places like the fbi or the air force i don't think they are going to want me around. i think my voice is malleable on my own and i have an obligation but they continued to push and i was there with open arms and it was an eye-opener for me. in all different places in the intelligence communities that were speaking out strongly against these practices and i remember sitting down with the lieutenant general from the agency being incredibly intimidated knowing what i had done and sitting here at the dinner table. he was gracious enough to spend an hour or two speaking with me as a friend and showed the kind of affection and support for what i'd done and no combination, there were questions about how this

happened and i was part of the group and i was reintroduced. it allowed me to recognize a lot of people feel very strongly about this. >> host: senator mccain said it best it's not about who they are committed to the er. and one of the narratives. not only does this have in the incalculable impact on the custody is that wercostof theseo suffer psychologically. also, what does it mean for the soldiers and others that are

working with the government when we ask our own to do this to engage in torture. what effect will that have on our friends and family who come back from war. i do want to ask, this may not be the most comfortable subject but i'm curious what you think about this if you had the chance to talk about the detainees that you interacted with the proposed that were subjected to these forms of abuse, what would you say to them? >> guest: it is incredibly important and difficult question and i think i process that often and come up with different answers and maybe the best one is it would be obscene to make any suggestion as to what i would want to come out of that meeting or how i would approach it if something like that ever were to happen and i were in any

other way just quiet and open it would essentially be another violation. i'm not suggesting it would want it to him but there have been moments where similar types have been taken place but i don't know that any of us have reached that point yet. to suggest that agenda in this kind of meeting. meeting. >> what did you think about the politicians that should return to waterboarding and what you think of the interrogation into the argument for the enhanced interrogation isis and the other

groups that wouldn't hesitate to chop off heads and tying our hands in the ability to respond if we don't resort to these tactics it is a very prominent theme even a presidential campaign that i think even among that portion how would you respond? >> guest: it's been played over and over about waterboarding. but i also kind of empathize with it because i had been there and they knew they came from a place of fear and what we could have used then is the voice that simply doesn't matter. i have an eight year old son as he comes home from school with a bad grade or bath report not behaving well and says it doesn't matter, everyone failed or if he comes home with that behavior, kids were doing worse

than me. i was just talking during class. i wouldn't say to him that's fine and continue on. no, again i say i don't care what your classmates are doing. i care about the way that you are representing yourself and the way that you are interacting with the world in the way that you are performing and that is all that mattered if these are the same values instilled in me. if that is the only standard that we have, as long as we are not then and not doing this.

one of the images that still sticks with me are the thousands of iraqis surrendering. they would be treated by their own units in the idea that you ran to the country for safety and that is the message that we should send. we will be treated humanely and if you want to cooperate whether we do or not i don't think that matters in terms of the discussion of torture. the high-level military leaders have always been opposed to this but even in the bush administration come if you will

in the military and the dod it had really been those leaders in the militarand the military than pushing this. my hope is that as the conversation continues your post heart transplant now. it's your conversation and narrative. >> guest: i'm absolutely someone who still feels obligated to talk about these things.

a heart transplant recipient tend to think pretty short term. i still feel obligated. later in the week. the book doesn't end the chapter for me and i've now moved on. it identifies me as someone who is in a kind of careful moving forward and listening to the right voices and the surrounding myself from the right people i'm capable of falling into these things again. we have john brennan the

director of the cia saying they will not waterboarding, but we can't walk away from this suggesting that isn't who we are anymore. it is who we are. it happened as a country and as a nation and we need to address it. ..

we'll discuss how democrats and advocates of the affordable care act of preparing for the promised repeal and replace effort by congressional republicans in the trump administration. then joseph, american enterprise institution talks about the expected repeal and replace efforts by republicans when the new congress begins in with repeals could look like. what it means for healthcare in the united states. watch c-span's washington

journal, live at 7:00 a.m. eastern on five friday morning. join the discussion. >> this holiday we cannot see spend two's book to become saturday night at ten eastern on afterwards, afterwards, wall street journal editor joann work looks at top leaders in corporate america. at 11, cnn contributors talk about thomas lake's book, unprecedented. the election that changed everything and a look back at the 2016 presidential campaign. campaign. >> sunday afternoon after five, professor blanche cook talks about the final volume to her eleanor roosevelt series. at 10:00 p.m. eastern, the author on the death of the steel industry and its effect on a working-class town seen through the ends of high school football, in his book playing through the whistle. for the complete complete schedule go to