>> once again, thank you. >> thank you. [applause] >> locum to scottsdale on booktv. located just east of arizona's capital city of phoenix it was foundefound by u.s. army chaplan winfield scott in 1894. today it has a population of about 236,000 with tourism is the largest economic driver. with the help of our cox communication cable partners, for the next 90 minutes we will learn about the areas history and literary seeing as we interview local authors and visit independent bookstores. >> scott still has one of the largest civil war round tables so we have people interested in the civil war. we do have people who come from out of state just to come to our

bookstore. a lot of times we will get people from san francisco. love san francisco. scottsdale is the home of the spring training for the giants, and those people love to read. >> ever since women first one the right to vote in 1912, women have played a leading role in politics, when you compare to the national average. arizona has been consistently in the top three to five states that have chosen women to elected office. i think that has a lot to do with some of the early pioneers. >> we began our special feature on scottsdale with tranone. >> in collecting, first i'm going to shoot a book that is in my view, not collectible. this is the ernest hemingway old man and a see.

i thought a dozen copies, some in pristine condition and some of lush condition. this is a true first it's in poor condition. recently don't treat it as collectible. first thing, it's not price script. modern first additions any luck that is not price script is considered superior to one that is price script. being price script may often be enough to disqualify it in a collectible item. it had the previous owners name which is a negative. the other way to know a first edition of the old man in the seat has a ba in the steel and if the blue cast and that's typical and sometimes you will see the stamp winner of the noble prize and it's always on later additions. the fact is you look at the condition of the book also also, no-space\no space collectors should be buying this book except a reading copy to use it as a teaching example. we hate to have a clear but it does help us explain some things about collecting.

it was most marvelous man in it. come right before charlemagne becomes emperor. to me with a and a new dark age. in spite of the proliferation of electronics, all of the things that are nice of these all the time, we see people shortchanging thought for soundbites. consequently we love the long haul and without we have looks and with books come as you've seen in some parts of the shop we are books that are $25.3015 and where bookstore in the thousands. we find the right person for the right book or should say they find it and in the process we are changed forever. if a book is 250 years old and is not in superb condition it is unlikely to be sellable. people say it's 250 years old. old. that is not a selling point.

we want a book of significance. whether it's 16th century work that was read by the major people in that era or a 19th century work that deals with the new point of philosophy. i sold a first addition of origin of species by darwin. original photographs taken in 1860-61, marvelous with a nice large camera that was one of a kind. that was my most expensive item. i won't go into that except to say we've had amazing success with -- we recently sold a major collection with 16th century chaucer and milton, 17th century milton and other, and major collection to can we sold it. all these were brought to us. people trust us to take time to research and they don't, read books, and of the books you can look at and right of way you say

i'm sorryi'm sorry, we can't us. 99% of all books in my opinion are not going to be sellable but the one or 2% we do find are the exceptions we love. here is a nicer copy, green hills of africa and this is again it signed by ernest hemingway. also it's got this dreamcast. this green cast makes it interesting because halfway through production they realize people cannot read printing because of the green so they stopped production and it made it all white in the background. consequently this is called the first state of the dust jacket which is even closer for the collector of his classic on africa. on commonplace books that are, if you write a book that came from thomas jefferson to library, the library of congress would be eager to buy because they have his collection and in

their special collections. if you want a book signed by a major president, not in the 1950 on probably but lets a good book by treatment where he had inscribed it and say i appreciate what you did in tibbets, your role in dropping the atomic bomb. even though the book otherwise would be another collectible item, the connection we call, association copy, would transform it. here is a nice addition of jack london. not at first but it is interesting aspects to it. the first thing that it has a photograph taken by jack london and he says this is bock and it signed jack london. if you can see, this is the dog at the bottom of the picture. beyond that jack london has done an inscription on this page. dear emma, we don't know if was a friend of his so we can't say

who it is but it's as dear emma, nevermind, nevermind the new san francisco. here's to the new library. affectionately yours, jack london. here he is writing june 15, 1906. we like this for its condition and for the marvelous inscription. i'm not aggressive. i don't go out looking for books. people bring us books. sometimes they invited to a real serious library. they will bring in books 16 through the 18th centuries which we love a great deal. they may bring as a rare western document. documents on the wall, not just photographs, original photographs but we have documents from the early days of arizona 1864. everything is brought to us or we are invited to see. we don't go out looking for. obviously people bring us things.

i would without a book scout fun something and bring a something you can charge us $100 for that we can sell for 500. everybody is happy. here we have a nice first addition of huckleberry finn. we have these protected in covers and so on. this is a true first but the important thing is it's a beautiful, beautiful copy. in this condition its highly collectible. plus it has all the points. the points are ways you distinguish first editions and are so many points i'm not going to go into them but any person who studies jacob blank can identify them from that alone i think in most cases. what's interesting also have, part of the same collection, we have a salesman perspective of huckleberry finn. before and after the civil war one of the best ways in which to sell books was to get out to the hinterlands and show people the actual books themselves in partial as they being printed. they are not fully printed yet

and these are scenes from huckleberry finn. then the salesman would look at the house and he would say they have a lot of black leather, we have a special edition we can print with this beautiful leather. then they would see in-house books bound in and say i see have a lot of books. we will issue this in a beautiful cap edition. the society has over 400 of salesman perspective since. i don't know if they have this one but it's a marvelous copy. there's a way to study books history because it tells you how people were hungry for books. salesman going door-to-door because mark twain was already collectible, they would want to have his books. in those days the my safe for $1.75 you can have this. for $1.95 you can have it with this binding. i don't remember the prices. in the back you will see this is where the people would sign the names and address, and then the

style of binding they wanted. that's the way books were sold outside of the few bookstores in large cities. the role of the antiquarian bookshop is in a sense to get the best books both i think that just in terms of rarity and collectibility but serious of books for the reader. people began to see books, they don't buy a bookie, i'm happy to have series people look at a book and for the first time realize there's books on a subject of whatever category they never dreamed existed before. we have a section of books from hawaii to books on watchmaking. i think we sold those by the way but all these obscure categories. it captures in a sense the diversity of the genius of the people throughout history. >> c-span is in scottsdale, arizona, to learn more about its literary culture. up next to speak with gary

stuart on the landmark supreme court case miranda versus arizona. >> you have the right to remain silent. you have the right to a lawyer. if you don't have a lawyer one will be provided for you and everything that you tell me today can be used to any court of of law. did you understand that? they are called the miranda rights or the miranda warnings because their name on the case the came down from the united states supreme court in 1966 was miranda v. arizona. they are as fundamental and essential to justice today as almost anything ever created. they are a product of the fifth amendment to th the u.s. constitution. that's where they came from, that's why we have them and that's what they stand for today. miranda lived in mesa, arizona.

he was born in mesa, arizona. he was a young man in his mid '20s at the time. he was suspected by the phoenix police department of being involved in the abduction, in the robbery and the kidnapping of three different women on three different occasions. all of those occasions happened in downtown phoenix. that pickup, for lack of a better word, was done in downtown phoenix. some of the crimes took place out in the desert. at the time that was thought to be the desert, is now 20 street and bethany home. it's no longer the desert. it's a major part of central phoenix today. but that's how it started with being a suspect in those crimes. the police went to his home in mesa, arizona, two police

officers, and asked him if you would come down to the police station in central phoenix. they would drive them down here. they wanted to talk to him about some criminal activity. he wasn't sure what at the time, and he agreed to do that. so they brought him down here and interviewed him or interrogated him, depends on your perspective. here in the building we are in today. the police had no direct evidence of any kind. they had no physical evidence. they had no eyewitness identification. they had no admissions. he was a suspect, but they had nothing upon which to base a formal arrest or to charge him. but they asked him for an interview and involuntarily gave that interview. he was not warned of the consequences of this interview because the law did not require that in 1963.

so during the course of talking to him, the police officer that was in charge of the case and was the primary interrogator or interviewer at the time, his name was carol junie. he was then a police detective. he stayed with the police department and became a captain. he is alive and well today, still lives here in phoenix. and during the course of the interview, miranda denied any connection to any of these three cases that the phoenix police department was investigating. he said he was not involved. he did not abduct anybody come he didn't rape anybody, he didn't rob anybody. he didn't kidnapping women. that was his clear statement. so they asked him, detective cooley asked him, if you'd agree to appear and a lineup. and they would bring in one of the victims or two other

victims. it wasn't quite clear, and if he's telling the truth then they will not be able to identify them, and they had no other evidence. they were open with him about that. they had no other evidence. so they asked him if he would agree to be in the lineup, a photo, not a photo lineup, and actually. that also took place here in this building. he agreed. they have a room for that and they found two other victims who were able to come in on short notice. phoenix was a very small place in those days. and so the two women came in. and neither of the two women could identify him with certainty. one of the two women said that she thought it might be the man, poster number one. they're all identified as one, two, three, four. all in his line up group, lineup

group, but she wasn't sure. the other one couldn't pick one of the four, but agreed it might be number one but there was no positive identification. and so on the basis of that, detective cooley went back into the interview room where miranda was waiting, and miranda asked detective cooley the question, did they pick me out? how did i do? some question to that effect. the interview was not tape-recorded or video recorded. this is 1963. and detective cooley said, i'm sorry, or words to that effect, they nailed you. so i think the best thing for you is to just tell me what happened, and we will see what he can do to help you. and miranda did. he confessed to all of them. he described in some detail,

although there is no recording of that, he described in some detail. and detective cooley said, which was good police procedure, then and now, well, i'd like you to write this out in your own hand, and i'll ask you to sign it after you've written out and after i've read it. so first miranda wrote a one-page confession in his own handwriting, and gave it to detective cooley. cooley read it and said all right, if this is the truth, if this is your statement, sign it down at the bottom. and there is a reference in that written statement that this statement can be used in court against him. it's one of the four elements of the miranda warning. so that part was there. he then signed it, and it became

exhibit one, the only exhibit in his trial. this is the sixth floor of the old maricopa county superior court house. it still function as superior court. the first floor of this building is where miranda was tried. we are now on the sixth floor. this is the jail part. he was kept here in this jail until his trial. and after the jail he was moved to a temporary institution, and then he went to the state penitentiary. the physical presence is important because the interview happened here and he was jailed her and was kept here during trial. there were two separate trials. there were three cases, three women involved. he admitted in conversation with detective cooley to all three cases, but in only one of the cases was he asked to write out

a statement. and that was in the rate of one of the three women. and it was clear to the jury, i'm making an assumption here, that his confession is a true, voluntary confession. he said said it was. he didn't take the stand in either case, which is standard practice in those kinds of cases. so he was quickly convicted by two different juries in two different cases one day apart. then went into the system in 1963, at the lead to the appellate process which began after the actual trials. his lawyer on the trial was a man named alan moore, and he in 1963 was a 73 -year-old lawyer in phoenix.

during that trial, during the rape case, alvin moore objected to the admissibility of the written confession and his objection was because he didn't have a lawyer before he gave that statement. alvin moore's statement to the trial judge was i abject because there was no lawyer present at the time he gave that and no one told him he didn't have to give it, or words to that effect, in the trial record. so when the case went to the arizona supreme court, it went up there in 1965. that was the record that there was an objection made by a lawyer on mr. moran does behalf, that his confession should nodded in admitted and shown to the jury because he didn't have a lawyer at the time he gave it. so when the case went to the arizona supreme court, they came

down with an opinion in 1965, and they rejected the argument by mr. moore that the confession should not be admitted because he didn't have a lawyer. the arizona supreme court said that's not required under american law. the supreme court has not said that a confession is inadmissible if you don't have a lawyer. what the court had said two years prior in a case called escondido versus the united states, the court has said if the suspect ask for a lawyer at any time before or during interrogation, then you have to give them one right now. in this case miranda had not asked for a lawyer. so that is the issue that the supreme court took up in 1966. so in the briefing stage prior to oral argument in the miranda

case, all of the briefs focus on that question, who has to give these warnings, our warnings required? if they are required who is to give them and who do they have to give them to? just knowledgeable people or everybody? so that was the setting for this case. then the briefs in all four cases focus on the sixth amendment, which is the right to counsel. so when the oral argument is held in february of 1966, in the miranda case, there were two lawyers visibly involved in the case, john p frank wrote the brief and john flynn argued the case. they were both from the same law firm, lewis and broker, a phoenix firm still here. and in his argument to the court, the supreme court in february 1966, john flynn was

asked a question by the judge during the argument that justice stewart's question was something like this, these are not exact words but they are close. he said, so you are position is that there's a point in time when this interrogation becomes almost confrontational because the police officers digging for a confession, and the suspect is avoiding that, which is the case in all of these cases, so what is your view when this confrontation occurs? does the sixth amendment required at that point a lawyer be appointed when this confrontation going on? and mr. flynn said, mr. justice, the issue here is whether the defendant has a right to remain silent, and the only person who can tell him that is a lawyer.

and so the fifth amendment right against the privilege of self incrimination and the six amendmenofthem are connected tot juncturejuncture, that intersec. somebody has to tell that suspect before he or she confesses what his rights are. that's when the sixth amendment comes in. the court after that argument fashioned an opinion that ultimately came down based on the fifth amendment, and tangentially tied to the six amendment. so the primary issue of the miranda opinion came down is america's right to remain silent. that's the first warning. you have a right to remain silent. the language came from chief justice earl warren. he wrote the opinion, the majority opinion. it was a split opinion, 5-4 decision. reaction of the decision was

wrong the law enforcement community very negative. and very reluctant, and very suspecting. so the law enforcement team unity said it's not our job to get people we arrest information about their legal rights. that ought to come from the lawyer. it's not our job to get them and lawyer. what you're going to do by this decision is the end result will be a lot of people will not be charged with crimes that they committed when they should be charged with crimes that they committed. the reason we can't charge of them is because they didn't admit it. so the admission of crime is a very important element of all law enforcement, understandably so. so that the reaction was negative, largely. "time" magazine and "newsweek" and other magazines and other newspapers, there was an awful

lot of coverage about this in 1966. in 2000, what is arguably the second most important decision about miranda, a case called dickerson versus united states, in that case the u.s. supreme court said enough. once and for all. miranda v. arizona is a constitutional decision of this court. it is not a prophylactic rule. it's a positive decision of this court. we will continue to examine cases that involve the miranda warnings and issues and the admissibility of confessions, but quit telling us it's a rules, prophylactic rules case. it's a constitutional decision of this court. that opinion was written by chief justice rehnquist. chief justice rehnquist was at the time of the miranda decision a practicing lawyer here in

phoenix. so history repeats itself in many ways. miranda was from here. judge then lawyer rehnquist was here and all of that gets transferred to the year 2000 which it becomes a constitutional decision. something interesting happened in 2000 when the dickerson case went up. if you look, date into that case and read the briefs, because briefs in supreme court cases, u.s. supreme court cases, they invite a class of people, for lack of a better word, called amicus cure i, or amicus briefs, friends of the court, they are not parties to the case but they're interested in the issue and so they invite people to write briefs that are called amicus briefs. and a good many of those briefs were filed in the dickerson case by chiefs of police

associations, other law enforcement agencies arguing for miranda. no longer believing that miranda is a bad thing. no longer believing that it harms law enforcement. believing what the rally has become, and the reality is that if the police officer does his or her job and gives those miranda warnings and does it in the proper way, tape recording, video recording, written documentation in some form that's reliable, then what happened in the trial court system is that many, i think most, it may not be 100% at a very high percentage, if the confession is miranda compliant, then the judge fairly routinely admits it in evidence because it is miranda applied. it's become a good way for a

good cop to get a good confession in evidence. use the miranda documents. document it, say it in writing, get the suspect to sign it. do it, recorded, tape-recorded. audio recorded. something so there's some evidentiary basis for. so that's become a reality today. as a consequence, lawyers and judges, judges in the middle and lawyers on both sides, prosecutors and defense lawyers, don't argue much anymore about the miranda documents what argue about with the miranda rights waived? that's the new question or has been for a long time. so that's what's really happened is we now argue about waiver, not whether, and we now argue about consequence in ways that i

think are central to due process of law. >> c-span isn't scott still as of two or more history and literary culture. we learned about some about some key female figures in history of arizona politics. >> ever since women first one the right to vote in 1912, women have played a leading role in politics when you compare it to national average. arizona has been consistently in the top three to five states that chosen women to elective office. i think that has a lot to do with some of the early pioneers. i think the woman that really got the ball rolling for women in politics here was frances willard barnes. in fact in 1995, sandra day o'connor was given the frances willard award. who's about? she was a woman who grew up on

the frontier in nevada. she had a better than average education. she demanded her mother sent her back east to boarding school which are brothers did not have to keep a sort of a wild young lady i hear, a hell raiser. in fact her classmates called her a nevada wildcat. so frances was one of these women to work outside the home because she knew to like so many women here. they were often, even when they were married, they had to pitch in. and so i think when you women working outside the home, they realized the discrimination that occurs. teachers were paid less than their male counterparts. women could serve on juries. women didn't have the boat, and so she became an agitator for the women's right to vote and let the suffrage association. out of her distrust of the male politicians that it pushed aside

the women's vote for many decadesdecades, she decided to r office or self and she won in 1914 as did rachel berry who was a mormon woman from apache county. she went to the lower house. francis went to the state senate. there she met with a lot of the same questions that janet napolitano and other women subsequent to her met with when she entered the senate. they asked her how old she was. he was sent her flowers? they didn't care about her legislative agenda. they cared about her social life. life. one day when francis did not show up in the senate, the newspapers said she must be out shopping because that's what women do, right? she actually was an officer in the general federation of women's club here, and she was very organized and to have it at the conference and she was attending that and helping supervise that. and that another avenue that women use because males were not

too receptive to them as politicians. the female organizations here, the business professional women's club were very active in promoting women like frances. but there was one woman here in arizona that really did smash that ceiling for higher office, and that was isabella greenway. she grew up on the frontier on a ranch owned by her father jointly with teddy roosevelt in the decoders. and she was testing the decoders. she was a debutante in new york at the time teddy roosevelt niece was, i think just a year after eleanor roosevelt was. those two became lifelong friends before either one of them was married. you could see in their letters, there's a wonderful book written by christie miller about them, two books about them called a volume of friendship, and

isabella greenway was a really smart political mind early on. franklin roosevelt was impressed with her as well. greenway was a phenomenal politician, and franklin was, new that her husband was an upcoming politician, but he died only a couple years into their marriage. he was involved with veterans groups, and she took over for that after his death. and franklin had her aunt eleanor suggested she be appointed national democratic committeewoman for arizona in 1928. at that time and all the women were talking about in these early years were democrats. arizona was a democratic state until after world war ii. and fairly progressive at the stated time. so mrs. greenway, as she was known, really organize women in

the party, where as frances had been a fairly adversarial member of political realm with the males. isabella really got along with everybody, and she brought women into the party. and in 1930, 15% of the lower house in arizona was female. that is the number you don't see anywhere in state legislatures until the 1970s. isabella greenway really set the stage for women to run here. like i said, you see a flood of women into the legislature in the twenties, the late twenties and thirties under her mentor ship. one of them was nelli nelly bus. nelly was an unusual woman. she was not from the big city. she was from parker arizona which is just north of uber along the colorado river on the border. she grew up here in the phoenix area. she went to tempt the normal

school which is now arizona state university. got her teaching degree and taught school here for a while before marrying, and she began her life both in business and politics there. and she was the driving light to that community, with her husband, but really she was the outgoing personality. he was a little bit quieter. she became one of the first female licensed riverboat pilot and the trinity. she was a school teacher and principal. she ran for public office because she was so outgoing. was local justice of peace and then becoming a state legislator. legislator. she wanted to go back to law school. she went down to tucson to the university of arizona, taking her five -year-old son with her. left her husband to run the ferry boats in parker. mom and dad went with her to take care of her young son and she went law school district she went through law school. they were pioneers down there. the first of women to graduate

one day when they were in class, the dean came to them and said ladies, you can't attend class today. they said wise about? he said well, we are going to discuss rape class and it's just not appropriate for a woman to do that. now his response was have you ever heard of a rape case that didn't involve a woman? they let in and out of that. she had a no nonsense approach that she used humor and common sense over, a lot of prejudice against women in government. lorna lockwood the way to alaska with nellie trent bush also found some errors to her -- barriers to her political career. she was the daughter of a distinguished attorney, and she had hoped to go to law school and practice with him but he was selected to the state supreme court. she tried to go into practice with, by herself in with another

woman and found that clients really discriminated against women attorneys. since lorna couldn't find a good paying job as an attorney she turned to government and she became assistant attorney general, she also ran for the state legislature. again, chairing the judiciary committee and again a fairly powerful person in the state legislature. then in 1950 she decided to run for mayor of -- maricopa county superior court judge. that's where the state capital is and she won that election. first woman to be elected as a superior court judge. she served a lot of times in the juvenile courts. she never married. she didn't have those barriers other women did. but she was very active in juvenile courts, and served on the maricopa county for several years before running for state supreme court. she was selected back in 1960 10

and chosen the first woman chief justice of the supreme court in 1965. lorna lockwood, when she retired, there was a woman that took place on the maricopa county superior court bench, and that woman was sandra day o'connor. sandra graduated one of the top of a class at stanford law school, and like lockwood, she cannot find employment in private legal world. she found a job in government, i think in california as an assistant attorney for the county offices. she came to arizona, married, at three young boys and she found jobs here. she ran for the state legislature. she became the first majority leader of a state legislature when she assumed office in the

states and in the 1970s, early 1970s, was chosen by her peers. and then she ran as superior court judge, and her nominations were always supported across party lines. bruce babbitt an who is democra, supported her. at a time when politics were a little us contingent in this state. and nationally as well i guess. she didn't of course was named to the u.s. supreme court in 1981. in 1998 went all these women were elected to office here, they were called the fab five by the national media. there were editorials written about them all over the country. when they were sworn in in january 1999, sandra day o'connor who was the first woman on the supreme court and was from arizona, she came to give them their oath of office. these women, it was a big celebration at the state

capital, and i think it was a recognition that these women had done this on their own. that glass ceilings had been broken years long before the women's movement. i think that's why you saw a lot of women, the seventies, eighties and nineties climb to power in the state, like sandra day o'connor, like janet napolitano because there were women that came before them. i really think in arizona, women saw the need to get into politics because their inches were not being represented by state legislators. they often represented the big industries, the mining industries, ranging industries in those days. nobody really paying too much attention to the rights of women. there were a lot of widows, and when women entered the legislator make sure this was the first place in the country that had state-supported widows pensions. they also wanted to improve schools, which a lot of men were not paying too much attention

to. good roads. when you look at women in the legislature they were always advocates of good roads. but if you are a woman alone in a model t going to run arizona out in the middle of the desert, it's a dangerous place to be and they really wanted to get roads paved. i know isabella greenway, when she was in congress, worked really hard to get route 66 paid because in the winter it was basically close down between northern arizona, a lot of snow and rain and mud and/up there, would make that interstate closed. so she worked for good roads in the state legislator. there were a lot of those issues that women saw ignored by men. and again they had experiences as businesswomen and try to get things done. so they were inclined to run for office. >> book teaches in scottsdale, arizona, more about the cities which literary scene. we stick with the marshall trimble about his book "arizona

outlaws and lawmen." ♪ spirit i think outlaws represent, we're fascinated with them because they rebel. they rebel against authority. there's a glamour that's been attached to being an outlaw, sort of the jesse james or billy the kid. they don't realize that these guys didn't have really a very good life. they were constantly on the move. there was always somebody pursuing them, and later in the later days of history, western history like during the time of which cassidy and the sundance kid, they had telephones and then. law enforcement could just call and say these guys just robbe ra bank and other headed your way. one of the things you never see any movies or hear much about but it really drove the outlaws,

drove them out of business. arizona was unique for outlaws in that because of the wild country, especially down along the mexican border where you could just break the law and run across the line, both there and here, you know, and also in the rugged mountains of eastern arizona, the white mountains and the blue river country and all that, that is still wild country to this day. you could hide in there and never be found. and so as law and order came to places like texas and mexico, colorado, montana, there was one last refuge and that was here. so well into the 20th century, we were still dealing with outlaw gangs, rustling cows but by the way we are still dealing with cattle rustling out in these remote ranches. people are still stealing cows. when i was writing about the outlaws and lawmen, i wanted as

much diversity as i could with law men. i picked the sheriff who was a no-nonsense man, and he was judge, jury and executioner and he was one of the most famous lawmen in arizona, from texas. he had been a texas ranger and he was down on the mexican border. it was no holds barred on either side with lawmen. they were fair game. so you would just say say, likei had an accident coming in and he didn't make it. and then there was bucky o'neill who is one of my favorites. he was sheriff of yavapai county. he was welcomed into office with a big train robbery up near flagstaff. he had to go after them. what he had this chivalrous, he was a chivalrous guy and use a very likable guy. just a good irishman. women loved him. women just adored in an and admired him, and he did.

he cracked, he chased the train robbers clear into utah and brought them back. and then when the war came with spain in 1898 1898, he went outd recruited the troops and they elected him, the volunteers, the arizona volunteers and teddy roosevelt roughriders. he was elected captain of the company a pick and then he was killed just before the charge of the san juan hill. so he died a warriors of death. this is probably the way he would've wanted it but he was this knight in shining armor type sheriff. you also had to deal, mentioned a tombstone just now and it made me think of curly bill and the clans, the clinton family and johnny ringgold and a bunch of these guys that were rustlers and they were stealing on both sides of the border but they were especially stealing down along the mexican side because there were big herds of cattle

down in chihuahua that they would go down and russell these cows. they would bring them back to these mining towns and the butchers in the town, there were butcher shops and i they would y these cows. so you eliminated the middleman in a way. in fact one guy bolstered, he said the reason i made a profit is i didn't have to buy the cows. but the thing is, the merchants or the people, the common folk in the town, the butcher shops and things like that, they like to get a better price if they could buy a cow for the fraction of the price they would have to buy from an honest rancher. they kind of like these guys, like having them around. besides when he came came to town they spend a lot, gambled a lot. cowboys don't usually have much money, not when you're making 1 dollar a day. when you're coming into town with a pocket full of, a role of money in your pocket, and spend it freely because there's more where that came from, you are

pretty popular. talking about outlaws. billy the kid name wasn't really billy pickett was a really bonnie. it was henry mccarty. what would you call them? hank the kid? or henry the kid? ithen you have the famous "wild bill" hickok, the kansas law men. his name was james butler hickok. somebody just called a "wild bill" one day and a stuck. so there is a lot in these names. curly bill, that's a good day. johnny ringgold is the best one of all. this brought thing even when the didn't deserve it. an author wrote a book about johnny ringgold called johnny ringo the gunfighter who never was. i think he killed one guy really that we know, that we are sure of. the others maybe he didn't, but the guy, he decided to exterminate the guy and he went up, they guy was washing his face and he had a towel over his face and ringgold shot him.

that's his only real standup shootout. so a lot of these guys were pretty counterfeit, but in the 1920s the journalist picked up on it because america, they had faded from reality. and america wanted he rose, cowboys. the movies really inspired that. the first movie with a story, the great train robbery in 1903, it was a train robbery began chilly butch cassidy and the sundance kid were still robbing trains out west at the time this one happened. as the movies got real popular in the 1920s, it was really kind of a superhero super screen heroes. all of a sudden people started thinking these movies are real. this is the way they really were. so many people today come all to know about the west is what they see on the movie screen.

so they equate everything to that. i have to explain, hollywood is trying to make money. hollywood is about profit, so don't expect them to play it the way it really happened may be. if you really want to know, read a book. the arizona rangers were organized in 1901. this was after you normally, this was about five or 10 years after they say the normal era of the old west ended. we are now into the 20th century, such. but the outlaw gangs which we had gangs still operating in the rugged mountains of eastern arizona, and they were bracingly stealing cows in the middle of the day. write in broad daylight stealing cattle. so that was when it really began to fade, but as far as in 1918 they were still having gunfights and some of these remote areas like the mountains.

you go into the mountains, north east of tucson and you go in there today and it's still while the country, and few people around. i think as long as you tell a good story, and the west with the perfect place to tell a story, because you could have contemporary issues, problems, but you give it an western theme, give heroes like lenny eastwood or somebody like that, give him a role, or people who are real drawing cards, kevin coster is today, you know, makes good westerns. people like that they can get up there and make a good film, and they also have box office, box office power. the stories are still there. >> we are an old tent and

scottsdale, arizona, where booktv is learning more about the cities rich literary scene. cap next we take you to guidon books the specialize and works about the civil war and old west history. >> guidon books was started in 1964 by my parents. they wanted to open a western history and civil war bookstore in scottsdale, and the first store was on main street. there's a story that when somebody saw what was going in, they told my father, well, you're only going to be here six months. it's now been over 52 years that we've been in scottsdale. guidon books, to what i believe, is ruby coster, george's wife, wrote three books when she was traveling or after she was traveling with her husband. and one of the books was

following the guidon. my father was a great coster collector. my mother loved the civil war but was also enamored with the women in the west, so i'm sure they came up with guidon books. it fits both military. we have books in western and eric in history. we focus a lot on arizona. of course the southwest indians, the apache and navajo history. a lot of people enjoy reading about tombstone, the wyatt earp and doc holiday characters. sometimes superstition mountains which are just south of here, looking for the lost dutchman mine. but there also interested in cowboys. we got a lot of early cowboy recollections, how to. coster again, great selection of custer. and then the civil war. scottsdale has one of the largest civil war roundtables, so we a people interested in the civil war here.

we have a small connection to the actually event string to civil war. lincoln a created the separate territory of arizona in 1863. he wanted to be sure that our mining properties, the gold and silver, stayed with the union. arizona was part of the new mexico territory. it was more leaning towards the confederate. they're a been a large texas contingency in their. they came over, did a little bit of an invasion into southern arizona, had a battle. very small but it presents an opportunity for arizonans to go and have a reenactment with our more soldiers in the reenactment that in the actual. but people come to arizona to live, but they come from somewhere else. a lot of them maybe had

relatives that fought in the civil war, so they are still interested in learning about their family, what they did and the battles. reading about arizona, because it is such a young state, 40th state, it also has the combination of being a great frontier. it had the element of hostile indians. it had the element of mining and loss minds, and cowboys and outlaws. you have all of that combination within the past 100 years, and it just provides great stories where people can get interested. i think guidon is important not only for bringing an avenue for people to read books but also supporting the whole arizona culture. the whole story of marshall trimble getting his first book published. we are great supporters of the

arizona history convention which puts on an annual event each year. and it just becomes important to get people interested in history, keep them interested in giving our younger generation interested in reading more. booktv in scottsdale, arizona, learning more about the cities literary scene. cap next we stick with author bob boze bell about his time curling up on route 66. spirit for the better part of two decades my family took a road trip every august to the family farm in iowa. we would leave kingman road early pick my mom would pack the night before and in the morning at 4 a.m. we were up and ready to roll the evening before light. i don't think we left kingman. we estate. there's nothing more magnificent than to be on the road in those early twilight hours.

i never understood the attraction of route 66 are why it was such a big deal. it it was just a road to me. about four years ago i wife got an assignment in spain, and so i went along because i wanted to find the ground zero for the cowboy. because i had a theory, the three was if i could find where the conquistadors emanated from, find their ground zero zero, i d find the capital because it's the conquistadors who come to the americas neighboring horses. they bring cattle. they bring the tradition of brandy. they create the cowboy that we celebrate today around the world. so i was in spain, which turns out was the place that columbus set sail on his second expedition to the new world. he left with the boat picks i stood there for about 20 minutes and i finally took it all in attica ready to leave and i turned around, and on the beach

i spied the route 66 bar, in spain. i thought to myself, if you like a ton of bricks. i get it, i get it. they sent the horse. they sent cattle. they sent all other european traditions to us and we sent them back a legend of a highway. at that moment i realized, this is an international road, a legend, and i lived on it. i grew up on it. when i was a little kid, i was so into old west history and i would read true west and the office during slow times and then i would look up and i would go, nothing ever happened in kingman, arizona. this is of the dumbest place you could ever live. history is what happened in tombstone, arizona, dodge city, kansas, deadwood dakotas. nothing happened here. fast-forward about 10 years ago i got a call from a writer and

he said, i read about your article of your fathers gas station in arizona highways. i would like to interview. i said sure. he goes, his first question, that very first thing he asked me is, what was it like growing up in such a historic place? .. no big deal. you had to put on night crews. everybody was trying to get to california and we were the last

stop before you get there. it's in the northwest quadrant of arizona and up in the area that was so unpoppulated at the time. there was like 45,000 people, an entire county, fifth largest county in the country. the kids would come to my high school and had to be bussed in from the outlying ranching areas and in some cases all the way towards utah and they would get on the bus in the dark and go home and get off the bus in the dark, that's how isolated the area was. when ruth 66 was really popping in the 1950's, here we were, isolated area that could barely get television and the cars were coming from all over the country with the hipster kids and tubes at the top of the car and people are laughing and we are like, whoa, this is weird. the traffic on route 66 was

always a good cliff. this was the road to california. in the summer time it got crazy. my father had to hire extra help and worked around the clock. three shifts over eight hours at the time. my first job was icing jugs. in the first days there was no ac, no air-conditions in cars. none. and so everybody had a jug in their car of water and ice would melt the first 10 miles so it was my job to ask if they had jugs they wanted ice and would come back and get a tip. every summer my father would take a vacation and my father's idea of fun was to visit the family farm in iowa and so my farmer was old school, you had to get up at 4:00 a.m. drive-throughs an hour before he had to have breakfast and we

were going eastbound on route 66. they are on the way to disneyland and here we are going to utah and there were signs all the way across mesa, gas, regular 19.9, cleanest restroom. world largest buffalo. he said, why the indians as opposed i guess the other guy, could we stop? i realized that my father was not going to stop except for maybe gas, food, oil, maybe eep wounds but not going to stop till we had too get to iowa so

we could eat five times a day and talk about crops. on the way back from iowa one year, i said, dad, you have to get me one place to stop back. we will, kid, if we have funment and i started poking him. my father was describing and there's a weak spot that runs from the ear down and i start poking him. you promised and he tried to shaked me off. you promised, you promised me and he finally swung the '57 ford. he said, you have 15 minutes.

i just try today replicate it right here in my life. i just bought it. it's mine. i got home and i put it on the wall, right before i go to school. i look at the photo, we have to have a hat like that. i'm going to have a rifle like that, i'm going to have everything that's in this photo, well, about a week later. my mom had to go to downtown to get a prescription filled and i ran into the front of the office, the store and there was magazine and i told the true stories of the west and i bought the issue and while my mom was talk to go mag at the department i'm reading the magazine and on page 37i discovered that the photograph i bought was a fake.

it was taken at a parade. hey, george, you look like billy the kid, get up in the flat bed. i was so mad now that i missed the watergate, why, because i was in the library trying to figure out what wild west heros and legends were actually true and that led me to owning true west magazine. well, the thing that was so bizarre and ironic and we didn't know it at the time, wasn't summer in 1968 and 1967, i remember them coming through -- putting stakes in the ground north of our house and we asked the guys what they were serving and they wouldn't tell us.

it was top secret and so later we found out it was i-40 and sent to the south of town coming into town and i worked on it and i didn't think any -- i didn't realize that we were killing the very thing, we were killing the goose that laid the golden egg. it was just progress, they were going to cut out 15 miles from hackberry and cut across there. when the bypass happened, you can cut off the oxygen, everything in the middle of that died and i mean died, there were places that were out of business for a year, some of them it took longer but they eventually, in fact, it's sad for me to drive through kingman, the park that i grew up in because so much of it

is so torn down, desert drug and that's very sad. there's one message that the book has or that my life has, it is pay attention, we are all looking right at history and i want to reach the 9-year-old boy. >> book tv is on twitter and facebook and we want to hear from you. tweet us, twitter.com/book tv or post a comment on our facebookbs page.trance to the wa facebook.com/booktv. >> ms. nutt, who is nicole. 199,

>> nicole is and i dentcal boy given the name wyatt. and when i say when do i get to be a girl, you know, when do i get to look like a girl, believed she was a girl and two middle class ordinary parents, needed to figure out what that was about. >> how did they figure it out or did they? >> the twins were adopted at birth. kelly knew two things that were most important for her as a mother, make sure that her children were safe and happy. she had to understand the happy party because she also knew that the child was unhappy when she

didn't get to play with the toys that she wanted or or a father who was conservative, republican, veteran, you know, was really unsure about who this child was and resisted it, but kelly was determined and so she did very early when a lot of us do and she googled the words boys who like girls' toys. that began the beginning of odd oddessy. to try to bring her husband into it it took her longer to do that and he's probably the one that goes the most transformation in book. he goes out and talks to people about transgender kid.

jonas is a remarkable kid. they are entering sophomoref college. what was wonderful about jonas that really probably knew before anyone. kids would come up to him and say, you know, what is it like to have a transgender sister and, you know, he didn't know, he just knew he had a twin that was really a girl, not a boy. and when they were both very young, basically said to his father, face it, you have a son and a daughter. it was a wake-up call that he was my child telling me that his brother is really a sister, so jonas had to go on a journey to understand to be protective of

his sister when she was discriminated against and then told by staff at middle school that she would have to use the teacher's restroom and not the girl's room. she had changed her name dressing as a girl for all intents and purposes. it was tough on jonsa and profoundly so it's hard too try to talk to people to make them understand. he struggled with it too. they were very close and different in a lot of ways and each one other's best friends and protectors.te >> what was the first step in becoming nicole, was it clothes, was it name?

>> the evidence to the parents was certainly the clothes. nicole born yatt loved to -- sh would pull shirt over her head and we wanted to wear mother's jewelries. these were the first signs and a lot of kids go through phases. it was constant. and then she actually would say when daddy, when does my penis fall off. this wasn't a child that says i feel like i'm a girl, this was i child who knew she was a girl but couldn't understand being a child why people were treating w her like a boy. >> when did surgery happen?

>> surgery happened after she graduated high school, nicole was one of the first cases of an american child at the children's gender clinic in boston, the first one in the country established in 2007 under dr. norman, first to have puberty suppressed so that she had time to go through all the psychological tests and had time to dress and act and be a girl in order to know for certainha that this was who she was and then when puberty was going to start for her, they could see in her twin brother when it was starting, that was when they started her on estrogen, so she wouldn't going to have the surgery. she wanted to do it before college. this is a very important step. so many people go through puberty and when they decide to make transition they make it

when they are adults. it's specially difficult foror female transgender people because, you know, they have gone through male puberty. she went through female puberty at the right time. she's been able to have the right development and at the right time as other young womeni and she's a beautiful young woman and is happy and thrilled and has a boyfriend and is about a normal a kid as you can come across and it's the beauty of this family because they are ordinary in so many ways, they are extraordinary in how they dealt with the situation. they are ordinary in being an every-man family. they are your mother and father, and sister and brother. it would be hard not to identify with this family. to the degree that that can

normalize for people what it means to be transgender and whah it means to have a transgender member in the family, then i think it spreads the message and educates the people just by their presence. >> amy ellis, how did you find the story?y? >> the story actually found me honesty. it was first published in the newspaper in the boston globe in december of 2011. very far-seeing editor who promoted the story, i read it and fascinated by it and i was contacted -- i didn't know that they were going represented at the time by someone i had known earlier in boston and she reached out to me because the family was getting publicity requests. they were uncomfortable with doing anything more than that. they we wanted to protect their

kids and have them grow up. have them a normal teenage life but they knew that maybe down the line after they graduatedth high school, they would want thg story to be told. she contacted me because she knew i had written a book so the story came to me, but i remember say to go my agent, this is fascinating and the fact that there were identical twins is an important aspect of trying to explain the science and what we know about the brain and gender, do you think anybody is going to read a book about a transgender kid. that was five years ago. the world has changed so dramatically, and honestly the best estimates are grossly inadequate. the ones that you will read most frequently between 7 and 800,000. those figuressed are based on 10-year-old surveys of three states. it's impossible to know.

i'm waiting for the next stage so we can get an estimate. of course, we face the sameme problems and people not identifying as transgender and -- or not wanting to identify, so honestly i think we -- we don't know. but what i learned from doing this book is i had always thought the phrase gender spectrum was very nice, politically correct, lovely phrase but it really is truehats that this is not exceedingly rare that one in 200 kids are born with atypical -- one in 200 are born with atypicaly, genetelia.itive to androge insensitive to tees -- your an

you see what can happened in the braib and this is why identical twins have the exact dna but they get different chemical messages from the mother even where they are positioned in the womb. the thick of variation because of the mother takes in the environment, the way our brains are set is nearly infinite.

>> what kind of testing did nicole have to take before surgery?: >> back then before geneticc testing, so what she went through was mostly psychological test and also physiological test to understand, you know, her anatomy. it was mostly a series of psychological test. a child can live as the gender they believe they are for as long as possible to be fully confident that that's why they are. there are a lot of kids who, you know, test boundaries and, you know, boys that like to dress up as girls and girls that were tomboys and these were temporary, these are things that are experimenting, not all children who do that are

transgender but a child who says at the age of 2 when do i goat to be a girl, and says it constantly and consistently, that's a trance gender child. >> amy ellis nutt, transformation of an american family, also the coauthor of the teenage brain, neuroscientist survival guide to raising adolescents and young adults, pulitzer prize for what? >> that was for a series called the wreck of the lady mary. it was a story -- true story based on the sinking of a scallop boat off the coast of cape may in 2009, six of the seven crew died. the seventh survived. the accident happened so quickly that he didn't know what happened. the story was on the one hand a narrative about what happened to

these men and their families but also an investigation. i think it's a strong case that they were the victims of a hight seize german ship. it's it's a mystery and investigation and a story about people. >> also spent nine years as fact-checker as sports illustrated. >> that's right. >> becoming nicole is the booka we have been talking with her about, the transformation of an mesh family here it is. >> here is a look at some of the staff picks from the harvard bookstore in carve bridge, massachusetts, yahoo news political columnist explores how the down fall of gary hearts presidential campaign has shaped campaigns on all the truth is out. supreme court justice supreme briar look at how court

decisions are stretching out america's borders. in 1944 historian reviews the decisions fdr had to make regarding d-day and the end of world war ii. journalist reports on the lives of afghan women and girls in the underground girls of cobble. another staff pick from the harvard bookstore is black man in a white coat by dr. damen who weighs in on raise and inequalities and the american healthcare system. we should all be feminist, argues that everyone should be fighting for gender equality. english professor dissect it is seven debates between abraham lincoln and douglas during senate race in lincoln's tragic pragmatism. the difficulties she faced as a career pilot an first woman to

fly solo across the atlantic ocean in her memoir, west with a night. some of the picks. many have appeared on book tv and you can watch them on our website booktv.org. >> i'm here with scott farris, hitler's perfect beauty and prime suspect. who was inga? >> inga was miss denmark of 1931 but she was much more than that. she was actress, ballerina, screen writer for mgm and she was the great love of john f kennedy's life. it was not a play, it was a romance. one she was suspected nazi spy and two she was married to her second husband.

there's a 1200 page file and i would say that ultimately it was concluded that she was not a spy. so interestingly, of course, for several months she was considered the prime suspect, the key to the entire espionage network in the u.s. all based on circumstantial evidence. but interestingly, when hoover himself was convinced that inga was not a spy, directed him to continue with the observation ant under surveillance, fine tapped, apartment bugged, mail open, it was remarkable thing. >> you're the autoo of two other books, kennedy and reagan and the men who lost the race by changed the nation. what do you think the legacy will be of president obama's administration and how do you think this past election cycle has affected the united states? >> well, president obama's legacy is going to be turned over the coming years. obviously as our first african-american president his

legacy is pretty secure in that regard as historical figure. i think probably the most important thing he did, though, was probably following the great financial crisis in 2008-2009. history will be pretty kind to him on that. the other great accomplishment of presidency was onliy obamacare and the question is is that a steppingstone to other healthcare reforms that people would build a pivotal moment and moving onto a single-payer system or is it going to get repealed by the republicans and maybe his legacy will be less than right now but only time will tell. it's hard to tell with presidencies. truman left as one of the most unpopular presidents in america and 250 years later considered one of near great president or our great president. time will tell what the legacy is but he's obviously historically significant figure and we will see how that goes. >> in terms of the past election

cycle, how do you think it has affected america? >> time will tell. mr. trump has been neither. he's a different type of president with a different kind of background. it's hard to say what's going to happen. i wrote about losing presidential candidates and their impact on american history, so a question is what will mrs. clinton's legacy will be in america. like president obama because she was the first woman to be nominee of a major party, the question is what her campaign do, it's an open question, if she leads to a certain trumpism and era of america which is really good or really bad, people will say that was important that her campaign was not successful and so allowed president trump to come to office. but did she change the democratic party, that's hard to say. the last centrist democrat for a

while. the democrats move a little to the left under senator sanders. historians need time to get perspective and they have been losing presidential candidates at the time. they were complete disasters, now from the respective of 50 years later, goldwater transformed the republican party and so it will take a few decades before we know what mrs. clinton's legacy is as well as mr. trump's. >> what made you want to write this book? >> just an unbelievable story. it's straight out of movie from the 1930's with secret agents and spies and glamorous women and all sorts of things. a little corner of the kennedy presidency that i don't think most people are familiar with. inga was in many ways

responsible for john kennedy becoming president as anybody. we think of john kennedy as handsome, vein man who was destined to be president when inga had romance, he was a young officer in naval intelligence, she was skinny, and maybe had inferior complex compare today joe, jr. inga did a few things, she knew the president of france, she knew the kick and -- king and queen of denmark and that he had everything to be president. and then to get any political talent and inga managed to help him stand up to his father and get the spoort he would later need to become president. because their affair was scandallist, president kennedy

was marshaled out of the navy. at that time john kennedy thought his career was over. he came back with a reporter inga who realized the tale was heroic and portrayed him as a war hero and not a failure. that was the basis kennedy political biographies for all the years in running for the white house. >> c-span where history unfolds daily. in 1979 c-span was created as a public service by america's television company, it is brought to you today by your satellite provider.