[inaudible conversation] [inaudible conversation] >> good morning. welcome. we are delighted to have you here. i'm john. i'm the president of cis. before we start events only have outside guess we start the safety announcement. mike will be responsible for your safety. if we hear a voice i'll say follow his lead he will take you

to the stairs that take us down to the alley. will take to left hand turns in a right-hand turn. we'll go over to national geographic and there's a great show and i will pay for the tickets. nothing will happen but if it does follow michael's instructions. thank you for coming. i was talking with julio as we're getting ready back in the room and i said there's a lot of americans who talk about courage but i can't say how odd i am to see you and i mean that very sincerely. i cannot think of a more traumatic time and set of events think it's too little focus and attention in america. imagine if something if there is a disaster in america and 90% of the people in the state were living below the poverty line, would we tolerate that? would that not be the first story every night in the news?

when the average venezuela have lost 24 pounds because of starvation. why is that not the lead story every night in america. these are our brothers and sisters, so close to us. to have a country of first world sophistication swept backwards and decay is breathtaking. we are not outrage the way we should be. this is crucial and not enough americans know about it. we are so grateful that those who are here to share our perspective on what's going on. right now, the only story in washington is about north korea. well, this story is just as important. i am so grateful that you are

here for us. we need to bring this bright spotlight in washington in this tragedy that is unfolding. thank you for coming. michael, i will turn to. you will offer some remarks. i'm so glad that you are here to focus on this. michael, come up and get this started. >> thank you very much for those words. it is important that you are with us this morning to open this event twitches an important event that we have to over these last two years. our venezuela project is one of the top priorities and together

with -- who's been with me from the beginning, we have tried to shine the light on venezuela in different ways. we have done this with the many different people. a couple are here in the audience. we have had an incredible team working the issue. the day after seems to be further away. we're hoping it is going to be closer with the passing of the weeks and months. our focus has been on the humanitarian situation and we have a number of initiatives there. i'm not going twice more time talking about it. i will turn the floor over.

before i do that i would like to talk and turn to landon lewis. a senior advisor and the vice president and president trump have been actively engaged in the issue and that has made a difference. we wanted to have him here today to share a few words. >> thank you michael. thank you for inviting me to participate in this event. but i like to do is recognize julio and the vice president i enjoyed meeting with you in lima. he came away from that encounter impressed by your story, by your eloquence and ability to speak to a broad, global public about venezuela. i said there is an important

moment now that we share our sense of outrage. i can assure you that the president and vice president show that sense of outrage. in able to connect with and highlight that it's very important. venezuela is a top priority for this administration. when vice president pence travel throughout latin america last year he talked about the sense of urgency. the problems have been a slow-motion crisis for a long time. what they have done is said this will not stand. there is a sense of urgency in our policy. it is important and consistent that the vice president articulate. a sense of urgency has become a sense of frustration.

frustration because despite historic, unique, global sense of what is happening in venezuela is unacceptable, despite the consensus around the region in venezuela was still have a situation which is devastating to its people. that is where we were on may 19. as my colleague said this morning, the majuro administration missed an opportunity by not listening to the overwhelming voice and asking the regime to postpone the elections and commit to a free and fair process. to make decisions based on the good and well-being of the venezuela people. the administration missed an opportunity when they held the elections. as expected, a dictator stole

the ring to election. he got to set all the rules of the game in advance and make sure everything was stacked in his favor. he got half as many votes as he publicly declared. he set a record for extension more than doubling the extension rates from the last presidential election. that's in a country that has a proud heritage of civic participation and engagement. clearly there is disc content. the cynical use of food as a weapon in the electoral process has been a decisive factor. they have endured such misery. the united states for years has maintained this deadly drumbeat of pressure.

a campaign to bring the full weight of economic and diplomatic pressure to bear. to bring about the peaceful transformation of democracy we will continue to do that. our response after the election was swift. on the friday before the election we dedicated -- and his family for being corrupt officials aiding and abetting corruption undermining the well-being of the venezuelan country and people. on monday we issued an executive order with sanctions already in place to ensure they do not have access to the u.s. financial system. we have sanctioned more than 70 individuals under four different executive orders. it is important to remind us to highlight the policy which is not always a address. so what is the purpose, why does the united states use sanctions? it is to change behavior they

are part of the choices the regime is making today. it behavior changes, sanctions are designed to be removed. that is an important concept as we look forward. ultimately, the solution lies with the venezuelan people. the ultimate arbiters are the venezuelan people themselves. this is important for the venezuelan people to think about how to build international pressure which has reached a new level the u.s. and the world will stand with the venezuelan people. we have the earliest general assembly happening next. we plan to continue our efforts to work collaboratively to call for free, fair and credible

elections to address humanitarian crisis and to restoring respect the national assembly. working across the entire agency and to build partners who want to work every store venezuela. thank you. >> thank you all for being here. i'm just going to give the panel panel started. he was part of the largest party and served as a coordinator of the party in 2000. he's currently serving his third term and it is party they capital. he also served as president in

2018. he was in a position here with the representative of the regime and a party that took place in the dominican republic. he's become one of the main leaders in venezuela and abroad. and calling out the human rights violation taken place. he started in one of the universities because they also went to that same school. he also got a masters in philosophy and a policy from -- university. with the want to thank you for coming, were delighted to have you here. and now the floors yours. thank you.

>> thank you for this introduction. i appreciate it. thank you michael, landon and my friend mark, i like to have the two-party position the first part i would like to underline some issues that i think are very important to understand and how the venezuela regime is a threat to the security of the region and democracy all over the world. secondly, i would like to share with you our view about the future and what has to play in order to seek change in venezuela. first of all, think what is

going on in venezuela is a connection, real connection between cuba, nicaragua, venezuela. venezuela has played the role to mainly finance all the movement, the extreme movement all over latin america. there was a lot of money due to the oil revenue. now even though we have such a hard crisis in venezuela, they're still paying the bills from countries like cuba. two weeks ago we had the news that venezuelan government use $400 million to buy oil for cuba. in this moment in which we are facing this huge crisis,

venezuela majuro wants to use it in a different issue. it's very clear how a real solution in venezuela could lead to a solution in cuba and nicaragua as well. for me it is clear that even the social and political manifestation are the result of venezuela has not the money in order to provide funds to nicaragua. and everything is that it is paying its due to the government in order to provide more for the quark ring as well. the third actor is russia.

russia probably does not have the trends to maintain venezuela as it did with cuba. but for me it is true that they want to play a role to use venezuela to take part in the region. in the region through the conflict on it's very important oil or gas in the recent time. then right now i guess their main expectation is to weigh in order to see a change in the region. if you see -- i hope you don't you will see all of the whole

plan venezuela is about change in mexico and change in brazil. it's a dangerous situation. there is a very real hope in the government and waiting for a change for the region in order to break all of the alliance that exists surrounding venezuela. this is a danger we are facing the sheer unit is crucial to obtain a new landscape in order to break the consensus around human democracy and human rights. at the same time, after the so-called election we can expect

an increase in the number of people going out of venezuelan immigration. it is the real threat for the region as well. right now almost three or 4 million venezuelan people have left the country and this number will rise. it's very difficult for the people around venezuela. we expect this number, due to the political crisis will increase and will produce in the region. as far as the old revenue decreased the opportunity to open and illegal activities such as the organized crime is growing. a month ago i had a meeting with

a german official. he told me the problem with drug traffic is not only related to groups in latin america, and columbia venezuela but the drug traffic has to do through africa and through europe. and government has detected that the money from the drug traffic goes to groups that they gain money through the traffic in the region. so were talking about a global negative business that has to do with guerrilla movement and latin america. and also has to do with radical movement in africa and europe. there is a common thread that

has to do with the open use of the drug business in venezuela. another issue is the use of conflict as a defense mechanism. it's clear as far as he's involved in more trouble he will look for more trouble abroad. that is the case in mexico or columbia. it's clear there is right now a corruption business related to the government with the food by. he buys the food from mexico, he buys the food from parts of chile and colombia and after

they made the business with the people in mexic mexico, colombia virtually they help radical groups. that is the case in mexico and is the case in columbia as well. it is the case of a different movement in america. the use of drugs and corruption to fund radical movement in the region it will be an increase practice. he would like to have deeper problems from venezuela and conflict all over latin america as a mechanism of his own situation as well. another issue i would like to underline, what is it that you

love. >> howie: all the crisis he had created. his only vision is to resist. that would be his only position in front of the crisis he had faced. as you know we had hyperinflation, we have the drop in revenue production, we have a huge military crisis. we have internal and sternal pressure and the answer for those crisis will be only resistance. he would like to be like a -- but in the country. two days ago with the european ambassadors he has a unique petition for them. he told them he would like to be

treated as cuba. they don't want to be sanctions or different treatment for the addition of it was we would like to be -- they consider themselves and cuba. but economic change in cuba could produce political change in cuba. different firms venezuela. only the political change could produce economic change and freedom. the other way around. what they have known their heads is only to resist. they don't want to change they want to consolidate in order to be in power.

then, i would like to make it clear that the recent years we have done almost everything. we went 2015 the government shutdown the parliament. then, we used our mechanism in the government stopped. then we went to the streets and had 130 days of demonstration. unfortunately an equal number of people died. then we went to the regional elections. then we went to a dialogue, the chief of the organization they close the door in her face. so we have done everything,

elections, dialogue. constitutional mechanism. we have done everything. right now we have to real damage to the government. they never expected to have solo amount of votes on the election. it's very important to underline the venezuela people's dignity is so high that even though in order to have something to eat you have to be on your knees before the government. even though people express their silence with participating in the election. i'm very proud they show that a mother dignity. he was surprised about the

outcome. right now, more than six country denies that election. the g-7 come the g20, european union, united states. right now we have alliance from all over the world. we need to strengthen our internal pressure in order to match external pressure and make an outcome. the democratic outcome. for me it's important to speak to and emphasize that were very clear that we are in a real opportunity for change in venezuela. he has created so many crisis indifference and economic issues and internal issues that in my

opinion, he would be able to deal with all the crisis. people always ask, why is he empower? what happened that this guy is in power after all the destruction of venezuela. in order to understand this and the historical terms we have oil we have army force and we have the keeper regime the commendation of these army force, oil and the cuban regime produce the change in venezuela which is happening in slow motion. like small slow-motion moving.

but we have a great outcome and it has to be this year. in order to to take it apart and have a conversation what about the position? the main challenge is unity. not only political unity, because the struggle is not a position versus the government. the whole society against the regime. the church the university. the entrepreneurs, the unions, the political parties. -- wants to be the expression of a democratic society. we have our first victory on may the 20th. but we have a second challenge,

to produce a different approach to the army. we should say they are part of the future. there part of democracy and part of what development. there we are looking not only for revenge of the country but we have to build together a unique country and a third challenge is to express to the world that we have a plan. then we know how to deal with crisis. we know how to change economy. we know how to change institutions to have a democratic society. we want an open society, and open venezuela to make a huge social exchange for the world.

that we know how to deal with it. our fourth challenge, change is unavoidable. changes can happen. that we are not doomed as cubans waiting for change. that medora is weak and we are strong. that democracies all over the world is with venezuelan people that change will happen very soon in venezuela. in the other challenge we have something you also have is to show to the rest of the world the deep humanitarian crisis in venezuela. this is something that has to take consciousness all over the world. is happening is not comparison

to any crisis in the world. i guess that within these traditions as michael says i'm sure that there is a real compassion about what's going on. i have had three meetings with vice president pants. i can feel that he is a personal commitment with venezuela. when i hurt your opinions and voice about what's going on i can feel it's not only a political thing it's a human crisis that touch your hearts and your soul and touch the history between venezuela and america. very grateful but your devotion

about what's going on venezuela. will be something to be very proud in the future. but we reach change to to tell to our sons and grandsons the role that played the united states and fighting for freedom and dignity in my country. i'm very grateful for that. and for that opportunity. most of the challenge is to collaborate with the threat the right now they represent just for the region but also for democracy all over the world. thank you. [applause]

[applause] >> thank you. now will have about 20 or 25 minutes of conversation between mark and julio before we open it up to questions. i'm sure you have questions. we will get there. but before then you've served it. his positions in the administration he served as white house stopper assistant to the president and senior director. you help implement -- toward cuba in the development of the colombian initiative in advance

steve between mexico and canada. he currently consult with major-league baseball on issues and among other groups. thank you for being with us. you heard julio's remarks. we are curious to get your thoughts and reactions before we get on conversation. >> thank you for the invitation. it's an honor to be here. it's a challenging time specially to follow julio. i don't know if there's anyone better informed of what's happening in venezuela and julio. known julio for many years. i was a consultant for a tv

network. the dr. spoke earlier about how courageous julio was. my 35 plus years of working around the world, met many people who been fighting for democracy and rates in their country. i've never met anyone as courageous and committed as julio. i'm confident that when the history of this in the final chapter would be a good one. think julio will go down as a hero. michael spoke earlier about the cs effort in venezuela.

his very painful and frustrating to work on this issue and i felt that my cell. the last two years in the obama administration i spent more time on venezuela than any other issue. the same is true with my successor as well. it is frustrating that the regime has held on this long. despite the deepest economic pressure in the world and the highest murder rate in the world. there's a significant set of u.s. sanctions and domestic pressure as well. in terms of the international effort. the united states has taken the lead in sanctioning 70 individuals. it's a target rich environment.

this regime is full senior officials. is to be crimes against humanity, drug trafficking, et cetera. we noted this morning that with regard to sanctions is one of several. there are plenty more to go. i've seen sanctions by canada and the e.u. and landon laid out the strategy with it being very sound which is to try to change behavior. they said this morning that the ideas to create fissures within the regime, can to signal there is a cost to officials and continuing to align yourself with this. but also have incentives to find

a way out as well. some part to send a signal to those who be a sanctioned. they could be next. they take certain steps in advance they could avoid getting on that list. to be honest we have not seen as much as we would've hoped. my understanding is that their broader sanctions than what the united states can impose there's hesitation to go too far. there's discussion about the possibility of an oil embargo. there's a series of steps that can be done well in advance of that. there is concern about infecting greater pain on the venezuelan people. that greater sanctions may be

unnecessary because it's collapsing on its own. seen oil production collapse and that's exhilarating. there are potential cost united states as well. especially with regard to an oil embargo which could impact wrestling prices. there are more steps that other countries can take. the general assemblies, not, be wonderful if the venezuela was suspended. thanks i think it's an appropriate move. the venezuela government pretense they don't care about it but they do care a lot. they put an enormous amount of

effort to try to prevent their diplomatic isolation. only one thing preventing them from being suspended and that is -- law. i served about 20 odd years ago. at the time the caribbean block was a set of 13 countries that were there providing -- when it comes to issues of democracy. they have effectively been bought off. i believe if countries abandon the principles another's great effort not to try to encourage countries to break and by the vote and suspend venezuela from the organization. next week they will publish a report. that report would be referred

they can then conduct investigations who are responsible for those crimes against humanity. it would be helpful for the countries would match what panama did. there really the only country that has taken strong action. i think there are steps that countries can take one would hope they would match your take these appropriate steps given their own relationships the venezuelan machine. despite the efforts, it's not clear that international pressure will be sufficient to change behavior and promote a democratic transition. especially when you consider there are other factors as well

russian china continue to provide support to the regime. what we have seen in the past three years since the time to draw pressure but they haven't been in sync. a couple of years ago the efforts from the opposition their protest. frankly international pressure was very weak. when the recall referendum was canceled and the vatican jumped in and oversaw the tocsin negotiation. ultimately they failed because there is no international pressure. our sin international pressure but there's limited domestic pressure. the tragedy there's some people

have been demobilized. people spend days looking for food and medicine and their going to exile. they are afraid because the regime use violence against protesters. they are free to go to jail and be torture. we reached a point where many people are waiting for desperate measures. for military invasion which is not going to happen. i think it's critical because the regime needs to feel more pressure than within the currently field. i then pose a question to julio if you agree. and feel free to take issue with anything i said.

we look at the importance of creating greater internal pressure to match the external. what steps can you take to do that? is there anything they can do to help you create that? >> i agree with what you said. we are very thankful for all the jobs in venezuela. this is part of the time. when we have enough internal and domestic pressure it was the beginning of international pressure there's no match. right now venezuela many people come and no the possibility to have organized store to have

call for demonstration when it is now very limited. in all social and political elite are under more fear and with fear there's panic. the government has no limits to do what they want. i guess the only window of opportunity has to do with social issues. regarding food and money. regular people live under fear. i guess that situation could be so dramatic in the future. where the dramatic than it is right now. more dramatic that people could put fear aside and go demonstrate the review feelings.

it's very curious. you see these people's behavior, it was a very clever and sharp way to protest without violence. because people took the position and although it depends on the government for food although people took position and no to present. i'm very sure that in a limited situation people can overcome fear and make demonstrations because it's within a period in nicaragua nobody expected demonstrations and riots. nation has to do -- so i treat

your question i think that we should expect internal pressure coming from the social and economic reality. and political has a role to play in this situation is to make easier the organization to people to demonstrate for the right. >> thank you. i know this is a very important issue and i agree with you both pressures are needed to see a change in venezuela. we don't know what will happen the day after the elections. but, i haven't really seen in some plan moving forward. could you describe for us

whatever prints to defendants we let people have to engage? what kind can they engage and to mobilize that pressure. >> that is a crucial question. when we have to start to think that we are in a tax situation. you have to fight. there is no legal constitutional institution. that is where he led venezuela so, that situation we have a

position beside the challenge about unity but the plan for the future and about the military crisis, we have to keep the idea of elections as the final goal for having the solution in venezuela. this is not an idealistic or naïve position, we are aware we are facing a very tough situation in venezuela. but, in any of these scenarios we have to undergo a social explosion or we have to go for our new and real negotiation. a real one.

the final will have to be elections. we have to be clear. one thing it changed is the current establishment and the other thing is what is the final goal that were looking to build it for? for people of venezuela and abroad it seems awkward that were talking about elections. it has a real argument, we don't have election. we save them for the so-called election and we would like to have real elections in venezuela. this is the room they have to play democratic leaders to support venezuela.

not in a naïve way but under real consciousness being aware that were facing a dictatorship in venezuela. with all the implements i have mentioned earlier before about unity, but our solutions about humanitarian crisis in our approach, about the unavoidable feeling of change in venezuela. but with elections and freedom no matter what could cost. this change it would be a social military reaction and real negotiation. we are pushing for change. with the final goal that's a democratic -- think you.

>> there was a turning point after may 20. there was something that happened we have never seen before. they recognize the president of venezuela. they condemned -- with the family they condemned other institutions. now there's a debate going on of what type will they have moving forward. to see the president of venezuela are no longer? there's also the government operate in the -- columbia. were trying to operate from abroad, can begin to thoughts of how do you's issue moving for of the legitimacy of the current

reserved. they're increasingly gaining importance. >> that's reason i say we are living a -- situation. it doesn't have to do with his quality or his democratic outcome. it's just a factual thing. a dictatorship that he kidnapped into power and he -- the venezuela people have done everything to produce a change in venezuela. i think a crucial change has to do with the army force and one of my main concerns is after mal

enemy. it is here that we're leaving after may the 20th. i'm sure that i now they are thinking how to destroy. it is something that has to call attention to the world. the last institution that we have to restore democracy in venezuela. right now they're producing a huge repression on the reforms this is led by cuban officials and it is very clear that after it could be the new trophy that they want to show.

anything different from that right now institutions in the exile can help in order to call attention. the urgency that we are living now in venezuela, these problems about the almost distraction of the army force have to be one of the most important issues we have. we should have to put on the political and public will be. >> there's been a lot of discussion about the army's potential and democratic savior. when i look at it i see enforcement indoctrinated social thinking and a force that has

been trained and armed by the chinese in different ways they've engaged in court other criminal activity. i look at them and they seem to be unlikely democratic savior few will. obviously no forces monolithic. could you speak to that a little bit. >> you see right now the last two or three weeks there are more than 200 officials. and for the moment there is a real problem they thought it was the new generation of the army force in the great surprise was

people don't like what's going on in venezuela until like the cuban influence in the army force. they do not like the behavior. it's very important that the new elite have a reaction for democratic and constitutional behavior. for me, provides me hope that there's some moral reservoir in it. were not talking about two or three guys that are talking about panic bad about the government, were talking about more than 300. it is a huge rebellion which is totally different.

behold the institution, we do not want to be cuba. we have to take attention to the situation that is happening right now. >> thank you. we look at sanctions policy, has sanctions been effective from your point of view? what else can be done to increase its effectiveness that was being described for us. >> i was the chief of the opposition republic. if sanctions were not working, the government haven't talked about sanctions it was amazing.

in every single one of sanctions. we don't want more sanctions. everything. sanctions are not working. it's important element not only for punishment but to have it within the regime. there is a rumor that new sanctions are coming from europe or from the united states. these guys that you see screaming the tv about revolution, they tried to say to everyone, to know if i am the new -- of the sanction. their fear of the sanctions of their working. in order to break the system or to lead to a real negotiation

have no doubt about the deficiency of it. as mark said, the government out of sanctioning. all the problems of the tropical. it has to be blamed on his regime. it has nothing to do a sanctions. we have to be very clear that if the government wants to blame sanctions on everything that is happening but i have so much research as good as mark's research that said people don't buy the argument that the venezuelan crisis is due to the sanctions. they're very clear that the economic social disaster it has to do only with maduro.

the last six years has to do with heat what he called the economic work and they repeated it, right now. and in survey people who believed that the economic work was the origin of the social crisis committee was number than 13%. so another thing we have to be very hopeful about the change in venezuela is there is a real mental change. i remember one of the service that mark will speak about, it was amazing, 90% of venezuela supported and they were very happy.

they want more from the private sector to the state. right now the support was 3%. from 90% to make 3%. what the differences people have changed. people would investment and trade, they do not by the cuban project anymore. this is an important issue that shows venezuelan the people are really ready for change right now. >> you're being very patient. please identify yourself with the name and affiliation. please keep the questions short. >> hello.

want to push back on the . he said the day after the albion election and we all agree on that. but there's a vacuum that we've seen from outside what are the steps for the day after and you mentioned two things. when you say you're seeing there is a slow-motion change happening. i wonder what the evidence is on that. to know something we don't know. but what is the evidence that there's a slow change happening. people say that in terms of social construct the government is for strong. but there's no evidence of it so when you try, why strategy?

i believe that unifying is not an option. you need to unify run to strategy and that's what it looks from the outside. i know it's -- it's worth hearing your thoughts. >> i think there are a lot of evidence about change in venezuela. i do not see no example of no evidence of change. if you see what's going on in the economy, what's going on with the oil production within the army force.

all of these factors is the force of change is happening in venezuela. two months ago's impossible to talk about military crisis. now it's an open issue. now there is a real issue. for the government the change has to do with the possibility to maintain. and people's ability to have all of the financial health never for changes for people may bill -- i don't recognize your

election. changes year ago i remember i was in europe a year ago. is talking about sanctions they remember president telling me, it will happen. europe is not prepared for sanctions in venezuela. it happened. it -- so if you see an objective way there has been a lot of change the last month regarding venezuela. but, the question is saying, why is maduro empower? well, repeated. i think the combination of what is there an oil today with they have an army court and you shake

it and that's what in my opinion the real support that he has right now if you take that, there is nothing else that supports him within or abroad. >> at the risk of offering advice to a politician a form politician to his own country. i do think that part of the opposition approach needs to be about unity and reconciliation. the maduro of paces ferry small, i think whether you like to manatt the truth was is very popular. he had high approval rating.

there's a certain identification people had with him for years ago when we're doing focus groups needed people who do not identify with the government was a for the first time in our lives we can disagree or disagree. that was the perception people have of the chavez. you can see the consequences of so much of what he tried to do. with that said, venezuela although the opposition had overwhelming support still in severely polarized society in many ways. think any new government will need to take that into consideration both in terms of rhetoric and programming.

>> any other questions? >> will take to this time. >> there is a big discussion in venezuela about why maduro called -- and there are several, one was to discard the opposition and to replace the opposition. the third one was to change inside -- parts of the publicity in the campaign.

[inaudible question]. it was not about human rights but it was about social situation and sanctions. . .

>> and be up to something. >> i would like to answer the question. but they have a real connection [. [laughter] and on sunday with the election and with ambassadors and clumsy is the word because

he said they all failed as a was to produce with the new opposition. and then they rejected. that was very important because beyond the election and with this and with that new part was tailored as

well. there isn't even one issue not even one. and in my opinion was put in a countdown we are capable with the alternative for those democratic voices for venezuela and that rule is very, very said then with the

span of eight years with that role there is an explanation for that. and then public opinion is key and people in venezuela but then he wants to try again and again but something that we have to reject for the fran -- for the friends and allies venezuela.

>> so it is a reminder there are a range of international actors other countries are taking more of the leap and then that used to be at the center but now they are very much isolated. >> i have two quick questions maybe one for mark. so with your experience, is

there a catch 22? to stabilize that social crisis do you feel that could be in any way? does that favor the government as they try to govern venezuela? >> good afternoon. >> so if i can give a little perspective and observation

because that was during the most difficult time that i went through those strategies but what i want to ask should a political crisis or a humanitarian crisis but people forget. but that you need to understand that social element. then to about those measures a true dialogue. but in 2003 or 2002 and also

you talk about the force and the sanction but that did not work because they failed to understand that you are coming from venezuela that is far less than far right. and then i can talk about that.

and then with the general elections. and then to change the government. look at the people. and i thank you. thematic the united states does not use nuclear weapons. i am not aware of those discussions then to be quickly as possible with that calculation that usaid has aware about that their own

government decide they will accept humanitarian today and tomorrow. and then to provide as much military. but also for public opinion with that is what has happened to him.

but right now but at that time it was 17% and compelled with the amount of money that the maddock regime. and then that is a solution.

it was the people from venezuela to have freedom for them to remain consistent. yes. and then to take control of the escort. and with those means in venezuela to make yes. the fantasy continue with that is a very important factor to keep in mind.

venezuelans are not alone. and we will to continue to do so. thank you so much. keep fighting for democracy. we all need it 1735. [applause] [inaudible conversations]