>> it starts going back up here. it will be public health. >> thank you, richard white. [applause] .. that would be greatly appreciated and thank you so much for attending this evening. [inaudible conversations] [inaudible conversations] >> you are watching booktv on c-span2 with top nonfiction books and authors every weekend. booktv, television for serious readers.

>> good evening, everybody. welcome to the jewish museum. my name is nelly benedek and on the senior director of education. it's my pleasure to welcome you to two nights author talk with francine clarksburg under new book "lioness: golda meir and the nation of israel," a program where pro presented with the jewish week there were honored to host this talk because vaccine has been a long time jewish museum board member. for 30 years in fact, right? we appreciate her ongoing dedication to our institution and its programming.

please visit our website to sign-up for our news to learn about other lectures, concerts and workshops taking place this fall season. after the talk we invite you to stay for a reception where francine will be signing books in the corner. now please join me in welcoming gary rosenblatt, editor and publisher of the jewish week who will introduce our speaker. [applause] will. >> thank you very much. good evening everyone. before i forget i want to ask all of you to turn off your cell phones. and that goes for you too, golda. doesn't look like she's ahead of her time. so as editor and publisher of the jewish week i am proud that the jewish week is co-presenting this program, along with our friends at the jewish museum.

and i'm so honored to be introducing the women of the hour, francine klagsbrun, who in addition to her other writings, is deeply admired and avidly read as a columnist for the jewish week, and did your friend. so on my way in this evening, i her to jump in talking about your new book. and one said it's a great read, you can't beat it. and the other one said beat it? you can't lift it. [laughing] so the truth is i received an advance copy of the book and was a little intimidated by its size and half. yes, it is 813 pages, but keep in mind that includes 73 pages of carefully annotated notes in the back, followed by 55 pages

of bibliography and index. so the text is really about 695 pages. and fran, when i finish reading it i played to make a cm. that's a celebration that scholars make to mark the completion after months or years of study of -- but seriously, as i read this book, i come away each time enlightened and full of admiration. not only for the remarkable accomplishments of golda meir, this central figure in modern jewish history, but for the way francine has made her come to life in this monumental work. and it is now and forever the definitive biography of golda. and as francine told sandy barofsky whose excellent piece on the new book is featured in

this weeks issue of the jewish week, francine felt like she began to inhabit golda during the eight years she's been working on this book. it is law and thoroughly researched, but it is not a dry read. pick up any page and start reading and you will be drawn into the narrative, the story of the unique woman and emerging nation and an ancient people. fortunately, i am familiar with her writing because she's been contributing a monthly column to the jewish week, almost from the time i came to the paper in 1993. and given our rates contributing is pretty accurate. but i can type that of all the columnists and reporters and others whose work i see in the office, she's the most reliable in meeting a deadline and producing a clean his copy. i wasn't at all surprised when i heard her editor say that the

manuscript came in at something like 346,000 words, and she didn't have to change any of them. now, , that's the sign of either great writer or a really lazy editor. [laughing] and i know he is one of the best editors in the business. what's so impressive to me about her output between books and her essays is that she is both a scholarly historian and a keen observer of contemporary trends, and that's a rare combination. she's the author of more than a dozen books. her other works include voices of wisdom, the fourth commandment, remember the sabbath day, and married people, staying together in the aged divorce. she was editor of the best-selling free to be you and me produced by marlo thomas. she's contributed articles to many publications and in

addition to our ba and ma degree, she holds a bachelor of hebrew literature from the jewish theological seminary and was awarded an honorary doctorate. francine is a trustee of the jewish museum, and on the board of directors of the jewish book council, and is a contributing editor to two jewish feminist publications. she was at the forefront of the struggle to have women ordained as rabbis in the conservative movement. and finally francine, i hope you know that you and your endlessly charming husband, sam, are so dear to my wife judy and me. so i'm honored to introduce you now. ladies and gentlemen, please join me in welcoming the author of "lioness: golda meir and the nation of israel," francine klagsbrun. [applause]

>> thank you, gary. i just love gary. is one of the great editors of our time, and for me it is such an honor to be introduced by gary rosenblatt, and for the jewish week to be cosponsoring this. gary has been my editor, my boss for all these years that i've been writing for the jewish week and it's just been a joy every single moment of it. and we're also very good friends. i also want to thank the jewish week -- i don't know where she's sitting, but want to thank her for this event for the jewish week and was involved in this bid and whenever it is its magic and what if she does is magic and i thank her for that. and then i want to thank particularly the people of the jewish museum who put this event together, nelly benedek who introduced gary, who was the

person who invited me to speak your at the museum, and she has been so supportive, very patient with me when i got a little concerned about this or that. jenna weiss who does public programming and who pulled this program together let me tell you where all quite overwhelmed by the number of people who are here, and jenna has managed to do it very graciously. and the director of key medication at the museum and runs the whole shebang in terms of public events and anything has to do with the public, and i thank you for your kindness and for your support also. then i have to just do a quick shout out to carolyn hessel who is at the guardian angel of all writers but a a very good fried of mine. this project began because of caroline. it was her idea. she met with me every month for lunch. all these years i was writing it, she would say what you up to now?

she read the manuscript at least twice and has been just so wonderfully supportive. and i want to thank my beloved editor who never said what are you up to now? who just accepted that i was when i was and has been a joy to work with and her wisdom and knowledge has been wonderful for me. i also want to thank naomi firestone who is the current director of the jewish book council. carolyn had been the director. carolyn one -- naomi is here and she is still one of ideas and she keeps giving me ideas of things i should do with this book, and i thank you, naomi. so want to also thank all of you, so many of you for coming and i'm very touched and very grateful to all of you. now we're going to begin with the word from our guest of

honor. so just hold on. >> the former prime minister of israel golda meir is totally visiting this country on behalf of the you ja on the occasion of the 25th anniversary of the launching of israel bond. by the way this is her only network television interview and we welcome you to our country and tour program. >> thank you very much. >> you must say zionism is equated with jews. and what they did at the u.n. was to give a legal stamp to anti-semitism. call it by its right name. and that's series. the are anti-semites in the world and now it's been legalized and, of course, if you say that zionists are racists, that israel is a racist state,

then almost necessary to destroy that state. i mean, it has given legal sanction one, for the semitism which affects every jew in the world, and two, for anything that in countries they want to do against israel. >> i chose that, this is from an interview in 1976 shortly after the u.n. had passed zionism is racism resolution, which it did not resend, by the way, into making 91. but i want to show you that golda was person of her own time but she was also a person of our time. the issue of the u.n. in terms of israel's attitude to you and is one of that is prejudiced, unesco research showed that. the word designed his own racism are still used together. the term racist is used for the state of asia. golda would not have objected to criticism for israel, norwood

high but those kinds of words which were said then we still used today. so she was in some ways very much a a part of our own times. but, of course, she was also very much part of her own time. her story has been told before, in some books, film, and television, in play on broadway last year. but i felt that she was not given her dues, that we need to examine her and her times in more depth and more breath. ice still think with the perspective of the time we shod take another look at golda meir. you know in our own day she was one of if not the most powerful women in the world. more powerful than many men. so i want to know how would we see her today? how should we see her? who was this person? you look at her on the screen and i think many of you that's a memory of her, this little old

lady, so sometimes grandmotherly looking. but the way she really? what i i found in all those yes of research is that she was a very complex person. she was a bundle of contradictions. for example, she was the ultimate insider in israeli politics. she rose through the ranks. she became labor minister, prime minister, prime minister, yet in many ways she was also an outsider. she was the woman in the world that was very much of a man's world at that time. not only that, she was a woman who came from the united states to go to then british mandatory palestine. she was born of course in key have in russia but she spent her youth and the united states from the time she was ages old until she was 25. she was the only found of the state who had done that. she was on the founder who came from a country that was not

persecuting its jews. she came from a country where your parents or grandparents like mine could really succeed, could grow, and she could have grown. who knows, , she could become or first woman president since we haven't gotten there yet. [applause] >> so she wasn't outsider even though she seemed to be so much inside. and that was important, who she was and to she became. she was also a female, a women, an icon for women. in many ways she lived a very modern woman's life. she was married. she separated from her husband. they never divorced but she split from them. in her early years of marriage she had an abortion. she had lovers. she also left her children for long times because you so busy working. she was a single mother. and yet she was opposed to the feminist movement of the 1970s that so many of us here were

involved in. that's not to say she didn't care about women. she cared very much about women's issues at all levels. for example, when the state was first being formed, every little decision had be discussed to the nth degree. one of the decisions that had to be made was how do you address members of the knesset, members of the parliament here in the united states we say the senator from new york, for example. but in israel they don't vote geographically. so how do you address them? than men in the cabinet in their great wisdom said will, why don't we use a system that is used in senegal, particularly orthodox synagogues, where men are called -- to bless the torah you say, for example, -- isaac the son of jacob. so why do we identify the men by their fathers -- why do we identify members of the knesset by their fathers names? and golda said, i think we

should identify them by their mothers name. why don't we say isaac, the son of rachel? they put the whole thing aside. they didn't discuss it any further. but on a more serious level when she was a labor minister she pushed, literally pushed through legislation that protected women, that protected women working women when she was baby. that would be free, it was paid maternity leave which we still don't have now. so she cared about women if she cared about women's issues but she was very opposed to the women's movements in the 1970s 1970s, which is i sort of call that a little bit against her, she said those crazy bra burning women. well, part of that was because golda was a socialist and she had this vision of socialism taking over all of society and everybody would be under that

blanket of socialized, socialism and nobody we did have a special movement because everybody needs, everybody would feel the same. the other reason was simply her ambition. she knew that in her man's world identifying with the feminist movement was not going to get her what she wanted to go. you might know that even women leaders today don't call themselves feminists but they don't say those crazy bra burning women. but even so the interesting contradiction is that the women's movement adopted her as their icon. i remember going to the ms. magazine, some of you remember this post always going to the ms. magazine office because i was editing free to be you and me and a compilation of articles for ms. magazine, and on the wall was this big poster with the lovely image of golda and the legend beneath it that said but can she type?

[laughing] because that was what people thought women should be doing in those days. another contradiction. she was poorly educated. she did have more than a high school degree. she went to normal school for about a year and dropped out, and yet she could speak without notice. even i have notes pick she could speak without notes right to the heart of her audience. our colleagues said she could read from the phone book and make people cry, she was bad effective. and then another contradiction, she often had that kind of grandmotherly and which i've mentioned before, she played. she like to present herself that way at times. when she was interviewed by newspapers she would talk about her chicken soup recipe, you know, but when she mentions her chicken soup recipe one time thousands of people wrote in to

get the recipe. so i put in my book because i thought everybody would want it. but i got to tell you the truth, it's nothing much. [laughing] this grandmotherly type woman was tough as stupid she could also be sarcastic, cunning, even cruel to people who didn't agree with her or she didn't like or did things she was not happy about. somebody i interviewed said to me, when he heard because she was not only so sarcastic and counting at she was so -- he said when he was told, he worked for her, when he was told that while she was on the telephone that there was phone call, it was golda meir, he said i stand up straight and salute. [laughing] because that was the kind of feeling she conveyed, along with the grandmotherly image. and then finally, the saddest

contradiction is golda meir was and remains appeared in the united states and in countries around the world, in her own country, in israel she became a controversial figure. she became controversial for one thing, for sexist reason, from us optimistic reasons. men would work for her when they're young and didn't really like working for this powerful often difficult woman. after she died really let her have it. and things that she had been confident, well, that became arrogant. words that we have heard often applied to women when men don't like them. that's really all that part of the story. the other part, probably a larger part, is that she was a prime minister during the yom kippur wars 1973 1973 israel wt war, but they lost about 2600

soldiers, thousands more who were wounded. the country was left with a very -- a feeling they were now vulnerable and that feeling has remained. and golda meir, i'm going to come back to the subject, golda meir was the prime minister and she was held responsible for that. now, her life story reads almost like fiction. she was born as a set in kiev in 1898. her sister, her older sister was nine years older than she. between her birth and the birth of shayna, her parents had four other babies, all of the boys, all of them died in infancy. she grew up in milwaukee. her father went first and then she came with her mother and her sisters in 1962 milwaukee, wisconsin. that was something, i looked at it again and thought about it again. the fact that she grew up in

milwaukee and did not grew up in the slums of new york or the tenements of new york had a great effect on her. in those days as you all know there were ways of jewish immigrants coming from eastern europe. the german jews had, had a dent the 1880s helped them and started philanthropies for them, but were embarrassed by the ellipse down, most of our parents and grandparents look down at them. they thought they were dirty, and that they were congregating in cities like new york and chicago, the big cities. the german jews, their organizations that they formed which whose purpose was to spread the jews out, these eastern european jews so they would not be in one area only, and also they could become americanized. for the most part the system did not work. it did work with her father, and he settled in milwaukee. because she lived in milwaukee it seems to me that she was a

different kind of person than she might've been had she gone in new york. to be sure the family was very poor. they lived in the ghetto of milwaukee. nevertheless, the city was a socialist city. golda had joined the zionist socialists, and that was reinforced by the atmosphere in her city. milwaukee was closer to the frontier. she didn't grow up in a tenement. was poor but there was a piece of green and is also that front you feeling, that can defeat them. you work hard enough, you really give it your all and you achieve what you want to achieve. i was absolutely golda's attitude. then there was this optimism. even america as as a whole was still going, sense of optimism, expanding westward. she always describe yourself as an optimist. a jew she would say cannot afford the luxury of not being an optimist because of our

history. and then gold is sister went to live in denver and golda joined her for a while and she met a man named morris. morris was a sign pena but he was very cultured. he loved music. he loved art. he loved books and golda to read the small education, not enough of an education was very taken with that. as a matter fact, all her life she was always attracted to men who were very intellectual and were very cultured. yes, she had several lovers. i wrote about three of them but i know that there were more than that. she was very good-looking as a young woman. she was very charismatic. her friend said for every 5 million matter, four of them fell in love with her. this time morris fell in love with her and golda fell in love

with morris. at some point his mother came to visit to meet golda's family. i have letters that nobody has had that i got, whatever, to the family and i have a letter from one of his sisters to another sister and in this letter she says that their mother really did not think very highly of the family but not only that, she did not think it's golda was worthy of her son, morris. now, as you know they went on to live in palestine, and morris could never find himself he really wasn't a scientist at heart. he would because of golda. he could never find himself. he really was a failure in many ways. golda meir became golda meir, so i think we have to think twice about being mothers-in-law. and also i think now you should

just keep her income people always makes mix up her name se to tell to you. she was -- her birthday. she was golda myerson all the years she was labour minister she became golda meir because ben-gurion insisted that -- that's how she got to be the golda meir that we know. golda and morris and the friends went to british mandatory palestine in 1921. that was something else i start reconsidering. i felt what did they know about the land they were going to? they knew it would be hard. they did know how harsh it was going to be. they didn't know there was going to be desert all over. they would have to build on sand. but more than that they knew that there was another people living in that land. they were not stupid. they knew how the arabs had responded to partition. they knew there was another people living there, but they

really truly believed that after a time they would be welcomed by the arab population. they were bringing western ways. they were bringing their know-how. they would bring technology, and they thought that would be welcomed. well, we know that didn't happen. so they made a big mistake about that. the other mistake they made was at that time there was a big yiddish movement in the states. it was a big emphasis that people should speak yiddish because that's the length of the jewish people. they spoke yiddish, grew up speaking yiddish that should never written it because she didn't go to school very much and they really struggle. they begin writing to each other in yiddish, and people who spoke english to each other begin writing to each other in yiddish. when they came to palestine they discovered as you all know that the language of the jewish part of the land was hebrew. hebrew was rediscovered. it was being reinvented and the only new yiddish.

they settled in, as a golda very quickly showed a leadership qualities and she was sent to a conference in tel aviv and she spoke in yiddish because that's what she knew. and then she was sent to conference in the first agricultural settlement in palestine, and she began to speak in yiddish. one of the pioneers, a well-known man, a pioneer, got up and stopped her and he said, and tel aviv it was bad enough but here, , no. don't speaking yiddish. for golda was humiliated because she didn't know hebrew and chad to continue in yiddish. but she did learn hebrew. it became her language like everybody else in the land but she was never proficient at it. she could . she could never mastered when she had english, for example. it's bad enough that she only

has a vocabulary of 2000 words, but why doesn't clec is the 2000 words? she got back at him when she was told he was very educated and when she was told that he speaks five languages, golda said well, so does the waiter at the king david hotel. [laughing] morris hated it, he didn't like communal living. they moved to jerusalem where they had two children. they were abjectly poor. they were so poor some of you know this about her past, they were so poor that golda had to take in wash and wash the laundry of the local nursery school. and then around 1930s, she was offered a job by and then david, a job to work with the women workers council which was part of the jewish federation of labor. he was a very important person in that.

david became her lover later and of all the men she ever knew, i believe he was truly the love of her life. but she began working there, the pioneer women in the united states, and she worked there for a few years. she was traveling back and forth, back and forth it was a difficult she had to leave her children sometimes for nine months at a time, but she did it. she wrote about how difficult it was but she did it. she really exhausted herself, but she continued doing that. and then she began to move up in the jewish agency which was the quasi-government of the pre-state of israel. in 1938, there was a turning point she would say later in her own attitude. in 1938 hitler had already come into power, and this was before the final solution of killing all the jews.

but jews were becoming refugees, thousands upon thousands of jews were becoming refugees. franklin roosevelt convened the convention at evian which is on the lake geneva on the shores of lake geneva turkey invited 32 nations to come to this convention to talk about the refugees, who could take the refugees in? what could they do? of the 32 nations, 31 could not find any way to take in the refugees. they were all professionals, we don't have room for that many professionals. another one, they just did what the jews. the only one whopper to take in the jews was the dominican republic, but the offer to take in the jews to work land that was really not workable. at the end of this conference, golda was part of a news

conference that took place. she wasn't an actual delegate because they're not the state yet but she was there as a sort of delegate. she was part of a news conference. i i will read to you what she said. there is only one thing i i hoe to see before i die, and that is that my people should not need expressions of sympathy anymore. what golda later said was she looked back on that and she said he really was a turning point when she came to understand that should never understood before, that jews have to depend on themselves and they can't really ever depend completely on anybody else. in 1948 the partition, the u.n. had partitioned the land into at jewish and arab state, and ben-gurion was the head of the

jewish priest in israel, been durian stood at that assess the state was declared the arabs around with invade. he desperately needed money and this is -- excerpt from a book but have something more to tell you about it. anyway, he needed money and yet sent an emissary to the united states to get money but this man came back with nothing more than $7 million which is really not a lot. then ben-gurion thought he was going south but for him to leave the country at that point would have been nuts. so he sent golda as he trusted her. she came on a freezing day in the middle of a storm. she heard that there was a luncheon going on in chicago with the well-heeled jews from the jewish federation and she knew she had to speak their to those people. so she came and had him on tour

was a man who was executive director, and he said recalling all this, he wrote, taped, he said women in america knew who golda was because she wrote to these women's organizations. i just thought she was a -- that's as much as a knew about it. then she came without a dime in her pocket and she said to me, i have to raise money for so he didn't have much faith in anyby set apart to speak at this luncheon in chicago. she did. her knees were trembling. she was terrified that she was not going to get any place. she would be like a fool. but in the same straightforward way without a drop of makeup on her face, with her hair pulled back and parted in the middle, she spoke from hard and she told him why they needed money. she ended by saying you cannot decide whether we will fight. we will fight even if we have to

use stones. what you can decide, you american jews, is whether we shall win or the arabs will win. that you can decide. and when she finished speaking, there was a kind of electric current that went through the room. people then gave her a standing ovation and almost two months after everybody pledging all over the place. that was wonderful. but the next day reality set in and this is a part that very few people do know. i believe, not sure he is here, but robert morgenthau, our previous district, beloved district attorney, was going to be in the audience tonight with his wife, i don't know if they are or not, but what happened the next -- yes, there they are, okay. okay, so here's the story.

i wanted you to hear it. henry morgenthau, roberts father, had been the secretary of treasury under franklin roosevelt but at this time he was chairman of the board of you ja, and the next day after this great success in chicago golda went to new york and she met with you ja leaders and they sat around the table eating kosher deli sandwiches and discussing whether they can help golda raise this money. and again these very proper uja wealthy men said no, we can't do that uja is a philanthropic organization. we cannot raise money to give arms to israel. and henry morgenthau said, i will call him now, if golda meir says you have to have arms and we are the only place where they can get the money to buy the arms, i'm afraid, gentlemen, we will have to accept my decision.

we're going to include golda meir in this year's fundraising campaign. and they did, and golda and some of the people from uja went around the country and the raise $55 million that they split and she came home with $25 million to buy arms. i'm going to take a sip of water. some of you may remember that she dressed up as an arab, a woman, to go meet with king abdullah to try to convince him not to join in the 1944 against israel. she was not successful. years later she had at least 30 secret meetings with his grandson, king hussein of jordan, and she wanted to do a

deal to trade land for peace. that didn't work out either. soon after the state was declared, golda was the first ambassador to the soviet union. at the time nobody knew what the condition of soviet jews were. they were repressed, stalin was in charge, and everyone was supposed to be the soviet man, loyal to mother russia. the russians had supported partition, state of israel because they thought it was a way for them to get more power in the middle east. but russian jews were the jews of silence. so golda came in and she wanted very much to meet russian jews and she somehow wasn't about to appear to never could. but on the jewish new year and day david atonement, she went to the synagogue in moscow, and when she came out, thousands upon thousands of jews came out to greet her, to touch her, to tell

her, golda, golda, to give her notes, slip into our pockets, to send home somehow to get help for them. somebody pushed her into a taxicab for her own safety, at all she could think to do was put her head out the window and say thank you for having me remain jewish. and there were other things that are not so well-known. she had complex relationships of all the men whose names you know, ben-gurion, shimon perez, they were always fighting with each other. always fighting with each other and get there they were, they created the state of israel. when she was labour labor miniu became labor minister in 1949 and aside from the laws and legislation about women, she managed to push through a very progressive insurance law that became the basis of israel's social security system now, and

their welfare state now. she worked on the housing or the immigrants who came firsthand, very temporary housing. it was a very trying job but she loved it. golda herself lived very modestly. when you think of her in comparison with some of the world leaders today, she lived in a a little house, aside from official residences, she lived in a little house outside of tel aviv. i visited there several times because i got to know her family. it was a little house and had just a very small living room. on one side was a fireplace and on the other side was a couch and two chairs, to soft chairs, easy chairs. her son told me that the chair golda sat in was this win was r because it was closest to the kitchen. she would go into the kitchen and she would make tea and cookies for visiting dignitaries as well as the family. she loved the house.

when she became prime minister she would shut the lights out before she went out the door because that's what you do, your frugal. she made no effort to benefit her family are to give them any extra gains on her becoming prime minister. when she became foreign minister in 1956, there were many things that she did but it want to mention just one thing. she met with president kennedy in 1962. and he said something to her that no american leader had ever said to an israeli leader before. he had met ben gurion. they didn't each other the ben-gurion said he he's just a politician, and it didn't like ben-gurion with his burning eyes and his flying hair and his big accept. but golda liked him very much. she saw him as this president. she was very taken with that and he was very taken with her maternal aspects and how warm, and she could be very warm and grandmotherly.

what he said to her was, the united states has a special relationship with israel,, comparable to our relationship with great britain. and if israel is ever attacked, we will be there to support her. now, this this is not been relationship between the united states and visual before that but andrew golda this relationship will develop and she made the empathy and washington what the most important indices of all the embassies. she really develop that relationship. she always remembered that before she left president kennedy he took her hand, looked into her eyes and he said to her, don't worry, nothing will happen to israel. that meant a great deal to her. when kennedy was assassinated, lyndon johnson of course became president, and out, , at a reception we golda he said i know you've lost a friend, but you you'll find another friend in me.

golda became prime minister in 1969, and now we are back to the yom kippur war. there was a feeling of war in the air but that kept threatening war, but the generals, golda's generals were so sure that was going to happen they kept reassuring her. there's a low, low probability of war. that phrase though probability of four became so, there was a book with the name of that phrase. they kept reassuring her that even if there were a war on israel had been in the 67 war and conquered all those lands within six days. even if there were over israel would win it. and golda had to accept it because they were generals and she accepted what they said. but very close to win that war broke out one day they kgb, they picked up a sign from the kgb that hundreds of advisors from the soviet union had been in russia and in syria were leaving in a great hurry.

remember that was the cold war era and rush and syria, egypt and syria were clients of russia and israel was a client of the united states. so these advisors, russian advisors in syria and egypt were leaving in a great hurry. golda had such a gut feeling that something has got to be wrong. why are they doing that? but no, no, her generals reassured her not to worry about it. maybe they think we're going to attack them there's a low possibility of war. and then of course the war broke out and it was very difficult times for issue. as i said in the end, they lost so many soldiers and so many wounded that the scars of that war are still felt in israel today. and for golda it was a great tragedy. she said i will never again be the person i was before that war. even so, during the war moshe diane, the great general, he

fell apart completely but golda meir was unlocked but she held the country together. she made military decisions she didn't know she would know how to make and she was calm and that helped him with the outcome of the war. still, with great anger in the country, there were protests that spilled over to gold at a 1974 she resigned. but even then during the time in which, before the next person, of you who to go for, but during the time before he took over, golda was still holding office until he would take over, she negotiate with henry kissinger. she had earlier negotiate with henry kissinger who separate switches between egypt and israel, and she negotiate with henry kissinger on a separation of troops between syria and israel. it was a very tough negotiations. they were at each other.

some of you know this. of 1. kissinger said to golda and anger, mrs. prime minister i am an american first, a secretary of state second, and did you only lasted and she said, that's okay, hendry. in hebrew we read from right to left.applause. [laughing] she finally resigned in 1974, and the journalists who with her picture as she walked away from the power prime minister holding a bag. she always held her handbag for her big legs, her body stooped and nobody said anything to her. this was the end of an era, he said and that's what it was. even then, even at the end of the era, even then when gold was no longer in office she would take part in everything, president ford, she was still raising money. she was giving yitzhak rabin

advice all the time. she was something. when anwar sadat came to israel in 1977, she was at the airport to greet him. then when other dignitaries and we met her and said to her, i want to meet you for such a long time. and she said, why didn't you come? and he said the time was not yet ripe. he had needed this war to restore arab pride that had been so badly beaten during the 67 war. golda died in 1978. she never saw the final peace treaty between israel and egypt. she died at the age of 80. she had been fighting a terrible lymphoma for 15 years and kept it secret from everybody. so golda meir had many flaws. she could be rigid as a said. she could be tough. she to be sarcastic.

she didn't totally understand the jews who came from arab lands. she was so committed to the soviet jews and they felt she didn't completely understand them. she certainly did not understand palestinian nationalism nor did most people at that time. everybody was fitted with the state of egypt, lebanon, jordan and so on rather than with the palestinian people. but golda meir was a leader. golda meir had a vision, and she gave up her private life, much of the family life, and her health for that vision. and now i would like you to hear her say it before i tell it. >> do you have any words of wisdom for other people who have retired and find themselves perhaps in some what of a position like a? >> i have a word of wisdom. all i can say is that every person should find the thing in

life which is most vital to enter outside of his own family life. but in addition to that there must be something that one wants in the world. in hebrew the words -- the dreamer, and the word the fighter have exactly the same leverage. only one place they change, the same letters, i'm not hebrew scholar, only one who dreams a great dream finds that support enough and sometimes essential to fight for the realization of that dream. i pity people who don't have dreams, world dreams and believe in them. i believe that the fate of my people depends upon sovereignty, reestablish. >> at 78 you still have your

dreams, and that's the secret of your greatness. >> shalom. golda meir had a great dream. she was willing to fight for that dream, and she achieved it. a homeland for the jewish people. thank you very much. [applause] >> we have time for questions, yes? so i'll be happy to take questions. there are microphones -- >> we will come around with two microphones. raise your hands high so i can see them, i see one right here. >> i just wondered about a relationship with franklin roosevelt? >> say it again. >> i wonder what a relationship was with franklin roosevelt. >> she didn't have a relationship with franklin.

she did not have relationship with franklin roosevelt but she did have a relationship with eleanor roosevelt. they were good friends and she said that actually if i was still, it was his father henry morgan thought introduce golda to eleanor roosevelt, and golda wrote whenever she was in town in washington, which was frequently, if eldon was in town at the same time they would manage to keep together. they were really good friends, but they didn't have a lot of time together but that was the relationship with her. >> why was she not alert to the attack in 1973? what was the reasoning for -- >> i can't hear you. >> why we should not alert to the attack on 1973 by the various arab countries?

>> why we should not alluded to the attacks? >> yes. >> is really sort of a longer story. do you want me to tell you a longer story? okay. there was a spy, some of you may know this, this is a long story. there was a man, very high level inside the government and he volunteered, nobody knows exactly why, to be a spy for israel. after much examination, much investigation they accepted in. he was called the angel, the source, you know, just known as the in law. he had warned them that the war was going to break out. he had warned them, at the last minute he warned them the was going to break out at 6:00 that evening.

and so they were ready. there are going mobilize the troops. israel didn't have really a large standing army. it's army dissolved reserves, people who are trained all the time, you know, after school. there they're going to mobilizee reserves, be ready. and then the attack came at 2:00 in the afternoon. so they did not expect it at that time. they were not ready for it. the troops were not mobilized. the arms were not in place, and golda said i'm so angry a surprise us after all. that's what happened. other questions? yes. >> okay. if i'm wrong about this i'm going to be stoned, but somewhere i remember hearing,, and want to ask you, wasn't it that same henry morgenthau who was not, , was it not the same

henry morgenthau who discouraged fdr from admitting the ship full of -- >> no, henry spady and encouraged him to send the shit? >> no. >> do you know who it was in his administration? >> that's not part of my golda story. [laughing] >> okay, thank you. >> tell us a little bit about her family, her children. >> you want me to tell you about the children? i will tell you what happened yesterday. yesterday i was in dallas, texas, speaking, and at the end of my talk people buying books and so making over to me and he said, i'm . i said okay. he said, then realized he was golda's grandson lived in the mistakes and what interviewed by fungi so touched he came to my talk.

but her son and her daughter, he was a cellist, she kept books. golda was so proud of. they so presented their mother leaving them when they're young when they did. but when they got get older ann i met them, they defended her to the hilt. you could not say one negative word about, particularly to menachem who is one who most resented her earlier. but they were very nice. i really got to know that i like you and promised them come menachem said the beginning we will not cooperate with you because, you know, we don't know which are going to write. and i said look, i promise you i will write a fair book. i'm not going to whitewash golda. they would be her flaws in this book but i will be as fair as i can be. and he accepted that. i would see him most time back and forth is your many times, and i would see them most times.

he had three sons, menachem had three sons, one in america, one is a harp course. one is a researcher. her daughter had a daughter who is mentally not well, and a son who is a terrific man. and then golda's secret was that manatt comes first wife gave birth to a child who has down syndrome. golda wanted them to, then menachem split with that wife and golda had wanted him to institutionalize the child but that women wanted to raise it herself and finally golda had said there was no relationship between thin. i don't believe golda ever saw the baby. but she help support the child as she was growing up and she's in a special home now. anybody else?

>> i believe that -- all of the weather should use -- [inaudible] in the 73 war. could you talk about that, please? >> the play was all wrong. [laughing] >> i i spent a great deal of tie really investigating that whole thing. i interviewed henry kissinger about it. i interviewed james solicitor who was then the secretary of defense about at great length. of that play. the fact of the matter is, dayan had suggested using unconventional weapons. gold and the rest of the cabinet absolutely said no. they would not do that. they were absolutely opposed to that. i think that was a very important example when a country, a small country is nuclear ability but it's responsible. they were responsible.

however, dayan was able, not that this was better. by the way i interviewed henry kissinger about that and he kept saying yeah, but golda's balcony says. you don't always leave everything that people are in position tell you but i did believe it this time. and he said this is absolutely untrue. had they threatened us, they threatened us that they would use nuclear capacity if we did not help them. i could not make the decision. israel at the time and even now has an attitude of opacity we don't know if it would have been everybody knows the do but though it was their attitude. he said if there threatened as i would have had to take this much higher levels, to the president himself. it would've would been very bar israel. however, dayan to do something which was not bad. he somehow, and i don't know the details and i'm sure nobody else, i don't think anybody

does, but they had what were called missiles -- he positioned them in a way not to threaten the united states but that egypt understood that they had those weapons because at that point the soviet union apparently was beginning to send some nuclear weapons to egypt. so james said to me, as far as i know, dayan did that and you did the right thing. and i figured out when the americans secretary of defense it is for i know, it means he knows. and he said dayan did the right thing. he had to let egypt know where they stand but this was not a threat to the united states. .. in the book from the book of

ezekiel that said your mother was a lioness. protecting her cubs. i thought it really went so well. she would kill for her people and she would protect them. from the feminist point of view i agonize with that. because i don't like using that over something. there is a different for the female lion than we have. i have decided. in my editor that loved that name and we did it. so far we have very positive response to that thing.

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the editor in chief explores that leadership skills. it was exactly the same on stage as offstage. he lit up the room wherever he went. an early story of this that was interesting was i always ask on the campaign trail the girls who do make it for tv that's a place where no one can see it. you. there's no cameras or campaign staff you could be as nice or as rude as you want to be and those women will help you out anyway. i thought it was interesting and then when i met him on the campaign trail he was so different from other politicians. he was genuinely nice and authentic and unlike the other people who had run everything through the poll after that it

airs on book tv. and sunday at 9:00 p.m. eastern and pacific. [music] our next speaker is just the third ceo of microsoft history overseen a renaissance of the conch -- --dash my company's culture in the three and half years based where he became ceo. his efforts to reinvigorate microsoft in the outlook on the future of technology. please join me in welcoming into the 2017 summit microsoft ceo. [applause]. that was such