that the referendum in support of the peace accord was defeated by low turnout in precisely the areas of the country where support for peace and end of violence were the highest. but they were also the areas of the country where the government reached less, less well or not at not at all. the -- you mentioned argentina and its dirty war but i think that is something that has passed in argentina. argentina, chile both countries with military dictatorships particularly nasty probably have some of the best chances to reestablish good and effective government.

it won't be easy to do. there's a lot of work to be done. but there's -- there is positive movement and there is some foundation on which to build in these countries. with respect to argentina specifically i'll tell a funny story and that is i once asked a economist workinged at the world bank. what do you learn? primary and secondary school about how democracy, about how your government ought to work? what are the responsibilities? what are the kind of rules of the game? and this individual kind of chuckled and said you know i think we shot all of those professors.

[laughter] fighting back, but i think the question is something we all ought to ask as we deal with the region. what do young people, whether they're in good schools or bad schools -- learn about how government should perform. what the responsibilities of government are and what the responsibilities of citizens are are. so i think without that glue of faith in your government and good performance on the part of your government is going to be very hard to deal with the questions of transnational organized crime, of gang violence, and et cetera. and i think we also need to be quite aware that, you know, an

awful lot of money making traffic is moving toward the united states. and in the form of marijuana, cocaine, increasingly for mexico, heroin and -- and the arms trade goes the opposite direction. so we are contributing a part to this. we have for that region, an obligation to participate to do what we can to help resolve some of these problems. but they're problems that just don't deal with controlling gang violence or transnational organized crime. they're problems that most profoundly are related to the -- the poor, the ineffective government and a rule of u law that exist in many of the countries. thank you.

>> thank you very much. places thank -- places thank -- thank you for trying to focus on the role of education because the security challenges they are really to ask how the children perceive the role, and we can see now with a terrible tragedies elsewhere such as in syria. so that children and refugee camps today of tomorrow perhaps they will turn to the gun thankfully because of this -- >> other skill. >> so i'm delighted that you

tried to focus on the education. we're going to move on obviously to the issues but we'll come become to a discussion. i think we move on to our next speaker right here liana -- perhaps focus to make a case study. but you can speak about other related issue. >> thank you very much professor alexander and thank you for inviting me to participate in the panel here today if. i am going to return to your theme. challenges and opportunities in the post area and i'm going to raise this in the context of venezuela because venezuela has become a cuban security state. with cuba provided military

intelligence, doctors, nurses, in exchange for venn venezuelan oil and the existence of the state about an the problems that called principally for the venn sway are a concern for the poem but also for us in the united states so there are four issues that i want to raise this afternoon. how does cubaswal cuba, venezuela -- kubaswala so-called single government, single country separate? secondly, what was cuba's role and in the creation of this security state in venezuela, how is it unraveling today? third, what options are there

for the venezuelan people themselves to undo, repair the political and most of all economic situation? and finally what's the role of the international community including the united states? so i must give you some background allow me to be very brief because i have only ten minutes and i want to focus on the issues. when elected this was julio chavez elected into office in 1999, he introduces socialism. that is if the state is dedicated to bring about greater equality to transfer fair wealth from riches to the poor in housing, in transportation, in medical health, in education so that those who were deprived in

previous decades can assert their rights as venezuelan people. he dies in 2014? 2014, 2013 -- 2013, and is succeeded by the cuban selected err nicholas a former union leader in boss company. but a man who had been trained politically in havana. my daughter had neither the charisma nor the smart, nor any economic basis on which to lead the venezuelan people. so today we have inflation according to the imf at 180%. the imf anticipate that with

inflation in november last month at 58% inflation rate for next year will be over 600%. and all of us can recall from our history the impact that had in germany and the republic and the lack of support of ordinary venezuelan citizens or trust in their government. in the political realm, a divided opposition decided not to participate in legislative elections which meant that the chavez party could take control of the legislature and with that controls stack the supreme court and the electoral tribunal. the result is that central control created by chavez inherited by maduo and faced

with both political and an economic crisis. political crisis is that the opposition exactly a year ago december 15, 2015, one of two-thirds majority in fact national assembly enabling diverse opposition parties to unite unusual but they did with a demand for a recall referendum or what we would call impeachment of the president. the president resisted. the president used the supreme court to deny that recall referendum on grounds of fraud. and despite the fact that the the opposition succeeded in gaining 1.8 million votes in favor of this recall referendum, the supreme court has denied it. the electoral tribunal has not

only denied that referendum but has denied the elections this month for mayor and state governs. in other words, legislative participation and electoral democracy is dead at the moment in venezuela. at the same time, food is very short. are not to be found. the police stack the hospital, guard the hospital so that any new medication, antibiotic, anesthesia, bandages, can be stolen and resold outside. the venezuelan people are suffering to a degree different from syria but equivalent in terms of human suffering.

violence now has an intentional homicide rate of 90 per 100,000 that is the worst in the world except for syria. and it compares with 25 years ago when it was only 8-10 people per hundred thousand. in other words the venezuelan state has collapsed so what does the cuban leadership. the cuban leadership who in 2007 proclaimed were a single government. we are a single country, what do they do? it favored them back in 2007 because subsidized oil enable the cuban economy to be able to run. but that's subsidize oil no longer arrives in the quantity it was used to.

in 2008, it was 115,000 barrels per day. today, it is 55 thousand barrels per day. so last venezuelan tanker to dock at the fort and tun load venezuelan oil was august and the cuban leadership has recognized venezuela can no longer be helpful to us. so it is demanding that its doctors and its nurses return. ...

the socialist revolution will continue. i wonder what rift. so as we see cuba separate itself from venezuela and shift towards a reliance on american tourism and international investment, we ask, what can and what are the venezuelan people doing to resolve the situation? and here is a big question. there are those who believe that once again the students should go back into the street to

demonstrate. venezuela worker should go back to demonstrate here and there isn't this more violent wing among the opposition who would like to bring down the maduro regime through public demonstration. but it risks violence on a huge scale. because the state that only has the national guard, the military and the police but it also has what they call -- these are young men and women put on a uniform for the occasion, take out their motorbikes and slash and murder and violence is widespread as is always deniable. because they are not part of the state aggregators. there is a hope, but it's only based on a hope that the venezuelan military, who have a tradition of upholding

constitutional law, will not allow this violence to take place. that they will stop the transeven, restrain the police, who will who put themselves between the demonstrators and the state to achieve some calm. by the leadership of the military have been co-opted by participation in drug trade. so they are now participants in the transfer of cocaine and heroine and marijuana and meth, through venezuelan ports to africa and then up to europe and to a degree lesser to us in the united states. so there's no reliability that the senior levels of the military will actually act as that restraining force. there are those on the opposite side in venezuela who believe that discussion, that i want is the only way forward. in the event helped by the

vatican who in october asked maduro to enter into negotiations with the opposition to seek a solution. the opposition demanded two things. one, the constitutional right for a recall referendum. the second was the release of political prisoners. those numbers of political prisoners are now in the hundreds. many of them are hauled into jail for only a matter of three or four days, but they are treated in such humane, inhumane ways during those days that when released, they retreat into the family. the retreat into their homes fearful of being exposed once again to that brutality. so while you have this moderation wing which has, since

october 20, been participating in negotiations brokered by the former presidents of spain, the dominican republic and panama, those negotiations have gone nowhere. maduro has stalled at each point, such that earlier this week the opposition said it's not worth is remaining at the table. we will not participate in next tuesday meeting. maduro has agreed to keep the cable open, the negotiating negotiating table open until january 17, which conveniently is seven days after the constitutional deadline for a recall referendum. after that date the vice president will take a leadership and they were moved towards the next presidential election.

in other words, maduro has a way of protecting his regime, even if he has to step aside, which suggest that it is the regime clinging to power. because once it loses the immunity from prosecution as government officials, they are exposed to cases, criminal cases, for drug trafficking, for abuse of human rights, and for other international crimes. what is the international community doing? the argentinians have taken the lead. they had said to venezuela, you are no longer acceptable within the regional grouping of south american countries. your presidency is suspended and we are assuming that pro tem. when the venezuelan foreign minister appeared this week in buenos aires to assume her

chair, she was not allowed in the room. she was then subjected to a little bit of jostling outside the room which maduro said was abusive to her since she ended up on the floor. nobody can quite see the floor or her on the floor, but there's no doubt that there was pressure on her to move away from the room where they were meeting and she was rejected. nicaragua remains a friend. bolivia remains a friend. but neither country is incapacity to really support the economy as it goes through this spiraling downturn. so finally what should we in the united states, what could president-elect tromp you? i would suggest that in the same way as he had a telephone call to the president of taiwan, this is the time for a telephone call

to the leadership of venezuela opposition. it's a time for stating u.s. support for the opposition, knowing that maduro will use it to say that the united states is in connivance with the opposition. but you state that we stand for something, and that the maltreatment of citizens citizee humanitarian crisis is not something that we can tolerate. our secretary of state elect, re,rex telemann, had still of en mobil knows the situation in venezuela since exxon mobil has set its assets expropriated, its contract when it and, in fact, in 2014 exxon mobil won a suit for damages to the amount of $1.4 billion. so we have a secretary of state elect who knows the situation in

venezuela and we have a president-elect who is prepared to change some of the traditional positions of u.s. foreign policy an make telephone calls which wake people up. that is my words, and i look forward to questions later. [applause] >> i think you touch on the very important case of study. obviously, again like margaret, triggers a lot of questions, not only visibly the situation in the country itself or the inter-american relationships, but globally and particularly the goal, for example, of iran,

that iran develop a base in venezuela for many years during the time of chavez, but at any rate we will come back to it now. we're going to move on to bruce. you have good news for us? >> i have mixed news, but first, thank you for the invitation. it's an honor and a pleasure to be here. so what i want to do is talk about several issues. i want to talk about some of the issues of transnational organized crime, arms, drugs, migration. touch on a couple of the geographical issues, and then i want to focus on the need to build a better hemispheric framework for international enforcement cooperation. it is challenging for the new

administration because of the campaign discussion of, you know, tough, tougher border walls, some of the derogatory remarks about mexicans and also about the need to renegotiate nafta, and some of the discussion against free-trade. i think the beginning of the administration, it would be good for the new administration to call the leaders together and you sit down and listen to them and have a dialogue about what's needed in terms of hemispheric security and all the other issues. let me now focus on some of the issues starting with arms. we've already heard about the arms problem, and the u.s. is

clearly the leading source of arms, not only in hemisphere, but in the world. and there have been two important treaties. the 1997 inter-american convention against the illicit manufacturing and trafficking and firearms ammunition and explosives and related materials, and 20 countries, 22 latin american and caribbean countries have ratified the u.s. signed in 1997, it was sent to the senate and it's been sitting there. you also have the u.n. arms trade treaty of april 2013. 2 20 hemispheric countries have signed that, and that treaty, by the way, pertains to trade in conventional arms on small arms to battle tanks, combat aircraft, warships. it entered into force on

december 24, 2014. the u.s. signed but again the senate has done nothing. drugs are a problem. one initiative of many countries in the region, including the u.s., is to find ways for non-incarceration treatment of people who just use drugs, including the oas itself has had a project. i think more needs to be done hemisphere click engines of exploring that initiative, and he is needs to do more with respect to the demand side of drugs. in terms of migration, there has been some good initiative

already. there is a reference to outline for prosperity. the u.s. and the countries in central america have had a very broad public education campaign and also to have been some changes in the loss. so for instance, now if you want to apply for asylum you don't have to come here to do that. you can do it from those countries. i mean, that's an effort to reduce the amount of migration because that's where a lot of people are kidnapped, killed, but there's also a lot of interplay between the cartels. first there was drugs, but now there's a lot of trafficking of persons and all kinds of other crimes. one of the initiatives that was

i think useful that was done in the clinton administration was the use of sanctions against both transnational organized crime and against narco kingpins. one thing that could be tried is more effort to get other countries to go along with those sanctions so that it's not just unilateral. okay, let me now quickly, well, one thing i want to say about migration. first of all, it's a problem in the hemisphere, the fact that the u.s. hasn't had comprehensive immigration policy for the longest time. another problem with respect to

security has been that there's been a lot of deportation of hardened criminals. and it's happened in most cases without any notice and without any planning. and when you don't to hundred desperate when you don't to hundred or 1000 criminals on fragile states that have no capacity to deal with them, what happens is these criminals who haven't even been in these countries for most of their lives, they end up doing more violence and then they transfer their know-how to their friends. and guess what. only does it destabilize those countries, but because they know the u.s., they often target their criminality back to the

u.s., whether it's trafficking in humans, stolen or embezzled cars and aircraft, drug trafficking, et cetera. so the u.s. needs to do more what it's done with haiti. with haiti, it notifies haiti and it helps haiti to mitigate and to plan for the persons that it deports. well, looking at a couple of the countries. so because this panel is entitled challenges and opportunities in a post-castro era, i think i need to say a few words about the u.s. relationship with cuba. one of them, the biggest problems for the use in the region has been that at every

regional meeting, the number one question has to do with cuba, and the fact that cuba has been isolated. that has changed since december 17, 2014. and there has been 11 agreements that have been done between the u.s. and cuba dealing with everything from narcotics enforcement to migration, to the environment. and even before the new initiative, historically relations between cuba and the u.s., when they have improved or sometimes staging improvement, they have had to do with the same issues where they've had to do with exchange of hijackers, exchange of spies, exchange of political prisoners.

and to very positive developments between the u.s. and cuba is a fat cuba has been in the forefront of dealing with hemispheric security in that cuba has sponsored the talks in colombia with the farc. in addition, cuba has been very helpful with respect to haiti and earthquakes and so forth. cuba has used their doctors to give a lot of assistance. with respect to, well, i think because of the shortage of time let me turn now to the need for a better hemispheric framework in terms of enforcement. and here clearly the most important body has been the organization of american states.

there's been a group called the inter-american juridical committee that meets twice a year to make recommendations on laws and policies there has been in the last 10 or 15 years a new group called -- basically, the attorneys general for ministers of justice. they meet every other year, and they make recommendations for new agreements and policies, and they have done a lot of good work. but the problem is it's not an organic organization. it depends on the permanent council for its marching orders,

for the council to draft, for its budget. and so it really can't do much. some of the other entities having to do with enforcement in the oas are more organic, like the inter-american drug use control commission or the organization for counterterrorism. what is needed is an america's committee on crime problems. this would be a committee that would have its own institution and would be composed of lawyers, diplomats, criminologists and it would meet every day and it would consider all the threats and some of the solutions whether they be uniform laws, treaties,

different organizations. and this isn't something out of mars. there's been something like this since 1958. 1958. the council of europe has a european committee on crime problems. and that's what it does. it needs every day, and it focuses on the different threats. threats. i mean, it has produced over 100 conventions on enforcement, many of which the u.s. has become a part of. so to be successful the enforcement agencies have to be, have to network as well as the criminals. and so in order to have successful enforcement regimes and networks, we need to do more in terms of hemispheric cooperation.

thank you. [applause] >> thank you very much, bruce. we will come back to some of the issues you raised. we will move on to fernando jimenez, please. >> thank you for inviting me. every time i get an opportune to speak your. in the interview with fidel castro with reporter from "vanity fair," fidel expressed that his death, nothing would happen. that the country, the party and the government would quickly adapt to the situation, saying that all of political legal institutional mechanisms exist to confront the situation when it arises. the life of the country will not stall for a single minute. there is no indispensable anywhere in the world and even less in this country. for many of us the so-called

castro revolution that began in 1959 has been a permanent threat to the cuban democratic institutions, and that continues detriment to the economic and social development of this country. also, a permanent failure in the projection that castro wanted to export to the majority of latin american countries. it died in the hands of the bolivian military. [inaudible] on accelerated the coup d'état. his relationship with argentina didn't produce any political or military results, but all contributed to operation condor that for many years seven repression in the hands of the methodist of chile, argentina and uruguay. in the same way it only for the

spoiled cuba and spain relations with spain being a country that always maintain good military ladder relations with cuba. [inaudible] castro managed to subsist thanks to the initial support of the soviet union and subsequently by promising that managed to connect with the left of latin america. cuba -- and a change for all countries. and maintain relations with brazil and ecuador for support and international annexations in exchange for --

[inaudible] now everything is changed but generally was characterized by the rise of the left and latin america. the extreme left led by hugo chavez and maduro has led to -- the american also against the present government of spain. furthermore in discussing alliances with rogue states as well with terrorist groups including the colombia park and hezbollah. due to these reasons the death of fidel castro will not create any significant political tolerance or geopolitical classes in the hemisphere. fidel was incinerated just six days ago and no one is talking about fidel anymore. cuba today only has limited -- especially venezuela. the rest of such as bolivia, nicaragua limit themselves to

purely maintaining the same castro rhetoric by manifesting their content for human rights. in relation to bolivia i would like to take this opportunity to denounce their repeated persistent and willful violation of human rights. absolute power and control of weapons is purpose is to carry out illicit -- but also against minister of the supreme court and judges of the constitutional court. and even question against those who defended the dependence. sadlysadly, the demand against e abuses before the commission of human rights are rarely studied and many times not even processed through its process. the revolution have been ever said consolidated before the dictators passing.

in regards to the security, we find ourselves at this point in time with central american and south american countries whose level of security are extremely low, and with populations increase. i am referring specifically to cases such as honduras in el salvador and venezuela. we also cannot gain secure a large part of mexican territory. it has not improved his qualification in security and many in argentina also suffer from a lack of security and poor police protection. despite the peace agreements between the plumbing government and the farc, citizens security in this country cannot be qualified as positive. there is still kidnappings -- not attributable to groups but to common criminality without knowing for certain whether these kinds of -- [inaudible]

concerning criminal organizations the case in mexico is known by a large. organized crime funded by -- has hit mexican society. despite the actions taken by the different governments immersed in the political world, the international community must support executive actions of mexico -- [inaudible] furthermore, it is imperative to reduce the consumption in countries that have high illegal drug imports, particularly united states and the european union. the social and political developing countries are in immediate consequences such as economic stability, labor stability and level of well-being and of the factors that are taken into account when the countries give with judicial security mechanisms. this can be found through a

system of -- that guarantees that only for security of investments, the protection through royalties technical and proficient assistant and general know-how but also by a least a minimum of the existing for the citizens -- daily living and subsistence. free from political stripes or attacks against property or persons. let us to consider the project in specific countries. it's changing as political spectrum. the room have governments of the center-right and colombia is centered in high stable entity. china. china, who became a member of the latin american development bank and the american investment corporation with full support of the united states and the european union among others has increased its economic and its strategic presence in the region.

peru needs special attention because of its investment in infrastructure. 13 railroad projects to boost the countries of development will demand total investment of nearly 27 billion according to the commerce institute for economics. also, they hit their second-highest number in october. however, this favorable economic situation does not allow us -- [inaudible] the inequalities subsist. they are the reason that the peruvian government decided to purchase -- to enhance its forces, disaster response and to confront the stabilizing internal threats. we suppose that the prime contractor -- it would contribute peru's plant of

building a multidimensional -- by 2030. chile and and colombia also have expressed interest in the right. mexico, the protectionism and isolation are growing but it don't think that -- what is been happening in latin america. [inaudible] likewise, and relation to mexico, we will expect a pragmatic position. it is going to be challenging we know the close relationship between mexico and the u.s. come after the nort north american elections we can detect a political and diplomatic proximity between the two countries. whatever happens in latin america affects the regional security. economic prosperity and stability of the united states as well as spain, given its investment in the region. altogether latin american groups

make up more than 40% of united states exports, with the u.s. being the source of 65% of its imports. if the territory of whom -- descendents, 17% of u.s. population. we have been able to assert the army contractual opportunities and colombia, mexico and brazil but there will never be contract work fluidity without the assurance of our greater legal security. european union, the european union has just signed a cooperation agreement with the republic of cuba which substitute the common position adopted in 1996. this includes the removal of the blockade to create a stable framework of political relationships through dialogue,, cooperation and comments with the basis of mutual respect, interest and respect of the

state sovereignty. the relationships will be arranged to sustain the process of modernization of the economy, and cuban society through cooperation and international -- with the aim of stressing human rights, democracy, the fight against discrimination and achieving the objective of sustainable development. there exists an essential growth for respect to human rights. united states, it is to be expected that the initial -- between cuba and the united states continues to advance and allows them to be instrumental for cooperation and the development of series safeguards that will allow for a pacific ac transition in the island as well as ensure that the cuban society be part of the political and multilateral negotiations. it is possible that new forms of populism may appear, and not -- but we must be sure that the only thing that we allow for

such thing with the government and economic revolution is in accordance with the rule of law. the report that eyesight at the beginning of my speech concluded her interview with castro, asking him if he had heard a joke that was popular in the streets of cuba at the time? he said he had not. and asked that she tell it to him. she did. say, what are the times of the revolution? education, sports and health? what are its fault? breakfast, lunch and dinner. castro laughed and said yes, you see what happens when you have too many breakfasts, lunches and dinners. it's bad for your health. [applause] >> thank you very much, fernando, for the very comprehensive, i think, lecture

of the situation now in latin america. the last three speakers as all of us know our lawyers. of course i would have to call now on our fourth colleague, obviously is a lawyer and a professor of law. don, would you like to say something about your college or anything else? >> i'm not going to say anything about my colleagues, many of whom i know personally but i will say something about that he said. once again joan has given us an extra ordinary which the right of speakers -- yonah -- i would say with respect to latin america which i include central america, the caribbean, there's also there's also a numerous variety of conditions and in many ways overwhelming. every country is different with different prospects, often dependent on personalities.

a good leader in peru. other countries have not had such leader but you see the change in argentina and begin the exchange. one thing not mentioned was the fact the growing minority in the united states of lines from different countries of course. you wouldn't confuse acumen with the mexican with a guatemalan but i'm sure that's relevant to how the united states will proceed in the future, at least i hope so. i know the title relates to challenges. we can to think of challenges at the national security level, terrorism, the dells hope for export of revolution which led to -- but i think it was brought on by professor hayes, really the issue that strikes me latin america are the other ones, the human security. i involved with the university for peace which is in costa rica, and daniel we write a conference in as it happens on human security.

i've learned a little about it. what human security means a necessary type such as jenna k probably thinks about but not all military types think about which is within the conditions in the countries. it seems seems clear to me that so much of the difficulties in latin america and elsewhere are the failures of countries to get a grip on themselves. another person that he knew was the general counsel of the world bank who actually persuaded the board, executive board, that governance was relevant to economic development. it's crucial. lawyers know that. we think of legal institutions, the rule of law. including this is a problem of varying degrees in latin countries which makes it difficult for an american who is really quite ignorant of latin america. as a rule we know a bit about cuba. and mexico but it's not too much built in brazil because it's a

bit but then again it doesn't speak spanish. it's different and so forth. i think this is a real problem. richmond international organizations picking mention the european, he proposed an american committee on criminal problems but i think you put your finger in a way and what is the problem. latin america is not europe. there is no organization comparable to the eu, although it's in trouble. its institutions are in trouble. i think this was a real challenge and it's always been a problem. as a professor at supervised papers. if you read the number of regional agreements the land, entered into each other, to countries, three countries, for countries, it's dizzying. most of them come to nothing. even the stronger ones. it'll come to very much at all. they are all spanish speakers except for brazil. tom dewey once referred when he entered his ambassador brazil, and no set of identities the ambassador of our great

spanish-speaking and of the south. but then again he lost the election. finally a word about the incoming administration. undoubtedly donald trump is putting the cat among the pigeons. and you will be interesting to see what kathy selects and now this cat looks at the latin american pigeons. i think we had to wait to see what happens to thank you. >> thank you very much, don. [applause] >> if i may as moderator, begin with one question and then we will turn it to the audience. we always speak about latin america, russia, i think whatever, democracy versus dictatorship, for example. and, obviously, this will

continue not only the question of venezuela, but maybe bolivia and some of the others. but the other issue that was really mentioned in terms of trafficking narcotics on human trafficking in terms of women, this is obviously very bad news. the question is, the way of good news in terms of women, to countries like brazil and places changing now, but before and also argentina and so on. can we address this particular issue when we talk about security, security for whom? in terms of gender and so on. would you like to begin?

>> well, first of all, i'm not sure that the women who have become leaders perhaps with the exception of michelle in chile are exemplary. it is the case, however, that in their very slowly, gradually, more women are running for political office in the legislative branch and so forth. and i think that is very positive. they are certainly most of the university systems, there are a large number of women who are preparing. but there still a barrier as there is in this country. there will be slow progress, but

i think that women's organizations are very, are gradually exerting themselves, particularly in the more developed countries, in the southern cone countries and so forth. not perhaps in central america, bolivia, et cetera, where i think the increasing rights for women is probably a side of higher degrees of development for the latin americans are following that pattern. >> very briefly. i'm not under focus focus on the leadership because the three leaders that you have mentioned are all very unpopular in their own countries. i want to focus now -- yes. i want to focus on the younger generation. i want to focus on those women who are trained in the stem

subjects and who are showing their leadership and forming their own companies, enjoining multinational companies, and are sharing their skill set which will enable them to stand shoulder to shoulder with their male colleagues. that's the future. >> bruce, any comments on that? >> no. >> no, okay. i don't see, i think the statistics are one point, but the reality is of the other. we can see statistics that three leaders in latin american country, women, as became president, but but how many leaders we have in europe also in this country. statistics, talking about men and women, is not the right thing. the right thing is to see if

they have the equal opportunities to go ahead, do become leaderships, to lead universities, to lead the companies. but not because of that, because they are women only. but because the opportunities to achieve these goals. but this is my position. in my family we have long discussions. everybody has work. men and women, you know, we have. but things are coming and we will see a different world in 10 years. >> all right. a little bit of time for discussion. pat murphy. wait for the mic, please. [inaudible] i'm 78. i was born before the beginning of world war ii. after world war ii with lots of

use money, europe rebuild itself. and japan did, too. china has gradually industrialized and is probably a little bit freer than it used to be also. india is finally making moves like that. i've even heard that are parts of africa where the word middle class are developing. but in latin america it seems like the same old mass. you know, -- mess. mexico is developing a slightly bigger middle class than a tad in the past. i also remember reading many years ago of course that argentina was one of the top three or four best off countries in the world until peron came along and i was in the 1930s. it has stabilized at a low level. i can't even say it's national character because spain and portugal are both doing recently well economically in terms of both of them have long since

been a democracy is injured. so what is it about latin america that makes a difference? >> well, i will respond. >> just to finish, part of this is colonization. >> if you see african countries and you let an american countries, of course there is a difference. fortunately, fortunately. but the former vices of the colonies like corruption, like not empowering, inequality, still we have, still we find there. but i don't see the population is responsible for that. they have improved a lot. i visit latin american countries from, frequently from 1996. and i will tell you that the

change is astonishing, it is astonishing. i'm not going to give fears now because i don't have the figures, but it's astonishing. there is a middle class. there is the government. of course sometimes it's an artist. but this is the situation -- and august. everybody is trying to help. international organizations are capable for that but there is countries like i think former french colony that i think is one of the worst, and the worst not colonize by spain or parts of -- or portugal. >> i think some of the countries are doing quite well. chile has a good middle-class, a lot of stability.

even brazil, until the problems recently, was doing very well. and i think brazil is a very good case right now because of the operation. there have been so many prosecutions in brazil, and it continues. i mean, i think things are changing in terms of accountability in the government. they still have a ways to go, but, i mean, i think roadway has done well. i don't think -- er uruguay. spirit i think that petrobras is due, owes many thanks to harvard law school where summative prosecutors trained and took back some of the practices of plea bargaining and other

practices that didn't exist in brazil at the time. i would also, i often have, with students and others that we, north americans, don't appreciate how lucky we were in our founding. and that is that with the traditions of democratic and participatory government came particularly from great britain, but then the influence again by the french revolution and others, those tendencies, those traditions, that history wasn't, it wasn't a part of the founding of latin american states. and so for a very long, they waited a longer time before

grasping the importance of institutions, education and so forth for building a democratic participatory government. i go back to my question that i still often ask, what do you learn in school in brazil, argentina, chile, colombia about how government should perform and so forth? we don't, i've never seen anyone focus on the answer to that question. we need to spend, we need to understand that more. >> you mentioned the law. i think lots of things have been put on lots of things. we are snobs. we are lucky. my wife is an english woman whose father was a judge and law professor. i think we tend to dismiss latin america to quickly because we

were established anglo-saxons and those poor south americans who were established by latins, forget haiti which had a revolution to integers ago by the way. countries based on the magna carta have an advantage of a think there's some truth in that. but i think the relevant point is one touched on by diana and fernanda. it's changing, not just because they all could harvard law school, but the truth is it's changing just as a lawyer i see this and probably bruce sees it. the latins have a system rather like the french were the judges control proceedings, which americans do not like, particularly americans but it's changing. you go to latin america, to chile to mexico. there slowly picking up our approach, the adversarial approach. i feel sorry for them because it will mend -- implement in this discovery, increasingly rich

lawyers but it is happy. diana touched about, i meet lots of young latins and their changing preventative effect i think we can take some credit for. i think america has been a powerful beneficial benefit on many parts of the world. america has been the model for the world. since world war ii, even before since 1776 and people take it seriously. even the latins call us gringos, they come to school there. the truth is the world is changing and one of the things he comes across again and again enter programs which yonah puts together is the abiding to things, the enthusiasm of americans and/or ignorance. and i think we really have to get out of that and see what's happening in these places and hopefully it's happening bu buti think we have to focus on that. >> okay. we'll take a question, one more. >> thank you. i'm with the george washington university and i am

enthusiastically ignorant about traveling the world and learning everything i don't know. i think that's right. certainly you all were tremendously educational and expert and legal matters and governance matters. someday i may ask you different question because you know that so well. one thing latin america, this may influence post-castr post-cn america. one thing latin america and taken with regard to safety, sa, security and well-being, and particularly among just the population season that's different in the world today is they see a pope who is from latin america and that leads me to ask a simple question. what is the role of faith-based organizations? what's the role of faith in hoping for a better latin america, or actually not helping but enabling a better latin america? because that's a big change. >> professor alexander alexanded like to take that one. ron taylor, you raise a very

interesting question and one that is rarely discussed. the traditional ideology, religion of latin american, is catholicism. and it was dominated by a church with a very clear hierarchy, but that has stated. it stated because the abuse of power. i'm a practicing roman catholic so i am talking about my own faith. but the abuse of power by the leadership of the catholic church in terms of its land ownership and abuse of human beings has led a search for alternatives. and the protestant religions are now making steady headway, particularly in central america, because instead of saying it is sin you are doomed to hell, they say you will be redeemed.

god is a loving god, a forgiving god, and i'm bringing health care, hospitals, education, orphanages and old peoples homes to help you. so -- [inaudible] spin thank you for what you're movements are bringing then. so there's a shift away which is accompanied by what we talked about, the growing middle class. a middle class which is not only economically more independent, but psychologically more willing to stand up and say, the old religious ways are no longer necessary for my families enjoyment. and i am therefore prepared to be more independent thinker and that is having its impact also on the political thought. thank you. spirit one footnote there. where the church is having an

influence now, ironically is cuba. because the church was instrumental in intermediate in ththe fall between the u.s. and cuba, the regime now has allowed the church to do a number of things. for instance, there's something called cuba -- which is an organization that tries to help people learn how to view proprietors, because they haven't had that in cuba. and because of the church has been relatively diplomatic, the regime allows these programs to go on here and so they are doing all kinds of training on a very basic level, but they are also doing some outreach programs for the indigenous.

you would think the regime would not like this because they don't want people to say that the state can't do that. but again, there is a lot of people that are in need in cuba. and so they are allowing the church quietly to do some of those programs. i think that's a very interesting development that's ongoing. >> we are going to continue just a short note about the questions that was initially asked about latin america. let's look at some of the contributions of latin america, so the security in the world, the global, you know, interest and so it advances the cause of faith or justice. and now at a time of christmas and christmas spirit, and peace around the world, pope francis

provides the leadership that is so needed at this time when we see all the atrocities around the world and inhumanity of man-to-man. so please their spiritual i think contribution of latin america, which is really extraordinary should be appreciated and recognized. now we will take some more questions. you and next and then we will have concluding remarks. >> a lot of -- what's happening in latin america, and part of the reason is that the media doesn't cover it as much as they cover other regions of the world, conflict or no conflict. it's not always in the headline news. now, do you believe that, what

is your opinion at this point with the advances in technology, particularly internet, facebook, whatever you want to call it, that much of what you were saying he is going to be more exposed, and do you see any influence on it going in any particular direction? >> okay, we are very grateful to you for coming. thank you. okay, so anyone want to -- i'm sorry about this. again, do you want to restate your question one more time? >> just wanted to know with the advanced technological advances, internet and so on, opens up the world more. will it affect any of the

situation in latin america? .. >> giving the information and the best one is the financial times which is a north american newspaper us-based newspaper but i think the well educated class is very much aware of what is going

on and i would say the one thing that is not addressed in the degree to which i believe it ought to be our studies about united states studies,as we do latin american studies in our university , it is hard to find a program in latin american universities that focuses on the history, the politics, the functioning of institutions and the united states and this is something that is sorely lacking but headlines, they know . and they i think are very sorely, programs and classes

that are working on addressing this lack of understanding and founding of us historyand functioning . >> thank you very much, there is time for one more question . the young lady right there. >> thank you, my name is caitlin with the brookings institution and i was curious, it's sort of a loaded question but i want to hear your thoughts on whether or not president-elect trump will back any of the warming toward cuba and if he does, what you would think he would do and what's the bulk of the policy would be ? >> i'm not sure that he knows yet. we don't know. >> a couple of comments that have said that unless cuba gives a better deal, then

he's going to changethings . but other than that, nothing's been said and we don't even have yet a secretary of state for assistant secretary of state for inter-american affairs so we really don't know . [inaudible] i would say that the us just as i mentioned, in terms of latin american policy has had a much better reception from a number of governments because no longer does the us have to confront the fact that it's isolating cuba. in addition, a lot of the organizations that have grown up to as an alternative to the oas like alba have been as a result of you know, the

policy of cuba and the relationship between cuba, nicaragua, venezuela, libya and with normalization, that will no longer be as much of a threat. in addition, i think probably the biggest thing is mister trump is a businessman. and increasingly in this country, whether it's the agriculture group in the midwest or the tourist industry, americans want to do business with cuba and so also, there's no longer the big political majority in florida that's anti-cuba and it's pretty much split. so there's no longer a political advantage which

used to also drive a lot of us policy towards cuba so i would say that normalization has a lot of advantages and even though mister trump doesn't like a lot of the lyrical, economic, human rights policies and cuba they will probably improve with normalization because that will take the pressure off of either the current or, there will be a new regime in 2018. >> once again, we're going to wrap it up and were already over time so well done, you all . i want to on behalf of the potomac institute and all of us, i want to thank this panel. you've just been great and we hope to get you back soon.

were going to talk about latin america some more area i'm the eternal optimist, of course and i want to say that i've been in all of the latin american countries and spent considerable time in a number of them and in a number of different capacities but the latin american people are good people. some aren't, just like in this country. and we need to remember that and a number of the latin american countries stuck with us in world war ii, like brazil and the like. i had the dubious distinction some years ago, just before the falklands war, down in camp lejeune, my division trained both the argentinian marines and the royal marines for england. so we had a big bet going on as to who was going to win.

there was some comments, some reference to the military side. don't underestimate the military side and the military relationships . these relationships are long-standing. there are many, many, many young officers from latin america who have trained in army schools and needy schools and the like and the relationships are what you would expect. it's not just all military. it's a personal, personal people to people kind of thing and even in the case of the marine corps, all latin american countries have marine corps and the like. with the exception of cuba and the relationships there, you just can't explain it. there therefore ever and so these, these kind of, the thinking that goes into this is much more than just military and the like and so we have a great opportunity to make things better.

i think in terms of policy and the light and with the new administration, he's picking people who understand what's going on. he's picking people who are very knowledgeable about latin america for example and the kind of challenges they face and so on. and so we need to be optimistic here. we need to go forward and we need to understand that it's a little bit of a different culture and maybe the american people would be wise and learning about other cultures and other regions and other thought processes and the like and the treatment of women is a good example. that's gotten much, much better. 20 years ago when i was still in active duty and a commandant, i never sent women marines on security duty in latin america or in

the mideast. simply because the people there treat our women the way they should be. and if you want to get in trouble with me, mistreat our girls and others with dignity so that's changing over time. >> when the argentine army began to take troops and women into the arm, one of the generals commented that the thing to note is that the women are infinitely more qualified and prepared than the men because of course, this was a new opportunity for leadership for those women who had not had opportunities to have the education and so forth for leadership. >> we wouldn't be as prepared as we are today if we didn't

have women make the contributions but when you talk about women doing like an interim or something like that, that's when i draw the line but we will talk about that another time. the point i want to make is that the young people, the young people are helping to change things. that's going on in this country and it's going on all over the world so again, i think we have great opportunities here but our policy has to be consistent. our policies toward latin america have not been consistent in the 50 years or so thati've been fooling around with it . with that, thank you very much and you have a great holiday season and certainly a super new year and come back. >> you very much. [inaudible conversation] >> on c-span2 a senate

hearing on the renewable fuel standard and then we show you a conference from new york university law school about the us political system and we hear about the viability of third parties, remarks from vice president joe biden and we will show you a conversation on campaign finance reform area this week on c-span, former vice president dick cheney and leon panetta on the future of the defense department under president-elect donald trump. >> i think the challenges are very great. we have unfortunately over the course of the last many years done serious damage to our capabilities to be able to meet those threats. >> we are living in that. where there are a lot of flashpoints and the new administration is going to have to look at that kind of world and obviously defined policies that we need in order to deal with that but then develop the defense

policy to confront that kind of world thursday at 8 pm eastern a look at the career of mike pence. >> among the shifting sands of contemporary culture and law we have stood without apology for the sanctity of life, the importance of marriage and the freedom of religion. [applause] >> on friday night beginning at eight, carol maltby pays tribute to outgoing senators including harry reid, barbara boxer, kelly ayotte and dan coats. this weekend prime time on c-span. >> a now in preparation for the inauguration of the west front of the us capitol where donald trump will take the oval office to become the nation's 45th president. on january 20 atnoon eastern. the vice president also takes his oath of office, that will happen before the president . >>.

[music] the presidential inauguration of donald trump's friday, january 20. c-span will have live coverage of all the days events and ceremonies. watch live on c-span and c-span.org and listen live on the free c-span radio .

>> join us on tuesday, january 3 for live coverage of the opening day of the new congress. watch the official swearing-in of the new and reelected members of the house and senate and the election of the speaker of the house. our all day live coverage of the days events from capitol hill begins at 7 am eastern on c-span and c-span.org or listen to it on the free c-span radio app. >> senate homeland security and governmental affairs subcommittee recently held a hearing on the renewable fuel standard program which is designed to reduce greenhouse gas emissions. >> good afternoon everyone, i want to welcome everyone to today's subcommittee hearing regarding the renewable fuel standards . thanks for being here.

today the subcommittees second hearing on the renewable fuel standard and my fourth hearing total on this topic has been elected to congress. the oversight until we found a solution to what is done as a deeply flawed program. 2005, congress established the goals of reducing our nation's dependence on foreign oil and lowering greenhouse gas emissions and mandating fuels with domestic transportation fuels and increasing volumes until year 2022. after that time the environmental protection agency will have wide latitude on biofuels and the gas pipeline. however, the situation has changed dramatically. in 2005 and subsequently 2010 revision. the transportation sector is lower than originally predicted and in heightened fuel economy standards, these economic roads. further giving the

substantially increased production resulting from the shale oil boom, the us imports much less oil than initiallyforecasted. in 2005 and 2007 , we were importing 60 percent of our oil, now it's 27 percent. for a series of hearings that work to determine the structure to achieve its goals, specifically i tried to understand the arguments through the eyes of the epa and appreciate how difficult it is for the agency to administer the program. congress created the unworkable formula. the epa is left trying to make it work anyway. the epa is required to release the final volumes of biofuel by november 30 of the preceding year, to allow industry participants and stakeholders to comply in the plan for the future. between 2009 and 2015, epa failed to meet this deadline and only finally released mandates for 2014 in 2016 on november 2015. one year late for the 2015 volumes and two years late for the 2014 final volumes. i'd like to recognize the epa has released the 2017 volumes on november 23, meeting the

statutory deadline. we are making up ground. recognizing difficulties the epa faces with the rfs, on 2015 i asked dao to examine the viability of the rfs to determine whether the program will meet its goals in the future. making the gao approximately 19 months to conduct an analysis of the rfs and finalize its conclusions. in order to reaches conclusions, gao in coordination with the national academy of sciences convened stakeholder experts from industry, nonprofit sectors to produce two reports on the rfs, both of which were released monday 2016. the gao's first report determined biofuel production is unlikely to meet the rfs's increasing production targets. gao noted that advanced biofuels are still too

expensive for stakeholders to produce necessary levels to meet the rfs target through 2022. even with government-funded r&d and mandated subsidies. despite government spending at $1.1 billion, and fiscal years 2013 and 2015, advanced biofuel research and development, gao determined that the targets are unattainable. the second report concluded the rfs is unlikely to meet its goal of reducing greenhousegas emission. production of biofuels which should reduce emissions will remain too limited to meet the programs greenhouse gas reduction targets. for example, 2015 , the loss in biofuel and advanced categories was produced at a meager 142 million gallons. less than five percent of the statutory target of 3 million gallons. the hearing will give gao the opportunity for to present his findings in these reports

and the epa to comment on the findings. with the release of the gao reports, we have an independent governor honors finding that confirmed congress including myself have come to hold that the rfs is not sustainable and will not meet its goals. the program wields few benefits that inflict substantial costs on consumers, rather than continuing with an unwieldy program which fails to meet its targets and goals, it's now for congress in the next administration and the american public to do away with the rfs. here's my comparison. last year, congress looked again at administrations. 15 years ago we created no child left behind in a very eager effort to do what is best for our kids. there was a whole series of mandates that were put in place with no child left behind. 15 years later, congress looked at it again and said those mandates were the wrong way to go and we fixed it. we came back and wide bipartisan majorities after research and examination and said it's time that we do

away with these mandates and do education in a different way.it's not that we don't like education, we do. we just went in a wrong direction with no child left behind. it's a good octane booster. in the fuel supply right now, not that i meet anyoneas opposed to ethanol. a series of mandates were put in place and volume requirements that are not important . in light of the epa and the gao requirements here to witness it, to engage in productive conversation on rfs. i look forward to considering oversight of the rfs with our witnesses today.we recognize ranking member heidi heitkamp for her opening statement, she's running a little behind but as we always say, a lady is never late so when she gets hurt here, i will allow her to do her opening statements. withthat, let me swear in our witnesses . if you would please stand.

use where the testimony you are about to give before the subcommittee will be the whole truth and nothing but the truth, so help you god? let the record reflect the witnesses may be seated. let me do a quick introduction for both of you and then when senator heitkamp arrives i will have her do an opening statement as well. frank rusco for the government accountability office, leaving work on a broad spectrum of energy issues, mister roscoe holds a masters degree in economics from the university of washington and seattle. jenna mccabe is the acting and mistreat of the via environmental protection agency, having previously served in the oa ours principal deputy to the assistant administrator. mister mccain was the executive director of improving kids environments incorporated in indianapolis and from 1993 to 2005 leadership positions in the management office of air quality. mister mccain served as attorney general in

massachusetts, graduated from harvard in 1980 and harvard law school in 1983. thank you both for being here and i would recognize the ranking member for opening statements. >> thank you mister chairman and my great apologies for being a little late, it's been a crazy day. first off i want to thank both are women's for attending the hearing, this follows on our hearing of last june on the rfs and in that hearing we discussed pathways, issues we saw with the epa management program and the staff and i'm glad epa took our words to heart and just last week the rfs is back on track and hit levels required by law for calendar year 2017 for most fields and even increase the volume for a biofuel and advanced biofuel so thank you miss mccain for your good work on that and we are grateful, we wish it would have come a little earlier but we will take it you can get it. of course, epa didn't meet

the statutory levels for some advanced biofuels, allegedly because of lack of production and we want to hear more about that and that really is what generated this discussion today. senator and i noted last june that setting up the program and setting annual volumes and obligations did lead to stall investments in advanced biofuels so had we had more certainty in the marketplace, we could have actually i think seen the kind of investment it would havetaken to get that product into the market . so the reports we are reading today note don't necessarily come as a surprise. gao found we won't meet some of the targets for biofuels on greenhouse gas were greenhouse gas reduction, two measures which arguably and do go hand-in-hand area again, this isn'tsurprising or even knew as we acknowledged at last year's hearing . it was part of the disruption that we saw in the marketplace as a result of

uncertainty from earlier decisions. fortunately, the authors of the rfs made contingency plans if the epa found the industry wasn't able to meet these targets and allowed the epa to reduce those obligations. this is why having annual rules is helpful although it also brings a level of uncertainty. we can't of course, we can adjust course when it's necessary. the office put in place authorities for epa to rewrite the statutory levels through reset authority and i look forward to discussing that here today. with both of our witnesses so i look forward to hearing from the witnesses and discussing how we can work together with the industry and administration and certainly note that president-elect trump supports the rfs and we all know how important that is to market and to certainty for our farmers so we are grateful you are both here, this will be an ongoing and continuing objects of discussion but if you are going to be for all of the

above, this is a key component to an energypolicy that helps us diversify our energy sources moving into the future . congress was wise when they first enacted it, providing incentives. i want to see that consensus work so thank you miss mccabe, thank you mister rusco for being here and i look forward to your testimony. >> mister rusco you are recognized. >> thank you. chairman james lankford and members of the subcommittee, i am pleased to be here today to discuss the renewable fuel standard program. in response to our request from chairman lankford we entered two studies on the rfs. one study reported on federal efforts to support r and d for advanced biofuels and the current state of technology as well as prospects for meeting the rfs category targets for biofuel

production. the second strategy reported on epa's administration of the program and how that administration could be improved as well as it the prospects for meeting the rfs goals for reducing greenhouse gas emissions among other things area to do these studies we entered into a contract with the national academy of sciences to identify a broad and comprehensive group of extra experts to assist us in answering a question. last spring we held a group meeting at the academy with 20 of these experts and explored the state of technology and prospects for meeting production targets for advanced biofuels and also met individually with 24 experts identified by the academy to evaluate the administration of the program . in addition we focused officials from doe, usda, the epa, nfs and department of defense. we visited research laboratories in iowa,

illinois and wisconsin, interviewed representatives from 11 advanced biofuels producers that use a wide variety of conversion technology. finally, we reviewed numerous buddies and reports pursuant to our questions. the most salient finding of our report is that it is unlikely that advanced biofuels and meet statutory targets for the rfs in the near to midterm. cynically, production of advanced biofuels fell below category targets by well over 1 billion gallons in 2014 and it's expected to be all $5 billion short by 2017. while there are growth of advanced biofuels, the fuel that have already been commercialized, we found broad expert consensus that growth potential in the near to midterm falls short of rfs statutory targets. the second major finding is that changes to law or epa administration could mark markedly improve the program and the investment climate toward advanced biofuels.

experts say changing obligated parties to vendors as well as well providers would improve the functioning of the green market, reduce fraud and eliminate in asymmetric reliance on small independent refineries . in addition, providing federal tax credits that do not require periodically would reduce uncertainty. however there remains significant barriers to adding more biofuel to the transportation camera. these include the need to install retail stations, educate consumers about how to value different blends of biofuels and addressing the risk that increased advanced biofuels use as mandated will lead to higher consumer fuel prices. these barriers if not overcome will constrain growth and biofuel use and dampen investors appetite for risk area the third major finding is that because advanced biofuels production targets are unlikely to be met, so too are the goals set out for the rfs including greenhouse gas reduction.

specifically experts question the extent to which the rfs is achieving its goal of reducing greenhouse gas emission considering most of the biofuels produced today come from starch conversion technologies which do not yield large production in greenhouse gases. with respect to reducing reliance on imported fuels, the united states has made progress in recent years to reducing the influx of petroleum in large part because domestic oil production has increased dramatically. biofuel production of imported fuels have also helped but to a much smaller degree and further progress would require development of cross competitive advancement on fuels. lastly, experts generally agree that meeting goals the rfs be done more efficiently with policy and in particular a carbon tax for a low carbon fuel standard would more directly affect greenhouse gas production in the rfs and at lower cost. we do not make recommendations in these two reports because there is no

consensus among experts on how to proceed with the policy in general. i will be happy to answer any questions thank you. okay. >> thank you chairman lankford and other members. i also appreciate the opportunity to be here and testify on the renewable fuel standard program and on the epa approval of the standards for 2015 and the biomass volume requirements in 2018. the rfs program began in 2006 and was subsequently modified by the energy and security attack of 2007. about loss goals include moving the unitedstates greater energy dependence and security and increasing production of clean, renewable fuels . plus a new annual volume target for fuels that included every year to reach a total of 37 million gallons by 2022 including 21 billion

gallons of advanced goals. congress included tools known as flavor provisions for epa used to adjust the target as specified, including where the statutorily prescribed volume could not be met. the clean air act requires epa issue annual extenders do fordifferent categories and renewable fuels . advanced, biomass and cellulose. these standards designate the percentage of biofuel categories that producers and supporters of gasoline and diesel must blend into transportation fuel and must be issued by november 30 of each year for the following year and 14 months in advance for biomass targets. the epa is committed to implementation of the rfs program and one of our key priorities has been timely issuance of the annual volume controls and we have stayed on schedule for this rule at the german acknowledged and we just finalized that last week. the final rule incorporates

the most up-to-date data available and is informed by the comments for input provided during the city, and by our consultations with the department of energy and agriculture. the 2017 volume final rule established advanced and told renewable fuel for 2017 and includes biomass of legal volume for 2018. the 2017 final rule once again establishes sufficient but achievable targets for the rfs program. it becomes part of what is now the multitier tracking system. as finalized, total renewable fuel volumes would go by nearly 1 point 2 billion gallons in 2017. advanced renewable fuel which requires a minimum 50 percent lifecycle greenhouse gas emission reduction would grow by nearly 700 million gallons in 2017 and while congress did not establish the new goals for non-advanced

biofuels, the established target for total and advanced fuel means conventional biofuels would reach $15 billion. 2017 final rule achieve that level. biomass which must achieve 50 percent lifecycle emissions reduction would grow by at least 100 million gallons from 2017, 2018 and the final standard is more than double the congressionally mandated minimum level of funding. finally, cellular city. there are 60 percent lifecycle carbon emissions production would grow by 81 million gallons or 35 percent between 2016 and 2017. the other volume rule, the agency and acted multiple other areas of the program and on november 16 we could publish the renewable enhancement and growth proportion of those rules. a collection of proposed revisions to the fuel regulations that will support market growth and advanced

and other biofuels in the us. that proposal among other things would establish an updated regulatory action that allowed biofuel producers to partially process renewable feedstocks at one facility and further processed them into renewable fuels at another facility under existing pathways. this would improve the economics and efficiency for the production of biofuels, particularly advanced and cellulose fuels. the proposal strongly reflects industry stakeholders in recent years and we are looking forward to people comments in january. the second thing to mention is that over the past year, epa has received petitions from stakeholders asking us to change the point of the station under the program it's been mentioned. currently refiners and importers of gasoline are the regulated parties and certain stakeholders have asked us to initiaterulemaking changes to that point of regulation for points further downstream . and since we do not have input from a ride range of stakeholders and on november

10 of this year we issued uppermost denial of these petitions that extends the issue in depth and importantly provides an opportunity to the public to provide comment to the agency what was a strong request as well so we are again looking forward to people's interest on the. just recently the gao issued these two reports.we provided responses to those reports and we appreciate that opportunity and those comments are included as part of the final report. broadly speaking, the report examined the same challenges we recognize and talked about before associated with reaching greater levels of advanced biofuel production, especially for the last fuel and we welcome the discussion in the report and certainly the discussion here so we recognize that our opportunities and challenges ahead. we are committed to implementing congresses that

way we can to reach the goal and we look forward to that conversation today and i appreciate the opportunity. >> thank you. we are deferring our questions to the end, we recognize that the senator. >> thank you mister chair and thank you to both of you for appearing today. this is an interesting topic for a number of us and especially for me coming from the midwest where this is a great part of our economy so again, i always appreciate the opportunity for the rfs and it has spurred investment in domestic energy production, help grow our economy through the midwest especially and in those rural areas and it's brought a lot of competition, needed competition to the gas pump and saves american consumers money and reduces reliance on foreign oil so the aggressive targets for advanced biofuels originally envisioned by

congress haven't been achieved and i think we all recognize that. it is certainly not time to hit the panic button and pull the rug out other this burgeoning industry. we are really just getting started is how i feel about this. so mister rusco, one of the reports that the gao had states that both on cellulose technology at existing plants is the most cost effective means for generating those advanced biofuels. i did visit one of those facilities, one of the full-time facilities in iowa earlier this year and they are using corn fiber which is a byproduct of the ethanol process to create cellulosic ethanol and this is a great example of what this was originally intended to do.

it was to support the expansion of conventional biofuel as a springboard for those advanced biofuels and if we create further uncertainty about the future of the rfs and our commitment to biofuel, it will only serve to slow our research and investments towards attaining these goals originally set by congress so my question to you would be, what are the most effective things we can do at the federal government to provide certainty so that these companies who want to invest in the advanced biofuel production process? what can we do to provide certainty? >> we did hear from a number of people that certainly certainty about the availability of federal tax credits, the one dollar tax

credits, we also heard from a lot of the producers that they really relied on federal funding for rfp, there really isn't available investment funding for the private sector that's sufficient to do a lot of the research they need. but we also heard that even with those changes, there are many many years away from bringing even the technology that they understand very well like cellulosic ethanol into what are currently a couple of commercial plans, they are many years away from bringing costs down to where they are competitive in a market sense. >> thank you. and miss mccabe, i want to first applaud as the vice chair did for the epa getting

the rfs back on track. we appreciate that and that was the final .17 and you can can you highlight the factors that led to the agency increasing the blending targets from the proposed levels to the final rule? >> yes, so the major fact that we look at and we updated through the year is expected gasoline usage and so there were, we rely on eia for their estimates on that and there was predicted that there would be additional gasoline usage in 2017 which allowed us to grow those volumes and we just continually update our expectations about the ability of the industry to produce volume and so when we put all that together, that's the way the numbers fell out that we were able to increase those volumes. >> very good,we appreciate that very much . we do have some challenges in the industry but again, i think providing certainty

going back is an important part of ensuring that we can stay on target with the production of ethanol and biofuel, advanced biofuels and we have seen other concessions made within the federal government, other tax credits for other petroleum-based products. we see it with fracking, i don't see why we should continue with research and development in this area, especially when it has done a great deal to support the economy and especially when we have this downturn in the agriculture which we seen in the last number of years so i encourage you to continue supporting the rfs. let's look at ways weakens further research and development in this industry. i think it is a soluble part of our american economy but i want to thank you both for

being here today and answering our questions, thank you. >> senator heitkamp. >> thank you mister chairman. before i begin my questions i want to ask that the letter that i'm going to hand to you is consistent to the record. it is signed by a number of groups who frequently don't sign their names on the same letter. they are expressing their unified position in opposition of efforts by petitioners to move the point of obligation in compliance area you've got api and the rfa on the same letter, that's pretty remarkable. that speaks volumes in terms of answering the petition, obviously we hope you get full consideration but these interest groups have been long involved and for them to share a common opinion might put a little more weight on what they are doing or what they are suggesting so i think we are all trying to get a handle on how we don't have this happen again.

where the market is unresponsive or is in a position of uncertainty given the lack of certainty on where we are headed in terms of numbers and so in order to prevent that from happening again, i think we have to better understand why the market didn't respond and come to numbers that were adequate to meet the quotas or meet the levels. so i guess my first question would be for you, mister russell. in your opinion, what was the most significant contributor to the delay in advanced biofuels solution? was it delay in setting up the rfs program initially, uncertainty related to the rfl, uncertainty for the litigation with what i believe was flawed reading of the statutory waivers or was it more about tax uncertainty or was it something altogether and in your

opinion, in the work that you did do you believe that had we had maintained a level of statutory certainty or certainty in meeting those statutory requirements, we would have seen the level of investment that would have been able to meet the standard? >> i think that it's pretty clear from most of the people we spoke with including producers of advanced biofuels and inspection researchers and from that area that the biggest issue is the price of oil. so the price of oil is very high and there's going to be more investment in alternatives to that and when the price was high a number of years ago, the well companies were divisive fine and investing in biofuel technology but when the bottom fell out of the market for oil and also with reductions in slower growth

since then, motor fuel demand in the united states, investors just looked at biofuels as not viable as other things so money flowed elsewhere. i do think that in the margin , things like uncertain regulatory uncertainty and uncertainty about tax credits do play a role but what we found is that for example, ethanol which is probably the most likely advanced biofuel to be technologically and commercially ready in the near to midterm, it will require multiple generations of plants to achieve the kind of efficiency that might bring it down to where it commercially is viable. but that also then again, on the underlying price of motor

fuels, so that is the biggest . >> i understand what you are saying that the lower price competitor can drive investment someplace else and cost people a lot of concern but so can regulatory uncertainty. and i think when we look at advanced, just not to put a fine point on it but this is a building block industry. as you look at other potential available both advanced manufacturing for a product. so i used to say we want to move beyond food, fiber and fuel and the pushback i always got is that is this technology that can be developed and the plans that can be developed provide the building block for other opportunities whether it's styrofoam or whether it's a comp reserve, all of that again is at this level of