anouncer: "washington journal" continues. us now is andrew rasmussen, the formernato and former neral prime minister of denmark and e's here to discuss secretary

of state rex tillerson's speech today at the minister's meet as well as sels, u.s. relations with russia and the impact of brexit. thank you so much for joining us today. guest: good morning. host: so secretary tillerson is eeting with nato foreign ministers today. what are the top things, in your for on, we should look out in this speech? guest: i think two messages are important. message should be the american commitment to defending that is the commitment is unchanged. european i think allies should commit to defense. much more in we decided ummit, within the next decade, all percent ll reach the 2 target.

invest in defense equivalent 2 percent of their total economic production. and so, these two messages from today'sivered meeting. host: okay. concerns aboutan nato, s. commitment to have they leesed, after all of campaign trail? guest: of course, we were very concerned listening to candidate trump. lead. it is up for and after the office as president, he has slightly in ged the tone, and, particular, he pointed to security, who are reasonable people who went to europe to allies. i know secretary of defense very i also think secretary of tillerson, the director of

mcmaster, the u.n., ambassador, et cetera, they have reassuring statements, say put it would this way. i'm less pessimistic than i was. okay. we are talking to anders fogh rasmussen, formernato secretary general and former prime about u.s. denmark transatlantic relations and u.s. event relations on the of rex tillerson's speech of today. democrats can call 202-748-8000. republicans 202-748-8001. and independents 202-748-8002. recently wrote a piece in the wall street journal the u.s. out relationship in terms of in that, nd you wrote

u.s.-russia relations may need to get worse before they get better. shifting to a harder line is the only way for washington to gain change the moscow, dynamics in the ukraine, and gain congressional support for policy. foreign mr. trump has an example to ollow, even as the cold war raged, president ronald reagan u.s. military presence in europe. reagan spoke from a position of urged soviet he mikale gorbechauv, tear down this wall. what do you think president rump had should learn from reagan? guest: he should learn what i meetings with president putin, mainly that putin only respects power. respects strength, unity. and this is the reason why

president trump should negotiate with the russians from a strength. that includes to help ukraine. better the road to a elationship with russia goes through ukraine. the russians must change their ukraine. ith they must withdraw from eastern ukraine as a precondition with relations with russia. host: has his position been of the newsl by all about potential russian meddling n the election and ongoing investigations that are happening here, has that hurt president trump's credibility? guest: yeah, well, i think it possibilities s to change the relationship with russia. that would be much too to change the u.s. now. s on russia right

a method of concern s that president putin's ambition is to undermine people's trust in our democratic institutions. president putin is following the banter on the ill, i think he's lying, because hehas actually achieved goal. and people do have mistrust ight now to all democratic institutions. they are thinking what is going on. i think people feel convinced that this is a swamp that should be drained. what i would urge is to get a bipartisan policy on russia. issue from ove this a omestic agenda to being foreign policy agenda, the

president and congress should in a bipartisan way formulate a long-term russian partnership. host: okay. former u.s. ambassador to nato wrote in the huffington post about president trump. the world is listening, and the world knows the reality. and when they see a president grounded in reality and facts or is not even othered by them, that is eroding not only his credibility but the credibility of the united states. him? u agree with guest: yes. i agree with him. an american t that president always follows up on words and that he always full credibility.

words matter. and when an american president people atements, then should take them seriously. you divide, for instance, a red line and say if the red line crossed, you should act. and you should always tell say. the truth, i would the united states should be a global leader. american a determined global leadership. if the u.s. hat retreats or even is perceived to retreat, you will leave behind a vacuum or a void and that vacuum the bad guys. by book, that case in my new "the will to lead." this is also reason why we have this book to all members of congress, because i hink this message is more ever. nt now than

we need american global leadership. host: we are talking to anders fogh rasmussen, formernato secretary general and former about prime minister u.s.-transatlantic relationships. dean is calling in from on the s maryland republican line. hi, dean. caller: hi. jeanne. and i have a question for your guest this morning, and the question is if you could a elaborate how is russian behavior towards kraine, i guess, or in the cri crimea's, apart with the russian citizens or population, represents majority of the thelation is different than sovern of nato toward nation serbia and relationship part of vo, which is a a sovereign country of serbia.

county where the population was the majority and the minority of christian was fighting them after world war ii ongoing, and the nato attacked them, bombed during the clinton administration, and i think that can tourists that go there confirm that the ruins are still there. is that justified what nato 1990s to serbia, versus what russia is doing to people in own crimea, as opposed to ukraine. i have second question is why should the united states $20 trillion in debt, support a ar or conflict, intimidate russia, interest of the united states in ukraine and t's very far away from our borders. and i'll hold for the answer. thank you very

much. i would like to say there is a kosovo fference between and crimea. kosovo, the then dictator of to eradicate ned the people. genocide. and this is the reason why nato to stop him and help the kosovo people. and our mission was supported by united nations. in crimea, you have another situation. a part of ukraine. 1994, ukraine gave up her nuclear weapons, handed them received, in and exchange, certain guarantees from russia, from the u.s., from

u.k., they, among other things, they were guaranteed borders, which included crimea as part of ukraine. nevertheless, putin took crimea illegally, in violation of international law, annexed crimea into the russian federation. so there is a very clear and rence between kosovo crimea. now, you also asked me why the u.s. engage in ukraine, because the united don't have interests, ukraine? in actually, i do not agree with you. i think it is of strategic importance for the united states to help ukraine. is, so to speak, the and e between russia europe. if the united states gives up

russia, it wouldn't make america great. would contrary, it strengthen and embolden putin, ho is challenging american global leadership. has strong strategic interests in keeping ukraine as western world. host: okay. form eformer nato ecretary general anders rasmussen. and as we talk about the u.s. relations, we have a line of 202-748-8003. if you're outside the united we encourage you to join the conversation as well. want to ask about a tweet you sent yesterday. you said the world hasn't become a more peaceful place after u.s. hesitation to act over eight years. we need a policeman and only play that role. what did you mean by that, and what was the reaction?

guest: there was a lot of that tweet, i can you. because it is important to state that the united states shouldn't policeman. s but you can see that the world is on fire. wherever you look, there are problems, middle east, iraq, erbia, africa, even europe is sinking from the burden from refugees. n eastern europe, you have russian aggression. you have china flexing its muscles in the south china sea. ung, korea, kim jun threatening his neighbors and also the united states. you need someone to restore national order. but united do that states? power states is the only with the global reach.

so that's why. said before, if the u.s. retreats from that role, you and leave behind a vacuum the bad guys in the situation. didn't sident obama sad crossed the red lines. putin has stepped in and has facts on the grounds that has made a solution much difficult now. guest: david is calling in from smiths grove kentucky on our democratic line. david. caller: hey, how you doing in i've always admired you. i've watched you for years on tv, and i think we need people pragmatic at have views of the world and russia europe. i just wanted to ask, how did view untries of europe trump and also, what are the military capabilities of nato?

thank you. guest: first, on trump, well, i to say that in europe, it crisis in h like the the united states. of course, people are divided on a lot of there's skepticism. has been , mr. trump elected president of the united states. now, we should give him a chance. european from perspective, i think he has also rovoked a very healthy debate on the transatlantic relationship. he has said, you must pay more for your defense. agree with him. and after mr. trump became you have seen what i would call a healthy debate in future bout our transatlantic bond, because we cannot any longer take the relationship for

granted. we have to consider how we can invest more in that relationship, both economically, politically. thing. is a positive now, what is the military capability of nato? nato is the world's strongest security alliance, and he world's most successful security appliance. i think nato countries, all in all, represent more than 50% of defense investment. so it's still very much are the alliance in itary the world. after the cold war, we thought the russians were our partners. in 2014, they demonstrated they are not our partners. adversaries. so we have to invest more in our

make sure hawe can rotect the principles upon which we have built our free societies. mentioned the vacuum left in syria during the obama administration. given that, i want to get your headline today that the trump administration doubled down on prioritizing the against isis war saying it's no longer about getting rid assak. secretary tillerson indicating a possible shift in u.s. policy on the war in syria. rom the obama administration, secretary of state rex tillerson said on a trip to turkey that status of term resident assad will be decided by the assyrian people. what's your reaction to that? main i would say the priority now is to make sure hat we get a cease fire, that with help people into it

human terror assistance, because the human terror situation is disastrous. of course, that's the highest priority. said that, i can hardly see how a long-termed ustainable political solution can be found with the assad and power. because he's done things to his own people that i don't think he own peopleted by his and of course he's saying that the syrian people should decide destiny of assad, but how it'so you that in syria in democracy. in theory it sounds good but in we can , i don't think find a long-term solution as ong as assad is president of syria. host: okay. you are, in addition to being former nato secretary

general, you are the founder of rasmussen global. what is your nd relationship with european governments? stepped downwhen i s secretary general of nato, i decided to start my own consultancy business. didn't know whether there was has ket for that, but it turned out to be very successful. and now we have just opened a office in brussels. work as external foreign policy advisor to the president i have very good governmentsill with in europe. built can say that i've i business on the network terms in through my

denmark and as secretary of ato, and i'm still working on so i did it very much the american way. that is not usual in my country very has shown out to be successful. host: okay. kelly from san antonio, texas, is on our independent line. on with former nato secretary general rasmussen. caller: thank you so much, morning, nd good secretary rasmussen. i had one question, and now i have three. but the first question would be recent reports about the in south an crisis sudan and 100,000 people facing starvation, and what are the plans there? and er 2, it seems to me -- i don't mean to be indignant, but you're saying you have

confidence in trump and you want to see him work and yet he is under investigation for ties to just said russia friend. was not our our n you plose clarify if administration has been undermined by the russians, how work with nato? and the last thing is for c-span. internso see your women do more than bring coffee. thank you very much and i will my answer off air. host: i'll speak to the last one. trust me, they do a lot more coffee, but go ahead. sudan, yes, it is really a disaster. as such, doesn't have any in south sudan. think that's a task for the

international community like the united nations. it's a tragic situation and i do united nations would be able to deploy people sudanese and south sudanese people. russia. ump and i feel sure that the russians or tried to interfere election process in the states. but they always try to interfere processes. cratic they will also do it in europe. we are approaching elections in france and later in germany. already now in france, we can

russians are interfering with that election. visited marin lapen president putin in the kremlin. financed her s party. and the reason is that national france is in favor of lifting he e.u. sanctions against russia. so a lot is at stake for russians. so we wouldn't be surprised if to interfere with these elections and, for news or create fake false stories about the leading la pen. to his name is makong. already. e seen that and i wouldn't be surprised if same in ctly the

germany. o i have no doubt that the russians tried to interfere with our election campaigns, and we should do all we can to counter that. but my point is the best way to counter it is to achieve it rtisan policies when comes to russia. enjoys e that mr. putin very much the banter on the hill here in washington right now. he's laughing, because this weakens americans. how you finally asked me this will impact on nato. of course, if the russians creating a split within our western alliance, weaken nato. this also is the reason why it's so important that the secretary of state tillerson today visited brussels, and i'm sure message of unity once the counter meeting would be concluded today.

host: okay. linda is calling on the democratic line from longwood, florida. linda. ning, caller: good morning. agree with mr. the nato as far as issues. relatives all and over the world and i have poland. in i have relatives in scotland. i have friends in france. nd the united kingdom and ermany, and they're all afraid of russia's meddling. country is the laughing stock of europe. no longer number 1. world war ii, we helped was europe.

and at this point, i almost feel we're doomed. host: linda, let's let him respond. guest: i really agree. t is in the united states core interests to ensure integration this is a n europe. lesson from the second world united states has a ital interest in having peaceful friend on the eastern of the atlantic. need a is also why we firm united states stance russia. ecause if the united states retreats from europe, then russia will advance, and you soon see that then europe

split. europe would be more hostile towards the united states. definitely not in the interest of the united states. host: okay. former nato second general anders