and he, of course, knows all things, feels all things, is compassionate be beyond human belief. and the entire book runs through him, through his brilliance, through his -- so that's what the new book's basically about. [laughter] >> and that was author pat conroy from 2015 talking about his writing process and a few idiosin rah says about the south as well. he died march 4th, 2016. this is booktv's live coverage of the savannah be book festival, now in its tenth year. we've got several more authors coming up and several more call-in opportunities as well. up next, you're going to hear from the former editor of rolling stone and esquire and sport illustrated, terry mcdonnell, who has written a book called "the accidental life." after that, former cia agent william doherty, in the shadow

of the ayatollah, is the name of his book. he was in the cia and in iran in 1979 when the militants took over our embassy. after that fox business news anchor jerry willis will be talking about her book, "rich is not a four-letter word." you'll have a chance to talk with her after that as well. and finally, dan slater, who is a professor at the university of chicago and has written a book about drug trafficking, "wolf boys," it is called. that's all coming up this afternoon from savannah. now, if you are a social media maven and enjoy seeing behind-the-scenes photos and videos, you can follow us on our social media sites including facebook, facebook.com/booktv, @booktv is our twitter handle, and you can also follow us on instagram to see some photos from savannah that we've been taking.

so in about ten minutes, you'll hear from author terry mcdonnell and "the accidental life." booktv's live coverage from savannah continues. [inaudible conversations] >> put the book, i would put more of in the book is a much more explicit argument about just how bad things can get if we don't have that international order which i believe absolutely requires american military strength. and i think it could get very, very bad. so we may say these are all original conflicts, sort of

implying you can pull back from one and it doesn't have a bearing on the other, i don't think that's the case. we do live in a globalized world, these things are all interconnected. and if we were to pull back from that, i think the consequences would be felt not just in the region, but more globally. i don't know if -- >> well, whether you look through the lens that elliott just described that we created after 1945 with the help of other countries and some international institutions or even if you're looking at it from the point of view of america first, more jobs for americans, you know, our prosperity has rested historically on freedom of access to the global commons and particularly freedom of the seas which we have advocated since our birth as a nation. and what china is doing is, essentially, chipping away at that principle. and so, yes, it goes to the strength of oural allies -- of our allies, but it goes to something even more fundamental

which is the underpinning of the entire system on which the free flow of global commerce and international trade and the prosperity of much of the world depends. and it's for that reason, i think, we, you know, that's why we care about the south china sea or the east china sea. and the challenge that we face. this goes to hal's point of the changing regional balances, is that some of the rising regional powers or in some cases declining regional powers that are exerting themselves to more completely dominate their own regions have found that they can, if they can take certain actions that fall below the threshold that would normally elicit a military response from us, they can through a series of salami slices begin to chip away at the foundations of this order. and so, you know, we're faced with a very challenging, you know, question, you know?

as china militarizes these land reclamation projects, these sandbars that they're building, starts to put airstrips on them, at what point do you respond? when they put hq-9 anti-aircraft missiles on the first time, do you take them out then? maybe not. that would seem like a small step that warrant a massive u.s. military response that would put us in a conflict with china. so maybe you wait until they've done it on two islands. is that enough? what about three? what about ten? what about a hundred? what about when you wake up one day and find out that they've created an air defense information zone over the area, and you can no longer three over it? -- fly over it? this is the challenge that we face, and it's not just in the south china sea, it's elsewhere as well. >> and i'm not sure what pulling back actually means in the geographic context of the western pacific where the united states has territory, american citizens who are represented in congress in the wen pacific.

in the western pacific. so pulling all the way back to, you know, u.s. territory means pulling all the way back to guam. so that's not really -- seems to me that's never been a really realistic geopolitical option. how -- and we'll go to last -- >> just two brief points. i think we need to rediscover our imagination of the tragic in terms of thinking about what a real breakdown of international order can look like, because we've been blessed to have this order for the past 70 years. i think it's hard for people today to understand what can happen when things really go wrong. the second point is that i echo everything that's been said about the importance of the south china sea. i would simply add i think for any administration whether that was the obama administration in '15 and '16 or the trump administration today, it's important to really have a firm idea of what you're trying to accomplish in the south china sea and when you are willing to

use the level of coercion that is necessary to bring that about. so i'm all for taking a harder line with china. if you take the comment that rex tillerson made in his confirmation hearing that we are going to deny china access to the artificial islands that it's built, okay, what is the level of coercion that is necessary to bring that about, and are you willing to sign onto that? if the answer is yes, okay, as long as you understand the consequences of that. if the answer is no, then that's a dumb thing to say, because it's going to make you look weak and foolish. >> you can watch this and other programs online at booktv.org. >> you know, i had a lot of people die in my hands while i was over there. i almost died a lot of times, and i think what really messed me up the most was seeing people lie to get awards. i could fight wars and almost die and have people die in my hands, you know, it's fine, but just seeing a soul fall apart in front of you as somebody's just trying to lie and just do

anything for an award, you know? napoleon said a man will fight long and hard for a bit of colored ribbon. and just seeing that in action where people are lying and fighting for a bit of colored ribbon, you know, it just breaks your heart, breaks you inside just to see that time and time again. and, yeah, and just coming home, one of the reasons i wrote this book was i talk about in here, and i was on a date with this girl, and she starts talking about this newspaper article she had read in one of these local newspapers, hometown herald piece. it was about this guy that just came back from iraq and what a hero he is, how he's the epitome of an american soldier, he's just this perfect g.i., and she's telling me about that story, and i'm like, i enjoy a good war story, what's the guy's name? not only was he a hero, he's one of the biggest dirtbags in the entire unit. i call up a buddy of mine, and i said this is what they're saying about lolllydash.

and the first thing he says is let's go burn this guy's house down. [laughter] there was just this aspect of people come home, and there's a lot of real heros in the military, a lot of great guys, but there's also guys that chase ribbons, fight for a bit of colored ribbon, and it happens. >> yeah. >> the instance he's talking about in iraq, me and a few buddies were nominated for awards, and we didn't want to stand up there and look like idiots. just like in high school where you have to stand up there and get your participation trophy. and on the other side, you've got people that were petitioning to change military regulations so that they can get an award because something happened they didn't qualify for it. everyone wanted a combat action badge, and that's what everyone wanted to lie about. and, you know, an ordnance exploded far away from people but it was unexploded because the terrorists took out all the gun powder.

so it didn't explode, they just basically were shooting a rock at us. but these guys, they thought they would have qualified for an award but not really, so they're trying to change army regulations just so they can get this award. and then later on at the end, this guy wanted me to lie so he could get an an award, and i'm like, dude, i don't even like you. [laughter] i might think about it if i liked you, but i don't even like you, you know? it's just this bad aspect, and it tears out your heart. when you fight for these things, you think you're fighting for something, and you've got these guys wearing the same uniform as you that are just fighting for that ribbon. >> i mentioned that passage where you're talking to the vietnam vet, and he's saying, you know, i'd rather have somebody spit on me than shake my hand. you talk, and elsewhere there's a book called thank you for your service. talk about the resentment of veterans and yourself about, you know, a kind of fawning

attitude, a sort of shall he curiosity that doesn't want to hear about the nonheroes and that kind of stuff. i wonder how should we, let's say you see a soldier in uniform at the airport. do you say thank you? do you just let him be? or at the bar with a friend who served, how, how do you -- how would you recommend for those of us who are civilians for life to talk to you, approach you, attitudes as friends, strangers? >> yeah, yeah. so, i i mean, i'll tell you two quick stories. one story was after the publication of my first book, you know, i met thousands of vets at things just like this. and i remember talking to a lot of vietnam vets, and they would say, oh, thank you for your service, and i would say, you know, thank you for your service. and this must have happened to me at least a dozen times.

vietnam vets said no one's ever said that to me before. oh, jeez, you know? i can understand not supporting the war, the vietnam war was what it is, the iraq war is what it is. so i i can understand people had that sensation, but to go for 50 years and people not even recognize that you were willing to give up your life, you went over and did this, now it's 2000 and whatever and i'm the first person to say that to a dozen people. i think the other end of this is to go back to one of those dating classes. it was a really good one where you work on those inner games. i remember this one scene during one of these exercises there was this big guy, masculine guy, and we're doing this, like, internal meditation exercise and this really big guy, masculine guy, he had this, like, breakthrough, right? he just realized something about himself, something about life, and he starts crying, right? he's having just one of those cathartic cries, that full-body cry.

he just realized something about his life, and he's having this perfect breakthrough. and right in the middle of his crying, cathartic moment, one of the other guys walks up to him and says, oh, awesome breakthrough, high-five, dude. and he's right in the middle of this cry. and the guy's like, oh, high-five be, dude. [laughter] i feel like sometimes vets coming back from war, they're in that zien, you know? -- zone, you know? and sometimes someone comes up to you it's like, high-five, dude. you really don't know what's going on inside me, and you don't realize what you're thanking me for. especially when you first come back, you're in that zone, and it can feel just like, oh, high-five, dude. >> yeah, yeah, yeah. >> you can watch this and other programs online at booktv.org. >> and booktv's live coverage of the saw van that book festival now continues. up next, author terry mcdonnell talking about his life as an editor.

"the accidental life" is the name of the book. this is live coverage on booktv. [inaudible conversations] >> good morning. we have a few coming in the back. there we go. my name is linda, and we are delighted to have you participate in the tenth annual savannah be book festival presented by georgia power and the sheehan family foundation. we are blessed to host such celebrated authors in the trinity united methodist church today which has been made possible by the generous --