haitian government against raising the minimum wage from $3 a day to $5 a day on behalf of people who happen to have given to the clinton foundation. this is a level of disgusting mixing of government and person personnel health. for hillary clinton to raise the concept of conflict of interest shows a capacity for schizophrenia that is stunning. [applause]

>> i talk about the capacity for schizophrenia. the idea that somehow the clinton foundation is somehow a bad thing or that somehow it can be compared with donald trump's worldwide efforts. the clinton foundation has done very good things. it is a charitable foundation. it is extrodinarily -- extroidinarily commendable. did you know the landscape of america, in fact the world is littered with people with contractors and employers who have never been paid but owed by donald trump? have been stiffed by donald trump? when you say that somehow donald trump created jobs but the clinton's haven't. the clinton's have been involved

most of their life and i have seen it, experienced it and worked with them in the public sector. in the public sector, bill clinton as president presided over on economy because of his policies that created 22 million net new jobs in the united states. that is not insignificant. >> wait a second. this is breathtaking. you have saying that hillary clinton, the feminist icon, my first book was called "the hillary trap" as a feminist icon we are supposed to judge hillary clinton's plan for the economy, robert, from her husband's record on the economy? because i thought women stood for themselves. [applause] >> i thought women -- come on! >> wait a minute. >> [multiple conversations]

>> no, no, no. let me finish. i never interrupted in the debate. when you cut to the bone of a liberal they always call foul. remember, i am woman hear me roar. hillary clinton is the tough, pioneering trailblazing woman except when the going is tough it is like i am a dam sill in distress and it is like michelle obama can you go campaign for me? or my husband's economy is good so please, just belief me, he is going to be my economic advisor and save me from all of this. if you want to stand on your own two feet... see they don't listen.

if you want to stand on your own merit and your own two feet with your own policies than i am ready to hear about how hillary has been hiding in a secret treasure chest and the secret to the u.s. economy and the secret she's has been keeping from barack obama for years because he hasn't been able to do it. i hope hillary stands on her own two feet as a strang and accomplished woman and said my husband is his own person, i have my own way forward and listen to my ideas. that is better. >> please be brief. >> i will be very brief. >> thank you. >> i disagree. [laughter] >> let me just say, laura, you can't have it both ways. you are saying hillary clinton and bill clinton haven't created a single job. you are saying hillary clinton

wasn't responsible for the jobs created under the bill clinton administration. she was first lady and the fact is hillary clinton to the extent she is and has been a partner with bill clinton over the last 40 years i think deserves some credit. no? okay. >> robert, i don't know if you will win this. >> wait a minute, her health policy, i was there in the white house when she worked night and day to try to craft a health policy. there has been no first lady in my -- >> and it failed. >> we will move to closing statements. i want to be conscious of the time so we will do it in the reverse order meaning jennifer granholm you up with three minutes on the clock. >> i totally want to lighten it up. in honor of tonight, i have constructed an ode to this muck

debate and insanity in the u.s. election. bob and i spoke against the resolution america is already great, trump is not the solution. many canadians believe americans will not lect a president trump. in history is any guide, police don't displayer, we never had a president with that color hair. so sad that newt and laura have not yet come to grips with the retality of the trump. ponder trump's psychology, his whole rational for running is he. you ask why does his bluster seem so sure? is it because he is so insecure? his words so bold and he seems super strong for a seven year old. manipulated by flattery, voted

by tweets and his hands near the launch codes when he overheats. when he is done he is bromancing vladimer putin and kim. he says i will bring back the jobs let go but he makes stuff in china and mexico. one reason we cannot let up the attacks is trump's refusal to release his own taxes. this lack of transparency like never before as he is dashing his loot offshore? or because donald trump's race is unfair? or his global investors are at such a scale that trump foreign policy would be for sale? he is the candidate of america firstism spewing anti-immigrants, rants and racisms, building huge walls are part of his plan and must all be related to the size of his hand.

of course that wall will block bad guys from mexico. weird there are no bad guys here in ontario? and his issues with women and what it reveals punish the women who exercise choice, criticizing the sound of hillary's voice, bleeding out vile like a glow hard, i think it is time to play that woman card. so, no pressure, no pressure tonight. vote as your conscious dictates. the election just turns on the outcomes of the munk debates. [applause]

>> i would say it is very difficult to follow dr. suess tonight. i have a rap if you don't mind. [applause] >> no, i am totally kidding. that would be really tragic. a blonde american rapper. vanilla ice part two. i think it is really serious what we are talking about tonight. poetry is really funny but not withstanding america is in decline. i am a daughter of a working class couple. my mom was a waitress until she was 74 years old. her hands knotted up with arthritis from carrying the tray and died at 79 not much time out

of her retirement. she worked had hard for her children. my father ran a car wash. we picked tobacco, picked peaches and blue berries and delivered newspapers and did jobs because of dignity and work and had to. i learn from my mother that when something is true say it. when something is wrong fight against it. don't be afraid even if you are in a room of skeptics. mile and try to share your story. the story of america is complicated but in 240 years we didn't get to this place to see it go down the drain not because of one party failing but both parties failing.

we have real unemployment and und underemployment and people taking part-time jobs at 12.6 people and people really in despair have given up all together. i think donald trump is the only person to make america great again because the alternative would continue us on a path of the same decline, the same division on our streets, frankly between the races, between the poor and the rich, immigrants and non-immigrants because without pros prosperity and the dignity to work and make a better living america will not continue to exist as it does today. that might sound alarmist and that is never going to happen. but in a scenario with the rise of china, position of russia and america in decline, my friends, that is not a good scenario for

this beautiful country that we are sitting and standing in today. donald trump will make america great again. [applause] >> i think you seen the 2016 election has worn be down. [laughter] >> i was 6-2 before. i am also getting old. i remember harry truman as president, the esinhower election, and an america that feels different than what i am witnesses today.

part of what happened to your neighbor to the south and frustration and anxiety over declining wages and job security. 2/3rds of americans are living paycheck to paycheck and jobs are becoming less secure and for the first time in memory most americans believe their children will not do as well as they are doing. to that extent, i agree with our debating opponents that i think the vision we believe is better for america is sharply different. part of the anger and part of the fear and part of the anxiety in america today has found its way into a viciousness, a name calling and inability of people to talk to one another across

the great boundaries of party in class and race, and it is vitally important and i say this as somebody who is getting older and served as secretary of labor in the clinton administration and served even in a republican administration and that is something else i will stel tell you to keep under your hats. we have to learn to work together and work together better. donald trump, to my mind, his misogyny,xenophobia, narcissistic behavior, represents a character that is dangerous for the united states. he needs to be reputated big time.

i want to all of you, i want to ask the 14% of you who are still with trump, i want to ask you to come over to our side for the simple reason i want americans to know that here in canada you know right from wrong and you repur reputiate this person who should never have been dominated to be president of the united states. [applause] [applause] >> first of all, thank you. it has been a lot of fun. i think you can tell that all four of us like to live in a world of words and are fairly good at it. i want to pose one question and a way of measuring that question. i think donald trump is a risk. i think when you have somebody totally outside politics and an

entrepreneural business person by definition to bring them at the top is a risk. but i also think that the current pattern is an even bigger risk. this is what i ask you of the next few weeks to think about as you read newspapers or watch news. how many terrorists attacks does it take in europe and the united states where i think a humanitarian crisis in nigeria because of boka haram? ...

ask yourself, you go from george w. bush saying, there's an axe sis of evil. he names three countries, one of those iran. we're currently sending iran billions of dollars and day-by-day we're learning the deal is even worse. you think the iranians have changed? you think they're not? president obama body says the largest state supporters of terrorism on the planet, and we're sending them billions of dollars. that's going to work? so every time you work around the system is not working. in the next riot, the next violence, you think this has worked? my point is simple. i've been at this stuff since august of 1958. i helped create a majority for

the first time in 40 years, speaker of the house. worked with bill clinton to baseball the federal budget, so reform welfare am genuinelyfighted nonjust for the united states but for all of western civilization, and you just read the papers, put the dots together and, which i the bigger risk, more of the stuff that isn't working or taking a gamble on real change. [applause] >> ladies and gentlemen, we began the week with an uninspiring, less than terrific debate. we ended friday with the debate on u.s. politics that i wanted to watch on monday and you gave it to us tonight. please, let's thank our debaters. they were fantastic. [applause]

[applause] >> so, we have a luxury tonight. we don't have the responsibility of voting in november but get to cast a ballot now. all 3,000 of you in this hall have a ballot. you received a second ballot on your way in. >> remember the drinks i promised you. >> marge reel ritas for the -- margaritas for the 14. we'll look at what the results were at the start of the evening again. we began tonight's debate with an agreed/disagree vote.

those numbers i believe were 14% in favor of the motion. the rest, 86% opposed. you're submit on whether you can change your minds or not. let's see if that happened. all of you, there's ballot boxes on the way out. of the hall. and we'll tally those results around 9:00. those of you watching this broadcast right now on c-span, the results will be on our social media feed, also shortly after 9:00 p.m. so, again, lamp, thank you for being part of a terrific debate. to ballots, to the bars to their margaritas. let's do it! [applause] >> our c-span campaign 2016 bus

is traveling thought new york this week, asking voters which candidate do you support in this election and why. >> my name is cecil felton, the media coordinator for cardinal television at fisher college the candidate i support is hillary clinton. think she is the most qualified and the most suited for the election being that she was secretary of state, she also was a senator in new york city, and i just think that she is the most qualified and she is the best for this position. >> hi hi. i'm john francis. a new york state nor from central new york and i'm supporting donald trump. think we need a change in this country. after what has been happening the last few years. the international situation is deteriorating, the domestic situation with respect to violence and terrorism in the united states is getting worse. we need a change, and i think donald trump can make that

change so that we don't have eight more years of the policies that have brought to us this particular position. as we sit now. >> i'm september johnson. this eye lex season i'm supporting hillary clinton because i believe she will -- the best candidate to protect women's rights and reproductive rights and knows how to do that and i'm excited to vote for her this election. >> i'm phil stick. i represent the 110th assembly district in the new york state assembly, con zest offing of the continues of colony, scene neck tidy. the only democratic to endorse bernie san guesser for president. -- sanders for president and now i'm supporting hillary clinton for the same reason as senator sanders. feel strongly it will be a greater opportunity to influence her administration than her oppo