working for you and to grab on, even if there's nothing to hold on to, hold on to the faith that potential is waiting for you. and you will be fulfilled. so, fear has no place in the ups and downs of life. it'sed a adventure. >> host: this has been a wonderful conversation and thank you. >> guest: my pleasure. thank you, johnny. >> trails like this one that went look the willamette river provides about residents an opportunity to enjoy nature. come along on this trip on oregon trails. >> eugene is in a beautiful spot but also a fragile place, and peoples of defensive about that. our former governor, tom mccall, shocked a national tv

audience when he went on air to tell people not to come to oregon. he said, visit all you want, we love tourists, but for god sake don't move to oregon. oregon was settled by walkers. the earliest known evidence of humans anywhere in the americas, north or south, or is in oregon in a cave in eastern oregon and that dna they've taken from that, university of oregon pailon tollingists have done this, shows that their ancestors came from siberia. so this is the first proof of the alaska left-hand ridge theory and people actually walked to come to oregon, the descendents of the people are still here as the oregon tribes but there's also this tradition of walking because the white settlers on the oregon trail. they didn't ride in the wagons. they were full of gear. they walked here. so when you want to get out,

cabin fever rages -- it rains a lot in the winter here and you get a nice day in april like this and people are lacing up their hiking boots and hitting the trails. maybe there's an echo of that oregon trail and the first native tribes walking to oregon that persists here. people still want to get out and walk. my book is called "oregon trips and trails" and is come comp layings of the pressey eest places i could find in oregon. hiking trails and cool places to stay, hot springs like thick ewitness guys for countries in europe. they don't cover oregon but they do it wrong. covering five star resorts. that's what what people in oregon care about. it's the outdoors and cool little hideaways. the federal government owns haven't of the state of oregon, 50% is national forest or bureau

of lan management land. so, that plays a huge role, but on sum oregon pays more in taxes than we get back, and there's some controversy about that. people feel that -- in people feel we should get that federal rand and use it and develop it but a lot of people are saying, well, actually, the feds are doing a nice job of protecting that. so, let's keep it in public ownership and -- so that's why there's a strong movement for wilderness and preservation in oregon. for my series of hiking dids for oregon, i have five books that cover different parts of the state, each book has 100 featured hikes. so-so that's 500. and each book has 100 more at the back of lesser uses, less interesting trails. so that's a thousand trails in oregon. and people ask me, have you hiked them all? and i have to say, yeah.

that's what i do. it's a tough job, hiking for living a living. >> my favorites is in on sidon trail that are an hours drive from here. if you want to good snowboarding in august on a glacier, you can do that up there. but the trail is -- was so popular it's one of the few in oregon you have to have a permit and only let 20 groups a day to hike the trail. there's wild flour flower feels, laugh a flow, glaciers, in a six mile hike. waterfalls and lakes, pretty cool hike. one of the toughest trail is one up south sister, so thousand foot volcano and there's a hiking trail to the top. you don't need a permit. you just have to have a lot of stamina because you're gaining 5,000 feet of elevation in about five miles.

the next hardest one would be hell's canyon, on the idaho border, and you're lose 50:00 feet of elevation, you start on the rim and you hike down to the snake river. that seems easy. then in the afternoon and the heat of the day you have to come back. welcome to downtown eugene. very close to where eugene was funds over 100 years ago, and it still is the heart of the city. you think, that's is a whitewater river with trails in the woods on either side? but that is what eugene is about. so, we're on a biffle -- bicycle bridge. eugene has more bridges for bicycles than cars. in this town it's five to four and this one is in me middle. you can go ten miles of the path and not nor you're in a city.

eugene is a an extremely bike-friendly city by design. separate bike paths all over the city so you don't have to fight traffic. makes it handy for commuting. our former mayor, right bass -- ruth bascom, completed the trails on both side of the willamette river. there was time it was full of steamboats. but it was no longer important for transportation and also a huge fishery with salmon coming up and it's on iconic oregon outdoor experience, sam con coming up. but then there was a period of real bad pollution, and people were so upset that they declared the entire willamette river a grownway, cleaned up the pollution. salmon are coming back and it's

a canoe route. you can canoe to portland. on that route you almost never see a farm or house or a city. you would imagine that you are in the wilderness for 120 miles. oregon has always been a magic name, just oregon. it speaks of mystery and beauty and i'm hoping my book will help people find that part. it's a great place to visit but maybe you don't want to come here to live. >> on sunday, matt taibbi is our guest. >> you look at thousands of faces until one day you see that one face that you feel is put on earth just for you and you -- that's instantly that you fall in love in that moment. for me, trump was like that except it was the opposite.

when i first saw him on the campaign trail i thought, this is a person who is unique, horrible, and amazing, terrible, characteristics were put on earth specifically for me to appreciate or unappreciate or whatever the verb is, because i had really been spending a lot of the last ten to 12 years without knowing it preparing for donald trump to happen. >> mr. tie even by is a contributor to "rolling stone magazine" and the author of books, include "smells like dead ale fants," the great derangement. griff-topia. a story of bunkers, politics and the most audacious power grab. and his recent book, insane clown president. during our live three-hour

conversation we'll take your calls, tweets tweets tweets andk questions on his literary career. "in depth" lime from noon to 3:00 p.m. eastern on sunday. >> i had a lot of people die in my hand while i was over there. i almost died a lot of times. what mosted me up the most was -- messed me up the most was seeing people -- i could fight wars and almost die and have people die in my hands, it's fine, but just seeing -- i don't know -- like a soul fall in part in front of you. something doing anything for an award. napoleon said a man would fight for a colored ribbon, and seeing that in action where people are fighting and lying for a bit of colored ribbon. breaks your heart, breaks you inside just to see that time and time again, and just coming home, one reasons i wrote the

book was i talk about in here, and i was on a date with this girl, and she starts to talk about this newspaper article she read in a local newspaper, the homedown hero piece, and this guy just came bam from iraq and he is a hero, the epitomy of me american soldier, a person g.i., and is telling me this story and i said i enjoy heros and i'm like, what's the guy's name, she says is a lolidash. a guy that served in iraq and he is one of the biggest dirtbags in the entire unit. and i called a buddy and said that is what they're saying about lolidash and he said, let's go burn his house down. there was this aspect of people coming home and there's a lot of real heros in the mail tear, great guys, real heros and guys that chase ribbons, fight for a bit of colored ribbon and it happens. the instance in iraq is a bunch

of -- me and a few bodies nominated for awards and we don't want them. we don't want to stand up there and look like idiots, just like in high school you get participation trophy, and then on the other side people petitioning to change military regulation so is they can get an award because something happened they didn't qualify. everybody wanted a combat action badge and wanted to lie about, and ordnance exploded far away but it was unexploded bus the terrorist took out all the gun powder. so didn't explode. thus shooting a rock at us. but these guys thought they qualified and not really and they're trying to change. the regulations so they can get the award and this guy wanted know lie so he can get an award. i'm like, i don't even like you. maybe identity think about it if

i liked you but i depend like this. it tears at your heard. when you're fighting for things and you think you're fighting for something and you have guys in the same uniform as you that are just fighting for the ribbon. >> i mentioned that passage where you talk to the vietnam vet and he says i'd rather have something spit on me than shake my hand. you talk in one -- there's a book called "thank you for your service." and talk about the resentment of veterans and yourself about a kind of fawning attitude, a sort of shallow curiosity that maybe, a., doesn't want to hear about the nonheroes. how should we -- let's say you see a soldier in uniform at the airport. do you say, thank you, do you just let them be, or at the bar

where a friend who served, how do you -- how would you recommend for those of us who are -- civilians for life and to talk to you, approach you, attitude as friends, strangers. >> guest: yeah. two quick stories. one story was after the publication of my first book -- i met thousands of vets withing toes just like that. i talked to a lot of vietnam vets, and they would say, thank you for your service, and i would say, thank you for your service and this happened to me a dozen times. vets said no one ever said that to me before. i can understand not supporting the war, the vietnam war is what it is, the iraq war is what it is. so i can understand people had a sensation but to not recognize

you did the and now 2000 i'm the first person to say that to a dozen people. the owned of this is going back to a death class. took -- a dating class. you work on those inner games. this one scene where this one time during one of these exercises, big guy, masculine guy, and doing this internal meditation exercise and this big guy had this breakthrough. just realized something about himself, about life, and he is having a really big breakthrough and starts crying. a cathartic cry. just realized something about his life and having this perfect breakthrough. and right in the middle of his crying and moment, one of the other guys walks up to him. awesome breakthrough, high five, dude. and he is in the middle of this cathartic, full-body cry, and the is like, high five, dude.

feel like sometimes vets coming back from war are in a zone and sometimes -- someone comes up to you and is like, high five, dude. you don't know what is going on inside me and don't realizes what your thinking for. when you first come bam you're in a zone you hear this, high five, dude. >> yeah. >> you, watch this and other programs online at booktv.org. >> good morning. welcome to the annapolis book festival and we're hear to talk with doctors stephanie deluca k and doctors kathryn edin. we'll offer them an discount -- an opportunity to discuss their books and you the opportunity to ask questions.